OOTS #680 - The Discussion Thread

[The Giant]

New comic is up.

[Kroy]

Yay, new comic! Thanks Giant. Particularly good one, too.

[WNxArrakis]

Ah, trees. They are the root of all evil. And the trunk. And the branches.

[tcrudisi]

What's an arboreal?

[Renegade Paladin]

I believe that in the last panel Haley is supposed to say "there were no flumphs available."
What's an arboreal?
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/arboreal

[Yana]

Yes, there are good reasons for running gags. Especially this one.

[MReav]

I wonder if there is an Autocratoria.

Nice comic man.

[GSFB]

This is why I still have all my old textbooks (and old Dragon magazines. and...)

[chiasaur11]

Trees. Untrustworthy to the last.

[Katana_Geldar]

I wonder what the new place is?

Thanks Giant! I was wondering if it would be today.

[Mystic Muse]

that was AWESOME!:smallbiggrin:

[Ron Miel]

I don't understand the title. Which running gag does it refer to? Durkon and trees, or Haley's secrets? And why running gag, she's not running, she's hiding.

Other than that, great strip.

[MoleMage]

Typo in first panel: it says begin instead of being.

[Raging Gene Ray]

And so, Lord Tyrinar, widely thought to be father of Nale and Elan, is shown to be not another side in the Ultimate Showdown of Ultimate Destiny, but just another ham-and-egger in a world where mighty warlords are a dime a dozen.

Of course, this won't stop the speculation on how essential he will be to the plot. Maybe Haley's dad was released and is lost...or maybe he's been passed around from prison to prison as new conquerors don't know or care why he's in there.

And it's called a running gag because it provides a distraction for running away. That's the pun

EDIT: Ninja'd.

[SPoD]

IO don't understand the title. Which running gag does it refer to? Durkon and trees, or Haley's secrets? And why running gag, she's not running, she's hiding.

Other than that, great strip.

She's running away from the Durkon in the second to last panel. She is using the running gag as a distraction so that she may run.

[theinsulabot]

there is never any flumps around when you need one anymore

[Smoke_Rulz]

Ah, Elan. You're so funny when you're being stupid.

[Blaznak]

Oh sure, more picking on the Flumpfs, even when they AREN'T here! Sheesh!
Actually, pretty funny. I like the explanation on why the maps aren't up to date, and the line about needing to keep a light inventory!

[RedScholarGypsy]

Didn't see that coming. Heh, he's probably ruling his own country now and Haley's going to be thrown into his concubine, and Hilarity Ensues.

By the way, any new ideas on what Haley was trying to confess while speaking babeltongue?

[Herald Alberich]

Well, well, well. All this time the forums have been buzzing about how close we are to Tyrinaria and its lord, and it turns out the place probably doesn't exist anymore and the lord could well be long dead! That means Haley's father could be anywhere by now. Who knows what sorts of interesting sidequests are on the horizon?

It's got to burn, though, finding out you went through all that trouble to raise a pile of cash only to find you might not need it after all. Fortunately, cash is a multipurpose item.

And, of course, there's "this new place", the description of which is conveniently cut off. Is it one of the new countries? A recently-arrived tent in town? Something else entirely?

[Dust]

I'm just surprised she's finally starting to come clean about her dad. I mean, we all know how well Elan keeps secrets from Roy.

[Ron Miel]

She's running away from the Durkon in the second to last panel. She is using the running gag as a distraction so that she may run.

It looks to me like she's walking, albeit with a quick step.

[Elfin]

Quite amusing. Great work.

[golentan]

Nice one, thank you. I like the east and west Despotonia gag meself.

[Haven]

I'm just surprised she's finally starting to come clean about her dad. I mean, we all know how well Elan keeps secrets from Roy.

Elan probably has high bluff, and it's established that Roy doesn't have the best Sense Motive, so no matter what Elan says the dice dictate he'll be okay (since apparently those skills work on other PCs in this game).

Anyway, while I laughed at this gag showing up again, it reminded me that Durkon gets the characterization shaft hard, and that made me sad.

But getting back to this subplot--with another twist that should have been foreseen but wasn't--is a good thing in my books.

My guess on the new place: Starshinia.

[DBJack]

Amsuing, and it mentioned that Haley really doesn't want anyone else to know about her Dad!

Great job

[Katana_Geldar]

Well, well, well. All this time the forums have been buzzing about how close we are to Tyrinaria and its lord, and it turns out the place probably doesn't exist anymore and the lord could well be long dead! That means Haley's father could be anywhere by now. Who knows what sorts of interesting sidequests are on the horizon?

It's got to burn, though, finding out you wet through all that trouble to raise a pile of cash only to find you might not need it after all. Fortunately, cash is a multipurpose item.

And, of course, there's "this new place", the description of which is conveniently cut off. Is it one of the new countries? A recently-arrived tent in town? Something else entirely?

Maybe a country that was started up by Mr Evil Chancellor Miron Shrewdanker?

[Draquenoire]

I wish I could find a sax tent, that would be awesome. Maybe Bill Clinton would be in it and we could do songs together and everyone would clap and admire us. That would be fun.

[Shale]

And that's why you shouldn't assume you know where the story's going.

Edit: Also, the idea that the most of the military leaders in the area are flashes-in-the-pan with a very short life expectancy seems to put a damper on the idea that Lord Tyrinar, who was active and running a kingdom as recently as two years ago, is the same warlord who already headed his own army when he fathered Elan and Nale.

[Crod]

I'm really getting fond of the new color palette used for this continent. You can really feel the change - good scenery work Giant. Also, very nice comic.

[Thanatosia]

oooo, a look at part of the OOTworld map in greater detail. So the Elven Nations are the northern part of the Western Continent? Wonder how they ward off the periodic Tyrants conquerors that keep rising up.

[Aldrakan]

My guess on the new place: Starshinia.

Like that idea. Possibly not called that precisely, because that would give it away and it'd be hard to make reading the name off a map dramatic. But that would make sense, he is a high level rogue after all, rather well designed for assassinating a leader and taking over.

Also, from first impression the elves don't seem very nice.

[veti]

I'm very surprised by the cartographer chick's attitude. In her place, I'd certainly keep a selection of older maps around. If what she says is true, then I can't believe Haley is the first potential customer ever to ask about a kingdom that's no longer there.

So, who in the town would know about "ancient history", I wonder?

[DnDgeek13]

Haley, you are a genius.

I think the fourth wall just got sneak attacked.

[Xondoure]

Aw, glad to see they trust eachother. andDurkonisafradytree.

[B. Dandelion]

Durkon's tree-phobia has actually been among my least favorite running gags. But this time I actually laughed out loud. Well played.

[brandr]

i laughed so hard at this comic i fell out of my chair in what i can only imagine was a comical manner, and hit my head so hard i couldn't see through the stars for about 10 seconds.

moral of the story: OOTS, so funny it causes brain damage

internet high five rich!

[Starscream]

Loving the new color scheme. Got so tired of blue.

And Haley now has 200,000 gp? That would make her around level 15 by the WBL guidelines. I know it doesn't matter from a story perspective, but expect threads to pop up debating this little tidbit.


Didn't see that coming. Heh, he's probably ruling his own country now and Haley's going to be thrown into his concubine, and Hilarity Ensues.

I assume you mean thrown into his harem or made into a concubine.

Being thrown into a concubine would be...something else entirely.

[Ruduen]

How would she use flumphs to cover her getaway, anyways?

[Ron Miel]

Hey, the lizard king is wearing Xykon's crown. Significance?

Maybe Master Fryon got involved in one of these wars, and the crown was his trophy.

[Katana_Geldar]

Like that idea. Possibly not called that precisely, because that would give it away and it'd be hard to make reading the name off a map dramatic. But that would make sense, he is a high level rogue after all, rather well designed for assassinating a leader and taking over.

Also, from first impression the elves don't seem very nice.

It would also be great if

If Lord Tyrinar really was Elan and Nale's dad, and that he was imprisoned and held for ransom. And Elan asks for Haley's money to ransom him out. Haley's Choice!

[Random832]

And Haley now has 200,000 gp? That would make her around level 15 by the WBL guidelines. I know it doesn't matter from a story perspective, but expect threads to pop up debating this little tidbit.

She has 200,000 gp CASH, in addition to a +7 Bow (and other stuff, but the bow is almost certainly the most valuable item she owns).

But more to the point, the WBL guidelines are _not_ applicable to this situation, or to most in-game situations.

[dsavereide]

I don't understand why Haley doesn't want anyone to know. Especially Roy - wouldn't he want to help her? If she did trust someone else, couldn't she find out what her father's status is with a sending? Or would that just be one way?

[Haven]

It would also be great if

If Lord Tyrinar really was Elan and Nale's dad, and that he was imprisoned and held for ransom. And Elan asks for Haley's money to ransom him out. Haley's Choice!

What A Twist!

Aldrakan: that sentence actually sums up the reasons why I do think it would be called precisely that. Because reading it off a map would be dramatic and because it would have ruined the reveal if they'd said it in this strip (which, er, they rather conspicuously didn't.)

Also: someone on TVTropes suspects that that cartographer is Sabine. Which is distressingly plausible.

[Aldrakan]

But more to the point, the WBL guidelines are _not_ applicable to this situation, or to most in-game situations.

They did stumble across the hoard of an ancient dragon at one point, after all. And stole an epic level lich's loot. I mean okay they lost the first one, but it still demonstrates that the WBL curve isn't exactly a certain thing.

[jmucchiello]

oooo, a look at part of the OOTworld map in greater detail. So the Elven Nations are the northern part of the Western Continent? Wonder how they ward off the periodic Tyrants conquerors that keep rising up.

Trees. The elves are in league with them.

[Katana_Geldar]

Also: someone on TVTropes suspects that that cartographer is Sabine. Which is distressingly plausible.

Possible but...

Sabine and the woman have slightly different coloured skin. That is the one feature that does not change with Sabine.

[Aldrakan]

Because reading it off a map would be dramatic and because it would have ruined the reveal if they'd said it in this strip (which, er, they rather conspicuously didn't.)


....good point. Ahem.


From the look of the map I'd say it's because there's a great big mountain range separating them. Impassable, filled with monsters, something like that.
And of course if they do get through there are always the say, treants, to deal with.

[Katana_Geldar]

That also explains why there's desert, the clouds stay with the elves. We have the same sort of thing downunder.

[Bianco]

Aww, poor fourth wall. There it goes again.

Liking the colour scheme, and Haley's new look is looking less and less odd to me. Also, the strip itself is great. :smallbiggrin:

[Haven]

Possible but...

Sabine and the woman have slightly different coloured skin. That is the one feature that does not change with Sabine.

Oh, they do indeed. Good eye. Maybe she finally wised up about it and decided to change?

[Katana_Geldar]

Oh, they do indeed. Good eye. Maybe she finally wised up about it and decided to change?

That would be rather inconsistent.

[Herald Alberich]

I don't understand why Haley doesn't want anyone to know. Especially Roy - wouldn't he want to help her? If she did trust someone else, couldn't she find out what her father's status is with a sending? Or would that just be one way?

See this thread (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125745) for possible answers.

The short version of the most likely answer is that Haley has a pathological need to keep secrets. They keep her from getting too close to people and thereby making herself vulnerable, in her eyes. It's not logical, but it makes sense to her and is a believable personality flaw, given her background.

Telling Elan about her father, among other things, was a major lowering of her barriers and a sign that she trusts him more than anyone.

[Tubal-Cain]

Woot 1st page! So Haley's father is being held at ransom?

Someone hasn't read the archives (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0131.html).

[amiplayable]

Woo! Maybe now, there could be a sidequest involving Haley's dad. Extra points if he ends up getting involved with a gate or something like that.
Hee hee. I love the trees gag.

[Berserk Monk]

I agree with Durkon. That tree has to be allied with Xykon.

[Ron Miel]

Is "held ramsom" correct usage in American English? In British English it would be "held for ransom."

[David Argall]

I'm just surprised she's finally starting to come clean about her dad. I mean, we all know how well Elan keeps secrets from Roy.
Effectively quite well. Since Roy does his best not to listen, Elan can blab all the secrets he wants and Roy will almost never notice. Note in this regard how easy it was for Nale to replace Elan. Every mistake he made was ignored because everybody just assumed that was just Elan.

Those of us who thought "sex tent" superior to "sex taint" are presumably now shown that our writer had found a way to [almost] use both.



someone on TVTropes suspects that

that cartographer is Sabine.
Which is distressingly plausible.

The LG has almost a year head start on the party, and has no good reason to be in the current burg. And the current plot seems to be that the fiends use Xykon and the party to clear out the defenses, and each other, so the LG can just march in. That does not need Sabine to get in the way of the party.
Essentially, this trick has been pulled once, and won't be again. Sabine is not the process server, not the mapmaker, nor....

[Haven]

Is "held ramsom" correct usage in American English? In British English it would be "held for ransom."

"Held ransom" is an accepted usage. Though the "begin" in that sentence is mystifying.

Argall: If the LG did things they had sensible reasons to do, they wouldn't be in this comic would they? :p

[Larkspur]

I like the amphoras.

Say, do we have any evidence Haley's dad is still alive?

Or that he's not the person who sent the ransom note, for that matter? If you happen to be a rogue who needs some fast cash for your operations on a distant continent, what better way to get it than to tell your daughter you've been kidnapped and you need the ransom money stat?

Haley has nothing but a piece of paper to go on. Obviously she has to operate on the assumption that it's genuine, but that's a pretty big assumption. Her secrecy is going to screw her over here, because she really needs one of the casters to do some serious scrying...

[Tubal-Cain]

Is "held ransom" correct usage in American English? In British English it would be "held for ransom."

To my knowledge, both are acceptable.


Say, do we have any evidence Haley's dad is still alive?
Alive? No




Haley has nothing but a piece of paper to go on.
And Bozzok's taunting. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0609.html)

[Shale]

Well, she's also got corroboration from Bozzok, who from all we've heard doesn't seem like a guy Ian Starshine would trust to help him in a long con.

[Ridureyu]

I sense doom.

[Hrairoo]

haha, from the moment i saw the title i knew it would be awesome!

i totally didn't see the mapmaker tying haley and roy's paths together, and i had guessed the running gag to be the 'king of nowhere' routine when i saw the line of rulers on their thrones.

i doubt tyrinia is as insignificant as the cartofgopher claims it to be, but this is certainly a strange turn of events. at least the flumphs get a break!

[Elan's Modron]

I like this new continent a lot- the color scheme- the cultural differences- just the opening up of space in the OotS world it provides.

And I loved Rich's major derailing of where I/this forum seemed to be going re. what might with Tyrinaria & Lord Tyrinar.

A la Joss Whedon, and China Mieville, and some other masters of narrative, Rich always gives good bang for his tropes - or his justified aversion of same.

Plus- he brings the funny.

I've been very happy on this continent so far.

[RMS Oceanic]

I'm thinking of the possibility of reconciling the theory, and my thoughts turn to Nale.

"No one denies me. Not Father, not you."

Is it possible that...Nale deposed his father, and was then deposed himself?

[Herald Alberich]

Hey, look, Haley's wearing the Light Tan Boots of Speed. They do make the outfit look better.

Edit:

Is it possible that...Nale deposed his father, and was then deposed himself?

Maybe ... but given the approximately-yearly turnover, perhaps he deposed his father, renamed the nation - and is still there. Imagine how convoluted a patented take-down-the-Order Nale scheme would be with the resources of an entire country to bear.

[lothos]

Nice. Love these running gags. Maybe the running gags will come quicker with the boots of speed.

And now we know that Haley still likes to keep lots secrets from most people. She may have opened up to Elan, but she hasn't changed completely. That's believable for me.

[Katana_Geldar]

I'm thinking of the possibility of reconciling the theory, and my thoughts turn to Nale.

"No one denies me. Not Father, not you."

Is it possible that...Nale deposed his father, and was then deposed himself?

That would explain a lot.

[lothos]

That also explains why there's desert, the clouds stay with the elves. We have the same sort of thing downunder.

Speaking as a fellow Australian, I must refute your assertion that we have clouds here only where Elves Live. Possibly down in Tasmania you have Elves... I haven't seen much of your state :-)

[Selene]

Also, from first impression the elves don't seem very nice.

In what way? :smallconfused:

[Aldrakan]

In what way? :smallconfused:

Well they've shut themselves off from the rest of the continent with all the decent land, leaving the other races to eke out a fragile existence in a barren desert.

Also I'm assuming until we learn more that the method they used to seal themselves off was creating mountain range, which if true would make them at least partially responsible for devastating the rest of the continent.
An initial impression of course, more information may put things in quite a different light.

[AxeD]

Hahaha, breaking the 4th wall brings a smile to my face :smallbiggrin:

This comic also provides an interesting outlook on military conquest in d&d.

Keep up the good work Rich!

[factotum]

Well they've shut themselves off from the rest of the continent with all the decent land, leaving the other races to eke out a fragile existence in a barren desert.

Also I'm assuming until we learn more that the method they used to seal themselves off was creating mountain range

I think that's reaching a bit, to be honest. Seems far more likely that the mountain range was already there and the elves just happened to be on the northern, wetter side of it. We have precisely zero evidence that there was even anyone else up there to be driven out when they claimed it, after all. It would be easy enough to seal it off from the rest of the continent by just guarding any passes through the mountains.

(After all, if the Elves are powerful enough they can raise entire mountain ranges, I'm sure it wouldn't be that hard for them to just claim the entire continent rather than settling for only the northern half!).

[AxeD]

Woot 1st page! So Haley's father is being held at ransom?

Firstly, I'm pretty sure you're not supposed to celebrate that you got on 1st page/post, etc. The moderators made a "First Post/First Page "Shout-Outs"" thread to discourage this sort of stuff.

Secondly, read comic #131 for the letter detailing the her father's imprisonment.

[Kobold-Bard]

So the OotS know about the Flumphs? And yet they keep landing on them?

That's pretty sadistic really isn't it :smallamused:

Good comic as always.

[DSCrankshaw]

Hey, look, Haley's wearing the Light Tan Boots of Speed. They do make the outfit look better.

Edit:


Maybe ... but given the approximately-yearly turnover, perhaps he deposed his father, renamed the nation - and is still there. Imagine how convoluted a patented take-down-the-Order Nale scheme would be with the resources of an entire country to bear.

That's what I'm voting. Specifically...

Nale deposed his father, and Haley's and Elan's dads are sharing a cell. He's now using his country's resources to try to be the first to the gate (which is what he was going after last we heard of him). This sets things up for a fine conflict where several plot threads get resolved.

[lothos]

I think that's reaching a bit, to be honest. Seems far more likely that the mountain range was already there and the elves just happened to be on the northern, wetter side of it. We have precisely zero evidence that there was even anyone else up there to be driven out when they claimed it, after all. It would be easy enough to seal it off from the rest of the continent by just guarding any passes through the mountains.

(After all, if the Elves are powerful enough they can raise entire mountain ranges, I'm sure it wouldn't be that hard for them to just claim the entire continent rather than settling for only the northern half!).

I tend to agree with factotum here (and in many other places too...).

The thing I really liked about the continent's geography it's how it mirrors the design process that Rich outlines in his series "The New World" on this site. If you have not read it, it's quite interesting. The specific section that's most relevant to the geography mentioned above is here (http://www.giantitp.com/articles/xO3dVM8EDKJPlKxmVoG.html).

Interestingly, the continents general shape in that article is similar to the western continent, but not so much in terms of climate, so far as I can see.

So I don't think it's likely the elves raised the mountains, but since the mountains were there, it fits well with what Rich has written in "The New World".

[squidbreath]

Hn, I'm glad the colour of Haley's top got changed to a better one =]
(or it was just the lighting in that other shop?)

[TheBibliophile]

Hey, I think this is the first time the word "flumph" has been mentioned in the comic! A landmark moment!

In other news... great comic! East and West Despotania, heh.

[Killer Angel]

Poor flumphs! mercilessly killed by hordes of falling adventurers, now are rarer than the bison... :smallfrown:

[dyslexicfaser]

Wow, that's a good gag (the titular one) masquerading as a bad running gag.

That's too deep for me.

[King of Nowhere]

The western continent seems really a nice place...

That seems to depose against the idea that Tyrinar is Elan's father: Elan's father had his army when he was a child, about 15 years ago. And Haley get her note 2 years ago. So it would take for tyrinaria to have lasted 13 years at least, which is fairly uncommon in the western continent; if it has happened, someone should remember the lone nation that challenged history by lasting more than a decade.

[pnewman]

The western continent seems really a nice place...

That seems to depose against the idea that Tyrinar is Elan's father: Elan's father had his army when he was a child, about 15 years ago. And Haley get her note 2 years ago. So it would take for tyrinaria to have lasted 13 years at least, which is fairly uncommon in the western continent; if it has happened, someone should remember the lone nation that challenged history by lasting more than a decade.

Who says he's been on the Western continent for that long? Elan and his mother are from the Eastern continent and Nale seems to be familiar with it too. I think Nale grew up on the Eastern continent with his Dad. After many years of not conquering an Eastern nation Dad went West where its easier to do. If their Dad has (or Had) his own country I don't think Nale knows about it, because he'd have used it in his plans, and maybe demanded to be called a Prince.

OTOH it would be cool if one blonde twin was raised by his Dad in the West and the other was raised by his Mom in the East only to meet years later on an adventure (i.e at camp) because that would be a homage to 'The Parent Trap' ....

[Olorin Maia]

I woke up at three in the morning, and I knew (and I mean KNEW that there was a knew comic up. I was halfway to my computer when I realized that no, I didn't know that, and that I was really tired and going back to bed. Sure enough, though, Giant you didn't let me down.

[Hacktor]

Great comic :D

[Werbaer]

So the OotS know about the Flumphs? And yet they keep landing on them?

They know about them since the trial: comic 271 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0271.html)

[geekwraith]

Nooooooooo! Durkon, the tree is not your foe! It's a frondly tree!


I can't believe Haley and Elan deserted him like that. :smallwink:

[Mauve Shirt]

Heeheehee, nice one.
Despotonia? Really? :smalltongue:

[Assassin89]

I wonder if that new country has any importance, or if it will be ignored.

I also guess that history doesn't matter for these people, even if they could make a profit from selling "antiques".

[Herald Alberich]

I also guess that history doesn't matter for these people, even if they could make a profit from selling "antiques".

It does make sense. When your history is nothing but 500 years of constant warfare, conquering, reconquering, and redrawing borders, would you care about the particulars? I imagine the commoners don't even pay attention to which overlord they're toiling for anymore except to note the new face on the copper pieces.

[Sijo]

It seems like Rich is trying to remind us of every character's hanging plotline before we get on with the story. Good of him, though it makes things feel slow.

I wonder if the country Haley is looking for simply doesn't exist? I mean, she's taking some criminal's word that they have his father, not to mention that they'll give him back once she pays the ransom. She should know better than to trust them...

And speaking of trust, why doesn't Haley just admit the truth to her teammates? Knowing why she was so greedy all along could only make her look better in their eyes. Especially now that several of them have faced their own flaws.

And quite honestly? The Evil Trees joke is not running anymore, it fell dead of exhaustion quite some time ago. To say nothing of the Sextant.

[DOOMBOT9000]

Oh, how I miss the flumphs...

[HOLEkevin]

/em erases "Despotania" from his old campaign maps…

[Acero]

gweat comic, East and West:smallbiggrin:

[harami2000]

Nooooooooo! Durkon, the tree is not your foe! It's a frondly tree!


I can't believe Haley and Elan deserted him like that. :smallwink:
*facepalms*

:smallwink:

[Scarlet Knight]

*facepalms*



No, just a regular palm, but sneaky none the less...:smalltongue:

[the_tick_rules]

haha, good one haley.

[Silverraptor]

Ok, so what will Haley do to rescue her dad now?

And the reaccuring gags are always still funny.:smallbiggrin:

[Scarlet Knight]

How would she use flumphs to cover her getaway, anyways?

Getaway? She would use them simply for cover; in the desert , they make great sombreros.... :smallcool:

[Silverraptor]

Getaway? She would use them simply for cover; in the desert , they make great sombreros.... :smallcool:

Oh you naughty person.:smallamused:

[Kaytara]

I can't believe no one has yet pointed out that the so unfavourably received colour of Haley's new armour was changed.

It's much paler and lighter now. :)

[nybbler]

That seems to depose against the idea that Tyrinar is Elan's father: Elan's father had his army when he was a child, about 15 years ago. And Haley get her note 2 years ago. So it would take for tyrinaria to have lasted 13 years at least, which is fairly uncommon in the western continent; if it has happened, someone should remember the lone nation that challenged history by lasting more than a decade.

He could a crafty one, either escaping when he was deposed and coming back later with a new name, or even faking his own overthrow.

[Lkctgo]

I wish I could find a sax tent, that would be awesome. Maybe Bill Clinton would be in it and we could do songs together and everyone would clap and admire us. That would be fun.

No. Just, just, NO.

[Kurald Galain]

Oh dear. It took me three readings to catch the (groan) pun in the comic title :smallbiggrin:

[Pyron]

He could a crafty one, either escaping when he was deposed and coming back later with a new name, or even faking his own overthrow.

That's.... needlessly complicated. :smallwink:

[One Skunk Todd]

I wonder if one of those islands off the SE coast is where V teleported the Azurite refugees.

Also, what's up with that map in panel two? Is that the strapless bikini top caravan route? :P

[TooManySecrets]

This comic has offended me.

http://flumph.com/images/flumph.jpg

[Athaniar]

It will be interesting to see what has really happened to Haley's father and Lord Tyrinar. I think I'll wait and see rather than take part in the speculation.

[Gamerlord]

"An advance scout for the arboreal army" classic :smalltongue:

[Jokasti]

Nobody got that they deserted Durkon in the desert?

[ThePhantasm]

I think this strip was the best of this arc so far. Though I'm a bit disappointed that Tyrianna is missing from the map - I hope Giant had this planned out all along and this isn't just a quick way to wrap up what has been a long character arc for Haley.

[geekwraith]

Nobody got that they deserted Durkon in the desert?

Ahem. On the previous page:



I can't believe Haley and Elan deserted him like that. :smallwink:

You were saying? :smallcool:

[Pyron]

"An advance scout for the arboreal army" classic :smalltongue:

I guess they're finally branching out.

Don't worry Durkon, I'm rooting for you!

[Silverraptor]

I can't believe no one has yet pointed out that the so unfavourably received colour of Haley's new armour was changed.

It's much paler and lighter now. :)

Oh my gosh, you're right!http://i636.photobucket.com/albums/uu90/NamonakiRei/SmallKyaa.png

[King of Nowhere]

I'm surprised at the great number of people already misspelling Tyrinaria. It reminds me when nobody wrote Therkla correctly. What's the matter with names?

[factotum]

this isn't just a quick way to wrap up what has been a long character arc for Haley.

Er, how would this be a quick way to wrap up ANYTHING? Haley still has to find her father, and the fact she can't see Tyrinaria on any maps makes that job harder, not easier. Unless her father happens to stumble into the shop in the next strip and say, "Haley, what are you doing here?" then I don't see this as being any sort of short-cut.

[veti]

I imagine the commoners don't even pay attention to which overlord they're toiling for anymore except to note the new face on the copper pieces.

But commoners are hardly the target market for maps in the first place.

Realistically, if the countries are changing as fast as the cartographer says, I wouldn't expect the maps to show "countries" at all. They'd just show mountains, rivers, settlements etc. - the sort of thing that has a sporting chance of still being there by next New Year. And I'd expect most people to talk about geography in those terms as well.

[hamishspence]

Might depend on if the borders shift as rapidly as the countries change.

a country might change hands (coups) without changing shape. Or a conqueror might build an empire of provinces, but each province still have distinctive traits making it different from other provinces.

Visitors, come to trade, would probably need to know who controls where.

[Jokasti]

Ahem. On the previous page:



You were saying? :smallcool:

In the DESERT!
Deserted!
In the desert!

[Shmigor]

Typo first panel, although I'm sure someone else has already pointed it out.

Awesome strip though! Well done again, Rich.

[Shatteredtower]

Here. We go. Again.

Joy.

Running gags are good and all, but I really hope this won't be another case of one-step-forward-two-back, what with Haley holding something obstructive to the main goal in reserve, delaying the main plot with excessive complication yet again. That last book was awfully tedious for quite a long time.

Still, the thread's suggested a few ways this might not lead to a similar fiasco, so I can hope. It would just be a shame if the only reason V stopped being an idiot was to hand the title over to Haley.

[JonestheSpy]

"Sax tent"...heeheeeheee

Now that's a great use of a running gag.

[grubblybubbly]

i finally got to the current last post! i made it! wow...
funny post too.:smallbiggrin:

[Mad Scientist]

I really like Haley's cute new desert outfit.

[ref]

The map maker is clearly not Sabine... no red.

[Tobimaro]

Good comic, Giant. And I love the comic's title. Just as long as we do not have to deal with walking stiffs in this comic. :smallbiggrin: *ducks*

[MReav]

I'm wondering if there is a place ruled by Nale called "Sinister Twinsletown"

[Selene]

Well they've shut themselves off from the rest of the continent with all the decent land, leaving the other races to eke out a fragile existence in a barren desert.

Also I'm assuming until we learn more that the method they used to seal themselves off was creating mountain range, which if true would make them at least partially responsible for devastating the rest of the continent.
An initial impression of course, more information may put things in quite a different light.

If the other races are in as much constant warfare at the cartographer said, I'd shut them out, too. But I think Make Mountain Range would be some pretty serious magic, and might have been mentioned before now.

OTOH, we have them sending scouting teams into Azure City for no benefit to themselves except to help out their allies.

[Conuly]

If the other races are in as much constant warfare at the cartographer said, I'd shut them out, too.

But here we go again putting the cart before the horse. WHY are the other races in constant warfare? Because all the good land has been snatched up and they have nothing left but the scraps. Maybe if THEY had the forests and the ELVES were stuck with the edges of the desert, the elves would be the ones squabbling and fighting while the humans and lizards and who-all-else sang Kumbaya behind their mountains.

[Selene]

But here we go again putting the cart before the horse. WHY are the other races in constant warfare? Because all the good land has been snatched up and they have nothing left but the scraps.

You have no way of knowing that. You're just making an assumption that supports your viewpoint.


Maybe if THEY had the forests and the ELVES were stuck with the edges of the desert, the elves would be the ones squabbling and fighting while the humans and lizards and who-all-else sang Kumbaya behind their mountains.

My experience with reality suggests that you could put humans in utopia, and we would still find something to go to war over.

[Conuly]

You have no way of knowing that. You're just making an assumption that supports your viewpoint.

No, I'm directly reading what the cartographer says on the subject. She lives there, she should know.

[David Argall]

No, I'm directly reading what the cartographer says on the subject. She lives there, she should know.
You are directly reading what was said, and then adding an explanation that does not explain the wars and revolts of reality and seems unlikely to explain those of the story either.