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MethosH
2009-09-03, 01:23 PM
I'm not sure if you should ask this here or on the arts and crafts sub-forum... well.. anyway...

I'm trying to gather information on modrons, actually more specific information on all kinds of modrons and how they look like.

I know that modrons first appear on AD&D 1st edition monster manual 2, but I can't get my hands on it.

I got the modrons web enhancement from Manual of Planes and I got the Planescape "The Great Modron March", but they don't give much away about how the modrons actually look like...

And I'm not talking about Monodrones, Tridrones and Quadrones... Those are very famous (well.. as much as a modron can be).. My avatar is a winged quadrone.

I'm talking about Pentadrones (I really could use a image of a pentadrone by the way), Decaton (I've got a image of those from de monster manual 2), nonatons(got the image), Octons, Septons (got the image), Hextons, Quintons, Quartons, Tertians (got the image), Secundi and Primus.

And I have a image from The Great Modron March I can't figure what the hell is that...

So... I will get out of my lazy ass and post the images I have here... But if you guys happen to have anything that could help me I would really appreciate.

Optimystik
2009-09-03, 02:14 PM
Does this help? (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/we/20010921a&pf=true)

Edit: you already got that :smallsigh: they're tiny robots with one eye I think is the gist of it.

Calmar
2009-09-03, 02:27 PM
Here are some.

http://www.deviantart.com/download/51763324/March_of_the_Modrons_by_jdillon82.jpg

Gralamin
2009-09-03, 02:28 PM
I'm talking about Pentadrones (I really could use a image of a pentadrone by the way), Decaton (I've got a image of those from de monster manual 2), nonatons(got the image), Octons, Septons (got the image), Hextons, Quintons, Quartons, Tertians (got the image), Secundi and Primus.


Your asking some hard stuff.

Dragon 354 has an image of a Pentadrone. Specifically, he's the guy in the bottom right here:
http://fc02.deviantart.com/fs14/f/2007/085/d/6/March_of_the_Modrons_by_jdillon82.jpg

Primus has an image in Dragon 341. In addition, quite a few older images appear here (http://unurthed.com/2008/09/06/modrons-as-contemplative-geometry/)

Starscream
2009-09-03, 02:29 PM
No wonder they replaced these guys with Inevitables for 3rd edition. Flumphs would laugh at them for being too silly.

PonceAlyosha
2009-09-03, 03:32 PM
No wonder they replaced these guys with Inevitables for 3rd edition. Flumphs would laugh at them for being too silly.

But Modrons are hilarious, and are even more hilarious when forced to work in factories of pure law by their Inevitable overlords.

I'm fairly certain this isn't how it works, but Modrons should propagate by fission.

Skorj
2009-09-03, 03:47 PM
But Modrons are hilarious, and are even more hilarious when forced to work in factories of pure law by their Inevitable overlords.

I'm fairly certain this isn't how it works, but Modrons should propagate by fission.

Yeah, modrons are great! Not all outsiders should be spooky beings of fire and shadow. :smalltongue:

Armoury99
2009-09-03, 04:10 PM
I'm fairly certain this isn't how it works, but Modrons should propagate by fission.

Each rank transmogrifies into the next higher rank to replace any losses, with new monodrones (the lowest rank) being replaced in city-sized factories in Mechanus... although indeed fission sounds like a good alternative.

The original - first edition - modrons were basically dice with faces, arms and legs (like a disney movie version of dice). Their current appearance and 'culture' stems from the work of Tony DiTerlizzi (http://www.diterlizzi.com/), principle artist for the 2e awesomtastic Planescape setting. As far as I know he gave them the part organic cyborg look, which was also somewhat less cute in those days.

http://www.sigil.de/decaton.jpg

In Planescape all modrons are part of a single massive hierarchy, each answering to the rank above, up to "Primus" (a modron of godlike power). Each has a very specific function and is barely intelligent at all in the way normal mortals think of it. Each modron has a number of functions equal to its "sides" (so monodrones only do one thing, Duodrones two things, etc), only accepts orders from modrons of the rank immediately above it, and doesn't even know that modrons beyond its immediate superiors and inferiors even exist, let alone care about them (or anybody else). They're implacable, uncaring, ruthlessly logical, and have no concern for their own lives. Like a colony of ants. Like an army of robots. LIKE THE BORG.


"We are the Borg. Lower your shields and surrender your ships. We will add your biological and technological distinctiveness to our own. Your culture will adapt to service us. Resistance is futile."
Ahem, where was I?


No wonder they replaced these guys with Inevitables for 3rd edition. Flumphs would laugh at them for being too silly.

The eternal tragedy of mordons is that they are almost always portrayed as cute comic relief (even Planscape was guilty of this somewhat). The truth is, if your party gets in the way of the Great Modron March they aren't met by smiling cutsey robot dice men... they're trampled by rank on rank of perfectly in-step marching monodrones who don't even register the screams as your ground beneath their metalic heels. THATS modrons. At least the Borg actually want to assimiliate people. Modrons don't want or need anything from you. Their purpose is to maintain (cosmic) order in the multiverse by maintaining the Clockwork Nirvana of Mechanus and fighting chaos. Extraneous biological lifeforms are irrelevant.

Its probably a Planescape monstrous manual or boxed set you'll need to really find out about them (probably Planes of Law), alternatively you should definitely check out the many PS sages on Planewalker.com (http://www.planewalker.com/index.php) as they'll be able to give you a much better low-down than this one (although wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modron_(Dungeons_%26_Dragons))is actually a good start).

EDIT: There's also such a thing as Rogue Modrons too, 'fallen' modrons that were player character material. They are quadrones (the square ones) that have become infected by chaos/mad/no one knows exactly what and gained a spark of individuality. They're relentlessly hunted down as abominations by their kin and spend their lives as tragic exiles, constantly baffled by their own individuality and the chaos inherent in everything.

Amiria
2009-09-03, 04:21 PM
Its probably a Planescape monstrous manual or boxed set you'll need to really find out about them (probably Planes of Law), alternatively you should definitely check out the many PS sages on Planewalker.com (http://www.planewalker.com/index.php) as they'll be able to give you a much better low-down than this one.

I have the Monstrous Supplement from the Planes of Law Boxed Set here. No modrons in it. I also have the Planescape Monstrous Compendium Appendix here. No modrons in it.

But the both have Tony DiTerlizzi as interior artist ... :smallsmile:

I am sure that there were stats for all of the modron types in Planescape somewhere however ... but where ? ... where ?!

Eldan
2009-09-03, 04:59 PM
Let me delve into my Planescape picture collection... these are all from Planewalker, I think.

Edit:
Hmm. There was a huge thread with modron art, but it seems all those pictureds aren't hosted anymore. I'll send the artist a PM for you.


http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/3938/roguemodronbybasiliskey.jpg

http://i186.photobucket.com/albums/x183/pearhead4/JP%20Cool%20****/1636.jpg

http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b358/FiannaVPC/Planescape/Modrons/Dekaton.jpg

http://fc09.deviantart.com/fs31/f/2008/232/d/6/Nonaton_by_Clone_Artist.jpg


All of these are, ouf course, inofficial interpretations.

shadzar
2009-09-03, 05:13 PM
http://www.somethingawful.com/d/dungeons-and-dragons/wtf-dnd-modron.php

Try that for some info and images.

Starscream
2009-09-03, 05:29 PM
Found a picture of one on a cover of Dragon Magazine:
http://paizo.com/image/product/catalog/WOC/WOC82354_500.jpeg
Too bad I don't have the issue itself, looks like there's a whole article on the things in there.

Yuki Akuma
2009-09-03, 05:33 PM
Actually Modrons do reproduce via fission... whenever a Modron dies, other lower-ranked Modrons get promoted to fill the gaps. When they get to monodrones, one random monodrone splits into two.

I know this because I seem to be the only person who read WotC's Manual of the Planes web enhancement on Modrons...

Eldan
2009-09-03, 05:48 PM
That must be a newer version. In Planescape, they came from some sort of energy pool called The Source.

Eldan
2009-09-03, 05:59 PM
Found while digging on the net:

http://i.somethingawful.com/u/elpintogrande/may09/modron3_img.gif

http://i.somethingawful.com/u/elpintogrande/may09/modron4_img.gif

http://i.somethingawful.com/u/elpintogrande/may09/modron5_img.gif

http://i.somethingawful.com/u/elpintogrande/may09/modron6_img.gif


Of course, these are ancient and I really prefer Primus as shown in Modron March.

Cieyrin
2009-09-03, 07:02 PM
EDIT: There's also such a thing as Rogue Modrons too, 'fallen' modrons that were player character material. They are quadrones (the square ones) that have become infected by chaos/mad/no one knows exactly what and gained a spark of individuality. They're relentlessly hunted down as abominations by their kin and spend their lives as tragic exiles, constantly baffled by their own individuality and the chaos inherent in everything.

What I wonder is why Rogue Modrons are always Quadrones? Going lower obviously seriously limits characters but why not a Rogue Pentadrone or possibly even a hierarch! I suppose the hierarches wouldn't be viable without some serious story reasons, considering they have a minimal number of them about and all.

Also,
...Dragon Magazine cover...

That article was good, though they only talked about the base modrons and the pics from the article are linked by Calmar and Gralamin earlier in the thread. I know the Tertian shows up in Dungeon #144, though whether they have a picture of one, I have no idea. Stats for the Hierarches were homebrewed based off of the Tertian in this thread: http://www.enworld.org/forum/homebrews/193223-hierarch-modrons.html They're decent, I think, though they could be improved on, definitely.

bosssmiley
2009-09-04, 06:26 AM
What I wonder is why Rogue Modrons are always Quadrones?

Because that's how the Hierarch Modrons have planned it. Alles ist in ordnung. :smallwink:

@Armoury99: GJ summing up the sheer alienness of these creatures of perfect Law. They're as weird and incomprehensible as the Slaadi on some levels.

Project_Mayhem
2009-09-04, 07:40 AM
What I wonder is why Rogue Modrons are always Quadrones?

I remember reading that they become that shape for some reason

Yuki Akuma
2009-09-04, 08:48 AM
Rogue Modrons are always Quadrones because that's the first rank at which they actually have a semblance of individual personality, and there are a lot of Quadrones.

(Also, Modrons do come from the Source... it's just, well, the Source is metaphysical, and the bodies need to come from somewhere. Hence, Monodrones reproduce via fission. The Source is what animates them. :P)

shadzar
2009-09-04, 09:13 AM
"the Source" created by "the Architect", and he is the father of the Martix. :smallyuk:

It's an energy pool (the one Primus resides in) in Nirvana, nothing more that primordial organized (lawful) ooze.

Fixer
2009-09-04, 10:39 AM
I'm fairly certain this isn't how it works, but Modrons should propagate by fission.Modrons don't propogate. They are born of the energy pool from which Primus draws its power. Each Modron, when it dies, automatically promotes the nearest modron of one lower rank to their station, and that continues down the line until a new monodrone is created at the pool.

Thus, there are always exactly the same number of Modrons in the multiverse.

Yuki Akuma
2009-09-04, 12:47 PM
No, a Monodrone splits in half. The Source does nothing in particular (although it might power the fission or something).

This is apparently very distressing to onlookers, but the Modrons themselves don't seem to even notice it happens.

cheezewizz2000
2009-09-04, 12:53 PM
While this isn't exactly helpful as to what modrons ARE like, I've always envisioned the Clockwork Nirvana of Mechanus to be like an extra-planar Alpha Complex with primus taking the role of Friend Computer and inevitables taking the role of the Ultra-Violets. This basically means that all modrons would be rogue, but all the other modrons aren't aware of it.

Not everyone's cup of tea, but it might make a fun adventure idea.

LibraryOgre
2009-09-04, 01:10 PM
Modrons don't propogate. They are born of the energy pool from which Primus draws its power. Each Modron, when it dies, automatically promotes the nearest modron of one lower rank to their station, and that continues down the line until a new monodrone is created at the pool.

Thus, there are always exactly the same number of Modrons in the multiverse.

Except for a split second, when it is possible to disguise yourself as the newest monodrone, thus upsetting the balance of the multiverse, and bringing about the resolution of the Blood War in the favor of Chaos.

I WILL REIGN SUPREME!

Eldan
2009-09-04, 01:14 PM
Well, Rogue Modrons are already upsetting the balance, by drawing power away from the source. That's why the must be hunted down.
Is there an inevitable of Modron-hunting already?

PonceAlyosha
2009-09-04, 01:16 PM
While this isn't exactly helpful as to what modrons ARE like, I've always envisioned the Clockwork Nirvana of Mechanus to be like an extra-planar Alpha Complex with primus taking the role of Friend Computer and inevitables taking the role of the Ultra-Violets. This basically means that all modrons would be rogue, but all the other modrons aren't aware of it.

Not everyone's cup of tea, but it might make a fun adventure idea.

That's awesome. It gives them all an excuse to act as subtly as possible, because they'd all fear others recognizing they were "doing something different". They'd all be working for the exact same purpose, but none of them know it, because apparently "True Law" isn't something expressible by language, so they'd have the urge to hide it, thinking all the others do not know the Truth the way they do.

Cieyrin
2009-09-04, 03:36 PM
Last I checked Modrons and Inevitables didn't actually have much to do with one another. Modrons maintain order in Mechanus and where ever else they can get to and Inevitables go out and try to bring order to the rest of Multiverse, even if they have to choke the **** out of it to get things done.

Irreverent Fool
2009-09-04, 09:09 PM
The modrons were replaced by the Formians, not the Inevitables.

The article in Dragon 354 is fairly detailed and makes reference to earlier source material. The pdf is probably still available from Paizo's website. I've bought several Dragon pdfs from there for about five dollars each.

Modrons are great to use in a campaign when you've remembered your dice but forgotten your miniatures.

obnoxious
sig

Calmar
2009-09-05, 06:04 AM
What I wonder is why Rogue Modrons are always Quadrones? Going lower obviously seriously limits characters but why not a Rogue Pentadrone or possibly even a hierarch! I suppose the hierarches wouldn't be viable without some serious story reasons, considering they have a minimal number of them about and all.

Pretty much every type of modron can go rogue (except Primus, I suppose). There are a few examples in the Planes of Law boxed set, such as a rogue nonaton in the "Haywire" adventure.

The quadrones are probably best suited for PCs because they are neither as limited as the lower ranked modrons, nor too powerful in comparison to other player races.

Lord Loss
2009-09-05, 08:15 AM
That must be a newer version. In Planescape, they came from some sort of energy pool called The Source.

Wait, where could that come from? ''Cough'' Matrix ''Cough'''

WOTC really is getting bad at ripping people of, these days...

Eldan
2009-09-05, 08:19 AM
I said in Planescape. Check some dates, please.

The Matrix: 1999

Planescape campaign setting: 1994

By the time the later matrix movies came out, Planescape was long over. Also, it was before Wizards bought DnD.


Pretty much every type of modron can go rogue (except Primus, I suppose). There are a few examples in the Planes of Law boxed set, such as a rogue nonaton in the "Haywire" adventure.

The quadrones are probably best suited for PCs because they are neither as limited as the lower ranked modrons, nor too powerful in comparison to other player races.

Actually, there was a fan story set after The Great Modron March/Dead Gods, which involved a rogue Secundus, the one who technically should have become the new Primus. Gone rogue for the thought "But... I should be Primus now!"