PDA

View Full Version : Beguiler Build help



Ilriyn
2009-11-09, 06:50 PM
I'm creating a 9th level, grey elf, beguiler. I need help on choosing my advanced learnings, choosing my feats, and any other helpful advice will be appreciated.

Assume that I am only allowed core.

Toliudar
2009-11-09, 07:30 PM
Any sense of what you'd like your beguiler to focus on? Are they the primary trapspringer? Focused on hiding/misdirection/illusion or charm/social interaction?

Ilriyn
2009-11-09, 07:32 PM
More of a sneaky trapspringer. But with some bluffing and (Maybe) diplomacy.

quiet1mi
2009-11-10, 01:47 AM
I have found Ray of Stupidity to be invaluable as there is no save... only an amount of HP = to the In score and the ray dealing 1d4+1 to it...

To avoid starting another thread... I play a level 11 beguiler...
Shadow Evocation or Shadow Conjuration (the OP will have to deal with problem later on...)

gorfnab
2009-11-10, 02:23 AM
I too am playing a Beguiler in a campaign, a Beguiler Beguiler actually. Power Word Pain (RD) is an awesome choice for your 1st advanced learning (For Core though that leaves you with choosing Magic Aura or Ventriloquism, since you already known all the other Core level 1 Illusion or Enchantment spells). I suggest taking a one level dip into something like Mindbender or Shadow Adept at level 6 before your advanced learning at Beguiler level 7 so you can, as previously posted, pick up Shadow Conjuration (however you mentioned you're only allowed core.... Rogue 1/ Beguiler 6/ Loremaster 1/ Beguiler X?) More info for Beguiler spell choices can be found here: New Beguiler's Handbook (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=2322.0).

quiet1mi
2009-11-10, 02:40 AM
I recommend Magic Aura as it defeats most initial screenings with basic divination... IE: Detect Magic... after all you could look like a peasant but why would you have all these powerful auras of evocation around your favorite (Backscratcher)

Thurbane
2009-11-10, 08:24 PM
Ray of Dizziness is a solid choice for advanced learning. It can bring a melee monster to it's knees with a single ranged touch. The beguiler in my group has used it to excellent effect so far.

deuxhero
2009-11-10, 08:30 PM
How do you have a Beguiler with only core? Do you mean core +whatever book it was from (PHB2 I think) or "Beguiler is the onlything I can use from outside core"? Is web published (like swiftblade) stuff/exert/previews allowed?

Ilriyn
2009-11-11, 09:04 AM
I got special exemption to play the beguiler. I might be able to use excerpts from other sources.

Burley
2009-11-11, 09:33 AM
There is a spell in the SpC called Distract Assailant. Awesome spell, for your 1st level choice. Makes the target flat-footed. Great if there is a rogue or ninja in the group. Also good for cloaked casting.
My problem is similar to yours. I took a PrC and took Shadow Conjuration as my second Advanced Learning. But, with spells from core... Well, I'm left with only Sepia Snake Sigil as a useful spell...

Edit: Where is Ray of Stupidity? SpC? I need to get a wand of that...

Leewei
2009-11-11, 09:50 AM
Presumably, you'll get the PHB2 spells listed for Beguiler. There aren't that many Enchantment/Illusion spells in the PHB2 that aren't already on the Beguiler spell list.

Some thoughts regarding the PHB + PHB2 Beguiler:

Full Beguiler build through level 20 is nice for the capstone, but it is unlikely you'll ever actually reach 20 to enjoy it. This means a PrC such as Loremaster or Archmage could be used. Spell Focus (Enchantment) and Spell Focus (Illusion) are nice feaets to pick up, regardless.

Your first Advanced Learning options are pretty limited. Ventriloquism, magic mouth, and Nystul's magic aura are about it. Between the two, Nystul's seems a better choice -- ghost sound duplicates the other two fairly well.

I'd suggest heroism as your second Advanced Learning pick, assuming your party has no Bard. This buff is a nice 10 minutes per level which gives the target +2 to pretty much everything.

After this, Symbol of sleep allows you to craft your own portable magic traps in advance. As an elf, you're immune to this, of course. Your next Advanced Learning pick could be either shades or greater shadow evocation.

Darrin
2009-11-11, 11:03 AM
I got special exemption to play the beguiler. I might be able to use excerpts from other sources.

You may have to push for access to other sources. Let's see if there's anything decent on the WotC website...

Here's one you might want to pick up at Beguiler 2nd:

Fengut (http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/fw/20030706a), from Far Corners of the World, Mire and Mud: Spells of the Wetlands. It's mind-affecting, but it's a Fort save rather than Will, causes nausea for 1d4+1 rounds. So it's an ideal save-or-lose spell for any enemy spellcasters.

At Beguiler 7th, Tasha's Hideous Laughter is available in Core, but you've already got Deep Slumber and plenty of other Will save-or-blah spells. I can't imagine you'd need Illusory Script. Heroism is a decent buff, probably your best pick in Core.

Outside of Core, I'd really push for Deceptive Facade from Complete Mage, mostly because it covers a rather large blind spot in the Core illusion spells. Namely, there's no easy way to put a glamer on an object without going through the whole shebang of a Mirage Arcana. If you can get your DM to agree, then you might want to pick up Nystul's Magic Aura at 2nd, so that you can put a Deceptive Facade on an object and then make it look nonmagical to Detect Magic.

At Beguiler 11th, the big decision here is do you take Shadow Conjuration or Shadow Evocation. While the latter goes up to 4th level spells, you're going to get a lot more utility (summons/battlefield control) on top of a little direct damage if you go with Conjuration. In Core, this gives you access to:

Grease, party rogue = happy.
Mount, summon trapfinder that lasts hours.
Unseen Servant, turn simple standard/full actions into move or free actions.
Acid Arrow, not quite an orb but direct damage
Summon Swarm, automatic damage and immune to some creatures
Web, automatic entangle and flammable
Phantom Steed, *240' fly speed!*
Stinking Cloud, awesome save-or-lose spell.

I was going to say, if your DM allows PHBII (he allowed your beguiler spells after all), you could add some more, but unfortunately the only Conjuration (summon) or Conjuration (creation) in that book is the Luminous Assassin spells. However, those are standard action summons, unlike most full-round summons. You might be able to convince him that Cloud of Knives or Melf's Unicorn Arrow are Conjuration (creation)... actually, I'm pretty puzzled why they aren't listed as such.

Hmm. Tough call... Evocation gets you better damage, wall of fire/ice, fire shield, and resilient sphere. Better pickings in PHBII, as well... a whole fistful of Bigby's Inappropriate Touching spells, Kelgore's Fire Bolt, Prismatic Mist, and some other goodies. If you're going to take Greater Shadow Conjuration at 15th, or your DM will give you access to PHBII evocations, then take Shadow Evocation here at 11th.

Beguiler 15th, Greater Shadow Conjuration.

Beguiler 19th = Shades. Done.

Burley
2009-11-11, 11:47 AM
I was going to say, if your DM allows PHBII (he allowed your beguiler spells after all), you could add some more, but unfortunately the only Conjuration (summon) or Conjuration (creation) in that book is the Luminous Assassin spells. However, those are standard action summons, unlike most full-round summons. You might be able to convince him that Cloud of Knives or Melf's Unicorn Arrow are Conjuration (creation)... actually, I'm pretty puzzled why they aren't listed as such.



I know, right? Lesser Luminous Assassin is neat, but... I'm not sure it's worth a 4th level slot.
I'm currently trying to work with my DM to get some Spell Compendium stuff for Shadow Conjuration. Bands of Steel... Awesome.

quiet1mi
2009-11-11, 03:28 PM
What spells of note do you get from shadow conjuration from the complete series, spell compendium, PHB 2 ?