View Full Version : S&S: A new game. Help and PEACH would be nice

2009-11-30, 07:52 PM

Earlier this year me and some friends had an idea for an interesting game. It started out as mere stories we thought of individually and started intertwine together. We started with D&D and that was fine for a few levels. However what we imagined was starting to push the system. Now normally we were fine with that but we deiced to tweak the rules and it eventually turned into a new system. The game is coming to an end, and we are planning on playing another campaign starting in 2010. However we wanted to get a published version because a lot of what we have is not written down but just memorized. We also want to fix some mechanic problems and get the rules out if others want to say. A lot of what we used were made complete from scratch and combined they form the core rules. (similar to the core in dnd). You will also notice a lot allusions, similarities and direct reference to dnd (3.5). This is because as noted above this started as a D&D game.

The Game: Saints and Sinners
The original campaign of SS, takes place in modern day earth, and that is meant to be the setting for all games. However you place the setting anywhere and any time you want. The original characters where in highschool but characters of all ages joined in.. It is about humans fighting the war of good and evil. However the game is not as black and white as it seems. Through out time certain humans make contact with devils and demons. Often called witches in the past and Satanist in the present neither title is true. Along with a variety of powers and developing super human abilities, Demonst can channel fiends in combat to gain great powers for a limited time. To combat them the Knight Templar wielding similar powers rose to power, channeling the power of angels. Eventually Demonst, unable to organize against the powerful orgianstation of Templars, was pushed underground. However throughout time people have channeled the power of the devil in desperate times, forever becoming demonst. These people however are not always bad but the Templars do not see this. Many blinded with piety, and holiness see Demonst as the only human enemy. In this day some Templars seeing the weakness of their comrades’ plot and scheam using the Holy power for bad while the innocent and possibly good and holy Demonst are hunted down. It is here where two highscool students, fans of Death metal, who go to a Holy private school become Demonst. Using their powers of evil they fight against the evil Demons and Demonst that threatens their area. However, their school is a major headquarters (in the region) to Knights Templar. As more kids (from other schools) and adults join the two students in their fight, the knights start to boost recruitment specifically in the region (the kids are located in), many friends quickly become foes. In the recruitment many charters are misjudged as kids who are fake when adults are around join. Using their new found positions they bully their way into greater power. This is a fight of good and evil, with twists and turn, corruption and salvation at every second. This is Saints and Sinners.
Note: There is a bit of anime influence.
The game goes from lv 1-lv 50. It could go higher but anything above 30 would be the equivalent to epic.


The game started as D&D and eventually became similar to a classless system and then this.

Scores (abilities in Dnd)
Power pwr (Str)
Coordination Crd: (hand eyes, similar to dex but a bit difference)
Endurance End (Con)
Agility (Agl): The other half of DEx, focus on leg power reaction and speeds.
Intelligent (INT): Books smart
Wisdom (WIS): Thinking, and not what you know and not book knowledge.
Charm (CHA)
Spirit (Sprt): Connection to other world it is one faiths and beliefs.

Charter Creation:
When you create a level one character all stats are at 15. You can decrease one to increase another at a one for one ratio with a minimum score of 10 in any. You also get 30 extra points to spend to increase your stats.

Combat Skills
Similar to BAB and saves. Combat skills are the basic offense and defense of fighting. When you start, all CSk’s are at zero. When you level up you get a bonus in each one based on your class. You have points (not sure how much and what determines the number). That you can put into a skill at a one on one basis. The maximum amount you can put into a skill is determined by your class at well (for each skill the max is = to the amount times level in that class+ amount times level of all other classes). The amount of points plus class bonus is called your plus in that skill. Each skill has a score modifier as well.
Melee fighting
Rang Fighting
UnArmed Fighting
Evasion (REF)
Blood (FORT)
Control ( see below): Control might not be a free Csk. You might only get a bonus with points, but you would get less of a limit. However with out certain feat(s) it might cost twice as much

Weapon Skills
Instead of weapon profiecency and feats like weapon focus, you get weapon points for your class. Each class gives so many and you can spend it on any weapon but some weapons would be cross class. A higher ranking (more points), gives advangte in combat with that weapon.

Talents are basically dnd 3.5 skills.

Sleights are feats. However they are more important sense class features are more general. At level one you get the normal amount a level plus 2. Every time you level up you can pick three sleights. You also get points (number determined by class). You can invest these points in Sleights you have to get a stronger benefit or use them to buy stronger version of Sleights.

Classes are pretty simple. You can multi class no penalty. Follow the layout (when I get it out) to see how to read a class. When you start out you choose Demonst or Templar. When you reach level three additional classes for both options become available. Also there are special classes called unique classes that are composed of only a couple levels and have perquisites. These are dnd prc’s.

Spells and Spell casting
Magic is a powerful source found through out the universe. Used by Angels and Demons alike, magic is a versatile substance.
Using magic.
To cast magic you must first prepare your slots. A character can know as many spells as possible (see below), and can cast as many times as mp allows. However you must choose which spells you can use on a given day. If you know or have access to 5 spells of a given level but only have 2 slots of that level you can only use two of them. However you can use these two spells as long as you have enough mp.
Learning Spells
Before you can prepare a spell you must “learn” it. A learned spell is one that you can prepared. You don’t neserely have to know but have access to it. For example if you carry around a spell book and have the appropriate sleight (Book Caster), you can prepare spells from your book. Some templars can also pray for spells.

Control/ Psionics.
Control along with psionics is the ability to manipulate space around you and the elements. Options are learned through sleights and you choose which options with a control Csk roll. You can also learn powers when you meet preqs.

Techs are all other special attack forms that do not fit in above. They are composed of a lot of physical attacks. They also have some spirit exclusive techs.

Channeling Spirits
is one of a characters most powerful traits. When you start out you have are a level one chanenleer with two Spirits. Usually when you level up your channel level increases by one, but some classes increase it by more and other by none. Also, while channel level, represents your ability to forge a connection each spirit have its own individual level that is your own skill with that Spirits. Each spirit gets a part of your exp when used. Also as you level up you gain bonus spirits and their level can be increased by class effects. Also leveling them up give more options and you can learn techs and other things by training a spirit.

Energy and points.
One of the last important topics is energy and points. Using speacail attacks takes energy coming from different pools
Hp: not energy but health points. Hp equals 30+end+class benfit (rolled like in dnd with hd)+end/lv
Mp: for magic, magical energy
Fp: for control/ psionic: focus points
SP: Spirit points for channeling spirits and other speacail abilites
TP/En: Tech points or energy general energy and physical energy, or energy that does not fit in above.

2009-11-30, 07:55 PM
Slieghts Page one

Book Caster
Req: Mgc 38+, Extra Spell Slot, Able to cast third level spells.
You can prepare spells from a spell book.

Improved Book Caster
Rrq: Book Caster
You get an extra slot of spell level you know. These slots must be filled with spells from a spell book and the book must be on you when you cast.

Improved Aim
You get +2 on Range Combat rolls.

Two Weapon Fighting Melee
Pre: Melee fighting 4 points and +8
You can make attacks with weapons in both hands. You make two set of attacks, one for right hand and one for left. Your second attack set takes a -3 on the attack check (in addition to the penalty of attacking with the weaker hand), and a -2 on damage (once again).
Normal: You can wield two weapons but only attack with one at a time.

Unexpected Strike [Invest]
Whenever you attack an opponent, and he can not properly defend himself because they did not expect it or overwhelm or the like you can deal an extra 1d6 points of damage + 1d6/5 points of invest. You can only apply the damage if you are within 15 ft of target

Sneaky Shot [Invest]
Req: Unexpected Strike (4 points invest), Range fighting 4 points invest and +10
You can apply you unexpected strike up 20 ft away. For every 10 points of invest increase the range by 5ft.
Normal: You can apply your strike up to 15 ft away.

Strong Fists
Req: Unarmed Fighting 2 points and +8
Your unarmed strike deals 1d4 damage
Normal: Unarmed strikes deal 1d2 damage.

Unarmed Strike [Invest]
Req: Unarmed Fighting 3 points and +10, Strong fists.
Your unarmed deals 1d6 damage +1d6 damage/5 points invested.


Req: Control (+10), any four other control sleights.
You can manipulate basic control powers. You can qualify for manipulate feats. You can learn certain powers and techs.
You can learn Ray technique by training.
Manipulate to Ray
Req: manipulate, Ray
You can manipulate the shape into a ray. To manipulate to the proper tech increase the dc of the current power by 15. To simply make a line take the number of current squares affected and half it. For every square above 10ft increase the dc by 5.
Element Fire
You can learn fire powers.
Element Water
You can learn water powers.
Element Wind
You can learn wind powers.
Element Earth
You can learn earth/terra powers.

2009-11-30, 08:01 PM
The Starting Templar or Demonst (first 20 levels)
O and I am not sure If I am going to format the classes into tables. I sorta like them looking like lists and it does not get to complicated

The Demonst/Templar
Hp: D8+4
Skills: All skills are +1, and have a max of +1/lv
Talents: ???????

1st : Chanel Spirit, 2 Spirits
2nd: Spell Casting
3rd: Multiple Paths
4th: New Spirit, bonus Sleight
5th Spirits +1 (all), bonus Sleight
6th Bonus Sleight
7th Bonus Sleight
8th Bonus Sleightx2
9th Spirits +1 (all)
10th New power, spell or tech
11th Bonus Sleight
12th Bonus Sleight
13th new spirit (lv5)
14th Bonus Sleightx2
15th New power, spell or tech
16th spirit +1 lv (all)
17th Bonus Sleight
18th Bonus Sleight
19th new Spirit (lv9)
20th Bonus Sleightx2


Spells (sx= spell level x, x is a level)
LV Benefit
2 spell slots+4 (lv0), spell slots+1(lv1), new spell(lv1)
3 spell slot +1(lv1)
4 spell slot+1 (lv1)
5 new spell (lv1)
6 spell slot +1(lv1)
7 new spell lv (lv2), spell slot+1(lv 1 and 2), new spell (lv1)

Spell slots +x (lvy): gain x amount of spell slots for spell level y. And means there are two that gets this benefit or means that you choose between or distrbute between the two options.
new spell level(x): can cast higher level spells
new spell (x): learn a new spell for lvx

2009-12-01, 03:29 PM
This looks fun. Personally, unless you are going for a very religious game, why don't you make angles and demons different orders of the same race (although in the bible demons are fallen angels). But whatever the case the Demonst (is it meant to be demonist?) should work not only with demons but with other supernatural beings as well. Although that might just be because the name reminds me of Bartimaeus. The idea sounds sound whatever the case.

2009-12-02, 08:47 PM
Thanks for your reply.
The idea of Angel v.s Demon is a very old story. The idea of being blinded by the light and that evil grows in man made establishments is also as old as dirt. That is where these ideas stemded from. Also when I refer to Angels and Demons they are vague terms. Angels could include (well???) while demons would include fiends goblins ghosts etc. Also I have a few other ideas as sources of “power”. They are primal and Alien. They are half way covered with the existing ones though.
Also here is the list of classes
(Basically the same as Demonst/Templar thing.)

Demon Restricted classes
(these base classes are restricted to demonst)
Demonic Brute (Possibly, but may be scrathed. High hp and pow/no magic)
Cultist (Similar to a Priest but has some skills towards leadership and corruption)

Angel Retricted classes
(these base classes are restricted to templar)
Priest/Priestess (Cleric like caster but less melee skills)

I also have a question. What ideas to you guys have for slieghts/feats
Also minor edit to front page. The edit states. The game goes from lv 1-lv 50. It could go higher but anything above 30 would be the equivalent to epic.

2009-12-02, 09:03 PM
The first of the Spirits. Fluff will be added but if you have ideas for fluff please tell them.

Reading an entry
Lv req: The required channerler level learn
Req: other preqes
Changes: The changes to ones appearance when channeling. Also includes the changes to attitude and personality.
Hp Bonus: Bonus to Hp/leve while channeling.
Other Stat Bonus
Special: Other benefits or channeling. The main thing that makes each demon unique. Note on Demons and Angel naming. Demons as in pure demons not Goblins but actual demons names are composed of alot of constant with hard sounds. Angels names have names with light vowel sounds

I’shka N’srth (Fire Spitter)
This demon (race) is small but when it comes to fire they will burn you. They give those who channel them their signature ability.
Lv req: 1
Req: can cause fire damage
Changes: ???

Fire Spit (Attack, Range, Fire, Spirit Spec Power)

You spit out a bombardment of fire.
Range: 30
Action time: Full turn
Cost: 1 Sp and 10 En and 1 mp or 20 En and 5 mp (might be to high)
Effect: Make a full range attack as allowed with “fire spit”. Fire Spit deals 3d8 fire damage+1d8/Spirit level+1d6/5 channerler levels.

Fire Defense: Reduce fire damage by 5+1/2chanerler levers.


Aio (Healing Angle)
This angle provides healing for his allies .
Lv req: 1
Sp Cost: 1
Req: Know one healing spell
Changes: The changes to ones appearance when channeling. Also includes the changes to attitude and personality.
Hp Bonus: D4
Other Stat:
Healing Aid: Whenever you use supernatural healing you heal an additional 1d4+1/channeling level+3 spirit level.

2009-12-03, 05:50 PM
update on the classes. The demonst/Templar has levels up to 20 done and the spell chart is up to level 7. Also I have an alternate idea for demon leveling up. Since channeling (level) exists already I am thinkning of still having level that represent training with the demon but the benefit is that you gain investment points to invest into its abilites

2009-12-05, 09:42 PM

Weapons are pretty similar to DnD but different. There are weapon points that are received each level. The amount is determined by your class. Some weapons are considered cross class skills, meaning they cost 2 points to increase the value by one. You are proficient if you have one point in the weapon type.
For every 5 points in weapon, when attacking with that type of weapon you get a +1 to attack.
For every 10 you get +1 to damage.
However it does not stop there. There are still magic enchantments but you must have a number of points in the weapon equaled to the total enhancement level to gain the benefit.
So if you have 1 points in a weapon and had +3 weapon you would only use a +1 bonus so you would have +1 to attack and damage.
However usually you don’t see a +5 knife or a +20 flaming ax of death. Instead you might see a snakes death, a tigers claw or an unimportant unnamed sword. Weapons in S&S often have special stats if wielded by a character with enough skill. A snakes head is a +4 poison knife (although their could be variation, but those would only be rare treasures) but if some one with 20 skills in knife uses it is a +5 toxic poison knife that deals 2d6 points of damage. However if some one that does not have enough skills the knife would deal the normal amount of damage (1d6) and would be a +4 poison knife (as long as it has enough skills for all the enhancements).

The Standard Weapon Table (not complete)
Bastard Sword|1d10+5|??|90|x|X
Reading the table

Weapon:The weapon group name
Damage: The basic damage
Weight: how much it weights
Cost: The basic cost
Reach: The reach of the weapon. if x there is no reach only adjacent if it is a value it is adjacent squares +1 value.
range:if it is a range weapon how long it shoots.