help me!

[Desmond Tiny]

First post ever!

Seriously, my campaign got messed up horribly.

This is how it is supposed to go: My players meet in a tavern to hunt mind flayers. One player tracks them down and asks to join them. they attack the thralls controlled by the mind flayers and stop the ilithids master plan.

This is how it went: The players met in the tavern. One player failed to track them down. He got the misleading information that they had already left without him( which he believed because he was not the most popular person in the group). He killed an innocent person out of anger( he is neutral). The rest of the party witnessed it and decided to attack him. Both rangers in the party hit him, knocking him unconcious. They sell his animal companion( he is a druid) and send him to jail. the rangers who think he is dangerous decide to guard the jail themselves. He attempted to escape and now the rangers are trying to kill him.

Also this is my first time DMing or even playing D and D(same with the other players).

[dragonfan6490]

Wow, that is one heck of a story.

You should have Mind Flayers attack the party and have the Druid help defeat them, thus gaining the trust of the party.

[PersonMan]

Well...[Expletive]

First off, I'm pretty sure that killing someone due to being angry about your group leaving without you is evil. Enough so to either cause an alignment shift or almost cause one.
Second, the character is trying to escape rather than talk to the others...Not a good idea.

So, you can either let this turn into PvP, let the guy die and have him make a new character, or just have random mindflayers/thralls attack and force them to cooperate. Keep the threat of town razing/death/mindflayers over their heads to force them into action. That's the best I can think of right now. Good luck.

[Desmond Tiny]

I would do that but right now the rangers are chasing him with the intent to kill. He would have died last time if i didn't step in. Also i don't think that the other players will even listen to him.

[Eon]

rocks fall and everyone dies.

nah, i've never dmed but try to have a high level npc catch the druid and stop the rangers from killing him. maybe try to have the illithids attack afterwards and kill the npc. leave enough illithids and then they'll have to work together.

that's what i have. use it if you want.

[Desmond Tiny]

This campaign is level 1 so if I use a high level npc then it will completely overpower the pcs and i was just going to have them fight thralls and a single ilithid as the boss.

[oxinabox]

first off: You had 2 rangers and the druid was doing the tracking?
second: sounds like most of you players are acting in character. (good)
not so much the attacking an innocent, in anger.
That's not neutral, unless he hass terrible, terible rage (flaw worth rage).

closest i've come to that in character was knocking down a wall with a bardstool (er... i mean Maul) when a NPC that had put a large hole in my kidney, escaped though the solid stone* floor! just as I almost knocked him out. *explict*

(or maybe it was wood, that would name more sense)

I second having mind flayers attack the jail.
Or work out something better, that *only* a druid can solve.
Maybe a herd of Dear, suddenly suround the jail, shaking with fear.
and heavily wounded.
Only the druid can find out what happened.

[Eon]

then replace illithids with mind slaves.
:smallamused:
and make the thralls just strong enough were they need to work together but not too strong where they cannot win. and if the high level pc dies then it won't overpower them for more than one encounter.

[Kallisti]

So either ask the players to stop killing each other, or let them kil him and have him roll up a new character. If this keeps being a problem, ask them to start being mature about it. If they won't, get new players.

[Temet Nosce]

Kill them, but not with rocks fall everyone dies. Maybe they'll get the idea after their enemies get the drop on them while fully prepared. Don't fudge it either, consider precisely how nasty the preparations might get and slam them with the full amount. Some may survive, some may not, but the point should be driven home.

This tactic has two benefits. First, it's probably what would happen assuming their enemies were aware of them, and second it'll hopefully make them realize that the world goes on regardless of what they do.

It's also a good time for them to learn this lesson, since the campaign just started.

[Desmond Tiny]

I would really prefer not to kill any characters unless i have to. I am the only one who knows things about the game and it took two hours of trying to help all of them fill out their character sheets. They are my friends and I really want to keep playing with them. None of them have any experience so i don't want to be too harsh.

[herrhauptmann]

If they have no experience with the game, tell them before the next time, it usually breaks the game up if people keep getting their characters murdered by other players. To try to find a reason to work with the players.

In the meantime, why exactly did you decide to start the players separated from one another? And if one person is so disliked, why is he in the group? It'll just cause friction and resentment if the other players keep killing his character because they don't like him (regardless of what race/class he's playing next).

[Desmond Tiny]

I think I will do that you guys helped a lot.

[Desmond Tiny]

Also the player asked to be started away from the other players for role-playing. Also one of the people chasing him is his brother, so he isn't totally disliked.

[Pika...]

Well...[Expletive]

First off, I'm pretty sure that killing someone due to being angry about your group leaving without you is evil. Enough so to either cause an alignment shift or almost cause one.

Agreed.

Even as a newer DM I know that unless you are an experienced DM you should not let evil PCs in a game. Hence why I state in my houserules that if your PC turns evil, or I judge your PC has shifted alignment toward evil, I will take it as an NPC from that point on.

Trust me, one evil PC (or someone saying they are CN but are actually playing CE) in a non-evil group can, and usually does cause problems.

[Temet Nosce]

Agreed.

Even as a newer DM I know that unless you are an experienced DM you should not let evil PCs in a game. Hence why I state in my houserules that if your PC turns evil, or I judge your PC has shifted alignment toward evil, I will take it as an NPC from that point on.

Trust me, one evil PC (or someone saying they are CN but are actually playing CE) in a non-evil group can, and usually does cause problems.

That's less a matter of DM experience, and more a matter of PC experience. A competent and well played evil character has actually a relatively minimal chance of causing problems. The problem is that many people play evil in such a manner that it's entirely incompatible with working with a good or even a neutral party.

Further, the issue isn't really with evil but with their alignment diverging from the parties. If most of your group is evil, it's actually not an issue (although players can still cause problems - the alignment itself is unlikely to). The relevant point is that everyone needs to have an IC reason to cooperate in a given party, particularly in the case of characters which have strong motivations to act in a certain way that might cause trouble.

[Seonor]

This is what I got:

Talk with the players. Decide as a group what happens next:

1. The three of them are attacked and they have to work together (as mentioned above). This is prabably the fastest option, but it depends on weather the other players can roleplay it.

2. You take over the druid as a NPC. The former player rolls up a new character or if he still wants to play a druid uses his old one with some minor adjustments. The reason the new character joins the party is that he was sent by a council of druids who noticed that one of their own used his powers for evil to capture the druid.
Meanwhile the druid freed his companion (and some other animals) and now you have a exciting miniboss with some minions, the party can test their teamwork before they have to fight the real enemys and the inner-party conflict is averted (this can be important if your players can't handle it good).

3. The cheap way out: The druid got captured and what the other characters saw was staged to hinder the fight against the mindflayers. They free him, clear his name and all is well.


But the most important part, I think imho is to talk to your players, especially since you are a new group.



Edit: Ninjad. What the others said.

[taltamir]

why is everyone giving in game solutions?
what I see is a player problem here...

1. Player A believed they ABANDONED him because he was
which he believed because he was not the most popular person in the group
2. Player A kills a commoner in front of the others "because he is neutral".
3. Party role plays their alignment... by ganging up on another player instead of smoothing things out (acting out said dislike?)...

At many points PLAYERS should have stepped out and said something about how this is basically inter party fighting. Everyone must participate in making a story.

You first need to resolve player - player tension.
Then explain to them what alignment means...
Then fix the campaign. The last is the easiest part... they catch up with him and kill him... only to find out it is a dopple ganger. The real one never killed the villager. The villager was really an evil spy for X. Or any number of other "solutions" (heck you can just do a "do over").

[Paulus]

hmm. Giving them the choice to work together in their first game ever when it is apparent such things have failed would see folly to try and promote. Instead, take choice away from them. and I don't mean in a railroad sort of way. Have the Ithy squid attack, with a RIOT of mind slaves, ALL doing unarmed nonlethal damage. Your goal is to knock them ALL out Remove ALL gear. And put them ALL, ALL THREE, in the same cell, the same predicament. so they are forced to see that they must band together to fight a common enemy.

This first saddles them all with the same sin, killing common people. If they choose to fight back, leathal, against the mind controlled people they will be seen as murderers, because the Ithy squid was unseen for all of it, they will be just as guilty as the druid. And making it so they fought each other led to the Ithy being able to pool his forces and attack. Now, they must work together to get free, and doing so form a grudging respect and bond of victim-ship. How? Have the Ithy squid kill the Druid's animal companion.
Death is now a very real part of the equation and they must now find a way to break out and stop the threat, more than likely, it will require getting past some guards and back to town, where a disbelieving populace will be mistrusting- especially with the Druid's callous killing and the Ranger's seemingly unproved slaughter of so many during the riot, especially if you made it clear they were all unarmed. and dealing non-lethal damage.

This will make their actions have solid consequences, to avoid the mistakes of killing innocents. Rub it in further by having it made apparent, even if they do save the town, that their actions left many fatherless, sonless, motherless, etc- guilt trip extremo!

But anyway. Giving the party a common enemy, plight, and goal is the surest way to bring them together. Making it so their actions are also relative to GRAVE consequences will reinforce the fact that this is D&D and not some video game, the NPC's WILL remember you and react to you if you do something like that. The world around you lives, breathes, and reacts. bring them together. Remind them of their resolve. Then let them save the day and earn forgiveness.

Have fun! don't give up!

[EndlessWrath]

Ah, someone like myself.

My first d&d campaign I had to DM. I started with 10 players. Most had not played d&d before, the rest had done some crazy games.

I encountered a similar problem. First off..here's a few things to keep in mind.

Usually, try to start first campaigns with everyone's alignment being Good. Evil is harder to deal with when your new. Trust me, warlock stealing from churches of heironeous successfully and continuously...as out of game a cleric and paladin of that god knew about it. it causes tension, causes competition, and all in all just not good for the party teamwork.

2nd. Try to keep the party together. Thats a good rule of thumb. Sometimes people have to separate...but when they do you give more attention to one person(s) and none to the other person(s). this also causes problems. Bored players are worse then evil ones 90% of the time.

3rd: Mindflayers starting out is a heavy deal! Kudos. Level 1 druid killed town commoner? I guess i understand that. What's the law doing about it? What's the town doing about it?

okay. now to your problem.

You need to have a sit down chat with your players. all of them. Be frank, and honest and get to the point. Establish that Player versus player is not a good thing in d&d. ever. Establish you don't want the campaign going this way. and establish that You're the DM. You don't have control of the characters. But You don't want this to turn nasty. You're the referee. You're the rules. D&D rule 0 = The DM is always right. Why? because its your game. The game belongs to you and the players, not just the players. You control the rules of this game. Don't afraid to talk out the issue with the players out of game.if one player isn't liked very much, get him more involved and less headbutting with other players.

You need to establish to them that this is a problem, that there is a problem, and your not going to deal with it. You want the game to continue..even if you have to start over or pull a deus ex machina. Deities and unavoidably powerful NPCs usually grab the players attention. Don't Railroad them anymore than you HAVE to...because its not a railroad..its still a game. If the campaign doesn't go with the mindflayers right now, thats okay...as long as its going. Bottom line, this isn't taking your campaign anywhere. You need to fix that. pulling a deus ex machina or a dm purple lightning bolt, or throwing everyone back on the tracks can only work if you settle the real world issue though. You need to stop the players at the table from fighting. if not...well.. the campaign isn't worth playing and you should start a new one.

[FoE]

This sounds less of a D&D problem and more like an RL problem, ie. the other members of the group don't like this particular player and have decided early on to get rid of him. In which case, there's very little you could have done.

It sounds like you need to halt the campaign and talk this **** out. It also sounds like that one player might have to leave the group.

But even if that's not the case, you need to reboot the campaign with clear instructions that PVP killing is not allowed.

[bosssmiley]

First post ever!

Seriously, my campaign got messed up horribly.

This is how it is supposed to go: My players meet in a tavern to hunt mind flayers. One player tracks them down and asks to join them. they attack the thralls controlled by the mind flayers and stop the ilithids master plan.

This is how it went: The players met in the tavern. One player failed to track them down. He got the misleading information that they had already left without him( which he believed because he was not the most popular person in the group). He killed an innocent person out of anger( he is neutral). The rest of the party witnessed it and decided to attack him. Both rangers in the party hit him, knocking him unconcious. They sell his animal companion( he is a druid) and send him to jail. the rangers who think he is dangerous decide to guard the jail themselves. He attempted to escape and now the rangers are trying to kill him.

Also this is my first time DMing or even playing D&D (same with the other players).

Silly Des'! You forgot the first rule of DMing:


No plan ever survived contact with the players.

You went and gave the players free will in whether or not they'd play the prepared content, didn't you? And, inevitably, they went and stuck a spike in your plans.

The meaningful content of a campaign doesn't start in the tavern; it starts at the first adventure location. Your best bet is to drop the PCs into it in media res (in this case a couple of chambers into the dungeon will do - just far enough in that it's less trouble to play the game than to jump the fence), then let them fill in the story of how they met later.

[Gamerlord]

Have the thralls and Illithids unleash a mass attack on the city, even a newbie should know to retreat in the face of a superior foe, have them get chased into the woods, send in enough foes so that they can only win if they all work together.

If they refuse to work together, let them all get overwhelmed and transformed into thralls.

[Lord Loss]

First post ever!

Seriously, my campaign got messed up horribly.

This is how it is supposed to go: My players meet in a tavern to hunt mind flayers. One player tracks them down and asks to join them. they attack the thralls controlled by the mind flayers and stop the ilithids master plan.

This is how it went: The players met in the tavern. One player failed to track them down. He got the misleading information that they had already left without him( which he believed because he was not the most popular person in the group). He killed an innocent person out of anger( he is neutral). The rest of the party witnessed it and decided to attack him. Both rangers in the party hit him, knocking him unconcious. They sell his animal companion( he is a druid) and send him to jail. the rangers who think he is dangerous decide to guard the jail themselves. He attempted to escape and now the rangers are trying to kill him.

Also this is my first time DMing or even playing D and D(same with the other players).

First things First, Let me congratulate you on your name. Cookies to you!!.

Second of all you let the players take control of the situation. A DM is supposed to allow the PCs to impact the environement, not create it . As mentioned before, there really isn't that much point starting in a tavern. My first adventure started on a street in the middle of a Zombie-infested town. You could have put them in Illithid territory.

Second off, I'm starting an Illithid campaign myself, and, although this isn't really part of your Question, I'll give you the quick advice of GET RID OF MIND BLAST!!! It is not fun for players, because they sit out for quite a while, relegated to the background by their inability to act.

Now that that's done,