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Paganboy28
2009-09-14, 03:32 PM
Following on from a thread I was reading about an all-caster party. My friends and I have been considering this option.

How would this composition be:

Cleric (cloistered) going Radiant Servant (uber healer)

Artificer

Sorcerer focusing on enchantment (doesn't want to be a wizard) but wants to be a sort of semi-beguiler with more flexibility

Conjurer

Myou
2009-09-14, 03:33 PM
As long as you summon and buff yourselves some tanks you ought to be pretty overpowered. :smalltongue:

sofawall
2009-09-14, 03:34 PM
Following on from a thread I was reading about an all-caster party. My friends and I have been considering this option.

How would this composition be:

Cleric (cloistered) going Radiant Servant (uber healer)

Artificer

Sorcerer focusing on enchantment (doesn't want to be a wizard) but wants to be a sort of semi-beguiler with more flexibility

Conjurer

Cleric focused on healing? Ouch.

Sorcerer focused on Ench? In the same party as a Conjurer? I hope they Wizard has no clue how to play, and the sorcerer knows what he's doing, then it might be balanced.

Temet Nosce
2009-09-14, 03:36 PM
High powered party, but relatively reasonable in all cases except the healer, since healing isn't exactly going to make them feel useful in that party.

Although I'm assuming the Sorc is going to be taking the alternative Nightmare Spinner (I believe that's the PrC) which lets him use his spells on things that are normally immune (otherwise he might break down at upper levels).

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-09-14, 03:37 PM
Sorcerer focusing on enchantment (doesn't want to be a wizard) but wants to be a sort of semi-beguiler with more flexibility


Beguiler is more flexible than sorcerer unless he really knows what he's doing.

JeenLeen
2009-09-14, 03:41 PM
In the 3.5 game my friends and I had, one of us was a Cleric focused on healing. He used DMM to buff himself defensively and could have been decene melee if he put up Divine Power (or whatever gives you caster level BAB). It was good in our game as somebody usually needed a Heal every round. At high levels, I find it useful. Cure x Wounds, though, don't really help, except an occassional Mass.

If no-one is keyed on being a 'caster damage' caster, a Druidzilla or Clerizilla could work well. As your party stands, it sounds okay. You lack someone with Disabile Device, etc. as class skills (unless Artificer gets those; I don't know), so that could hurt you. If the sorcerer went Beguiler, that'd be solved. He could take a dip for the skills and some extra low-level spells, but of course that's a sorcerer caster level hit.

Thrice Dead Cat
2009-09-14, 03:41 PM
So, you've got two people to use Wands of Lesser Vigor/CLW. Good. The cleric should, in all honesty, be more tank focused than healing focused. Maximized cure spells, even for free, just don't cut it.

The artificer, if built right, could do just about anything for the party. As it is right now, if the Conjurer doesn't blow SM I for dead celestial monkeys, he should be the skill monkey.

The sorcerlator will have problems as more things become immune to enchantment. A secondary focus (heck, or even primary shift) to Illusion should solve that issue. If the enchantments are for buffing, though, things should be fine.

The Conjurer is either going to be an excellent battlefield controller or summoner. Probably both if malconvoker is on the table. Depending on whether or not Captain Cleric goes beatsticking or not should influence the Conjurer's decision. Having moar dudes in general is great though.

Everyone, maybe minus the sorcerer, can pull off general utility, given some time between 15 minutes and 8 hours.

taltamir
2009-09-14, 05:48 PM
where is the tank?

lsfreak
2009-09-14, 05:58 PM
where is the tank?

Conjurer can lock down anyone he wants on the opening round. And the sorcerer with his Dominated and/or Mindraped BDF.

taltamir
2009-09-14, 06:17 PM
well, that depends on the level, sure you can always just summon a large elemental as a tank later on...
what level do they start at?

Thrice Dead Cat
2009-09-14, 06:25 PM
well, that depends on the level, sure you can always just summon a large elemental as a tank later on...
what level do they start at?

Cleric still isn't bad as an early game tank, to be fair. Divine Favor (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/divineFavor.htm) lasts for a minute straight, so, he's basically like a fighter with 2 less HP at level 1.

taltamir
2009-09-14, 06:34 PM
Cleric still isn't bad as an early game tank, to be fair. Divine Favor (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/divineFavor.htm) lasts for a minute straight, so, he's basically like a fighter with 2 less HP at level 1.

true, but he is the only tank. the only solid hitter. and the only healer of the party in early levels. Too many eggs, one small basket with limited actions per turn.

lsfreak
2009-09-14, 06:37 PM
Cloistered cleric, not cleric. They don't make very good tanks. I'd say the cleric would be better off going either tank or buffer/archer rather than healer, that tends to be a pretty weak role beyond about level 2.

Mando Knight
2009-09-14, 06:38 PM
Cloistered cleric, not cleric. They don't make very good tanks.

Persisted Divine Power doesn't really care.

taltamir
2009-09-14, 06:41 PM
Cloistered cleric, not cleric. They don't make very good tanks. I'd say the cleric would be better off going either tank or buffer/archer rather than healer, that tends to be a pretty weak role beyond about level 2.

that is even worse, that means there is no tank. How is level 1 cloistered cleric damage output and healing?

HCL
2009-09-14, 07:05 PM
Knowledge devotion

imperialspectre
2009-09-14, 07:37 PM
Cloistered clerics are at absolutely no disadvantage at 1st level compared to standard clerics, except for Fort saves. In fact, they don't fall behind in any other appreciable way until L3 (when the standard cleric gets a point of BAB and they don't). Between Knowledge Devotion and persistent buffs, the cleric is in no danger of being ineffective.

The sorcerer, on the other hand, will probably suck. As Pharaoh said, beguiler is superior as a mind-affecting caster.

Switching a beguiler in for the sorcerer and a druid in for the artificer would increase the party's effectiveness drastically.

Temet Nosce
2009-09-14, 07:41 PM
Cloistered cleric, not cleric. They don't make very good tanks. I'd say the cleric would be better off going either tank or buffer/archer rather than healer, that tends to be a pretty weak role beyond about level 2.

Agreed, healer isn't really a battle role. It's something done almost purely out of combat, usually with wands. Some kind of DMM persist Cleric would definitely be more suitable for this party (and closer to a similar power level).

taltamir
2009-09-14, 07:47 PM
According to developer interviews and journals I read, in play testing nobody wanted to play the cleric... So they just beefed it up in power until enough people did...

I always thought some improvements to mechanics, a little DEBUFFING, specialization, and better fluff would have done the job better... but that is WOTC for you.