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Anonanimal
2009-11-17, 03:45 AM
I'm working on making a setting, and was wondering what you folks thought. Now, this isn't all fluff--in fact, I'm much more interested in an accurate assessment of the crunch--but I'll put it in there for gits and shiggles.

Fluff (Quickly Written, Un-Edited)
In the beginning, there was only one Goddess, known simply as the Great Mother. After shaping the Earth from the Void, she created three servants to watch over what she had created—the trees, the rivers, the lakes, et cetera. These servants were Visadhara, Raaksaka, and Khandate, the Angels of Truth, Faith, and Protection. The Great Mother, however, was unsatisfied with the world she had created. It was beautiful, but it was empty, for there was no life yet on it. And so she went into labor and birthed the Gods, though in the process, died of childbirth. As soon as the Gods came into being, they took control over what the Three Angels were meant to keep watch over. They created the five races (Humans, Halflings, Elves, Orcs, and Dwarves), and populated the Earth with them. They took control over the seas and the forests and the skies, of the Sun and the Moon. Although the Great Mother was dead, her children were turning what she had dreamed into reality. Jealous of the Gods, the Angels became corrupted into the Devils of Deceit, Defiance, and Destruction, and launched a war against the Gods, twisting their creations and turning them into terrible monsters. The war was short but brutal, and the Gods knew as they were slain one by one that they were fighting a losing battle—they had to have some special plan to deal with the Devils. After all but three of the Gods were dead, Crepusculos, the Sacred Twilight unleashed the dimension the Gods had been working on (and which he’d labored on in secret between the day and the night, unable to be harmed by the Devils). The Devil Lords were thrown into Hell, forced to deal with the corruption they had created in the world. The dead Gods remain alive as they are immortal, but are powerless beyond the ability to grant power to the faithful (or have it stolen by demons). Even now, the Devil Lords send their demonic minions to steal power from the Gods and create more demons, until the Devils have enough power to release themselves from Hell and take control of the world they feel they deserve.

In addition, there is heresy that there were old divinities before the Gods we know now. These divinities are long dead and forgotten, but still exist in an empty pocket dimension, devoid of all senses, because of their inherent immortality. There are those who practice what is called pact magic, people who summon these entities and bind them into their bodies, trading in another chance to experience the world for a fraction of their power. These people are called binders.

The world itself is in progress, but the idea of it is that it's a rough world to traverse. Trade is very important, and the classic adventuring party usually has the dangerous job of transporting goods from one place to another. The world is covered in wilderness, which is filled with the dangerous monsters the Three Devils left behind from the God War. I have some basic ideas for places I want to make, but not an enormous amount.

1. In the desert, I want there to be a man who is trying to ascend to Godhood. His name is Vincent, and he tried to seek enlightenment through agony by having his followers crucify him (X-Cross, not T-Cross) and leave him to bake in the desert sun, only bringing him water every few days to keep him going. After about a month and a half, he reached the enlightenment he craved, emaciated, with his skin irreparably damage by the sun and desert vultures, his eyes only able to see through a connection to the divine. He himself is nearly unable to move anything but his head and his gaze, but merely being in his presence makes the skin tingle, having him look at you is described as "Epiphanical Agony," a pain that is so intense it brings you to your knees, and he can kill by making eye contact. His growing group of followers is beginning to conquer the desert tribes and constructing a holy empire.

2. Up north, there is an Orcish tribe called the Rivac, who have an ancestral connection with the Smilodons that romp around the region. They ride into battle on ones that have been magically enlarged, and they are generally highly revered.

And I have a couple of ideas beyond that, including all the Gods, but not a lot of time to go and type up the details.

The Crunch (the important bit in this instance!)
So, here are the 8 base classes I'll be using for the setting, and the following changes.

Binder: Unchanged, except for fluff--need to flesh out the First Ones, the Gods before the Gods, who will be a little more eldritch horror than the Great Mother's second batch of children.

Cleric: d6 HD, 1/2 BAB (though Divine Power still exists, now granting 3/4 BAB to the caster), a good Will save, 4 + Int Skills (I'm taking a page from Baron Crom's generic class system--as I will in other sections--and letting each character choose whatever skills they wish), light armor proficiency and 1 simple weapon proficiency. They can cast 3 spells per level per day (once again, thanks Baron Crom), and can only learn 2 spells per level. They only learn up to 8th level spells (2nd level spells at 3rd, 3rd at 6th, 4th at 8th, 5th at 11th, 6th at 13th, 7th at 16th, 8th at 18th), but can choose from any full divine caster's spell list (not counting domains). They get Turn Undead as your standard cleric, plus a free Devotion feat at 1st, 9th, and 17th level. They can use turn attempts to recharge spell slots, expending one turn attempt for each spell level. At 20th level, they gain three 9th level spell slot (but no 9th level spells). Some divine spells, like create food and water, are banned, simply because they make survival in the wilderness too easy.

Druid: d8 HD, 3/4 BAB, good Fort and Reflex saves, 4 + Int Skills, light armor proficiency, proficient with all simple weapons. They have the Shapeshift, Multishift, and eventual Double Shift abilities created by Baron Crom (found here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=94616)).

Fighter: Not many changes here, surprisingly, but the ones that were made were significant. As standard, but bonus fighter feats can be any feat ('cause a lot of Fighter feats are a little meh). Also, the Barbarian, Knight, Samurai, and many other melee classes have been incorporated into the Fighter, by making their class features fighter-only feats (that require particular amounts of fighter levels). These include the Precision ability created by Baron Crom (same link as above), split into parts for Sword and Board, One-Handed Weapons, and Archery.

Monk: d8 HD, 3/4 BAB, all Good saves, 4 + Int Skills, no proficiencies except for unarmed strike. Gets Wisdom to attack and damage at varying early levels, as well as Wisdom to AC. He gets Crom's Flurry of Blows, Martial Arts, Diamond Body, and Perfect Self (same link as above).

Paladin: As normal, except spellcasting, Aura of Good, detect evil, remove disease, Aura of Courage, and Divine Health are gone. The Paladin uses Crom's Lay on Hands rules (you know the drill), and can channel points of Lay on Hands into Smites (which is no longer Smite Evil, just Smite). Essentially, for each point of Lay on Hands divested, you do one extra holy damage (that isn't subject to DR or anything--this means that Smites with Lay on Hands invested are immune to DR). Inspire Courage is added, granting +1 at 3rd, +2 at 7th, +3 at 11th, +4 at 15th, and +5 at 19th. Certain Inspire Courage feats are altered to work without Bardic Music, allowing Dragonfire Inspiration and such things. Your special mount isn't summoned and dismissed willy-nilly, you have to actually take care of it. Your mount can be a creature large enough to support your weight with a CR equal to or less than your character level -3.

Rogue: Unchanged.

Wizard: Only keeps the name Wizard, and even that is malleable--in game, Wizards are also called Sorcerers, Warlocks, Magi, etc. d6 HD, 1/2 BAB (which increases to 3/4, but while using Eldritch Blast), good Will save, 2 + Int skills, can use Int or Cha as casting stat (chosen at 1st, and cannot be changed from there), no armor proficiencies, 1 simple weapon proficiency. You learn a new invocation at 1st, 2nd, 4th, 6th, 7th, 9th, 11th, 12th, 14th, 16th, 17th, and 19th level. Lesser invocations are unlocked at 6th, Greater at 11th, and Dark at 16th (at standard). DR 5/magic at 5th, DR 10/magic and silver at 13th. Gains Crom's Spell Mastery at 20th as a capstone.

So my main question is whether or not these base classes are relatively balanced. There won't be many magic items around, either, though I don't doubt I'll add additional masterwork enhancement (that might mimic the effects of pluses and keen and such).

dsmiles
2009-11-17, 05:08 AM
For your "First Ones," check out anything cthulhu-related if you want to go eldritch horror. I like the orcs on smilodons concept, I use something like it in my campaign world (my elven cavalry rides dire wolves, but my orcs ride horses like everyone else).

Tehnar
2009-11-17, 07:05 AM
From the balance side, I think it mostly depends on your players (their playstyle). I think the most important thing is to make sure that every class has something to do, and no one class overshadows the others.

General world creating tips:
I would suggest that aside from the globe spanning creation myth you start out small. Create a country/kingdom (or a small area of a country) where you will place your first adventure. Do this in as much detail as you can.

Then try to come up with a vague idea of surrounding countries. Think of what kind of relations they have with your original country; this will give you more ideas to flesh them out.

From a mechanical side, aside from rebalancing issues I would develop certain fluff left vague in the PHB. What is the paladin code, are paladins tied to a church (religion), do druids have a organization, etc. Try to flesh out your world by developing political entities. A good way to go about this is to create your prestige classes or create organizations for current ones.

Anonanimal
2009-11-17, 10:50 AM
@dsmiles: I was definitely thinking Lovecraft for the Gods-before-the-Gods, although perhaps a little more human. It'll be the seasoning rather than the meat.

@Tehnar: This isn't the first world I've created, and it has a particular purpose in the end, so I went with the big creation myth. This isn't just for a campaign--I'm making a full setting to amuse myself. Thus, big thing going on at the beginning. This pixie's been around the bend (and I've been lurking the forum for a looooong time).

As for Paladin code, I'm cutting falling. The Gods grant a modicum of their power, but aren't strong enough to take it away after they give it. Thus, most Paladins are tied to the Church, but if you're faithful enough and dedicated to becoming a paladin, you might become one whether or not you've a church connection. I definitely do want to start working on Paladin orders.

As for druids, they're essentially clerics of nature Gods with different crunch. I'll post all the Gods later today, and describe creation a little more in detail.

That said, focusing on a single country or small area of that country, then zooming out, or jumping to a neighboring kingdom based on its relation to the last, is probably a good way to figure things out. Fluff, however, is not my biggest concern--I know I can work out fluff, I just want to make sure the crunch is appropriate.

Optimystik
2009-11-17, 11:22 AM
Fighter: Not many changes here, surprisingly, but the ones that were made were significant. As standard, but bonus fighter feats can be any feat ('cause a lot of Fighter feats are a little meh).

Any feat? I can dip into fighter and still grab metamagic feats?

Ormagoden
2009-11-17, 11:29 AM
Just stating the obvious but this should get moved to homebrew no?

Anonanimal
2009-11-17, 12:14 PM
Just stating the obvious but this should get moved to homebrew no?

Not sure. It's its own world, but any actual homebrewed stuff is just adjustments--whenever I see threads going, "Are my homebrew rules OK for game balance," it goes in this forum, as it's not really anything new.

@Optimystik: I suppose so, yes. You're trading some free feats in because you lose caster levels. I might change this later to be any combat-related feat, up to DM discretion, but I kind of prefer the simplicity of any old feat. Makes the fighter worth it.

Anonanimal
2009-11-25, 01:46 PM
Alright, made some more changes. The fluff of the world is completely worked out now, but not what I want to go into right now. Assuming these are the only base classes available, is balance roughly achieved?

Binder: See original post.
Cleric: See original post.
Druid: See original post.
Fighter: See original post.
Monk: See original post.
Paladin: Paladin: Uses Recharge Magic variant for spellcasting, Crom’s Lay on Hands, can channel Lay on Hands into extra smite damage (+1 damage for each point expended), remove Aura of Good, Detect Evil, Aura of Courage, Divine Health, and Remove Disease. Add Inspire Courage (+1 at 3rd, +2 at 7th, +3 at 11th, +4 at 15th, +5 at 19th). Special Mount is always around, and functions as any other animal. You can have a Special Mount with a CR equal to your CR -3. Good Fort and Will saves. The paladin gains 1 spell known per level, starting at 4th level—he doesn’t have the versatility of the full paladin list.
Rogue: Still unchanged.
Scout: Unchanged.
Wizard: See original post.