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Confused Dad
2009-09-24, 03:11 PM
I'm looking for assistance in building a reasonable outsider slayer. I'm kind of drawn to the Knight of the Chalice, but it requires a building block of 8 (minimum) levels due to needing BAB +8. Originally considered Fig 4, Pal 4, but doesnt give Knowledge (the planes) as class feature.

Rules: 3.5 (3.0 may be possible if necessary)
Books: Any (if I don't have one, my DM or other players probably do)
Goal: Massive melee damage, good AC to protect the squishys

Leaning toward Cleave/Great Cleave type build for multiple kills/round in case DM throws us against hoards (he can be unpredictable).

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-09-24, 03:18 PM
How about a Cleric, or a Favored Soul?

Eldariel
2009-09-24, 03:20 PM
Are you interested in casting? 'cause obviously, casting does it better. If not, I'd definitely take few levels in Ranger; Favored Enemy is quite fitting for "X Slayer" (if you take "Arcane Hunter" and can get the unerrata'd version, you get the bonuses vs. anything with spell-likes which is practically all Outsiders).

Favored Power Attack seems like a vastly efficient way to break Outsiders if you want to do melee. You'll also want some ways to stop the damn outsiders from teleporting out or some such.

Person_Man
2009-09-24, 03:22 PM
What's class level are you starting your game at? How long do you expect it to go?

Cleave is a decent feat at low levels. But by mid-high levels, it is unlikely that you will kill an enemy every round. So there are other more efficient feats out there. Great Cleave is utterly worthless.

Melee damage is easy. All you need is some combination of Dungoencrasher, Power Attack, Leap Attack, Spirited Charge, Shock Trooper, Headlong Rush, Battle Jump, Valorous Weapon, Rhino's Rush, and/or anything else that either provides scaled damage or multiplies damage without requiring a critical hit.

AC is even easier, especially for a Paladin. Just buy some mechanus gear, throw in a couple of buff spells, and maybe a few X to Y bonuses (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=125732), and you're set.

PinkysBrain
2009-09-24, 03:25 PM
How about a Cleric/Excorcist of the Silver Flame? (From the ECS). It's a full BAB prestige class which drops caster levels specifically aimed against evil outsiders.

They also have a turn undead like power specifically aimed against evil outsiders.

Keld Denar
2009-09-24, 03:26 PM
Human

Pal1 Law Devotion, True Believer
Pal2
Pal3 Knowledge Devotion (start backfilling Kn: Planes)
Pal4
Pal5 (Charging Smite ACF)
Fighter1 Power Attack, Divine Might
Fighter2 Weapon Focus
Pious Templar1
Knight of the Chalice1
...

continue on from there.


Alternatively, Cleric or Cloistered Cleric all the way, be Any Good, and pick up the spell Turn Anathema in Complete Champion. Go forth and turn all the demons you want, since there is no save and outsiders tend to have WAY lower HD compared to their CR (unlike Undead).

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-09-24, 03:34 PM
There's also Banishment, Dispel Evil, etc.

Best of all, you get full BaB as a cleric assuming the DM allows Divine Metamagic and Persist Spell.

Doc Roc
2009-09-24, 03:36 PM
You call me from the wastes, and I stand prepared to deliver. Please further specify your desires, amount of book-keeping you are willing to handle, and the precise nature of the existing party. Understand that for me, massive damage starts at 6000 and rises to just OVER NINE THOUSAND!

Keld Denar
2009-09-24, 03:42 PM
Tide, your cliches are tired and overused...you should really work on your material...

Doc Roc
2009-09-24, 03:56 PM
Eh, I don't really need to. My CO Kung-Fu speaks for itself.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-09-24, 03:59 PM
Please state the nature of your Charop emergency.

Keld Denar
2009-09-24, 04:14 PM
Help me CharOp Wan Kenobi, you're my only hope!

:smallcool:

woodenbandman
2009-09-24, 04:41 PM
Hey you could be a ranger. A Planar Ranger, to be exact. They have Knowledge The Planes as a class skill, and they work well with Knowledge Devotion. Splash fighter for Weapon Mastery and build from there.

EDIT: hmm... melee damage, huh? That's a bit more difficult. Try a Paladin/Fist of Ralziel (Book of Exalted Deeds) It's a prestige class based around the smiting of the evil.

Confused Dad
2009-09-24, 04:52 PM
Thanks for the suggestions, especially on the feats. Any hints on placing a 28 point buy?

Rest of the party will be an arcane caster (prob Sor or Wiz 20), a skillmonkey and the 4th player just discovered Artificers, and she's into the crafting scene. Yay, gadgets galore!

PinkysBrain
2009-09-24, 05:29 PM
You're playing epic? In that case if you want to avoid casting you really have to optimize the hell out of your character ... otherwise you aren't going to be protecting anything.

HamHam
2009-09-24, 05:47 PM
Hellreavers from FC II are pretty good. Best entry would probably be either Paladin 5 or Warblade 5. Crusader 5 could be good too.

herrhauptmann
2009-09-25, 12:27 AM
Occut slayer PrC would help with anti-casters, doubly nice if you take Favored Enemy: Arcanists.

+1 on hellreaver and Pious templar. Both grant Mettle which can be very nice if your DM pulls monsters from books other than the MMs.
WItchslayer is situationally useful. More so if you play using Binders.
Dwarven Deepwarden 2 and Fist of the forest x. Max out your con, and watch your AC soar as Fist fo the Forest adds your Con bonus to AC (the way monks get wis to AC) and Deepwarden replaces dex to AC with Con to AC.
If you don't want to play a dwarf, you can always put a few levels into Stoneblessed: Dwarf. Now your half-ogre can count as a dwarf for all racial PrC's, feats and items. Only takes 3 levels, and also boosts your con by 2. (that's +2 AC if you go FotF and DW)

Also a Greenstar metal sword (complete mage or arcane). It acts like an adamant weapon most of the time, but against outsiders it gives 2d6

Doc Roc
2009-09-25, 12:35 AM
Would you like my help? I'll need to know more about what kind of damage you want.

Playing a dwarven deepwarden is literally prolly a death sentence for your party unless you have 30 ft + reach.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-09-25, 12:39 AM
Know you of any such dwarven deepwardens? :smallwink:

herrhauptmann
2009-09-25, 12:50 AM
Would you like my help? I'll need to know more about what kind of damage you want.

Playing a dwarven deepwarden is literally prolly a death sentence for your party unless you have 30 ft + reach.

Played a character over the winter, deepwarden, and dwarven defender. He had more survivability than the psion or anyone else in the party.

olentu
2009-09-25, 01:00 AM
Played a character over the winter, deepwarden, and dwarven defender. He had more survivability than the psion or anyone else in the party.

Oh I would expect so. I mean why target the dwarven defender who can be avoided with a brisk walk barring said 30 ft. or longer reach.

herrhauptmann
2009-09-25, 01:55 AM
Except I was getting targeted as much or more than the other players. Either in regular attacks, or a monsters spell-like abilities

olentu
2009-09-25, 02:02 AM
Except I was getting targeted as much or more than the other players. Either in regular attacks, or a monsters spell-like abilities

Those are silly monsters but then again I suppose that means that the game was not a deadly game that requires high optimization to even hope of surviving.

ericgrau
2009-09-25, 02:06 AM
Ranger with outsider (pick alignment) bane weapons of the appropriate metal and alignment enchantment. That's the easy way to really pile on the damage. But if you only want to focus on combat ability, I'd get only 1 level of ranger. With 4 levels per +2, you could easily find another class to give you an equal boost all the time, not just against the favored enemy. The advantage of ranger is the non-combat abilities. So now you have 7 more levels to work with.

Signmaker
2009-09-25, 02:14 AM
Aww, no cleric in the party? And here I was going to suggest Sacred and Profane Item as spell choices. They are both quite useful when enchanted on to weapons, are are permanent until discharged. One affects Good Outsiders, the other Evil Outsiders (can you guess which is which?)

When discharged, damage + fear effect. It's in CChamp if you'd like to know more, though it doesn't seem applicable.

But yes, Keld's Devotion feat suggestions are quite useful to up damage on just about anything, and having outsiders as a favored enemy helps too.