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Melamoto
2009-09-08, 05:05 PM
Ok, I think most people will agree (Although this doesn't include me) that the Truenamer just doesn't work and should not be played. That, I can accept.

But what about all the Utterances? Some of them seem pretty good to me, and more powerful than most non-cheesy/overpowered spells. What are your favourite utterances?

Mine is definitely Magical Contraction. Extended, it gives an ally 10 rounds of free use of empower spell. Alternatively, Spell Resistance that makes me wish you could boost your Truenamer level as easily as Caster. Second favourite would be temporal spiral. Daze an enemy for 3 rounds. Will Negates, but Truenamer Saves are always equivalent to as if it were the highest level of spell a caster of the same level could use. So good luck with that one.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-09-08, 05:15 PM
Up to level 8 or 9, the utterances are ok. So that's level 1 and level 2 utterances, tehn.

Level 3's don't seem to be worth it.

Fax Celestis
2009-09-08, 05:18 PM
I actually like the spells with Truename components stuff, particularly unnaming. If I were to try to rescue Truenaming, I'd work it that way: more powerful spells that require a special check during the casting, but still work within the bounds of typical arcane casters.

Melamoto
2009-09-08, 05:20 PM
Up to level 8 or 9, the utterances are ok. So that's level 1 and level 2 utterances, tehn.

Level 3's don't seem to be worth it.
Not even Incarnation of Angels, or Temporal Spiral? Not to mention Energy Negation and Word of Nurturing.



I actually like the spells with Truename components stuff, particularly unnaming. If I were to try to rescue Truenaming, I'd work it that way: more powerful spells that require a special check during the casting, but still work within the bounds of typical arcane casters.
That does sound pretty cool. But the entire point of Tome of Magic was adding in new types of magic, similar to Tome of Battle. In the case of the Truenamer, an attempt to see if they could make casting work off of skill checks, they failed. But I still like the idea, and just because WotC did it wrong doesn't mean it can't be done right.

Kobold-Bard
2009-09-08, 06:24 PM
I think it was Salvonus (but I could be mistaken) who mentioned a Truenaming PrC that was pretty good if accessed via Wizard, Demonbinder perhaps. Never looked into it, but maybe that's another way to look at Truenaming.

I also don't know the details of it (Truenaming has never jumped out at me) but this homebrew (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90961&highlight=truename) seems to come highly recommended.

Steward
2009-09-08, 06:36 PM
If I were to try to rescue Truenaming

Really? You will? Gee, thanks! :D

Edit: Basically, the idea of Truenamers isn't bad, but it was constructed in a way that made it frustratingly weak -- the arcane equivalent of playing a gestalt Paladin/Barbarian with Metapsionic feats.

Kyeudo
2009-09-08, 06:49 PM
I've done some work of my own (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=120488) trying to make Truenaming work. I kept all of the old utterances (a lot moved a level or two, one moved lexicon), so it is fully backwards compatible with previous characters. Oh, and I added a reason to research a creature's personal truename.

Optimystik
2009-09-08, 07:17 PM
Spell Rebirth would be my favorite, just because it's so unique and elegant. But my TN ended up just bashing with his mace anyway :smallfrown:

Zaq
2009-09-08, 08:56 PM
I've made a few comments (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=114269&highlight=Experiences+Truenamer) on Truenamers and their Utterances. The second post has a lot of material on Utterances, as does this one. (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6270684&postcount=49)