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View Full Version : [3.5] Fractional CRs (or, how to handle CR 14.5)

SpikeFightwicky
2009-12-07, 07:42 AM
3.5 => If I'm advancing a monster with non-associated class levels, how do I adjust the CR fraction if the monster has odd numbered hit dice?

For example: A dark naga is a 'caster' type monster with 9 hit dice. Barbarian levels are thus non-associated, so the CR advancement is 0.5 CR per level until it has 9 levels of barbarian. I want to add 11 levels of Barbarian. 9 of those levels get the non-associated progression of .5 CR per level, and the 10th and 11th levels give +1 CR each. So now, the Naga's CR is now 14.5 (8 CR base + 4.5 for 9 levels at +.5 CR per level + 2 for 2 levels are +1 CR per level).

Fraction rules say I round down to CR 14, but that feels wrong (giving the monster 'free' extra levels and hit dice). I couldn't find this covered in the rules anywhere.

jindra34
2009-12-07, 07:50 AM
You actually don't end up with a fraction because the advancement for non-associated is 1 CR per to levels, not .5 CR per level. As the last non-associated level of Barbarian in this example is un-paired it doesn't currently count toward CR.

Zeta Kai
2009-12-07, 07:53 AM
I hate to be so dismissive, but the CR "system"** is completely borked to hell. And adding decimals doesn't help anything when the integers don't function. Just let it go, pit your monster again your party, & hope for the best; if they live, then reward them with treasure; if they die, then reward their next characters with treasure.

** = The system here is a wild mass guess based on eyeballing the creature's ability to fight an arbitrary number of PCs using unoptimized tactics & fulfilling sub-optimal/obsolete party roles while expending an arbitrary amount of personal resources, any one of those assumptions being extremely variable & prone to being as accurate as picking a random number off a dartboard.

Sir.Swindle
2009-12-07, 08:24 AM
As much as i hate to just dissmiss a rule, he is right. However you need a number for the experience points and 14.5 isn't on the chart. I'd just let them fight it, if it was a little to tough give exp as if it were 15 if it was a little to easy give exp like it was 14. or go the "super accurate" route and split the difference.:smallwink:

Zom B
2009-12-07, 08:29 AM
As much as i hate to just dissmiss a rule, he is right. However you need a number for the experience points and 14.5 isn't on the chart.

"Well, there's no entry for a 14.5 challenge rating on the chart, so no experience for that encounter. Sorry everybody!"

or go the "super accurate" route and split the difference.:smallwink:

This.

bosssmiley
2009-12-07, 09:00 AM
Fraction rules say I round down to CR 14, but that feels wrong (giving the monster 'free' extra levels and hit dice). I couldn't find this covered in the rules anywhere.

Wow, one extra non-associated level on a CR 14 creature. That'll break game balance in twain. :smallamused:

Don't sweat the small stuff.

lesser_minion
2009-12-07, 09:12 AM
I suspect the official answer is "call it CR 15, and add another level of barbarian if it seems weak".

Sliver
2009-12-07, 09:18 AM
I thought CR was only important for truenamers and is nothing but a poor tool for DMs to judge the monster's relative power. Do you have a truenamer in your group?:smallconfused:

SpikeFightwicky
2009-12-07, 10:20 AM
I thought CR was only important for truenamers and is nothing but a poor tool for DMs to judge the monster's relative power. Do you have a truenamer in your group?:smallconfused:

It's not for monster power or truenamer-isms, it's mainly for XP distribution. I'm not really worried about monster balance (unless the players call me on it because they think a challenge is too high/low) and except for one or two players in my usual group that might be interested if I use a 'created' monster they like, the players never know what CRs they're up against. The main issue is that by RAW, I should either treat the monster as CR 14 (round fractions down) for XP purposes, or treat it as one CR 14 monster and a CR 1/2 monster (which doesn't make much sense either). For all the players know, they're getting the correct amount of XP regardless, but I feel like they're missing out.

I think the 'middle of the road' XP between CR 14 and 15 seems like a fairer solution.

Sliver
2009-12-07, 10:54 AM
I think the 'middle of the road' XP between CR 14 and 15 seems like a fairer solution.

And the logical one.. But it is still guidelines only.. If a higher CR battle was easy for the party but a lower one was more taxing, the lower one should give the better XP (if it wasn't harder because they dealt with it poorly).. XP should be given after some thought..