World of Warcraft VI: Additional Threads Cannot Be Launched

[Guancyto]

Autolock evade go go go!

I hear Lupy had some questions.

[TheEmerged]

Questions have you. Answers have we.

Guarantees the two are related, have we not :smallredface:

My main (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-achievements.xml?r=silver+hand&n=Shaynta)

Primary Alt (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Silver+Hand&cn=Laram&gn=Aggressive+%C3%9Fy+Nature)

[Kish]

Well, someone at the end of the last thread said "post links to your characters," so...

I have others, but this (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Scarlet+Crusade&n=Trian) is the most advanced one.

[The Linker]

Here be the incomplete list of GitP characters, organized alphabetically by server (after being divided into US and EU sections). If you want in, just give (via post or PM) your name and your realm, and I can find the rest. Of course, it'll go faster if you give your level, race, and class. :smallbiggrin: Spec is optional -- you're free to give it, but if you don't think it's important or you're experimenting, that's fine too.

If you see the level listed here is way behind your current level, or your spec's been changes, post or PM me to update it! You could also alert me when, say, you've deleted your character, race changed it, name changed it, server transferred it...


Now -- The Challenge: I'm a perfectionist. Every mistake you find will net you a Point. This could be something like a bad link, but a missing capital letter, improper spacing, inconsistencies, anything is worth a Point. The more notoriously anal you are, the more points you get. The person who gets the most points gets to make the next one if they're so damn good at it to ask me to make an alt on their server to be their slave for an hour. And I will jump off cliffs at your urging. :smallamused:

Warcraft in the Playground -- Version 1.3

US and Oceanic Servers

Archimonde

Alliance

tyckspoon: Dougalmcstew (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Archimonde&n=Dougalmcstew), 80 Dwarf Paladin

Area 52

Horde

Mattarias, King.: Mattarias (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Area+52&n=Mattarias), 80 Blood Elf Mage

Mattarias, King.: Reios (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Area+52&n=Reios), 73 Blood Elf Paladin

Bronzebeard

Horde

Anatharon: Zulmaran (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bronzebeard&n=Zulmaran), 76 Troll Beast Mastery Hunter

Anatharon: Rekiraak (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bronzebeard&n=Rekiraak), 64 Orc Frost Death Knight

Anatharon: Zarikash (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bronzebeard&n=Zarikash), 36 Blood Elf Combat Rogue

Anatharon: Kelaos (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bronzebeard&n=Kelaos), 15 Blood Elf Demonology Warlock

Anatharon: Sathias (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Bronzebeard&n=Sathias), 11 Blood Elf Discipline Priest

Cenarion Circle

Alliance

The Linker: Linkera (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Cenarion+Circle&n=Linkera), 65 Draenei Holy Priest

Horde

AgentPaper: Lithdrail (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Cenarion+Circle&n=Lithdrail), 36 Blood Elf Hunter

AgentPaper: Queldanem (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Cenarion+Circle&n=Queldanem), 20 Blood Elf Paladin

Darkspear

Alliance

Archangel Yuki: Necrodermis (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Darkspear&n=Necrodermis), 80 Night Elf Rogue

Destromath

Alliance

ReluctantReaper: Hiandran (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Destromath&n=Hiandran), 71 Draenei Paladin

Dragonblight

Horde

The Linker: Trium (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Dragonblight&n=Trium), 13 Tauren Hunter

Duskwood

Alliance

drakeblood4: Bannen (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Duskwood&n=Bannen), 79 Human Warlock

Executus

Alliance

Anatharon: Muran (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Executus&n=Muran), 20 Dwarf Protection Paladin

Frostmourne (Oceanic)

Horde

The Linker: Durgregin (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Frostmourne&n=Durgregin), 33 Tauren Shaman

Garrosh

Alliance

Prophanti: Bryngar (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Garrosh&n=Bryngar), 64 Dwarf Hunter

Horde

Prophanti: Kemall (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Garrosh&n=Kemall), 80 Tauren Warrior

Galakrond

Alliance

Manicotti: Manicotti (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Galakrond&n=Manicotti), 80 Human Rogue

Jubei'Thos (Oceanic)

Alliance

Hailphage: Irongouger (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Jubei%27Thos&n=Irongouger) 22 Dwarf Hunter

Kilrogg

Alliance

Zherog: Caigin (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kilrogg&n=Caigin), 70 Dwarf Hunter

Zherog: Uvora (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kilrogg&n=Uvora), 22 Draenei Shadow Priest

Kirin Tor

Alliance

Alex Star: Rhysode (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Kirin+Tor&n=Rhysode), 80 Human Protection Pally

Llane

Alliance

The Linker: Daidistelf (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Llane&n=Daidistelf), 80 Night Elf Kitty Druid

The Linker: Daidisto (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Llane&n=Daidisto), 70 Human Rogue

The Linker: Daidist (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Llane&n=Daidist), 61 Dwarf Hunter

Horde

The Linker: Basilis (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Llane&n=Basilis), 80 Tauren Hunter

The Linker: Daenerian (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Llane&n=Daenerian), 61 Blood Elf Rogue

The Linker: Tranoria (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Llane&n=Tranoria), 31 Blood Elf Demonology Warlock

The Linker: Shmash (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Llane&n=Shmash), 14 Orc Arms Warrior

Maelstrom

Horde

darkblust: Sardor (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Maelstrom&n=Sardor), 21 Troll Mage

darkblust: Bulle (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Maelstrom&n=Bulle), 11 Tauren Warrior

Magtheridon

Horde

AgentPaper: Gurukai (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Magtheridon&n=Gurukai), 80 Orc Shaman

AgentPaper: Keule (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Magtheridon&n=Keule), 80 Troll Protection Warrior

AgentPaper: Guruchill (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Magtheridon&n=Guruchill), 62 Tauren Death Knight

AgentPaper: Firehoof (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Magtheridon&n=Firehoof), 43 Tauren Druid

AgentPaper: Gurumal (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Magtheridon&n=Gurumal), 34 Orc Warlock

AgentPaper: Guruken (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Magtheridon&n=Guruken), 11 Undead Rogue

AgentPaper: Drools (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Magtheridon&n=Drools), 10 Undead Mage

Malfurion

Alliance

The_Glyphstone: Fantastkfred (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Malfurion&n=Fantastkfred), 80 Draenei Restoration Shaman

The_Glyphstone: Fredthedread (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Malfurion&n=Fredthedread), 77 Human Paladin

The_Glyphstone: Fredinand (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Malfurion&n=Fredinand), 71 Human Warlock

The_Glyphstone: Furballfred (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Malfurion&n=Furballfred), 66 Night Elf Druid

Ner'zhul

Horde

Forderz: Forderz (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Ner%27zhul&n=Forderz), 80 Tauren Druid

Norgannon

Alliance

darkblust: Falnar (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Norgannon&n=Falnar), 30 Dwarf Hunter

darkblust: Millee (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Norgannon&n=Millee), 25 Human Paladin

Ravenholdt

Horde

The Linker: Tyrothos (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Ravenholdt&n=Tyrothos), 72 Blood Elf Frost Mage

Scarlet Crusade

Horde

Kish: Trian (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Scarlet+Crusade&n=Trian), 80 Blood Elf Paladin

Sen'jin

Alliance

expirement10K14: Afrid (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Sen%27jin&n=Afrid), 80 Human Warlock

Horde

expirement10K14: Githdar (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Sen%27jin&n=Githdar), 80 Blood Elf Death Knight

expirement10K14: Githdor (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Sen%27jin&n=Githdor), 35 Blood Elf Paladin

Silver Hand

Alliance

AgentPaper: Ishwar (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Silver+Hand&n=Ishwar), 80 Human Death Knight

AgentPaper: Barccik (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Silver+Hand&n=Barccik), 55 Dwarf Paladin

TheEmerged: Shaynta (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-achievements.xml?r=silver+hand&n=Shaynta), 80 Human Mage

TheEmerged: Laram (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Silver+Hand&cn=Laram&gn=Aggressive+%C3%9Fy+Nature), 80 Night Elf Druid

Silvermoon

Horde

tyckspoon: Rafflaram (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Silvermoon&n=Rafflaram), 80 Undead Priest

Thaurissan (Oceanic)

Alliance

Hailphage: Grailraven (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Thaurissan&n=Grailraven), 48 Draenei Paladin

Horde

Hailphage: Citrixica (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Thaurissan&n=Citrixica), 80 Blood Elf Hunter

Hailphage: Krushnkill (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Thaurissan&n=Krushnkill) 80 Orc Warrior

Hailphage: Hailphage (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Thaurissan&n=Hailphage) 74 Blood Elf Death Knight

Hailphage: Yetamar (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Thaurissan&n=Yetamar) 61 Tauren Druid

Tichondrius

Alliance

AgentPaper: Sabette (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Tichondrius&n=Sabette), 10 Human Priest

Trollbane

Alliance

darkblust: Syleann (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Trollbane&n=Syleann), 60 Night Elf Balance Druid

Vek'nilash

Horde

Zherog: Mazumoka (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Vek%27nilash&cn=Mazumoka), 80 Orc Rogue

Zherog: Randagny (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Vek%27nilash&cn=Randagny), 80 Undead Fire Mage

Zherog: Berinick (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Vek%27nilash&cn=Berinick) 80 Undead Warlock

Zherog: Mithip (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Vek%27nilash&cn=Mithip), 70 Taruen Warrior

Zherog: Valysth (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Vek%27nilash&cn=Valysth), 46 Blood Elf Paladin

Zherog: Mokog (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Vek%27nilash&cn=Mokog), 37 Tauren Druid

Whisperwind

Alliance

mangosta71: Ivellios (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Whisperwind&n=Ivellios), 80 Night Elf Rogue

mangosta71: Nalia (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Whisperwind&n=Nalia), 80 Human Paladin

mangosta71: Paedric (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Whisperwind&n=Paedric), 80 Human Warlock


EU Servers

Darkmoon Faire

Horde

Castaras: Castaras (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Darkmoon+Faire&n=Castaras), 23 Blood Elf Holy Paladin

Castaras: Càssandra (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Darkmoon+Faire&n=C%C3%A0ssandra), 58 Blood Elf Blood Death Knight

Der Rat Von Dalaran

GolemsVoice: Mannwin (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Der+Rat+von+Dalaran&cn=Mannwin&gn=Smaragdwache), 80 Human Discipline/Holy Priest

Earthen Ring

Alliance

Castaras: Kaelde (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Earthen+Ring&n=Kaelde), 58 Draenei Blood Death Knight

Ghostlands

Alliance

Castaras: Castaras (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Ghostlands&n=Castaras), 65 Human Blood/Unholy Death Knight

Castaras: Aslandle (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Ghostlands&n=Aslandle), 56 Draenei Protection Paladin

Castaras: Kaelde (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Ghostlands&n=Kaelde), 15 Draenei Restoration Shaman

Castaras: Ethrelda (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Ghostlands&n=Ethrelda), 13 Dwarf Hunter

Ravenholdt

Alliance

BooNL: Jorun (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Ravenholdt&n=Jorun), 23 Night Elf Resto Druid

Steamwheedle Cartel

Alliance

Even Human: Alhatazza (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Steamwheedle+Cartel&n=Alhatazza), 60 Draenei Protection Paladin

The Sha'tar

Alliance

Lord Xavius: Athaniar (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Sha%27tar&n=Athaniar), 41 Dwarven Hunter

Lord Xavius: Cynewalden (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Sha%27tar&n=Cynewalden), 31 Human Warlock

Lord Xavius: Buri (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Sha%27tar&n=Buri), 30 Dwarven Priest

Points

AgentPaper: |||| ||

[Xanedan]

Can't hit up the armory at work, but Xanedan on Drenden is my main. Ignore the fact that I'm mutilate and not equipped with daggers. Was just screwing around last night on a friends connection.

More questions, has anyone tried out the SteelSeries mouse and keyboard? My logitech LX7 broke, so I'm open to alternatives before I go and get a new one off Amazon (I like the weight of the LX7, but SteelSeries sounds like it has to be heavy, no?)

[Prophaniti]

Here's my main on Garrosh (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Garrosh&n=Kemall). I'm looking for a fun guild right now as I don't have the time to raid much. I have four Horde alts the lowest of which is 30, and a few Alliance characters including a hunter (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Garrosh&n=Bryngar) that just got to Outland recently.

I have a few 20-somethings on Icecrown, which was my original server long, long ago.

I'm also looking for some people to play with on an RP realm, but I don't know anyone.

[DrakebloodIV]

Bannen, the 79 lock. My main and the third highest Bannen in the game. Also, the only warlock named Bannen for some reason (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Duskwood&n=Bannen)

[Lupy]

Indeed, I do have questions. My friend convinced me to give WOW a shot this weekend, and I'm really looking forward with it. I've never played a real MMORPG before (Runescape doesn't count) though so I'm wondering a few things.

My friend told me that Mage is the easiest class to start out as. I'd like to play a Paladin but he said I'd be better off learning to play as a Mage. Second opinions?

What race is the best to start as? He said that Draeneds (sp?) can heal themselves, but that sounds like it carries some sort of negative to balance it out.

Can I have characters on different servers?

[AgentPaper]

Gurukai (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Magtheridon&n=Gurukai), level 80 Orc Shaman, as seen in my sig. He should be in his Elemental gear/spec right now, but the gear is kinda crappy because my main spec is Restoration. :smalltongue:

I also have Guruchill (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Magtheridon&n=Guruchill), level 61 Tauren Death Knight, Keule (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Magtheridon&n=Keule), level 63 Troll Warrior, and a handful lower level alts. (mostly 10-20)

Edit: Mages are not easy to use. Paladins are easy to use, and I recommend playing one of them first, as it'll make learning the game a lot easier. As for race, it really doesn't matter that much, so pick the race you like the looks of the most, because you're going to be starting at him for a long time. Draenei (pronounced as DRAN-eye or DRAHN-eye) can indeed heal themselves, but it's a bit lackluster, and if you're a paladin you're probably better off using your own heals. That said, I haven't actually played one very long, so maybe it's worth more than I give it.

[Xanedan]

My friend told me that Mage is the easiest class to start out as. I'd like to play a Paladin but he said I'd be better off learning to play as a Mage. Second opinions?

The real important thing is to pick a class that looks good to you, no class is especially difficult to play if you put a little time into learning the mechanics. Do a little research on sites like elitistjerks.com and weigh the end game pros and cons.



What race is the best to start as? He said that Draeneds (sp?) can heal themselves, but that sounds like it carries some sort of negative to balance it out.

All races have their pros and cons but the imbalance between racial powers isn't usually impossible to overcome. The Draeni healing racial has a cooldown and isn't that powerful. That +hit they give is a nice boost, however.



Can I have characters on different servers?

Yep, quite a lot of characters on quite a lot of servers. More than enough for any mere mortal to be reasonably happy.

[Lupy]

Yep, quite a lot of characters on quite a lot of servers. More than enough for any mere mortal to be reasonably happy.

Thanks.

Does it cost more to have characters on multiple servers?

[AgentPaper]

Thanks.

Does it cost more to have characters on multiple servers?

Nope, you can make as many characters as you like, as far as I know, it's just that playing more than one or two will increase the time it takes for you to progress exponentially.

[Xanedan]

Nope, it's free to create a new character on a new server. It costs money to transfer old characters to a new server, though, so plan ahead if you don't want to pay.

[Kudaku]

Playing a Paladin is very easy when you're starting out, but don't be discouraged if it seems a bit too simple - paladins have a slow start but really start to pick up speed around level 40. Playing a Hybrid class (a class that can fill multiple roles (Protector, Healer, Damage-dealer) - like paladins, shamans, and druids) is a great idea when you're starting out since you can try the different aspects of the game while you level, and find out what you enjoy most.

No, having characters on multiple servers does not cost you extra.

[Lupy]

Thanks for the support guys. What servers do you play on? Is there a Giantitp clan?

[AgentPaper]

Thanks for the support guys. What servers do you play on? Is there a Giantitp clan?

I'm on magtheridon, horde side mainly. Cenarion Circle is apparently the main server for GitP players, and I think there was even a guild at some point, but I don't know how many people actually play on there anymore. (or ever, really)

If you want some help starting out, I'd be happy to make a new toon to play with you for a while, whatever server you end up playing on.

[Lupy]

I'm on magtheridon, horde side mainly. Cenarion Circle is apparently the main server for GitP players, and I think there was even a guild at some point, but I don't know how many people actually play on there anymore. (or ever, really)

If you want some help starting out, I'd be happy to make a new toon to play with you for a while, whatever server you end up playing on.

That'd be pretty cool. I know my friends at school would be glad for another player, the two of them seem to have a tough time.

[The Linker]

The overall character limit is actually 50. But you really shouldn't have that many, ever. :smalltongue: And you can only have ten per server.

I'm not sure why your friend would tell you Mages are easiest to level. Maybe just because of their ability to teleport to any capital city in the world (eventually), and the ability to make their own food and water... but I don't find that as important as the ability to kill things without getting killed yourself -- and for that, I find Hunters to be among the best (at least once you get to level 10). I've never leveled a Paladin, but they can heal themselves and have crazy good armor, so they're awesome that way.

In the past, Paladins have done horrible damage, but that's been rectified from what I hear.

If you want to play a Pally, play a Pally. Do iiiit! Don't let him push you around! :smalltongue: Mages are very fragile, relying on manipulating the enemy and avoiding getting hit at all. Pallies, conversely, can survive for a very long time. But ultimately it's up to you how you want to play.

Finally: Yeah, Dranei do have the ability to heal themselves, and there's no real downside. No race ever has a 'negative' -- just varying degrees of positives. :smalltongue: If you were to go a Mage, then being a Dranei might indeed be a good choice, because Mages can't heal themselves otherwise. If you go Pally, then the Dranei heal would be fairly superfluous.

The point could be moot. How are you going to be playing WoW? On his account, or a trial account? If it's a trial account, I'm not sure you'll have the ability to play a Dranei. Dranei and Blood Elves come with the first expansion (Burning Crusade). But I'm not entirely sure how the trial process works.

[Lupy]

I'm going to get my own account, the first month is free so the only risk is the cost of the game, and I don't want to spend 90 days in a watered down trial.

How do guilds work, are they all player run? And if so what's to stop people from cheating you out of something you earned with the guild?

[AgentPaper]

That'd be pretty cool. I know my friends at school would be glad for another player, the two of them seem to have a tough time.

No problem. I'll probably play a hunter or something, depends on what race you're using. They used to be my favorite class, back in the day.

By the way, out of random curiosity, how long has everyone here been playing WoW for? Not /played or anything, just when they first started. Personally, I started playing sometime around 2002. :smallwink:

[The Linker]

I'm going to get my own account, the first month is free so the only risk is the cost of the game, and I don't want to spend 90 days in a watered down trial.

Yeah, it doesn't sound like you're shelling out the 100+ bucks for WoW and its two expansions, so unfortunately you won't have access to Dranei at all. The other choices are Human and Dwarf, if you still want to go Paladin. I'd vote Dwarf, myself, just because I like their starting area better. :smalltongue:

(Oh, and beware: by 'first month free' they mean you have to pay for a month, giving you a free one and a paid-for one. It's more a two-for-one thing.)


How do guilds work, are they all player run? And if so what's to stop people from cheating you out of something you earned with the guild?

Guilds are entirely player-run, yeah. Every guild started with someone buying their own guild charter and getting ten people to sign it before the guild could come into being. Then they invite people, and those people invite people, and hopefully it grows into something that can go out there and run dungeons and raids and kills lots of stuff!

I'm not sure how to answer your second question, though. All the Guild function really is is a way to organize players and create a sense of community. There's nothing you can do with twenty guildmates that you couldn't do with twenty random people. It's just that with the former you know the people involved and know they're good, decent people.

(Well, hopefully.)

[AgentPaper]

I'm going to get my own account, the first month is free so the only risk is the cost of the game, and I don't want to spend 90 days in a watered down trial.

How do guilds work, are they all player run? And if so what's to stop people from cheating you out of something you earned with the guild?

All guilds are player-run. Not much stops a guild from cheating you out of stuff, but this never happens, because if it did, that person would be booted from the guild, and probably have a hard time getting any other guild to let them in. If it's the guild leader who does it, even worse, because the whole guild will probably just leave for a different one, and that leader will have a hard time getting anyone to join his guild again.

[The Linker]

No problem. I'll probably play a hunter or something, depends on what race you're using. They used to be my favorite class, back in the day.

By the way, out of random curiosity, how long has everyone here been playing WoW for? Not /played or anything, just when they first started. Personally, I started playing sometime around 2002. :smallwink:

I don't know the exact date, but I think I started playing just before or after the time patch 1.6 was relased -- which is July 2005. So, 2005 is a safe bet for me. :smalltongue:

[TheEmerged]

RE: Starting classes. I'll second the earlier statement -- the easiest class to level is the one you feel comfortable playing. For me, that's mage. Your friend *might* be guilty of planning to bum ports off of you :smallwink:

RE: Characters/server. You are limited to 50 characters overall, 10 per server. There used to be restrictions about taking both horde & alliance characters on some servers, this is no longer true.

RE: Racials. Personally, I'd say the Blood Elf (Horde) and Draenei (Alliance) are the best races starting out, just because their starting areas are that much better. In the long term though, I'm glad I went human on my main -- for the diplomacy advantage (+10% to faction gains). Your mileage may vary, and the racials are supposedly going to be changed around in the next expansion.

RE: New to MMOG's. Keep the following in mind.

1> Change is the only constant. I make the joke about "Bliizzard being Blizzard", but the fact is that things change often -- and sometimes fiercely. The "Flavor of the Month" spec/class last month might be "nerfed to the ground" next month.

2> They're just pixels/data. Don't get too attached to your items, your spells, acheivements, etc. They're all just one nerf from being gone, or one expansion from being 'pointless'. Set your own goals and learn how to enjoy them.

3> Put the following link in your favorites: http://blue.mmo-champion.com/. That link is as close to the official Blizzard/WoW forums as you should ever come. PERIOD. NO EXCEPTIONS. For every MMOG I've ever played, the official forums were the biggest compilation of useless whining I've seen. The signal to noise ratio for the Blizzard/WoW forums is the worst I've seen for MMOG's. So use that link to see what Blizzard has to say and don't waste your time reading anything else (or posting, for that matter) there.

[Xanedan]

If you do plan on getting attached to things, make it quirky and weird stuff. I couldn't give a crap less about what tier my gear is (although missing rolls on two Dragonspine Trophies and never getting a single piece of T5 despite raiding the Eye for a few solid months does make me wonder how I could be that unlucky) but so help me god if anything happens to my Foror's Eyepatch or the siamese kitten I rescued out of the Deadmines I'm going to raise hell.

[DrakebloodIV]

If you do plan on getting attached to things, make it quirky and weird stuff. I couldn't give a crap less about what tier my gear is (although missing rolls on two Dragonspine Trophies and never getting a single piece of T5 despite raiding the Eye for a few solid months does make me wonder how I could be that unlucky) but so help me god if anything happens to my Foror's Eyepatch or the siamese kitten I rescued out of the Deadmines I'm going to raise hell.

Seconded. I may not have any decent armor, but I love my Zherva.

[Prophaniti]

I find that I enjoy doing some of the achievements instead of worrying too much about gear. I have my Albino Drake and I'm only a few pets away from my skunk, and only 4 more days away from exalted with yet another faction. Of course, I also eat up my playtime with way too many alts...

[Xanedan]

There's an albino drake now!? So many pets to hunt for after I get my internet connection hooked up...

I wish you could have multiple vanity pets up at once, so I could run around in stealth with a menagerie of drakes following me.

[AgentPaper]

I was never really much for the whole vanity pet thing, but I do love my squire. And he'll apparently be even more awesome tomorrow, once I (FINALLY!) finish up becoming exalted champion of all of the horde races.

AHH! It's only a few hours! Must...kill....time.....

[tyckspoon]

There's an albino drake now!? So many pets to hunt for after I get my internet connection hooked up...

I wish you could have multiple vanity pets up at once, so I could run around in stealth with a menagerie of drakes following me.

He's talking about the reward mount for having 50 mounts, I think.

Character links:
My first and main, Dougalmcstew (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Archimonde&n=Dougalmcstew) of Archimonde. He'll end up leading a whole bunch of Mc-liquidfoodtypes if I decide to get all altoholic on that server.

The Horde alt, Rafflaram (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Silvermoon&n=Rafflaram) on Silvermoon. Heal-specced priest, which is about as far away from a plate DPS class as you can get.

[Philistine]

No problem. I'll probably play a hunter or something, depends on what race you're using. They used to be my favorite class, back in the day.

By the way, out of random curiosity, how long has everyone here been playing WoW for? Not /played or anything, just when they first started. Personally, I started playing sometime around 2002. :smallwink:

That's a good trick, since the game didn't even reach beta until 2004, going live in November or December of that year. :smallcool:

I purchased the game in mid-February 2005, got guilded up a few months later, and began raiding with said guild around October of that year - initially on a Hunter (my first level-capped character!), but by the end of the year I was grinding out levels on a Warlock to replace him (because 20-man raids with 7 Hunters were made of fail, and the guild was very very short of 'Locks :smallyuk:). The Warlock remained my main for the next two years, though later on I also spent quite a bit of in-game "downtime" leveling alts - notably a Feral Druid (which came close to displacing the 'Lock, and probably would have done so eventually); I also took a Mage and a Warrior to the then-current level caps, and took one of each other pre-WotLK class to at least level 30. I took a break from WoW in late 2007 following some in-game drama, and when a month had gone by and I still didn't miss playing the game, I unsubbed in January of 2008.

I still enjoy talking about the mechanics and theory of the game, though, even if I find the actual gameplay to be primarily an exercise in tedium and frustration. (I did do the 10-day free trial of WotLK a couple of months ago: IMO it's improved considerably, but not enough to lure me back. I await the changes promised for Cataclysm with both eagerness and dread, however, because that just might be enough to do it.)

@Lupy: I've only ever heard of two people who seriously considered Mage to be "the easiest class to level" - your friend, and TheEmerged. :smallwink:

The general consensus is that classes which can heal themselves (including the Warlock, and the Hunter which can heal its pet) are easier to level than classes which can't, and that the hybrids (Druid, Paladin, and Shaman) are the easiest overall. Hybrids also bring amazing utility to a small group, particularly the Druid and Paladin which can tank or heal or do good damage on an "as-needed" basis - sometimes doing multiple jobs within a single encounter. But ultimately, you have to choose a class based on what you enjoy playing, because that's really the entire and only point of playing in the first place.

[AgentPaper]

That's a good trick, since the game didn't even reach beta until 2004, going live in November or December of that year. :smallcool:

Oops, sorry about that. 2003 is probably more accurate. :smallredface:

Oh, and for those interested, I'm going to be starting a new toon with lupy when he makes his, to play around in early levels and such. If anyone else wants to join in, go ahead. I don't think this is going to be anything but a few hours of low level questing fun, but if everyone has fun, we could do it a bit more, and maybe do some minor instances.

[The Linker]

Oops, sorry about that. 2003 is probably more accurate. :smallredface:

So... what, you got to test the Alpha version? :smallconfused:

[DrakebloodIV]

So... what, you got to test the Alpha version? :smallconfused:

He bought an illegal pirated chinese version which was actually a modified version of Pac Man. Damned if the pink ghost didnt make an amazing Druid though.

[AgentPaper]

So... what, you got to test the Alpha version? :smallconfused:

Indeed. Through some stroke of divine fate, One of my mother's clients was the mother of one of the lead developers over at blizz. Me and my brother got to tour the blizzard HQ, and got into the alpha testing of World of Warcraft, back when nobody had even heard of it. Those were the good old days, where the level cap was 20, and you could only play one class at a time. It was surprisingly bug-free even then, compared to many MMOs, which is one of the main things I point to as a reason for it's success.

It used to be that you could literally jump straight up a wall, as long as you found the right spot, and then went jump, move slightly forward mid-air, and then stop moving before you hit the ground. Me and my brother had a lot of fun exploring areas that weren't finished yet using this tactic. :smallbiggrin: I think he still has some screenshots of that, actually. I'll see if I can share them.

Edit: I may as well mention that we're still in contact with him, and it seems likely that we'll be getting into at least the SC2 alpha, and possibly the diablo 3 one as well. (he's less sure because he's not working on that one) Of course, I won't be able to share anything with you guys, so there's not much point in me saying this other than to taunt you with my incredible luck. :smalltongue:

[The Linker]

He bought an illegal pirated chinese version which was actually a modified version of Pac Man. Damned if the pink ghost didnt make an amazing Druid though.

omg blinkys OP he keeps chasign me blinky neds a nerf bad

noob l2use entanglign roots


I would so play that game.

[DrakebloodIV]

omg blinkys OP he keeps chasign me blinky neds a nerf bad

noob l2use entanglign roots

"OMFG H4X, MIZZ PAX HAS 2 MUCH TEH AOE!!!!"

[Mattarias, King.]

Mattarias, of Area 52! (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Area+52&n=Mattarias) Reios, of the same! (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Area+52&n=Reios)

This new thread is glorious. :smallbiggrin:

I'm trying to get back into the game.. Been kinda "meh" about it and haven't played much, even though my sub's still going. Any suggestions on how to mix it up, make it more interesting?

[DrakebloodIV]

I'm trying to get back into the game.. Been kinda "meh" about it and haven't played much, even though my sub's still going. Any suggestions on how to mix it up, make it more interesting?

One thing I've always wanted to try is just equipping one of my characters only in greys. See how far I can get before it becomes impossible to beat anything.

[AgentPaper]

As people on the internez say it:

lol :smallbiggrin:

Well, I DID do it for teh lulz. :smalltongue:

[Athaniar]

All my active characters are on The Sha'tar (Europe).

Since I suffer from Alt-itis, I've never reached any high level. My main character is Athaniar (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Sha%27tar&n=Athaniar), the Level 33 (almost 34!) Dwarven Ranger Hunter, apparently the only dwarf character with that name. And before you ask, yes, he was raised by elves. Got a problem with that?

Other characters I use less frequently include Buri (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Sha%27tar&n=Buri) the Dwarven Twilight Cultist Priest, Cynewalden (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Sha%27tar&n=Cynewalden) the Second War-era Death Knight Human Warlock, and Ryvengard (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Sha%27tar&n=Ryvengard) the Human Paladin Paladin.

[SlyGuyMcFly]

All my active characters are on The Sha'tar (Europe).

Since I suffer from Alt-itis, I've never reached any high level. My main character is Athaniar (http://eu.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=The+Sha%27tar&n=Athaniar), the Level 33 (almost 34!) Dwarven Ranger Hunter, apparently the only dwarf character with that name. And before you ask, yes, he was raised by elves. Got a problem with that?

That is highly amusing. Back when I played I has a Night Elf Hunter that was raised by Dwarves :smallbiggrin:

[Dublock]

I have (two) main guy(s), a level 36 Blood Elf Mage and a level...23? Hunter that I have forgotten about :p.

I have been enjoying the mage a lot. I'm following a frost-lvling spec for talents and I have been by the top in damage a few times on BGs with it, so I am managing to learn a few things about the class. However the low armor IS annoying. Dumb rogues have one hit killed me, priests/warlocks DoT, and such is painful. Dark Iron is my server.

I can't wait to get to level 80 though.

[mangosta71]

Obligatory links:
Ivellios Primrose (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Whisperwind&n=Ivellios) - main
Nalia Charynne (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Whisperwind&n=Nalia) - primary alt
Paedric Sanaug (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Whisperwind&n=Paedric) - secondary alt

I have more, but those are my 80s. I have a 74 DK that I was leveling with a friend, but I promised I'd stop until she got her sub back up, a 70 mage DE mule, a 71 feral druid leather farmer, and a bunch more under 70 on various servers.

Oh, and I started playing in January of 2005...

[Bouregard]

I started with the Beta... ah jolly good times... using exorcism on forsaken and crusaderstrike ...
So the actual Paladin is a bit like back to the roots, except he can tank now.
And 100% Illumination.... *drool*



My first character was a troll rogue. I played him to 35 and then joined the good old Alliance.... for the Paladin. But recently I started to level little Shaggmoe (the rogue) again.... ah it was really cool to open a old charackter and take a look on all those hoarded Blindweed and Dust...

[Guancyto]

I'm trying to get back into the game.. Been kinda "meh" about it and haven't played much, even though my sub's still going. Any suggestions on how to mix it up, make it more interesting?

Get together your guild if you have one or a bunch of random people if you don't.

Make level 1 alts and raid Hogger. Watch the carnage unfold.

[Tafkan]

Bah, I decided to take a small break and my character's profile is already gone from Armory! Used to have a level 80 night elf druid and 80 paladin on Earthen Ring (Europe) though. Yes, that server with Karathos and Valimar on it, to those who know these names (surprisingly many do), though you probably haven't ever heard of me unless you were hanging out in that server's trade chat back when I was still active. Anyway, this new coliseum thingy seems interesting. About how difficult is the new instance anyway?

[TheEmerged]

@Lupy: I've only ever heard of two people who seriously considered Mage to be "the easiest class to level" - your friend, and TheEmerged. :smallwink:

The general consensus is that classes which can heal themselves (including the Warlock, and the Hunter which can heal its pet) are easier to level than classes which can't, and that the hybrids (Druid, Paladin, and Shaman) are the easiest overall. Hybrids also bring amazing utility to a small group, particularly the Druid and Paladin which can tank or heal or do good damage on an "as-needed" basis - sometimes doing multiple jobs within a single encounter. But ultimately, you have to choose a class based on what you enjoy playing, because that's really the entire and only point of playing in the first place.

/humor on
And I'll repeat what I told you last time -- I heal myself (http://www.wowhead.com/?item=42738) every four minutes (http://www.wowhead.com/?spell=12051) or so :smallwink:
/humor off

Really, it goes back to the earlier point: whatever you're comfortable with will be easiest for you. There's a woman here at works that swears she can't stand to level anything but her warrior and paladin. My eyes start bleeding every time I try to level a paladin.

Similarly, I loved leveling a druid. I recommended it to a cousin that was starting and he couldn't stand it -- he felt like he was having to learn the whole game on this one character.

[Guancyto]

About how difficult is the new instance anyway?

Normal 5-man Trial is about on the level of the easier heroics and gives some excellent Naxx-10 quality gear. Heroic 5-man Trial is difficult (though not nearly as bad as Magister's Terrace back in the day), but gives Ulduar-10 quality loots.

As for the new raids, I haven't been in there personally (took a long break from raiding) but my guild clears 10-man normal Trial and complains it's too easy. They have yet to kill Yogg-Saron in any capacity.

[mangosta71]

I wouldn't call the heroic 5 man difficult. It was the first thing I tanked at level 80 on my paladin and we did it quick and clean. Even my lock has cleared it multiple times, and he's been 80 less than a week and is still in absolute scrub gear.

The normal raid is easier than Ulduar. My guild has poked at the heroic version though, and our tanks have a tendency to get roflstomped. I don't know if it's a tank or healer issue though.

[Guancyto]

Well, it's tougher than most WotLK heroics in that you can actually die if your team doesn't know what they're doing.

With that in mind, I would rate it up with Oculus and Halls of Lightning.

[The Linker]

I found heroic 5-man ToC very difficult! More difficult than any other heroic, at least. I've ran it at least five times, I think, and never has my group been able to handle the sequence with the three mounted combatants dismounting without either dying or running out of the instance. Just the fact that they can be anywhere when that part starts, and they do enough damage to drop a squishy-type in an instant... if the positions aren't favourable, it can be almost impossible for a single tank to catch all three before they murdalize someone.

Though I guess a coordinated group could make sure everyone is in the same place once that fight starts, so all three enemies would run to the same place, making it simple for the tank to pull 'em all... none of my groups have thought of that, unfortunately. :smalltongue:

Rest of the instance is cake, though. At least, once you have a group that can handle the first part. :smalltongue:

[AgentPaper]

That part is easy. You ALWAYS run out of the instance, then go back in once the three guys have reset. Paletress and the Black Knight are a bit annoying, but a tremor totem helps a lot with the first, and a cleansing totem with the second. The main trick with the Black Knight is that whenever you kill one of his forms, that is when the ghouls start building up to explode, so as long as you move away from them then, you should be fine. The last part is annoyingly healing-intensive, though, and I'm not sure how you're supposed to get through it without crazy healing. (Not that I can't handle it, but I'm suited up in ulduar gear :smallwink:)

[Guancyto]

The healing on phase 3 isn't actually that bad. One person will get an extra debuff that makes them take triple damage so do your best to take care of them. Everyone else's damage taken is completely deterministic. I've done it as a disc priest in Naxx10-level shadow gear.

And yeah, even on Normal not running away from the champions is dicey. They seem to take a few seconds to actually start on an aggro list.

[The Linker]

Perhaps my groups have all been high DPS and low on survivability, and yours have been the other way around. High DPS means the Black Knight is terribly easy -- it's not healing-intensive because he has no time to build debuff stacks up in wraith form, and we always slaughter the ghouls before they can do much of anything.

Conversely, the three enemies of the first boss fight are too tough to take down quickly, and with low survivability we can't defeat them before they plow through our tank too quickly for the healer to keep up.

We just need to combine our groups and we'll have an unstoppable force. :smalltongue:

[TheEmerged]

Yeah, I've found it a LOT easier to do with a shaman healer than with a paladin healer.

[Manicotti]

Yeah, I've found it a LOT easier to do with a shaman healer than with a paladin healer.

Odd, I don't actually run with shaman healers (there's maybe, one that i know that still even plays), but ToC5 is laughably easy in all its fights. The first boss(es) are annoying and buggy as hell, but the main problem is that they don't reset their aggro table from the mounted phase, so they'll go everywhere. Just having the dps wait for a few moments before unloading makes things simpler.

As to the ToC10/25 raid - it's a joke. The fights are somewhere between naxx and Ulduar in difficulty, leaning towards naxx, despite giving loot that is better than Ulduar's.
First boss fight - 3 different bosses; don't stand in the bad sh!t, collect loot.
Second boss - Kill the add, interrupt casts, and don't stand in the bad sh!t, collect loot.
Third boss - Free for all fight against mobs whose aggro tables reset every couple seconds; kill the healer first, don't stand in the bad sh!t, use your PvP trinkets/cooldowns as necessary.
Fourth boss - kill the boss of X color, kick its heal, and change "polarity" when the big spell starts its 5 second cast.
Last boss - Anub'arak is essentially the same here as he is in Azjol-nerub. Hit him hard, stand in the safe spots away from his spikes, kill adds.

Oh, and here:
Manicotti (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Galakrond&n=Manicotti)
Do a /who on any kind of pasta on Galakrond, really, and you'll find an alt of mine.

[Mattarias, King.]

One thing I've always wanted to try is just equipping one of my characters only in greys. See how far I can get before it becomes impossible to beat anything.


Get together your guild if you have one or a bunch of random people if you don't.

Make level 1 alts and raid Hogger. Watch the carnage unfold.

:smallbiggrin: Hogger raid in greys! Brilliant!

[The Linker]

I wonder how few level 1 characters it would take to defeat Hogger when they're all outfitted with heirloom items?

I could imagine a big group of 'scientists' working endlessly to figure this out.

[TheEmerged]

The trouble would be whether or not they were still level 1 when they got there, based on the two times I've joined Hogger raids. I have trouble getting there without killing enough mobs not to level a time or three :smallredface:

[The Linker]

Yeah. I participated in a Gnome Death Race from Dun Morogh to Stormwind once... we all started at level one, of course, but no one ended up less than level 3. :smalltongue:

Still, true scientists would of course have high levels to both clear the area of all other gnolls and summon the level ones straight there, denying them the chance to level up on exploration XP. :smallbiggrin:

[DrakebloodIV]

We'll if you form a raid group in Dun Morough I don't think you can get XP for the vast majority of things. I'm not sure about exploration XP though.

[Lupy]

I've gotten my Paladin, Knelious, up to level 5 now. :smallsmile:

Best game I've played in... tied with Empire Total War and Medieval 2 for best game I've ever played.

[Philistine]

We'll if you form a raid group in Dun Morough I don't think you can get XP for the vast majority of things. I'm not sure about exploration XP though.
Quests, no. Kills and exploration, though? Oh, yes. My old guild occasionally did "flight path runs," where a few high-level characters would shepherd large groups of lowbies all around a given continent so that the low-level toons could pick up all the flight points. I know that people dinged during those runs; IIRC, some people who brought really low-level toons actually leveled up twice.

Good times. :smallcool:

[Forderz]

the normal raids of ToC are somewhere around the level of wet cardboard socks in difficulty, the heroic version of the 10 man is doable with any competent group, but the 25 heroic is brutalistic. (I've heard that this is the case for the first boss only, though)

Behold and wonder at the glory of http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Ner'zhul&n=Forderz

[TheEmerged]

*Weekend Report*

In a way, a disappointing weekend. I was unable to make any progress on my Emblems on my main... but my feral tank got *several* upgrades to his healing set while tanking for my my tankadin friend's healing alt through several pre-heroic dungeons. I also managed a triple-threat for achievements on my mains (exalted with Ebon Blade, which was both my 25th exalted faction and my final Northrend faction).

Oddly, I get the feeling that my friend and I are going to be doing this pair more often than our mains for a while :smallcool: We're both still learning our way around our new roles, but we did it well enough that we essentially four-manned pre-heroic Gundrak (#5 was a hunter that disconnected and never came back).

Said feral tank also finished off his Northrend recipe collection, got his healing trinket from WG, and got closer to Kirin Tor revered. Since I don't care about achievements for him, I only need him to get most factions to revered (instead of exalted) -- and I don't really need to worry about the Sons of Hodir since he's a scribe (and his self-only enchants are better).

Since I was having no luck getting the heroic daily either Saturday or Sunday, I ended up running some lower-leveled guildies (in my new guild, which has actual other people in it) through both sides of Strat. The irony is that most of them started playing during TBC and hence had never run through it -- while Strat is the only dungeon I've run so often that I know it by heart (I stopped counting with run 72 shortly before TBC hit). Of course the mount didn't drop :smallbiggrin:

[Xanedan]

Anyone else excited about the Razer Naga? I don't think they've announced a release date as of yet but it seems a very nice place to bind most of your cooldowns.

I have small hands, though and find anything right of the "5" key to be a little bit more work than could easily be done in an instant.

Terrible confession time: I usually play with the arrow keys. Still mouse turning but binding most of my abilities to 1,0,4, 2, mouse scroll, and additional buttons. Then make use of ctrl and shift to give me a decent amount of binds. Something about WASD just seems hard for me.

[Inhuman Bot]

Does anyone play on Bronzebeard, specifically the horde side?

If so, give me a whisper. I go by Zulmaran for my most used charcter there.

[Leon]

Does anyone play on Bronzebeard, specifically the horde side?

If so, give me a whisper. I go by Zulmaran for my most used charcter there.

Yes. although i cant whisper you as im not playing atm but i'll try and remember when i come back.

[sihnfahl]

the normal raids of ToC are somewhere around the level of wet cardboard socks in difficulty
Except when you get a bad comp on Faction Champs and someone misses a necessary CC + interrupt. (Having a ret pally, enhance shammy and rogue all go for your priest ... yeah...)


the heroic version of the 10 man is doable with any competent group
See #1. Exception to rule - not having enough DPS to get down Gormok before the damage input overwhelms the tanks and their healers.

And you better pray nobody has a lagspike when Icehowl charges - that enrage is undispellable and he hits like a freight train carrying a mack truck loaded with C4.


but the 25 heroic is brutalistic. (I've heard that this is the case for the first boss only, though)
Again, DPS race on Gormok. Once you get over that particular hump, things get easier.

Loving my DK's new gear. Justicebringer, 2pc t9.25 ... I've hit about 11k AP in raid, and diseases tick for a godawful amount with that going. 11.5k deathcoils + another 20% from unholy blight during that spike ...

[The Linker]

Just had some epic moments with a Trivia Bot in Cenarion Circle. :smallbiggrin:

Zergetsu: [Trivia-Bot] What instance does AQ-40 refer to?
Linkera: Ruins of Ahn'Qiraj
Linkera: Temple of Ahn'Qiraj
Zergetsu: [Trivia-Bot] Linkera is correct: Temple of Ahn'Qiraj!
Linkera: Ruins, temples, same thing.
Bluee: Nice Google skills
Linkera: Who, me? Are you serious?
Bluee: yeah hacker
Bluee: No one spells ahn'qiraj right



He was just kidding around, but I still felt extremely gratified. :smallbiggrin:

Afterwards, it switched to general trivia, and none of us knew any of the answers. ANY. When a question asking for a certain year came up, there was one guy who made systematic guesses, picking a year and adding one over and over...



Zergetsu: [Trivia-Bot] Name the year Ringo Starr joined the Beatles.
Iarith: 1960
Iarith: 1961
Linkera: 1962
Zergetsu: [Trivia-Bot] Linkera is correct: 1962!
Iarith: 1962
Linkera: YES!
Iarith: DAMNIT



Best. Blind guess. Ever. :smallbiggrin:

I also healed Ramparts, with a 62 Death Knight as the tank. Then I healed Blood Furnace, with two tanks -- a 63 Death Knight and a 67 Death Knight.

Extraordinarily old news is extraordinarily old news, but GOOD GOD THEY'RE EVERYWHERE.

[tyckspoon]

I also healed Ramparts, with a 62 Death Knight as the tank. Then I healed Blood Furnace, with two tanks -- a 63 Death Knight and a 67 Death Knight.

Extraordinarily old news is extraordinarily old news, but GOOD GOD THEY'RE EVERYWHERE.

I'd say they thin out a little when you get the higher levels, but that would be a lie. Death Knights still make up.. I'd say about 20% of the Ally toons I see, and probably 35% or so of the Horde (the rest of them are BElf paladins.)

[TheEmerged]

Background: I've been leveling my alts a lot lately to get their tradeskills up to Northrend levels.

True Story: While leveling my shadow priest from 60 to 68 recently, I only saw 2 non-DK's outside of cities for the entire run. While leveling my Shaman from 60-67, I've seen 3 non-DK's out of cities. Granted I play primarily out of prime times, but I assure you I've seen plenty of DK's :smallredface:

[The Linker]

I'd say they thin out a little when you get the higher levels, but that would be a lie. Death Knights still make up.. I'd say about 20% of the Ally toons I see, and probably 35% or so of the Horde (the rest of them are BElf paladins.)

Well, two groups with a combined percentage of just 30% Death Knights is still pretty good, compared to the months closer to after WotLK came out. If not for the need of a healer, groups would have been nothin' but death, decay, and rabid ghouls flying around. :smallamused:

[AgentPaper]

Well, while playing around with a DK in hellfire penninsula a few days ago, I did happen to be part of a group doing Ramps which consisted of: A DK, a DK, a DK, a resto-specced druid healer, and me, also a DK. :smalltongue:

[Khanderas]

Fine with DK's all over the place.
Just some of them better be tankspecced. With all the DK's stinking up the servers a suprising low number of them have tank gear at all and even fewer knows the first thing about tanking.

[sihnfahl]

Fine with DK's all over the place.
Just some of them better be tankspecced. With all the DK's stinking up the servers a suprising low number of them have tank gear at all and even fewer knows the first thing about tanking.
What about those of us who're dualspecced (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hyjal&n=Merriana)?


If not for the need of a healer, groups would have been nothin' but death, decay, and rabid ghouls flying around. :smallamused:
Silly thing is, thanks to the way DKs worked starting out, 5 DK groups were doing Ramparts, no problem. Ah, those were the days.

[mangosta71]

Silly thing is, thanks to the way DKs worked starting out, 5 DK groups were doing Ramparts, no problem. Ah, those were the days.

Gogo blood tank. We sneer at the measly tanks that need heals!

[Swok]

I remember facerolling ramps when Wrath came out amongst the death knight spree. That was good times. Is it still possible to do ramps with 5 dks, or is that possibility closed now?

[sihnfahl]

Is it still possible to do ramps with 5 dks, or is that possibility closed now?
It's still possible. The likelihood of it is diminished solely because, well, most folks have gotten DK levelling out of their system and the # of new DKs in Outland is really quite low (at least, on my server).

[Swok]

Speaking of DKs, I finally got mine to 80, after she languished at 71 since March. About my only real complaint right now is that it's weird how people are treating HToC(5man...I hate how unclear the acronym is) as hard. It's like they want it to be hard because of the drops it has.

[Guancyto]

Speaking of DKs, I finally got mine to 80, after she languished at 71 since March. About my only real complaint right now is that it's weird how people are treating HToC(5man...I hate how unclear the acronym is) as hard. It's like they want it to be hard because of the drops it has.

People thought Loken was hard.

No, wait, that's wrong.

When people were still gearing up and healers didn't have the mojo to simply let people stand in the novas, Loken was the #1 PC killer from 5-mans. Almost twice as many kills to his name as the #2 (which I believe was Keristraza).

Anyway, I've had some reasonably close shaves in HToC when a particular role didn't know what they were doing (tank/healer/entire freaking dps corps), myself included. New tank? Might have to work a little harder. New healer? Might let some DPS die. Randomly mashing buttons while paying attention to something else? Works in almost every other heroic, but not this one. Thus, hard.

[mangosta71]

I went in as a fresh 80 warlock in mostly quest greens and did fine. So far, I have lost the roll for the hat three times. :smallannoyed:

[The Linker]

I was just reviewing my payment history, and it turns out I officially started my account on July 29, 2005.

From the first page of the thread:


I don't know the exact date, but I think I started playing just before or after the time patch 1.6 was relased -- which is July 2005. So, 2005 is a safe bet for me. :smalltongue:

Oh, I am GOOD. :smallbiggrin:

[Khanderas]

Originally Posted by Khanderas
Fine with DK's all over the place.
Just some of them better be tankspecced. With all the DK's stinking up the servers a suprising low number of them have tank gear at all and even fewer knows the first thing about tanking.
What about those of us who're dualspecced (http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Hyjal&n=Merriana)?
Fine by me, if you got tanking spec and gear then you can count as a tank.
My issue was and is with the 90% of the DK population who only do dps. And so there are 5 groups in the LFG for the heroic daily all looking for a tank with 20 ppl waiting for a tank. Some of them being DK's.

[Kudaku]

{Scrubbed. Don't edit a mod edit.}

[sihnfahl]

My issue was and is with the 90% of the DK population who only do dps.
Trust me, after running into more than a few PUG tanks, I can assure you, it's probably better off that those folks aren't tanking.

(Granted, my gear is definitely not what PuG tanks expect, but ... heh...)

[Kish]

{Scrubbed}
Broadly, I agree. In practice in WoW, I generally find that when I'm on one of my tank characters, all the pugs I find can't find a healer, and when I'm on a healer, guess what.

[SlyGuyMcFly]

Solution: Roll a dualspec Holy/Prot Pally. :smallbiggrin:

Damn, I wish WoW would finish downloading. Should have kept those installation CDs...

[mangosta71]

Solution: Roll a dualspec Holy/Prot Pally. :smallbiggrin:

That doesn't solve the problem, because you can't do both at the same time. Now the group has a healer but no tank, or a tank but no healer. 'Tis a vicious cycle.

If the solution worked, you could also do a feral/resto druid. Might actually be easier, as you're already crit immune before you get all the heroic gear that any other tank needs to reach that point.

[TheEmerged]

That doesn't solve the problem, because you can't do both at the same time. Now the group has a healer but no tank, or a tank but no healer. 'Tis a vicious cycle.

If the solution worked, you could also do a feral/resto druid. Might actually be easier, as you're already crit immune before you get all the heroic gear that any other tank needs to reach that point.

The bolded part is *exactly* what I run into on my dual-spec feral/resto druid. True story, last Saturday I went into LFG to try and run GunDrak and saw a warrior, a paladin, and a DK all in LFG solely as DPS. I offered to heal if one of them would tank, no responses.

{Scrubbed -- upon a second read, I see what you're saying in the 2nd sentence.}

[Inhuman Bot]

Having noticed all the DK conversation, I feel weird about never having made a DK. :smalltongue:

I'll get around to it when I get my own charcter to 55, I suppose.

[sihnfahl]

Having noticed all the DK conversation, I feel weird about never having made a DK. :smalltongue: I'll get around to it when I get my own charcter to 55, I suppose.
You really should try the class at least a little bit. The runes allow for a bit of flexibility in role, but a fun 'breaktime' between.

For example, Heroic Jaraxxus. One of the tricks to the fight is to immediately switch from Jaraxxus to a nether portal / fel volcano and DPS it down; as long as it stays up, it spews out adds. However, if your runes are on cooldown, your personal contribution to the closure DPS is lowered, and that increases the # of adds that are spawned...

[Ego Slayer]

Isn't that the strategy one should be using on normal Jaraxxas also?
Just sayin'. :smalltongue:

Don't feel bad, Slaanesh, my DK is never gonna see level 80. Not that they're not kinda easy/fun to level (I took on, accidentally, 10 mobs in NR once and lived...and accidentally chain-pulled at least 8 in OL including a rare elite) but melee dps...ew... I don't even like playing my pally on ret. :P

@HTOC - It's harder than the other instances, by far, but it still not thaaat hard. Granted, I lol when I tank it and have my healer friend or guildie with me, and people still manage to die... and we're raiders. :smalltongue: I think running out to reset the first bosses is for noobs who can't just kill the guys near each other, though. They're not that damn hard to pick up. Grawr. >:(

[The Glyphstone]

Normal Jaraxxus, the volcanos/portals don't have a health bar, they just spawn one sister/a couple infernals then disappear. On Heroic, they turn into additional adds that spawn more and more adds until you kill them.





@HTOC - It's harder than the other instances, by far, but it still not thaaat hard. Granted, I lol when I tank it and have my healer friend or guildie with me, and people still manage to die... and we're raiders. :smalltongue: I think running out to reset the first bosses is for noobs who can't just kill the guys near each other, though. They're not that damn hard to pick up. Grawr. >:(

Funny....I've never seen a group that successfully managed to pick them up from the dismount, and I've been running it almost constantly since 3.2. If your group is coordinated (read, experienced raiders) and can dump them all directly on top of each other, then you can get them all at once - but any sort of PuG that leaves them dead in different parts of the arena is a suicide deal..and that's hoping it doesnt bug and leave them on steeds when you get dismounted, that's happened a few times and it sucks. And it's awfully hard - for me, at least - to convince the other people in my guild to go run a heroic from which they need neither Badges, Seals, or gear for any of their toons.

[mangosta71]

@HTOC - It's harder than the other instances, by far, but it still not thaaat hard. Granted, I lol when I tank it and have my healer friend or guildie with me, and people still manage to die... and we're raiders. :smalltongue: I think running out to reset the first bosses is for noobs who can't just kill the guys near each other, though. They're not that damn hard to pick up. Grawr. >:(

Ego! Welcome back! <3

The difficulty in picking them up is also affected by which three you get. The hunter is bloody hard to hold aggro on anyway (at least for most tanks, oddly I never seem to have a problem with him when I'm tanking it), and the mage is close behind him for causing wipes. I always laugh a bit when the rogue spawns and everyone else in the group groans. He hits like a little girl. No idea why people are so scared of him.

I've seen tanks successfully pick them up after dismounting on normal difficulty, but not on heroic. Though at this point, the people in pugs are accustomed to running out, and the raiders in my guild (my main and pally alt included) have no reason to run it. Presumably members of other raiding guilds face a similar situation. So I'm usually in there on my scrub undergeared lock with a bunch of other scrub undergeared alts. =p

[AgentPaper]

The rogue is nasty because he poisons people up like a storm. And they're nasty poisons too, so you better hope your healer can get them off while still healing. Or, have a shaman healer, which pretty much negates the rogue altogether. :smalltongue: I've never had any trouble with that fight personally, but I don't see any reason not to run out unless you're just showing off. Even in a run with guildies, where you could probably get them to drop everyone in the same spot, it's still much less hassle to just run out and then just come back in and have them all lined up for you. Leave the hard stuff for raids and acheivment runs. :smallwink:

[Ego Slayer]

Heya, Mangosta. :smallsmile:


Normal Jaraxxus, the volcanos/portals don't have a health bar, they just spawn one sister/a couple infernals then disappear. On Heroic, they turn into additional adds that spawn more and more adds until you kill them.
Ahah. I didn't know the portal mechanic changed as such in Heroic. My raid will be unlocking Heroic10 tonight. :smalltongue: (We're kinda behind now 'cos we took a week off 'cos our healer was out of town. v.v)

I guess I understand that they're hard to pick up in Heroic and if people have the option to get around it, they will... but... The only time I ran out on Heroic was because all three were more than 30 yards a part... which is not so much hard as it is just a pain in the ass. I pick them up regardless of location in normal and if they're within a reasonable distance of each other in Heroic. Maybe it just me, but if I continue to acknowledge that I'm a damn good tank (TM), no Heroic is gonna kick my ass... even if its 'easier' to reset them. I pick them up because I CAN. :smallbiggrin:

[Guancyto]

Ego Slayer: cojones of steel on a pally tank.

The problem with not running out is that they seem to keep at least some of their aggro list from the mounted portion. It's super-easy if you're running around, charging a lot and generally getting all up in their business but much harder if you had to be the one to jump on the first rider down (because nobody else would).

I tend to run out because everybody seems to mount up before buffs go out. :( I wants me mah fortitude!

[Ego Slayer]

I tend to run out because everybody seems to mount up before buffs go out. :( I wants me mah fortitude!
Totally one of my pet peeves. :smalltongue: Guess no one wants those pally buffs! *innocent whistle*

[sihnfahl]

Ahah. I didn't know the portal mechanic changed as such in Heroic.
My favorite one is the undispellable enrage if Icehowl hits someone. One person gets hit ... GL keeping the tank up.

[AgentPaper]

But dodging him is so EASY! I've never even been close to getting hit! All you have to do is look at where he is, and then run around the arena in the direction that will take you to behind him. Congratulations, you are now 100% guaranteed to NEVER get hit by Icehowl. I always facepalm when someone gets hit and blames the person who was targeted for not pinging. :smallannoyed:

[Ego Slayer]

My favorite one is the undispellable enrage if Icehowl hits someone. One person gets hit ... GL keeping the tank up.
Does it still have the short enrage? My party didn't previously have a hunter available so if someone got hit (rarely, thankfully), I could just pop my bubblewall and wait out the short enrage.

[mangosta71]

But dodging him is so EASY! I've never even been close to getting hit! All you have to do is look at where he is, and then run around the arena in the direction that will take you to behind him. Congratulations, you are now 100% guaranteed to NEVER get hit by Icehowl. I always facepalm when someone gets hit and blames the person who was targeted for not pinging. :smallannoyed:

He turns to face the direction he's going to charge. If he's looking at you and you don't move, it's your own damn fault. I've never gotten run over and I toe the line on his path so I can get right on him when he's stunned.

Also, make sure your raid knows not to charge until after he hits the wall... I know that the cat version of feral charge results in a flat kitty and an enraged boss because someone did it. I assume bear and warrior charges would have the same result.

[Leon]

I think i'll be back early this year - don't want to miss out on Brewfest yet again...

[Xanedan]

Anyone else think "Trapped Under Ice" by Metallica the first time they played a Death Knight?

[Zherog]

So two weeks or so ago I started up a druid for the hell of it. So far, I'm enjoying it, and up to level 21. Any generic advice, particularly for bear form? So far anyway, I'm liking bear more than cat, though that could just be because I've had more time to play around with bear so I'm more familiar with it.

What stats matter most? What are some of the pitfalls? Generic advice?

[The Linker]

So far you're liking Bear Form more than Cat Form because Cat Form doesn't get good until 28. Just you wait. :smalltongue:

As for what stats matter most... well, ho ho, that all depends on your spec. But I'm assuming you're asking about Feral stats, due to your line of questioning. In which case... well, at that level, it's pretty much Agility and Stamina. Strength could help too, each point being worth twice as much attack power as Agility (but with no dodge and critical chance bonus, of couse). Eventually you'd want lots of pure Attack Power and Crit Rating -- you know, once that becomes available.



Now, I have a favor to ask of the Playground. Specifically, anyone with the Gatherer addon.

To make alt leveling fun and fresh again, I've adopted alternate forms of marking my progression. This started with keeping a level log, and now I've gotten the Gatherer mod so that I can keep track of all the herbs I've picked up, showing where I've been. (And it seems like ALL of my characters are herbalists somehow. I honestly don't know how that happened.)

Problem is, I've been at an entirely different computer for the last two weeks. I downloaded the Gatherer addon onto it, but the herbs I've collected are recorded on this computer. Not my home computer. And the way they're recorded, I can't just take a certain file home and stick it on the other computer without removing all my OLD records. Conundrum!

But there is a solution, as told by one of the mod developers (I think). I can share the entirety of my herb locations with another person -- and when I get home, they can transfer them back to me on THAT computer, combining my old and new records together and keeping my path of harvest intact!

(And yeah, in case anyone's wondering, I do kinda feel like a dork.)

So, how about it? I just need someone to visit me on Cenarion Circle -- alias 'Linkera', but I'll be checking the forums repeatedly, so you can just wave at me here. I send you my Gatherer herb locations, and tomorrow (or, heck, whenever, I'm in no rush at that point) you send me everything that has the source listed as 'Linkera'. And I'll be your WoW servant for the next year, somehow. Or, if that's not tangible enough for you, I'll even throw in some monies. :smallbiggrin:

I'll most likely be on for, like, the next five (or more!) hours. And checking the forums the whole while. I would greatly appreciate any assistance in this dorky matter. :smallbiggrin:

TL;DR: Read the two paragraphs above this. The rest is blather. :smalltongue:

[Kish]

What stats matter most? What are some of the pitfalls? Generic advice?
For bear form, stamina, dodge, agility. For cat form, strength, +hit, +crit, +expertise. Before you get to 80, decide whether you primarily want to tank (bear form) or do melee damage (cat form), and don't try to spread your talent points to do both--Blizzard's very explicit about having gone out of their way to make sure that won't work.

[Philistine]

So two weeks or so ago I started up a druid for the hell of it. So far, I'm enjoying it, and up to level 21. Any generic advice, particularly for bear form? So far anyway, I'm liking bear more than cat, though that could just be because I've had more time to play around with bear so I'm more familiar with it.

What stats matter most? What are some of the pitfalls? Generic advice?

Congratulations! You've made it through the "difficult" (relatively) part of leveling Feral; your reward is the most efficient grinding in the game. In general, Cat form has Rogue-like DPS and is great for killing things, and also for bypassing trash mobs that you just can't be bothered with; Bear form has Prot Warrior-like survivability and is great for soloing Elites of your own level or higher; Caster form is for buffing and healing, and nothing else. If you get into trouble, use Nature's Grasp to lock an opponent in place so that you can step back, shift out, and heal up before shifting down and Feral Charging into the fray again. Faerie Fire is an excellent debuff, and is free to cast in Feral forms; there's no reason not to have it up on whatever you're killing.

Stats-wise, Stam (and to a lesser extent Agi) boosts your defense, letting you live longer; Str (and to a lesser extent Agi *) boosts your offense, letting you kill faster. You don't need Int or Spi at all, and in fact should avoid them like the plague.

As for pitfalls... What pitfalls? A Feral Druid is very nearly a perpetual motion machine, using mana to heal when the green bar starts getting short then shifting back into Feral form to fight while the blue bar refills. You don't have a lot of options for ranged combat or CC while shapeshifted - but really, that's about it. The Druid is exceeded as a "go anywhere, do anything" class only by the unlockable DK.


* I think I recall reading that when Cataclysm hits, all leather- and mail-wearing classes are going to go to the "1 Agi = 2 AP" formula to increase gear homogenization. At that point you'll definitely want Agi over Str; until that time you'll want both, probably favoring Str over Agi.

[Ego Slayer]

Yeah, so... finished TotC10 on Friday. A'R dropped the tank sword, so I got that. But... I'm miffed that it's actually not as good as Titanguard from Uld25, even though they're both i232. I dunno... Titan has hit and more dodge, and Crusader's Glory's only plus is 430ish armour, which is unusual. The latter is one sexy looking sword, though, so I'm using it despite my loss of Hit. :smallsigh:

Re: Druids: I've got one who has been sitting at level 10 for a month now and I mostly haven't leveled her because I only has caster BOA gear for the xp bonuses and other plans for all my Paladin's conquest badges.

I guess I see their versatility and haven't made it to leveling one yet, but... if something is easier than leveling an Afflic/Demo lock I'd be damn surprised. The only thing that guy was missing was an ability to stealth, but that'd be too hax. :P

I've wanted to have a feral kitty since they redid the feral skins. >>'

[DrakebloodIV]

I guess I see their versatility and haven't made it to leveling one yet, but... if something is easier than leveling an Afflic/Demo lock I'd be damn surprised. The only thing that guy was missing was an ability to stealth, but that'd be too hax. :P

Succubus sort of has stealth, but in a retarded way.

[Philistine]

There's not much to choose from between them for easy, but the Druid is definitely more efficient: it kills about as fast, and has near-zero downtime since your mana is regenerating while you're killing things rather than being depleted.

And yes, Druid versatility is a thing to behold. In one encounter during the Heroic Sethekk run that bagged me my Swift Flight Form, we got a bad pull and the healer got nuked right off. I shifted out of Cat to throw a couple of HoTs at the tank; battle rezzed the healer; threw another HoT at the tank; dropped into Bear to OT, taking some of the pressure off the MT while the healer potted up and got up to speed again; finally, with the healer and MT clicking again, I shifted back to Cat to DPS down the last couple of mobs in the pull. It was wicked keen.

Unfortunately, a lot of Druid players don't play to all of the class's strengths, thinking they can't heal if they're running Feral spec and gear, or they can't emergency OT if they're Balance, or whatever. But the plain and simple fact is, Druids are awesome.

/fanboy :smallbiggrin:

[Xanedan]

thinking they can't heal if they're running Feral spec and gear, or they can't emergency OT if they're Balance, or whatever.
/fanboy :smallbiggrin:

I could swear I saw a video floating around a couple years back of someone trying to main tank as a moonkin.

[Philistine]

I don't know about somebody trying to do that, but I saw a video of someone succeeding at it. Of course, he had to sport T5/T6 (IIRC) gear in order to MT Heroics and Kara, but still!

[Guancyto]

I saw one where he had Arena gear (for crit protection) and main tanked Gruul.

It was epic. :smallbiggrin: Not really indicative of what a boomkin will usually be doing, though.

[Xanedan]

I saw one where he had Arena gear (for crit protection) and main tanked Gruul.

It was epic. :smallbiggrin: Not really indicative of what a boomkin will usually be doing, though.

That's the one I was thinking of. That and the rogue tanking Sharaz/Illidan were pure win.

[Leon]

I think i'll be back early this year - don't want to miss out on Brewfest yet again...

Having just discovered that Brewfest has started i think i'll be missing it again for the 3rd time in a row - not only am i currently away i can not afford to play atm

[mangosta71]

That's the one I was thinking of. That and the rogue tanking Sharaz/Illidan were pure win.

I found out about the rogue tank too late to do it myself. I was gathering a set and had about 85% dodge/parry/miss when they nerfed the ratings. :smallsigh:

Pally ran ToC 10 last night and also got the sword. But I picked up a new tank belt and t9 gloves, too. But I'm noticing that my block value is still really low compared to a lot of other people - I only sit at 1122 unbuffed. I don't expect to be competitive with people whose mains are tank, but only having a third the BV? I've been gemming for stam and splashing mitigation stats in red and yellow sockets (and possibly for my meta - I forget what the requirements for it are). Is it ever worth it to gem str as a tank?

[Inhuman Bot]

I'm having an issue.

I'm level 46, as a BM hunter (With some points in MM), and it's working out well.

However, I have no idea where to go for good gear (I'm using lots of level 20-30 gear, except my gun. Which is awesome.), and have no idea where to go or how to level rapidly. Anyone have advice?

[TheEmerged]

BREWFEST.

Quick reminder for those that are going for the achievement. You can sell items back now. So it's perfectly possible to earn the tokens to buy the set (350 tokens) to do Disturbing the Peace, sell the suit back, and then use the tokens to get into Brew of the Month and the new vanity pet.

[Alex Star]

Hey guys,

Not sure how many Raiders post here at GitP, but I figured I'd stop by the WoW thread here.

Character: Rhysode
Realm: Kirin Tor
Class: Paladin
Spec: Protection

Anyways, I'm not part of a particularly hardcore raiding guild right now, although the guild I'm in does raid (the raiding guild I was in and I had a bit of a falling out back in february and I've yet to attempt looking for another actual raiding guild). So most of my end-game raids are in the form of pugs, although our guild has currently formed an alliance with another guild which has provided us with a much needed boost in our raid capability.

I'm one of the best geared tanks on our server (2547 WoW-Heroes Score), and have run with some of the top raiding guilds on the server, but when it comes to end-game content (ToCr 10/25) I'm still for the most part stuck putting together pick-up groups.

In particular the fight that I'm having the most trouble dealing with is of course the Faction Champions in ToCr. I'm at the point where my belief is that more DPS is simply required for this fight. And unfortunately that's fairly difficult to find in a pug. I've had groups with the coordination (as far as CC's and kiting, and what not) to effectively perform what's needed in the fight, however, when the chips come down they just don't have the DPS to make it work.

I've started assembling my pugs by using a combination of gear checks through WoW-Heroes and Be-Imba and asking the raid members privately how they would rate their DPS... however, I still find myself in the position of crashing through to the FC on ToCr easily then wiping for hours and days on the Faction Champions themselves.

Does anyone have a better idea what I should be looking for? or am I just going to have to bite the bullet and join a raiding guild if I want to clear this content. It's frustrating to me, not just because the fight is a PVP nightmare and I'm not particularly interested in PVP, but because I'm fully capable of tanking everything up to Anub'arak on 25 Man Heroic ToCr but I can't get past this ridiculous fight.

Ideas?

[Kish]

I'm having an issue.

I'm level 46, as a BM hunter (With some points in MM), and it's working out well.

However, I have no idea where to go for good gear (I'm using lots of level 20-30 gear, except my gun. Which is awesome.), and have no idea where to go or how to level rapidly. Anyone have advice?
For gear, go to dungeons, pretty much at all levels.

For leveling, at level 46 with a hunter, I'd go to the Western Plaguelands or Felwood, but that's just me.

[The Linker]

It's a bit early for Western Plaguelands, I think. The minimum level of enemies there are 50, right? And if you're Alliance, you won't even be able to easily head north past Andorhal, with its level 53-55 enemies. :smalleek:

Felwood's good, though. Tanaris, too. Heck, if you go to Tanaris and get the (many) quests for Zul'Farrak, you can get new gear as quest rewards and random drops! I know the Divine-O-Matic Rod quest rewards a nice Hunter ring, with Agility and Stamina.

Un'Goro would be good in a few levels, too. Best to start at 48 or 49.

[Inhuman Bot]

It's a bit early for Western Plaguelands, I think. The minimum level of enemies there are 50, right? And if you're Alliance, you won't even be able to easily head north past Andorhal, with its level 53-55 enemies. :smalleek:

Felwood's good, though. Tanaris, too. Heck, if you go to Tanaris and get the (many) quests for Zul'Farrak, you can get new gear as quest rewards and random drops! I know the Divine-O-Matic Rod quest rewards a nice Hunter ring, with Agility and Stamina.

Un'Goro would be good in a few levels, too. Best to start at 48 or 49.


Apparently it's not too early for WPL. Yeah, the minimum level is a skull for me, but I've paired up with a protection pally, and we're ripping most of the mobs apart. I just did the ZF quests, and yeah, the quest rewards are rather nice. I haven't really been to Un'goro though.

And for the record, I'm horde.

[Ego Slayer]

Alex Star - I am a raiding prot pally as well. FTW. Anyway, as far as the Faction Champs are concerned, that is, possibly, officially my least favourite encounter ever. :P And I like pvp. Honestly, if you want a shot a shot as consistently successful raids, yeah... find a guild. Which is really kinda hard, I know. I rejoined a previous (large) guild I was with before Wrath, back in April, hoping to start raiding with them because I'd actually never really raided, save a stray Kara run on my mage in BC. Guess where I was a week later. In another guild. Someone who had a 10man with friends in another guild needed another tank, and thus I stumbled upon an awesome raid and guild. I guess start guild-testing. The problem becomes, then, are you a main or fill-in tank for the raid you find. Thankfully I was filling a spot so it was going to be permanent, but I know for a fact I would never have consistently been a core tank in the guild I rejoined. I'm not sure if the official Bliz forums (there's some recruitment subforum, yes? I haven't been there in a long time) are worth advertising yourself on, but y'never know when there's someone out there who needs to fill a [permanent] spot.

Blahblahblah. ShutupnowEgojeeze. :smalltongue:



Pally ran ToC 10 last night and also got the sword. But I picked up a new tank belt and t9 gloves, too. But I'm noticing that my block value is still really low compared to a lot of other people - I only sit at 1122 unbuffed. I don't expect to be competitive with people whose mains are tank, but only having a third the BV? I've been gemming for stam and splashing mitigation stats in red and yellow sockets (and possibly for my meta - I forget what the requirements for it are). Is it ever worth it to gem str as a tank?
Wow, is 1122 really THAT low? I'm at 1295. Actually, the only piece of gear that has BV on it is a belt that's in dire need of replacing by now if I could find another belt with as much avoidance. :smallyuk: I don't even have Str gemmed either. As far as two-stat gems are concerned, I do hit-stam and dodge-stam, the latter because I'm hanging on to my block cap by a thread. Otherwise, I'd probably gem str there, I guess. You don't know the points per str->BV, do you?

[mangosta71]

Hey guys,

Not sure how many Raiders post here at GitP, but I figured I'd stop by the WoW thread here.

Character: Rhysode
Realm: Kirin Tor
Class: Paladin
Spec: Protection

Anyways, I'm not part of a particularly hardcore raiding guild right now, although the guild I'm in does raid (the raiding guild I was in and I had a bit of a falling out back in february and I've yet to attempt looking for another actual raiding guild). So most of my end-game raids are in the form of pugs, although our guild has currently formed an alliance with another guild which has provided us with a much needed boost in our raid capability.

I'm one of the best geared tanks on our server (2547 WoW-Heroes Score), and have run with some of the top raiding guilds on the server, but when it comes to end-game content (ToCr 10/25) I'm still for the most part stuck putting together pick-up groups.

In particular the fight that I'm having the most trouble dealing with is of course the Faction Champions in ToCr. I'm at the point where my belief is that more DPS is simply required for this fight. And unfortunately that's fairly difficult to find in a pug. I've had groups with the coordination (as far as CC's and kiting, and what not) to effectively perform what's needed in the fight, however, when the chips come down they just don't have the DPS to make it work.

I've started assembling my pugs by using a combination of gear checks through WoW-Heroes and Be-Imba and asking the raid members privately how they would rate their DPS... however, I still find myself in the position of crashing through to the FC on ToCr easily then wiping for hours and days on the Faction Champions themselves.

Does anyone have a better idea what I should be looking for? or am I just going to have to bite the bullet and join a raiding guild if I want to clear this content. It's frustrating to me, not just because the fight is a PVP nightmare and I'm not particularly interested in PVP, but because I'm fully capable of tanking everything up to Anub'arak on 25 Man Heroic ToCr but I can't get past this ridiculous fight.

Ideas?

A good frost mage can hold onto at least one of the melee types and keep it completely locked down. A rogue can sacrifice his personal dps to become an interrupt machine that keeps all of the casters locked down. It may come down to paying people to respec for the fight. The mobs can be taunted, so use your taunts and bubble to protect your team. Shamans need to be dropping tremor totems, and grounding totems are good too. Everyone that has a fear needs to be using it. Stuns, silences, disarms, interrupts - spam them all. What works best for my guild's raids is nuking the healers first (priest -> druid -> shaman -> paladin is our priority order). Once they're down, we're home free. Just keep the fire focused.


Apparently it's not too early for WPL. Yeah, the minimum level is a skull for me, but I've paired up with a protection pally, and we're ripping most of the mobs apart. I just did the ZF quests, and yeah, the quest rewards are rather nice. I haven't really been to Un'goro though.

And for the record, I'm horde.

At 46, I'd suggest Hinterlands or Searing Gorge for solo leveling. The later half of Feralas would be good, too. As long as you have a partner in crime higher level stuff is doable, but many quests have minimum levels. If you can get a group (and spare about 6 hours), Maraudon would be a good run for you. Personally, I'd hold off on WPL and UGC until at least 48.


Wow, is 1122 really THAT low? I'm at 1295.

I wouldn't have thought so, but I keep hearing about people blocking 3k or other ridiculous amounts.


I don't even have Str gemmed either. As far as two-stat gems are concerned, I do hit-stam and dodge-stam, the latter because I'm hanging on to my block cap by a thread. Otherwise, I'd probably gem str there, I guess. You don't know the points per str->BV, do you?

I'll look into the conversion factor.

[Guancyto]

Wow, is 1122 really THAT low? I'm at 1295. Actually, the only piece of gear that has BV on it is a belt that's in dire need of replacing by now if I could find another belt with as much avoidance. :smallyuk: I don't even have Str gemmed either. As far as two-stat gems are concerned, I do hit-stam and dodge-stam, the latter because I'm hanging on to my block cap by a thread. Otherwise, I'd probably gem str there, I guess. You don't know the points per str->BV, do you?

lolblock

Part-time prot pally here too (represent!) and seriously, don't worry about it. ShoR has a cap and when things hit for 25k blocking an extra thousand isn't as useful as more stamina, avoidance or armor.

Now building up a set composed mainly of block pieces is fine and you can get some amazing block value. But it's mostly for heroics/old content (and 10-man Algalon, or so I'm told).

[Alex Star]

It's not that I'd have a problem finding a guild(I've already gotten invites from many of the top ones on my server). It's more of whether or not I want to commit to such a tight raid schedule.

I have considered advertising myself on the official blizz forums... and perhaps looking for a guild on ANY server in need of a Main Tank, or even I suppose an Off-Tank. But once again it comes down to whether or not I can commit to a full time raiding guild.

My hope is that with the rebirth of the Onyxia raid I can get back to content that just doesn't require a ridiculous amount of coordination in raid that can only be found in a well put together guild run. (I still have trouble coming to terms with exactly how the FC fight registers as anything other PVP being forced into Raid content.)

As far as Tanking stats I have a few insights for those of you who are interested.

Buzz-words right now are Effective Health, and Avoidance.

This is partly the reason Paladin Tanks are getting so much play. It's easy to stack avoidance, (I'm at 62% avoidance on Rhysode, with the new Libram (Which is a 1/3 Proc rate thus a 100% up-time). And Effective health for Paladins is currently perhaps the highest in the game.

Self buffed I have 37k Health... Which if you factor in the 30% Less damage taken when under 35% HP... and the 30% HP refill the first time I'm reduced to 0 is an effective Health somewhere in the middle 50k range. Raid buffed that gets even higher, and currently with the ability to stack avoidance and the highest Effective Health in the game Paladins have a lot of spotlight on us.

Now as far as the future of tanking goes there are a few changes that are coming down the pipe.

The first is a much less forgiving diminishing returns on Avoidance.

Avoidance is most likely going to be "Hard-capped" by diminishing returns at 20% (Meaning that the returns after 20% dodge or parry are going to be so bad that it'd be detrimental to stack it).

The second thing is reduced amounts of damage mitigation from talents which reduces overall effective Health and makes mitigation through gear (block value) more important.

The next big thing in tanking is going to be Expertise Rating... current theorycrafting is showing that getting Expertise Capped is 80% as effective as dodge when it comes to damage avoidance.

56 Expertise pushes all Dodges, and all Parries off the table. Pushing parry off the table means you will NEVER parry haste a boss. This means that along with taking a reduced amount of damage due to the boss having fewer chances to hit you, it means a DRASTICALLY reduced chance of death because the, HIT, PARRY HASTE HIT, HIT that every Tank dreads can NEVER happen.

Anyways that's what I know so far, and some of the new gear coming out seems to be supporting it. (Expertise has already started to show up on the end-game tank gear)

[Ego Slayer]

RE: FC: To add some QQing, make sure you balance your CC. If dps is focusing too much on it, you won't burn your first target down, but if there is not continual CC on the second healer especially it's going to be a pain (I'd say Mangosta's healer killing priority list is spot on, though I'm not sure I've ever seen the priest and I'd probably put the druid before him.) One of my biggest peeves is when the second healer is not CC'd every second possible second during the first npc burn. If you have a priest in your raid, have them add Mass dispel to their rotation; you need to dispel Bloodlust/Heroism, the paladin's bubble, and HoTs if you have the druid. We had our SPriest spamming MD most of the time last week, which proved very useful. And your tanks need to taunt!! Even your plate dps should taunt if there's a mob on a clothy or healer. As a tank (I go ret for Repentance and wear my tank gear) I spend most of my time taunting off our clothies and healers. Spread out, lay frost traps, earthbind totems, judgment of justice on the melee. Slowed movement counts as CC here. :P

Edit: I think it's interesting they're making raiders expand for one encounter outside the box of their role. It's almost a little funny. The first night we spent trying to get them down was such a mess because a couple others didn't have the quickness required for pvp. But, as I'm sure we all remember... there was soo much CC required in BC I think it's a bit comical that Wrath requires no CC except for this one fight where it's all about being able to use ever CC ability you have. :smalltongue:

[Alex Star]

RE: FC: To add some QQing, make sure you balance your CC. If dps is focusing too much on it, you won't burn your first target down, but if there is not continual CC on the second healer especially it's going to be a pain (I'd say Mangosta's healer killing priority list is spot on, though I'm not sure I've ever seen the priest and I'd probably put the druid before him.) One of my biggest peeves is when the second healer is not CC'd every second possible second during the first npc burn. If you have a priest in your raid, have them add Mass dispel to their rotation; you need to dispel Bloodlust/Heroism, the paladin's bubble, and HoTs if you have the druid. We had our SPriest spamming MD most of the time last week, which proved very useful. And your tanks need to taunt!! Even your plate dps should taunt if there's a mob on a clothy or healer. As a tank (I go ret for Repentance and wear my tank gear) I spend most of my time taunting off our clothies and healers. Spread out, lay frost traps, earthbind totems, judgment of justice on the melee. Slowed movement counts as CC here. :P

As I said before, the strategy of the fight isn't the issue... The problem comes down to pure DPS issues in a pug.

Usually in a pug raid, even having gear checked everyone to 2300+ (WoW-Heroes) the reason these people aren't in raiding guilds for the most part is because they just aren't very dedicated to their class...

Sure occasionally you get the person who can pump 5k DPS.. but more often than not you're stuck with a vast majority of your DPS in the 2.5k Range. And I think thats where it just doesn't cut. You just can't kill anything fast enough before the diminshing returns take effect for your Taunts/CC's

[Blayze]

Vezax 10 (Normal) down for the first time ever last night after three failed attempts. As a Warrior, I think I've found my niche -- with an action bar setup consisting entirely of Pummel, Mortal Strike, Sunder Armour, Battle Shout, Demoralising Shout and Bloodrage. Between my Rogue guildie and myself, we handled those interrupts almost perfectly.

Might even be able to handle them myself next time, allowing him to focus on DPS.

[Ego Slayer]

FC blither wasn't exactly directed at you. Just adding to what Mangosta said. :P

Re: Interrupts: Funny story. On Friday our dps DK was supposed to be doing the interrupts on the light side of the Twin Valks after we burned the bubble... and I made a game of beating him to it every time. I'm gonna do this every week now. :smalltongue:

[Alex Star]

Vezax 10 (Normal) down for the first time ever last night after three failed attempts. As a Warrior, I think I've found my niche -- with an action bar setup consisting entirely of Pummel, Mortal Strike, Sunder Armour, Battle Shout, Demoralising Shout and Bloodrage. Between my Rogue guildie and myself, we handled those interrupts almost perfectly.

Might even be able to handle them myself next time, allowing him to focus on DPS.

Grats!

Had a crazy Ulduar 25 last night myself... solo-tanked Razorscale from about 40% down... Off-tank went down way to quick and we were out of battle-rezzes... I was just about to run out of time on Fuse Armors when for some reason I had an idea... I called out "DI ME, DI ME, DIVINE INTERVENTION RHYSODE" on vent... Both of the pallies in the raid DI'd me at the same time, which did exactly what i thought it would do and removed the Fuse Armor debuff.. Only one raid member died while I was clicking off the DI debuff, and fortunately that was just enough for me to tank him and the raid to finish him off.. It was pretty intense, and one heck of a battle.

[Ego Slayer]

Grats!

Had a crazy Ulduar 25 last night myself... solo-tanked Razorscale from about 40% down... Off-tank went down way to quick and we were out of battle-rezzes... I was just about to run out of time on Fuse Armors when for some reason I had an idea... I called out "DI ME, DI ME, DIVINE INTERVENTION RHYSODE" on vent... Both of the pallies in the raid DI'd me at the same time, which did exactly what i thought it would do and removed the Fuse Armor debuff.. Only one raid member died while I was clicking off the DI debuff, and fortunately that was just enough for me to tank him and the raid to finish him off.. It was pretty intense, and one heck of a battle.
xD That's pretty damn epic. Congrats. I take it that regular bubbles don't remove the debuff then? I never tried that. Mm... another use for DI. Fun. :smallbiggrin:

[Alex Star]

xD That's pretty damn epic. Congrats. I take it that regular bubbles don't remove the debuff then? I never tried that. Mm... another use for DI. Fun. :smallbiggrin:

Divine Shield might have removed it but I had forbearance from using Divine Protection during the part where I had 12 stacks of the flame debuff LOL.

[mangosta71]

In 10 man, the casts on Vezax are far enough apart that one person can do all of the interrupts. On 25, you need at least 2.

FC: the disc priest dies FAST if everyone jumps on him right at the start. He can also dispel most of your CC, unlike the druid. Thus we kill him first if he's up.

[AgentPaper]

Reminds me of a fight against Jaraxus, where I was assigned to heal the main tank. (I think it was a pug) We had a mage and a couple DKs that were supposed to take care of dispels and interrupts, but at the end of the battle 90% of all interrupts and dispels were from me, not to mention a good chunk of healing. Purge and Wind Shear FTW!

Also, what macros/addons does everyone here use?

Addons:

Deadly Boss Mods - Duh. Raiding without this is suicide. Refusing to raid without this is a good way to get /g kicked. :smallwink:

Grid - Surprisingly, I didn't even use this until recently, and regret not doing so. I just wish it was more flexible, for example making the status effect icons much smaller, the whole thing bigger, being able to choose exactly which buffs/debuffs to show or not, etc.

Auctioneer - Makes it much easier to throw stuff into the AH and make money. Also nice for knowing whether I should throw away the worm meat or the light feather to make room in a full bag. :smalltongue:

QuestHelper - Helps so much it's not even funny. I don't know if I could stand leveling without this anymore.

Cartographer - Becoming less useful as Blizzard adds many of it's functions to the basic interface, but still worth using for now.

Dominoes - My interface addon, because there aren't enough bars in the basic interface. (Yes, I filled all 5 bars with abilities on my shaman) 10 bars will take a bit longer to fill, hopefully. :smallbiggrin:

Dominoes has also let me get a more comprehensive shortcut setup going. Currently, I use the standard 1, 2, 3...0, -, =, as well as a different bar accessed by pressing alt-1, alt-2, alt-3, etc., and another with shift-1, shift-2, shift-3, etc., and also F, G, and H for totems (or stances on my warrior and presences on my DK) and shift- and alt-R, T, Y, U, F, G, H, J, V, B, N, M for other various purposes, mostly mounts, buffs, and pots. I was actually only using the alt-versions of these until recently, but found myself running out of room for all my abilities on my DK and so added a shift-version as well. :smalltongue:

Macros:

Unfortuntely, I'm not at my normal WoW computer, so I can't list any of these, but a few useful ones include one to switch to my off-spec's talents and armor setup, (and back) One that makes it so I can't use Bloodlust outside of combat, one that announces who I'm rezzing, and one each for Wind Shear and Purge, which targets my focus and casts it on him. (So I can just hit shift-1 or whatever and interrupt the boss, instead of wasting time trying to target him while I heal)

I also have a macro in my DPS set that uses all of my cooldowns, trinkets, and bloodrage at the same time with a button press, so I don't have to clutter my bar with five different abilities to use at the same time. (It helps that they all have similar cooldowns) My warrior also has a similar macro for his rage-producing abilities, and my DK has a macro to automatically use the ability that makes your next ability a crit right before I use Howling Blast.

I also have a macro that takes off all my armor, /dances, and yells out "NAKED TIME!"...

[Vonriel]

I use DBM, a loot addon called Drunkard Suicide Kings (my guild's loot distribution method), recount and omen (duh), pallypower, and gathermate, and that's pretty much it. Macros are few and far between as well, although I've been tempted to make a single button macro to use for dpsing on my ret pally, just to see if I can. My main macro was one that tied - past tense because I just got rid of the trinket - my use-trinket into my avenging wrath, since I always forget to use both of them and I figured tying them into one button may help. (It doesn't.)

The ToC fight isn't as much about sustained dps as it is about burst, I've noticed. And bursting down the first healer is the absolute most important part. Once all the healers are dead, the fight becomes an endurance match, with the scales tipped heavily in favor of your raid. I only think most people hate it because they get to it and then realize all those buttons that they never use actually have a use, and now their action bars are all messed up from the fight. :smalltongue:

[mangosta71]

Let's see...I use DBM, Omen, Recount, SCT, Cartographer, Atlas and AtlasLoot, Auctioneer, several of the pieces of the CT suite, Chatter, Spelltips, and a rune mod for my DK (Yury's or something like that). I also have lots of macros. One to pop my trinket with Cold Blood, one that does the same but adds popping a Potion of Speed, a random and conditional macro for mounting (has to be modified for each character), mouseover macros for Tricks on the rogue; heals, decursing, bubbling, and taunting for the pally; buffing and decursing on the mage, druid, and priest... I like mouseover macros. I use macros to add fun little emotes and/or yells to some of my abilities (for example, when I feint I yell "Come see the violence inherent in the system! Help! Help! I'm being repressed!")... I've considered making cast sequence macros for the pally and lock, but never actually gotten around to doing that yet. Difficulty there is that I start at different spots in the rotation depending on the conditions.

[Alex Star]

I use,

Questhelper
Xperl
Auctioneer
Atlasloot
Recount (With the recount threat meter)
Wardrobe
MSBT (I absolutely cannot play wow without MSBT anymore... lol)


Macros..

I have one for Divine Protection that sends out a raid warning when I activate it (It used to also notify when it was running out until Blizz removed the delay from macros)

I have one for Divine Shield which first tries to cancel divine shield, then applies it, so on the first click it activates Divine Shield, and then on the second click it cancels it. (Great for short bubbles to remove a bad effect or something without losing aggro when tanking).

I now have one for Divine Intervention which cancels Divine Intervention.

I also have ones for Raid Vent posting.. Raid loot rules... and I probably make a raid specific macro almost every other time we raid to instruct someone to do something LOL.

[Ego Slayer]

Letsseeheere...

Pally has:

Drunken Suicide Kings (Von's in mah guild, yo :smallcool:) and Ora2 for raiding

Bartender 4
Pallypower
Omen and Recount
Sexymap
Power Auras (zomg, favourite addon EVER!)
Atlas loot
WIM (AIM for WoW. Just a little addon I use to separate whispers, it tabs each person on the same window)
BigWigs (boss mod)
RaidMobMarker (just a little bar with all the raid marker for quick and easy marking)
RatingBuster

And TellMeWhen as a DoT timer on my 'lock.

[mangosta71]

Oh yeah, forgot oRa, Bartender, and x-perl. Kinda funny, since those are the most visible addons I have. Also Gatherer.

[Zherog]

I'm forgetting some, but off the top of my head I have Auctioneer and RatingBuster, and I have Cryolysis3 installed for my mage.

I had cartographer and didn't like it. *shrug*

As for macros, the only one I have at the moment is one that displays the current coordinates.

edit: Now that I can log in and look... I don't have Cartographer; I have/had Atlas. It's no longer active, though. I have Auctioneer (and it's many related mods), EnhTooltip (which I believe is a requirement of something else), Informant, and RatingBuster.

[TheEmerged]

RE: Brewfest. Well, it took a couple of days this time, but the infamous Brewfest Lag has struck on my server. As in previous years this makes the Dark Iron Invasion essentially impossible but makes Ram Racing more forgiving (my mage got nearly 20 trips today).

RE: Addons. I have DBM and Omen installed but not generally active. The only addon I use all the time is RatingsBuster -- primarily because it's hard to keep gear straight on my army of alts sometimes :P

[AgentPaper]

One addon I discovered recently but haven't been able to try out is Considerator (http://wow.curse.com/downloads/wow-addons/details/considerater.aspx), which is basically an addon version of LootRank, scoring gear based on stat scores, and then comparing it to stuff you're wearing, have in your inventory, or is in your bank. It even figures out the best gems to have and includes that in the comparison.

[Inhuman Bot]

I managed to grab the 200 tokens for brew of the month today. :smallbiggrin:

Addons:

I haven't bothered to use many, so I only have Omen, Auctioneer, Questhelper and Sexymap. There's another one that I can't recall what it's called, but it improved the portraits too.

[sihnfahl]

The only two mods I use while raiding are Recount and Deadly Boss Mods. Everything else is more or less superfluous, as I'm quite good at watching procs and timers on my own (comes from being a healer / dispeller during the old days with limited mods to help you watch people).

The lag was horrendous last night - we had people taking 3-5 minutes to zone in, long waits to release and get back into the instances after wipes... but we got it down.

Onyxia proved a massive problem for a few folks. The problem came down to the whelps and the AOE. When we got the biggest pack we could, their connections decided 'NO!' when the damage reports started coming in. Something about a DK doing 102k dps and a mage doing 98k dps messed things up... (2 diseases ticking every 3s, plus D&D ticking every second, plus random wandering plague procs, then lots of blood boil...)

[mangosta71]

Lag? Count yourself lucky that your server was up at all. Whisperwind died during prime time.

RE: Onyxia - I got to do the 10 man in the early afternoon. Pretty easy, but a large part of the group remembers her from level 60. Not sure how a bunch of people who had never seen her before would fare. I'm noticing that WoW is really loose on minimum requirements to run, but as you get into instances and raids you start needing high-end machines and connections. My lousy ISP, which is unfortunately the only high-speed service in the area, is often overwhelmed by AoE. :smallmad:

In rogue news, since they took the interrupt off talented FoK (but didn't change the tooltip. GG Blizz) I switched my secondary spec to sub. Just to see what I could do with it in a raid. But they broke HAT. After the server came back up, I did the daily heroic, and didn't get a single combo point from the group's crits the whole run. That may not sound so bad until you remember that sub doesn't have any other form of gaining combo points, and has NO energy regen. I do like the 100% crit rate on ambush though. Mmm, SS ambush for a quick 10k...

[Zherog]

Yeah, the lag was terrible for me last night. I couldn't even get mail, it was so bad. Last night was the first weeknight I've had a chance to play in quite a while, thanks to a crazy work schedule. I ended up logging off and going to bed early instead.

Can folks give a little info about some of their mods? Simple stuff, like what's it do? ;)

[Alex Star]

YAY for Onyxia!

Grabbed Gleaming Quel'Serra off Onyxia 10 in my first run last night.

Hoping to soon get Burnishined Quel'Serra off the 25 version!

BTW: Extremely Easy Fight..

1 Geared Tank
2 Geared Healers
4 Ranged DPS
3 Melee DPS

Probably reccommended setup for most groups. A very well geared group could 1 Tank 1 Heal it.

A group with extremely well geared melee DPS could 5 Ranged, 2 Melee.

The trick to the fight is how quick you burn her down during the Air Phase... the faster you push her from 60% to 40% the easier it goes. :)

Make sure your raid is smart enough to stay away from her tail.

[Zherog]

The trick to the fight is how quick you burn her down during the Air Phase... the faster you push her from 60% to 40% the easier it goes. :)

Make sure your raid is smart enough to stay away from her tail.

If that's the case, then it's pretty much the same fight as before, if I remember correctly. Get her back to the ground as quickly as possible and avoid the tail slappage.

[Alex Star]

If that's the case, then it's pretty much the same fight as before, if I remember correctly. Get her back to the ground as quickly as possible and avoid the tail slappage.

Yeah no big change at all.

There is some stuff with adds doing an AoE during the air phase, and Onyxia herself fearing when she comes back down from the air phase, but any competent raid should be able to handle it pretty easily.

[Zherog]

I recall Ony having a fear ability before, though, so that's also nothing new. I recall because I once got feared into the eggs, creating a large number of whelps. :smalleek:

[sihnfahl]

The only 'new' part to the fight are the Phase 2 dragonkin adds.

It's something for the melee to do between whelp timers, since most melee has extremely weak ranged.

I'm an unholy DK. Ranged DPS? About 1700....

[Alex Star]

Yeah the dragonkin adds are pretty weak though... They die quickly and if they don't even begin to cast their AOE until they've been up for like 10 or 15 seconds... and then it's a REALLY long cast time... like 3 seconds or something so no-one really should ever get hit by it..

I think in the 2 attempts we faced Onyxia we literally saw 1 go off.. (only reason we needed 2 attempts was because we tried it once with 2 tanks and 3 healers... then we were like man... our DPS is kinda slow and we're hardly getting hurt maybe we only need 1 tank and 2 healers.. then it went really quick.)

[mangosta71]

If HAT was working, I could be tossing some hefty deadly throws at her. Don't think you can hit her with melee ranged special attacks, so that's a change from before (I was always the designated rupture rogue back when only one of any debuff could be up at a time). The deep breath isn't a one-shot kill any more, and she can do it in more spots. The guards have been mentioned already. Other than those little tweaks, it's the same Ony we know and love from the old days. On a similar note, melee can safely engage the trash now.

[Kish]

I recall Ony having a fear ability before, though, so that's also nothing new. I recall because I once got feared into the eggs, creating a large number of whelps. :smalleek:
And you got minus fifty DKP for it?

[Zherog]

What's DKP?

[mangosta71]

And you got minus fifty DKP for it?

No, he got a FIFTY DKP MINUS!

Zherog, go to youtube and search for "Onyxia wipe". Classic stuff. That guy was both a jerk and an idiot. People standing in the right spot, especially melee dps, got feared into her tail and tossed into the caves all the time. That's what the whelp groups were for.

[Alex Star]

What's DKP?

DKP stands for Dragon Kill Points..

It's literally an OLD Holdover raiding loot system from like Everquest...

Raid members recieved Dragon Kill Points for their participation in raids... downing bosses... and that sort of thing.. Lost Dragon Kill Points for doing things that seriously undermined the raid.

Then players would bid with Dragon Kill Points on loot that they wanted... Basically it was designed so that if you just stuck with it eventually you could win the item you wanted if you just saved up your DKP...

[Karoht]

Can't wait to get my Pandaren Monk Pet. So cool!

I'm Karoht, on Kul Tiras server, Tauren Druid

Also, does anyone here use Healbot? Its a mod/addon for healing. I like it but I'm looking for a better HoT timer if there is one.

[Inhuman Bot]

Having just gotten my hunter to 55, I decided to make a Death Knight.

I went to Blizzard's site, got the 10 day free trial. The last step wanted me to either download the game client or the Classic WoW trial, so I chose the first.

I logged out, then tryed to log back in and got the message
"Your account is aurthorized for the Wrath of the Lich King expansion, but the computer your are playing on does not cotain Wrath of the Lich King data. To play on this machine with this account, you must instal the Wrath of the Lich King. Additional data is available at: [www.worldofwarcraft.com/lichking/download/]
Allright. I followed that and... Got to the same step I was at when I went to get the free WotLk trial. I try again and it says I've allready got it and thus am not elegiable. Anyone able to help?

[Guancyto]

So, lots of paladins (especially prot) on this thread.

wrf are they thinking with the new Blessing of Sanctuary? :smalleek: It's both ridiculously amazing and completely ridiculous. I had 40k HP with just kings sanc and fort in a heroic yesterday and I haven't even shed all the blues off my tank set.

And an extra 10% strength that stacks with kings? Did they find that plate classes were lacking in dps or what?

[tyckspoon]

So, lots of paladins (especially prot) on this thread.

wrf are they thinking with the new Blessing of Sanctuary? :smalleek: It's both ridiculously amazing and completely ridiculous. I had 40k HP with just kings sanc and fort in a heroic yesterday and I haven't even shed all the blues off my tank set.

And an extra 10% strength that stacks with kings? Did they find that plate classes were lacking in dps or what?

I'm pretty sure Sanc's bonuses aren't supposed to stack with Kings; it's just meant to make it so you don't have to choose between a Stam/threat buff and damage reduction/mana return in small groups. If they *are* stacking, I would enjoy it while it lasts- it'll probably get hotfixed out soon.

[Guancyto]

I would think so too, and that would definitely be a very sensible and sane solution, except... in the patchnotes, it says it's stacking and intended as such.

This very well may make strength better than +hit for retribution again. :smalleek:

[Alex Star]

Ret damage was already nerfed with the loss of Martyr... The upgrade in strength from sanctuary (Which a ret pally really only gets if there is a prot pally in the raid AND he's the third paladin in the group) is negligible..

All ret pallys will still go Might-Kings-Sanctuary-Wisdom as what they'd want. And one of those buffs is depending upon a very specific structure of your group. So I don't think it's really that OP...

On the other hand.. with the increase in block value important combined with the reduction in threat generation from Righteous Fury the extra strength for a Prot Pally puts us just about where we were before except perhaps doing a SLIGHT bit more damage.

[Guancyto]

It's probably too early to say whether or not it'll make strength dps overshadow their counterparts; making ret overpowered would take a bit, but they are the biggest strength-stackers. Bear in mind that this isn't me going "other classes get such nice things ;_;" since being a Ret/Prot, well, if anybody is benefiting from this more stand up now. :smalltongue:

But it is a good reason to get a prot pally in your 25-man by hook or by crook. You're spot-on that it isn't nearly as likely to feature in 10-man, though.

[mangosta71]

It's probably too early to say whether or not it'll make strength dps overshadow their counterparts; making ret overpowered would take a bit, but they are the biggest strength-stackers. Bear in mind that this isn't me going "other classes get such nice things ;_;" since being a Ret/Prot, well, if anybody is benefiting from this more stand up now. :smalltongue:

But it is a good reason to get a prot pally in your 25-man by hook or by crook. You're spot-on that it isn't nearly as likely to feature in 10-man, though.

Well, there's still a decent chance of having a prot pally in a 10 man. Whether or not you'll also have the other two is another question. Seems that Blizz expects us to have one character of each class in 10 man raid groups. That said, about the smoothest 5 man dungeon I've ever run featured one pally of each spec...

There's a reason ret paladins stack strength more than other plate dps. Once you reach the hit cap, more hit is useless. Armor pen is less than ideal because so much of ret's damage is non-physical. Haste isn't ideal because it only increases your white damage, which is comparatively smaller than that of the other melee types. In addition to the white damage increase, warriors at least gain more rage from hitting more often, which increases their yellow damage too.

[Kish]

I would think so too, and that would definitely be a very sensible and sane solution, except... in the patchnotes, it says it's stacking and intended as such.
Wait, what?

It says specifically that they don't stack. The closest the notes come to saying it stacks, is when they say that they fixed the bug where, if you had both Kings and Sanctuary on and something purged or dispelled Sanctuary, you'd be left with Kings only affecting the three stats Sanctuary doesn't affect.

[Guancyto]

Wait, what?

It says specifically that they don't stack. The closest the notes come to saying it stacks, is when they say that they fixed the bug where, if you had both Kings and Sanctuary on and something purged or dispelled Sanctuary, you'd be left with Kings only affecting the three stats Sanctuary doesn't affect.

!

You're right. :smallredface: I had misread that like you wouldn't believe.

Also wasn't aware of the bug, so yeah. Carry on, everyone, I have a cone hat to wear and a corner to sit in...

[TheEmerged]

Well, today was set aside for achievement spam. I'm sitting at 7 right now: Master of Arms; Knuckle Sandwich (which I got separate from Master of Arms); Pest Control; To All Squirrels Who've Shared My Life; Friend or Fowl; Filling Up The Barn; and Ultimate Triage. I'm at 49 pets right now, working on the Sprite Darter chain, and caught my second Mr. Pinchy today (got the potions for my first wish). I was hoping for Mr. Pinchy as Pet #50, but I might just go ahead and take it with the Sprite Darter.

[Karoht]

About 2 weeks ago I had a major achievement spam. I must have got 20 achievements in about 3 or 4 days. I was going after the title Champion of the Frozen Wastes, and only had 1 heroic dungeon left to get. Heroic Occulus. Errr. Hate that place. Friends do not let friends do Heroic Occulus. For reals.

Anyway, I lined up the achievement for the daily quests as well as the daily heroics, and got a group. Took us 3 hours to finish, but we got it. So that was three achievements. Then finished up all the reps for the factions from the tournament dailies, got those titles plus Ambassador. I think all in all that was 10 different achievements. Next day finished off another rep, got an achievement plus another achievement for getting 20 factions to exalted. And we got a bunch of boss fight achievements in the Heroic Dungeons doing dailies. All in all, it was a good week.

Then my guild sort of went down hill and now I'm guild shopping. I have never, ever put a guildie on ignore until yesterday. I'm serious. It has never happened. Our guild is really nice about helping people out (we had a warlock who couldn't get over 1200 dps jump up to 4000 dps once the guild master sat down with her and helped her with her spec and rotation) but this kid was constantly asking every question under the sun rather than just going to check or looking it up himself. And he's been doing it for weeks. Sorry, but you don't need to ask what the daily heroic instance is, every single day, when you can just go pick up the quest and find out yourself.

Sorry, cheer turned into rant.

[AgentPaper]

Pshaw, H-Occ is easysauce, especially the last boss. (The one before him is a bit of a pain, but workable) You just have to know what the f*** to do. Or rather, the red drake does, the green drake throws heals at the red and /follows and otherwise spamming poison, and then the bronze can go have sex with a goat for all I care, but throwing out some DPS and freezing him during rage is nice too.

For those who don't know how to play red: Keep martyr up 100% of the time, no exceptions. Use the dodge spell thing whenever it wears off, or just whenever it's off cooldown if you don't want to keep track of the buff. Spam your attack on the boss whenever you're not doing anything. Whenever the big balls appear, run the f*** away, and KEEP running away until they dissappear, at which point you should head back to the boss. Green should be /following you, and so should the bronze for that matter, so nobody else should have to worry about moving. In case you don't know, you have to actually type "/follow name" to follow someone on a drake. (And that's their character's name, not the drake's)

[Ego Slayer]

I'd just like to say... people basically never die when I'm tanking. And if they do, its not my fault 98% of the time. Now... I hate H Occ with a passion but my friend roped me into tanking it last night (I don't even remember if I actually TANKED it the first and only time I ran it before). He's an officer in my previous guild and the group consisted of another officer, the GM, and the original GM, my friend, and I. I killed them all. At least twice. It was horrible. :smalleek: :smallannoyed:

I've never felt like such a horrible tank before... but some of those pulls are absolutely stupid. Argh!!

[AgentPaper]

Which ones were really bad? The only time I've seen a group have trouble is on the second-to-last boss, with all the ice and stuff. I'm really not sure exactly how you're supposed to beat that guy, but we usually manage to beat him through sheer force of damage and healing. (Bloodlust helps)

[tyckspoon]

Which ones were really bad? The only time I've seen a group have trouble is on the second-to-last boss, with all the ice and stuff. I'm really not sure exactly how you're supposed to beat that guy, but we usually manage to beat him through sheer force of damage and healing. (Bloodlust helps)

Walk him backwards around his ring, so that the tank spends as much time as possible *not* standing in the ice bomb (especially important on Heroic- there's an additional stacking debuff for standing in the ice that makes the DoT ticks do more damage). Melee DPS attack him from the front, because they don't want to be stuck inside the ice slick any more than the tank does. When he teleports to the center, hide behind a pillar *really fast* (I have died to this thanks to (a) still standing in the ice slick and (b) being equidistant between two pillars at the time. Also (c) having stubby Dwarf legs [and (d) not remembering I have Hand of Freedom unless I'm PvPing, and (e)being slow to realize I wasn't going to make it and hit my Bubble button. In my defense, it was the first time I'd done the fight.]) Alternately, if your healer is up to it you can just tank him near a pillar and eat the ice bomb damage, so your ranged characters don't ever really have to move and your melee doesn't have too far to go. Other than that, healer keeps an eye out for somebody who shouldn't be damaged eating a spike- it means they got the Time Bomb and should be healed. Doesn't necessarily have to be to full, but every point of healing they get is one less they're going to inflict on the rest of the group when the bomb goes off. If you don't think you're going to get a heal, pay attention to your own health and swallow a potion.

And Frost Resistance is handy if you have a source of it around, of course.

[Kish]

In my experience, the continuous-kiting method leads to people trapped away from the pillar and/or the floor behind the only pillar close enough to hide behind being coated with ice so that the group can choose between "stand in the open and die" and, "stand behind the pillar and die." My preferred method involves the tank tanking him in one place and eating the frost damage. May not work as well with a less durable tank.

[Inhuman Bot]

So, got level 52 today, and went to my first AV match an-

DEAR GOD DEATHGRIP, WHY!?! *sobs*

At least there's disengage I suppose. :/

[AgentPaper]

That your main at 52? Or an alt you're raising? If it's your main, then grats, and be happy that your old world questing pains are almost over, and soon you will be floating happily through Outlands questing, which is oh so much more bearable. The only thing better is Northrend questing. Seriously though, I would recommend that, once you hit 58, just drop all the quests you have and head straight for the Dark Portal. It's what I've done on all my alts, anyways. :smallbiggrin: And even if you do decide you want to do more old-world quests, you'll at least want to make a quick stop in Hellfire Penninsula to do a few quests and get some great upgrades.

[Inhuman Bot]

That your main at 52? Or an alt you're raising? If it's your main, then grats, and be happy that your old world questing pains are almost over, and soon you will be floating happily through Outlands questing, which is oh so much more bearable. The only thing better is Northrend questing. Seriously though, I would recommend that, once you hit 58, just drop all the quests you have and head straight for the Dark Portal. It's what I've done on all my alts, anyways. :smallbiggrin: And even if you do decide you want to do more old-world quests, you'll at least want to make a quick stop in Hellfire Penninsula to do a few quests and get some great upgrades.

Thanks. :smallsmile:

It's the first charcter I've raised by myself. "I" have an 80 paladin, but I don't use it (or make DKs because of it) anymore, because it was my brother that did most of the work.

Fortuneately, I've allready raised a small fortune from farming cloth and ore, so as soon as I hit the right level, I can soar gracefully throughout OL. :smallbiggrin:

[sihnfahl]

DEAR GOD DEATHGRIP, WHY!?! *sobs*
Because they can.

The most amusing one is when you get chain deathgripped around the field, wondering what you're supposed to do with all this flying about.

On that note, I HATE what they did to unholy. I pretty much can handle the main part with a castsequence macro, with three other buttons for general DPS.

A simple blood tap / boneshield macro every minute, one to summon the gargoyle, and the third to dump RP via deathcoil.

You know how they say ret paladins are faceroll? I could probably put a bobbing head toy on my keyboard and win...

[mangosta71]

I sorta did that on my lock, except I went back to old world when I hit 60 to do my epic mount quest.

In my experience tanking H Oculus, the worst groups are the bunches of whelps at the beginning. They just sit still and cast and don't group up so I can effectively hold all of them, and they hit reasonably hard on non-tanks. Most likely scenario is a couple turn on the healer and nuke him, and then you have to hope you have the dps to take them all down before everyone else in the party dies. And if you're running around trying to hold the whelps, the elites in the pull are probably free. There was also one time I DCed during the first little menagerie thingy on the third boss, somehow the group didn't realize that I had stopped moving and hadn't joined the group and pulled the next group, and I came back online just in time to see them die halfway around the circle...

In news, I finished Brewmaster yesterday. One month to a violet protodrake! Unless the RNG screws me again.

[SlyGuyMcFly]

Shhhh! Never utter the three letters of the-acronym-who-must-not-be-named lest you suffer it's wrath! :smallwink:

[Philistine]

Pfft. You're going to suffer its wrath anyway, so you might as well call it by its name.

[darkblust]

I was looking at some class abilitys,and it seems like druids do alot less ranged dps then mage and priest.Is this true?

[Zherog]

So I've started semi-seriously working on the Loremaster achievements in the old world. Is there anywhere that shows you the quests you've completed, so I can compare that to a list of available quests? I don't think so, but figured I'd check just to be sure...

[Kish]

I was looking at some class abilitys,and it seems like druids do alot less ranged dps then mage and priest.Is this true?
No. Not at level 80, anyway--presuming you mean balance druids, that is.

[darkblust]

Yeah,balance.

[Ego Slayer]

Raidrage spoilered for your non-viewing pleasure.
Yeah, so. Our best healer/sorta raid leader decided to take a break to sort some RL things out... in hardly a week, that managed to snowball into the raid falling about entirely. We were already going to be losing our out of guild healer, so we were already prepared to work on a replacement when our other healer suddenly decided to take a break. TotC went really damn well on Friday despite our leaving guild healer step in to OT for the night (one of us found a priest healer for that night) because for some damn reason our other tank and 'lock (who live together) didn't show up because they thought we weren't going 'cos of our healer taking a break, even though the other tank had apparently said the day before that they WOULD be there. :smallannoyed: And it doesn't even end there. The 'lock is not going to be raiding anymore and I haven't even seen the tank on since Thursday... like... were either of them planning on telling us any of this? We called last nights Uld off at the last minute 'cos of missing people, and the priest healer getting himself locked to Uld on Friday night after the TotC while still in Vent with us....well, apparently no one told our one out of guild dps (who is a guildie with the out of guild healer we were losing) that we were calling it even though the healer had popped into Vent and we'd told her...so the dps took herself off the rest of the raid invites. And that's still not all. Our other in guild healer, the only one who was gonna be left after all this, has decided also to take a break. I knew he'd been thinking about it for weeks, but losing five people in a week left him the perfect opportunity to cancel his account last night.

And so Ego is left, apparently, raid-less. My only hope is that one of the other guilds on server is, for the second time in only a couple months, having a large group of people leave to form their own guild because of conflicts and BS in raids. And I actually happen to very much like the guy who is leading their new guild, so I'm going to hope and pray he needs a tank for the 10man. Plus I'm good friends with one of the other raid leaders of that guild who is officially quitting the position after tonight, so I think he's going to heal for their new guild...so if I'm lucky, I'll get in with them. Don't know what the hell I'd do otherwise. Even though I could pretty easily sell myself to another raid, I wouldn't look forward to trying to find exactly what I want. :smallsigh:

In more interesting news... I solo'd Normal MgT for a Phoenix and got one last night. I'm gonna see how long I can put up with soloing Heroic every day in hopes of a mount. Let me tell you... Heroic Kael was one pain in the ass 'til I figured out I was actually better off doing it as ret and not prot. :smalltongue:

[sihnfahl]

Is there anywhere that shows you the quests you've completed, so I can compare that to a list of available quests? I don't think so, but figured I'd check just to be sure...
Nope, there's not. (Plus, that list would be HUGE; I'm sitting just 57 shy of The Seeker myself)...

Your best bet is to just run around every area with 'low level quest' tracking on and see what pops up. Inefficient, to be sure, but no other alternative.


I was looking at some class abilitys,and it seems like druids do alot less ranged dps then mage and priest.Is this true?
Mages smoke the ranged meters. Priests are pretty good, but you need a geared one and a fight where they don't have 'ramp up' times (they need to build stacks in order to max their DPS; if something dies before that ramp up occurs, their DPS suffers from target switching).

[Zherog]

Nope, there's not. (Plus, that list would be HUGE; I'm sitting just 57 shy of The Seeker myself)...

Your best bet is to just run around every area with 'low level quest' tracking on and see what pops up. Inefficient, to be sure, but no other alternative.

That's what I figured, but wanted to check.

I've been doing exactly that. Just wanted to be sure I haven't missed anything, like drops that lead to quests and such. I need another 298 quests for Kalimdor, and then I'll start on Eastern Kingdoms, where I need around 300.

[sihnfahl]

I've been doing exactly that. Just wanted to be sure I haven't missed anything, like drops that lead to quests and such. I need another 298 quests for Kalimdor, and then I'll start on Eastern Kingdoms, where I need around 300.
Most of the drop items are usually found with mobs you'd be killing anyway, or the item that spawns a quest will have a ! over it.

One of Blizz's best decisions, IMO, since those little items can be easily overlooked if they didn't have SOMETHING that said 'hey, quest here!'

[Khanderas]

Lookup the achivments on wowhead.com
In the comments there left by other players there are often links to 'this item starts a quest' drops/quests.

I also managed to get a GM to tell me wich of the 3 mechanical chicken quests (Tanaris/ferales/Hinterlands) that I had missed. To ask them to list the quests you havn't done may be a wee bit too much though.
Anyways the point is that it can be found by the GM's so there IS a list. Just not very visible to players.

[mangosta71]

I'm 6 Kalimdor quests short of Loremaster. The only spot I know I haven't hit is Mudsprocket, but I'm still hated from my Bloodsail grind. The Loremaster achievement will also get me the 25 tabards one, which will enable me to take all those old, ugly tabards back to the vendor where they belong and free up a bunch of bank space, which I can use for enchanting mats since I dropped herbing to level that. Fortunately, I only need 400 for the ring enchants, so once I get another 40 or so points I can stop blowing through my cash and finish it up nice and slow.

[TheEmerged]

I also managed to get a GM to tell me wich of the 3 mechanical chicken quests (Tanaris/ferales/Hinterlands) that I had missed. To ask them to list the quests you havn't done may be a wee bit too much though.
Anyways the point is that it can be found by the GM's so there IS a list. Just not very visible to players.

Interesting, I just did this too -- for the same quest. I got an email saying a check like this was right on the border of what they were allowed to do but they could tell me one word. The word was Ferales.

In other news: Mr Pinchy. I can has it :-)

[Zherog]

Hit 407 out of 685 Kalimdor quests last night after mostly wrapping up Desolace. Also managed to get exalted with Orgrimmar in the process. Now I just need to locate another 280 or so quests and I'm done that continent...

[darkblust]

Are the playgrounders mostly horde or alliance?

I mostly play alliance,but thats cause all my friends play it.I love horde,but i like to play with my buddys more.

[TheEmerged]

Primarily Alliance here. I have some horde alts on a PvP server that I haven't touched in something like a year, but obviously they don't count. My 10th character slot on my RP server is reserved for a Goblin (insert here) when Cataclysm hits.

[The Linker]

I'm pretty evenly split. My two highest are an Alliance 80 and a Horde 80. My two second-highest are a Horde 72 (73?) and an Alliance 70. The two alts I'm working on now are a Horde 30-something and an Alliance 65.

:smallbiggrin:

[sihnfahl]

Got my 3rd piece of midgrade T9 gear... had the emblems, so I sprung for the 4th piece of lesser T9, which was a minor upgrade over T8.5...

But boy, having diseases crit as an unholy DK is just win. Up to 3600 crits, averaging about 3k, and with wandering plague proccing off those for another 3k-3.6k is just icing on the cake.

Then add in that my 2H weapon (justicebringer) is normally 2.6s attack speed in raid...

Draenei DK. Not going another race, unless they get rid of the +hit racial. It's just too useful in groups (and personally, since I don't have to worry as much stacking hit!)

[The Linker]

In the undocumented changes for 3.2.2, (http://www.wowwiki.com/Patch_3.2.2_(undocumented_changes)) it says the faction champions in ToC now run back to the door when you knock them off their horse, as they would if you ran out of the instance portal. I knew that change was coming sooner or later! High-five!

...

*high-fives the crickets*

And 3.2.2a's undocumented changes (http://www.wowwiki.com/Patch_3.2.2a_(undocumented_changes)) show some rather significant nerfs in said champions' damage. Some abilities have been more than halved in damage! Sounds like it's a much easier instance now.

I'm not sure how I feel about that. On the one hand, I did have a lot of trouble with the instance, having more than one group that wiped repeatedly on that encounter. On the other hand, though, that place has better gear than Naxx10. It should be hard.

And yeah, I'm totally slow on this 'news'. I haven't played in weeks! :smallfrown:

Edit: Oh, wait, the damage nerfs are in the raid. Gah! Millions of words out there and they have to pick two that start with C to name their instance wings.

[sihnfahl]

Edit: Oh, wait, the damage nerfs are in the raid. Gah! Millions of words out there and they have to pick two that start with C to name their instance wings.
Trial of the Champion, Trial of the Crusader, Trial of the Grand Crusader. Yup, they love ToC, ToC, ToGC.

The reason why is because of melee train gibs. Blizz couldn't stop their NPC AI from ganging up on clothies. With as aggressive as the defensive dispeller is on the NPC side, not to mention how free the paladin tended to be with Hand of Freedom, it wasn't unheard of for a clothie to get almost insta-gibbed with a melee train - and there'd be very little folks could do about it.

And God help you if you got the Ret Pally, Enhance Shammy and Muti Rogue combination... they just had to LOOK at a clothie and the clothie would die.

(Heck, even some plate wearers had trouble; pop all defensive CDs and hope for the best...)

[Zherog]

Managed to finish up Desolace* last night. And now I remember once again why I hate that zone. Even with a fast mount, it blows. I also grabbed the quests from the goblin along the coast near Feathermoon Stronghold when I entered Feralas and got those done before making my way to Camp M and grabbing all the quests there. Looks like I'm going to have to go diving into a couple of instances, given the quests I had left there. Overall, I still need to find around 260 quests in Kalimdor. I'm 99% sure I never did Winterspring, so I'm hopeful to find a lot of quests there. And Mudsprocket is another location I didn't do any quests, since this character was already 60+ when that town was created.

* by "finished up" I mean I got the needed rep with Magrim centaurs and did what I needed to do on that chain. I didn't bother working my rep the other direction to get to friendly with Gelkas centaurs. I sure hope I don't end up needing those 5 or so quests. That rep grind is going to suck...

[mangosta71]

And God help you if you got the Ret Pally, Enhance Shammy and Muti Rogue combination... they just had to LOOK at a clothie and the clothie would die.

The rogue is sub. Hemo and Shadowstep. But yeah, she's a nasty little bitch.

[Ego Slayer]

Trial of the Champion, Trial of the Crusader, Trial of the Grand Crusader. Yup, they love ToC, ToC, ToGC.
Interestingly enough, it seems that on my server Trial of the Champion is ToC and Trial of the Crusader is TotC... or at least it seems to be generally understood that way. And if you're talking about raid specifics, there's a 10/25 attached anyway. Dunno if the extra 't' in there is used everywhere else. :smalltongue:

[mangosta71]

There was someone trying to pug a ToGC 10 on my server the other day in trade, recruiting for "H ToC". It would be nice if some sort of short version became standardized.

[AgentPaper]

On my server, you see either H-ToC or ToC-reg for the 5-man version, and ToC, ToC 10, and ToC 25 refers to the raid version. If you tell someone you're doing ToC, they'll ask if you're in the 10 or 25 man version. ToGC doesn't really need it as much, as only guilds really even try that, at least so far, but I'd assume they would just say ToGC 10 or ToGC 25. 4 letters instead of 3 isn't so bad.

And yes, Faction Champs is very much nerfed, and I say hallelujah! I'm just glad they did it now instead of waiting half a year or so. PvP fights in a PvE area is just a bad idea. I'd thought that blizzard had figured that out by now, but hopefully they'll remember that now.

[TheEmerged]

Well, it seems that I still need the random beacon drop in Feralas; the chicken isn't giving me a "!" even with low-level tracking on. So I'm taking advantage of the need to kill lots & lots of stuff to try and empty it out for quests.

As for Desolace? I doubt I've got more than 4 quests there, and probably all for the Centaurs.

[Karoht]

I've been wondering how the Loremaster achievement/s will change when Cataclysm drops. Will the requirement be the new quests? The old and new quests? Will the new quests just be a new achievement, and Loremaster be no longer attainable?

[Zherog]

Well, Old Onyxia is no longer achievable. It's one of those "feats of strength" or whatever they call them. They might do the same thing. Or they might just work it out so the same number of quests are still available on both continents.

[TheEmerged]

They've responded to this officially. Unfortunately, the answer was essentially "We can't give you any details, because we haven't worked it out yet." I'm not paraphrasing as much as you might hope.

What we DO know is that they've said it's not going to involve being on another server as I was expecting. That is, the 80-85 crowd will not be in an "Azeroth" that's on a different server from the 1-60 crowd.

Therefore, I suspect the current Loremaster Eastern Kingdoms & Kalimdor will be reverted to Feats of Strength -- but that the Loremaster meta-achievement will be set to work with either the previous ones or a new pair to reflect Cataclysm quest numbers. Blizzard has shown reluctance to take titles away from people... note the way World Explorer was not updated when some additional areas were added to the game in 3.1 and 3.2, for example.

Another possibility is that the tracker will somehow differentiate 80-85 quests on a new achievement(s), and that they'll be careful to make sure there are still enough 1-60 quests to get the currents achievements.

Now, what I would LIKE to happen is for them to 'graduate' the LM:EK & LM:K achievements like they do the Outland & Northrend ones. Keep the current meta-achievements... and add a new meta-achievement for completely all the 'graduated' achievements (which will involve more quests).

[The Linker]

I was going to say that it would be nice if they split the Eastern Kingdoms and Kalimdor loremaster achievements into an anchievement for each zone, like for doing 40 quests in Durotar, 65 quests in Dustwallow, etc. Should be easier to count the quests if they're revamping the whole old world anyway.

But, I think that may be the same thing TheEmerged said at the end of his post up there. I'm not sure. :smalltongue:

[TheEmerged]

Split up, graduate, you say tomato I say yucky red squishy thing with too many seeds :smallbiggrin: This way people that have already earned Loremaster could keep it, while the new quests in the (reshaped) old world would count toward the next title...

[sihnfahl]

Therefore, I suspect the current Loremaster Eastern Kingdoms & Kalimdor will be reverted to Feats of Strength -- but that the Loremaster meta-achievement will be set to work with either the previous ones or a new pair to reflect Cataclysm quest numbers. Blizzard has shown reluctance to take titles away from people... note the way World Explorer was not updated when some additional areas were added to the game in 3.1 and 3.2, for example.
Classic Loremaster, Feat of Strength. Title retained, no points. Would make sense.

You know, the thing that'll make me sad? The raiders like me who like reading lore and seeing how Blizz 'defines' the world will have a 'fun' time with things. Guilds will be pushing us to get to 85, work on our Path of the Titans stuff, and get raiding, but we'll also be wanting to do all the new quests to see how the world has changed.

Splitting the Barrens in two, and making the south side contested, Alliance-dominant? Auberdine wrecked, Astranaar under aerial bombardment? I want to know the story behind those things!

[Zherog]

So last night I only did another 8 or 9 quests. But then, I was only on for about 90 minutes or so. I determined (as I suspected) that Brewfest quests don't increase the quest count for either achievement. I also determined that I skipped a helluva lot of instance related quests. I'm going to have to take a day or so and plow through a few of them to get them out of my quest log.

I would so love to see the old world quest achievements broken down to a count by zone, rather than a big ass number for the whole continent. First, I think it would be a lot easier to know if I missed anything. Second, it would feel less daunting; I mean, right now I still need 260 quests in Kalimdor and 300-ish in EK. I'd so love to be able to work with smaller numbers...

[TheEmerged]

The only (legitimate) reason I can think of that they haven't already graduated the old-world Loremaster achievements is the large number of "travel all over Azeroth" quest chains in the 40's and 50's. How do you determine what zone should get credit for, say, the Linkin chain?

Got a little closer to Loremaster Kalimdor last night, but the OOC beacon in Feralas continues to elude me. I also confirmed that the Pristine Yeti Hide "item starts a quest" doesn't count toward Loremaster :smallannoyed:

I also discovered, quite bit accident, that you can purchase the +10% exp legacy chest pieces for Emblems of Heroism. I was under the impression they were only purchased with Champions Seal. This is especially annoying because I had >80 EoH and "burned" them on epic gems when heroics started dropp EoConquest instead. Since leveling my "cliche" (draenei shaman jewelcrafter) is my next priority, I burned through my EoValor supply and topped it off with about half my EoConquest supply to get the Melee Mail piece.

[Zherog]

The only (legitimate) reason I can think of that they haven't already graduated the old-world Loremaster achievements is the large number of "travel all over Azeroth" quest chains in the 40's and 50's. How do you determine what zone should get credit for, say, the Linkin chain?

*shrug* You either place the quest in the zone where it started or the zone where it ended. Your quest log already splits the quests into "groups" anyway. Whatever group each of those quests gets sorted into is what it would apply to if they broke it down to smaller numbers.


Got a little closer to Loremaster Kalimdor last night, but the OOC beacon continues to elude me. I also confirmed that the Pristine Yeti Hide "item starts a quest" doesn't count toward Loremaster :smallannoyed:

Huh. I wonder why the hide doesn't count...

I'm off on Monday. (I've been working crazy hours, for me, recently so took a "mental health" day.) I think I'm going to spend at least part of it plowing through the half-dozen or so instances I have quests for. If I don't do it over the weekend at some point, that is. I know I have a few people in my guild who have alts that need to run some of the instances I have (WC and DM I know for sure), so maybe I'll be nice and try to coordinate.

[mangosta71]

Yeah, splitting those achievements into zones would make it easier for us, but would be a nightmare for the developers. On a related note, someone in guild claimed that the blues finally admitted that vanish is broken, but said that fixing it was too difficult so they aren't even going to try.

In more fun news, I pulled another last man standing stunt. Except this time, it was Anub'arak in ToC 25. It was epic - boss dies, I snarl "Gotcha!", the healy officer exclaims in vent, "This isn't Sarth +3 10 man! You can't do that!" I'm starting to wish I had FRAPS. That and the H10 NRB last week were too awesome to not be recorded for posterity. :smallsigh:

[Zherog]

Yeah, splitting those achievements into zones would make it easier for us, but would be a nightmare for the developers.

I'm not so sure about that. Granted, my professional experience is in business-related programming rather than game-related. But it seems to me that the database already has every quest assigned to a zone, given how it sorts in a player's quest log. It doesn't sound particularly difficult to me to use that information to devise the by zone counts. It also should be fairly trivial to count how many quests any given character has completed in any given zone.

I certainly could be missing something. But from a programming perspective, it sounds pretty easy to me.

[The Linker]

I imagine they wouldn't want to just let the game sort it that way. Imagine if you had 49/50 quests done in Winterspring after scouring the zone completely, and the final quest is a delivery quest from Booty Bay that itself was part of a chain that went to Sunken Temple and started in Un'Goro. You'd have no way of knowing that was the case. :smalleek: The developers might want to make that entire chain give credit to the Un'Goro achievement. But, of course, sorting out all the chains would take a lot of development time. :smalltongue:

The Northrend and Outland Loremaster achievements were very easy to make, just because the amount of quests that go from zone to zone are very, very small. From a player perspective, it makes things easier, but I do still like seeing all the connections between zones in the old world, seeing who's a relative of who and getting sent to the old guy deep in the forest and hey I've seen him before oh cool that's what he's there for.[/blather]

[TheEmerged]

I imagine they wouldn't want to just let the game sort it that way. Imagine if you had 49/50 quests done in Winterspring after scouring the zone completely, and the final quest is a delivery quest from Booty Bay that itself was part of a chain that went to Sunken Temple and started in Un'Goro. You'd have no way of knowing that was the case. :smalleek: The developers might want to make that entire chain give credit to the Un'Goro achievement. But, of course, sorting out all the chains would take a lot of development time. :smalltongue:

And I'd like to emphasize, there's not just one or two of those quests in the 40's & 50's.

In other news, we're getting 3.3 patch notes. Biggest news I see are a change to Misdirection for hunters and to Fire Nova Totem for shaman (a huge improvement in this case).

[The Linker]

Hmm, you can really tell they're looking at improving the experience for newer characters now. Dual-wield at level 1 for Rogues sounds nice, as does the instant 70% stealth. :smallbiggrin:

What's the point of making level 1-5 characters immune to daze, though? :smallconfused:

Maybe Blizz's next objective is to facilitate Naked Gnome Races. :smallamused:

[TheEmerged]

The best explanation I can come up with is that they're trying to make it easier for beginning characters to make it from the newbie area to the home city, the better to beg for a port and start the leveling process with friends in another newbie area.

Seriously, that and GGR are all I can think of.

[Karoht]

Huh. I wonder why the hide doesn't count...

Most if not all of the UPS quests don't count. UPS meaning 'go here and talk to that guy' which typically start a chain. If it's the first in the chain, it probably doesn't count. If it doesn't start a chain, it's probably just considered bonus XP, and thus you don't really get anything achievement wise.

[darkblust]

Are their any addons that tell you how much aggro everybody has?And how many addons would it take to mess up your gameplay?

[Karoht]

Without getting into the casuals VS hardcores arguement or starting an epeen waving contest, I do see blizzard as aiming to fix something about WoW. The 1-60 process. Back in the day, it was way way slower. My druid took 4 months at about 6 hours a day to get to 40. Then BC came out, and it was another 2 months to 60. Now, with the bonus XP gear and using nothing but rested XP time, I went from 30 to 60 in less than a week with my warrior. And he's prot. He's not supposed to kill things quickly or anything.

To put it in perspective, many other games really focus on the 1-level cap part of the game, but suck in the endgame, where WoW has been all about the endgame for as long as I can remember. Now they are trying to catch that 1-cap market that they've lost to other games like CoX. I hate to say it, but they'll probably lose people in that demographic to Aion for a while, just like when Conan and Warhammer came out. It'll be temporary. If Blizzard can fix this, they'll really have the retention they are aiming for. Another reason for the shorter level cap for Cataclysm.

Oooh, patch notes, missed those this morning. Later.

[Karoht]

Are their any addons that tell you how much aggro everybody has?
Dozens.
Diamond Threat Meter
Omen

Go to curse-gaming.com and just type in threat meter.
If you know what you're doing, you can use them as a damage meter as well, depending on your class and a bit of estimation on your part.

[Blayze]

Skada covers both DPS and threat, but can't break down information on your individual attacks and procs like Recount can.

[mangosta71]

I've heard that something like 80%+ of the people that went to Conan and Warhammer came back to WoW after a month or so. And I'm already seeing guildies that went to Aion coming back.

[Khanderas]

I've heard that something like 80%+ of the people that went to Conan and Warhammer came back to WoW after a month or so. And I'm already seeing guildies that went to Aion coming back.
I went to AoC for a month, then went back.
I went o FF11 for two days before I left that screaming (and infact I was so unsatisfied I called up a GM there to do what basically was shouting the games failures at her).


Are their any addons that tell you how much aggro everybody has?And how many addons would it take to mess up your gameplay?
I use Omen for threat and recount for dps/deaths/healing done and other statistics. I would reccomend them for everyone.
As for messing up gameplay, no problem. The windows for both are resizable, you can have them both take up less space then the minimap.

[Blayze]

Fantastic progress last night! In TotC 10, we've never beaten the Faction Champions before -- and in our previous couple of attempts, the Beasts encounter has always beaten us upside the head.

Not so last night. Beasts? Three tries. Jaraxxus? First time. Champions? Third time. Twins? Third time. Anub'arak still needs to die, but my Triumph badge total has taken a serious boost. I think I'll save up for the 75 and 50 Triumph not-tier items... :D

[sihnfahl]

In TotC 10, we've never beaten the Faction Champions before
That event was a serious stumbling block pre-nerf. A bit overtuned, I think, and not very forgiving when compared to the other events.

They really need to change Garrosh's closing lines to Jaraxxus. What he only makes sense if the Champions in the Arena who beat Jaraxxus were Hordies.

When Alliance ... not so much.

[mangosta71]

The whole encounter is stupid. Tirion knows that either way some of his best are going to die. It's obvious from his speech at the end that he considers either outcome a victory for the Lich King. So why does he allow it?

Also, in the 5-man, I think that either we should get to kill the champions and the confessor/paladin, or they shouldn't be able to kill us.

[The Glyphstone]

Because Garrosh is a big whiny baby, and Tirion doesn't want to have to put up with it?


Personally, I always laugh at the end of Jaraxxus when Garrosh starts yelling and Fordring's like "No, no, we didn't try to kill your d00ds with a demon lord! The warlock totally did that on his own without orders!" It's not like the fight started with Fordring announcing the entrance of said warlock and that he was going to summon a demon or anything...

[sihnfahl]

It's not like the fight started with Fordring announcing the entrance of said warlock and that he was going to summon a demon or anything...
I put Fizzlebang on the Niby the Almighty level of incompetence.

"... and a fearsome DOOMGUARD ... will ... appear!" And he gets an Eredar.

And he thinks he can control an EREDAR!?

[The Glyphstone]

It's more how quickly Fordring washes his hands of the whole thing, especially since it's his fault the little guy is dead.:smallcool:

[GolemsVoice]

I've always seen Fordring as a man who wants exactly one thing, to the exclusion of all other things, and sometimes compassion and rational thought. He let's the Horde warrioirs fight because that's the easy way of placating Garrosh, and maintaining the union. The individual warrioirs that die are tragic, but necessary. He probably wrote Fizzlebang off from the beginning, his death only a good thing. That man has been out in the cold for too long.

[Talkkno]

But all Fizzlebang wanted was to show all his warlock friends how cool he is :smalltongue:

[Ego Slayer]

That event was a serious stumbling block pre-nerf.
Yeah, the first night we tried it we wiped for a good 2 1/2 hours without any luck. One shot it on Thursday when I was on my lock in a friend's group. Can't complain... even though I was the only one dead, for the whole damn fight. Grawr.

So... congrats on completing them! Be glad they were nerfed. xD

I'm tanking 25mans with said friend's raid tonight. Ony and then TotC if we manage to get her down. I'm not even sure where they're at in TotC25, but ughhh~ Wouldn't look forward to the FCs in 25... I'm so useless in 25s. Toooo much going on... why in hell did I accept. T-T

[AgentPaper]

Most likely, Tirion realizes that there's going to be trouble either way, and at least if he sanctions it, he can retain the appearance of control over the situation as well as limiting the casualties to just the horde and alliance in the arena.

[The Linker]

I'm considering making a Leatherworker to support my Feral Druid, and just to have fun actually raising a profession that doesn't involve herbs or mining for once. But, I'm confused as to how it works when Leatherworkers start learning how to make Mail items. If I were to make, say, a Hunter, and he specialized in Elemental Leatherworking... will he be skilled in making Leather gear with Agility + Stamina for my Druid, and Mail gear with Agility + Stamina for himself? Or just one of the two? :smallconfused:

[tyckspoon]

I'm considering making a Leatherworker to support my Feral Druid, and just to have fun actually raising a profession that doesn't involve herbs or mining for once. But, I'm confused as to how it works when Leatherworkers start learning how to make Mail items. If I were to make, say, a Hunter, and he specialized in Elemental Leatherworking... will he be skilled in making Leather gear with Agility + Stamina for my Druid, and Mail gear with Agility + Stamina for himself? Or just one of the two? :smallconfused:

He'll get his specialty items plus whatever is still in the base skill. It won't make as much difference as you level through anyway; almost all of the items in Wrath of the Lich King (and not that many in Burning Crusade) don't require a specialization, including the level 80 craftable epics.

[Zherog]

Well, I'm at 505 out of 685 for Loremaster of Kalimdor. And I have a handful to turn in. I still have to do all of Dustwallow and all of Winterspring. And then a sprinkling of quests here and there....

[mangosta71]

Yeah, the only things that required the specialization in BC were the pre-raid epic sets, and I know that they at least made the tailoring sets not BoP any more (but you still needed the spec to buy the patterns) - seems reasonable that they would do the same for LW.

That said, hunters and shamans generally went dragonscale so that they could make the mail epic stuff. Elemental was the rogue/feral spec, and tribal was for caster druids.

Bearing all that in mind, you'll still likely replace any BC crafted epics in your first couple zones in Northrend. And all of your crafted level 80 epics will be replaced with Naxx gear.

[AgentPaper]

I'm considering making a Leatherworker to support my Feral Druid, and just to have fun actually raising a profession that doesn't involve herbs or mining for once. But, I'm confused as to how it works when Leatherworkers start learning how to make Mail items. If I were to make, say, a Hunter, and he specialized in Elemental Leatherworking... will he be skilled in making Leather gear with Agility + Stamina for my Druid, and Mail gear with Agility + Stamina for himself? Or just one of the two? :smallconfused:

Everything you'll want to make doesn't need a specialization. This goes for all professions, really. And leatherworking really is the easiest profession to level, especially if you pick it up early. Just skin whatever you come across, and you should be floating in skins without much trouble. Though it helps if you choose areas to level that have a lot of skinnable mobs.

Anyways, I'm loving my Drums of the Forgotton Kings and Drums of the Wild. Only two pallies? No problem! Druid out of reagents? I've got it covered! Of course, actually having enough pallies to cast everything you want and kings, or a druid with Improved Mark of the Wild is still preferable, but it's nice to be able to have those buffs in pugs when you otherwise wouldn't.

Edit: Besides the drums mentioned above, the main thing you get from having LW is the self-only bracer enchants, which are better than anything else you can get by a good bit. Other than that, you can also make leg enchants, which sell pretty well because everyone needs them whenever they get a new pair of pants. You can also make some nice epic cloaks for people who haven't gotten into raiding yet, which at least used to sell for about 500g on my server. (Dunno if they've become less valuable now that ToC is out)

[Zherog]

Well... if I come up one quest short, I'll know why (http://wow.allakhazam.com/db/quest.html?source=live;wquest=6522).

[The Linker]

Thanks for the Leatherworking advice, guys. :smallbiggrin:

Right now I'm working on my rep with my home cities, so I can get the Crusader title with the Argent Tournament. I thought it would be a pain, but I'm actually itching to keep going -- I hand in my last four valiant tokens and become a champion of the final faction tomorrow, and all four factions besides Darnassus (me being a Night Elf and all) are revered, and at LEAST at 16000/21000. I simply cannot wait for the flood of achievements tomorrow. :smallbiggrin: 4x Exalted! 4x Exalted champion! Ambassador! Crusader! 10 exalted factions!

While all this old-world questing is fun -- watching things die in one hit to thorns really gives one a sense of power -- I don't think I could ever work up the motivation to go for the Seeker title. It's just... such a big number. I'm not even at 2000! :smalleek:

[AgentPaper]

I got my crusader title a few weeks ago. Actually, that was the same day I got epic flying as well, I think. (Or maybe it was a few days before? Or after? w/e) Of course, now I neeeeed that pony for my squire, not to mention all the other awesome stuff the argent quartermaster hands out, so I'm still doing the tourney dailies just for the crusader marks. :smalltongue: Or, well, I would be if I was playing WoW at the moment, but I seem to have taken a break for a few weeks. I guess I just got burned out, and my guild seems to be dissolving as well, so perhaps it's a good time.:smallfrown:

[The Linker]

Yeah, I burned out a week or two back. I just started playing again a few days ago.

My reason for burning out? I had learned that Crusader required all home factions to be Exalted.

You might call this my upswing. :smallbiggrin: