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Tyndmyr
2009-09-04, 09:10 PM
Im looking at prestige classes for my lowly level 3 wizard...gotta prep early and make sure I hit those prerequisites. I have ridiculous dex, wis, and int, and have plenty of skill points per level. I haven't selected my level 3 feat yet, having just leveled. Im a domain wizard(Unearthed Arcana), and thus, cant qualify for anything that requires specialization.

What do you recommend in the way of generally useful PrCs that don't inhibit caster progression?

mikej
2009-09-04, 09:28 PM
Incantatrix [PGoF] big one here if setting material is allowed.
Initiate of Sevenfold Viel [CA]
Mage of the Arcane Order [CA]
Archmage [DMG]

Sinfire Titan
2009-09-04, 09:28 PM
Ok, the fact that you're using the Domain Wizard makes up for not being a Specialist Wizard (or a focused Specialist). I was going to suggest Master Specialist and Archmage, but those are somewhat worse considering your options.


What race are you? If its Changeling, look into Races of Eberron's Recaster PrC. It may cost you a level of advancement (putting you on par with the Sorcerer in spell progression), but the trade off is worth it (basically, you get a bunch of free metamagic and spells from other classes).

Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil is always a good option.

woodenbandman
2009-09-04, 10:49 PM
Shadowcraft Mage, and Malconvoker are favorites of mine.

Emy
2009-09-04, 11:15 PM
If you're nongood, a Mindbender dip is quite solid.

Every single other suggestion in this thread so far is good too, especially Malconvoker because it just oozes style, but you can't go wrong (except in the "too powerful" direction for some of them) with these: Anima Mage, Halruuan Elder, Hathran, Sacred Exorcist, Divine Oracle (2 level dip), Tainted Scholar, Fatespinner (4 levels).

Really, it depends on what you want to do with your character.

BobVosh
2009-09-05, 12:58 AM
Wild Mage is great if you cheese it up with practiced spellcaster.

Mikej pretty much listed the strongest PrCs in order of brokenness.

Tempest Fennac
2009-09-05, 01:00 AM
Loremaster is neat if you want even more skill points (the Skill Focus (Any Knowledge) prequisite is annoying but you can at least get a feat later to compensate for it.

olentu
2009-09-05, 01:24 AM
Loremaster is neat if you want even more skill points (the Skill Focus (Any Knowledge) prequisite is annoying but you can at least get a feat later to compensate for it.

I think one can grab a skill focus for a knowledge skill from one of the locations in complete scoundrel.

Kylarra
2009-09-05, 01:30 AM
I think one can grab a skill focus for a knowledge skill from one of the locations in complete scoundrel.
Frog God's Fane gives you Skill Focus in Knowledge (History), (nature), or (religion).

valued@ 2k

Jergmo
2009-09-05, 01:32 AM
I'm a fan of Fatespinner, myself. It's quite easy to qualify for, too. Besides what you'd already have, you just need 5 ranks in Profession(Gambler). You're eligible after, what...level 7?

J.Gellert
2009-09-05, 01:57 AM
What about the Hathran? Spontaneous casting is no small deal (though if you are not making a new level 3 character, you may have missed some prerequisites :smalltongue:)

Emy
2009-09-05, 02:05 AM
What about the Hathran? Spontaneous casting is no small deal (though if you are not making a new level 3 character, you may have missed some prerequisites :smalltongue:)

You mention the spontaneous casting, but not Circle Magic? @.@

Kurald Galain
2009-09-05, 04:59 AM
What do you recommend in the way of generally useful PrCs that don't inhibit caster progression?

One level of beguiler then ultimate magus? It puts you one level behind, but with dozens of extra options; I'd consider it a good tradeoff.

Wings of Peace
2009-09-05, 05:31 AM
Anima Mage 4 as others have mentioned is good. It grants you the ability to freely with time persist any spells you wish. If your dm allows you to take it (You normally need to take the Ethran feat at level 1) Hathran 1 combined with Wyrm Wizard 2 (For learning Acorn of Far Travel) lets you cast your spells spontaneously.

Fishy
2009-09-05, 05:41 AM
One level of beguiler then ultimate magus? It puts you one level behind, but with dozens of extra options; I'd consider it a good tradeoff.

Actually several levels behind. UM advances your beguiler casting unless you do some Practiced Spellcaster shenanigans.

I like Divine Oracle -> Loremaster. Skill Focus Knowledge isn't so bad if you're getting to use it twice, and then earn the bonus feat of your choice to make up for it.

Siegel
2009-09-05, 05:44 AM
Why is IotSV considered to be that good ?

mostlyharmful
2009-09-05, 05:47 AM
Why is IotSV considered to be that good ?

Immediate action defenses that stop just about everything along with full casting progression. And since they're Su you can't dispel them and they ignore SR.

Thespianus
2009-09-05, 06:38 AM
While I don't have a suggestion for a PrC, have you considered the feat Arcane Disciple? It requires 4 ranks in Knowledge(Religion), but it will give you one Clerical Domain worth of Wis-based Cleric spells. Normally, Wis is a dump-stat for a Wizard, but since you say your Wisdom is good, this sounds to me like a very sweet way to get your hands on some spells you normally wouldn't get close to.

Which Domain you would pick would be entirely up to you, I have no suggestions, even though any domain that gives you Divine Power can be lots of fun. :)

jiriku
2009-09-05, 08:49 PM
Seconding others here, I have used incantatrix, fatespinner, divine oracle, and archmage very effectively. Incantatrix is ten levels of goodness, progression in the others is more situational; depending on your goals you might want full progression, or just a few levels.

FMArthur
2009-09-05, 09:21 PM
You can qualify for Ultimate Magus with wizard alone and have it progress your wizard levels fully if you trade your wizard bonus feats for the Spontaneous Divination ACF from Complete Champion. The benefits are: an improved caster level, 5 non-divination spells made spontaneous, and a couple of bonus metamagic feats. You can't use Augmented Casting, the class's main attraction, unless you later take levels in other casting classes (Ur-Priest even works and is probably the best option), but you're still better off than straight wizard.

mikej
2009-09-05, 09:35 PM
Which Domain you would pick would be entirely up to you, I have no suggestions, even though any domain that gives you Divine Power can be lots of fun. :)

Trouble is unless the DM okay's custom domains none if them listed Here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#wizardVariantDomainWiz ard) have Divine Power.


Originally posted by BobVosh
Wild Mage is great if you cheese it up with practiced spellcaster.

Mikej pretty much listed the strongest PrCs in order of brokenness.

well, I do try. :smallbiggrin:

Douglas
2009-09-05, 09:44 PM
Trouble is unless the DM okay's custom domains none if them listed Here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#wizardVariantDomainWiz ard) have Divine Power.
Ah, but Arcane Disciple's domain is chosen from this list (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spellLists/clericDomains.htm) (plus a bunch more added in certain splatbooks, mainly Complete Divine and Spell Compendium).

Bad Situation
2009-09-05, 09:46 PM
Initiate of the Sevenfold Veil, Malconvoker, and Incantrix (setting specific) are my favorites. My DM has a little problem with Incantrix though so the class never sees much play.

Gorbash
2009-09-06, 06:38 AM
Earth Dreamer:

Good Fort save
Spellcasting progression at every level
Divination 1/day
X-Ray Vision
Tremorsense
Earth Glide

Very nice defensive PrC and really flavorful. I'm playing one now and being able to do stuff mentioned above really pays off (who needs a rogue with high Hide, MS, Spot and Listen when you can walk and see through walls?). Combine that good fort save with a rat familiar and being a gnome, and I ended up with a +20 fort save at lvl 14. :smallbiggrin:

Thespianus
2009-09-06, 08:43 AM
Trouble is unless the DM okay's custom domains none if them listed Here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/variant/classes/variantCharacterClasses.htm#wizardVariantDomainWiz ard) have Divine Power.

I was referring to the feat Arcane Disciple in Complete Divine, which gives you the spells from one Cleric Domain (not an Arcane Domain, he already has that from the Domain Wizard class variant) to add to your spell list.

He would have to use Wisdom instead of Intelligence to cast them, but since he said his Wisdom was good, there's some handy Cleric spells that opens up this way.

EDIT: Yeah, yeah, I got Ninjaed

mikej
2009-09-06, 08:50 AM
I was referring to the feat Arcane Disciple in Complete Divine, which gives you the spells from one Cleric Domain (not an Arcane Domain, he already has that from the Domain Wizard class variant) to add to your spell list.

Yeah, I'll apologize, had a major brain fart moment and I didn't notice the Arcane Disciple bit. If you have the Wisdom and the feat it's not too bad. I'd rather leave the Divine Power and melee stuff for the Cleric but Spiritual Weapon is pretty darn fun.

Tyndmyr
2009-09-06, 09:26 AM
Some excellent suggestions here...It looks like I can fulfill the prereqs for fatespinner, initiate of the sevenfold veil, and incantrix, respectively.

Get into incantrix at level six, pick up a few levels in that, and a bit of fatespinner when I can, then do the full seven levels for initiate of the sevenfold veil.

Should be a rather nice combo, though I doubt I'll ever bother with the final level of fatespinner.

Tyndmyr
2009-09-06, 09:29 AM
I was referring to the feat Arcane Disciple in Complete Divine, which gives you the spells from one Cleric Domain (not an Arcane Domain, he already has that from the Domain Wizard class variant) to add to your spell list.

He would have to use Wisdom instead of Intelligence to cast them, but since he said his Wisdom was good, there's some handy Cleric spells that opens up this way.

EDIT: Yeah, yeah, I got Ninjaed

Oh, that's also interesting. I won't have a free feat for a bit, but when I do, that certainly is attractive.

18 wisdom, since I really needed a good will save. Everyone else in the party has extremely poor will saves, and I didn't like the idea of a single spell taking us all out. On the flip side, my strength is 3. This provides a number of interesting challenges when it comes to carrying stuff/swimming/etc.

Eldariel
2009-09-06, 09:30 AM
Some excellent suggestions here...It looks like I can fulfill the prereqs for fatespinner, initiate of the sevenfold veil, and incantrix, respectively.

Get into incantrix at level six, pick up a few levels in that, and a bit of fatespinner when I can, then do the full seven levels for initiate of the sevenfold veil.

Should be a rather nice combo, though I doubt I'll ever bother with the final level of fatespinner.

Incantatrix requires you to give up an extra school, so you should go for it all the way if entering it at all. It does give you the goods far greater than the loss, but only if you go for the Incantatrix-levels all the way. Also, it's pretty close to being the best PrC in the game.

And yeah, the last level of Fatespinner is incredibly unimpressive. It's basically a 4-level class.

Gorbash
2009-09-06, 09:38 AM
Oh, that's also interesting. I won't have a free feat for a bit, but when I do, that certainly is attractive.

18 wisdom, since I really needed a good will save. Everyone else in the party has extremely poor will saves, and I didn't like the idea of a single spell taking us all out. On the flip side, my strength is 3. This provides a number of interesting challenges when it comes to carrying stuff/swimming/etc.

You can always take the feat Keen Intellect and use Int modifier for will saves.

Tyndmyr
2009-09-06, 10:53 AM
Incantatrix requires you to give up an extra school, so you should go for it all the way if entering it at all. It does give you the goods far greater than the loss, but only if you go for the Incantatrix-levels all the way. Also, it's pretty close to being the best PrC in the game.

And yeah, the last level of Fatespinner is incredibly unimpressive. It's basically a 4-level class.

Well, since I can enter the first prestige class at sixth level...that gives me a grand total of 15 prestige class levels by the time I hit epic. Initiate of the seven veils is definitely worth taking all seven levels of, IMO, so that still leave eight. Even if I take all four levels of fatespinner, that's four levels of incantrix...and I may opt to do more incantrix, less fatespinner. This campaign is likely to go well into epic, too, so eventually, it's likely I'll finish them all out.

I don't mind banning one school...that still puts me far ahead of where I would be as a specialist wizard.

Keen Intellect would have been a good idea...honestly, I just missed it during character creation. Oh well, not a terrible loss. Cha and str are great dump stats too, and taking Spellcasting Prodigy was certainly a useful choice.

Southern Cross
2009-09-09, 01:39 AM
The Geometer from Complete Arcane looks like a decent prestige class.Not only do you get the cleric spell glyph of warding added to your spellbook (and at higher levels,the greater version),you also get special abilities at each level,in addition to full caster progression.

Gorbash
2009-09-09, 04:42 AM
I don't mind banning one school...that still puts me far ahead of where I would be as a specialist wizard.

Why is being a specialist a bad thing? :smallamused:

sofawall
2009-09-09, 04:55 AM
Be a Generalist or Domain wizard :P

Gnorman
2009-09-09, 05:27 AM
Be a Generalist or Domain wizard :P

No, no, no. Focused Specialist. Conjurer, Illusionist or Transmuter. Generalists are for namby-pambies and elves!

sofawall
2009-09-09, 05:32 AM
They are one and the same.

Hmm... What is the most dwarven school...

Gnorman
2009-09-09, 05:35 AM
They are one and the same.

Hmm... What is the most dwarven school...

Conjuration. Practical. Real. Grounded. Utilitarian. No trickery, just solid pragmatism.

Illusion is too flighty. Enchantment is too deceptive. Necromancy is distasteful. Evocation is just flashes, bangs, and dissipation.

Abjuration is probably a close second. Dwarves likely appreciate the power that Transmutation brings, but are a bit too conservative to embrace the school of change. Divination also has its uses, but doesn't quite fit with the dwarven character of action over thought.

Cyclocone
2009-09-09, 08:14 AM
Nah, Transmutation is the must dwarven school! Think of manly spells like Flesh to Stone, Stone Shape, Transmute Mud to Rock, Move Earth, Earthbind, Earthen Grasp, Fist of Stone, Undermaster, Iron Body, Iron Bones, Xorn Movement and Earth Glide. It can't get more dwarven than that!

Admittedly, Transmutation also has cowardly elven spells like Expeditious Retreat.:smallfrown: