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pffh
2009-12-06, 02:20 PM
I'm thinking about playing a rakshasa (rakshasa 7/sorcerer 2/ initiate of the sevenfold veil 7/ AC 4 for anyone interested) but I'm having a hard time finding information about their culture, lifespan, traditional names etc besides the stuff in the monster manual. So if anyone knows where I can find anything, no matter how irrelevant, about rakshasa that would be great.

Dervag
2009-12-06, 02:33 PM
Well...

They're demonic entities, yes? So in a real sense they're probably immortal, or at least unaging. If not, I bet they're very long lived.

Since they are demonic entities and are biologically based on cats, their culture is probably that of solitary predators: interactions between two rakshasa are very tense, and the only stable relationships in their society are dominance relationships where one party is much more powerful than the other and tells them what to do.

Names... as I recall they're derived from some type of demons in Indian mythology, so that gives you a good place to start looking.

Vonotar
2009-12-06, 02:42 PM
Perhaps this will be of some use to you.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rakshasa_(Dungeons_&_Dragons)

Beelzebub1111
2009-12-06, 02:47 PM
What setting? I know in eberron they are considered elder evils, manipulative bastards, belched forth from Khyber.

Gorbash
2009-12-06, 02:51 PM
I'm thinking about playing a rakshasa (rakshasa 7/sorcerer 2/ initiate of the sevenfold veil 7/ AC 4 for anyone interested) but I'm having a hard time finding information about their culture, lifespan, traditional names etc besides the stuff in the monster manual. So if anyone knows where I can find anything, no matter how irrelevant, about rakshasa that would be great.

You do realize you're playing a ECL 34 character, right? :smallamused:

AstralFire
2009-12-06, 02:52 PM
You do realize you're playing a ECL 34 character, right? :smallamused:

Pffh. Big deal.

jmbrown
2009-12-06, 03:05 PM
Read up on real-world Rakshasa. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rakshasa)

In Hindu lore, Rakshasa are the equivalent of D&D's devil. They're lawful evil spirits in the form of men with beast-like features (normally apes and tigers) and inverted hands. Rakshasa exist in a structured but cruel society. They assume control and dominate lesser mortals, corrupt the righteous, and tempt priests.

Dragon #326 features the ecology of the Rakshasa so you might want to hunt that down. AD&D describes Rakshasa civilization as honorable and noble but with a cruel, rigid caste system. Rakshasa subsist on flesh (they're cannibals) and like a true feline their personalities vary depending on their wild mood swings. They can be war-like, conquering territories and capturing mortals for consumption, or they can be peaceful and apathetic enjoying luxuries, mind games, good food, good drink, and good company.

Regardless of how you portray them, rakshasa never reveal their true forms to humans if they can't help it. They use illusion and powers to blend in with society while ruling it from the shadows.

pffh
2009-12-06, 03:06 PM
What setting? I know in eberron they are considered elder evils, manipulative bastards, belched forth from Khyber.

Mix of Greyhawk and homebrew.


You do realize you're playing a ECL 34 character, right? :smallamused:

How do you get 34 out of that, The Rakshasa 7 is the 7 LA from the monster manual and the rest of the levels ads to 13 levels.


Read up on real-world Rakshasa. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rakshasa)

In Hindu lore, Rakshasa are the equivalent of D&D's devil. They're lawful evil spirits in the form of men with beast-like features (normally apes and tigers) and inverted hands. Rakshasa exist in a structured but cruel society. They assume control and dominate lesser mortals, corrupt the righteous, and tempt priests.

Dragon #326 features the ecology of the Rakshasa so you might want to hunt that down. AD&D describes Rakshasa civilization as honorable and noble but with a cruel, rigid caste system. Rakshasa subsist on flesh (they're cannibals) and like a true feline their personalities vary depending on their wild mood swings. They can be war-like, conquering territories and capturing mortals for consumption, or they can be peaceful and apathetic enjoying luxuries, mind games, good food, good drink, and good company.

Regardless of how you portray them, rakshasa never reveal their true forms to humans if they can't help it. They use illusion and powers to blend in with society while ruling it from the shadows.

Hmm this is really helpful I must go and find the issue of Dragon. Also wooo that last paragraph fits perfectly with my character concept.

Mavian
2009-12-06, 03:07 PM
You didn't include the 7 racial hit dice.

Tanuki Tales
2009-12-06, 03:09 PM
Mix of Greyhawk and homebrew.


I was going to ask. 'Cause in Pathfinder they state that not all of these guys have kitty heads.

Eldrys
2009-12-06, 03:16 PM
Racial Hit Dice, but that would only make it 27 ECL. How do you get 7 more levels?

The Glyphstone
2009-12-06, 03:23 PM
Maybe he counted the LA twice by mistake?

Ladorak
2009-12-06, 03:27 PM
How do you get 34 out of that, The Rakshasa 7 is the 7 LA from the monster manual and the rest of the levels ads to 13 levels.

You add the racial hit dice and level adjustment together... I know, I know, this renders almost all monsters unplayable... But the other way round they're way overpowered so *Shrug*

nekomata2
2009-12-06, 03:32 PM
Savage Species does have a 14 level monster class for them...and immunity to 8th level and lower spells is pretty big, though the no save insta-death from blessed bolts seems silly if the DM ever uses it on you...

The Tygre
2009-12-06, 03:33 PM
... Brother, you've come to right (http://www.goodman-games.com/3005preview.html)place (http://pathfinder.wikia.com/wiki/Escape_from_Old_Korvosa).

I need you to be a bit more specific, though. What in particular do you need to know?

pffh
2009-12-06, 03:46 PM
... Brother, you've come to right (http://www.goodman-games.com/3005preview.html)place (http://pathfinder.wikia.com/wiki/Escape_from_Old_Korvosa).

I need you to be a bit more specific, though. What in particular do you need to know?

Well, I'd be interested to know how their families work, would a rakshasa be driven away from his mother at a certain age or would he be raised to take over and/or work for his mother/father?

Also if two rakshasas, both with true sight, would meet on an open road how would they react? Ignore each other? Attack?

If they would be openly hostile to each other if they met in a deserted place would that change if they met in a crowded city? What if the city is kinda the territory of one of the rakshasas (as in he's not the ruler but maybe a gang leader or a guild leader)?

If a rakshasa doesn't worship Ravanna is he hunted down by other rakshasas or is he just generally despised like say worshippers of Vhaerun are for drows of Lolth.

Ravens_cry
2009-12-06, 03:51 PM
I would think of them, role play wise, as a mix of Disney's Shere Khan and Jafar. Cultured, dignified, suave and sleek, and able to rip out your throat in an instant. That's my thoughts anyway.

Boci
2009-12-06, 04:01 PM
Savage Species does have a 14 level monster class for them...and immunity to 8th level and lower spells is pretty big, though the no save insta-death from blessed bolts seems silly if the DM ever uses it on you...

That would probably be updated to a high SR, say 10 + 1.5 level in 3.5 and the blessed bolts would be removed.

Animato
2009-12-06, 05:05 PM
Well, I'd be interested to know how their families work, would a rakshasa be driven away from his mother at a certain age or would he be raised to take over and/or work for his mother/father?

Also if two rakshasas, both with true sight, would meet on an open road how would they react? Ignore each other? Attack?

If they would be openly hostile to each other if they met in a deserted place would that change if they met in a crowded city? What if the city is kinda the territory of one of the rakshasas (as in he's not the ruler but maybe a gang leader or a guild leader)?

If a rakshasa doesn't worship Ravanna is he hunted down by other rakshasas or is he just generally despised like say worshippers of Vhaerun are for drows of Lolth.

The point is, in my opinion, that every hint everyone on this forum or elsewhere can give you on Rakshasas is virtually useless, depending on your DM way to think about them.

I've seen Rakshasas and other mithological/religious/folkloristik ripped monsters handled with proper documentation, a great effort of research and, sometime, maniacal precision.
I've seen also DMs that handle this kind of monster as they are portrayed by stupid fictions etc. (Kevin Sorbo as Hercules? Any bell ringing?)

So the question is: does your DM sets Rakshasas in a Indian-like atmosphere? He thinks they're only big evil humanoid cats with reverse hands and magic? Where HE says the Rakshasas are born?
And the more important question... They clean themselves as the common felines? (Hairballs... Bleah... :smalltongue:)

pffh
2009-12-06, 05:14 PM
The point is, in my opinion, that every hint everyone on this forum or elsewhere can give you on Rakshasas is virtually useless, depending on your DM way to think about them.

I've seen Rakshasas and other mithological/religious/folkloristik ripped monsters handled with proper documentation, a great effort of research and, sometime, maniacal precision.
I've seen also DMs that handle this kind of monster as they are portrayed by stupid fictions etc. (Kevin Sorbo as Hercules? Any bell ringing?)

So the question is: does your DM sets Rakshasas in a Indian-like atmosphere? He thinks they're only big evil humanoid cats with reverse hands and magic? Where HE says the Rakshasas are born?
And the more important question... They clean themselves as the common felines? (Hairballs... Bleah... :smalltongue:)

Yeah this is where I'm quite lucky. If a race has not been used before in our game the player that plays it first can fit it into our game world himself.

Worira
2009-12-06, 05:23 PM
Rakshasas do not flop!

Kobold-Bard
2009-12-06, 05:26 PM
Dragon #326 has an article about Rakshasa, though it focusses mostly on their methods of obtaining power.

jmbrown
2009-12-06, 05:30 PM
Well, I'd be interested to know how their families work, would a rakshasa be driven away from his mother at a certain age or would he be raised to take over and/or work for his mother/father?

Rakshasa exist in a caste system which is more rigid but otherwise resembles the ancient Varna (Hindu society). I haven't read the Goodman Games book, but here's how I always handled it in my games:

Four Varnas (in order of importance)

Brahmins: clerics, priests, scholars, law makers, and religious instructors.
Kshatriyas: warriors who also had judicial power to enforce laws and administrate domains... basically knights in a Medieval feudal system.
Vaishyas: merchants, wealthy farmers, and skilled craftsmen. Think middle class in contemporary American society.
Shudras: servants and slaves.

Ruling above them is the Rajah (lord) and Rani (queen). The Maharaja (great lord) is basically the emperor who rules over all the Rajah. In Rakshasa society, the order of power by class basically goes cleric/sorcerer/monk -> fighter/noble/paladin of tyranny -> rogue/bard/expert -> commoner

To answer your question, the position a rakshasa is born in is the position he stays in. A Kshatriya will never be a Brahmin and so on. I can't say a Rakshasa will ever defy their fate because their essence is made from pure law. Those that do are surely cast out or killed.


Also if two rakshasas, both with true sight, would meet on an open road how would they react? Ignore each other? Attack?

AD&D says rakshasa rarely cooperate unless necessary. A ranking rakshasa in the prime material will rarely contact lesser ranking rakshasa if he ever meets one simply because it's one more liability for him, might attract attention, and they'll have to split the gain from hunting mortals.


If they would be openly hostile to each other if they met in a deserted place would that change if they met in a crowded city? What if the city is kinda the territory of one of the rakshasas (as in he's not the ruler but maybe a gang leader or a guild leader)?

Again, rakshasa don't want to be noticed in the prime material. They're powerful creatures but they're not stupid. Attention attracts powerful adventurers. A rakshasa that enters the territory of another will pay tribute but they aren't obligated to serve. They'll likely be watched because rakshasa outside of their native society are suspicious of each other and any slip ups will draw attention.


If a rakshasa doesn't worship Ravanna is he hunted down by other rakshasas or is he just generally despised like say worshippers of Vhaerun are for drows of Lolth.

Hunted down? No. A brahmin will probably ignore him but most rakshasa don't really care. There's so many better things to be doing like corrupting kings and eating humans than fighting each other.

Myrmex
2009-12-06, 05:48 PM
Rakshasa subsist on flesh (they're cannibals)

They eat people or they eat their own kind? Because only one of those is cannibalism.

Volkov
2009-12-06, 05:49 PM
They are tyrants, and from what I can tell, they don't enjoy each other's company that much.

Boci
2009-12-06, 05:52 PM
They eat people or they eat their own kind? Because only one of those is cannibalism.

D&D (or well BoVD) defines cannibalism as a preference for sentience beings as a source of meet.

Volkov
2009-12-06, 05:55 PM
Well it seems that rakshasa's will band together in small groups, but you probably will never see a metropolis filled populated mainly by them. If you do see a metropolis populated primarily by rakshasas, run far, far, far away.

jmbrown
2009-12-06, 05:56 PM
They eat people or they eat their own kind? Because only one of those is cannibalism.

Both. They prefer human flesh but even canonically in Indian mythology they've resorted to eating each other.

Volkov
2009-12-06, 05:59 PM
Also, may I ask how would the other two types of Rakshasa's mentioned in the third monster manual of 3.5e apply to your question? I am curious about this.

awa
2009-12-06, 08:00 PM
The inverted hands and cat body from the best of what I can tell are wholly invented by dnd.

And going by hindu myth i dont think the dnd idea of a demon is entirely acurate.

That said with a creature like the rakshasa you really need to see how your dm is placing them in the world.

Ormur
2009-12-06, 09:28 PM
They are classified as outsiders, which means they are from the outer planes but what does that mean for actual gameplay. Are the ones encountered on the material plane all visitors, exiles or refugees from some Rakshasa homeland on one of the outer planes? Does is mean they can't be resurrected and so on. I've never quite got the hang of how outsiders on the prime work?

Tanuki Tales
2009-12-06, 09:29 PM
They are classified as outsiders, which means they are from the outer planes but what does that mean for actual gameplay. Are the ones encountered on the material plane all visitors, exiles or refugees from some Rakshasa homeland on one of the outer planes? Does is mean they can't be resurrected and so on. I've never quite got the hang of how outsiders on the prime work?

Outsiders (Native).

pffh
2009-12-06, 09:37 PM
Okey after thinking about the HD and the level thingamajic. I still want to play a rakshasa so would cutting out most of it's bonuses, only keeping change shape and detect thoughts and changing the attribute bonuses to +2 con and +2 cha.
Would this be low enough power to make up for 0 LA? (To low? To high, maybe make change shape cosmetic only?)

Ormur
2009-12-06, 09:39 PM
Thanks, google and d20srd took care of the rest.

The Glyphstone
2009-12-06, 09:40 PM
The only positive net stats I know of with +0 LA are the Lesser Planetouched (AKA Lesser Cheesetouched). If you want the shapechanging, I'd use Changeling or Doppleganger as baselines, then alter them to be Rakshasa-like.

Thurbane
2009-12-06, 09:45 PM
It actually surprises me a little how many people don't realize that the D&D Rakshasa is (loosely) based on a real world mythological creature.

The backward curving palms existed before D&D, AFAIK. The "slain by a blessed crossbow bolt" in 1E & 2E, and the resulting "DR good and piercing" in 3E come from an episode of "Kolchak: The Night Stalker" ("Horror In The Heights").

Iamyourking
2009-12-06, 10:00 PM
I've always envisioned them as being allies with the devils, living in Hell. Kind of like the Kytons, their maharaja is allowed some degree of autonomy; although they live in Hell only at Asmodeus' whim. Of course, being truly lawful beings, neither side is likely to break the contract and they live in relative harmony. Their primary base of operations is a huge palace-fortress in Maladomini, where their leaders play politics with Baalzebul and his court, but most of them live in the city of Dis.
They have a caste system, but they themselves are only the upper class; various servants and slaves fill the lower castes. Their innate spellcasting ability means that all the castes make use of it in some way; the lowest Rakshasas are the craftsmen who make magic items while the warrior caste is mostly gishes of various kinds and the nobles and priests are all powerful sorcerers. Their Baatezu allies look down on them for the lack of social mobility they display, there is virtually no limit to how high a suffiently cunning and powerful devil can rise while Rakshasas are stuck in their castes. The castes certainly have vicious internal politics with the members jockying for position within them, but there is no way to become a higher caste.
Unsuprisingly, they are tied closely to cats and most rakshasas keep them as pets. A strong enough pedigree cat can be a powerful status symbol, similar to owning a fancy car, and one of the favorite pastimes of the idle rich is breeding and displaying cats. The most distinguished and skilled warriors may be allowed to join the elite corps of Fiendish Dire Tiger mounted knights; all of their steeds are bred by the Maharaja and for him to grant one to a warrior is a huge honor. There are other stables that keep and breed big cats, both as guardians and cavalry mounts, but those that can carry an armored warrior are rare and much sought after.
Rakshasa warriors occasionly serve as auxiliaries in the Blood War and have been quite succesful in doing so. The individual wealth of each warrior, along with the innate magic in their society, means that each of them are well equipped; favoring ornate fluted armor and a tulwar/shield combo. All of them are proficient in the use of bows, but don't often get to use them in battle due to the prevalence and height advantage of erinyes archers. Mages of all kinds are common, but the powerful ones generally disdain combat and will not participate. The majority of the warriors use their magic for selfbuffing, the dedicated mages tend to favor firey evocations that can be used without fear of harming their allies. Occasionely they prepare electricity spells for counterspelling, since demons are immune to it while devils have no resistence, but it is difficult to earn prestige when, if you are doing your job right, nothing happens. The tiger knights all have extremely good gear and have distinguished themselves many times with their assaults; they have an intense rivalry with the Infernal Charge that both Duke Abigor and Rajah Varna allow to continue as it propells both units to try harder. The nightmares that the Infernal Charge ride are faster and respond better to commands, while their narzugon riders are superior horsemen; but the sheer havoc that dozens of sonic lances followed by rampaging tigers can cause is truly something. The elite infantry are Warblades who fight with their trademark two-bladed swords, their mastery of Iron Heart has few equals.

This enough? I can certainly add more

Tanuki Tales
2009-12-06, 10:04 PM
@Iam: Not saying that they couldn't do that now, but Rakshasa's are Outsiders native to the Material Plane originally.

Iamyourking
2009-12-07, 12:49 AM
That may be the case, but I'm not a big fan of native outsiders. By defintion, an outsider should live outside of the Material Plane. I had them living with the devils because when it comes to evil outsiders you have to be pretty powerful to be independant, like the Efreeti. In any event, it looks like the topic changed between when I started writing and when it was actually posted. If nobody wants my discussion, I can remove it and let you get on with your new topic.

Beelzebub1111
2009-12-07, 02:17 AM
I see them as sort of an Illuminati-type secret society, that subtley inflence the world's events to their whims. They make great BBEGs by the way.

The Tygre
2009-12-07, 02:30 AM
*cracks knuckles* Already answered, but never too late.


Well, I'd be interested to know how their families work, would a rakshasa be driven away from his mother at a certain age or would he be raised to take over and/or work for his mother/father?

As others have said, the rakshasa operate on a caste system, although it appears to be more distinct, with caste differentiated more by species then simple political rank, although I do think it could be several species to a caste. Perhaps sub-castes? But I got the sense that you were more curious about their domestic life. It's difficult to say where pure-bred rakshasa come from, what with the species general detestation of each other. As anyone can attest, rakshasa keep harems when they can. Looking around any good third party publisher will yield you a half-rakshasa, so it's clear to see just where those harems come in. But where true rakshasa come from, ah, that's the rub. Maybe, like other Outsiders, they are born from souls or energy. Perhaps rakshasa give birth to mixed lots of rakshasa and half-rakshasa.

That said, rakshasa are rather like the Drow in their parenting. They usually leave the work to servants and tutors, all the while maintaining enough of a presence to let the cub know who's boss. They'll undoubtedly worry when the cub gets older; they just know the little monster is going to be nipping at their heels soon, trying to drag them down so it can go for the throat. At the same time, the cub can be a useful minion if it's under the parents' sway. Just as importantly, rakshasa are arrogant. They view their cubs as extensions of themselves, another form of immortality. Still, they are treacherous as their parents, and can be disposed of like anything else beneath the rakshasa.



Also if two rakshasas, both with true sight, would meet on an open road how would they react? Ignore each other? Attack?

It is most likely that they would both see each other, but not acknowledge it. Once at their lairs, ideally, the rakshasa will start investigating the area, wondering about the rival (for another rakshasa of an equal caste can surely not be an ally!). Should they find nothing, they'll stay on guard for a few years. If there is evidence of the other rakshasa, however, then they'll both watch each other, and wait. It may come to nothing, or it might lead to a shadow war between the two.



If they would be openly hostile to each other if they met in a deserted place would that change if they met in a crowded city? What if the city is kinda the territory of one of the rakshasas (as in he's not the ruler but maybe a gang leader or a guild leader)?

Rakshasa are inherently hostile to each other. As I said, in a city, the two would start with a shadow war of assassins and thieves. From there, it turns into a noble civil war and doesn't end until one is defeated or surrenders. At all times, though, a rakshasa tries to maintain its cover until it is assured victory and security. If a rakshasa invades the city of another rakshasa of equal rank, he will start to organize a coup, trying to stay as hidden as possible. This can be done any number of ways, from religious conversion to crime waves to propaganda. At the same time, the rakshasa holding the territory will be matching blow for blow, trying to squeeze the invader out.



If a rakshasa doesn't worship Ravanna is he hunted down by other rakshasas or is he just generally despised like say worshippers of Vhaerun are for drows of Lolth.

Rakshasa are fairly flexible with their religion. You see, like all felines, they believe they're god. Literally. After Ravana's last fight with Ramachandra, he disappeared. But, he was predicted to have one last reincarnation. All rakshasa, regardless of caste, species, or geography, from the lowest untouchable to the highest Asura, believe that they are that reincarnation, that they are Ravana reborn and are destined to one day rule the multiverse. (Sometimes this is a rather half-hearted opinion, but still...) How this works for clerics is up to you. Perhaps a rakshasa cleric just believes in himself very firmly. Maybe the cleric is devoted to the past incarnations of Ravana and his glories, sort of like an ancestor cult. It could be that the cleric is devoted to a more universal concept of Ravana, the Ravana in every rakshasa, thereby honoring the race as a whole. Or it is possible that the rakshasa was swayed into worship by another; no one said the rakshasa were beyond conversion.

There is one very important aspect to Ravana worship, though. Keep on the lookout for Ramachandra' next incarnation. If Ravana returns, it's inevitable that Ramachandra will too. The details on the avatar are scarce. All the rakshasa know is that Ramachandra will be a powerful warrior, wielding a flaming sword and riding a white horse. Of course, what the rakshasa refer to is the next incarnation of Vishnu, Kalki.

That said, rakshasa that don't worship Ravana are known to pledge themselves to a few other entities. Arch-devils are of course on the list, sharing so much with the rakshasa themselves. A few rakshasa worship Kali and darker aspects of Shiva, but these are rare. For all their horror and destruction, the gods are still the gods, and the rakshasa still hold a grudge against them. Finally, the rakshasa might be worshipers of the apocalyptic Kali-Yuga, the Devic living concept of sin, evil, and corruption in the world.

Another_Poet
2009-12-07, 10:14 AM
I always depict them as solitary. They have no society, they are fiends who eppear perhjaps from nowhere or perhaps from some hell-world. They lay careful traps, manipulate people or simply summon hoards of monsters to attack and torment some place they happen to like (a diamond mine, a palace, a town in a remote location - somewhere they're guaranteed a good numbr of people to torment). They don't need to have a social structure with their minions. They just put orders directly into their minions' heads and maybe their minions never even see them.

My rakshasas would never be a guild leader or an evil priest. They might however appear to a guild leader or a priest (of any alignment) and try to tempt/trick/mind control them into doing wicked acts.

If you really want a Rakshasa society I would go with jmbrown's Varna society, except with a change: I would only have rakhsasas occupy the (Maha)Raja, Brahmin and Kshatriya castes. Other races would make up the lower casts and some Kshatriyas would be other races too. A Rakhsasa is too dignified to be consigned to peasant status; just as the original conquerors of the Indus valley kept the high castes to themselves, so the Rakhsasas are the high castes and whatever nation(s) they have subjugated are the low castes.

Asbestos
2009-12-07, 10:27 AM
Well, I'd be interested to know how their families work, would a rakshasa be driven away from his mother at a certain age or would he be raised to take over and/or work for his mother/father?

Also if two rakshasas, both with true sight, would meet on an open road how would they react? Ignore each other? Attack?

If they would be openly hostile to each other if they met in a deserted place would that change if they met in a crowded city? What if the city is kinda the territory of one of the rakshasas (as in he's not the ruler but maybe a gang leader or a guild leader)?

If a rakshasa doesn't worship Ravanna is he hunted down by other rakshasas or is he just generally despised like say worshippers of Vhaerun are for drows of Lolth.
I've never considered Rakshasas being born to mommies and daddies in much the same vein as I've never considered it with Archons, Demons, or Devils. They are Evil outsiders and malicious spirits, they aren't humanoids bound by mundane biology. If you cut one open I bet you'd be just as likely to find a yawning star filled nadir as organs.

hamishspence
2009-12-07, 10:38 AM
that works for extraplanar outsiders- but I think thanks to the Native Outsider bit, rakshasas may grow up the normal way.

Or course, there are always exceptions to the rule.

Cambions (as a separate creature type, not as half-fiends) are extraplanar outsiders- yet they grow up the normal way, because they are the offspring of a planetouched mortal (most often a tiefling) and a fiend.

They are in Expedition to the Demonweb Pits.

So why not rakshasas that come into being fully grown?
(unless something in 3.5 says otherwise).

Sir.Swindle
2009-12-07, 10:58 AM
If i recall how the native subtype works correctly. They would actually lose the subtype if they went off plane. Also all other outsiders gain the native subtype when on their native plane (immune to bannish, cuz they're all ready home)

Basically their native status doesn't inherently mean they have standard biology any more than a Devil does in hell.

They are very likely spawned from the evil of the world or some such and have an inherent knowlege of the caste system and their place in it, if there is one.

I think there was a Slayers guide to Rakshasas that outlined a lot of stuff but thats no more reliable realy than what any of us say.

@the question on the other types in the MM3(?) and ToB the necromancer ones are likely in the priest caste (or untouchable if yuo go by actual hundu, but w/e) and the asassin ones likly fit into the warrior class (or untouchable again) all the ToB ones would be the warrior caste

Eldan
2009-12-07, 12:11 PM
Didn't the Rakshasa have fortesses on Acheron? Or am I misremembering something?

Asbestos
2009-12-07, 12:16 PM
Didn't the Rakshasa have fortesses on Acheron? Or am I misremembering something?

Isn't that a 2nd Ed thing?
If we use 4e's interpretation, they are immortal, world bound spirits that reincarnate in their adult forms some indeterminate time after death. They have no parents and are never children.

Gorbash
2009-12-07, 12:25 PM
Racial Hit Dice, but that would only make it 27 ECL. How do you get 7 more levels?

Oh, I though he had another 7 of Sorcerer levels on top of Rakshasa being able to cast as sorcerer's of 7th lvl.

But still, you forgot the racial HD, so it's an ECL 27, and D&D doesn't really support that high levels.

Hullu_Iivana
2009-12-07, 12:37 PM
If i recall how the native subtype works correctly. They would actually lose the subtype if they went off plane. Also all other outsiders gain the native subtype when on their native plane (immune to bannish, cuz they're all ready home)

Basically their native status doesn't inherently mean they have standard biology any more than a Devil does in hell.

They are very likely spawned from the evil of the world or some such and have an inherent knowlege of the caste system and their place in it, if there is one.

I think there was a Slayers guide to Rakshasas that outlined a lot of stuff but thats no more reliable realy than what any of us say.

@the question on the other types in the MM3(?) and ToB the necromancer ones are likely in the priest caste (or untouchable if yuo go by actual hundu, but w/e) and the asassin ones likly fit into the warrior class (or untouchable again) all the ToB ones would be the warrior caste

This is actually incorrect. Native outsiders are beings who have strong connection to Prime Material and/or mortal ancestors. Normal outsiders don't gain native subtype when they're on their home plane, they just don't have extraplanar type (which Rakshasa would get when travelling outside Prime). As native outsiders, Rakshasas must eat, sleep and breath, so they do have somewhat normal biology.

Asbestos
2009-12-07, 12:44 PM
This is actually incorrect. Native outsiders are beings who have strong connection to Prime Material and/or mortal ancestors. Normal outsiders don't gain native subtype when they're on their home plane, they just don't have extraplanar type (which Rakshasa would get when travelling outside Prime). As native outsiders, Rakshasas must eat, sleep and breath, so they do have somewhat normal biology.

Don't air genasi not have to breathe? Really, native or not, they do not have to be normal in any way. They are merely Outsiders whose home plane happens to be the Prime, you could view them as mean kitty-men, or you could view them as hyper-Evil, alien-minded monsters. I prefer the latter, humanoid forms tend to make people assume mundane needs and philosophies, at which point Rakshasas are no more interesting than powerful Wizards.

dsmiles
2009-12-07, 12:58 PM
If you can get ahold of some waaaayyyy back issues of Dragon, I believe Rakshasas were covered in an "Elminster's Ecologies" column.

Eldan
2009-12-07, 01:00 PM
Ah, yes, here.
Planes of Law - Acheron:

"Achaierai, baatezu, bladelings, imps, modrons, rakshasas, rust dragons and yugoloths are all encountered here. Only yugoloths and rakshasa are truly native. [...]
Rakshasa clans rule several hidden cubes throughout Acheron, all led by a singularly powerful maharajah. The clans vie for his attention by kidnapping petitioners from other realms (and sometimes planewalkers as well) to serve as slaves in their palaces and mansions. The Rakshasa realms are cloaked by powerful illusions, and most sods know enough not to go looking for them."

Not much about them, I'm afraid.

hamishspence
2009-12-07, 01:08 PM
3.0 Manual of the Planes mentions rakshasas in Acheron- doesn't say anything about them being native to the place though.

That was before 3.5 though- in 3.5 Extraplanar and Native became subtypes- though Extraplanar had been mentioned before then.

Maybe its only a 3.5 trait- but rakshasas appear to now be native to the Material Plane.

Starshade
2009-12-07, 03:39 PM
Races of Faerun list traits from Rakshasa as possible inherited traits for tieflings, so they can get offsprings with human, but wikipedia lists them as producing a new generation every century to replace those lost in battle, so, id guess they reproduce somehow. They still count as native outsiders, so, they are fiends, native to prime material plane, who means they originated there somehow?
But, still, id think, biologically (in D&D way), they are quite close to outsider fiends and other evil extraplanar creatures yes?
And a great source of cat eyed tieflings with tails! :smallbiggrin:

erikun
2009-12-07, 03:55 PM
I always knew catgirls were evil; you've just proven it.

Beelzebub1111
2009-12-07, 05:32 PM
Remember, that monsters are not constrained to the books but the imagination of the DM (or soursebook writers)

For example: in SoX, there is reference to a "Tiger-headed Balor". If you ask me, that sounds like an interesting idea that could be run with. Rakshasa could have variants with the abilities of demons or devils as either Mutants, or being Blessed with prowess, or trading their cunning for raw power.

Something to think about.

Asbestos
2009-12-07, 05:56 PM
How do they come into being? Well, being able to produce offspring with humans doesn't tell us much, even Elementals can do that. But, they are most certainly a sort of Fiend. A number of Fiends are created from either pure evil (the 'new' demons in the Abyss) or from particularly evil petitioners. It could be that particularly evil acts on the Prime spawn a Rakshasha fully formed, or that the head Rakshasa has found a loophole in the Pact Primeval, allowing him to take some of the LE souls for himself to warp into new Rakshasa. Perhaps every Rakshasa is capable of turning an LE soul into one of their kind but their natural hatred for their own kind limits how often they create an 'heir'.

AslanCross
2009-12-07, 06:12 PM
It really depends more on how your DM fits them into the world, OP.
In Eberron they have a definite place in the world as spawn of Khyber, agents trying to bring about the Apocalypse, and infiltrators in all humanoid societies.

They're supernatural fiends, so they don't really have a regular society as other humanoids would. Dragon magazine (forget what issue) has an article on Rakshasas, but it's specifically about the Lords of Dust in Eberron.

What I do glean from the Rakshasa entries in MM3 is that most of them tend toward megalomania and as such always want to be the boss in any establishment. They put up cabals that try to subvert the world in one way or another.

The only Rakshasa that don't have a need to be the boss are the assassin-type Naztharunes.

jmbrown
2009-12-07, 06:37 PM
How do they come into being? Well, being able to produce offspring with humans doesn't tell us much, even Elementals can do that. But, they are most certainly a sort of Fiend. A number of Fiends are created from either pure evil (the 'new' demons in the Abyss) or from particularly evil petitioners. It could be that particularly evil acts on the Prime spawn a Rakshasha fully formed, or that the head Rakshasa has found a loophole in the Pact Primeval, allowing him to take some of the LE souls for himself to warp into new Rakshasa. Perhaps every Rakshasa is capable of turning an LE soul into one of their kind but their natural hatred for their own kind limits how often they create an 'heir'.

Actually in some Indian myths a rakshasa is exactly that; a horrifically evil human warped into an otherworldly demon. I like to think their creation is different than the standard petitioners. When an evil tyrant or domineering overlord dies, a rakshasa gets its wings... er, stripes.

Iamyourking
2009-12-07, 08:25 PM
So I guess my idea is best if you want to tie them in with the pre-existing D&D mythos while the others are more faithful to traditional Hindu mythology.

I'd say use mine for a higher level threat because it gives them powerful backing and resources, along with allowing them to present a semi-unified front; while the others can be cobbled together to get a feeling for a lone or small group of Rakshasas. Ultimetly, I would say that the best choice would be either my idea or Tygre's.

Sydonai
2010-03-30, 05:14 PM
Well it seems that rakshasa's will band together in small groups, but you probably will never see a metropolis filled populated mainly by them. If you do see a metropolis populated primarily by rakshasas, run far, far, far away.

Archeron, whole cubes populated with nothing but Rakshasa and their slaves.

Sydonai
2010-03-30, 05:21 PM
*cracks knuckles* Already answered, but never too late.



As others have said, the rakshasa operate on a caste system, although it appears to be more distinct, with caste differentiated more by species then simple political rank, although I do think it could be several species to a caste. Perhaps sub-castes? But I got the sense that you were more curious about their domestic life. It's difficult to say where pure-bred rakshasa come from, what with the species general detestation of each other. As anyone can attest, rakshasa keep harems when they can. Looking around any good third party publisher will yield you a half-rakshasa, so it's clear to see just where those harems come in. But where true rakshasa come from, ah, that's the rub. Maybe, like other Outsiders, they are born from souls or energy. Perhaps rakshasa give birth to mixed lots of rakshasa and half-rakshasa.

That said, rakshasa are rather like the Drow in their parenting. They usually leave the work to servants and tutors, all the while maintaining enough of a presence to let the cub know who's boss. They'll undoubtedly worry when the cub gets older; they just know the little monster is going to be nipping at their heels soon, trying to drag them down so it can go for the throat. At the same time, the cub can be a useful minion if it's under the parents' sway. Just as importantly, rakshasa are arrogant. They view their cubs as extensions of themselves, another form of immortality. Still, they are treacherous as their parents, and can be disposed of like anything else beneath the rakshasa.



It is most likely that they would both see each other, but not acknowledge it. Once at their lairs, ideally, the rakshasa will start investigating the area, wondering about the rival (for another rakshasa of an equal caste can surely not be an ally!). Should they find nothing, they'll stay on guard for a few years. If there is evidence of the other rakshasa, however, then they'll both watch each other, and wait. It may come to nothing, or it might lead to a shadow war between the two.



Rakshasa are inherently hostile to each other. As I said, in a city, the two would start with a shadow war of assassins and thieves. From there, it turns into a noble civil war and doesn't end until one is defeated or surrenders. At all times, though, a rakshasa tries to maintain its cover until it is assured victory and security. If a rakshasa invades the city of another rakshasa of equal rank, he will start to organize a coup, trying to stay as hidden as possible. This can be done any number of ways, from religious conversion to crime waves to propaganda. At the same time, the rakshasa holding the territory will be matching blow for blow, trying to squeeze the invader out.



Rakshasa are fairly flexible with their religion. You see, like all felines, they believe they're god. Literally. After Ravana's last fight with Ramachandra, he disappeared. But, he was predicted to have one last reincarnation. All rakshasa, regardless of caste, species, or geography, from the lowest untouchable to the highest Asura, believe that they are that reincarnation, that they are Ravana reborn and are destined to one day rule the multiverse. (Sometimes this is a rather half-hearted opinion, but still...) How this works for clerics is up to you. Perhaps a rakshasa cleric just believes in himself very firmly. Maybe the cleric is devoted to the past incarnations of Ravana and his glories, sort of like an ancestor cult. It could be that the cleric is devoted to a more universal concept of Ravana, the Ravana in every rakshasa, thereby honoring the race as a whole. Or it is possible that the rakshasa was swayed into worship by another; no one said the rakshasa were beyond conversion.

There is one very important aspect to Ravana worship, though. Keep on the lookout for Ramachandra' next incarnation. If Ravana returns, it's inevitable that Ramachandra will too. The details on the avatar are scarce. All the rakshasa know is that Ramachandra will be a powerful warrior, wielding a flaming sword and riding a white horse. Of course, what the rakshasa refer to is the next incarnation of Vishnu, Kalki.

That said, rakshasa that don't worship Ravana are known to pledge themselves to a few other entities. Arch-devils are of course on the list, sharing so much with the rakshasa themselves. A few rakshasa worship Kali and darker aspects of Shiva, but these are rare. For all their horror and destruction, the gods are still the gods, and the rakshasa still hold a grudge against them. Finally, the rakshasa might be worshipers of the apocalyptic Kali-Yuga, the Devic living concept of sin, evil, and corruption in the world.


What about Elder Evils? What does an apocalyptic abomination from beyond reality look like to a Rakshasa? Would the Alchazzer see Atropus as Ravana's reincarnation, what about Sertrous and it's shared hatred for divinity?

Sydonai
2010-03-30, 05:24 PM
Isn't that a 2nd Ed thing?
If we use 4e's interpretation, they are immortal, world bound spirits that reincarnate in their adult forms some indeterminate time after death. They have no parents and are never children.

"...and are reincarnated Deva."

Maerok
2010-03-30, 05:26 PM
I'm thinking about playing a rakshasa (rakshasa 7/sorcerer 2/ initiate of the sevenfold veil 7/ AC 4 for anyone interested) but I'm having a hard time finding information about their culture, lifespan, traditional names etc besides the stuff in the monster manual. So if anyone knows where I can find anything, no matter how irrelevant, about rakshasa that would be great.

Well certainly, the first thing to know is that {non-OGL scrubbed}. But, of course, you can always {non-OGL scrubbed}.

:smallbiggrin:</srd>

AslanCross
2010-03-30, 05:35 PM
Sydonai> ...do you realize you necroposted three times in succession?

Maerok
2010-03-30, 05:58 PM
Oh wow, I didn't even notice how old this is (I get the posts from newest to oldest).