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View Full Version : Scrying At-Will? [D&D 3.5]



Kobold-Bard
2009-08-21, 11:09 AM
I'm currently unable to access my books, how much would an item that grants Scrying At-Will cost theoretically? If it's in the millions or something, is there an acceptably priced alternative?

Thanks in advance, and sorry if I'm being stupid.

K-B

AstralFire
2009-08-21, 11:16 AM
I'm currently unable to access my books, how much would an item that grants Scrying At-Will cost theoretically? If it's in the millions or something, is there an acceptably priced alternative?

Thanks in advance, and sorry if I'm being stupid.

K-B

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#crystalBall

112,000 GP if I understand the rules correctly when making a scrying item from scratch that's use activated. :smallyuk:

kamikasei
2009-08-21, 11:17 AM
It's a level 4 spell (for wizards), so a command-word activated item would cost 4*7*1800gp, or 50,400gp. You still have to provide the 1,000gp mirror as a focus.

Kobold-Bard
2009-08-21, 11:24 AM
Thanks very much. The speed of these boards sometimes is amazing.

Edit: Actually that's quite a big price difference. How did that happen?

AstralFire
2009-08-21, 11:28 AM
Core doesn't follow its own rules with high regularity?

Saph
2009-08-21, 12:09 PM
Because the Custom Item Creation rules are made of lose and fail. :smalltongue:

Longer version: The Custom Item Creation rules price an item based on the level of the spell required multiplied by the caster level required, but in practise there's no relation between the spell level of a permanent magic item and what it's actually worth. An item that casts scrying at will for 50k is quite reasonable, since it allows a save, takes an hour to cast, and isn't the kind of thing that adventurers will always have a use for anyway. An item that casts something like polymorph at will . . . you get the idea.

The only really reliable way to price an item is to see what people are willing to pay for it. If no-one's buying it, it's probably too expensive, and if everybody's buying it, it's probably too cheap. That's a bit hard to do in a book RPG, though, so WotC just took their best guess at the items in the core books (some are well priced, a lot aren't). They got better with practise, however - the items in the Magic Item Compendium are much more accurately priced, which is one of the reasons I like the book so much.

- Saph

Kelpstrand
2009-08-21, 01:37 PM
I don't know where the guy got 112,000gp from. The crystal ball, a use activated scrying item costs 40,000gp.

Calmar
2009-08-21, 01:52 PM
Stuff like this taught me to give up all attempts to count back the prices of DMG items. :smallbiggrin:

PinkysBrain
2009-08-21, 01:58 PM
112,000 GP if I understand the rules correctly when making a scrying item from scratch that's use activated. :smallyuk:
Use activation is a worthless guideline for pricing ... the other ones are just poor, but this one is worthless.

kamikasei
2009-08-21, 02:21 PM
112,000 GP if I understand the rules correctly when making a scrying item from scratch that's use activated. :smallyuk:

I'm not sure where that comes from. Use-activated is spell level * caster level * 2,000gp, which is only 56,000gp. Where's the doubling coming from? Because it's unslotted? Does that even matter for items that aren't granting a bonus?

Jack_Simth
2009-08-21, 08:49 PM
If you're looking for existing items, the Third Eye Sense (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/items/universalItems.htm#sense) is a steal at 24k, while the Crystal Ball (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/wondrousItems.htm#crystalBall) is a bit overpriced at 42k-80k (depending on version).

Doc Roc
2009-08-21, 08:49 PM
As much as it costs to bind an Elemental Weird. :)

More seriously, I myself might prefer third eye view.

Zuki
2009-08-22, 02:59 AM
I'm not sure where that comes from. Use-activated is spell level * caster level * 2,000gp, which is only 56,000gp. Where's the doubling coming from? Because it's unslotted? Does that even matter for items that aren't granting a bonus?

Because of the duration of the spell. Note that you double the cost when the duration is expressed in mins/level.

This is Astral, too lazy to log out of Zuki's account. :smalltongue:

Wings of Peace
2009-08-22, 03:31 AM
A little off topic but wouldn't it be easier to just summon an elemental weird and use it in place of scrying yourself? They get their divinations as free actions so in theory as long as you teach them to divine effectively there's nothing they can't find >.>

sofawall
2009-08-22, 03:37 AM
Tidesinger managed to make a radar system that was impossible to beat, by using weirds. It was part of a big Theoretical D&D Psychics thread.

Kobold-Bard
2009-08-22, 04:03 AM
Quick question: What the heck is an elemental weird? I've never heard of that before?

The Rose Dragon
2009-08-22, 04:54 AM
They're elemental diviners. That's as close I can get without the books on hand.

Also, they have an elemental pool they're bound to.

Doc Roc
2009-08-22, 07:21 AM
A wide set of divinations as free actions, regeneration 10 with no way to overcome it, monstrous intellect, and ninth level spells. They're supposedly cr 12 or so.

I kid you not. An unkillable elemental with 9th level spells, unlimited command elementals, and the ability to force save-or-die every round.... Who will always know you are coming is apparently a lower CR than some dire animals.

Hijax
2009-08-22, 08:15 AM
Tidesinger managed to make a radar system that was impossible to beat, by using weirds. It was part of a big Theoretical D&D Psychics thread.

Yeah. it was over at the wizards board. I happen to be the starter of the thread.
we also did a lot more digging in the workings of divinations, ultimately resulting in the realization that divination spells defies logic.


A wide set of divinations as free actions, regeneration 10 with no way to overcome it, monstrous intellect, and ninth level spells. They're supposedly cr 12 or so.

I kid you not. An unkillable elemental with 9th level spells, unlimited command elementals, and the ability to force save-or-die every round.... Who will always know you are coming is apparently a lower CR than some dire animals.

see now i totally wish i had thought of that in the oneshot game where we could use CR instead of ECL..

Doc Roc
2009-08-22, 08:21 AM
I thought you-were-you! Good to see you again, Hijax!

Jack_Simth
2009-08-22, 08:45 AM
A wide set of divinations as free actions, regeneration 10 with no way to overcome it, monstrous intellect, and ninth level spells. They're supposedly cr 12 or so.

I kid you not. An unkillable elemental with 9th level spells, unlimited command elementals, and the ability to force save-or-die every round.... Who will always know you are coming is apparently a lower CR than some dire animals.

Not quite unkillable. Suffocation bypasses Regeneration; anything that does Con damage or negative levels will still kill them.

But yes, the Monster Manual II is a 3.0 book, not a 3.5 book, and has some rather broken critters.

Doc Roc
2009-08-22, 09:07 AM
Can't suffocate or drown an elemental. :)

Con damage and Level drain work, except that the bloody thing knows your spell list, and has the right buffs up. ::sob::

Stegyre
2009-08-22, 06:41 PM
Because of the duration of the spell. Note that you double the cost when the duration is expressed in mins/level.
Where is that rule found? I'm not seeing it in the SRD. :smallconfused:

Zuki
2009-08-22, 06:59 PM
Where is that rule found? I'm not seeing it in the SRD. :smallconfused:

"If a continuous item has an effect based on a spell with a duration measured in rounds, multiply the cost by 4. If the duration of the spell is 1 minute/level, multiply the cost by 2, and if the duration is 10 minutes/level, multiply the cost by 1.5. If the spell has a 24-hour duration or greater, divide the cost in half."

Note 3 at the bottom of the table.

jeek
2009-08-22, 07:05 PM
A level 5 Binder with Improved Binding can use Divination as an at-will by binding Astaroth. (class from Tome of Magic, vestige from Dragon 357: page 68)

Calibri from the same issue gives Arcane Eye as an at-will, at the same level.

ericgrau
2009-08-22, 07:19 PM
spell level x caster level x 1800 gp. 7 * 4 * 1800 = 50,400 gp. Though the actual magic item seems to use spell level x caster level x 1500 gp = 42,000 gp, but with increases for special abilities tacked on.