Monk Feats

[Rasman]

I'm being allowed, in a Pathfinder Game, to reroll my feats. It's being RPed that I've become a prodigy and can "rewrite" my past ways. So as a level 6 Human Monk, and with the use of any WotC book, what feats would you take?

[BobVosh]

If you could change your stats as well, Kung-Fu genius = awesome.

[Curmudgeon]

Awesome? It's pretty ho-hum if you ask me. "You use your Intelligence modifier rather than Wisdom modifier for all monk special abilities that normally rely on Wisdom." The thing is, there's exactly one special ability that relies on Wisdom: their AC bonus. And how many that rely on Intelligence? Zero. So the Monk spends a feat and shifts the ability for one class feature. If they also shift stats correspondingly they get more skill points, but a weaker Will save.

It doesn't strike me as worth the feat.

[BobVosh]

I like skills. A lot. The monks have a great list but can't use another stat to point buy for. Rolling...well if you are lucky.

[Teron]

Awesome? It's pretty ho-hum if you ask me. "You use your Intelligence modifier rather than Wisdom modifier for all monk special abilities that normally rely on Wisdom." The thing is, there's exactly one special ability that relies on Wisdom: their AC bonus. And how many that rely on Intelligence? Zero. So the Monk spends a feat and shifts the ability for one class feature. If they also shift stats correspondingly they get more skill points, but a weaker Will save.

It doesn't strike me as worth the feat.
The quivering palm save DC is also Wis-based, as is Stunning Fist's (which counts as a monk special ability with a loose but sensible interpretation of the phrase). Regardless, I agree it's not worth a feat if your build only gets skill points out of it. Furthermore, Carmendine Monk is strictly better if your DM waives or adapts the setting specific fluff requirement.

[Curmudgeon]

The quivering palm save DC is also Wis-based
OK, I admit I missed that (stupid "Wis" abbreviation for QP when they spelled out "Wisdom" for AC Bonus). But have you ever seen Quivering Palm work? I haven't in all the time since 3.0 D&D came out in 2000.

as is Stunning Fist's (which counts as a monk special ability with a loose but sensible interpretation of the phrase).
No, that's not even "loose". Stunning Fist is a general feat, and its behavior has nothing to do with Monk special abilities or even Monk levels. Kung Fu Genius can't help here.

[Djibriel]

Actually, your amount of Stunning Fists does depend on Monk levels. Also, as a Monk, you get it seven levels before any other character could. Though the system doesn't force you to take it, as a DM I would definately recognize it as a Monk ability.

In addition, the similair Carmendine Monk feat specifically meantions Int instead of Wis to AC, Stunning Fist and Quivering Palm.

[Curmudgeon]

Actually, your amount of Stunning Fists does depend on Monk levels. The frequency of use isn't what we're talking about here; it's the relevant ability.

In addition, the similair Carmendine Monk feat specifically meantions Int instead of Wis to AC, Stunning Fist and Quivering Palm.
Specific trumps general for only one particular part of the rules, but has no impact on the rules in general. Your mention of how another feat changes the rules is akin to stating that every day it's the birthday of some man -- and then complaining when you don't get a birthday cake every day. :smallamused:

[Telonius]

It does get more useful when you combine it with three levels of Swashbuckler to get Intelligence to damage (versus creatures not immune to critical hits) and Weapon Finesse to get Dex to attack. That way you can ignore both Wis and Str. You're down to 3 ability scores (Int, Dex, and Con) you need to worry about, instead of 4 or 5 (Str, Dex, Con, Wis, and Int if you want to use skill points on UMD).

[Kaiyanwang]

OK, I admit I missed that (stupid "Wis" abbreviation for QP when they spelled out "Wisdom" for AC Bonus). But have you ever seen Quivering Palm work? I haven't in all the time since 3.0 D&D came out in 2000.

In my past EL campaign, the monk one-shotted an advanced 5-headed red wyrm (heavy party support of course). natural "1" happens!

[AtwasAwamps]

Fiery Ki feat chain!

It's not good at all BUT YOU COULD BE RYU.

[dsmiles]

In my past EL campaign, the monk one-shotted an advanced 5-headed red wyrm (heavy party support of course). natural "1" happens!


I, too, have had a monk ruin my day. A halfling monk destroyed an aboleth with QP. Rolled a nat 1 on the save.

[Starbuck_II]

I'm being allowed, in a Pathfinder Game, to reroll my feats. It's being RPed that I've become a prodigy and can "rewrite" my past ways. So as a level 6 Human Monk, and with the use of any WotC book, what feats would you take?

Saphire Fist (in Magic of Incarnum) so you can get a bonus Stunning Fist DC and extra damage to your attacks equal to essentia. The feat gives 1 so that isn't bad.

[Person_Man]

Weakening Touch: Burn a Stun use to impose a -6 Str penalty. No Save. Great for boss battles, especially when combined with Wounding weapons.

Pharaoh's Fist: When you use Stunning Fist, enemies adjacent to the target are also effected.

Snap Kick: Extra unarmed attack whenever you attack.

Sand Dancer: Whenever you move at least 10 feet, Tumble, and successfully attack an enemy while moving on loose dirt/sand/etc, that enemy must Save or be Blinded for 1 round. There are a ton of ways (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103358) to get free movement and/or Pounce. You can also cheaply purchase a bottle of endless sand, turn it on, and tie it to your belt to cover the loose sand requirement.

Scorpion's Grapple: Free Grapple check whenever you hit enemy. This essentially doubles the damage of your first hit (since you deal damage when you hit, and again when you successfully Grapple). Also, you can make a Grapple check per turn for each attack that you get. (This was always true, and it's clarified explicitly in the Rules Compendium). Grapple checks are much easier then attack rolls.

[Rasman]

If you could change your stats as well, Kung-Fu genius = awesome.

I looked at Kung-fu Genius, but it really doesn't do anything for me since my stats are better on the opposite end. I'm sitting on...

16 Str
18 Dex
11 Con (yes...I know it's low)
11 Int
17 Wis
10 Cha

...at the moment.


Fiery Ki feat chain!

It's not good at all BUT YOU COULD BE RYU.

I remember seeing that somewhere, but I wasn't really worried about my Ki Pool since it's so early on in levels atm. I'll have to go take a look for it later.


Saphire Fist (in Magic of Incarnum) so you can get a bonus Stunning Fist DC and extra damage to your attacks equal to essentia. The feat gives 1 so that isn't bad.

That may be one of the only books that I don't have, tbh. Downloading a pdf as I type, actually.

It looks like I'd have to take feats in order to be able to use Essentia, so this one might have to be a pass I'm afraid.


Weakening Touch: Burn a Stun use to impose a -6 Str penalty. No Save. Great for boss battles, especially when combined with Wounding weapons.

Pharaoh's Fist: When you use Stunning Fist, enemies adjacent to the target are also effected.

Snap Kick: Extra unarmed attack whenever you attack.

Sand Dancer: Whenever you move at least 10 feet, Tumble, and successfully attack an enemy while moving on loose dirt/sand/etc, that enemy must Save or be Blinded for 1 round. There are a ton of ways (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103358) to get free movement and/or Pounce. You can also cheaply purchase a bottle of endless sand, turn it on, and tie it to your belt to cover the loose sand requirement.

Scorpion's Grapple: Free Grapple check whenever you hit enemy. This essentially doubles the damage of your first hit (since you deal damage when you hit, and again when you successfully Grapple). Also, you can make a Grapple check per turn for each attack that you get. (This was always true, and it's clarified explicitly in the Rules Compendium). Grapple checks are much easier then attack rolls.

I recognize Pharoh's Fist and some of the others from SandStorm, where's Snap Kick from?

I'm looking over SandStorm again and it looks pretty amazing for a monk, feat wise. Rattlesnake Strike, while it's feat heavy, seems pretty nice since it can deal up to 6 Con Damage on top of my normal damage. Any thoughts on it?

[Boci]

I recognize Pharoh's Fist and some of the others from SandStorm, where's Snap Kick from?

Tome of Battle. Extra unarmed attack, all attacks at -2.

[Myrmex]

Awesome? It's pretty ho-hum if you ask me. "You use your Intelligence modifier rather than Wisdom modifier for all monk special abilities that normally rely on Wisdom." The thing is, there's exactly one special ability that relies on Wisdom: their AC bonus. And how many that rely on Intelligence? Zero. So the Monk spends a feat and shifts the ability for one class feature. If they also shift stats correspondingly they get more skill points, but a weaker Will save.

It doesn't strike me as worth the feat.

It mixes well with 3 levels of Swashbuckler or some Factotum.

[Kylarra]

Kung Fu Genious/Carmendine monk really only shine if you're not planning on staying in monk too long and you're going into some other class where INT is a prime stat.

[AtwasAwamps]

I remember seeing that somewhere, but I wasn't really worried about my Ki Pool since it's so early on in levels atm. I'll have to go take a look for it later.


It's in PHBII. You can take the whole chain as alternatives to default monk feats, starting at level 2, as long as you take stunning fist at level one.

It trades stunning fist uses for some entertaining, though not really powerful, stuff.

Basically:

Fiery Ki (sub in for monk feats at monk 2): One use of stunning fist = Swift action, all unarmed attacks you make this turn deal an extra 1d6 fire damage.

Fiery Ki Retribution (or something similar...sub in at monk 4 if you took fiery ki at monk 2, I think): Swift action, anyone who attacks you takes 1d6 fire damage, one use of stunning fist.

Ki Blast (Monk...6? If you took the previous Fiery Ki abilities): Two uses of stunning fist, create a 3d6 fiery ball of Ki with a 30 yard range that you can throw as a standard action. I think it's a move action to create.

Basically, it's a fun chain of feats that actually isn't that good but IS super fun-appearing...and leaves the rest of your feats wide open, too. Even more fun is if you go monk/fighter...you need BAB +8 and a minimum wis score to use these, but they can also be taken as fighter bonus feats. So basically you can mess around and not have a single one of your "real" feats taken up by these if you dip into monk early and switch over to fighter.

It's not really an effective build, but you could yell hadoken a lot.

[Rasman]

It's in PHBII. You can take the whole chain as alternatives to default monk feats, starting at level 2, as long as you take stunning fist at level one.

It trades stunning fist uses for some entertaining, though not really powerful, stuff.

Basically:

Fiery Ki (sub in for monk feats at monk 2): One use of stunning fist = Swift action, all unarmed attacks you make this turn deal an extra 1d6 fire damage.

Fiery Ki Retribution (or something similar...sub in at monk 4 if you took fiery ki at monk 2, I think): Swift action, anyone who attacks you takes 1d6 fire damage, one use of stunning fist.

Ki Blast (Monk...6? If you took the previous Fiery Ki abilities): Two uses of stunning fist, create a 3d6 fiery ball of Ki with a 30 yard range that you can throw as a standard action. I think it's a move action to create.

Basically, it's a fun chain of feats that actually isn't that good but IS super fun-appearing...and leaves the rest of your feats wide open, too. Even more fun is if you go monk/fighter...you need BAB +8 and a minimum wis score to use these, but they can also be taken as fighter bonus feats. So basically you can mess around and not have a single one of your "real" feats taken up by these if you dip into monk early and switch over to fighter.

It's not really an effective build, but you could yell hadoken a lot.

ah...lol...that would actually be REALLY useful right now considering our campaign "frost giant hate fire...it burns us...fire bad...no burn Gurd again, Gurd be good" lol

[Blackfang108]

It looks like I'd have to take feats in order to be able to use Essentia, so this one might have to be a pass I'm afraid.

Nope. You don't.

You just need essentia to put in, and, hey, the feat gives you one.

(bonus essentia gives you another one.)

[Person_Man]

I'm looking over SandStorm again and it looks pretty amazing for a monk, feat wise. Rattlesnake Strike, while it's feat heavy, seems pretty nice since it can deal up to 6 Con Damage on top of my normal damage. Any thoughts on it?

It's a Stunning Fist use to imbue your next hit with Poison that deals 1d3 Con damage (Fort Save prevents), and another 1d3 a minute later. Keep in mind that tons of enemies are immune to Poison, and that combat will be over before the secondary damage kicks in. So at best, it's 1 or 2 extra points of damage per enemy hit die. I personally wouldn't bother with it.

I would also skip the various Ki feat abilities. 1d6ish damage for a Stunning Fist use is a joke. There are much better feats out there.

Since you get Combat Reflexes and Improved Trip for free, you might also want to consider Knock-Down and proficiency with a good exotic weapon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88633) like a Spiked Chain or Pincer Staff.

You might also want Quickdraw, just so that you always get a full attack (when you run out of enemies within reach + 5 ft, you can use enchanted shuriken as part of a Flurry to finish your attacks).

[Temotei]

You might also want Quickdraw, just so that you always get a full attack (when you run out of enemies within reach + 5 ft, you can use enchanted shuriken as part of a Flurry to finish your attacks).

Agreed. Quick Draw is fun for this sort of thing, and it's actually quite good. An overlooked feat sometimes...hm.

[Rasman]

It's a Stunning Fist use to imbue your next hit with Poison that deals 1d3 Con damage (Fort Save prevents), and another 1d3 a minute later. Keep in mind that tons of enemies are immune to Poison, and that combat will be over before the secondary damage kicks in. So at best, it's 1 or 2 extra points of damage per enemy hit die. I personally wouldn't bother with it.

I would also skip the various Ki feat abilities. 1d6ish damage for a Stunning Fist use is a joke. There are much better feats out there.

Since you get Combat Reflexes and Improved Trip for free, you might also want to consider Knock-Down and proficiency with a good exotic weapon (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=88633) like a Spiked Chain or Pincer Staff.

You might also want Quickdraw, just so that you always get a full attack (when you run out of enemies within reach + 5 ft, you can use enchanted shuriken as part of a Flurry to finish your attacks).

ok, so Rattlesnake Strike only sounds awesome, got cha. Quickdraw I techincally already have with a set of bracers an NPC gnome gave me for my Shuriken, which are enchanted...it's like you know...but I can already draw however many I can Flurry with.

Pincer Staff actually sounds kind of cool, and very monkish imo, so I'll probably take a look at it for after this next battle.

You also mentioned Sand Dancer in a previous post. Blinded Foes are blind, which would REALLY help my survivability when I'm soloing something to save our rogue that likes to stand in front of things, it's also nice flavor for my RP since my monk is, basically, Egyptian by birth. But even with your post, I'm not sure how I'd get a Free Movement. Would it be considered a part of Spring Attack, since I have to move at least 10 feet in and out for it?

[Dimers]

So as a level 6 Human Monk, and with the use of any WotC book, what feats would you take?

Any WotC book? Like UA? I'm curious whether you've taken one of the monk ACFs in there -- that could affect the advice you get in terms of either mechanics or flavor.

[Rasman]

Any WotC book? Like UA? I'm curious whether you've taken one of the monk ACFs in there -- that could affect the advice you get in terms of either mechanics or flavor.

nah, no ACFs, but this is Pathfinder based, I'm just allowed to take feats from any book I want

Our DM is very much a "play what you want to play, but be willing to deal with the consiquences" type of DM

I also had a thought, I'm carrying a 10' Pole, just because I can, and if I took the Battle Jump feat from Unapproachable East, could I use it to "Pole Vault" myself into a battle jump for extra height?

One more thought, do I have to be a cleric to take the Travel Domain as a feat?

[Rasman]

Scorpion's Grapple: Free Grapple check whenever you hit enemy. This essentially doubles the damage of your first hit (since you deal damage when you hit, and again when you successfully Grapple). Also, you can make a Grapple check per turn for each attack that you get. (This was always true, and it's clarified explicitly in the Rules Compendium). Grapple checks are much easier then attack rolls.

I was rereading this and was wondering if I read this right. Does this mean that when i flurry of blows, that each hit gets a free grapple AND that each grapple gets a damage roll as well? or is it just the first hit that gets an extra grapple damage roll?