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Gilthans
2009-11-30, 10:13 AM
Putting aside Girard's epic illusions, I just had a thought:

Looking at the Order of the Scribble (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0276.html), Girard doesn't seem like the paladin lovin' fellow (chaotic good, pro'lly). Also, he's one of the first (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0277.html) to draw his weapons on Soon.

So what if Girard never trusted Soon with the real location of his gate?
The OOTS reportedly got their info from Shojo who got it from Soon (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0676.html), but Girard doesn't seem like he trusts Soon all too much. What if he gave him a fake location, thinking he might one day try to force his protection on the other gates, and the OOTS is actually waiting in the wrong place?

BRC
2009-11-30, 10:16 AM
Because you can't move the gates. The Order of the Scribble found the Gates together, the problem was they couldn't agree how to guard them, so each one took a gate and guarded it in the manner they saw most fit. However, because Soon was there when they originally found the Gate, he knew where it was.

Conuly
2009-11-30, 10:19 AM
So what if Girard never trusted Soon with the real location of his gate?

Didn't all the Scribblies find all the rifts to begin with, as a team? They only broke up after finding and sealing all the rifts. The gates are right where the rifts are, aren't they?

Morquard
2009-11-30, 10:19 AM
He might have known where it is but maybe he did not know the exact coordinates and Girad gave him the wrong ones then, once he had returned.

It is a possibility, but I doubt it.

BRC
2009-11-30, 10:24 AM
Girard clearly hid the Gate behind the 4th wall.

Girard put a spell on the Gate that alters any maps that get near it, so people just go past it.

Girard turned the gate into a Cactus. Elan just destroyed it.

Girard turned the gate into the MiTD

Girard hid the gate inside the 3.5 grapple rules

Fitzclowningham
2009-11-30, 10:32 AM
I posted a theory in the #691 strip thread, which about nobody saw, as the quick update (thanks, Rich!) killed it:


I'm pretty sure none of them is going to find the entrance. Not for a while, at least.

The whole thing is a red herring. One of the simplest ways for Girard to hide the location of his gate would be to cast illusions that shift the position of the sun and/or stars. Most people take the operation of the heavens so much for granted they'd never think to try to disbelieve them. So, imho, Roy's calculations have brought them to a spot that's miles away from the gate.

Since he started protecting his gate after the rest of the Scribble had seen it, their information on its location is most likely useless.

Silverraptor
2009-11-30, 10:38 AM
Your idea is a an interesting. It's certainly a possibility.

By the way BRC, nice speculating.:smallamused:

Optimystik
2009-11-30, 10:39 AM
Girard clearly hid the Gate behind the 4th wall.

Girard put a spell on the Gate that alters any maps that get near it, so people just go past it.

Girard turned the gate into a Cactus. Elan just destroyed it.

Girard turned the gate into the MiTD

Girard hid the gate inside the 3.5 grapple rules

Requesting a Blighter to burn down these epileptic trees! :smalltongue:

hewhosaysfish
2009-11-30, 10:59 AM
He might have known where it is but maybe he did not know the exact coordinates and Girad gave him the wrong ones then, once he had returned.

It is a possibility, but I doubt it.

Girard is referred to as "illusionist and tracker". Now whatever class or class-combo that may be referring to, it does imply that he was heavily invested in the Survival skill.... making him the natural choice in the Order of the Scribble to handle the desert navigation.
[Off topic]Does Roy have ranks in Survival? It's not a class skill for him but a Wis of 0 or better would put him ahead of Belkar and even a few cross-class ranks would put him above Durkon.[Off topic]

So it is actually plausible that Girard may have been the only one with an accurate idea of where the desert gate was.

factotum
2009-11-30, 11:04 AM
I posted a theory in the #691 strip thread, which about nobody saw, as the quick update (thanks, Rich!) killed it:


It's a nice theory, but it requires Girard to be capable of


casting an illusion miles wide, which furthermore is completely seamless at the edges (so you can't tell you've gone from "real sky" to "fake sky") and which also changes according to the time of day. I mean, the guy may be Epic, but that seems like a pretty big ask!

Alysar
2009-11-30, 11:04 AM
Girard clearly hid the Gate behind the 4th wall.

Can't be. The Order would be able to see it easily through the gaping hole.

Mystic Muse
2009-11-30, 11:12 AM
because he doesn't WANT it to be found.

If you're an epic level illusionist of some sort it's going to take a while to find anything you hid.

Fitzclowningham
2009-11-30, 11:14 AM
It's a nice theory, but it requires Girard to be capable of


casting an illusion miles wide, which furthermore is completely seamless at the edges (so you can't tell you've gone from "real sky" to "fake sky") and which also changes according to the time of day. I mean, the guy may be Epic, but that seems like a pretty big ask!


You make very good points, but I still think it's feasible:

As far as the miles-wide illusion goes, I can only reply "Epic", and hope it's enough. (Edit: see Cloister.) The shift wouldn't need to be much: even a half of a degree or so (depending on the size of the planet, distance from the "sun", etc.) could be enough to put them off by tens of miles. As for the transition, I picture it to be like a lens, where the distortion becomes more and more pronounced, the closer you get to the center.

I'm not saying it's what happened, only that it's possible.

Spiky
2009-11-30, 12:10 PM
From the standpoint of storytelling and drama, I doubt they are in the wrong spot. Or at least not by far. These theories would make the last 15-18 comics a complete waste of time that would essentially have to be redone, which doesn't seem to be Rich's style.

Järnblomma
2009-11-30, 12:40 PM
From the standpoint of storytelling and drama, I doubt they are in the wrong spot. Or at least not by far. These theories would make the last 15-18 comics a complete waste of time that would essentially have to be redone, which doesn't seem to be Rich's style.

Really? I find that completly in keeping with Rich's style (and in a good way I might add). I mean, the whole "Don't Split the Party" is essentially "waste" as it doesn't really affect the main storyline very much.

Besides, the "Oh Crap"-moment that would ensue from Roy (probably provoked by Elan) would be awsome to miss. :smallsmile:

derfenrirwolv
2009-11-30, 01:59 PM
Perhaps the sky is illusory and its throwing the sextant off?

ChrisFortyTwo
2009-11-30, 02:37 PM
From the standpoint of storytelling and drama, I doubt they are in the wrong spot. Or at least not by far. These theories would make the last 15-18 comics a complete waste of time that would essentially have to be redone, which doesn't seem to be Rich's style.

They wouldn't have to be redone, they simply were a story description of the effort by the Order to find the gate. I mean, if the Order can't find Girard or his gate, that's part of the story, too, not necessarily a waste.

Lamech
2009-11-30, 03:15 PM
An illusion on the stars and sky, a distortion over the whole area that gradually gets stronger and there off by a few dozen miles. Also if Girard never told the others the actual location of the gate it could very easily lied when they finally split; although I find the second unlikely as it would require him lying when he might get his soul obliterated and the location lost forever, and before they got mad at each other.

Skorj
2009-11-30, 04:09 PM
Girard hid the gate inside the 3.5 grapple rules

Woah! That would be sneaky. No one ever looks there.


Complex Analysis is hard, thats never happened before in one of my math classes.

It's all good fun until somebody loses an i.

The Dark Fiddler
2009-11-30, 04:14 PM
Perhaps the sky is illusory and its throwing the sextant off?

That sounds like a briliant plan to stay hidden!

I need to try that some time...

sihnfahl
2009-11-30, 04:14 PM
Perhaps the sky is illusory and its throwing the sextant off?
They could be in the right spot, but are so busy looking for the magical they don't pay attention to the mundane.

ericgrau
2009-11-30, 09:21 PM
My guess: Girard simply imported tuns of sand and used it to bury the stationary gate. No magic to detect or thwart. No entrance to find with search checks. Only way in is teleportation or passwall. That would explain why they haven't accidentally bumped into the concealed gate. That or some kind of illusion that foils even touch. Or one that creates a hallucination so OotS only thinks they're moving around and searching, when really they're comatose until they decide to leave. Then after they sleep 1 more night they wake up for real.

IMO the sextant thwarting idea is too obvious. It works specifically against the OotS' current means of finding it while most other enemies may not try such a thing. I mean, what if some random schmo walking around the real location happens to put up a detect magic and tags it by mistake?

Beren
2009-11-30, 10:30 PM
My guess: Girard simply imported tuns of sand and used it to bury the stationary gate.

Or it could have just been covered naturally by the blowing sands, without any magical interference. I don't think the process takes prohibitively long.

Lamech
2009-11-30, 10:37 PM
IMO the sextant thwarting idea is too obvious. It works specifically against the OotS' current means of finding it while most other enemies may not try such a thing. I mean, what if some random schmo walking around the real location happens to put up a detect magic and tags it by mistake?Disguising the only features around? I hate to say it, but that is a really good way to hide something. It wouldn't work on someone combing the desert, but if they have an idea were it is? They only have the stars to navigate by, so they use them and then they are looking in the wrong place. So yes, it won't be the only defense, but it is a rather good one.

Berserk Monk
2009-11-30, 10:40 PM
The Order of the Scribble went to each rift and sealed it with a Gate. It takes a Divine (Lirian) and Arcane (Dorukon) caster to create a Gate. Other members of the party knew where each location was so Soon probably did know where the Gate was.