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Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 05:03 PM
is a concordant blade possible for PCs or are concordant killers the only ones allowed to have them? for those who don't know a concordant blade has these enchanctments.
axiomatic
anarchic
holy
unholy

all act simultaneously

Quietus
2009-09-04, 05:06 PM
There's no clause saying you can't put those on the same sword, so sure, you could do it. You'd have to be true neutral to wield it without penalty, though.

Eldariel
2009-09-04, 05:07 PM
From the Concordant Killer-entry:

Concordant Greatsword (Su) ...

...but if the concordant killer
relinquishes its grip, the weapon dissipates.
If the concordant killer is destroyed, the sword it
bears disappears forever.


So by RAW, no. It's an extension of them and it's their class feature. You could of course homebrew some way to craft those, but Concordant Killers aren't a source of them.

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 05:11 PM
I know I couldn't get it from them. I was just wondering if a PC would be able to wield one/find one/make one.

Keld Denar
2009-09-04, 05:17 PM
If you could somehow get ahold of one, the only character would could wield it without taking 4+ negative levels would be a Horizon Walker with Planar Terrain Mastery (Aligned).


Aligned (Planar)
You have the instinctive ability to mimic the dominant alignment of the plane. You incur none of the penalties for having an alignment at odds with that of the plane, and spells and abilities that harm those of the opposite alignment don’t affect you. You have the dominant alignment of the plane with regard to magic, but your behavior and any alignment-related Class Features you have are unaffected.

Emphasis mine. You would be immune to the ability of the weapon (to give negative levels if you don't match its alignment), and thus be able to comfortably wield it. Since a Horizon Walker takes their mastery with them wherever they go, you would have that immunity on the Prime, even though the Prime is unaligned.

Quietus
2009-09-04, 05:19 PM
Unless I'm mistaken, they only bestow negative levels on the OPPOSED alignment. Therefore, a true neutral person, being devoid of extreme alignments, could hold a +1 Holy Unholy Axiomatic Anarchic sword... you'd just have to houserule a way to add any other abilities these concordant blades have in.

Douglas
2009-09-04, 05:20 PM
If you could somehow get ahold of one, the only character would could wield it without taking 4+ negative levels would be a Horizon Walker with Planar Terrain Mastery (Aligned).
No, any neutral character could do it just fine. The negative levels are only imposed on creatures of the opposite alignment, not creatures that just don't match.

Keld Denar
2009-09-04, 05:24 PM
Awwww crap. Forgot that part. Oh well, HW would be required if you wanted to be any alignment OTHER than TN.

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 05:28 PM
the only other one they have is holy. so for example I could have a holy, axiomatic, anarchic sword as long as I remained true neutral or neutral good. I'm thinking of using that as my greatsword although I don't know about the axiomatic part. see my character worships Eris so I'd think they have to be chaotic. But my DM hasn't said anything about that yet so I don't know. plus I'm only level 3 so it doesn't even matter right now.

now since I've been asked to keep threads concerning characters in one thread in the past does anybody know of a way to replace wisdom with intelligence on saves?

Douglas
2009-09-04, 06:08 PM
now since I've been asked to keep threads concerning characters in one thread in the past does anybody know of a way to replace wisdom with intelligence on saves?
Keen Intellect (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Keen_Intellect,)

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 06:25 PM
thanks Douglas:smallbiggrin:

Fax Celestis
2009-09-04, 07:14 PM
The easiest way to model concordant is to just make it a +4 bonus enhancement. Which amounts to saying "It's a concordant longsword +1," rather than saying "It's a holy unholy anarchic axiomatic longsword +1."

Cieyrin
2009-09-04, 09:06 PM
The easiest way to model concordant is to just make it a +4 bonus enhancement. Which amounts to saying "It's a concordant longsword +1," rather than saying "It's a holy unholy anarchic axiomatic longsword +1."

But holy and the rest are all +2 enhancements. Putting them all in a +4 enhancement is just saving you moneys, so you get an effectively +5 weapon instead of a +9 one. 0_o

Speaking of those, i suppose concordant would have word of balance as a requirement to make or whatever the holy smite equivalent is for TN.

EDIT: Damn, now I want to make a +1 concordant truebane weapon.:smallbiggrin:

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-09-04, 09:10 PM
The easiest way to model concordant is to just make it a +4 bonus enhancement. Which amounts to saying "It's a concordant longsword +1," rather than saying "It's a holy unholy anarchic axiomatic longsword +1."Except that Holy etc are +2 enhancements each.

Edit @ the Ninja: What's Truebane?

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 09:43 PM
I'm probably going to go with anarchic and holy. that way it doesn't cost as much, I don't have true neutral as a requirement and I can still be both chaotic and good.

Cieyrin
2009-09-04, 09:43 PM
Except that Holy etc are +2 enhancements each.

Edit @ the Ninja: What's Truebane?

Truebane is a +3 enhancement that is basically an adaptable Bane. It defaults to your type for bane till it hits something else, then next round it becomes bane against that creature.

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 10:12 PM
okay. Thsi is all concerning my character so no it's not going off topic.

I'm making a Drow warblade. Please don't make comments that say "A Drow Warblade? What in the Nine hells are you doing? don't you realize how unoptimized that is?" or anything like that. I know this and frankly I don't care. my question is how I should arrange my stats. I have
17 16 15 12 12 11

Every situation I can think of has too many drawbacks. I can use my highest for strength, my next for con and my third for Dex and it then looks like this. the problem is my will saving throws won't be good.

17Str 14Con 17Dex 14Int 11wis 14Cha

I can also arrange them like this take a feat and use INT as my will save instead. However in this case my Con is low and my fort saves are bad.
17 str 18 dex 17 Int 14 Cha 10 Con 11wis

this is rolling not pointbuy and these are the numbers I rolled. And I convinced my DM to take the LA down to +1 if that makes it better for those who are cringing.

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-09-04, 10:21 PM
okay. Thsi is all concerning my character so no it's not going off topic.

I'm making a Drow warblade. Please don't make comments that say "A Drow Warblade? What in the Nine hells are you doing? don't you realize how unoptimized that is?" or anything like that. I know this and frankly I don't care. my question is how I should arrange my stats. I have
17 16 15 12 12 11

Every situation I can think of has too many drawbacks. I can use my highest for strength, my next for con and my third for Dex and it then looks like this. the problem is my will saving throws won't be good.

17Str 14Con 17Dex 14Int 11wis 14Cha

I can also arrange them like this take a feat and use INT as my will save instead. However in this case my Con is low and my fort saves are bad.
17 str 18 dex 17 Int 14 Cha 10 Con 11wis

this is rolling not pointbuy and these are the numbers I rolled. And I convinced my DM to take the LA down to +1 if that makes it better for those who are cringing.Few questions. Starting level? How much access to the items you want does your DM give? Does he allow LA buyoff? Does LA count towards IL?

Anyways, don't worry too much about saves, that's what the Diamond Mind maneuvers are for. Boost your saves through cloaks and stuff, but 1/round should be enough to cover your weakest save and keep you from being dominated. I'd go 17 Str(cause, you know, melee), 14 Con(melee+Elf), 17 Int(Warblade), 14 Dex(AC+med armor), 12 Wis(Will save), 13 Cha(charisma).

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 10:25 PM
Few questions. Starting level? How much access to the items you want does your DM give? Does he allow LA buyoff? Does LA count towards IL?

Anyways, don't worry too much about saves, that's what the Diamond Mind maneuvers are for. Boost your saves through cloaks and stuff, but 1/round should be enough to cover your weakest save and keep you from being dominated. I'd go 17 Str(cause, you know, melee), 14 Con(melee+Elf), 17 Int(Warblade), 14 Dex(AC+med armor), 12 Wis(Will save), 13 Cha(charisma).

well I'll probably retire my current character as soon as this dungeon is over. I'm getting tired of playing a Paladin so probably level four maybe four and a half if the XP is enough to get us to level five. Unless the DM doesn't use that rule.

he usually takes our suggestions for magic items for our characters but I think all I can buy for myself at that level is mostly mundane items. although I'm going to get either a silver or cold iron sword. THe DM is nice. I imagine he'll allow LA buyoff and I'm sorry but what does IL mean?

okay. got you on the stats. sounds good.

Flickerdart
2009-09-04, 10:28 PM
...but if the concordant killer
relinquishes its grip, the weapon dissipates.
If the concordant killer is destroyed, the sword it
bears disappears forever.
Immobilize the creature. Chop off arm. Place creature in perma-storage of any kind. It never relinquishes its grip or dies.

Eldariel
2009-09-04, 10:30 PM
Immobilize the creature. Chop off arm. Place creature in perma-storage of any kind. It never relinquishes its grip or dies.

So you're wielding the creature's arm?

Flickerdart
2009-09-04, 10:32 PM
So you're wielding the creature's arm?
No, you're holding on to the sword over top of its hand. You can probably file off extraneous bits: as long as it's still a grip, it should be fine.

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 10:34 PM
you could graft the arm/ hand to yourself.

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-09-04, 10:36 PM
No, you're holding on to the sword over top of its hand. You can probably file off extraneous bits: as long as it's still a grip, it should be fine.I'm feeling Sovereign Glue+a good bit of work with a scalpel+Preserve Organ to get you a thin layer of skin wrapped around the grip...forever. Then just make sure the original owner doesn't die(Imprisonment, Flesh to Stone, or similar).

Cieyrin
2009-09-04, 10:54 PM
I'm feeling Sovereign Glue+a good bit of work with a scalpel+Preserve Organ to get you a thin layer of skin wrapped around the grip...forever. Then just make sure the original owner doesn't die(Imprisonment, Flesh to Stone, or similar).

Sounds like the job of Oil of Timelessness or Profession(Taxidermy) to me.

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 11:15 PM
what feats should I take?

Fax Celestis
2009-09-04, 11:17 PM
But holy and the rest are all +2 enhancements. Putting them all in a +4 enhancement is just saving you moneys, so you get an effectively +5 weapon instead of a +9 one. 0_o

Consider, though, how restricted its users are.

Thrawn183
2009-09-04, 11:22 PM
No more so than any of the enchantments normally are?

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 11:25 PM
will somebody please give a few feat suggestions? I'd like something that would make casters less effective against me.

Xenogears
2009-09-04, 11:35 PM
On topic: Mage Slayer might help. Casters can't cast defensively near you. Sure they can still snipe you from a mile away or just 40ft but it helps.

Semi-off topic: So a concordant weapon would totally own that Succubus Paladin huh? Since she would have Chaos and Evil as subtypes and so take damage as if it were those alignments but is Lawful Good so also takes damage for its real alignments. So that weapon would be so awesome against a succubus Paladin. If that were only a common foe...

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 11:36 PM
semi off topic as well. The succubus paladin would take an extra 8d6. hehehehe

Cieyrin
2009-09-04, 11:38 PM
will somebody please give a few feat suggestions? I'd like something that would make casters less effective against me.

Mage Slayer (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Mage_Slayer,CAr) and Pierce Magical Concealment (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Pierce_Magical_Concealment,CAr) are pretty standard as anti-mage countermeasures go, though your spell-likes will become more or less unusable. Pumping your saves is generally a good measure, though you got advice on that front already. Otherwise, standard Power Attack chain, I suppose.

EDIT: Ninja'd. :smallfrown:


Semi-off topic: So a concordant weapon would totally own that Succubus Paladin huh? Since she would have Chaos and Evil as subtypes and so take damage as if it were those alignments but is Lawful Good so also takes damage for its real alignments. So that weapon would be so awesome against a succubus Paladin. If that were only a common foe...

She's so morally conflicted as is without you picking on her. :smalltongue:

Xenogears
2009-09-04, 11:50 PM
She's so morally conflicted as is without you picking on her. :smalltongue:

Shes not morally conflicted. Shes just at war with the substance that makes u her body...

Unless you go by the BoED and BoVD where she insta-falls for not killing herself... (not killing a fiend is always evil apparently. Even if they are a paladin.)

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 11:51 PM
umm. sorry for my ignorance but spellcraft levels? I don't think warblades get those.

Fax Celestis
2009-09-04, 11:55 PM
umm. sorry for my ignorance but spellcraft levels? I don't think warblades get those.

It's not a requirement, it's a side effect. Basically, as a warblade you have a CL of 0. This feat instead makes it 0-4, for a total CL of -4. Which doesn't affect you, as you don't cast spells at all.

Basically, it's there to keep mages from pwning more.

Mystic Muse
2009-09-04, 11:58 PM
It's not a requirement, it's a side effect. Basically, as a warblade you have a CL of 0. This feat instead makes it 0-4, for a total CL of -4. Which doesn't affect you, as you don't cast spells at all.

Basically, it's there to keep mages from pwning more.

Yay! still need blindfight for the second one though. should I get blindfight or power attack?

Cieyrin
2009-09-04, 11:59 PM
It's not a requirement, it's a side effect. Basically, as a warblade you have a CL of 0. This feat instead makes it 0-4, for a total CL of -4. Which doesn't affect you, as you don't cast spells at all.

Basically, it's there to keep mages from pwning more.

Well, as a Drow, she has some spell-likes that are cast at her character level as CL, so those will take the -4 CL per Mage Slayer/feat requiring Mage Slayer.

Mystic Muse
2009-09-05, 12:01 AM
Well, as a Drow, she has some spell-likes that are cast at her character level as CL, so those will take the -4 CL per Mage Slayer/feat requiring Mage Slayer.

bah! those were of no use anyway. Other than giving my character a blue glow.:smallbiggrin:

Do they affect SR at all?

quick_comment
2009-09-05, 12:03 AM
bah! those were of no use anyway. Other than giving my character a blue glow.:smallbiggrin:

Do they affect SR at all?

If you arent using them, you might want to be a Karsite rather than a drow. Same SR, but you get healed by resisting spells, and get the tasty human bonus feat.

Fax Celestis
2009-09-05, 12:09 AM
If you arent using them, you might want to be a Karsite rather than a drow. Same SR, but you get healed by resisting spells, and get the tasty human bonus feat.

Aren't they less LA too, or are Karsites LA +2 also?

Mystic Muse
2009-09-05, 12:12 AM
Aren't they less LA too, or are Karsites LA +2 also?

+2 but I already got my DM to give Drow only LA+1 plus I can't find anything besides LA on Karsite.

are there any other feats that would help against casters or are those two pretty much it?

Xenogears
2009-09-05, 12:36 AM
Not sure if warblades get it but a thicket of blades stance gives you an AoO whenever anyone takes a 5ft step in your reach so that'd be useful in conjunction with mage slayer if you are already right next to the caster....

Is it bad if my advice is coming from reading Another Gaming Comic?

Mystic Muse
2009-09-05, 12:39 AM
quite possibly

Drider
2009-09-05, 08:28 AM
Except that Holy etc are +2 enhancements each.

Edit @ the Ninja: What's Truebane?

Maybe getting all together gives a discount, I'd make it +6 though, buy 3, get one free sorta deal.

Deth Muncher
2009-09-05, 09:30 AM
Maybe getting all together gives a discount, I'd make it +6 though, buy 3, get one free sorta deal.

I'd say the Concordant feature of an item should totally be discounted, because unless you're True Neutral, you're taking 4 levels of drain to the face when you touch it. It makes True Neutral fun again!
>_>
<_<

Thrawn183
2009-09-05, 12:47 PM
I'd say the Concordant feature of an item should totally be discounted, because unless you're True Neutral, you're taking 4 levels of drain to the face when you touch it. It makes True Neutral fun again!
>_>
<_<

Actually, you'd only be taking at most 2 levels of drain. And just as often as you'd be taking 2 you'd only be taking 1.

Cieyrin
2009-09-06, 12:35 AM
I'd say the Concordant feature of an item should totally be discounted, because unless you're True Neutral, you're taking 4 levels of drain to the face when you touch it. It makes True Neutral fun again!
>_>
<_<

True Neutral has always been fun, what're you talking about? It pisses the DM off less than being Chaotic Neutral (read: Chaotic Evil and the character doesn't know it yet, at least the way a lot of people seem to play CN) and I don't have to be contractual merc like with Lawful Neutral.

Morals? I don't got time for morals! That's for priests and other holy men to worry about, there's that hill to go over and see what's over the one after that and after that.