Passwords *Spoiler*

[Half-blood]

So if Girard has made one illusion responding to "Gate, Girard, Sapphire guard, and soon." But is that the only illusion? Perhaps it makes other illusions when given other passwords. I doubt that Girard thought that Soon, and ONLY soon would try to find the gate.

[SPoD]

If the fake coordinates were given to Soon, and only Soon, then the person activating them is either in league with Soon (as the OOTS are, indirectly) or has defeated him somehow and possibly ripped it from his mind, psion-style. There's no reason to provide a message for, say, Dorukan, because he built the Gate—he knows where it is, and it ain't here. He would have no reason to step on this exact spot in the middle of the desert.

[SaintRidley]

Unless of course, as party cartographer, he never let anyone else know the actual coordinates of his gate (even Dorukon or Lirian) to better protect it (especially so that it couldn't be ripped out of their minds psion-style).

[Dark Faun]

For all we know, the rest of the Order of the Scribble could be stupid enough for their slayers to not need psionics to get the wanted info.

[SPoD]

Unless of course, as party cartographer, he never let anyone else know the actual coordinates of his gate (even Dorukon or Lirian) to better protect it (especially so that it couldn't be ripped out of their minds psion-style).

Again, Dorukan built the Gate over the course of months or years (because that's how long epic magic items take) with Lirian's help. It's virtually impossible to imagine that he didn't know where he was at the time, given that he would have been teleporting materials in from elsewhere. Once you've memorized a place for teleportation purposes, coordinates don't matter.

[Occasional Sage]

Possibly, but I figure Girard lied about lying. I'm sure an epic illusionist could hide his illusions, and who'd look after finding that they need to search the whole rest of the continent?

[SPoD]

Um, everyone?

If you suddenly discover that the thing you are looking for could be anywhere within thousands of square miles of featureless desert, wouldn't your very first reaction be, "Screw it, let's search this area again, just in case he's trying to trick us."

[Shhalahr Windrider]

If you suddenly discover that the thing you are looking for could be anywhere within thousands of square miles of featureless desert, wouldn't your very first reaction be, "Screw it, let's search this area again, just in case he's trying to trick us."
If you’re the type to think about the possibility of double bluffs, sure. But many people (especially most paladins, according Haley), aren’t prepared to think in those terms.

[SPoD]

If you’re the type to think about the possibility of double bluffs, sure. But many people (especially most paladins, according Haley), aren’t prepared to think in those terms.

But Girard clearly does not understand paladins as well as Haley does. He thinks that Soon will break his word, so he likely thinks that everyone thinks about the possibility of double-bluffs. If he grasped the paladin mindset at all, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Paranoid people don't necessarily understand that other people aren't paranoid.

[Shhalahr Windrider]

But Girard clearly does not understand paladins as well as Haley does.
It appears that way.


He thinks that Soon will break his word, so he likely thinks that everyone thinks about the possibility of double-bluffs.
I don't think his misunderstanding of the paladin mindset necessarily leads to that. Even if it did, it would simply imply that Girard works with triple bluffs since double bluffs would clearly not be enough. But a triple bluff would require him to plant a hint that this is indeed a double bluff. Thus far, I don't think any such hint has been given.


If he grasped the paladin mindset at all, we wouldn't be having this conversation.
I'm thinking the idea of a double bluff would have come up here even if Girard has displayed a proper understanding of paladins. So I guess I disagree with you here.

[Roderick_BR]

But Girard clearly does not understand paladins as well as Haley does. He thinks that Soon will break his word, so he likely thinks that everyone thinks about the possibility of double-bluffs. If he grasped the paladin mindset at all, we wouldn't be having this conversation.

Paranoid people don't necessarily understand that other people aren't paranoid.
Well, thinking better, Girard doesn't think that Soon would simply break his word, but he thinks that paladins are arrogant, that they'll try some loop hole to justify his presence. You know, the typical "I can, because I'm the law" paladin type.

[factotum]

Well, thinking better, Girard doesn't think that Soon would simply break his word, but he thinks that paladins are arrogant, that they'll try some loop hole to justify his presence. You know, the typical "I can, because I'm the law" paladin type.

I'm not so sure. I think Girard is quite possibly Chaotic and doesn't really understand the Lawful mentality (remember Haley struggling to explain the concept of a shell game to Roy and the others at Azure City?). I'm sure he would be quite willing to break an oath if he thought it was important enough, and his hatred of Soon led him to believe Soon would do the same thing--which just goes to show he never really understood Soon at all.

[Fortuna]

This discussion just brought a book that I read some time ago to mind. One character, the daughter of an amazing thief, is talking with the son of someone about as Roy-like as you get. She plays a shell game with him, and shows him that the coin is never gonna be where you think it is. Can anyone think of an option becides "Here" or "Elsewhere" which is going to a) fit the illusionist mindset and b) be within the Scribble's abilities?

[SadisticFishing]

There IS no gate!

Muhuhuhahahaha!

Wow. That would work rather well.

[Ertwin]

This discussion just brought a book that I read some time ago to mind. One character, the daughter of an amazing thief, is talking with the son of someone about as Roy-like as you get. She plays a shell game with him, and shows him that the coin is never gonna be where you think it is. Can anyone think of an option becides "Here" or "Elsewhere" which is going to a) fit the illusionist mindset and b) be within the Scribble's abilities?

The only other possibility besides here and elsewhere that I can think of is non-existant, however that possibility kind of speaks for itself

[Fortuna]

By "elsewhere", I meant in a strictly mundane sense (so a pocket dimension would be fair play as an alternative, but would not really fit the illusionist's archetype.).