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Pika...
2009-08-31, 05:14 AM
Players don't read!!!


So after my last thread concerning the realms of dead deities, and the Asgardian Pantheon I got some inspiration combined with one other source. I then called up an old buddy of mine, and he gave me some great ideas (thanks dude!).

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Short of it:

When the other human gods were going mad and stuff, due to their worshipers killing each other off, Loki's humorous nature helped keep him distant from what was happening. Being Loki, and based on other Human pantheons' fates and current situation he decided to milk the current situation to his benefits before the power of his fellows was wasted (they were doomed anyway, right?). So he went sneaking around stealing divine ranks here and there, or harvesting what was left from the fading, for himself. By the time Odin realized what was happening Loki was too strong, and Odin too weak, but even then Loki did nothing to Odin (this was pre-Balder's fated death).

However, Loki could feel the madness starting to affect him, so decided he need to take desperate measures to prevent from falling like the rest of the Human gods. Being the clever trickster he is, and the master of changing forms, he quickly devised a plan admist the turmoil taking place on Asgard. He quickly began crafting rings, and within each he bestowed the divine ranks he had pilfered. Of the 72 divine ranks he obtained from his fading pantheon he placed 43 in rings of silver, each ring possessing a single divine rank within it. Within 14 gold rings he placed 2 divine ranks apeace, and the final 3 ranks were placed in a ring of mere copper. He then placed a single silver ring upon his left hand, and proceeded to forge his own own divine ranks (16) into a platinum dagger*.

Loki then fled Asgard as Odin mustered the last of his strength, and the confused petitioner guardians of Asgard to attempt catching him. Loki then scattered all the rings except the one on his left hand across the planes and Prime Material Sphere(s?), and hid his dagger in a "safe" place.

Loki then, as a mere Demigod (divine rank 1. he was a Greater-Deity), traveled to a world where he felt humanity stood it's best chance of surviving in decent numbers (aka my homeworld). Once there he took the form of a young peasant teenager within a refugee community welcomed into Elven lands. Once having gotten himself "adopted" by a kind pair of Human adults, he willed all of his memories into his silver ring (a simple silver band, with a small imprint of a flame on it [aka Loki's holy symbol]) and with his last thoughts as Loki that the ring become dormant.


So now there are quite a few "easter eggs" and plot hooks for me to work with. However, my imagination isn't good enough to come up with so many hiding places/dunegons/tricks/etc, so I am hoping you folks can help me out with ideas. Feel free to suggest anything, from any premade modules you feel would be a good place to use as a "dungeon" for one, to a place on a specific plane, to whatever you like and can imagine. Any ideas for where the dagger is/should be would be especially nice.


*The secret of the dagger:

Being Loki he made this into a "trick".

The trick is that it is the first person killed by this finely crafted platinum dagger who is ascended straight up to the level of a Greater-Deity (16 divine ranks).

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The long of it:

Here is my fluff as to why all the Human deities were dying out:

Human Deities

Most of the Human deities now lie dead. Humanity’s impulsive and reckless nature proved to be its undoing. Too many wars, too many rivalries, and too many enemies proved to be too much for the young race. Uncannily similar to their lives their race reached its peak, then began to regress back to nothingness in an insignificant amount of time.

Since no deity can ever truly die, most still walk the various planes as mere shadows of their former selves. Once worshiped by entire civilizations, they are now devoid of all their former cosmic power, and are destined to wander the multiverse endlessly as ghostly spirits; unable to even help themselves. Some have gone mad, others still try desperately to convince the living to change their ways, yet most wait quietly; watching what is to come.

* Nerull, lesser god of death, darkness, murder and the underworld (NE. Domains: Death, Evil, Pestilence, Trickery.)
* Pelor, lesser god of sun, light, strength and healing. More humans worship Pelor than any other deity. (NG. Domains: Good, Healing, Strength, Sun.)
* Vecna, lesser god of destructive and evil secrets (NE. Domains: Evil, Knowledge, Magic.)
* Wee Jas, lesser goddess of magic, death, vanity, and law (LN. Domains: Death, Law, Magic.)



My purpose by doing all this:

My original goal was to make Loki a sort of easter egg for players to unlock in my sandbox world. However, thanks to the advice of my friend I got the idea for the for him hiding his divine ranks. I then got inspired by events iin the show Earth: Final Conflict for the reaching in and absorbing divine ranks bit, which would give me a tn more eggs and plot hooks for PCs/players to explore, and it would give Loki some fun (aka plot motivation for the PCs) once he hopefully reaches the reascended stage (see below).



Loki's current situation:

When the last of Loki's memories were transferred into his silver ring, and the ring went dormant Loki instantly lost all personal memories. His new "parents" were confused at first, but later decided it must have been the shock of the tragedies the "poor boy" had experienced that caused his mind to make his memories fade.

Since he could not remember his name they renamed him Yana (a cookie for whoever gets the reference, which is what inspired this whole mess).

Today Yana is an old man somewhere in his 80s, however he still has the spring and health of a 50 year old, and the personality of one much younger than that. Note: He does not know it, but in truth it's the ring he still carries since childgood which has artifically kept him younger.

In addition, he is known for "knowing a lot". While yes he reads often, and has traveled a bit, he just happens to "know things at convenient times" "just out of the blue". He also has a strange sense for knowing when a game of gambling is going on in town, and always wants to partake (although he is infamous for always winning, he is always welcomed at a table for being so beloved in town). Note: This is meant to be a/the way of getting PCs/players involved with him. Basically, he just happens to always know what the PCs need to know at the right time, so they will hopefully continue returning to him. Basically, the ring may be dormant, but it's residual energy of a DIVINE RANK is enough to grant these abilities, which I am guessing Loki would have planned all along.

He also foten talks about some items which belong to him. He can't remember what they are, but he claims he is sure they belonged to him before he lost his memory as a child. He claims to have a vague idea of where they are, or at least he believes. He has been saving up for many years to hire top-notch adventurers to help him find them.



Loki once he hopefully "re-ascends":

So basically, the conditions for Loki to "re-ascend" are:


Him to posses a ring which is currently not dormant (basically, the PCs need to fetch him one, or tag him along as a good helpful rogue to get it). Then
Once he has a second/functioning ring someone must realize who he is. That he is truly Loki. The idea is that once someone acknowledges he is a deity he is one, or sparks the Divine Spark needed, which is then pwoered by the ring to ascend him.


Once the above happens, the original ring will return to him his memories, and the divine rank will be added to his total (so he would have a bare minimum of 2 divine ranks from the get-go). He still remains all his memories of his short mortal life, though.

Loki will then proceed to figure out what happened in his wake at Asgard. Eventually after some searching he will learn that by stealing divine ranks from the already crippled or near-crippled gods of his former pantheon he inadvertently lead to their premature demise. Indeed fate had declared that Ragnarok should have happened, so the Asgardians should have survived. But by his acts fate was adverted, and therefore what should have been was adverted. Though he had always known he would turn against his brethren, even that thought did not diverthim from his people's belief that fate must be.

So now Loki finds he has freed himself of his predetermined destiny. Something which is not truly what he desired.

Now he finds himself free, but alone. He is glad that the soles of the petitioners choose to remain at Asgard's defensce (he disguised himself to get in, so he could learn the fate of the others). However, he dares not make his presence known there out of fear (or perhaps if he was more honest to himself, shame?), so Asgard's great hall remains empty without the presence of a god.


What I plan to do with him/use him for as DM:

The basic idea my friend suggest, which I love is that instead of merely going out grabbing all the rings n a hurry (which would take him no time as a demigod now that he has his memories back) is for this to be his way of having "fun" like he used to. The complete chaos that could be caused by specific (aka PCs or villains) finding one of these would be spectacular for him.

Plus, he stole them back once, and he will probably have more rings by then than the single one he'd lead a party, villain, or both at once to, and being a patient deity he can wait until the fun goes cold before he snatches it back (or attempts to. come on PCs! Get on my deities list. :smallbiggrin:). And if for some surprising ( and definitely angering for him) reason he fails to take it back, then he can just move on to the next one (however being who he is he is not likely to learn his lesson).

I imagine I can make him a pretty big protagonist, and perhaps at times a helper (again, this all happened pre-Balder's death). However, he would quickly find that without his worshiper base his influence and options is even more limited, as if being a demigod after having been a Great-Deity wasn't bad enough. Being a master of disguise, and getting his morphing powers back he would have "fun" turning nations and armies against each and such. Alternatively these tricks could be used to help get him more rings, or to make they feel into the right hands as described above before falling into his. Although this means he needs to get his hands dirty for some time, it will just have to be this way.





Wow. That was a fun few hours. :smallsmile:



p,s. If you folks have any other ideas besides locations/dungeons for all this please let me know!

Radar
2009-08-31, 08:18 AM
First of, i love the ideas laid out by you. :smallsmile:

Second of, with so many rings containing divine ranks around, someone was bound to find some of them - someone not intended by Loki himself. Said person might experiance various benefits from the ring (similar way to Yana/Loki) and would or wouldn't realise the significance of the ring.
Possibilities are numerous: some unusually strong and successful barbarian, a long-lived and abnormaly wise king, secluded wizard wanting to ascend to godhood, some hidden cult trying to feed their crippled deity with the ranks stored in Loki's rings.

edit: nature hates vacuum, so if all human pantheons have fallen, there are probably some other deities trying to take their place (unless they are aware of the risk of madness) or at least getting sure, that no fallen deity will ascend ever again.

Pika...
2009-08-31, 09:07 AM
First of, i love the ideas laid out by you. :smallsmile:

Thank you. You don't know how much I appreciate hearing that. :smallsmile:



Second of, with so many rings containing divine ranks around, someone was bound to find some of them - someone not intended by Loki himself. Said person might experiance various benefits from the ring (similar way to Yana/Loki) and would or wouldn't realise the significance of the ring.
Possibilities are numerous: some unusually strong and successful barbarian, a long-lived and abnormaly wise king, secluded wizard wanting to ascend to godhood, some hidden cult trying to feed their crippled deity with the ranks stored in Loki's rings.

Hmm...

I guess you have a point of other adventurers accidently finding one. He really did not have the time to place each in Fortknocks.

However, I was originally thinking each ring gave a divine rank, and that Yana's didn't only because he willed it dormant. So why wouldn't those NPCs/side adventurers get the full benefits?



edit: nature hates vacuum, so if all human pantheons have fallen, there are probably some other deities trying to take their place (unless they are aware of the risk of madness) or at least getting sure, that no fallen deity will ascend ever again.

Well, I am not sure what vacume there would be. Yes on my world the long-lived races are begging a struggle with the savage races for their old land(s), but with the Human worshippers almost extinct what void could the gods of other races have?

Johanas
2009-08-31, 10:43 AM
Well, you could always have the rest of the rings dependent on the one Yana still carries. BTW, Yana is very appropriate, since I assume you named him after a certain rogue Time Lord....

Once Yana's ring get's "Reactivated", so do all the rest. So rather than have a bunch of established BBEGs holding super-rings, the party catches wind of a number of strange occurrences, and can dig up some info on why that poor jeweler from the middle of nowhere suddenly became a great warlord. Or why Joe NPC over here is now challenging the King's Guard (ALL of them) for rulership of the kingdom. Or who knows what can happen. Once Yana regains a measure of himself, you suddenly have a bunch of Crazed former npcs. The chaos would be loverly.

P.S. You could really have a lot of fun dictating WHOSE divine ranks were in which rings, and have the rings influence the wearer. For example, a ring which contains some of Loki's Divine Essence makes the wearer more of a subtle, cunning pyro, whereas a ring containing the essence of say...Hella, makes the wearer suddenly interested in death, and so on.

P.P.S I suppose you could use the rules for Vestiges influencing Binders.

Radar
2009-08-31, 10:55 AM
Thank you. You don't know how much I appreciate hearing that. :smallsmile:
Your welcome. :smallsmile:


Hmm...

I guess you have a point of other adventurers accidently finding one. He really did not have the time to place each in Fortknocks.

However, I was originally thinking each ring gave a divine rank, and that Yana's didn't only because he willed it dormant. So why wouldn't those NPCs/side adventurers get the full benefits?
On Loki's place i would make all the rings dormant and hide their aura as best as i could. The more power they radiate, the higher is the risk of someone adding 2 to 2 and stealing Loki's stolen divine ranks. Yet some magic would leak anyway, thus the beneficial effects.


Well, I am not sure what vacume there would be. Yes on my world the long-lived races are begging a struggle with the savage races for their old land(s), but with the Human worshippers almost extinct what void could the gods of other races have?
Still it might be a great and "one in a lifetime" opportunity for some lesser powers (demigods, lesser demons, homeless spirits) to get at least some worshippers without being smiten by a real deity.

As for hiding places, i would definately hide some of them in the Positive Energy Plane as the most hostile place in the multiverse. At least one could be left in Asgard - the place is still guarded by loyal servants. Some could be entrusted to Loki's worshippers (with or without the knowledge of ring's true power) - this could also be part of a plan to ensure humanity's survival. I would also secretly and magically meld some of the rings into other objects or terrain features like a very old and locally respected oak or top of a very hostile mountain (crown is a great hiding place - no one would want to destroy it and it's easy to find even after a very long time).

Pika...
2009-08-31, 11:43 AM
Well, you could always have the rest of the rings dependent on the one Yana still carries.


On Loki's place i would make all the rings dormant and hide their aura as best as i could. The more power they radiate, the higher is the risk of someone adding 2 to 2 and stealing Loki's stolen divine ranks. Yet some magic would leak anyway, thus the beneficial effects.

This is an awesome idea which I feel solves the balance problem, while making solid sense.



BTW, Yana is very appropriate, since I assume you named him after a certain rogue Time Lord....

LoL. Yup. :smallbiggrin:


When I went to wiki to double check I got the name/anachronism correctly I even found an image I want to use when the scene comes up:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/0a/Master_Regenerates.jpg


That is, if I ever get the chance to run all this.


p.s. By the way, here is your http://brain.hastypastry.net/forums/images/graphics_grabbag/cookie.gif.




Once Yana's ring get's "Reactivated", so do all the rest. So rather than have a bunch of established BBEGs holding super-rings, the party catches wind of a number of strange occurrences, and can dig up some info on why that poor jeweler from the middle of nowhere suddenly became a great warlord. Or why Joe NPC over here is now challenging the King's Guard (ALL of them) for rulership of the kingdom. Or who knows what can happen. Once Yana regains a measure of himself, you suddenly have a bunch of Crazed former npcs. The chaos would be loverly.


Ooh. Such nice ideas here.

However, what level would you say the party should be when begining to deal with these rings? Even a divine 1 rank I believe falls under epic level play.

Then again, what if I made it so when Yana/Loki "re-ascend" he does not fully reactivate them, but through a link between the rings he purposefuly set in during their swift crafting "activates" them only enough for a small amount of divine powere/energy/aura leaks out for him to be bale to track them (knowing ahad of time one or so may have gotten snatched by clever or lucky adventurers). Could this be a good way fo explaining why Joe NPC can take on the entire city guard single-handedly, but can still be beat by the PCs (pre epic that is)?






P.S. You could really have a lot of fun dictating WHOSE divine ranks were in which rings, and have the rings influence the wearer. For example, a ring which contains some of Loki's Divine Essence makes the wearer more of a subtle, cunning pyro, whereas a ring containing the essence of say...Hella, makes the wearer suddenly interested in death, and so on.

Again, even more awesome dieas. Thank you so much folks!

However, all of Loki's divine ranks are in his dagger, so I am imagining no one would get an aspect of his personality.


p.s. What does that mean about Loki having worn another deity's divine rank for so long, and in a bare Human mortal form no less (aka more vulnerable to it's effects than a god or even demigod)?




P.P.S I suppose you could use the rules for Vestiges influencing Binders.

I don't care much for Vestiges fluff myself. I prefer them to be free to wonder endlessly, and do as they wish, but knowing they can have virtually no effect on the multiverse. After what they were that must be torment for almost all of them. But then again, they are the one true things which never truely die.

Foryn Gilnith
2009-08-31, 11:53 AM
However, all of Loki's divine ranks are in his dagger, so I am imagining no one would get an aspect of his personality.


p.s. What does that mean about Loki having worn another deity's divine rank for so long, and in a bare Human mortal form no less (aka more vulnerable to it's effects than a god or even demigod)?

If he foresaw this contingency, just have one of Loki's divine ranks smuggled into the ring he's wearing. If not, then I could see something sort of happening where Loki absorbs all the Asgardian personalities in some absurd plot twist, becoming some sort of super-god.

Random832
2009-08-31, 11:55 AM
The Master and I claim my cookie.

EDIT: :smallmad: someone else got it first.

Did you at least bring enough cookies for everyone?

Pika...
2009-08-31, 11:58 AM
The Master and I claim my cookie.

EDIT: :smallmad: someone else got it first.

Did you at least bring enough cookies for everyone?

:smallbiggrin:

LoL. I had a spare just in case, so you can have it for making my laugh.

Enjoy:
http://brain.hastypastry.net/forums/images/graphics_grabbag/cookie.gif

Random832
2009-08-31, 11:59 AM
:smallbiggrin: Om nom nom.

You should put his memories in a pocket sundial, instead of the ring. Just to make the reference a bit more obvious for your players / make them feel a bit more stupid to have failed to get it :smallcool:

Pika...
2009-08-31, 12:01 PM
Damn. Is it really that obvious? >.>

BRC
2009-08-31, 12:01 PM
For some of the rings, Loki worked a curse into them. For example, if you put the ring on, you're hair starts rapidly growing, if you leave it on for long enough, the curse stops and the divine rank takes effect.

Lysander
2009-08-31, 12:04 PM
Perhaps mortals can't directly channel the full power of the rings. Because having 43 gods running around would be very confusing.

Instead each ring might just serve as an artifact, altering and empowering its owner in ways befitting its ring as was suggested above. And the rings might seek out and alter chance to land in the hands of appropriate hosts.

Like, a farmer who finds the ring of a harvest goddess suddenly has enormous crops on his lands and when attacked is suddenly protected by swarms of locusts and crows. Or a policeman finds the ring of a justice goddess and suddenly becomes a superpowerful vigilante that can phase through walls and see people's sin.

The BBEG might be collecting these rings for a ritual that will destroy them and allow him to absorb their true energy, instead of using this leakage.



As for where each ring should be hidden, it seems like it would vary by ring. Just putting them in a dungeon seems boring. There should be a clever twist.

For example, a ring of a war god might actually be hidden among identical rings of mundane steel in a piece of chainmail.

Random832
2009-08-31, 12:10 PM
Damn. Is it really that obvious? >.>

It's pretty obvious to a Doctor Who fan. I mean, there was a bit of a callback joke about it in the christmas special, too

But anyway, about rings... hmm :thinking:

How about one of the rings has a curse - if you put it on, you die within seven days.

Myshlaevsky
2009-08-31, 12:23 PM
It's pretty obvious to a Doctor Who fan. I mean, there was a bit of a callback joke about it in the christmas special, too

But anyway, about rings... hmm :thinking:

How about one of the rings has a curse - if you put it on, you die within seven days.

Could be: if you put it on without having 16 divine ranks and 71 divine ranks, you die in seven days?

The curses and other conditions are a nice touch - this is a god, so in terms of safety precautions he should be really, really extreme.

Radar
2009-08-31, 12:33 PM
However, what level would you say the party should be when begining to deal with these rings? Even a divine 1 rank I believe falls under epic level play.

Then again, what if I made it so when Yana/Loki "re-ascend" he does not fully reactivate them, but through a link between the rings he purposefuly set in during their swift crafting "activates" them only enough for a small amount of divine powere/energy/aura leaks out for him to be bale to track them (knowing ahad of time one or so may have gotten snatched by clever or lucky adventurers). Could this be a good way fo explaining why Joe NPC can take on the entire city guard single-handedly, but can still be beat by the PCs (pre epic that is)?
Well wearing a deity-powered ring and controlling it (or even having a clue, how to handle them, or knowing what they are) are two different things. Even if the divine rank is stored in the ring, then putting the ring on wouldn't permanently bestow the divine rank on the wearer. When the power stays hidden, a person would just feel some beneficial minor effects (as has been said before). Now the moment of activation could be quite a shocker - being exposed to that much power could in some cases either drive a person mad or even harm them physically (especially for the stronger rings).

The activated ring might be sort of erratic - then the party would have to evade deadly attacks long enough to spot the right moment.

Some wearers might not even realise, what sort of power they wield subconsiously - it could lead to some funny encounters:
1. PCs try to buy the ring from someone and that person just say:
"No way, just leave me alone!"
And all the PCs get a Geas to leave that person alone.
2. An absent-minded shopkeeper that allways has any bizzare and exotic (yet not magical) things on sale ("I might have it here somewhere...") who actually creates them or just teleports them from a random place (without knowing it of course). Bonus points for pulling a 10ft pole out of a drawer.

So with different approches to the wearers personality and their level of self awarness you can scale the difficulty of encounters and they don't have to be resolved by fighting.

For the copper ring (if anyone grabs a hold on it) i would propose Akira (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akira_%28film%29) style behavior - just because it was scary and awasome in the same time. :smallbiggrin:

I still don't have a witty place for the dagger, but it should be some sort of a large scale prank - Loki is a trickster after all. :smallamused:

kestrel404
2009-08-31, 01:02 PM
I like this idea. Very fun, lots you can do with it. Plenty of plot hooks.

First, for the 'one divine rank' in the Ring Loki wears right now, I would suggest that it contains the only rank that Loki managed to steal from the All Father (Odin himself). That would explain why he has 'mystical insight' - that's one of Odin's biggest traits.

Also, I really like the idea of having the source of the divine ranks influencing what the rings can do. That way you can flavor each of the rings as a different magical ring with its own powers, even before the 'big reveal'. And they don't have to be standard magic items either, since each and every one of those rings is effectively an Artifact (or possibly and intelligent item with a weak ego and empathic communication).

As for the original question: Where to hid stuff?

The obvious answer, from Loki's POV, would be 'in plain sight'. Really, you don't hide something you want to remain a secret at the bottom of some dungeon that an adventuring group is going to be looting ten years down the line. Instead, you hide the rings on the fingers of important personages of long-lasting and stable bloodlines. You give them to nobles/lords/what have you, after putting their seal on them. In other words, if you REALLY want to hide those magic rings, you use them to replace the reigning nobilities signet rings.

Not all of them, of course. The silver rings would only bestow demi-godhood on someone who's wearing it when it went 'active', so that's relatively safe. But the gold rings would grant actual godhood all by themselves.

So, the gold rings you give to MONSTERS. One to each color of dragon (the older the better!). One to a lich. One to a medusa, and so on. In other words, you give the rings to creatures who would choose to HORDE them, rather than WEAR them, so that when the go active, it might not be immediately noticed that they went from 'powerful magic item' to 'artifact of incredible power' overnight.

The copper ring is obviously meant as a special case. That's probably the one Loki intends to get for himself so he can 'wake up'. This one requires a real 'hero's quest' to recover, since it is in the bottom of a half-submerged dungeon guarded by some nasty beast, and more importantly, it is half-buried into a big rock. Yeah, that's right, to make sure the PCs don't walk off with it you should pull a sword-in-the-stone. This will also point out to the players how potentially potent this 'copper ring' could be, if they get the reference. Only a 'champion' of the old man can get the ring out of the rock - perhaps only he himself can do it, or maybe he'll entrust the responsibility to a paladin or some such.

Another interesting consideration is 'what does the copper ring do?' That would depend on who the divine ranks came from - but given that there are specifically THREE ranks (which is generally a significant number in mythology), I would suggest that there is one rank from each of the three Norns - who have a rough Greek/Roman equivalent as the three Fates. The Norns of past, present and future. Even 'damped down', the power behind three divine ranks would end up making this ring an artifact level magic item. You could leave it's powers as GM Fiat, or else just make them just that potent (3/day use of Time Stop, 3/day use of Foresight, 3/day use of Temporal Stasis).

As for the dagger? Loki will want his divine ranks back, but he won't feel like he earned them unless he TRICKS someone into giving them back. So put it in a place where it is likely to get used against him. My idea: He gives it to a poor cleric who's recently lost touch with their god and tells them it's a magic artifact that 'has already stolen the power of one god'. A couple of bluff checks later and this Cleric is setting up an entire order of clerics whose sole purpose is guarding this artifact until such a time as it is needed to stop a rampaging 'rogue god'. Now, the "Order of Saint Yehuda" is a growing cult who preach that one day doom will descend on the land and only their sacred order will be able to offer salvation. And when the PCs eventually go head-to-head with Loki (and his half-dozen divine ranks), they'll need a powerful artifact to fight him with - and look who's more than happy to provide a 'god slaying weapon'?

Pika...
2009-08-31, 09:41 PM
For some of the rings, Loki worked a curse into them. For example, if you put the ring on, you're hair starts rapidly growing, if you leave it on for long enough, the curse stops and the divine rank takes effect.

OK then.

Silver Ring #1
-Divine rank from: The Norse god of beauty (need to look up his name again).
-Location: (none yet).
-Granted abilities while "dormant": (none yet).
-Granted abilities once someone finds the copper ring, or Yana/Loki otherwise "activates the others": Grants +1 divine rank, (none yet).




Perhaps mortals can't directly channel the full power of the rings. Because having 43 gods running around would be very confusing.

Well, I don't know about the confusing part. Since I my Material Plane is of the Spelljammer style, andmy own hoembrewe sphere has around nie planets alone, not to mention Realmspace (where Faerun is), the Greyhawk sphere, one I would need to make for Eberron, etc they would be pretty dispersed I imagine. And they would be mere demigods.

I imagine with the idea presented below of Loki placing some of the rings in the hands of powerful nobles, bloodlines, tribe chiefs, kings, etc if Loki were to "activate" all those simultaneously the chaos would be amazing and spread out across a good portion of the Prime Material. Heck, probably even on other planes if I can figure out how. Suddenly you have worlds which were just becoming stable after the human plague suddenly break out in chaos again with everything from members of noble families (which usually don't go out into battle) to tribe leaders suddenly gathering armies and sweeping across the continent in conquest driven wars.

Then again, Loki might activate only one world's at a time, or even less (like the original main goal I had of him being a recurring "nuisance" NPC for various campaign to come) while he watches the chaos (read: not evil) in enjoyment. All the time keeping an eye on the various rings he activated, so he knows when it has come time to pluck them back into his care.

However, again I'd like to leave this not so much as "BOOM! 50-something new demigods are rampaging the place!" one-shot campaign, but something I can regularly go to during my future campaigns as a sort of nuisance style NPC, sort of like Nixplix (I know I spelled that wrong) I suppose.


Instead each ring might just serve as an artifact, altering and empowering its owner in ways befitting its ring as was suggested above. And the rings might seek out and alter chance to land in the hands of appropriate hosts.

Like, a farmer who finds the ring of a harvest goddess suddenly has enormous crops on his lands and when attacked is suddenly protected by swarms of locusts and crows. Or a policeman finds the ring of a justice goddess and suddenly becomes a superpowerful vigilante that can phase through walls and see people's sin.

Great ideas. I am trying to weave all these wonderful ideas (thanks folks!) together, picking the best parts. Right now I am thinking the rings should be divide into two different effect stages. One for when they are dormant (where they receive residual energy which leaks from the rings) like Yana, and another in case Loki (or someone who posses the copper ring as well) desires to activate one(s). The later I am thinking should automatically give the appropriate divine ranks, but then as suggested in this thread the PC/NPC/whoever will need to see if they can manage and/or control the sudden jolt of immense power.





The BBEG might be collecting these rings for a ritual that will destroy them and allow him to absorb their true energy, instead of using this leakage.

Eh, not too keen on this idea for some reason. It does bring up the question if mortals (aka anyone below divine rank 6) can activate them by themselves.

I am thinking the answer is simply that either a true deity (anything above divine rank 6+) can use them and/or absorb them without issue (as it says in Deities & Demigods), or the copper ring is needed by anything of lesser power.


p.s. Then again, I imagine that if someone obtains 6 divine ranks worth, then that would be enough for them to activate them and ascend fully?

Hmm...

Might be a way for new gods to form in my cosmology, AND gives PCs a way to strive to godhood?




As for where each ring should be hidden, it seems like it would vary by ring. Just putting them in a dungeon seems boring. There should be a clever twist.




For example, a ring of a war god might actually be hidden among identical rings of mundane steel in a piece of chainmail.

OK. Awesome idea dude.

Silver Ring #2
--Divine rank from: One of the Norse gods of war (need to pick one).
-Location: On my homeworld there is a large area of planes where an army from the Human State of Karen (basically a Viking style culture, which coincidentally worshiped the Asgard) had dared attempt to march on the frozen northern territory of the last dragon. There the Dragon King's armies met them, but to the surprise of Karen's soldiers completely unarmed aside from their armor. They at first thought it was a surrender, but moments later they say something approach them from the air, which got very, very big, very quickly. It is said it took mere minutes for the Dragon King to scorch the entire army, and the very land beneath them. This was almost a millenia ago, but up until the very end uf the Karen city state 100 years ago they were still bringing tribute to the Dragon King. A constant reminder to them to not stop was that the planes where their ancient army feel is still aflame in brush-fires of various sizes. Within the flames still lie the soldering armored skeletons of their ancestors. Occasionally the mystical flames rise the dead into mindless walks, and enough gather into random endless marches. Somewhere in this landscape woven into a dead soldier's chainshirt lies one of Loki's silver rings.
-Granted abilities while "dormant": (none yet).
-Granted abilities once someone finds the copper ring, or Yana/Loki otherwise "activates the others": Grants +1 divine rank, (none yet).

Pika...
2009-08-31, 09:51 PM
Could be: if you put it on without having 16 divine ranks and 71 divine ranks, you die in seven days?

The curses and other conditions are a nice touch - this is a god, so in terms of safety precautions he should be really, really extreme.

Not 100% sure where you two are going with this.

You mean it being the last ring one should get, including Loki himself?

Myshlaevsky
2009-08-31, 09:56 PM
Not 100% sure where you two are going with this.

You mean it being the last ring one should get, including Loki himself?

I was just pointing out it's very easy to install a specific order the rings must be collected in. It's also easy to install a specific mechanism for the wearing of the rings.

Johanas
2009-08-31, 10:04 PM
YAAAY I GOT A COOKIE!

*ahem*

Also, one thought. Loki is the Ultimate Trickster. As silly as it sounds, as almost anticlimactic as it sounds, where would he place his most potent rings? Not just in plain sight, but under his OWN nose. Maybe another silver ring, (hell, why not the copper one?) is somewhere at Yana's house. Unknown to himself. Are the PCs really gonna think to come back and search the middle of nowhere, if Yana (or even Loki himself, minus a little memory) doesn't remember he put it inside the stonework of his fireplace? You're gonna be dealing with Epic Level PCs here, and that means Epic Level Divination. Loki just:

A. *pulls out ring*
B. *casts nondetection*
C. *sticks ring in mantle*
D. *erases own memory via programmed amnesia*
E. *wonders why he is laughing manically*


Or puts the silver ring in the super-awesome-end-all-uber-dungeon. Whichever.

Pika...
2009-08-31, 10:13 PM
Well wearing a deity-powered ring and controlling it (or even having a clue, how to handle them, or knowing what they are) are two different things. Even if the divine rank is stored in the ring, then putting the ring on wouldn't permanently bestow the divine rank on the wearer. When the power stays hidden, a person would just feel some beneficial minor effects (as has been said before). Now the moment of activation could be quite a shocker - being exposed to that much power could in some cases either drive a person mad or even harm them physically (especially for the stronger rings).

The activated ring might be sort of erratic - then the party would have to evade deadly attacks long enough to spot the right moment.


Thanks for the advice.

How would you handle things when/if Loki (or if a PC/NPC gets the copper one) were to activate one?

Intense series of Fort Saves?

What would you make the requirement(s) for the individual to succeed?



p.s. Also, if a PC manages to get a divine rank what do you do with them? Should they be retired as an NPC?




Some wearers might not even realise, what sort of power they wield subconsiously - it could lead to some funny encounters:
1. PCs try to buy the ring from someone and that person just say:
"No way, just leave me alone!"
And all the PCs get a Geas to leave that person alone.
2. An absent-minded shopkeeper that allways has any bizzare and exotic (yet not magical) things on sale ("I might have it here somewhere...") who actually creates them or just teleports them from a random place (without knowing it of course). Bonus points for pulling a 10ft pole out of a drawer.

So with different approches to the wearers personality and their level of self awarness you can scale the difficulty of encounters and they don't have to be resolved by fighting.

Awesome ideas dude. Many thanks. :smallbiggrin:




For the copper ring (if anyone grabs a hold on it) i would propose Akira (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Akira_%28film%29) style behavior - just because it was scary and awasome in the same time. :smallbiggrin:

Yeah, and then I can throw a year's worth of making my homebrewed world away. :smalltongue:


I still don't have a witty place for the dagger, but it should be some sort of a large scale prank - Loki is a trickster after all. :smallamused:

Two people of said this. Makes sense, but I feel bad as a DM for not seeing it myself.

Johanas
2009-08-31, 10:33 PM
What if the effect isn't instant? It could be a gradual thing, starting with weird behavioral quirks, and eventually upgrading in to a few abilities, then maybe a template even, before finally starting onto a full-blown god-level advancement. No reason it HAS to be instant, and let's be honest, wouldn't it both be more FUN (from Loki's perspective) to have the chaos from the gradual increase, as well as make it easier for him to find the rings? And by find the rings, I mean find the rings WITHOUT them being in the possession of a being of now god-like power? Bizarre occurrences on NPCs are less threatening to him than gods, even more so gods throwing around cosmic power like softballs.

Dracomorph
2009-08-31, 10:53 PM
A ring with a divine rank from Tyr might initially cause the bearer's dominant hand to wither and fall off, or at least become useless.

Maybe it could eventually give some limited telekinesis to effectively replace the lost hand. Alternately, some sort of suped-up Zone of Truth effect would be thematic.

If I were Loki, I'd give a ring like that to either A) a magistrate/judge, or B) the head of a thieves' guild.

The Norse god of beauty was Balder. There was also a goddess of beauty or two, Freya and maybe Sif. I'm not entirely clear on which is which.

Radar
2009-09-01, 11:52 AM
How would you handle things when/if Loki (or if a PC/NPC gets the copper one) were to activate one?

Intense series of Fort Saves?

What would you make the requirement(s) for the individual to succeed?
Fluff-wise i was thinking of something analogous to sparks that occur on starting up some shoddy high-current electrical circuits. Crunch-wise i would go for a single Will (retaining sanity and mental stats) and Fort (avoiding physical damage) save with a random table of negative effects occuring on failing - i would probably add the difference between the save roll and the DC to the random effect roll, so table of effects should be sorted from lightest to most severe. As for effects themselves:
Possible Will saves fails: dropping unconsious for a few hours or days, temporal amnesia, various mental disorders (including megalomania and other paranoias, hearing voices, split personality and such), stat damage (or drain), being possessed by the ring (partially or fully), droping dead

Possible Fort saves fails: nausea, burns, going blind/deaf, loosing sense of touch or balance (that can be nasty), crippling, body deformations, internal organs failure, death

I'm not sure, where to put this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iesXUFOlWC0) (Dr Strangelove's right hand), but it's a nice effect to include.

p.s. Also, if a PC manages to get a divine rank what do you do with them? Should they be retired as an NPC?
Tough cookie here. I suppose putting the ring on after it's activation shouldn't be that dangerous (potential Will save should be much lower then that for activation). Being a demigod would up the PC into epic level of power, so it's hard to balance.
I guess it will on depend on, when will a PC get a hold on an activated ring - what level the party is, what Loki is currently doing and whether he (or some power-hungry being) will go after the ring immediately or not. If many actually powerfull beings are after the rings and the party is in the high levels, then it could be that every use of rings power would be like a big neon "I'm here" sign and would result in serious fight beyond party's CR (yes, it's LoTR, but it might work :smalltongue:). On lower levels it's either "go NPC" (it should be discussed with the player tough - you might forge a solo adventure for that player, where he could help the party indirectly or go into a power struggle with other lesser deities) or someone really powerfull snatches the ring from the PC. It's the best i could come up with by now.

Pika...
2009-09-01, 12:56 PM
I like this idea. Very fun, lots you can do with it. Plenty of plot hooks.

First, for the 'one divine rank' in the Ring Loki wears right now, I would suggest that it contains the only rank that Loki managed to steal from the All Father (Odin himself). That would explain why he has 'mystical insight' - that's one of Odin's biggest traits.

Also, I really like the idea of having the source of the divine ranks influencing what the rings can do. That way you can flavor each of the rings as a different magical ring with its own powers, even before the 'big reveal'. And they don't have to be standard magic items either, since each and every one of those rings is effectively an Artifact (or possibly and intelligent item with a weak ego and empathic communication).

As for the original question: Where to hid stuff?

The obvious answer, from Loki's POV, would be 'in plain sight'. Really, you don't hide something you want to remain a secret at the bottom of some dungeon that an adventuring group is going to be looting ten years down the line. Instead, you hide the rings on the fingers of important personages of long-lasting and stable bloodlines. You give them to nobles/lords/what have you, after putting their seal on them. In other words, if you REALLY want to hide those magic rings, you use them to replace the reigning nobilities signet rings.

Not all of them, of course. The silver rings would only bestow demi-godhood on someone who's wearing it when it went 'active', so that's relatively safe. But the gold rings would grant actual godhood all by themselves.

So, the gold rings you give to MONSTERS. One to each color of dragon (the older the better!). One to a lich. One to a medusa, and so on. In other words, you give the rings to creatures who would choose to HORDE them, rather than WEAR them, so that when the go active, it might not be immediately noticed that they went from 'powerful magic item' to 'artifact of incredible power' overnight.

The copper ring is obviously meant as a special case. That's probably the one Loki intends to get for himself so he can 'wake up'. This one requires a real 'hero's quest' to recover, since it is in the bottom of a half-submerged dungeon guarded by some nasty beast, and more importantly, it is half-buried into a big rock. Yeah, that's right, to make sure the PCs don't walk off with it you should pull a sword-in-the-stone. This will also point out to the players how potentially potent this 'copper ring' could be, if they get the reference. Only a 'champion' of the old man can get the ring out of the rock - perhaps only he himself can do it, or maybe he'll entrust the responsibility to a paladin or some such.

Another interesting consideration is 'what does the copper ring do?' That would depend on who the divine ranks came from - but given that there are specifically THREE ranks (which is generally a significant number in mythology), I would suggest that there is one rank from each of the three Norns - who have a rough Greek/Roman equivalent as the three Fates. The Norns of past, present and future. Even 'damped down', the power behind three divine ranks would end up making this ring an artifact level magic item. You could leave it's powers as GM Fiat, or else just make them just that potent (3/day use of Time Stop, 3/day use of Foresight, 3/day use of Temporal Stasis).

As for the dagger? Loki will want his divine ranks back, but he won't feel like he earned them unless he TRICKS someone into giving them back. So put it in a place where it is likely to get used against him. My idea: He gives it to a poor cleric who's recently lost touch with their god and tells them it's a magic artifact that 'has already stolen the power of one god'. A couple of bluff checks later and this Cleric is setting up an entire order of clerics whose sole purpose is guarding this artifact until such a time as it is needed to stop a rampaging 'rogue god'. Now, the "Order of Saint Yehuda" is a growing cult who preach that one day doom will descend on the land and only their sacred order will be able to offer salvation. And when the PCs eventually go head-to-head with Loki (and his half-dozen divine ranks), they'll need a powerful artifact to fight him with - and look who's more than happy to provide a 'god slaying weapon'?


There's a lot of awesome advice here. Thank you!

Sorry I did not reply to this sooner, but wanted to get some rest and take a better look at it.




I like this idea. Very fun, lots you can do with it. Plenty of plot hooks.

Thank you. Again, as an inexperienced DM I am glad to hear such things. :smallsmile:


First, for the 'one divine rank' in the Ring Loki wears right now, I would suggest that it contains the only rank that Loki managed to steal from the All Father (Odin himself). That would explain why he has 'mystical insight' - that's one of Odin's biggest traits.

Well, what I had originally done was add up all the divine ranks from the Asgardian deities who had less ranks than Loki (based on the stats in Deities and Demigods), since I figured he would not be able to (or dare try) from those of higher divine rank than himself. I then rolled a % to see what percent he got (I was surprised to have gotten a pretty high result). Plus, I had written in the fluff that "yet Loki still did nothing to Odin", since this was still pre-Balder's death.

Plus, don't all deities have the ability to see the future to some extent (might have misread that in Deities & Demigods)?

However, the idea could be used with the above mentioned one where due to him being practically mortal he was vulnerable to absorbing the ring's traits. Hence I might be able to justify my treatment of him as more CN than CE? Plus, perhaps his fond memories of his childhood and adopted family (which I am guessing he would never admit to having "fond memories" of living as a mortal peasant) might help with that? And to top the cake, what if this could be used to throw in the suggested idea above of Loki actually planning to try saving the human race somehow with the rings, even though that was probably not his original intent taking the divine ranks (which could going by the rules technically make him an Overdeity at Divine Rank 25+)?





Also, I really like the idea of having the source of the divine ranks influencing what the rings can do. That way you can flavor each of the rings as a different magical ring with its own powers, even before the 'big reveal'. And they don't have to be standard magic items either, since each and every one of those rings is effectively an Artifact (or possibly and intelligent item with a weak ego and empathic communication).

Agreed. Within the next few days or week I will try to roll % and compile a list of all the rings.

However, I rather avoid the intelligent part, since I imagine it would mean a portion of the deity's personality would remain within it rather than the simple residual residue (sort of like a fingerprint on a glass surface) which changes people (god's residue > mortal's entire mind) that is described above.



As for the original question: Where to hid stuff?

The obvious answer, from Loki's POV, would be 'in plain sight'. Really, you don't hide something you want to remain a secret at the bottom of some dungeon that an adventuring group is going to be looting ten years down the line. Instead, you hide the rings on the fingers of important personages of long-lasting and stable bloodlines. You give them to nobles/lords/what have you, after putting their seal on them. In other words, if you REALLY want to hide those magic rings, you use them to replace the reigning nobilities signet rings.

Dude that is simply brilliant! I love it. Plus they would need to somehow have to talk the mobilities/kings/chiefs/whatever to give them to random strangers (aka them the party). :smallbiggrin:

It is what gave me the idea for him suddenly turning whole worlds apart with wealthy pampered nobles suddenly becoming unstoppable marshals, and random small tribes suddenly becoming continent sweeping armies thanks to their newly "revitalized" leaders becoming savage warchiefs. Although this assume Loki were to actually activate so many at once (deepening on how many he placed in said planet), or if some joe NPC villain found the copper and activated them all at once without knowing.

However, I am assuming the people of the lands/realms/kingdoms would over the years notice that their nobles and other leaders seem to be getting better/stronger (or perhaps not aging as they should as Yana has) instead of withering due to the residual energies?




Not all of them, of course. The silver rings would only bestow demi-godhood on someone who's wearing it when it went 'active', so that's relatively safe. But the gold rings would grant actual godhood all by themselves.

Really?

So that changes things around a bit I believe (damn, I never knew there was so much thought into being a DM, but I am enjoying it quite a bit!).



So, the gold rings you give to MONSTERS. One to each color of dragon (the older the better!). One to a lich. One to a medusa, and so on. In other words, you give the rings to creatures who would choose to HORDE them, rather than WEAR them, so that when the go active, it might not be immediately noticed that they went from 'powerful magic item' to 'artifact of incredible power' overnight.

Dude I love this idea! So deviously wonderful. :smallbiggrin:

However, if the gold ones were to automatically give divine rank 2, would that be extremely obvious? Especially to the creatures you mentiones. The dragons, lich, and even beholder would catch on instantly I'd imagine, and I'd say the medusa as well.

Plus, those badies are powerful enough as is, so would Loki not fear taking the rings from them with divine ranks? Especially they would be the ones who'd best know how to use them, and would most likely past the ascension saves.




The copper ring is obviously meant as a special case. That's probably the one Loki intends to get for himself so he can 'wake up'. This one requires a real 'hero's quest' to recover, since it is in the bottom of a half-submerged dungeon guarded by some nasty beast, and more importantly, it is half-buried into a big rock. Yeah, that's right, to make sure the PCs don't walk off with it you should pull a sword-in-the-stone. This will also point out to the players how potentially potent this 'copper ring' could be, if they get the reference. Only a 'champion' of the old man can get the ring out of the rock - perhaps only he himself can do it, or maybe he'll entrust the responsibility to a paladin or some such.

Well, I run a sandbox game, so I would prefer if either PCs who roleplay and plan clever enough, or an NPC(s) I am running against them have the ability to get it.

Plus, Loki is in it for the "fun" chaos isn't he?



Another interesting consideration is 'what does the copper ring do?' That would depend on who the divine ranks came from - but given that there are specifically THREE ranks (which is generally a significant number in mythology), I would suggest that there is one rank from each of the three Norns - who have a rough Greek/Roman equivalent as the three Fates. The Norns of past, present and future. Even 'damped down', the power behind three divine ranks would end up making this ring an artifact level magic item. You could leave it's powers as GM Fiat, or else just make them just that potent (3/day use of Time Stop, 3/day use of Foresight, 3/day use of Temporal Stasis).

Hmm. I did not know three was an important thing in mythology. Good thing to know as a DM I believe.

And I love the Norns idea! They were not in the book I believe, so I had not known about them. And the idea is perfect in my opinion.

However, is only 9 spells a day really a major artifact item? Never stated one before, so I am not sure.



As for the dagger? Loki will want his divine ranks back, but he won't feel like he earned them unless he TRICKS someone into giving them back. So put it in a place where it is likely to get used against him. My idea: He gives it to a poor cleric who's recently lost touch with their god and tells them it's a magic artifact that 'has already stolen the power of one god'. A couple of bluff checks later and this Cleric is setting up an entire order of clerics whose sole purpose is guarding this artifact until such a time as it is needed to stop a rampaging 'rogue god'. Now, the "Order of Saint Yehuda" is a growing cult who preach that one day doom will descend on the land and only their sacred order will be able to offer salvation. And when the PCs eventually go head-to-head with Loki (and his half-dozen divine ranks), they'll need a powerful artifact to fight him with - and look who's more than happy to provide a 'god slaying weapon'?

Dude, this is pure DM genius, and I like your interpretation of Loki "not feeling like he earned it".

I am so using this if you do not mind. It is just perfect in my opinion.

Foryn Gilnith
2009-09-01, 01:03 PM
However, if the gold ones were to automatically give divine rank 2, would that be extremely obvious? Especially to the creatures you mentiones. The dragons, lich, and even beholder would catch on instantly I'd imagine, and I'd say the medusa as well.

Plus, those badies are powerful enough as is, so would Loki not fear taking the rings from them with divine ranks? Especially they would be the ones who'd best know how to use them, and would most likely past the ascension saves.

Disguise them as completely nonmagical, give them to monsters that already have their allotted two magic rings (and powerful ones, at that), and then suppress them for a day or two. Put them on some hapless adventurer or peasant, pass it off as an engagement ring, and watch it be thrown into the massive hoard.

It could go wrong, but hey - there's your drama.


However, is only 9 spells a day really a major artifact item? Never stated one before, so I am not sure.

The given powers would be comparable to the Shadowstaff in the DMG, so yeah, Major Artifact-ish.

Quirp
2009-09-01, 02:52 PM
Since Loki is a descendant of the giants I would give the gold rings
to some of his trusted giant friends commanding them to scatter all over the world(s). Loki could then be sure that these (too) powerful items wouldn´t be missused, while he could have fun with the lesser silver rings. The giants could then us spells, disguise and trickery to blend into human/elven/dwarven society always dying of "old age" and afterwards establishing a new disguise.

If two of the rings contain each one divine rank that belonged to married deities before (Sif and Thor, Odin and Frigga, Njord and Skadi) the two owners could fall in love for each other, even if they hated each other passionately in the past time. Including a kind of Romeo and Juliet story that could lead to a funny quest for the PC´s.

Zaydos
2009-09-01, 03:41 PM
Hmm. I did not know three was an important thing in mythology. Good thing to know as a DM I believe.

And I love the Norns idea! They were not in the book I believe, so I had not known about them. And the idea is perfect in my opinion.

However, is only 9 spells a day really a major artifact item? Never stated one before, so I am not sure.
Yeah 3 is big in Norse myth, and 9 is huge (3 sets of 3), for example there were 9 worlds, 9 great runes, Odin's ring creating 8 copies (making a total of 9 with itself, or maybe just made 9 copies) every night, it was the number of power in Norse mythology, and the power should put it at artifact level. Another powerful thing in Norse myths are magic rings like the ring of the Nibellung (can't remember the spelling) and Odin's ring.
As for the general idea it just sounds epic, and fun. Making it Spelljammer seems like it would work, then again I've always wanted to play Spelljammer but everyone I knew said it was too silly.

Since Loki is a descendant of the giants I would give the gold rings
to some of his trusted giant friends commanding them to scatter all over the world(s).
Personally I don't think Loki would really trust anyone with these, even his own parents. Loki might trust one with it if it didn't know what it was, though, having given them the golden rings as a token of his friendship. Even so that might be risky if they'll like the giants from Norse myth which already had nearly as much power as the gods, and some of which (i.e. Thrym) are even included as deities in Deities and Demigods. While most weren't this strong there were two more giants on the level as Thrym and Surtr in Norse myths. Although if the giants are just standard D&D giants this shouldn't be a problem.

kestrel404
2009-09-02, 11:17 AM
Well, what I had originally done was add up all the divine ranks from the Asgardian deities who had less ranks than Loki (based on the stats in Deities and Demigods), since I figured he would not be able to (or dare try) from those of higher divine rank than himself. I then rolled a % to see what percent he got (I was surprised to have gotten a pretty high result). Plus, I had written in the fluff that "yet Loki still did nothing to Odin", since this was still pre-Balder's death.

OK, so no Odin ring. Well, a bit of delving into the Norse pantheon reveals Vor, the norse goddes of Wisdom and Finding-what-you-seek! That's a pretty good fit, I think.


However, the idea could be used with the above mentioned one where due to him being practically mortal he was vulnerable to absorbing the ring's traits. Hence I might be able to justify my treatment of him as more CN than CE? Plus, perhaps his fond memories of his childhood and adopted family (which I am guessing he would never admit to having "fond memories" of living as a mortal peasant) might help with that? And to top the cake, what if this could be used to throw in the suggested idea above of Loki actually planning to try saving the human race somehow with the rings, even though that was probably not his original intent taking the divine ranks (which could going by the rules technically make him an Overdeity at Divine Rank 25+)?

Yeah. If you're going to be bringing Loki in as an 'occasional NPC', you might want an excuse for him not to be really evil - otherwise he'll have every reason to kill the party. On the plus side, if they find him one of his rings, and better yet, if they kill him with his dagger, he'll have reason to be grateful to them - and so not kill them out of hand, or find a reason to save them if they're in a tight spot. Once.


However, I rather avoid the intelligent part, since I imagine it would mean a portion of the deity's personality would remain within it rather than the simple residual residue (sort of like a fingerprint on a glass surface) which changes people (god's residue > mortal's entire mind) that is described above.

Yeah, intelligent items aren't everyones cup of tea.


However, I am assuming the people of the lands/realms/kingdoms would over the years notice that their nobles and other leaders seem to be getting better/stronger (or perhaps not aging as they should as Yana has) instead of withering due to the residual energies?

However you want to run it. Yeah, it might come up as somewhat odd that several nobles have effectively stopped aging - but that's what assassination is for, to keep the line of succession moving. Not ALL of the nobles, of course, but enough to muddy the waters and prevent it from becoming common knowledge that 'the ruler of kingdoms X, Y and Z don't age!'.


However, if the gold ones were to automatically give divine rank 2, would that be extremely obvious? Especially to the creatures you mentiones. The dragons, lich, and even beholder would catch on instantly I'd imagine, and I'd say the medusa as well.

Plus, those badies are powerful enough as is, so would Loki not fear taking the rings from them with divine ranks? Especially they would be the ones who'd best know how to use them, and would most likely past the ascension saves.

Excellent points. Perhaps a modification of Quirp's idea? Have Loki distribute the gold rings to powerful giants, or other exceptionally large creatures - and then say that they can't use them because they're too big! So Loki doesn't have to trust them to be anything other than too gready to give up the rings.


Well, I run a sandbox game, so I would prefer if either PCs who roleplay and plan clever enough, or an NPC(s) I am running against them have the ability to get it.

Plus, Loki is in it for the "fun" chaos isn't he?

Oh, certainly. It's just that Loki (or the mortal remnant of him) shouldn't make that too easy for the players. I mean, they're going to KNOW the ring is important, so the old man giving them the quest is not going to want to spend his money sending them on a fetch quest, and then get stiffed forthe powerful artifact after.

The way I design such scenarios, I try to make the BBEG's plan bulletproof. That way I force my players to dig deep and find their armor piercing ammunition, rather than just letting them fill the bad guy's plan full of holes from the get-go.


And I love the Norns idea! They were not in the book I believe, so I had not known about them. And the idea is perfect in my opinion.

However, is only 9 spells a day really a major artifact item? Never stated one before, so I am not sure.

That's 6 level 9 spells and 3 level 8 spells as SLAs. That means that the one item is given its wielder the best bits of a 20th level wizard. And those spells aren't weak.

Basically, if the PCs got their hands on it and figured out what it can do, they'll probably never lose another fight, ever, until you take it away from them. Which is another good reason not to let them keep it.


I am so using this if you do not mind. It is just perfect in my opinion.

I'm always happy when someone wants to use my ideas in their game.