why no camels?

[Acero]

why wouldn't Roy let the order get camels?
okayyy, so V is half camel. thats not enough for all of them

if its a matter of no camels short enough 4 Durkon and Belk, they can ride 1. camels got 2 humps, don't they

why no camels?

[pearl jam]

Camels from the Arabian peninsula have 1 hump. Camels from northeast Asia (China/Mongolia) have 2 humps.

As for why they don't get them, maybe the same reason they don't have horses now, whatever that reason is....?

[Surfing HalfOrc]

Not sure, to be honest. In one of the book commentaries, Rich said that drawing the horses was a bit of a pain, since horses are so big compared to people. And since camels can be ridden, and are even bigger than horses, Rich might want to avoid the same problem.

But in game or story wise? I don't see them being much of a problem, except maybe for feeding them. And camels can carry a gread deal of feed, casks of water, supplies and people. I know I'd take a small herd of well laden camels with me if I were to head out into the desert!

[Acero]

Camels from the Arabian peninsula have 1 hump. Camels from northeast Asia (China/Mongolia) have 2 humps.

As for why they don't get them, maybe the same reason they don't have horses now, whatever that reason is....?

they forgot the horses

[Meg]

they forgot the horses

Yes, that's the "Plot" reason for not having them, but if they were easy to draw, they would probably still have them. That's sort of how webcomic writing works, you try something, and if it doesn't work, give a lame explanation as to why it's no longer so.

[MReav]

Because camels are ill-tempered, hard-to-control creatures and no one seems to have Handle Animal.

[Katana_Geldar]

Elan does, though, doesn't he?

[Surfing HalfOrc]

Elan does, though, doesn't he?

Technically, he knows how to Ride. (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0141.html)

But if you look at the panel on the bottom left, you'll see how small the characters on horseback and with speech panels become. Now look how big the camels are in today's strip, then add "our heroes" on top, and you'll see why they'll be walking. The "camera" would have to be way back to take all this in at once.

[BatRobin]

Yes, that's the "Plot" reason for not having them, but if they were easy to draw, they would probably still have them. That's sort of how webcomic writing works, you try something, and if it doesn't work, give a lame explanation as to why it's no longer so.

The horses blew up.

[MReav]

The horses blew up.

No, they were left behind in the inn, and Durkon's pony was likely left in Azure City.

[ericgrau]

Durkon can create all the food and water they need and they have bags of holding for all their stuff, so they don't need camels to carry any gear. As for why they aren't riding camels, I have no idea.

And being dependent on one party member for their very survival seems a bit risky. I hope they brought a backup source of necessities.

[Acero]

And being dependent on one party member for their very survival seems a bit risky. I hope they brought a backup source of necessities.

thats why they brought diamond du........oh yeah

[CrimsonAngel]

There are no camels because O-Chul demands it.

[Acero]

There are no camels because O-Chul demands it.

That makes no sense...at all.

[The Rugi]

Yeah...Roy didn't really answer Elan's question there. Maybe next comic.

But yeah, the way Rich drew the camels, they aren't very stickfigurey at all. Maybe if he gave them stick figure legs like the horses, it'd be easier...

I guess Roy refuses to bring camels with him because he doesn't want to deal with all the mounted combat rules if they happen to run into a random encounter in the desert somewhere.

[Acero]

Yeah...Roy didn't really answer Elan's question there. Maybe next comic.



I guess Roy refuses to bring camels with him because he doesn't want to deal with all the mounted combat rules if they happen to run into a random encounter in the desert somewhere.

what about the mounted feats? horse archers are very effective
mounts can also get casters out quick if they're hurt. camels help every1 but Belk and Roy in battle

[Raging Gene Ray]

Well, now Durkon can cast Wind Walk on himself and 1 other person per 3 caster levels. If he's level 12, he could take himself and 4 others.

V would probably be the odd one out and use Overland Flight.

[Acero]

V would probably be the odd one out and use Overland Flight.

i dont think he has OF

[Raging Gene Ray]

Hmmmm...you might be right. Plus he couldn't catch up to them (Wind Walk = 600 ft/round, Overland Flight = much less than that).

Guess they'll just have to tame some wild landsharks to ride.

[waterpenguin43]

I think it would cost more than it would matter, also, they would probably get their camels attacked before too long, and there money would be wasted.

[MReav]

i dont think he has OF

Durkon casts the spell twice. Of course, the desert winds are too strong (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0673.html), so they can't use it.

[Raging Gene Ray]

Durkon casts the spell twice. Of course, the desert winds are too strong (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0673.html), so they can't use it.

Oh, forgot about that. Well, maybe it's not that far away from the Oasis that they'll need camels. Roy knows the coordinates and has carefully planned this journey. And we all know how careful planning always works out!

[FoE]

They have no need of pack animals or riding animals. As Belkar pointed out, they are smelly, ill-tempered beasts. So why bring them along?

[Porthos]

OK, let's look at the Create Food and Water (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/createFoodAndWater.htm) spell:


Create Food and Water
Conjuration (Creation)

Level: Clr 3
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 10 minutes
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Effect: Food and water to sustain three humans or one horse/level for 24 hours
Duration: 24 hours; see text
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No

The food that this spell creates is simple fare of your choice—highly nourishing, if rather bland. Food so created decays and becomes inedible within 24 hours, although it can be kept fresh for another 24 hours by casting a purify food and drink spell on it. The water created by this spell is just like clean rain water, and it doesn’t go bad as the food does.

OK, so that is MORE than enough food for the entire group (three people per level ≈ food and water for 42 people).

Even better, Purify Food and Drink (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/purifyFoodAndDrink.htm) is a zeroth level spell. Which means that Durkon only has to cast CF&W every other day.

====

Now let's go even one step beyond and say they have no need for food (the fact they have Iron Rations has already been established in a bonus comic) and will only need water while out in the desert.

Even better better:

Create Water (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/createWater.htm)


Conjuration (Creation) [Water]
Level: Clr 0, Drd 0, Pal 1
Components: V, S
Casting Time: 1 standard action
Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels)
Effect: Up to 2 gallons of water/level
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: No

This spell generates wholesome, drinkable water, just like clean rain water. Water can be created in an area as small as will actually contain the liquid, or in an area three times as large—possibly creating a downpour or filling many small receptacles.

Note: Conjuration spells can’t create substances or objects within a creature. Water weighs about 8 pounds per gallon. One cubic foot of water contains roughly 8 gallons and weighs about 60 pounds.

Durkon can create approx 28 gallons of water with a single casting of a ZEROTH level spell. Combine this with the bags of holding in the party, and I really don't see the need for camels. :smalltongue:

===

And if Durkon gets killed/can't cast spells anymore? Well then the party is screwed anyway as not having a [s]Walking Bandage Factory Cleric in monster ridden territory is just asking for trouble. :smallamused:

[bobothegoat]

Why on earth would they need another camel anyway? Isn't V part camel?

[Herald Alberich]

OK, so that is MORE than enough food for the entire group (three people per level ≈ food and water for 42 people).

I was wondering what they would trade for the shelter of the caravan. Not having to buy a few days' worth of food supplies will make Durkon fairly popular, I imagine. There are probably more than 42 people in the caravan, but I think he can afford to prepare it in two or three slots each day.

[thepsyker]

I was wondering what they would trade for the shelter of the caravan. Not having to buy a few days' worth of food supplies will make Durkon fairly popular, I imagine. There are probably more than 42 people in the caravan, but I think he can afford to prepare it in two or three slots each day.
I would think that as experienced adventures they would offer the benefit of their combat capabilities as the caravans passed through the rocky area, which from that description sounds like it would be a good place for a bandit ambush.

[Killer Angel]

Because camels are ill-tempered, hard-to-control creatures and no one seems to have Handle Animal.

And certainly they don't have Handle exotic animals!
Well, I know, but if there's a feat for exotic weapons... :smallbiggrin:

[Katana_Geldar]

I'm waiting for Rich to make camel-related jokes, like their being ships of the desert. Or the thing about a camel through the eye of a needle.

[Yendor]

The obvious joke here is:
:roy: I said no camels, Elan! That's six! Can't you count?

[Linkavitch]

thats why they brought diamond du........oh yeah

Blackwing went back and bought the diamond dust as Sombraro Blackwing, remember?

[Hardcore]

they all ready got a camel. It is not known how many humps it got.
http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0087.html

[allenw]

I would think that as experienced adventures they would offer the benefit of their combat capabilities as the caravans passed through the rocky area, which from that description sounds like it would be a good place for a bandit ambush.

You would think that, unless you realized that having PCs with you *guarantees* that you'll be ambushed, and by *really, really tough* bandits at that. Unless the inevitable Blue Dragon attack scares them off first.

Knowing is half the battle. :smallbiggrin:

[Roderick_BR]

As typical dungeon crawlers, Roy don't want to have to care for animals after reaching their destiny. That's why they are getting a ride instead of getting their own mounts. Saves lot of money, time, and trouble.
I don't know how he plans them to get back into a city, tough

[The_Firenail]

I've read in Coelho's The Alchemist (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Alchemist_(novel))that camels can die in the desert without warning, but horses slow down before they die.

"Horses are more trustworthy," says The Alchemist, or something like that. Because there is no other desert in any world larger than the Sahara.

[Hurkyl]

Blackwing went back and bought the diamond dust as Sombraro Blackwing, remember?
Right, so they should have no problem resurrecting Durkon if he fails.

[batsofchaos]

It's a shame, really. Those camels in the first panel are really cute.

[Acero]

Right, so they should have no problem resurrecting Durkon if he fails.

except only Durkon can cast ressurection

[batsofchaos]

except only Durkon can cast ressurection

Your sarcasm detector seems to need repairs. :smalltongue:

[JonestheSpy]

If there's no camels, who's going to pull the wagonload of chinchillas?

[Alysar]

The obvious joke here is:
:roy: I said no camels, Elan! That's six! Can't you count?

Exactly what I was thinking. :smallbiggrin:

[Shale]

If there's no camels, who's going to pull the wagonload of chinchillas?

They'll attach a tiny yoke to each of the gophers.

[GSFB]

They could get camels, but then they would forget about them and *POOF*

[Katana_Geldar]

If there's no camels, who's going to pull the wagonload of chinchillas?

*facepalm* Camels don't pull wagons

[Kaytara]

While it is a bit odd, it shouldn't be too hard to justify. They are adventurers, after all. With their luck, within the first week of travelling they'll discover some weird hidden catacombs and have to go through them to get past some obstacle and leave the camels behind, anyway, or they'll be attacked by a Terrasque or some huge sand beast and the camels will run off in terror while they're fighting... Besides, there's the matter of supplies. Roy said Durkon would summon enough water for all of them, so they're effectively without constraints in that regard. With six huge animals, though, it would be completely different, as I doubt Durkon can conjure THAT much.

[theinsulabot]

While it is a bit odd, it shouldn't be too hard to justify. They are adventurers, after all. With their luck, within the first week of travelling they'll discover some weird hidden catacombs and have to go through them to get past some obstacle and leave the camels behind, anyway, or they'll be attacked by a Terrasque or some huge sand beast and the camels will run off in terror while they're fighting... Besides, there's the matter of supplies. Roy said Durkon would summon enough water for all of them, so they're effectively without constraints in that regard. With six huge animals, though, it would be completely different, as I doubt Durkon can conjure THAT much.


and then after the TPK, the players stand up and beat the DM up, who is laughing his ass off and storm out, all whining about inappropriate level encounters.

[Katana_Geldar]

Kinda reminds me of my last game when the players kept talking about eating my horse. :smallyuk:

[Shraik]

Maybe it's cause Rich doesn't want to have to draw them for x amount of issues. And idk, maybe cause Roy feels daring...?

[CoffeeIncluded]

Oh man, what if the order actually does face off against a Terrasque in the comic?

[Acero]

whats a terrasque?

[Nimrod's Son]

whats a terrasque?
A very big monster. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/tarrasque.htm)

[reignofevil]

*facepalm* Camels don't pull wagons

I know this is a bit off topic, but I am curious.
Is there some reason camels CAN'T pull wagons, or is it just not widely done because they are generally terrible animals?

[Boci]

I know this is a bit off topic, but I am curious.
Is there some reason camels CAN'T pull wagons, or is it just not widely done because they are generally terrible animals?

Given that the egyptians used camel drawn chariots I'm guessing its just hard.

[Katana_Geldar]

Camels are rather taller than horses, this would mean they would need bigger harnesses and bigger wagons.

Bigger wagons are also rather heavy, and have wheels which sink in to desert sand. There is probably a good reason the Egyptians did not have the wheel until they were invaded.

Okay, I take that back, looks like I was wrong.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/37/Camel_cart.JPG

But wagons are impractical in the desert.

[Nimrod's Son]

I know this is a bit off topic, but I am curious.
Is there some reason camels CAN'T pull wagons, or is it just not widely done because they are generally terrible animals?
I think it's more that you can load about as much stuff as you could pull in a wagon straight onto its back, and it can travel just as fast if not faster. Wagons aren't too effective on sand, after all.

EDIT: (from here (http://southwest.library.arizona.edu/hav1/body.1_div.22.html))

It was found that three camels could carry as much as six mules could draw in a wagon over that country, and could travel twice as fast as the mules. They could, upon occasion, for a day or two at a time, carry burdens of eight hundred to a thousand pounds.
So yeah, far from being "generally terrible animals", camels are actually just too effective to need wagons.

[reignofevil]

Thanks for the quick informative answers guys!

[meioziz]

You would think that, unless you realized that having PCs with you *guarantees* that you'll be ambushed, and by *really, really tough* bandits at that. Unless the inevitable Blue Dragon attack scares them off first.

Knowing is half the battle. :smallbiggrin:

While you'd think that any regular caravan would be safer without PCs, the fact here is that this caravan isn't any regular caravan. It's a caravan identified by a party of PCs. Now, which is safer: being an identified nameless caravan heading through dangerous areas, or being such and escorted by said party of PCs?

I think it's safer to bet that the PCs will put up a good fight to protect the caravan and come out victorious, should they get attacked at all. ;)

[Katana_Geldar]

They are (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0145.html) going to get attacked.

[ericgrau]

But only once, fortunately.


Camels are rather taller than horses, this would mean they would need bigger harnesses and bigger wagons.

Bigger wagons are also rather heavy, and have wheels which sink in to desert sand. There is probably a good reason the Egyptians did not have the wheel until they were invaded.

Okay, I take that back, looks like I was wrong.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/3/37/Camel_cart.JPG

But wagons are impractical in the desert.

Are you sure it can still pull chinchillas? I don't see any in that photo :smallbiggrin:

[Gullara]

They have no need of pack animals or riding animals. As Belkar pointed out, they are smelly, ill-tempered beasts. So why bring them along?

And the only reason they bring Durkon along is because he is much more useful than a camel:smalltongue: