View Full Version : Help with a gestalt glaivelock

2009-12-06, 03:25 PM
So, I'm trying to design a villainous character for a game. Not the evil mastermind, but The Dragon (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/TheDragon). And I want to make him correspondingly awesome in combat.

The character will be level 10, gestalt, using a 28 point buy. Sources allowed are unspecified; it's pretty much "ask first," but should allow most things.

Now what I'd like to do, if at all possible, is combine Warlock (specializing in Eldritch Glaive) and Swiftblade. Glaivelock builds can be pretty nice, I understand, and Swiftblade makes everything better, so this seems like a decent framework. It's the details that I need help with; advice for getting into Swiftblade as early as possible, tricks for making a Glaivelock powerful, and any particular gear, buffs, or feats that would generally improve the character.

From what I can see, the earliest that I can qualify for Swiftblade is at Warlock 5//Wizard 5. That would let me take five levels in Swiftblade, then, splashing in two more levels of Wizard on the Warlock side to make up for lost caster levels. Sadly, I can't get any of the really nice features from Swiftblade, but free 50% concealment and a 20% miss chance against spells is pretty nice anyway.

As a Warlock 8/Wizard 2//Wizard 5/Swiftblade 5, I would have a base attack bonus of +8 and 4th level spells, eldritch blast for 4d6, and two lesser invocations. Since I'm not sure if he'll ever actually level up, I could also eliminate one wizard level for a warblade level. Not bad, but can I make it better?

2009-12-06, 03:32 PM
What's you're party made up of/what power level?

2009-12-06, 03:38 PM
Well, it's a villain, so he's actually not part of an adventuring party. The idea is that there's a level 15 villain, and a level 10 henchman, both gestalt and played by different people. And then there will be a party of adventurers trying to stop said villain. The villain that I'm hoping to have this henchman work for will be a wizard//cleric, I think, with Geomancer on one side. I'm not certain of the details.

2009-12-06, 03:41 PM
Well, if you get a decent str, Powerattack could be really good. Also, hellfire warlock+binder is a pretty standard way to increase damage. really, unless you're getting something good from the warlock levels, you should just drop them for something else.

2009-12-06, 04:00 PM
I rather like the ability to make all touch attacks. Even if the damage dice aren't that great, you can get a lot of damage just from power attacking, since hit chance becomes much less important. So I don't mind reducing my levels in Warlock - I only really need one - but I'd still like to keep that one, at the very least.

2009-12-06, 04:07 PM
Oh, I realize that. What I'm saying is that if the warlock level's aren't giving you much besides the glaive, then you should drop them.

Why not take combat casting, then take levels of Abjuran Champion? And are you using fractional bab/saves?

2009-12-06, 04:10 PM
Taking Abjurant Champion requires dropping Swiftblade (only one prestige class at a time). Which is a possibility, and one that I did consider, I'm just not sure about it.

As to fractional BAB and saves, I have no clue. I'd have to ask, but I assume so; it's generally a good idea in gestalt.

2009-12-06, 04:17 PM
:Facepalm: forgot about the 2 prc's at a time.

Well, depending on the rulling for BAB, there are a couple options. If yes, I would suggest a Warlock1/Incarnate3/x/Incarnate5//Wizard5/swiftblade5. This takes a bit of a hit on casting, but is better at melee. The x can be any full or 3/4 bab bonus class. If not, lose another level of incarnate and add one more level of either a full bab or warlock. I can give some soulmeld idea's, if you wish.

2009-12-06, 04:20 PM
Ah, I completely forgot about Incarnum. That could potentially be fairly neat. I'm not all too familiar with the specifics of that system, though, so any suggested soulmelds would be appreciated.

2009-12-06, 04:28 PM
This assumes evil alignment, and is just a cursory overview.
Bloodwar gauntlets: bonus on attack if you shape, bonus on damage if you invest. Bind does area damage.

Bluesteel Bracers-bonus on int if shaped, bonus on damage if you invest. Don't bind it.

Incarnate Avatar-bonus on damage if you invest. Can't bind yet.

Mantle of Flame-fire damage if they attack you.

Considering you're only a level 8 manifester, I'd suggest binding a crystal helm and the bloodwar gauntlets.

2009-12-06, 04:42 PM
Incarnate Avatar and Bluesteel Bracers both give insight bonuses to damage, sadly. The rest of that looks good, though. Not sure about the worth of the area damage from Bloodwar Gauntlets, since it requires unshaping the meld, but I'll think about it.

EDIT: So, I'm thinking Bloodwar Gauntlets, Impulse Boots, Incarnate Avatar, Crystal Helm, and Mantle of Flame. The Boots and Helm would be bound.

2009-12-06, 04:59 PM
I'm normally all for Incarnum, but I don't see where it does much for a glaivelock really. Excluding Hellfire Warlock shenanigans (if you're interested in this, there are already tons of guides and builds on the internet; Google and you shall find).

If you want to power attack with a glaivelock, a full BAB class on the other side helps a lot. Furthermore, I don't really see what Swiftblade is doing for you since you're not getting into its best high level class features. Extra damage dice on that glaive isn't terribly important if you're power attacking, so you only really -need- one level in Warlock. Unless there are invocations you want to pick up later, you should drop the rest.

So, here's what I suggest. Warblade 5/Warlock 1/Warblade 4//Wizard 5/Abjurant Champion 5. This gets you full +10 BAB, IL 9, CL 10, maximum fort/will saves, and excellent class features. See if you can finangle an Abjuration version of Mage Armor (which is Conjuration, in spite of it being specifically mentioned in the Abjurant Armor class feature). Focus your spells on long-term buffs. Mage Armor/Greater Mage armor and the like. If you have prior notice of your enemies approaching beforehand, buff up with Greater Invisibility, Haste, and the standard buffs. Focus your ability scores on strength, int, and con. Pick up good damage boosting boost maneuvers (Dancing Mongoose for the win). When they arrive, hit them with an invisible touch attack for 1d6+WHATTHEHELL power attack damage. Bask in your victory.

2009-12-06, 05:38 PM
Well when you put it that way, how can I argue? :smallbiggrin: Sad but true; I see now that Swiftblade really is relatively lackluster until higher levels. The miss chance is nice, but when that can be done just as well with normal spells, it's less useful.

Also, now that you mention it, I find myself agreeing that Warblade probably beats out Incarnate in terms of usefulness. Boosts, counters, and stances alone are at least as useful as a few static bonuses to damage.

Hmm. Unless there's a really good argument to the contrary, Warblade/Abjurant Champion it is.