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Chrizzt
2009-09-07, 08:32 AM
Hi folks!

Does anyone know about rules for setting up your own business apart from the ones in the DMG2 (and their expansion in Power of Faerun)? Even third party splatbook suggestions would be nice in this case (provided they have sane rules :smallamused:)
My character has leadership and would also be willing to incorporate followers into the business.
I'm specifically looking for ways to use the followers as an income source apart from Profession, Craft or Perform checks.

Thank you all in advance!

elliott20
2009-09-07, 08:42 AM
here's how I do it

1. create a skill for management, or make one of your relevant job skills the management skill. use your CHA skills for dealing with employees, and your management skill for actual organization and logistics. (an int skill would probably make the most sense here)

2. write up your business like it's a pseudo-character. Give it some skills like craft or profession as a skill, using your followers' average for this if you want a quick and easy one. (or you can make it a hybrid, where the manager's determine the skill levels) Give it HD to represent internal cohesion. Adding more people, more resources, more organizations, more infrastructure increases HD. Losing assets decreases it. So basically, HP and skills for your business.

3. for actually earning money, you'll have to work this out with your GM. Me, I roll a skill check for the entire business, and just multiply the results for income.

4. for buildings, the DMG book price for upkeep is 10%. You'll also have to pay your followers for working as well.

SilveryCord
2009-09-07, 08:47 AM
Unfortunately, with regards to money D&D has always been more gamist than simulationist--its usually expected that all characters are adventurers and thus follow Wealth By Level.

Instead of tracking how money through your business (which would be a pain), maybe you could use the PHB2 affiliation rules and just say that it grows a certain amount and OK which bonuses members/employees get. Make Profession (Management? CEO?) checks to increase the Scale of your business (maybe weekly or monthly) and then determine your criterion for employee scores (including your own score) and then OK the titles/benefits/duties with your DM. Since you're the head honcho, you get the highest tier benefit. (maybe you can take a loan out against your own company, or borrow a special item that was gifted to the company as a reward for its service to a king passing by?)

If you want to have a regular DnD game though, you probably shouldn't represent owning a business as making a monetary value every week. In fact, making money from it at all kind of screws up the game. Just say you have to reinvest it in your company, and you eventually get benefits from being the owner of the company that are similar to the kind you'd get for having 30+ points in an affiliation

elliott20
2009-09-07, 10:07 AM
well, the reality is, if you really wanted to actually RUN a business in game, you'd... do just that and not adventure. So it really depends on what you need these rules for.

if you need it for an NPC, that's one thing. But if you're talking about being an adventurer AND owner, well, you might have to put your cohort as the head manager for your business and just entrust everything to him.

the quick rules I put up above are just that, quick. They aren't detailed, and if you really want to spend any amount of attention on your business, they won't do it justice.

but if you just want to have something you can do with your followers, and just to give your GM more plot hooks, that should be more than sufficient.

Cieyrin
2009-09-07, 10:32 AM
well, the reality is, if you really wanted to actually RUN a business in game, you'd... do just that and not adventure. So it really depends on what you need these rules for.

if you need it for an NPC, that's one thing. But if you're talking about being an adventurer AND owner, well, you might have to put your cohort as the head manager for your business and just entrust everything to him.

the quick rules I put up above are just that, quick. They aren't detailed, and if you really want to spend any amount of attention on your business, they won't do it justice.

but if you just want to have something you can do with your followers, and just to give your GM more plot hooks, that should be more than sufficient.

Profession(Businessman or Merchant) would probably make the most sense in a general sense for running a business but yeah, having your cohort manage the business while you're away, with all your followers doing various duties that are required. If you have a specific business in mind, just use the specific skill for the business. Running a Tavern? Profession(Taverner). A Smithy? Craft(Blacksmith). And so on and so forth.

Them's my 2 coppers. Take as you will.

warrl
2009-09-07, 12:05 PM
2. write up your business like it's a pseudo-character. Give it some skills like craft or profession as a skill, using your followers' average for this if you want a quick and easy one. (or you can make it a hybrid, where the manager's determine the skill levels) Give it HD to represent internal cohesion. Adding more people, more resources, more organizations, more infrastructure increases HD. Losing assets decreases it. So basically, HP and skills for your business.

I like this with some variation.

First, you do NOT average your followers' skill stats to get your business's skill stats in those skills that are most essential to your business. Your skill-master does not really become less proficient for taking on another apprentice.

In fact for those essential skills I'd write up a master-journeyman-apprentice system. Where skill level lets you perform work of a certain difficulty maybe four times per day, and having the duty of supervising or training someone of one-lower skill *category* (5 to 9 points lower in that skill) decreases your effective skill for one of those four times by one point; two-lower skill categories by two points, or by one point on two occasions; etc. You can advise, but can't really train or supervise in their craftwork, someone who is of higher skill points to four points lower. Have some sensible way for your craftsmen to advance in skill (silversmiths should NOT get better at their work by killing monsters), with a bonus for working under someone of higher category.

Ancillary employees - those not performing the core functions - don't normally impact quality of work. The drudges who come in to sweep after all the silversmiths have gone home for the day (locking up their work in a safe)... who cares what their silversmithing skills are?

However, in many businesses the bookkeeper will be an ancillary employee who, while not impacting the quality of the work, can have a great impact on the business.

elliott20
2009-09-07, 10:16 PM
that's true. The rules I wrote down are really more suitable for business where all the workers pretty much perform the same job and pretty much must work independently of each other.

but when you have a business that is fundamentally driven by one your most skilled worker, the organizations business skills could be keyed to the key performer instead. i.e. say you're running a smithy that focuses on high quality works (like say, masterwork weapons), and the structure you have is that you have apprentices all aid a single master smith who is responsible for the actual production of the weapons. In such a scenario, it would make a lot more sense to have your business earnings be tied to your master smith, with aiding bonuses from his apprentices.

Really, it depends entirely upon how much detail you want to go into it and how your organization is structured.

An organization that only does one big contract at a time and has the entire organization backing it would probably have their performance keyed off of their main business performers, rather than an average.

It must be said though, at it's current state, this rule set does not give you any way to properly factor in market conditions and because of it, it assumes that the bigger your scale, the more you earn in return.

Like I said, for a small scale organization or if you just want to quickly emulate an organization without having to manage it too much, this will work fine.

but if you want to make the organization management a major part of the campaign (i.e. say you're running an organization meta-game where you are the king that must manage a kingdom), these rules would need to be expanded upon.

Yahzi
2009-09-08, 10:23 AM
I've got a few in my Ye Olde Shoppe game supplement. Businesses weren't quite the same in those days as they are now. There were a lot more regulations and fees - the lords wanted their cut of what they considered non-productive work (the lords were only happy when everyone was in the fields).

About the only biz it makes sense to run as a D&D campaign is importer/exporter, where you have to do a lot of traveling to strange and distant places.

Check out my sig if you are interested in Ye Olde Shoppe. Thanks.

Asheram
2009-09-08, 10:27 AM
Are there any D20 supplements that deal with businesses and corporations then?
Anyone that plays D20 modern?