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Kobold-Bard
2009-09-08, 01:34 PM
Just something I'd occassionally thought abut before, and re-emerged in my mind when a player in a game I'm in requested using Russian to convey Draconic.

So what real world languages think convey Fictional tongues?

I personally see Elven as French, Dwarven as German and Halfling as Spanish.

Rixx
2009-09-08, 01:38 PM
Halfling I think would work better as Dutch. I've always been partial to Spanish for Draconic, mostly because me and my friends once got a weird error while playing D&D: Tower of Doom that made the dragon we were fighting speak Spanish at us constantly. (The rest of the game was in English.)

John Campbell
2009-09-08, 01:51 PM
Due to a coincidence of real-world native-speakers in one of our games, French is Undercommon.

I personally use Old Norse for Dwarvish, and the Black Speech for Orcish. (There isn't much canon Black Speech extant - the Ring inscription is about half of it - but there are some fan-created dialects of various quality.)

I don't play elves much, but when I do, I tend to name them in Quenya or Sindarin and give the most prosaic possible translation of their names. For instance, I played, for a while, an elven fighter/mage named Palanrandir, which I translated as, "He Who Takes Long Walks".

Temet Nosce
2009-09-08, 01:51 PM
I'd equate Draconic with Latin personally. Elven... unsure, I definitely don't see it as even close to any of the languages mentioned here though. Dwarven, does kinda seem like German however.

PId6
2009-09-08, 01:55 PM
With the assumption that Common is English of course...

Elven French and Dwarven German sounds about right. Gnome would be Dutch while Halfling Italian. Undercommon maybe Spanish.

Kobold-Bard
2009-09-08, 01:57 PM
With the assumption that Common is English of course...

Being unilingual, yes English is my assumption of Common. If I were sucked into Greyhawk tomorrow and Common was actually Portuguese I would be unbelievably screwed.

PId6
2009-09-08, 02:00 PM
Being unilingual, yes English is my assumption of Common. If I were sucked into Greyhawk tomorrow and Common was actually Portuguese I would be unbelievably screwed.
Você fala o português? Yeah, that was probably butchered.

Kobold-Bard
2009-09-08, 02:06 PM
Você fala o português? Yeah, that was probably butchered.

Yeaaaaahhh. Lets just hope I'm a Sorcerer and the spells kick in soon :smallbiggrin:

Lycan 01
2009-09-08, 02:07 PM
I was going to make a thread about this later, actually...


In my games, I've always used Latin to represent Draconic. Yesterday, my GF gave me some ideas for what languages to use for a few other things. So, here's my current set-up for who speaks what...

English <---> Common
Latin <-----> Dragons
Spanish <--> Kobolds, Dragonborn
German <--> Goblins, Orcs, Ogres, et cetera
French <---> Elves, Eladrin, et cetera
Norse <----> Dwarves
Latin <-----> Demons, Devils, other evil things (Its spoken in reverse, btw)


That's all that really comes to mind. I have experience with English (duh), Spanish (tres anos de la clase de Espana...), and German (taking German 201 at the moment). My GF and roommate have experience with French, too.

Granted, none of it is actually spoken. Its just for if I need to scribble down a note or something, or somebody fails a bad Diplomacy roll and starts screaming in Norse. :smallconfused:

Although, I do plan to cobble together really bad German rhymes to yell out at the table for my Half-Orc Bard... :smallbiggrin:

dragonfan6490
2009-09-08, 02:08 PM
Generally people equate Elvish with one of the Gaelic tounges, Dwarvish with Norse and Draconic with Latin. I second the Halfling=Spanish and the French=Undercommon.

John Campbell
2009-09-08, 02:10 PM
Although, I do plan to cobble together really bad German rhymes to yell out at the table for my Half-Orc Bard... :smallbiggrin:

I've discovered that Iron Maiden songs translate disturbingly well into the Black Speech.

shadzar
2009-09-08, 02:12 PM
Now ye all know tha a dwarf speaks in auld english with a cockney accent dinae'ya?

Ormur
2009-09-08, 02:13 PM
Being Icelandic common is Icelandic (as all other languages spoken at the table mixed with the hard-to-translate English words) but if it weren't I'd put it as Dwarfen, it's a harsh language. Yeah I also see elven as French and Draconic as Latin. Those are the only languages I've though about but Halfling as Italian would make sense for me and perhaps infernal as German.

Yeah and for you English speakers that equate Dwarfen with modern Norse (whatever version), I'd advise against it. It's a pretty silly sounding language, old Norse or Icelandic on the other hand... :smallbiggrin:

Thinking about this I think I should adopt the "Allo Allo" method and speak all those languages with the appropriate real-world equivalent accent so non-speakers at the table would know what they shouldn't understand. If the party elves suddenly start speaking with mock French accents the human barbarian should pretend not to understand.

Lycan 01
2009-09-08, 02:15 PM
I've discovered that Iron Maiden songs translate disturbingly well into the Black Speech.

Black Speech from Lord of the Rings? How on earth did you manage to pull that off? :smalleek:

Although, I do like the idea of using Iron Maiden... I'll have to translate The Trooper and The Legacy when I find the time... Thanks! :smallbiggrin:

Oh, and I don't mind shoddily translating it myself. The more broken the German, the better the roleplaying will be...

Prophaniti
2009-09-08, 02:18 PM
Since my group is mostly unilingual with a smattering of phrases from other languages, I like the 'Allo 'Allo idea the best by far. Plus, it's hilarious.

Spiryt
2009-09-08, 02:18 PM
Meh, Elven is totally Finnish, Welsh (Tolkien - totally stereotypical, but face it, the guy definied modern fantasy elf stereotype), possibly Irish, some other Gaelic.

Obviously, there are other interesting choices, but French certainly is'nt one of them.

Kobold-Bard
2009-09-08, 02:25 PM
I just had a flash of Gnomish = Japanese. Don't ask me why, the inner workings of my brain are a mystery even to me.

lsfreak
2009-09-08, 02:31 PM
Meh, Elven is totally Finnish, Welsh (Tolkien - totally stereotypical, but face it, the guy definied modern fantasy elf stereotype), possibly Irish, some other Gaelic.

Certainly there are other interesting choices, but French certainly ins't one of them.

Definitely agree... it's Finnish. Or, actually, from what little I've heard of Farsi, it could be that too.

Disagree with Draconic as Latin. Draconic is some kind of tonal American Indian or African language. Differentiation between different levels of voicing (compare t/d) and aspiration (compare t in top/stop) and unlike European languages has ejectives, implosives, and clicks. Extremely complex with huge numbers of consonants that are impossible to differentiate unless you've specifically studied the language. Part of the reason why spellcasting is difficult is because spells make use of a Draconic-derived language while most of the other languages are Indo-European.

Eldariel
2009-09-08, 02:33 PM
I...don't feel like Finnish suits Elven as is. Finnish has long vowels and hard consonants; it doesn't flow off the tongue like Elven (at least in my mind) should. The Finnish grammar, on the other hand, is great for a rich language with variance within the words themselves (which is what Tolkien did with Quenya). Still, as is, I feel Finnish would be more suited for some harsh ancient language such as Dwarven due to the strong stops so common in Finnish words.

I love the idea of using different real world languages for the variety of in-game languages. Too bad that few groups have sufficient amounts of linguistic skills to implement this fluently into their games :smallfrown: One could try ancient Greek for Elven; it could work out reasonably well. It needs to be an ancient language tho! Of course, optimally I'd just use Quenya for Elven, but that feels like cheating :smallbiggrin:

lsfreak
2009-09-08, 02:41 PM
I...don't feel like Finnish suits Elven as is. Finnish has long vowels and hard consonants; it doesn't flow off the tongue like Elven (at least in my mind) should. The Finnish grammar, on the other hand, is great for a rich language with variance within the words themselves (which is what Tolkien did with Quenya). Still, as is, I feel Finnish would be more suited for some harsh ancient language such as Dwarven due to the strong stops so common in Finnish words.

Perhaps turn the stops into devoiced affricates/fricatives (random made-up word pegda becomes pfekhtha). Of course, most people have no idea what the hell I just said.

Spiryt
2009-09-08, 02:45 PM
I...don't feel like Finnish suits Elven as is. Finnish has long vowels and hard consonants; it doesn't flow off the tongue like Elven (at least in my mind) should. The Finnish grammar, on the other hand, is great for a rich language with variance within the words themselves (which is what Tolkien did with Quenya). Still, as is, I feel Finnish would be more suited for some harsh ancient language such as Dwarven due to the strong stops so common in Finnish words.


Yeah, I wrote Finnish/Welch as combination as it's the base for Tolkien Elvish language, not necessarily pure modern Finnish.

Although it's visible that names and words from Kalevala are similar to Tolkien's elfy elven : Ilmarinen, Vinyamar, Kullervo, Hauin...

And basing on my vast finnish studies*, I agree that it would be also good for some kind of Dwarven, or rather Troll or wild people/elf. It just sounds kinda primal.

*listening to Korpiklaani

xyzzy
2009-09-08, 02:49 PM
Gnomish is Pig Latin, clearly :smalltongue:

Actually, I prefer the idea of dwarven as Russian, elven as Spanish, and common as perhaps German.

Leeham
2009-09-08, 02:53 PM
We totally 'Allo 'Allo it up. Scottish accents for Common (we're from Scotland), REALLY thick Scottish accents for dwarven, middle class English for Elven, German for Draconic, Russian for Goblin. These are the only ones that have come up so far with the new campaign, so it's all I have really.

Temet Nosce
2009-09-08, 02:54 PM
I do like the idea of Undercommon as French. That actually seems to fit to me, I can actually hear it when I think about it.

Lord Herman
2009-09-08, 02:57 PM
But drow should have Italian accents!

In my D&D group, we have a running gag that all drow are Italian mobsters. Don't ask.

charl
2009-09-08, 03:07 PM
I have a tendency to imagine Elven as Finnish (partially due to Tolkien using that language as the base for his Elvish grammar).

My personal list, based on nothing but my own likes is something like this (in my list the languages are even related!). Planar languages are not included, since I think of these as having no Earthly equivalent:

Human Language Family
Common - English
Halfing - Dutch
Gnoll - German

Elven Language Family
Elven - Finnish
Undercommon - Magyar (Hungarian)
Sylvan - Sami (take your pick of dialect)

Dwarven Language Family
Dwarven - Russian
Gnome - Czech
Giant - Old Church Slavonic
Goblin - Bulgarian
Orc - Croatian

Draconic Language Family
Draconic - Latin

This obviously corresponds to several easily recognizable European language groups. While this leaves out a lot of Romance languages, and there's a lack of representation from the Northern Germanic languages, I like this interpretation. If you must, the Dwarven languages could be exchanges for Nordic ones instead, though I personally am against the whole "Dwarves talk like Vikings!"-cliché.

EDIT: The DnD languages are grouped by alphabet according to the PHB.

Spiryt
2009-09-08, 03:18 PM
For halfling, Tolkien like, 2ed "hobbits"/settled halflings Česky could be kinda perfect.

For more Kender like ones, short trip to the south - Magyar would be fine.

Eldariel
2009-09-08, 03:29 PM
I have a tendency to imagine Elven as Finnish (partially due to Tolkien using that language as the base for his Elvish grammar).

My personal list, based on nothing but my own likes is something like this (in my list the languages are even related!). Planar languages are not included, since I think of these as having no Earthly equivalent:

Human Language Family
Common - English
Halfing - Dutch
Gnoll - German

Elven Language Family
Elven - Finnish
Undercommon - Magyar (Hungarian)
Sylvan - Sami (take your pick of dialect)

Dwarven Language Family
Dwarven - Russian
Gnome - Czech
Giant - Old Church Slavonic
Goblin - Bulgarian
Orc - Croatian

Draconic Language Family
Draconic - Latin

This obviously corresponds to several easily recognizable European language groups. While this leaves out a lot of Romance languages, and there's a lack of representation from the Northern Germanic languages, I like this interpretation. If you must, the Dwarven languages could be exchanges for Nordic ones instead, though I personally am against the whole "Dwarves talk like Vikings!"-cliché.

EDIT: The DnD languages are grouped by alphabet according to the PHB.

I'd probably trade the Slavic and Finno-Ugric languages around. I feel Russian makes for great Elven and the other two fall in place as it goes. You'd have to take few more Finno-Ugric languages to the deal, but that seems very doable. Toss Estonian and e.g. Mari or one of the other smaller languages of the group.

But that's just me, I suppose. I can't deny that Sami feels like a perfect fit for Sylvan though.

Spiryt
2009-09-08, 03:31 PM
I feel Russian makes for great Elven and the other two fall in place as it goes.

Russian? Elven?

Maybe that's just my Slavic perspective, but Russian is anything but not Elven...

Jair Barik
2009-09-08, 03:34 PM
There is a bit on the Draconic language in the Dracomnicon including sample words and such. But in the setting it is definitely akin to latin except for the fact that people actually speak it with some cultures having it as a major language.

Eldariel
2009-09-08, 03:37 PM
Russian? Elven?

Maybe that's just my Slavic perspective, but Russian is anything but not Elven...

Mmmh, I like how Russian flows. The rather large number of different fricatives heavily employed in the languages does feel kinda weird for Elven, but I think the overall sound of Russian is pretty good for Elven.

Then again, Russian is one of the languages I don't yet speak on any relevant level, so I can't claim to be an expert on the matter.

Flickerdart
2009-09-08, 03:37 PM
Yeah, Russian doesn't quite work for Elven. It can be a beautiful language, but it's not pretty-sounding, which is what Elven is supposed to be, far as I can figure. Perhaps Elvish could be Japanese: bards study it so they can sing the Elvish songs, and anime nerds study Japanese for a similar reason.

Spiryt
2009-09-08, 03:52 PM
Well, it depends on Elves I guess, Russian can certainly sound mysterious and alike, but it's generally too... human, carnal and stuff?

My knowledge about fricatives, sounds, stresses and languages in general is close to 0, but I think that Russian is not 'Elven-like' accented at all.

I think that can be it, Russians stress words in characteristic way - I can't put a finger on it, beacuse my ear is from plastic :smalltongue:, but I think it doesn't fit.

FeAnPi
2009-09-08, 04:02 PM
And what about Sanskrit for Elven? It is an ancient language, and it did not change very much during the centuries.

charl
2009-09-08, 04:03 PM
Well, I figured that each of the major language groups of DnD (based on the alphabets listed in the PHB) should be pretty distinctive. Now, as for Russian, well I think it's a perfect fit for Dwarven. It's to my understanding anyway a pretty effective language in that it doesn't need as many "conditionals" as for example English. It can be very harsh sounding, but at the same time to an outsider it can drift into a surprisingly melodic and mellow passages occasionally, which to me fits Dwarven very well. It's also very distinct from Germanic languages, and it just doesn't make sense to me that Dwarves, who in many settings are very ancient and isolated from human civilization, would speak something that is fundamentally similar to Common (English). So for them to speak Norse languages just doesn't feel right.

T.G. Oskar
2009-09-08, 04:14 PM
Let's give it a try, then!

Common: I'd say an universal language, though perhaps not Esperanto. Given how it sounds, I'd say Interlingua. However, to people like us, it would sound like our native language.

Which in my case, it would be Spanish.

Elven: despite how much Quenya may draw from the Finnish/Suomi language, I can't help but find that a Gaelic language suits them better. However, I would say that a different accent from typical Gaelic accent would go for the Elven nations; perhaps a subtle French accent. Or British English accent.

Dwarven: real Dwarven asks for a strong language, one of Scandinavian roots. However, to hold with tradition, and how difficult it may be, the way Dwarves pronounce it ends up sounds rather Scottish. So they don't speak Scottish, but their accent is so strong that their Common would sound like it, even if Common is basically Interlingua.

Gnome: now, oddly enough, I perceive Gnome as a fit for Finnish. Gnomes, though, would speak their language in such a way that it sounds like a tongue-twister; thus, it would be very difficult to pronounce (and Gnomes would be very good with limericks on any language given some time to pronounce it)

Halfling: Well...I don't think I can figure any language fit for them. Spanish isn't very good, since Spanish is a bit more religious in origin. In old times, French was considered the diplomatic language, Italian the cultured and artistic language, and Spanish the best for religious fervor. However, I can allow a suggestion to Halflings, and is that they speak in a form of cant. Their words, regardless of language, would have a double meaning, and the language becomes a combination of intonation and word.

Orc: a rough language, perhaps Russian. Though, perhaps not Russian. However, and this may fit them perfectly; if they speak in Common, they speak in a guttural Irish accent.

Sylvan: this language is even more difficult. Since Elven would be a natural derivation of Sylvan IMO, it would be perhaps a purer form of Gaelic, perhaps tied with Proto-Scandinavian and Slavic words. However, it would be best sung rather than spoken, chanted like if you heard a Native American Shaman.

Celestial: this language can't be spoken; it must be sung. I'd say a very Semitic language, perhaps a base of Aramaic, with some Latin mingled around.

Abyssal: this one is definitely guttural, harsh sounding, insulting, and whatnot. Definitely anyone that's a native Abyssal speaker will sound guttural in any language. I'd say Abyssal is a language based on how would you say every single cuss word in the world, without sounding pretty. The cuss words that sound the most insulting would be the core of Abyssal.

Infernal: we already have that language. It's Legalese... Alright, out of the joke, Infernal is a rather subtle language, almost whispered, but extremely complex. It would be a literal nightmare to learn Infernal grammar, and those who manage to learn it still won't speak it with fluidity. Any language would fit, but it has to have such a complex grammar and use such a cultured language, that speaking the language sounds like petty flattering.

Elemental languages: Auran is basically whistling, but pretty whistling; like you'd hear from a bird singing. Any good languages that could be whistled?

Aquan would be like speaking a language underwater, so make it the language you could understand the best if you could just hear bubbling.

Ignan would have lots of language ending in "-shh"

Terran...well, that would require lots of r sounds, but not the short "r" sounds; rather, the long "r" sounds (like on railroad)

And Draconic...well, I could support Latin, but with terminations on Esperanto, the "z" sound in Spanish for anything that sounds like a hiss, perhaps peppered with modern German, and influences from another language or two.

deuxhero
2009-09-08, 04:21 PM
The French sterotype matchs the elf "sterotype" (is it a sterotype if the RAW says most elfs do act that way?) pretty well.

Eldariel
2009-09-08, 04:46 PM
And what about Sanskrit for Elven? It is an ancient language, and it did not change very much during the centuries.

I was thinking of this, but I honestly have to say that I have not spoken nor heard enough spoken Sanskrit to know if it's truly a good match. Nothing else feels too accurate to me though.

Maybe Celtic languages? I mean, I know Finnish/Welsh was already suggested, but frankly, would e.g. Welsh be a better match?


@T.G. Oskar: Considering I've yet to hear a foreigner speak Finnish on a level that I'd for a moment think them for a native, on that criterion it'd be a great match for your idea of Gnomish.

Calmar
2009-09-08, 04:51 PM
Common = Whatever everyone in a gaming group speaks and understands...

I won't suggest anything for monster cultures, because it does not make much sense to me. Halflings and Elves should have their own languages, not something related to human languages.

My suggestions for equivalents for important nonhuman D&D languages that might have had an influence on human cultures.

Draconic = Ancient Greek. (Was voting for Latin first since it's the language of sages and scholars, but AG is the language of Platon, Sokrates, et al who basically invented science.)
Celestial = Egyptian.
Infernal = Latin. (Being extremele complex it's well suited for devilish contracts.)
Abyssal = No clue.
Auran and Ignan (maybe even all elemental languages) = Arabic dialects. (Djinn and efreet are from Arabian mythology and I assume that these languages might be spoken in Arabian Nights-themed cultures as well.)

Spiryt
2009-09-08, 04:51 PM
Thinking about it, I would make Giant Russian.

"Rude", peasantish sounding (like from simple folk songs ) for sterotypical brute Hill Giants, and noble, literary sounding Russian for "high" dignified Cloud and Storm Giants.

I totally can see huge Storm Giant talking like that (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtmeQjiI2bU). A bit less "singy" perhaps.:smallwink:

EDIT: Or like that? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-lzkF1GLHY&feature=related)

Calmar
2009-09-08, 04:56 PM
I totally can see huge Storm Giant talking like that (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EtmeQjiI2bU). A bit less "singy" perhaps.:smallwink:

EDIT: Or like that? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-lzkF1GLHY&feature=related)

Hehe. :smallsmile:

But I wonder if it's the language, or rather the singer's voice that's Giantic...

Spiryt
2009-09-08, 05:00 PM
Hehe. :smallsmile:

But I wonder if it's the language, or rather the singer's voice that's Giantic...

In few moments when I can catch some words, I feel that it's Russian languge indeed fits very well, although probably similar Slavic languages could fit as well.

Ashes
2009-09-08, 05:01 PM
I just wanted to say, that I got a bit annoyed at all the mentions of "Norse" next to regular modern languages. There is no such thing as a Norse language.

And by the way, if you didn't know, Swedish, Norwegian and especially Icelandic has this very sing-song like quality, as did the ancient nordic languages. So for all you people imagining it as a gruff language perfect for Dwarves, I think you are mistaken. The only Scandinavian language that comes close to being gruff, is Danish, and that sounds a bit more pissed off, than most Dwarves should be.

Kobold-Bard
2009-09-08, 05:02 PM
Let's give it a try, then!

Common: I'd say an universal language, though perhaps not Esperanto. Given how it sounds, I'd say Interlingua. However, to people like us, it would sound like our native language.

Which in my case, it would be Spanish.

Elven: despite how much Quenya may draw from the Finnish/Suomi language, I can't help but find that a Gaelic language suits them better. However, I would say that a different accent from typical Gaelic accent would go for the Elven nations; perhaps a subtle French accent. Or British English accent.

Dwarven: real Dwarven asks for a strong language, one of Scandinavian roots. However, to hold with tradition, and how difficult it may be, the way Dwarves pronounce it ends up sounds rather Scottish. So they don't speak Scottish, but their accent is so strong that their Common would sound like it, even if Common is basically Interlingua.

Gnome: now, oddly enough, I perceive Gnome as a fit for Finnish. Gnomes, though, would speak their language in such a way that it sounds like a tongue-twister; thus, it would be very difficult to pronounce (and Gnomes would be very good with limericks on any language given some time to pronounce it)

Halfling: Well...I don't think I can figure any language fit for them. Spanish isn't very good, since Spanish is a bit more religious in origin. In old times, French was considered the diplomatic language, Italian the cultured and artistic language, and Spanish the best for religious fervor. However, I can allow a suggestion to Halflings, and is that they speak in a form of cant. Their words, regardless of language, would have a double meaning, and the language becomes a combination of intonation and word.

Orc: a rough language, perhaps Russian. Though, perhaps not Russian. However, and this may fit them perfectly; if they speak in Common, they speak in a guttural Irish accent.

Sylvan: this language is even more difficult. Since Elven would be a natural derivation of Sylvan IMO, it would be perhaps a purer form of Gaelic, perhaps tied with Proto-Scandinavian and Slavic words. However, it would be best sung rather than spoken, chanted like if you heard a Native American Shaman.

Celestial: this language can't be spoken; it must be sung. I'd say a very Semitic language, perhaps a base of Aramaic, with some Latin mingled around.

Abyssal: this one is definitely guttural, harsh sounding, insulting, and whatnot. Definitely anyone that's a native Abyssal speaker will sound guttural in any language. I'd say Abyssal is a language based on how would you say every single cuss word in the world, without sounding pretty. The cuss words that sound the most insulting would be the core of Abyssal.

Infernal: we already have that language. It's Legalese... Alright, out of the joke, Infernal is a rather subtle language, almost whispered, but extremely complex. It would be a literal nightmare to learn Infernal grammar, and those who manage to learn it still won't speak it with fluidity. Any language would fit, but it has to have such a complex grammar and use such a cultured language, that speaking the language sounds like petty flattering.

Elemental languages: Auran is basically whistling, but pretty whistling; like you'd hear from a bird singing. Any good languages that could be whistled?

Aquan would be like speaking a language underwater, so make it the language you could understand the best if you could just hear bubbling.

Ignan would have lots of language ending in "-shh"

Terran...well, that would require lots of r sounds, but not the short "r" sounds; rather, the long "r" sounds (like on railroad)

And Draconic...well, I could support Latin, but with terminations on Esperanto, the "z" sound in Spanish for anything that sounds like a hiss, perhaps peppered with modern German, and influences from another language or two.

Wow. I forgot that there were Playgrounders who study/enjoy languages. It's people like you who make me feel dumb (in the nicest way possible). That was an honestly interesting read.

Dixieboy
2009-09-08, 05:11 PM
Dwarven is Jutlandic, or Latin.
Because Latin is just such a "Strong" language. (There are rules, and there are no goddamn exceptions!)

Halfling... I'm thinking Dutch

Elven is Asian, probably Korean or Chinese. (I don't speak either one, but it SOUNDS about right)

Gnomes are French or German depending on your flavor of gnome.

That's really what i can think off.

Sstoopidtallkid
2009-09-08, 05:17 PM
So, I'm the only one who regularly pictures Halflings speaking Romani?

Flickerdart
2009-09-08, 05:21 PM
Hehe. :smallsmile:

But I wonder if it's the language, or rather the singer's voice that's Giantic...
Definitely voice. As with all opera, the words are twisted and hammered into the singing to sound nice, comprehension be damned.

This (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=shqtflastkg&feature=related) certainly has clearer lyrics, and may make a better point.

Xyk
2009-09-08, 05:24 PM
I would put it this way:

Common- English
Elven- French
Dwarven- German
Gnomish- One of those Germanic languages
Halfling- Probably Dutch
Draconic- That african language with the clicks and whistles and whatnot.
Giant- Definitely Russian
Goblin- Probably a slavic language though I know nothing of them.
Orc- A different Slavic language.
Celestial- Latin
Infernal- Nital (latin backwards)
Abyssal- Ancient Greek
Undercommon- Probably Chinese but maybe Spanish or Portuguese.

Dixieboy
2009-09-08, 05:28 PM
The only Scandinavian language that comes close to being gruff, is Danish, and that sounds a bit more pissed off, than most Dwarves should be.

I call Bovine feces!

SlyGuyMcFly
2009-09-08, 05:32 PM
I've always figured that Dwarven would sound like Euskara. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basque_language) Why? Because it is a language not related to any other language in the world and can easily be made to sound like a cement mixer full of rocks thanks to the large numbers of Ks Ts Ds and Zs in it. With my apologies to any Basques who may be reading this. :smallsmile:

Elves should sound kinda like Irish or Welsh, Common is English and Draconic sounds like Sanskrit (because most other languages derive from it).

charl
2009-09-08, 05:40 PM
I just wanted to say, that I got a bit annoyed at all the mentions of "Norse" next to regular modern languages. There is no such thing as a Norse language.

And by the way, if you didn't know, Swedish, Norwegian and especially Icelandic has this very sing-song like quality, as did the ancient nordic languages. So for all you people imagining it as a gruff language perfect for Dwarves, I think you are mistaken. The only Scandinavian language that comes close to being gruff, is Danish, and that sounds a bit more pissed off, than most Dwarves should be.

I would like to point out that native speakers of Scandinavian languages don't notice the "sing song" at all. It is a mystery to most of us why foreigners think of our language that way.

Furthermore, Icelandic and Faroese are very different to Norwegian, Danish and Swedish. While a Swede can understand Norwegian with little problem, and Danish as long as it is spoken slowly and clearly, there is simply no way to understand Icelandic at all. It is supposedly harder to learn than German.

But Swedish, Danish and Norwegian are basically mutually intelligible, so if you assign those you should keep in mind that they could almost be said to be dialects of the same language.

And Danish may sound gruff, but it's not a "hard" language. It is sometimes said as a joke that Danish is what you get if you try to speak Swedish with a southern dialect while eating spoon-fulls of porridge. As such, it is pretty soft.

Dixieboy
2009-09-08, 05:45 PM
I would like to point out that native speakers of Scandinavian languages don't notice the "sing song" at all. It is a mystery to most of us why foreigners think of our language that way..

Actually the "sing-song" quality is often noted by Danes as the prime difference between our language and the other scandinavian languages.
Just a little something.

AslanCross
2009-09-08, 05:55 PM
I always thought that Celestial was either Greek, Hebrew or Latin, and that Infernal was a perversion thereof (being spoken backwards, as suggested above, seems like a good idea). Abyssal would sound like a string of curse words no matter what your native language is.

There was also a really old post in this forum about how Infernal linguistics might work---given the really strict hierarchies that govern Hell, there would be several levels of speech. The closest equivalent for this in real languages I can think of is Japanese, where the forms of address change depending on the speaker's relationship with the other person.

charl
2009-09-08, 06:01 PM
Actually the "sing-song" quality is often noted by Danes as the prime difference between our language and the other scandinavian languages.
Just a little something.

That could have something to do with that you guys don't know how to articulate properly. ;)

Naw, seriously. I hadn't heard that before. Good to know.

Eldariel
2009-09-08, 06:43 PM
That could have something to do with that you guys don't know how to articulate properly. ;)

Naw, seriously. I hadn't heard that before. Good to know.

Yeah, I've heard a Dane describe Swedish as "sung Danish". That's what I mean by "flowing"; the words are seamlessly tied together with little pause in-between and the sounds blend into a symphony of speech that culminates in a meaning.

Eldan
2009-09-08, 07:03 PM
Actually, I always imagined halfling as yiddish, at least since one of our first games (when we still played in german), where there was a halfling talking like that.

Ormur
2009-09-08, 07:14 PM
I've often wanted to know how Icelandic sounds to foreigners. Hearing it equated to the silly sung Norwegian and Swedish is a pretty big disappointment. :smallannoyed:

Before I had heard it likened to the completely unrelated Finnish in pronunciation.

charl
2009-09-08, 07:44 PM
I've often wanted to know how Icelandic sounds to foreigners. Hearing it equated to the silly sung Norwegian and Swedish is a pretty big disappointment. :smallannoyed:

Before I had heard it likened to the completely unrelated Finnish in pronunciation.

Icelandic sounds like Old Norse to me. Not much of a surprise, I suppose.

T.G. Oskar
2009-09-08, 08:06 PM
So, I'm the only one who regularly pictures Halflings speaking Romani?

You got me on that one.

I'd say Romani cant, where one word can have more than one meaning.

And taking a cue of Eldan's proposal, Halflings would have a Yiddish accent (if that even exists)

@Ashes: the idea of Dwarves speaking the Nordic protolanguage comes from the best known form of dwarves: the curse-forging master blacksmiths, who were the only ones that could make magical weapons of any kind. So, it is expected to have them speak such a family of languages, probably proto-Scandinavian.

But, and I say but, since...I dunno, always, Dwarves have been associated with a strong and gruff accent, and almost always like a Scottish. Now, try to picture a strong accent, sounding like a Scottish, and speaking proto-Scandinavian.

@Aslan: I'd love to hear someone speaking in Infernal. It would sound like a Japanese reading a contract aloud; in typical Legalese. Where, if you somehow say "yes?", you'd be agreeing to something sinister. But yeah, the "layers" of language depending on importance would be a fine addition to a language fit for making contracts and trying to hide the truth.

@Calmar: I can't see that for Auran (although sung Arabic sounds interesting, when they shout and read aloud the Qu'ran), but Ignan? Sounds like a mighty fine idea. Though I'd imagine the person speaking Ignan spitting a lot because of the long "r" and the "sh" sounds (with excuses to native Arabic language speakers) Also, not convinced on any Arabic language for Aquan and Terran.

Bakkan
2009-09-08, 08:11 PM
Let's see...

Common: English, because it's my first language
Elven: Ecclesiastical Latin (Church Latin)
Dwarven: German (stereotypical, but it always seemed to fit)
Halfling: Irish
Gnome: Not sure, perhaps Yiddish
Orc: Russian, perhaps. Actually the Black Speech from Tolkien is good, though I am not sure what he based it off of.
Celestial: Classical Latin, or a variation thereof (I always think of the Ancients' language in Stargate SG-1)
Infernal: Also classical Latin
Draconic: No idea.

Lapak
2009-09-09, 01:52 AM
For Draconic, I'd be tempted to go with Sumerian.

- It's not just a dead language, it's a language that's been dead for a VERY long time.
- It was used in daily life, then used for ceremonial and scientific purposes after it was replaced by another in everyday use.
- It's not related to any languages that most of us speak today, and is a type of language that would be difficult for most of us to learn.
- It is the language of one of the very earliest recorded civilizations.

Calmar
2009-09-09, 04:00 AM
@Calmar: I can't see that for Auran (although sung Arabic sounds interesting, when they shout and read aloud the Qu'ran), but Ignan? Sounds like a mighty fine idea. Though I'd imagine the person speaking Ignan spitting a lot because of the long "r" and the "sh" sounds (with excuses to native Arabic language speakers) Also, not convinced on any Arabic language for Aquan and Terran.

All the elemental cultures (djinn, dao, marid, efreet) are Arabian in style. Therefore several variations of this language make sense to me. I guess it's more a matter of voice than language here.
Of course it's most likely not a perfect sollution. I don't know really much about Arabic. Maybe there are several languages closely related to Arabic that are different none the less? English, German, and the Scandinavic languages are also related but still very different.

charl
2009-09-09, 05:06 AM
All the elemental cultures (djinn, dao, marid, efreet) are Arabian in style. Therefore several variations of this language make sense to me. I guess it's more a matter of voice than language here.
Of course it's most likely not a perfect sollution. I don't know really much about Arabic. Maybe there are several languages closely related to Arabic that are different none the less? English, German, and the Scandinavic languages are also related but still very different.

Arabic is very diverse. There are many different dialects, and they are not all mutually intelligible. The only closely related language I can think of is Maltese. Hebrew is a distant relative though, as is Aramaic and Syriac.

EDIT: Can't forget Amharic and Tigrinya either (spoken in Ethiopia and Eritrea).

Nai_Calus
2009-09-09, 07:14 AM
I see Elven as being more Chinese or Japanese than anything else.

Both are generally difficult for Westerners to learn, which fits with what's been written about Elven being very hard for non-elves to learn. Japanese has a very flowing sound due to a general lack of ending consonants, Chinese sounds almost like singing sometimes. Both have a complicated, flowing writing system. Japanese especially lends itself to layering meaning in the written form.

So I'd use one or the other for Elven. (And the unused one for Drow)

daggaz
2009-09-09, 07:33 AM
Huh...

Elven is elven, clearly. And Drow speak drow, of course.

Orcs and Goblins speak Klingon.

Common is Esparanté.

Draconic is Parseltongue.

Dwarves speak Hut.

That pretty much covers our games..