Would you take quickdraw if it gave you an extra attack?

[Myrmex]

Quickdraw
Prerequisite
Base attack bonus +1.

Benefit:
You can draw a weapon as a free action instead of as a move action. You can draw a hidden weapon (see the Sleight of Hand skill) as a move action.

A character who has selected this feat may throw weapons at his full normal rate of attacks (much like a character with a bow).

When you have a BAB +3 or higher, once per round, you may throw the weapon drawn as a free action as part of a move or charge action at a -2 penalty to attack for that attack and all other attacks made that round.

[Godskook]

That wording doesn't seem to actually give an additional attack...

/me confused

[quick_comment]

I usually take it as is.

[Indon]

Quick Draw isn't that bad a feat to begin with. I don't take it with every meleer, but I do sometimes.

[Akal Saris]

Yes - it would be especially good for a wizard, who can cast polymorph, then move up to attack, throwing a large greataxe as he does so and drawing a second one afterwards. Or for any other class that buffs+moves like a cleric or druid.

[PhoenixRivers]

Harder for a druid, since they buff/move in OMNOMNOM form.

[Volkov]

Tyrannosaurus Rex Druids, such a priceless form.

[Eldariel]

I fear allowing attacks during move actions is an incredibly risky change since as it stands, move actions aren't worth much offensively and thus quite easy to get (just looking at e.g. Hustle and all the higher level extra action abilities granting entire turns complete with Move). Seems risky to change that.

[Keld Denar]

move actions aren't worth much offensively

Unless you are an Archivist. Just about all of the Dark Knowledges are move actions...including the 11th level STUN ability.

[Akal Saris]

Well, archivists are the rare exception. My wizard uses his move actions to urge his pet dog to attack with handle animal, but that's not really a typical thing to do either.

[Myrmex]

I fear allowing attacks during move actions is an incredibly risky change since as it stands, move actions aren't worth much offensively and thus quite easy to get (just looking at e.g. Hustle and all the higher level extra action abilities granting entire turns complete with Move). Seems risky to change that.

Hmm....
I'm looking for a way to make it so low level fighters can do something other than charge or attempt trips. Hurling axes and stuff would be pretty cool.

Maybe make it BAB +4 and only let people take it if they have 4 fighter levels? We're not playing with ToB, so I don't have to worry about warblades.

[Tyndmyr]

Harder for a druid, since they buff/move in OMNOMNOM form.

Poor, poor underpowered druids. :smallbiggrin:

[Stormageddon]

I haven't taken quick draw myself yet, but there's Atleast once a gaming season I wish I would. My next character is going to have it for sure.

[Godskook]

I haven't taken quick draw myself yet, but there's Atleast once a gaming season I wish I would. My next character is going to have it for sure.

This. I've many times wanted to have quick draw and not had it. That's the hallmark of a decent feat, or at least by current standards.

[sonofzeal]

I haven't taken quick draw myself yet, but there's Atleast once a gaming season I wish I would. My next character is going to have it for sure.
The problem is that you can already draw for free as part of a move, and the majority of combats start with a move action of some sort, and a majority of the remainder start with weapon in hand. It sounds great, but I've honestly never seen it useful except when people are switching weapons in the middle of a fight. Good for letting an archer quickdraw a sword though.

[ericgrau]

Ya if you have 1 weapon you can often get along fine without it. But it's great for those with multiple weapons / etc. I have a character concept in mind that involves a guisarme focused fighter, but he also uses his bow, bolas (ranged trip full attack! :smallbiggrin:) and wands when given a good opportunity. Quick draw is a must for him.

[LurkerInPlayground]

Rogues can sneak attack by catching an unsuspecting somebody flatfooted with quick draw.

Make it a death attack if you also happen to be an assassin.

[gdiddy]

Only character I ever used Quick Draw with was a Diplomancer that was also a Sneak-Attacking-Shock-trooper-Leap-attacker. Made for the best party face ever, because he was trustworthy looking and he knew it.

"We mean you no harm, friend Dragon!"

*quickdrawsneakyleapattack*

"BLOOD FOR THE BLOOD GOD!"

[Person_Man]

Quickdraw can be ridiculously useful (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5266526) as is. It's the key to several different combos. So there's really no reason to change it.

[Eloel]

Quickdraw is already a must-have for almost all thrown-weapon builds.

[Sinfire Titan]

If you word it as a Melee Weapon version of Rapid Shot, it would be nice. As is, there's only one feat in the game that functions as Rapid Shot for a manufactured Melee weapons, and that's Slashing Fury (PH2) which has a ton of requirements above and beyond Rapid Shot or Snap Kick.

Try wording it like this:


Quickdraw
Prerequisite: Base attack bonus +1 or Iaijutsu Focus 6 Ranks
Benefit: You may draw a stowed weapon as a Free action instead of a Move action.

Special: If you drew a melee weapon this round using the Quickdraw feat, you may take a Swift action to make a melee attack with it at your highest attack bonus. This attack must be made before you take any other attacks during your turn this round. This attack and all subsequent attacks you make this round are made at a -2 penalty to the attack roll.

[Roderick_BR]

I've considered mixing up QuickDraw with Improved Initiative, since both deals with quick-paced action in a combat, and make it sound like "special action + skill bonus" feat, that are usually not that bad (and yes, I know Initiative is not a skill in 3.5)

[Godskook]

Try wording it like this:

4 points to anyone who bothers getting 6 ranks in Iaiijutsu without gaining at least one point of BAB(Seems rather backwords to me...).

[PhoenixRivers]

expert 1 / wizard 1 / rogue 1

Choose Iaijutsu Focus as one of the expert skills.

[oxinabox]

Don't mess with what is already a decent feat.
HEck, combing reach weapon with greatsword, and (IIRC) AoO everythim someomne tries to get near you.

Or (what i've used it for)
SHooting at someone with my bow and then someone charges past me (jumping over a baracade) to get to the soft quishing rogue and wizard., my dagger was in my hand like that. and they were bleeding on the ground

[DragoonWraith]

expert 1 / wizard 1 / rogue 1

Choose Iaijutsu Focus as one of the expert skills.
Except that everyone should play with fractional BAB.

[Andras]

Except that everyone should play with fractional BAB.

Should they? Sure.

Do they? Not necessarily.

[Milskidasith]

Don't mess with what is already a decent feat.
HEck, combing reach weapon with greatsword, and (IIRC) AoO everythim someomne tries to get near you.

Or (what i've used it for)
SHooting at someone with my bow and then someone charges past me (jumping over a baracade) to get to the soft quishing rogue and wizard., my dagger was in my hand like that. and they were bleeding on the ground

Neither of those work... free actions can still only be done on your turn unless otherwise specified, and drawing a weapon is not. You can't draw a weapon on somebody else's turn, let alone draw a weapon, get an AoO, drop the weapon, and redraw another weapon as they approach.

[PId6]

Quick Draw is not worth a feat for anyone except throwers, wandificers, and certain other specific builds. For everything else, there's Mastercard Least Crystal of Return.

[Godskook]

expert 1 / wizard 1 / rogue 1

Choose Iaijutsu Focus as one of the expert skills.

My point wasn't about possibility, it was about practicality. Anyone emphasizing melee will urk at the thought of losing 3 points of BAB off the bat like that.

[Myrmex]

I fear allowing attacks during move actions is an incredibly risky change since as it stands, move actions aren't worth much offensively and thus quite easy to get (just looking at e.g. Hustle and all the higher level extra action abilities granting entire turns complete with Move). Seems risky to change that.

I just realized that since it's limited to once/round, you can get as many move actions as you like, and at most, it's only one extra attack. Not particularly zOMG good for a melee feat.


Try wording it like this:

Yeah, but now you can't chuck it at someone, then two hand a greatsword into their face. I wanted to reward players who like the idea of carrying multiple weapons around so they can be flexible.


Quickdraw can be ridiculously useful (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=5266526) as is. It's the key to several different combos. So there's really no reason to change it.

Being useful in a single build that includes virtually every source book doesn't make Quick Draw that attractive of a feat, especially if a player doesn't want to play some character they found online. Its only real use is in throwing builds.

[Sinfire Titan]

Except that everyone should play with fractional BAB.

No thank you. I do enough math as is, I don't want to do division to fill out my character sheet.

Besides, BAB for classes like the Wizard make no sense. A 10th level Wizard is the equal to a trained Swordsman, and can cross swords with an armed guard in your average metropolis-sized city and win without a single spell? Classes like that shouldn't even have a BAB progression. Stupid Touch spells messing up the combat section of the PHB...

[Godskook]

Besides, BAB for classes like the Wizard make no sense. A 10th level Wizard is the equal to a trained Swordsman, and can cross swords with an armed guard in your average metropolis-sized city and win without a single spell? Classes like that shouldn't even have a BAB progression. Stupid Touch spells messing up the combat section of the PHB...

What is it you picture when you think 'wizard'?

[Myrmex]

What is it you picture when you think 'wizard'?

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_Y5TwdoOLPTI/SPTb29aO3sI/AAAAAAAADNY/VklUdb6mdNU/s400/FuturamaBendersGame01.jpg

Second from left.

[Sinfire Titan]

What is it you picture when you think 'wizard'?

Something that doesn't involve Freaking Lasers. If my idea of a Wizard is going to melt your face, he's going to make it a little more impressive than a thin green ray.

Offensive touch spells should be restricted to classes like the Duskblade or Bard, classes that were intended to be partial-melee combatants or at least able to get in the enemy's face for a few rounds. Wizards and Sorcerers shouldn't have Touch-range abilities, at least not unless Polymorphing is involved. Rays should be more of the Warlock's or Cleric's stick.