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Grifthin
2009-11-20, 12:44 AM
If you have the combat reflexes, 16 dex and the Spiked chain weapon you get 4 attacks of opportunity when your opponents provokes.

Here's the question - can that be 4 attacks agaisnt a single target or must it be 1 attack against 1 target up to 4 times ?

Tackyhillbillu
2009-11-20, 12:45 AM
Combat Reflexes doesn't work that way.

It increase the number of AOO's you can take in a single round. You only get one per provoker, but you can attack multiple provokers.

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-11-20, 12:46 AM
The descriptive text for Combat Reflexes and Attacks of Opportunity state that you will only get one attack of opportunity per target.

BobVosh
2009-11-20, 12:46 AM
4 separate targets. 1 AoO per target per turn.

I know I got ninjaed :(

Tavar
2009-11-20, 01:15 AM
Well, technically if the same character does multiple actions that provoke then you can take multiple attacks against that same target.

Rainbownaga
2009-11-20, 02:34 AM
Like Tavar said, enemies only prevoke once for each type of action, so if a wizard tries to move and then casts after you tripped them, that's two free hits :smallsmile:

herrhauptmann
2009-11-20, 02:39 AM
But someone who runs straight past you, only one AOO for him.

Mongoose87
2009-11-20, 03:42 AM
There are, however, some feats in one dragon or another that allow you 2 and then 3 attacks per AoO. They're on Crystalkeep, if you need them.

Killer Angel
2009-11-20, 03:51 AM
And remember that you can make AoO against chargin opponents.
You've got reach, and regardless of the action, if the target moves out of a threatened square, it provokes an AoO.

herrhauptmann
2009-11-20, 03:58 AM
And remember that you can make AoO against chargin opponents.
You've got reach, and regardless of the action, if the target moves out of a threatened square, it provokes an AoO.

Throw in 'knockdown' and that skill trick that lets you stand as a free or swift action. :) You get charged, you hit with an AOO, knock the charger down on his butt. If you fail, he can try to trip you in return, but so what? You got the ability to freely stand up without wasting your move or taking an AOO.

Duke of URL
2009-11-20, 08:34 AM
Combat Reflexes doesn't work that way.

It increase the number of AOO's you can take in a single round. You only get one per provoker, but you can attack multiple provokers.

Minor correction, you get a maximum of 1 AoO per provoking act. It is quite possible for an opponent to make multiple provoking actions, each of which allows the use of an AoO

ghashxx
2009-11-20, 10:27 AM
So with 4 AoOs available, if someone goes running past you then you will get 3 AoOs against them. I just finished making an AoO build with the spiked chain, and it's fantastic this way. If you're really looking for some other nice AoO feats, then take a look at Robilar's Gambit (PH2) giving you an AoO each time anyone attacks you (though they do get a +4 to hit you). Deft Opportunist (CAdv) gives you a +4 on all of your AoOs.

There are some really nasty ones in the dragon magazines if those are allowed like getting an AoO if someone you threaten attacks someone that isn't you, and improved combat reflexes allowing you to use two of your AoOs on one provocation at a -5 to the second attack.

There's a feat in expanded psionics handbook called stand still that makes it so when you hit someone with an AoO for movement then you can forgo doing actual damage, they make a reflex save of DC 10+damage you would have dealt. If they fail then not only do they not move, but all of their movement is used up.

John Campbell
2009-11-20, 11:12 AM
So with 4 AoOs available, if someone goes running past you then you will get 3 AoOs against them.

NO.

Combat Reflexes and Additional Attacks of Opportunity: If you have the Combat Reflexes feat you can add your Dexterity modifier to the number of attacks of opportunity you can make in a round. This feat does not let you make more than one attack for a given opportunity, but if the same opponent provokes two attacks of opportunity from you, you could make two separate attacks of opportunity (since each one represents a different opportunity). Moving out of more than one square threatened by the same opponent in the same round doesn't count as more than one opportunity for that opponent. All these attacks are at your full normal attack bonus.

You only ever get one AoO for any opponent moving out of a threatened square in a turn, no matter how many threatened squares he moves out of. If he does something besides move, you can make more AoOs, but you only get the one from his movement.

Well, unless you've got Improved Combat Reflexes or something, but I've never seen asking a DM if Dragon Magazine material was allowed garner any reaction other than derisive laughter.

Cicciograna
2009-11-20, 11:30 AM
I always were dubious on why this half ogre (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0216.html) makes 2 AoO...

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-11-20, 11:30 AM
His grasp on rules and on tactics was a little off, it seems.

Cicciograna
2009-11-20, 11:32 AM
His grasp on rules and on tactics was a little off, it seems.

Whew! For a moment I thought that my grasp on rules was a little off!

Pharaoh's Fist
2009-11-20, 11:37 AM
Huh. That spiked chain seems reasonably designed.

Cieyrin
2009-11-20, 01:39 PM
Huh. That spiked chain seems reasonably designed.

It's okay but I'd still prefer a meteor hammer design for my spiked chains. I don't think he should be swinging it like a flail when he needs to launch it to actually use its reach. On the other hand, there are limits to stick figure art, so I'll let it slide.

Eldariel
2009-11-20, 01:55 PM
Whew! For a moment I thought that my grasp on rules was a little off!

Or he had Hold the Line or Improved Combat Reflexes.

Person_Man
2009-11-20, 02:29 PM
Combat Reflexes is very useful, but in practice I find that if you have a combo (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7044115) geared towards using it, it generally adds about 1 extra attack per round. Sometimes you might get 2 or 3, and some rounds you get none (especially towards the end of combat, when the mooks are all dead and you're fighting a big/strong boss, or trying to kill a caster with layers of magical protection). I've found that just adding extra attacks (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7066595) via other means tends to be more efficient.

KillianHawkeye
2009-11-20, 06:57 PM
Or he had Hold the Line or Improved Combat Reflexes.

He doesn't.

He specifically mentions that he had to take 5 feats in order to create his little combo. Those feats must be: Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack, Combat Reflexes, and Exotic Weapon Proficiency (spiked chain).

Bogardan_Mage
2009-11-21, 06:33 AM
He doesn't.

He specifically mentions that he had to take 5 feats in order to create his little combo. Those feats must be: Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack, Combat Reflexes, and Exotic Weapon Proficiency (spiked chain).
He also says he has to be a Half-Ogre. Can someone explain that to me? What is it about Half-Ogres that makes them necessary?

Sliver
2009-11-21, 06:49 AM
I think it was to get 15ft reach. That is why he claimed to get 2 AOOs. Due to having to move twice in his threatened area. He couldn't claim he gets 2 AOOs otherwise, but he still managed to roll high on his bluff.

Ormur
2009-11-21, 09:39 AM
I hoped to challenge my party by pitting them against a spiked chain paladin of tyranny/hexblade with 15ft reach. That should have worked except the unarmed VoP swordsage won initiative, succeeded on his defense check against the AoP and scored a critical hit reducing him to -1 hit points in the first turn of battle. :smallannoyed:

Although admittedly that PC was overdue for some awesomeness.

Curmudgeon
2009-11-21, 10:09 AM
He specifically mentions that he had to take 5 feats in order to create his little combo. Those feats must be: Dodge, Mobility, Spring Attack, Combat Reflexes, and Exotic Weapon Proficiency (spiked chain).
You're assuming things here. You don't have to take Mobility as a feat, because you can instead take it as an armor enhancement. Now you can add Hold the Line to the list of feats taken.

KillianHawkeye
2009-11-21, 11:21 AM
You're assuming things here. You don't have to take Mobility as a feat, because you can instead take it as an armor enhancement. Now you can add Hold the Line to the list of feats taken.

Armor enhancement? I had no idea, but even if that is true, the half-ogre in question doesn't appear to be wearing armor. Anyway, my main assumption is actually that the half-ogre wanted to be proficient with his weapon, which despite being a really good idea isn't strictly necessary.

I suppose we won't really know unless the Giant feels like telling us, but it seems like a pretty common assumption on the OOTS board that the half-ogre wasn't getting the AoO rules quite right.

Eldariel
2009-11-21, 11:40 AM
He may also be not-proficient and either eat up the -4 or use something that grants proficiency (Skilled?).

Fluffles
2009-11-21, 11:43 AM
Nobody has considered that he has more than 5 feats? I mean, he said it took 5 feats to make the build, but that does not mean that he doesn't have more.

Oh, AND MOAR TARRASQUE VS. FIGHTER!!!!!

Boci
2009-11-21, 12:15 PM
I think it was to get 15ft reach. That is why he claimed to get 2 AOOs. Due to having to move twice in his threatened area. He couldn't claim he gets 2 AOOs otherwise, but he still managed to roll high on his bluff.

Wouldn't you get 20ft reach, since reach weapon double your natural reach?

Huh. That spiked chain seems reasonably designed.

So I'm not the only one who thinks that the picture of the spiked chain in the PH looks like a double weapon?

Sliver
2009-11-21, 12:25 PM
Wouldn't you get 20ft reach, since reach weapon double your natural reach?

Well I just quoted the half-ogre on that.. But he might have gotten that wrong as well... He is a lying scum that tricked Roy due to his bad grades at school! You should all study hard so people won't trick you to believe they can shoot you twice on your turn just because you try to move.

Zovc
2009-11-21, 12:32 PM
Huh. That spiked chain seems reasonably designed.

...but it only has spikes on one end. :O

Looks more like this "spinning sword" I keep hearing about.

Curmudgeon
2009-11-21, 12:40 PM
Armor enhancement? I had no idea, but even if that is true, the half-ogre in question doesn't appear to be wearing armor.
Magic Item Compendium, page 13. And these are stick figures, so good luck identifying anything they're wearing. Remember when Elan mentioned not knowing he had boots for the first 100 strips? :smallsmile:

The half-ogre could be wearing a mithral breastplate with Mobility enhancement under his tunic. At least, that would be my choice for such a character.

KillianHawkeye
2009-11-21, 07:33 PM
Eh, I choose to believe the simplest explanation, which is that the half-ogre also got poor grades in combat school. Half-ogres aren't known for their Int scores, and Roy doesn't know enough to correct him on it. Makes more sense to me, and it's like a super secret inside joke for those of us who know the rules.

But if you wanna spend time figuring out a bunch of ways it could have happened, go ahead. Like I said, unless the Giant comes out and reveals the half-ogre's build to us, we'll never really know what happened. So I'll leave it up to each person's individual interpretation and say no more.