Arena Tournament, Round 71: Liquid Orc vs. Lance

[ArenaManager]

Arena Tournament, Round 71: Liquid Orc vs. Lance

Map:
http://i194.photobucket.com/albums/z123/TheChilliGod/Giantitp/Arena1i.gif

XP Award: 300xp
GP Award: 300gp

Liquid Orc (http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=149789) - Ladorak
Lance (http://www.coyotecode.net/profiler/view.php?id=7210) - HCL


All Combatants, please roll initiative and declare any final purchases.

[HCL]

[roll0]

Going to need to think about purchases for a bit.

[Ladorak]

Think away, no purchases but reserve the right blah blah blah

Init: [roll0]

[HCL]

Scroll of Light of Lunia x2 -50 gp
Scroll of Entropic Shield -25 gp
Locked Spiked Gauntlets - 13 gp
2x sack, one of them filled with 40 pounds of dirt

Does being at a medium load/medium armor decrease your fly speed?

Assuming you aren't making any reactionary purchases, ill go ahead and prepare my spells and start, if you do I might revise it.

Spells:
Entropic Shield (Domain), Faith Healing, Obscuring Mist (cast at +1 CL racial)

CMW X3

Actions: Start in B11 with Scroll of Lol in left hand, Longspear locked into right gauntlet

Swift: Activate Knowledge Devotion
[roll0] +1 to all attack and damage rolls if result 15 or lower, +2 if 16 or higher

Standard: Use scroll of lol
Free: Drop scroll and wield Longspear in 2 hands

Move: To F12

End turn, stat block coming shortly

[Sallera]

Can't fly if you're carrying more than a light load.

[HCL]

Stats:
Stats Block:
Lance
7/7 HP
AC 13, 9, 13 (+4 Chain shirt, -1 Dex)
Fort +4, Ref -4, Will +4
Luck Domain Power Remaining 1/1
Turn Attempts Remaining Undead 3/3
Air Devotion Uses Remaining (+1 AC, 50% Deflection of ranged weapons)
Animal Devotion Uses Remaining 1/1 (+2 Strength OR Overland Flight, duration 1 min)
Law Devotion Uses Remaining 1/1 (+3 Attack OR AC, can switch between effects as swift action, Duration 1 min)
Knowledge Devotion Uses Remaining 0/1 (+1 Attack/Damage on Knowledge Checks up to DC 15, +2 at 16+, Duration Permanent)
Spells Prepared: Faith Healing, Entropic SHield, Obscuring Mist, CMW x3
Buffs Active: Light of Lunia 100 turns, Knowledge Devotion +1 permanent


Can't fly if you're carrying more than a light load.

We both have overland flight as spell like abilities, which lets you fly with a medium or heavy load, it just doesn't say if it decreases the fly speed.

[HCL]

Oh, alsoGoing to make a listen check
[roll0]

[Sallera]

Ah, right, devotion wings are overland. In that case, I give you
you can fly at a speed of 40 feet (30 feet if wearing medium or heavy armor, or if carrying a medium or heavy load) from the Overland Flight spell description.

[HCL]

Ah, right, devotion wings are overland. In that case, I give you from the Overland Flight spell description.

Thanks for that.

Hold on, I'm an idiot and prepared a Domain spell from a domain I don't have. Fixed now, proceed.

[Ladorak]

Gonna buy half a dozen javelins, nothing else.

Liquid, turn 1

Starting holding javelin, shield. With Soulmeld. Proceed to V-7

Ready action: Throw javelin as soon as LoS is established


Stats:

@V-7
HP: 15
AC: 18

[HCL]

I am pretty sure we don't have LOS so I will proceed

Lance Round 2
Partial Move to F8

Nevermind, not done need LOS first

[madtinker]

need clarification
HCLyou must specify which spell you wish to cast in a readied action.

[HCL]

need clarification
HCLyou must specify which spell you wish to cast in a readied action.

Really? Then how come other people make vague ready actions like "Move if the opponent makes line of sight"?

Actually I think I would like LOS before I ready the action

[madtinker]

@HCLI don't know, but that is precedent and has been ruled on several times

LoS established as HCL's guy enters F8. The Ladorak's guy is in V7, and his readied action is triggered.

[HCL]

V7 is not a valid square for him to be in (assuming he is not flying), it would take 25 feet of movement for him to get there from Y10

Lance is glowing and holding his longspear. He has cover from the pillar in G8. What is Liquid orc holding?

[Ladorak]

Indeed, the fault is mine, not tinker's. Liquid should be in V-8. LoS is still established, readied action still goes off.

Javelin:
-4 due to range
Attack: [roll0]
Damage: [roll1]

Carry on

[Ladorak]

Well, I didn't really want to debate this but since it's come up... By my reading of the cover rules (I pick a corner of my square and a corner of yours and trace the line) Lance does not have cover from G-8. Unless you've activated Law or Air devotion or cast Entropy shield that's game.

I suspect you'll want to argue the point so I'm gonna call a ref now and hopefully save a little time

[vollmond]

Actually, Ladorak, I had the same misconception for a while. One corner of your square must be able to see all corners of his square for him to not have cover. I don't believe any corner of V-8 can see the bottom-right corner of F-8.

Source: SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/combat/combatModifiers.htm#cover)

You're welcome to wait for a non-init ref to confirm, but that's the reasoning I was given a few days ago, and it reads true.

[HCL]

Yes, you have to have perfect line of sight to all four corners of the opponents square for them not to have cover. I think I actually have double cover right here which would be +8 AC (though it misses at +4 AC anyways).

Anyway, finish my move action to
F8, hiding and peeking around corner
Hide: [roll0]
Spot: [roll1]

Swift: Activate Air Devotion
Standard: Cast Entropic Shield

End turn

[Ladorak]

I won't bother waiting, you're quite right.


To determine whether your target has cover from your ranged attack, choose a corner of your square. If any line from this corner to anycorner of the target’s square passes through...

That'll teach me to read a little closer. Well then, Liquid misses by 1. Carry on

Edit: I'm assuming you moved south to break LoS? Turn will be made under that assumption.

Liquid turn 2

Move to T-4, drawing javelin for free.
Ready action: Throw if Lances ends turn with LoS established
Edit: OR Move directly away if he comes within 15

End turn

Stats:

@T-4
HP: 15
AC: 18

[HCL]

Don't be grumpy, I was the one who was dumb enough to go straight around the corner without making hide/spot checks or activating my feats

close call

[Ladorak]

Oh, Liquid was holding a javelin (Obviously) and a shield

[Tanaric]

LoS established. Liquid Orc is in T-4, Lance is in F-7.

Liquid may revise his turn from this point if desired.

[Ladorak]

Thanks.

No, my action stands, your turn.

[HCL]

Since you did not tell me that I saw him ready an action, I assume he just moved and ended his turn.

Turn 3:
Swift: Activate a feat
Animal Devotion
Run to A11, 40 feet above ground.

End turn.

[Ladorak]

40 feet above ground 0? Isn't that a move of 105 feet? Average flying moving upward at half speed.

[HCL]

Sorry, a Run action not a double move.

[Ladorak]

Thought so, F-7 to A-11 isn't a straight line though. I assume you meant A-12?

[HCL]

I wasn't in F7 I was in F8, and it is a very straight line. It might not look straight if you try to look at it from the grid perspective.

[Ladorak]

Ref said you were in F-7. Ah well, these things happen.

Liquid turn 3

Double move south, breaking LoS at V-8

Ending turn at U-11

Stats:

@U-11
HP: 15
AC: 18

[HCL]

Turn 4:

Swift: Activate Law Devotion, to Defense
Run to O10, going to height of 50 feet

End turn

We don't have LOS yet so continue

[Ladorak]

Wait, hang on. We're gonna need a rewind here. There's no way you could have made your turn 3.

Average maneuverability requires 5 foot flying level between upward (Or downward) movements. F-8 to A-11 level is 30 feet. You can't be more than 15 feet up.

[Tanaric]

Lance:You stated in post #19 that you were ending your movement in F-7. Can you explain how you got to F-8 between then and when the LoS check was given?

[Sallera]

:smallconfused:

He's using a run action, thus the movement has to be in a straight line. Straight line from F7 at 0 to A11 at +40 is 50ft, taking 100ft of movement out of the available 160. I don't see the problem.

[Tanaric]

By the by, straight lines just mean no turns involved, not 45 degree angles.

I think it was Kyeudo that said it best when he said "This is D&D. Sometimes lines aren't as straight as they ought to be."

[HCL]

I was in F8 (actually it might have been better phrased as F9) hiding and peeking around the corner as far as I remember. Might have posted it wrong, but I don't think it matters.


I see what he is saying, I don't have enough forward movement to get up that high, forgot about the pythagorean theorem there.

Turn 3 should be: Single move to B9 20 feet above ground, second move to G9 on top of pillar

if this does not change your turn 3, my turn 4 still stands

Also I don't think that Warblades are proficient with Javelins. They are proficient with simple & martial melee weapons and melee weapons that can be used as thrown, not ranged weapons that can be used as melee.

[Ladorak]

True about the javelins. Damn, I'll have to swap them out for shortspears next match.

Liquid turn 3

Swift: Activate a feat
Animal devotion, flying

Liquid sprouts some rather pretty wings and uses a Run action to H-9, 20 feet above sea level (Lava level?) provoking an AoO at I-9

End turn

Stats:

HP: 15
AC: 18
Animal devotion 10/10

[HCL]

I'll take that Aoo, are you still wielding a javelin or do you have your sword out? In any case I will probably Lol you too.

Disarm attempt when you are in I9 against your shield [roll0], if this works your weapon is now in the lava. If your roll is higher, I reserve the right to use my luck reroll on this. Got my modifier wrong I think it should be a 19.

[HCL]

Round 4 revised:

Swift: Use a featLaw Devotion to attack

Expend Light of Lunia charges, attacks vs touch AC
[roll0]
[roll1]

Five foot step to the northwestwest (G8)
Fall to the ground as a free action, taking no damage due to racial. (assuming that using Lol does not provoke an Aoo), skip the readied action

[HCL]

You have a touch AC of 11 as far as I can tell so:

Damage[roll0]
Damage[roll1]

If knowledge devotion does not apply to this (it says attack and damage rolls, not specifying melee weapons or anything) decrease the results by 1

End turn.

[Tanaric]

Heavy Steel Shields are not light weapons.

[HCL]

Heavy Steel Shields are not light weapons.

Ah sorry, that is true, its a one handed weapon.

If you are wielding a javelin I disarm your shield (or you don't have a weapon and you are just wielding your shield), if you are wielding your longsword I disarm that.

[Ladorak]

Ok...

Firstly +9 on disarm. Explain how, it should be +8 as far as I can tell. I am holding a javelin so that'll be against my shield.

Disarm opposed: [roll0]

As for Lol provoking AoO, I don't know, we'll have to see what a ref says before I take my turn/ Make an AoO

[Ladorak]

Ref question answered by Sallera on page 46 of waiting room. AoO provoked.

Attacking with Javelin (-4 mod)

Attack: [roll0]
Damage: [roll1]

before I take my turn I should point out at end of move you dropped to ground level, you have to move at least 10 in any turn of flight or you drop to the ground. Is this ok with you?

[hustlertwo]

Since the opposed disarm is higher, I'd say that renders that question moot.

[HCL]

OK here is what happens I guess. I take the attack of opportunity to disarm your shield, fail. You get an opposed check to try to disarm me.

[roll0] (I have a buff active that gives me +1 to attack rolls, weilding a 2 handed weapon gives me +4, locked gauntlets +10, strength +4). EDIT: You won't beat that :D

After that I guess I provoke the Aoo when I lol you (I guess). Your Aoo fails, you soak 8 damage.

Actually since you already took your Aoo for the round I will just move to A8, 35 feet in the air (15 feet above my last position). Sorry about all the edits I am trying to make a smart decision.

Your turn.

[Ladorak]

Liquid turn 4

Charge action, ending in B-9 +35 feet.

Take your AoO, we'll go from there.

[HCL]

Ah, right forgot you could charge me there. Probably should have stuck with the five foot step.

[roll0] (reminder, you have -2 to AC)
[roll1]

[HCL]

Came up two short, lets reroll that attack so I can at least get one more hit on you if nothing else. You didnt tell me that you were wielding your shield as a weapon so I assume that you are not in which case I reroll (if you were coming at me with the shield I would skip it)
[roll0]

You soak 11, so you are at 15-8-11=-4

Need one more good one!

[Ladorak]

attack with javelin

Attack: [roll0]
Damage: [roll1]

end turn

stats:

[spoiler]HP: -4/15 (Soulmeld)
AC: 18 (16 charging)
animal devotion 9/10[spoiler]

[Ladorak]

Hot damn :smallsmile: Not that it matters. Good game sir

Crit confirm: [roll0]
damage: [roll1]

[HCL]

Due to the absurd wording of devotion feats, i'm not dead yet. Also, how did you get +6 damage on your javelin damage? and ofc why does it say "d6+6" instead of 1d6+6 (it makes me worry)

come on air devotion (I am betting high, miss on a 2)
[roll0]

[HCL]

Good game. I am going to have to drop my gimped domain :P, wondering if I should stick with Air devotion or get Rageclaws.

[Ladorak]

There's nothing wrong with Lance really, he's optimised quite well. However he's really only designed to do one thing (Relative immunity to ranged attacks while making flying reach attacks) however it has been my observation that in the arena generalisation works better than specialisation. Rageclaws or Bloodtalons are good bolt ons to any build but if you remove air devotion it might be an idea to rethink his stat line as well. Just my two cents.

[HCL]

I am thinking that I will drop that useless air domain for Celerity, that will kick me up to 50' move, then Expeditious retreat will get me to 80. Or I could just swap the domain for Air devotion and have them both.

Not sure if the whole flying dive attack for double damage is going to work though. It might on a more open map. Maybe I should just be human and keep my feet on the ground.

[Psionic Dog]

High Ref PsiDog

By virtue of having the pointier sharp object Liquid Orc appears to win.