GitP/ChHa TF2 Server II -- Snappy Tagline Still Pending

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

GitP/ChHa TF2 Server II


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http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/5/59/TF2_Group.jpg



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In this thread, we discuss Team Fortress 2, arrange evenings of gaming, and plan our weekly semi-competitive 6v6 matches.

The IP for the Giant in the Playground/Chocolate Hammer TF2 sever is: 208.100.38.222:27015
Featuring semi-regular Friday/Saturday friendly competitive matches: talk to drolkcal if interested, or just watch this thread.
Taking suggestions for add-ons: talk to Djinn_in_Tonic if you have suggestions.
Taking suggestions for maps: talk to potatocubed if you have suggestions.
Taking donations via Paypal at [email protected]


Admins
Djinn_in_Tonic
Dispozition
drolkcal
Faulty (on a 2 week trial period)
Onasuma
Phase
potatocubed
Rutskarn

Giants (Moderators)
Darth Mario
Fawkes
Jibar
KBF
Neovid
Nano
watsyurname529
Wojonator

[Jahkaivah]

Thread begins In Ten seconds.

















Five


Four


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*siren*

[wojonatior]

SECOND!!!! OMG OMG !!!!!:smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin:

[Rutskarn]

Admin, eh? I'll have to schedule an abuse of power sometime this week.

Jibar, watch your back, sonny jim.

[wojonatior]

Sounds fun!!!

[NeoVid]

Can we get a link to the server map pack?

[potatocubed]

There will be a link to that... eventually.

Z.

[Jibar]

Admin, eh? I'll have to schedule an abuse of power sometime this week.

Jibar, watch your back, sonny jim.

I'm not awake enough to not take that as a come on.

[Rutskarn]

Uh. Threat. It's, uh, it's definitely a threat. A manly, purposeful threat.

I'm going to beat you into a pulp! I'm going to grab your skull and smash it against the pavement! I'm going to stab you with a knife, and thrust it into you, again, and again, and...

...I'm going to wrap my hands around your...your, uh...

You're a dead man!

[KBF]

Potatocubed.

Hit it. Hit it now.


EDIT: ..Somebody find Potatocubed. He logged off Steam just half an hour ago? What madness is this?

[Worira]

Water particles!

[Arbitrarity]

Potato's in a srs meeting. Damn, I need to get up early tommorow. Must... get... direct hit...

[KBF]

Potato's in a srs meeting. Damn, I need to get up early tommorow. Must... get... direct hit...

When will his srs biznzz be done with?

Must play with these with you guys. Don't want to play with random complaining strangers.

[shadow_archmagi]

So, I've been seeing the server in "!!SIX VERSUS SIX!!" mode from time to time and joining and no one complains or mentions anything. Is it that I'm just joining before/after the match or are you guys actually that informal?

[Valaqil]

Gah. Update done, but no server. Yeah, I'm waiting to play with you guys.

[Arbitrarity]

S'long as you don't join a team, throws things off a lot, joining to spec or w/e is fine. We're pretty informal generally.

[Valaqil]

or are you guys actually that informal?

Mostly what Arbitrary said. I think the general attitude is something like: "Watching is cool, Interfering or being annoying is not." We want to have fun and play a little more serious on those nights, but what harm is it if you join and watch?

[Belobog]

6v6 games usually take place around 9-11 on Friday and Saturday, so if you're joining after that, the server is probably just stuck in War mode or something. It, uh...Did we fix that, yet, actually?

[potatocubed]

EDIT: ..Somebody find Potatocubed. He logged off Steam just half an hour ago? What madness is this?

That would be the madness we call 'GMT' and 'work in the morning'.

Anyway, 'it' has now been 'hit'. Go about your business.

EDIT: Except the Steam update seems to have killed the server completely. Goddammit.

[Dispozition]

I am in awe of what the new advanced medic stuff could mean. I am going in now and USING THEM HARD!!!! Also spamming stuff for demo and soldier :D

[KBF]

That would be the madness we call 'GMT' and 'work in the morning'.

Anyway, 'it' has now been 'hit'. Go about your business.

EDIT: Except the Steam update seems to have killed the server completely. Goddammit.

I more meant the timing. I don't blame you at all, but.. Half an hour.


And the server dieing.. It might just be a particularly large update? Or is it dead-dead?

[Dispozition]

Hmmmm. Maybe server is downloading the update, and doing so slowly?

[potatocubed]

Nope. Because the server was full, the update tried to download a load of new content (including all the arena maps we deleted :rolleyes:), got halfway, got rejected, and died. It's good to go now, although at some point I really need to clear out those maps again.

EDIT: maplist and mapcycle are broken - I don't know where the files have gone - so it's Valve maps or nothing until I or Djinn get around to fixing it. Djinn, there's a handy file called client_maplist.txt in the sourcemod/configs directory that lists everything on the server for easy list updating if you happen to get to it first.

And now... brb, earning a living.

[Dispozition]

ok, server has seemingly updated, but can't connect to steam. Restarts aren't helping at all v.v

[potatocubed]

The server can't connect to Steam?

But it was working an hour ago...

[NeoVid]

Is the server working right? I'll be on later today, so I'm hoping it's OK now.

[potatocubed]

Server's fine if you don't mind Valve maps only. The Steam inventory servers are down, though, so you'll have a tough time getting new gear.

[xp194]

Might try this server sometime in the future, hopefully.

[Valaqil]

I am in awe of what the new advanced medic stuff could mean. I am going in now and USING THEM HARD!!!! Also spamming stuff for demo and soldier :D

+1. Couldn't agree more. :smallbiggrin:

[Phase]

I don't know whether it's the new Medic buffs or what, but I just played 75-80 point rounds with Medic.

Sweetness.

[Valaqil]

I've lost the post, and am a little lazy right now, so: Are we doing comp match tonight? IF so, teams made yet?

[NeoVid]

Wait, what are the medic buffs?

[Dogmantra]

Wait, what are the medic buffs?

My sentiment entirely!

Also: have we got 12 people for the 6v6 tonight?

[Faulty]

Is there a 6v6 Saturday?

[Rutskarn]

Alright, we need a snappy tagline something awful. Maybe we should hold a contest?

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Alright, we need a snappy tagline something awful. Maybe we should hold a contest?

No! I enjoy our lack of a snappy tagline...it has character.

...in we have a contest, I'm submitting our current tagline, and hoping it wins.

[Valaqil]

Okay. Tracked down drolkcal's post (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7506937&postcount=1432). We have 8 for tonight, but we haven't really planned much. I'm going to go ahead and claim availability for both tonight and tomorrow night, IF one happens.

I _think_ the Medic "buffs" are the new choices in Advanced Options. A couple of neat things there for a Medic.

[drolkcal]

There is a 50% chance I can play tonight. We would still need to find 2-3 players though which shouldn't be too hard.

[Dispozition]

The medic "buff" consists of two options. One gives a little warning sound when people aren't on full health, the other makes them automatically call medic if they don't have full health. Makes medicing so much easier, even if it means you get massively spammed with medic calls.

[Dogmantra]

I'm so tired all of a sudden, and it's still about 3 hours until the comp. match, if it's happening. Sorry for the late notice, but I probably won't be able to play due to spontaneous sleeping.

[Lord of Syntax]

I can play tonight! (if it is ok)
EDIT: In the 6v6... :smalltongue:

[shadow_archmagi]

I may drop in as is my custom

[Valaqil]

I'm so tired all of a sudden, and it's still about 3 hours until the comp. match, if it's happening. Sorry for the late notice, but I probably won't be able to play due to spontaneous sleeping.

How dare you give short notice for something like sleep! Call on the Dark Side! Give in to your need for caffeine! Allow it to flow through you, making you stronger! :smalltongue:

[potatocubed]

It's not a single map pack, because I'm too lazy to compile everything into a single unzip/installer, but the current server maplist is:

All the standard Valve maps except the arena maps.
Redfort (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/96875) (CP)
Swiftwater (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/105583) (PL)
Cranetop (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/65823) (PL+)
Freight (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/59565) (CP)
Corporation (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/56057) (CP)
Industrial (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/67264) (CP)
Warpath (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/52314) (plech yuck, but drolkcal wants it for the comp nights...) (CP)
Cashworks (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/69298) (PL)
Follower (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/92392) (CP)
Meridian (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/112857) (love it love it) (TC/CTF)
HAARP (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/115508) (CTF)
Garbage Day (http://www.fpsbanana.com/maps/80910) (I don't know if this is the right version. =/ ) (KotH)
Nightfall (http://forums.tf2maps.net/downloads.php?do=file&id=2784) (PLR)

The ones in bold are ones you probably want to download ahead of time. This is either because they're in the standard rotation (Redfort, Swiftwater, Cranetop) or because they're HUEG and will take forever to download.

[Arbitrarity]

Cloning Drolkcal's post with updates:


6v6 Weekend Games
This post will be updated for this event.

Submit the following to join the fun:
Day: Friday, Saturday, or Both
Class: In order of preference
Captain: Yes or No.
Grade: Self grading
Mic: Yes or No

Friday Dec. 18 @ 9:00 pm EST
Captain:11/12
Beanie The Grim: Scout (3), Demoman (2.5), Soldier (2.4), Medic (2.3)
Dispozition: Medic
watsyurname529: Scout (4?), Other (3.5)
Valaqil: Medic, Soldier
Djinn_In_Tonic: Soldier, Medic
Manticoran: Medic(4.5), Soldier(3.5), Demoman(3), Engineer(4), Scout(3)
wojonatior: Demo(average), Pyro(average-to-good), or medic(Bad-to-average).
Valaqil
Arbitrary
volunteers for captain:
Manticoran
Arbitrary (ish)
Limecat ?
Shadow_Archmagi?

Sat Dec. 19 @ 8:30 pm EST
Captain:
Players 9/12
Beanie The Grim: Scout (3), Demoman (2.5), Soldier (2.4), Medic (2.3)
Darth Mario: Soldier 3.5, Utility 3.
watsyurname529: Scout (4?), Other (3.5)
Dogmantra: Medic (3.5)
Faulty: Soldier
Manticoran: Medic(4.5), Soldier(3.5), Demoman(3), Engineer(4), Scout(3)
wojonatior: Demo(average), Pyro(average-to-good), or medic(Bad-to-average).
Valaqil
Arbitrary

volunteers for captain:
Manticoran
Arbitrary(ish)

If Drol would migrate this, I'll delete.

[Dispozition]

New TF2 update, fixes a lot of bugs. Push the button please Potato :D

Unless we want to keep spy dispensers, and make me uninstall the new update >.>

[potatocubed]

Alright, button pushed. This time I have backed up the server just before, so if it all goes pear-shaped we can fix it more easily.

[Thanatos 51-50]

So, I hear Valve made TR_Walkway an official map?
Problem is, I can't find it when I want to go and practice.

[Dispozition]

I don't think they did Thantos...

Also, todays 6v6 was the biggest fail in the history of TF2, I think...

[The Linker]

What? Why? What happened? The Great Steamroll of 2009? :smallfrown:

[Dispozition]

One point was capped in the whole three rounds. I think Arb was the only one playing even near standard :P

[Thanatos 51-50]

Fine. I'll download it, myself.

[The Linker]

...You guys had a massive stalemate? That sounds kind of funny, actually. :smalltongue:

[Thanatos 51-50]

...You guys had a massive stalemate? That sounds kind of funny, actually. :smalltongue:

If only I were there, that would have broken the stalemate.
Just because I'm that bad.

[Dispozition]

If only I were there, that would have broken the stalemate.
Just because I'm that bad.

No, you misunderstand...We all sucked giant balls today. None of us could play properly. Drolkcal and I were shooting each other for a good 30 seconds as scouts before either one of us went into red health...At the end of the encounter I was 2 pistol clips light and had expended nearly half my scattergun ammo...I went into it with full everything v.v

[Thanatos 51-50]

For some reason, I seem to be steadily gaining skill with the demoman's 'nade launcher, though.
I already got something like 21/50 Laddy MacDeath kills.

[Ikialev]

So, I hear Valve made TR_Walkway an official map?
Problem is, I can't find it when I want to go and practice.
It's more 'endorsed' than 'official'. Also this map is the best achievement grind map.

*Still complains about medic achievements*

[Faulty]

So... we only have 9 for tonight. Is a game still happening?

So I figure we could put info about this in our sigs?

[Belobog]

I could jump in for the game tonight to fill a spot. It's still at 9, right?

[Arbitrarity]

8:30, but pretty close. Not sure if we have enough, yeah.

[watsyurname529]

For anyone who hasn't heard, I have a story I need to post here.

A few days ago, I was on the server and we had a good Cranetop match going, and the server was moderately full. We had a good number of [GitP] tagged players as well. Some guy joins the game during the last stage and after a bit said something along the lines of, "What does GitP stand for? Gigantic in the Pants?"

[Fawkes]

"What does GitP stand for? Gigantic in the Pants?"

It does now.

[Pie Guy]

Can I be a giant, now that I have a computer that actually runs?

[drolkcal]

Should I bother trying for a 6v6 this week?

[Belobog]

I'd say give everyone the week off. It's Christmas and, uh...Boxing Day, I guess. We wouldn't get a lot done in the best of circumstances.

[Faulty]

We could tentatively schedule a Saturday game.

[watsyurname529]

We could tentatively schedule a Saturday game.

I won't be able to make that one. I'll be en route to London.

[Player_Zero]

Walk into game.

Pick up intel.

Get slayed twice because Onasuma is achievement farming on the server.

Uh huh.

And once just now for standing still posting this apparently.

Seriously. Just go download an achievement unlocker. Generally speaking, threatening people with kicking who joined the server expecting to play a game is quite a stupid thing to do.

[watsyurname529]

Walk into game.

Pick up intel.

Get slayed twice because Onasuma is achievement farming on the server.

Uh huh.

And once just now for standing still posting this apparently.

Seriously. Just go download an achievement unlocker. Generally speaking, threatening people with kicking who joined the server expecting to play a game is quite a stupid thing to do.

Yeah, I joined in when he was doing it on Steel. I left a couple minutes afterward because he was threatening to kick anyone who interfered.

[onasuma]

My justification:

We were farming while the server was empty. When people joined, myself and another player both said we are farming, please dont interefer with it. Zero started capping, I slayed in order to stop said capping from happening.

Personally, I think if someone tries interfering with what the majority of people on the server want to do, then a warning such as that is a perfectly reasonable issue. If it had 24 players online and 3 were farming, Id do the same to them.

[shadow_archmagi]

Yeah, I joined in when he was doing it on Steel. I left a couple minutes afterward because he was threatening to kick anyone who interfered.

I've noticed a LOT of admin abuse on the server, frankly.

[Player_Zero]

I picked up the intel. I wasn't capping it. Also, that wouldn't've stopped you doing anything.

Want me to google an unlocker for you?

P.S. Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes?

[Thanatos 51-50]

My justification:

We were farming while the server was empty. When people joined, myself and another player both said we are farming, please dont interefer with it. Zero started capping, I slayed in order to stop said capping from happening.

Personally, I think if someone tries interfering with what the majority of people on the server want to do, then a warning such as that is a perfectly reasonable issue. If it had 24 players online and 3 were farming, Id do the same to them.

Propose we institute a new server rule:
"Actual game play trumps a desire to achievement farm. Always. Yes. Even then."

[shadow_archmagi]

If it had 24 players online and 3 were farming, Id do the same to them.

My experiences with Farming have been such that once you exceed about six people, it becomes unmanagable and tends to break down.

[Volug]

Propose we institute a new server rule:
"Actual game play trumps a desire to achievement farm. Always. Yes. Even then."

Seconded.

But even so, say there is 12 people on each side helping with achievements, and 1 who actually wants to play, well, it's not going to be much of a difference. Since the opposing team can still kill them from doing pretty much anything, yet the lone guy can probably stop the achievements.

Then nothing gets anywhere.

[onasuma]

I picked up the intel. I wasn't capping it. Also, that wouldn't've stopped you doing anything.

Want me to google an unlocker for you?

P.S. Quis Custodiet Ipsos Custodes?

We had asked you not to interfer with it. A responce to make it clear that you had no intention to would have sovled that - as it stands you ran past everyone in the middle carrying the intel back into your base - that looks like intent to cap to me which would mean that the round ends immediatly with a victory rather than indefinate overtime.

Also, no, I wouldnt - there is a difference of working together with some friends for something than never actually managing to do what is required of them.

[Dogmantra]

What I don't understand is why, when seeing that a server has solely people who want to achievement farm on it, you wouldn't just leave again. There are, for all intents and purposes, zero players on there, just as if the server was empty. You wouldn't complain if the server was empty, would you? Of course, if Onasuma had just decided to kick everyone and take over the server for his own evil intents, then that's different.

You didn't do that, did you, Onasuma? :smalltongue:

[Player_Zero]

You mean, instead of not getting in the way by not killing you on sight, as I did, I should've explicitly said that I wasn't bothered overly much by your activities?

It was the first freaking cap too. It wasn't as though I was in imminent danger of ruining your achievement farming.

And really, there isn't much of a difference in using an unlocker and doing them in such a fashion. You may as well just've used the time to play normally. Then you would've got your 'working with friends' dealie, your achievements and you would've gotten an actual game in.

While you may not've kicked everyone you did effectively lock the server from everyone else.

[potatocubed]

We were farming while the server was empty. When people joined, myself and another player both said we are farming, please dont interefer with it. Zero started capping, I slayed in order to stop said capping from happening.

Translation: You and another player took over an entire 24-man server and drove off anyone who disagreed with what you were doing or attempted to ignore you and play the game. Please don't do this again.


Personally, I think if someone tries interfering with what the majority of people on the server want to do, then a warning such as that is a perfectly reasonable issue.

Except because you're slaying anyone who tries playing the game, you will always be 'the majority'. Most people who want to play will just go somewhere else, as Dogmantra has pointed out.

So, here's the rule as of now: The ChHa server is for playing TF2. If it's otherwise empty and you want to farm, go ahead, but farmers give way to people who want to play the game.

[onasuma]

Not going to argue. Its Potatoes server, he wins. Id like to appologise to the two people who i caused issue with.

[Imposter]

So, uh, yesterday there was a discussion on the server. A discussion of 2fort, and why nobody likes it much. And how to improve it.

Yeah.

Anyway, I now have a strange kotH/cp hybrid 2fort. Would people be willing to see if it works?

[Faulty]

I'm game for it.

[Fawkes]

Put it on megaupload or rapidshare and we'll set up a time to playtest it.

[Dogmantra]

That sounds pretty cool, actually. I'll help test it if it's at a sensible time.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

With regards to the achievement issue: if it doesn't interfere with the game, fine. If it does, it's not fine.

For instance, the other day someone (I forget exactly who) and I were trying to get a few achievements by me running towards their spawn. I asked people not to kill me, but that's where it stopped. Eventually I just noclipped over, and that seemed to work fine. A few times we lost it because the round ended...

If it gets to the point where you're asking other people to not play the game, that's unacceptable. Point-capture achievements and the like just aren't acceptable to farm in a game-playing server. Stuff like mine, which took just me and one player on the other team out of the game and maybe a few minutes of saying "don't attack the constantly jumping soldier inside your spawn" are fine, but punishing people who don't cooperate isn't cool.

And shadow/everyone else? Drop me a line if you see Admin abuse, and I'll try to step on it.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Update: After consulting with some of our other Admins, Faulty has been given a 2 week trial period as an Admin, and may, pending our approval, be joining the Admin team.

Just a heads up. :smallbiggrin:

[watsyurname529]

Update: After consulting with some of our other Admins, Faulty has been given a 2 week trial period as an Admin, and may, pending our approval, be joining the Admin team.

Just a heads up. :smallbiggrin:

Cool. Out of curiosity, what can Admins do that Giants can't? I know there are some things but I never paid attention since it wasn't relevant to me then.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Cool. Out of curiosity, what can Admins do that Giants can't? I know there are some things but I never paid attention since it wasn't relevant to me then.

Some advanced server and map commands, banning, rcon (if you have the password), changing cvars and locked variables...and a few other things that elude me at the moment.

[Volug]

Where was the list of admins?

Front page, durdurdurdur

Also: Needa dispenser here

[Dispozition]

With regards to the achievement issue: if it doesn't interfere with the game, fine. If it does, it's not fine.

For instance, the other day someone (I forget exactly who) and I were trying to get a few achievements by me running towards their spawn. I asked people not to kill me, but that's where it stopped. Eventually I just noclipped over, and that seemed to work fine. A few times we lost it because the round ended...

If it gets to the point where you're asking other people to not play the game, that's unacceptable. Point-capture achievements and the like just aren't acceptable to farm in a game-playing server. Stuff like mine, which took just me and one player on the other team out of the game and maybe a few minutes of saying "don't attack the constantly jumping soldier inside your spawn" are fine, but punishing people who don't cooperate isn't cool.

That would have been me. And All it essentially did was make the game an 11v11 rather than 12v12. There again, at that point my ping was quite bad and wasn't really contributing anyway.

Also, on the topoic of admin abuse, I'm probably the worst for it. I'll acknowledge that. I do always do votes to see if the majority wants to screw around though, I'll never just automatically declare a gimmick round and make everyone comply. I'll normally stopp if there are more than about 10 people in the server too.

[Imposter]

Ok, cp-koth_2fort bsp is here: http://rapidshare.com/files/323679489/cp-koth_2fort.bsp

NOTE: My first map compile crashed halfway through. The second time, I apparently compiled the autosaved backup version, since it doesn't have the win conditions set properly. That is, they don't trigger. Everything works except the timers ending the game. I'll fix it if enough people like it to justify the hour long compile time.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Ok, cp-koth_2fort bsp is here: http://rapidshare.com/files/323679489/cp-koth_2fort.bsp

NOTE: My first map compile crashed halfway through. The second time, I apparently compiled the autosaved backup version, since it doesn't have the win conditions set properly. That is, they don't trigger. Everything works except the timers ending the game. I'll fix it if enough people like it to justify the hour long compile time.

Downloading as we speak. I'll explore it a bit myself, and probably upload it to the server for a test run when I have time to do so.

[Dispozition]

Ok, cp-koth_2fort bsp is here: http://rapidshare.com/files/323679489/cp-koth_2fort.bsp

NOTE: My first map compile crashed halfway through. The second time, I apparently compiled the autosaved backup version, since it doesn't have the win conditions set properly. That is, they don't trigger. Everything works except the timers ending the game. I'll fix it if enough people like it to justify the hour long compile time.

How big is the original file, and what sort of computer do you have? Depending on these things, I may be able to compile it more quickly.

[Imposter]

Cool. Just a warning, the cap layout isn't very conventional. Center point is a normal KotH point, capping both basement points instantly caps the center for you. You need to in control of your own basement to cap the enemies basement point. I was trying to make a sentry turtle as hard to do as possible, and I figured this would work.

My system is a 2.8 GHz dual core with 3.25 gig of ram, and the .vmf file is 12900KB.

[Faulty]

Given my admin powers, you should all feel free to send me a Steam message if you need help on the server with, say, a difficult player. If I'm able, I'll hop on and help. Just fill me in on the details.

[Dispozition]

Cool. Just a warning, the cap layout isn't very conventional. Center point is a normal KotH point, capping both basement points instantly caps the center for you. You need to in control of your own basement to cap the enemies basement point. I was trying to make a sentry turtle as hard to do as possible, and I figured this would work.

My system is a 2.8 GHz dual core with 3.25 gig of ram, and the .vmf file is 12900KB.

If you send it my way, and give me a very quick rundown on how to complie it, my 2.8GHz quad core 4gb ram might be able to handle it quicker :D

Sounds pretty awesome though. Unconventional cap layouts are great, for example Steel :)

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Ok, cp-koth_2fort bsp is here: http://rapidshare.com/files/323679489/cp-koth_2fort.bsp

NOTE: My first map compile crashed halfway through. The second time, I apparently compiled the autosaved backup version, since it doesn't have the win conditions set properly. That is, they don't trigger. Everything works except the timers ending the game. I'll fix it if enough people like it to justify the hour long compile time.

Alright. cp-koth_2fort looks like a pretty good map. I'm slightly concerned by how fast the basement points capture compared to the main point (I can see charging the basement being the primary strategy, due to the possibility of Demo/Pryo/Heavy/Soldier spam at the bridge), but we'll have to see how it goes. I also love the way it minimizes Sniper fire and Engies by having the point under the roof of the bridge.

I'm also worried about the proximity of the respawn to the point itself...just seems like it would make capturing it almost impossible. Thoughts on removing or disabling the upper spawn, and making just the basement room used for spawning players?

[potatocubed]

Hint: for quick test-compiling you can leave the... 'vis' setting, I think? The one in the middle? Anyway, you can leave it on 'quick'. That's what eats up most of the compiling time.

That said, I've never compiled anything as complex as 2fort before, so maybe you're already doing that.

[watsyurname529]

With all the random pub people on the server since the update, I've been feeling better about myself. I mean, easily getting top of the scoreboard and even then going 10, 20, 30, and even 40 points higher than the next highest player does wonder's for one's TF2 self-esteem.

[Imposter]

Actually, RAD is the one you really want to leave off. VIS you can set to quick, but it runs pretty fast anyway. RAD is the lighting calculations, and running raytrace computations for every single light in the map just isn't going to be especially quick.

But yeah, I have a finished version, I just accidentally ran the full compile on my backup. Woops.

Also: Could I be given a heads up when it's decided to try to run it? I have a practical interest you see.

[TheLogman]

To anyone that knows how the server works, specifically the auto-balance, why am I pretty much always the one that gets balanced? At least it feels that way.

Even if I'm not, could I ask how the server calculates who gets switched? I know it's by whoever dies when it needs a new person, but I got the message 3-4 times last night that I was chosen unless somebody died.

I know it's not the best or worst player, because I was number 3 or 4 every time.

[Fawkes]

Does forcing Disco mode on the server for short periods count as admin abuse?

If so, apologies.
I WILL NEVER STOP

[Celesyne]

don't worry watsyurname, when I'm playing you constently wipe the floor with me, so at least you have me to pick on

[KBF]

..Yeah, now I'm worried I've been abusing my position. Is threatening to punish particularly annoying people abuse? Also, I did mute that guy who was bothering Ninjews by yelling at him and swearing as much as he could in front of the kid. Oh, and I started a poll to see if we should nerf watsyurname (overwhelmingly yes) but I never got around to doing it.

[Nano]

Punishing particularly annoying/detrimental people is the purpose of being an admin/giant. If you're not doing it, then that's an issue.

[Vitruviansquid]

Ah. Played a little on this server as the Lobsterman Commander. Just wanted to drop by to say y'all run a good show. If either of you are reading this, avatarofwaste and wilson, you two are too tough. >_>

[Nano]

Ah, was playing against you tonight... My apologies, I was hardly playing at my best, mainly fooling around as engi. You're pretty good.

[Vitruviansquid]

I remember having a fight against you in which I jumped off Nucleus to my death, a scout having lost to an engi X_x

[Nano]

Yeah, I had me a nice little giggle over that one. :smalltongue:

Good to have you here.

[Faulty]

Does forcing Disco mode on the server for short periods count as admin abuse?

If so, apologies.
I WILL NEVER STOP

Only if you fail to play "Rasputin."

[Dogmantra]

Only if you fail to play "Rasputin."

Most servers would be slightly worried that their potential new admin was endorsing playing music and forcing everyone to go into disco mode.

Me? I'm worried that our potential new admin is endorsing music and disco mode. I'm worried that you're still potential, and haven't been promoted just for that. Geez guys!

[shadow_archmagi]

This morning I was on the server and getting loads of kills and not many deaths.

"Prince Of Thorns" in particular had a knack for dying. Seemed like every time I was in the perfect place to kill someone, and fired a perfect rocket... it was him on the other end.

[watsyurname529]

..Yeah, now I'm worried I've been abusing my position. Is threatening to punish particularly annoying people abuse? Also, I did mute that guy who was bothering Ninjews by yelling at him and swearing as much as he could in front of the kid. Oh, and I started a poll to see if we should nerf watsyurname (overwhelmingly yes) but I never got around to doing it.

Muting annoying people is our job man! It's the real point behind the power. Other than that, I didn't mind the votes, you only did it twice I think. Maybe three times. But still, I laughed and kept killing you.

[Faulty]

..Yeah, now I'm worried I've been abusing my position. Is threatening to punish particularly annoying people abuse? Also, I did mute that guy who was bothering Ninjews by yelling at him and swearing as much as he could in front of the kid. Oh, and I started a poll to see if we should nerf watsyurname (overwhelmingly yes) but I never got around to doing it.

Harrasing other players is against the rules. I'd warn them when they started, and if they refused to comply, silence or kick them at your discretion.


Most servers would be slightly worried that their potential new admin was endorsing playing music and forcing everyone to go into disco mode.

Me? I'm worried that our potential new admin is endorsing music and disco mode. I'm worried that you're still potential, and haven't been promoted just for that. Geez guys!

:P

[watsyurname529]

I have a story to tell all of you about a koth_harvest_event game yesterday!

I was playing on koth_harvest_event (I'm not sure why it was the event map but okay) and the server was mostly full if not completely full, and there were some GitP players on as well. After halfway through the map, and after another RED win, we start the next round and RED heads to the point ready to fight BLU. Except no one showed up from BLU, and we were wondering where they were, and we found out that every single one was sitting in their spawn, not moving. After a minute or so, Darth Mario shows up and joins BLU, and is the only person able to talk or move on BLU. I then Steam message Drolkcal asking what's up with BLU only to learn that he's not in the server anymore and not even in TF2 because he crashed, even though the scoreboard still shows him listed. So I believe that the entire BLU team crashed for some reason. None of them would move and were still listed on the scoreboard until they timed out. Plus the new players on BLU could move and act normally.

[AlterForm]

I have a story to tell all of you about a koth_harvest_event game yesterday!

I was playing on koth_harvest_event (I'm not sure why it was the event map but okay) and the server was mostly full if not completely full, and there were some GitP players on as well. After halfway through the map, and after another RED win, we start the next round and RED heads to the point ready to fight BLU. Except no one showed up from BLU, and we were wondering where they were, and we found out that every single one was sitting in their spawn, not moving. After a minute or so, Darth Mario shows up and joins BLU, and is the only person able to talk or move on BLU. I then Steam message Drolkcal asking what's up with BLU only to learn that he's not in the server anymore and not even in TF2 because he crashed, even though the scoreboard still shows him listed. So I believe that the entire BLU team crashed for some reason. None of them would move and were still listed on the scoreboard until they timed out. Plus the new players on BLU could move and act normally.

I took a quick demo of the event; I'll look into uploading a video of our shocked responses.

[Dread Cthulhu]

Only if you fail to play "Rasputin."

You summoned me?

[Folytopo]

Just popping in to say what a pleasure it was to play with you gentleman last night on my first day back to tf2 in 2 months. So rusty.

[Dogmantra]

I reckon I've actually had more kills with the Bat as a Scout this past month than the other two guns combined. There's something wrong with me, I'm sure.

[Darth Mario]

Harrasing other players is against the rules. I'd warn them when they started, and if they refused to comply, silence or kick them at your discretion.

Not to mention Ninjews is untouchable. Unofficial server policy is anyone who messes with him gets a banhammer (in a non-friendly way, of course).

[Rutskarn]

Yeah. Ninjews is like our shrill irritating mascot.

[Jahkaivah]

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c226/saxcsa/095.jpg

Ninjews is awesome.

[Faulty]

Atheist.

That was perfect.

[Belobog]

http://i28.photobucket.com/albums/c226/saxcsa/095.jpg

Ninjews is awesome.

Does...does that mean when he gets older, if he gets less annoying...we'll have to replace him?

:smalleek:

[Darth Mario]

Does...does that mean when he gets older, if he gets less annoying...we'll have to replace him?

:smalleek:

It won't matter, Ninjews will always be younger than us by the same amount. Therefore he'll always be just as annoying.

DO NOT QUESTION MARIO LOGIC

[watsyurname529]

Lol, that was awesome. That itself would be a fantastic idea for a front page for the server.

On a side note, has any one else read about the TF2_bots? Keeping that in mind, will Giants/Admins be able to use those commands?

[KBF]

Does...does that mean when he gets older, if he gets less annoying...we'll have to replace him?

:smalleek:

If he DOES get older (which I have trouble believing) we will replace him as mascot in name only. We will always keep him around as a reminder of the good times had of people yelling at him for having a slightly higher pitched voice.

That and Ninjews is actually a pretty cool guy kid guy. eh pisses off jerks and doesnt afraid of anything.

[Imposter]

Hey, was there ever anything definitive on why my map crashes the server? Not knowing really gets on my nerves. And I'm still really curious on how it would play.

Sorry, I'm kinda obsessive about the stuff I make when it doesn't work.

[AlterForm]

There was recently a post on the TF2 blog asking for feedback on bots.

I was wondering if anyone else liked the idea of scheduling a game (similar to the weekend 6v6s) of humans vs bots on the server?

[Imposter]

I'd certainly be interested, but I'm not sure how well it would work.

Yeah, definitely interested.

[Phase]

Oh man, that'd be kick-ass.

[Worira]

I suspect that would be very, very easy to win.

[KBF]

I suspect that would be very, very easy to win.

I just played a game, substituting bots for both my allies and enemies. They will surprise you. Their straightforward tactics are.. Effective.

[Rutskarn]

I think we should have, like, one bot at all times. We'd name him Eduardo, and he'd be like a server pet.

[chiasaur11]

I think we should have, like, one bot at all times. We'd name him Eduardo, and he'd be like a server pet.

We should have 2. One for each team. They can be Eduardo and Also Eduardo.

[Belobog]

We should have 2. One for each team. They can be Eduardo and Also Eduardo.

What would happen when there's no one on the server? Would it be jsut...Eduardo and Also Eduardo?

[Worira]

As soon as the last player leaves, they put away their weapons and take out the tea set.

[Jibar]

We should have 2. One for each team. They can be Eduardo and Also Eduardo.

Have you been in my Pinata Garden?

[Phase]

We should have 2. One for each team. They can be Eduardo and Also Eduardo.

They should both be named Lopez. Come on, guys, such an easy reference.

[Thanatos 51-50]

They should both be named Lopez. Come on, guys, such an easy reference.

Well, that's either a RvB or an X-Com referance.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Hey, was there ever anything definitive on why my map crashes the server? Not knowing really gets on my nerves. And I'm still really curious on how it would play.

Sorry, I'm kinda obsessive about the stuff I make when it doesn't work.

Honestly, I probably installed it wrong. Potato: Could you redownload and reinstall cp-koth_2fort, located a page or two back?

I also completely support Eduardo and Also Eduardo. :smallbiggrin:

[watsyurname529]

Yes, I also approve of the server bots named Eduardo.

Question: Can anyone use the tf_bot commands or just giant/admins, or just admins?

[Darth Mario]

They should both be named Lopez. Come on, guys, such an easy reference.

Clearly RED gets Lopez and BLU gets Shelia. Or Gary, depending.

[potatocubed]

There should be an entity somewhere in the level which tells TF2 what sort of level it is and what win conditions it's looking for, among other things. The game does read the first pre-underscore bit of text of the filename, but that doesn't affect the way the level plays.

EDIT: Wait. The post I was replying to has vanished. :smallconfused:

EDIT EDIT: I can't do any downloading or uploading or other debugging at the moment because I'm away from my gaming PC until the 2nd or 3rd of January. All I have is this feeble laptop.

[Jahkaivah]

Yeah I deleted my post under consideration that I probably ought to take a look at the map first before complicating matters with theories that are complete bull.

Then I can complicate matters with an educated theory which is complete bull.

[The Linker]

Man, these bots are fun. Going in not knowing what to expect, they really impressed me with how much they could do. I didn't expect engineers building and maintaining sentries and dispensers, for one.

Sniper bots are OP, though. Had one on Nucleus in a big 11v12 bot fight who got about six dominations and twice the score of the next guy. Who himself was a Sniper with a big lead on the rest. Definitely good at gettin' those headshots.

[Nano]

They're also a bit too noise/footstep sensitive. Makes spying especially rough.

[Imposter]

After playing 1v1 with a bot for a while, I seem to have started assigning personalities to the various class bots. Soldierbot I can respect. Demobot isn't that bright, but he's damn good at close range stuff. And Pyrobot likes to spawncamp. I hate her...

But yeah, the bots are pretty good. They can't deal with snipers well, and all but the pyro AI puts to high of a priority on the point, but they're still impressive.

[Dread Cthulhu]

Yeah. Ninjews is like our shrill irritating mascot.

There are mascots who aren't shrill and irritating?

[TheLogman]

I had a handful of suggestions for the server just from what I've seen playing on it.

Take these, of course, with a grain of salt, since I'm just a regular, not a Giant or anything, but I feel like things could be smoother.

This is mostly concerning gimmick rounds:

I like gimmick rounds. They are really really fun. But, today there was a lot of confusion and it made for some sad times for some people.

Some ideas:

1. Have the gimmick rounds be available by vote, instead of just declaring them by vocal majority. It seems more fair that way. Maybe the most fun ones (Period Weapons, Low Grav Heavies, Yakkety Sax Scouts) could be in a pre-set vote. Then, the admins could just put out a vote of "Gimmick Round?".

2. If a round is declared, we should probably tell people in chat and over voice. And maybe do one of those on-screen flashy admin things. That way we can declare: "Gimmick Round, in order to participate do this:, or play as this class, use these weapons:".

3. Be a little bit more careful with admin powers please. Wilson was a great player who I had been playing with for a few days, and he was getting to be a regular, but prematurely slaying him ended off chasing him away. Xjino or something was an okay guy, but punishing him when he was following the rules led to him flaming us and eventually I assume led to his kicking/banning.

4. Kicks before bans please. Bans should only really be for terra-bad stuff. Not following a gimmick round or speaking out of turn should only be a kick unless it is repeated or of an intense severity.

5. In most votes, the top choice is chosen. This is less true with map choices, and very very true with everything else. I have no clue how to fix this, except more voting possibilities than just "Yes" or "No". Example: Instead of voting for an immediate switch to red fort, maybe we could vote for a switch to red fort, staying on the current map, or switching to a map other than red fort. Then the admin could just trigger the rtv menu if the third choice was the most picked.

I've just seen server regulars chased away once or twice and a few people turned against the server because we're the "admin abuse" server. Now, of course, we've maintained the "If you don't like it, just don't use our server" policy, but I feel like people wouldn't have to not like the server if we just ran things a little smoother. I'm also not saying we have had admin abuse, but if we make the whole server, the gimmick rounds in particular, a little bit more transparent, it could be easier for everyone.

Just my 2 cents. Once again, it's not that important, just some ideas I've had.

[KBF]

3. Be a little bit more careful with admin powers please. Wilson was a great player who I had been playing with for a few days, and he was getting to be a regular, but prematurely slaying him ended off chasing him away. Xjino or something was an okay guy, but punishing him when he was following the rules led to him flaming us and eventually I assume led to his kicking/banning.

Aww what? I liked Wilson. Can you give any further details?


4. Kicks before bans please. Bans should only really be for terra-bad stuff. Not following a gimmick round or speaking out of turn should only be a kick unless it is repeated or of an intense severity.

As far as I know this had always been Djinn's intent, but we don't actually have rules for this kind of thing.


5. In most votes, the top choice is chosen. This is less true with map choices, and very very true with everything else. I have no clue how to fix this, except more voting possibilities than just "Yes" or "No". Example: Instead of voting for an immediate switch to red fort, maybe we could vote for a switch to red fort, staying on the current map, or switching to a map other than red fort. Then the admin could just trigger the rtv menu if the third choice was the most picked.

I'd really like to see people change the nextmap and timeleft variables so that we change after the current round, as opposed to the changelevel command. I usually enjoy the game we're playing when "Hey guys, lets change to the sniper-camp community level that KBF hates!" And then off we go.


Just my 2 cents. Once again, it's not that important, just some ideas I've had.

Opinions are valuable. Thanks for sharing.

[Faulty]

A few of these relate to me.


1. Have the gimmick rounds be available by vote, instead of just declaring them by vocal majority. It seems more fair that way. Maybe the most fun ones (Period Weapons, Low Grav Heavies, Yakkety Sax Scouts) could be in a pre-set vote. Then, the admins could just put out a vote of "Gimmick Round?".

Rut and I were talking about this. I made a vote to suggest a gimmick round and it got something like 60% of the votes and Rut suggested only starting gimmick rounds at 80%.


3. Be a little bit more careful with admin powers please. Wilson was a great player who I had been playing with for a few days, and he was getting to be a regular, but prematurely slaying him ended off chasing him away. Xjino or something was an okay guy, but punishing him when he was following the rules led to him flaming us and eventually I assume led to his kicking/banning.

Sorry about slaying wilson. I asked who the soldier on the roof was and someone said wilson so I slayed him to prevent him for dominating the point and it turned out that it was not, in fact, wilson. I apologized to him. That was unintentional. I was trying to get the soldier who was blocking off the point. As for xjino wasn't following the gimmick round and I asked him to, at which pointed he started flaming us. Rut and I both asked him to stop and he did not desist. He wasn't kicked or banned because he eventually stopped doing it. He left the server of his own volition.


5. In most votes, the top choice is chosen. This is less true with map choices, and very very true with everything else. I have no clue how to fix this, except more voting possibilities than just "Yes" or "No". Example: Instead of voting for an immediate switch to red fort, maybe we could vote for a switch to red fort, staying on the current map, or switching to a map other than red fort. Then the admin could just trigger the rtv menu if the third choice was the most picked.

Related to this: if there's a large number of people requesting we transfer to a map that can't be rtved to due to recent playing, would a 60% agreement to switch suffice?

[potatocubed]

Sorry about slaying wilson. I asked who the soldier on the roof was and someone said wilson so I slayed him to prevent him for dominating the point and it turned out that it was not, in fact, wilson. I apologized to him. That was unintentional. I was trying to get the soldier who was blocking off the point.

Wait... is there more to this story, or did you slay a player just because he was kicking your ass?

[shadow_archmagi]

Two thoughts, here.

First off, it'd be great if we could change the voting system such that the ONLY options were 5-9. I'm tired of finding that not only did I pull my shotgun out a second too late, but I also voted for 2fort. (shudder)

Second, I dislike gimmick rounds. On [TDR] (which used to be the ZMF server until the big split) we could do gimmick rounds with efficiency and fun. On [ChHa] I've been noticing that not only are the admins prone to do wonky things, but the players have no real respect for them. Players who do not respect the gimmick round kill the gimmick round.

Case in point: To my shame, awhile back, I wanted to get an achievement. Djinn volunteered to let me sticky jump and then kill him with the bottle in midair. So he used his admin powers to turn black, posted "DO NOT KILL THE BLACK SOLDER" in the giant white admin letters, and then started to walk over to the Blue spawn. He got there, I placed my sticky, got ready to jump, and then a blue soldier shot him.

Djinn sent a second message in through text, asked politely in voice chat, and the scenario repeated itself three times before we kicked the guy. Either [ChHa] possesses, I dunno, foreigners, or illiterates who play with the sound off, or people just don't care at all about doing what an admin says.

[Volug]

Hm, the mod talk reminds me, who was the guy that was obsessed with Kicking himself when the server started...? Something says it was KBF...

Also, I'm actually on the server frequently now, yays.

[Darth Mario]

Two thoughts, here.

First off, it'd be great if we could change the voting system such that the ONLY options were 5-9. I'm tired of finding that not only did I pull my shotgun out a second too late, but I also voted for 2fort. (shudder)

Note the existence of the !revote command in case of such terrible accidents as this one. I have hurriedly typed it in embarrassment after voting for the likes of Junction and Egypt many a time.

[Dread Cthulhu]

Wait... is there more to this story, or did you slay a player just because he was kicking your ass?

I can attest on Fault's behalf that he was playing soldier when everyone else was gimmicking up a medieval round.

Also, SHUT UP ABOUT JUNCTION AND EGYPT. And, to a lesser extent, 2Fort.

[KBF]

Hm, the mod talk reminds me, who was the guy that was obsessed with Kicking himself when the server started...? Something says it was KBF...

Also, I'm actually on the server frequently now, yays.

Hm? Oh, that was when the admin console wasn't installed and all I had was rcon. I wanted to use my hard learned powers, but nobody was really acting up.. So I kicked myself a few times to make sure I had the process down. And because I found it hilarious.

I also might have banned Charizard for 30 seconds to see if I could, but that's just a rumor. JUST A RUMOR.

[Fawkes]

You guys remember when Onasuma banned himself? Priceless.

[Rutskarn]

That's a story to tell the grandchildren.

[potatocubed]

Alright, I've knocked together some admin rules/guidelines for the server. They're kind of arbitrary at the moment, so let me know if there are any glaring errors or omissions:

The server is for normal people playing the game. This trumps pretty much anything else. The exception, I think, is the occasional gimmick round – those kind of have to be imposed on everyone, so I would just ask that they be instantiated in moderation and broadly advertised.

Abusive is not the same as annoying. Just because you do not like someone is no excuse for kicking, banning, gag/muting, etc.

Warn people first. Ask them to stop doing what they're doing. If they persist, then get stuck in with the admin powers.

When to Kick: When people won't comply with a gimmick round; when people persist in being abusive after being asked to stop.

When to Ban: When someone is a raging *******. This includes griefing. If someone keeps coming back after repeated kicks and persisting in their behaviour, that qualifies.

Gag/Mute: Hitting someone with both of these is the equivalent of a kick. Personally, I would much rather you just use kick - stripping someone of their ability to communicate annoys me immensely - but there are times when gag/mute is the better option so I'm not going to forbid it.

Music is micspam. If you can get a unanimous 'yes' vote on playing music, go ahead. Otherwise, don't.

Your Other Powers: This is the tricky one, so I'm leaving it out of the spoiler for emphasis. Admins and giants have various fun powers - slap, slay, disco, drug, etc. It's a shame to have all these powers and never use them for anything.

But... your responsibility as admins is to enhance the game experience of everyone on the server. Sometimes a minute of disco mode will be a laugh. Sometimes it's just annoying. Sometimes launching other players like rockets is fun. Sometimes it's admin abuse. It's always going to be a judgement call based on who's on and what they're doing, so there really aren't any hard and fast rules. If you can't make that call, or you consistently get it wrong, you're probably not cut out for admin work.

[TheLogman]

This is what I was looking for.

Thanks potato.

I know this is more of a conditional subjective thing, but with regards to when to trigger gimmick rounds or admin-switch rounds, what's a good guideline for that?

I'd recommend not doing it unless at least 75 or even 80% of the playerbase agrees. Because trying to impose a gag round when nobody is interested or when just one guy wants to play causes trouble for everyone.

Democracy makes the game much more fun. As long as extraordinary for the lulz admin action (other than rules imposition and the like) is supported by the majority, preferably more than that, then people are more likely to play along or leave, rather than going out in flames.

[Valaqil]

Music is micspam. If you can get a unanimous 'yes' vote on playing music, go ahead. Otherwise, don't.

I think I'll say, generally, that I agree with what potatocube posted above, and like most of logman's ideas on the last page. (Good ones.)

I'm a little curious about the one quoted above. Tonight, for example, we had probably a good ten people singing Bohemian Rhapsody at once, and we enjoyed a couple of other songs(Queen!). OTOH, I know there was at least one person, maybe two, who said that they didn't want the music. Is 90% good enough? 95? Or are we going strict 100? (I don't care, personally. I like the music, but never play it and don't find it necessary. I just want to be sure of this one since we have lots of music vs no music votes.)

[shadow_archmagi]

OTOH, I know there was at least one person, maybe two, who said that they didn't want the music. Is 90% good enough? 95? Or are we going strict 100?

I was that one!

I also noticed a repetition of a common server theme. I quickly muted the guy playing music (guy named Salomon), but for a good half hour, I heard phase and other GITP admins going

"HEY. SALOMON. NO. MUSIC TIME IS OVER NOW. STOP IT. STOP IT."

This is the sort of thing that I see a lot. No respect for admins.

[Faulty]

Wait... is there more to this story, or did you slay a player just because he was kicking your ass?

As Dread said, it was a gimmick round and everyone was complying except a single person, a soldier. Besides the fact that he was not complying, he was in a position no one could reach due to rocket jumping and the fact that everyone except huntsman snipers were using melee. I responded by reminding him it was a gimmick round, and asking him to switch. Upon a few admonishments from both myself and Rutskarn, I told him that I would slay him if he didn't comply and that if he didn't switch upon respawn, he would be kicked. I asked the BLU team who the soldier on the roof was, so I would know who to slay/kick, and someone said "wilson", when in fact it was NOT wilson, who had just before switched away from soldier. So I accidentally slay wilson. He says he had complied. I apologize profusely. I ask his name again, someone tells me, I slay him, he respawns, someone on BLU says that he still has not switched, so I told him he was welcome back when he wished to follow the rules and kicked him.

tl;dr: Both Rut and I told a guy to comply with a gimmick round multiple times, he refused, I slayed him to try and get him to comply, he still did not, so I kicked him.


Alright, I've knocked together some admin rules/guidelines for the server. They're kind of arbitrary at the moment, so let me know if there are any glaring errors or omissions:

The server is for normal people playing the game. This trumps pretty much anything else. The exception, I think, is the occasional gimmick round – those kind of have to be imposed on everyone, so I would just ask that they be instantiated in moderation and broadly advertised.

Abusive is not the same as annoying. Just because you do not like someone is no excuse for kicking, banning, gag/muting, etc.

Warn people first. Ask them to stop doing what they're doing. If they persist, then get stuck in with the admin powers.

When to Kick: When people won't comply with a gimmick round; when people persist in being abusive after being asked to stop.

When to Ban: When someone is a raging *******. This includes griefing. If someone keeps coming back after repeated kicks and persisting in their behaviour, that qualifies.

Gag/Mute: Hitting someone with both of these is the equivalent of a kick. Personally, I would much rather you just use kick - stripping someone of their ability to communicate annoys me immensely - but there are times when gag/mute is the better option so I'm not going to forbid it.

Music is micspam. If you can get a unanimous 'yes' vote on playing music, go ahead. Otherwise, don't.

Your Other Powers: This is the tricky one, so I'm leaving it out of the spoiler for emphasis. Admins and giants have various fun powers - slap, slay, disco, drug, etc. It's a shame to have all these powers and never use them for anything.

But... your responsibility as admins is to enhance the game experience of everyone on the server. Sometimes a minute of disco mode will be a laugh. Sometimes it's just annoying. Sometimes launching other players like rockets is fun. Sometimes it's admin abuse. It's always going to be a judgement call based on who's on and what they're doing, so there really aren't any hard and fast rules. If you can't make that call, or you consistently get it wrong, you're probably not cut out for admin work.

Perfect. Totally agree on everything. By the way, something I talked to Djinn about but would also like to talk to you about. What words are acceptable and what are not. I, for example, find "bitch" to be offensive, but I know many don't, so I've stopped admonishing people for it. So just what I am currently opperating on:

Racial slurs: Immediate ban.
[homophobic slur that doubles as a slang for "cigarette"]: Immediate kick,
"Gay": Warn, then kick.
Slut/whore: Warn, then kick.
Cursing or insults directed at a fellow player: Warn, then kick.

Your thoughts?


This is what I was looking for.

Thanks potato.

I know this is more of a conditional subjective thing, but with regards to when to trigger gimmick rounds or admin-switch rounds, what's a good guideline for that?

I'd recommend not doing it unless at least 75 or even 80% of the playerbase agrees. Because trying to impose a gag round when nobody is interested or when just one guy wants to play causes trouble for everyone.

Democracy makes the game much more fun. As long as extraordinary for the lulz admin action (other than rules imposition and the like) is supported by the majority, preferably more than that, then people are more likely to play along or leave, rather than going out in flames.

I'd agree with Rutskarn's suggestion of 80% for gimmick rounds.

[Vitruviansquid]

Racial slurs: Immediate ban.
[homophobic slur that doubles as a slang for "cigarette"]: Immediate kick,
"Gay": Warn, then kick.
Slut/whore: Warn, then kick.
Cursing or insults directed at a fellow player: Warn, then kick.


Ranking a because it implies that some kinds of discrimination are more acceptable than others. Instead, why not make the rule

"Racial/sexual/religious discriminatory language is unacceptable. Use it once and be warned, use it again and be banned."

This single rule is also a lot easier to remember than having an individual consequence for each offense.

[KBF]

Ranking a because it implies that some kinds of discrimination are more acceptable than others.

This may not have occurred to you, but it's actually that some discrimination is more purposeful than others. Hence why calling someone a female dog is occasionally acceptable (and usually acceptable when not referring to anyone) and referring to a cigarette (and not actually meaning a cig) is blatantly unacceptable.

I'm not a fan of zero-tolerance policies. Blanket rules with no written room for interpretation.. They don't work out too well.

[Vitruviansquid]

"Zero tolerance" refers more to the manner in which a rule is enforced than the rule itself. This is why admins are people and not machines, so they can determine when it's necessary to enforce the rules. And when it's really time to put your foot down as the admin, wouldn't you rather be able to say "you weren't really supposed to be doing that, but I was being lenient before since nobody complained" than "this isn't really in the rules, but since you're being such a huge ******* to everyone, I feel the need to penalize you"?

[KBF]

I like to say both, actually. It gives me fuzzy feelings inside when I get to remove annoying people that are only detrimental to the experiences of the server as a whole or the server's intended guests.

EDIT: Looking back at this comment.. I might be fascist, I guess? Take THAT, Faulty!

[Phase]

I dunno, I let all but red-level curses (and any slurs of course) slide.

The thing is, I don't think anything should be an immediate kick, everything should have a warning first. People have different comfort levels, some people may frequent servers where cursing and slurs are commonplace. Are we to instantly ban people from out server because they made a false assumption, or it slipped out? They could be a great person who just so happens to be a potty-mouth now and then. (Related, I'm surprised you find 'bitch' offensive, Faulty, considering your sailor's tongue.)

Someone who, when killed, says "Aww, you ****wit." Should be severely warned and, should he respond with any disrespect or engage in further inappropriate behavior, be kicked.

However, I admit that if someone says "So-and-So, you infantile ****muffin, do that again and I'll **** your ****, ******" Then yes, an immediate kick or ban is in order. They are not the type for our server.

tl;dr Innocent until proven guilty (of being an arse.)

[Narazil]

I dunno, I let all but red-level curses (and any slurs of course) slide.

The thing is, I don't think anything should be an immediate kick, everything should have a warning first. People have different comfort levels, some people may frequent servers where cursing and slurs are commonplace. Are we to instantly ban people from out server because they made a false assumption, or it slipped out? They could be a great person who just so happens to be a potty-mouth now and then. (Related, I'm surprised you find 'bitch' offensive, Faulty, considering your sailor's tongue.)

Someone who, when killed, says "Aww, you ****wit." Should be severely warned and, should he respond with any disrespect or engage in further inappropriate behavior, be kicked.

However, I admit that if someone says "So-and-So, you infantile ****muffin, do that again and I'll **** your ****, ******" Then yes, an immediate kick or ban is in order. They are not the type for our server.

tl;dr Innocent until proven guilty (of being an arse.)
I'm very often guilty of calling others something in the genre of female dogs and the like. Person: "Oh, I'm on a 50-0 score" Me: "Oh you *****!".
Of course, I don't actually mean it.
If someone says to me they think it's offensive, I of course stop instantly, but being kicked/banned without warning seems very harsh for something some people are simply used to..
Like using the "British" word for a cigarette, which I personally do a lot. Would hate to be banned over a coffinnail, here.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Alright. A few thoughts.

If a player refuses to cooperate in a gimmick round, make sure to communicate in both text and voice...some players lack a headset. sm_csay "text" is your friend, as they can't miss it unless they're blind. If they fail to comply, remove their weapons: the slay command just angers people.

sm_vote "question here" yes no is also your friend. Don't do anything crazy without at least a 60% majority.

Save your fun commands for when it's mainly or entirely GitP/ChHa members or pubbies we've come to know and love. New players will be scared off...old players may find it enjoyable.

Communication is your first line of defense...and your second, and third, and so on until it becomes clear that no amount of communication will solve the problem. Don't resort to that Admin panel right away: it's the easy way out, and doesn't really solve the problem.

If these things continue to be problems, I'm ready and willing to cut out number of admins by a large percentage, reduce the overall power of the Giants, and simply hand a 75+% majority Vote Kick function to the server. It might be that we've simply handed out to much power to to many people, and, as such, we've lost respect for those with the power.

I know that I personally am usually listened to...this may be how I handle situations, or that I rarely wield the power, or that I make my presence as an Admin known through the occasional server operation/green text issue...I'm not sure. All I know is that I haven't been encountering obstinate players much.

Thoughts?

[NeoVid]

Well, I think that's pretty reasonable, though personally I hope admins who haven't abused their abilities don't get our powers cut down. I've only needed to use mine once, but I wanted them because I'm often on at times no other group members are, and the server is usually a $#!+hole if it's full of non-GitPs, and I'd rather not be driven out of my own group's server.

My method for stopping troublemakers is

1)Warn (glad to know the command for the BIGASS ADMIN TEXT now)

2)Punish (remove weapons or drug or teleport somewhere unpleasant) once

3)Give 'em the boot

But, again, I've only had to do that once, and then I didn't even have to finish step 2.

Though there was the memorable time that I got on, mentioned over alltalk that an admin was now on, and half the players immediately left.

Edit: Hey, can we get a list of all the admin commands that aren't shortcutted in our admin menu, conveniently in one post we can look up while in game?

[Dispozition]

sm_csay is my friend. I find most people ignore my mic, which either means they don't like my voice or it's not working, but hey, whatever. I'll normally give a voice warning and text box warning, then a csay warning, then just kick. If they come back and stop, awesome, if they continue, another kick. After that, bans are up for grabsies. I'll normaly only ban for an hour or so, since by the end of it they'll have either stopped playing or moved onto another server. If a guy I know I've banned before is being an idiot, I'll do it for a week or so. I need to use sm_kick more often as well, instead of using the admin console.

I'm probably one of the most lienient admins... I also won't do gimmicks without about 75% of a yes on a vote.

Also, with 8 mods and 8 admins, it's a bit power heavy...In my opinion, it should really be about 4 mods, 3 admins, at most...It just seems ridiculous when you can almost populate the whole server with purely mods or admins...

[potatocubed]

Okay, I am mollified regarding the soldier-slaying. I just misunderstood what had happened and, given the strong temptation I have sometimes to just /sm_slay people who are dominating me (i.e. everyone sooner or later), I jumped to conclusions.

Anyways, swearing. Hmm. It's tricky to set a policy on this because it's a matter of both quantity and quality. I also think the occasional expletive is perfectly justified in the sort of circumstances that crop up in a TF2 game: "****, it's 2fort!" for example.

In terms of quantity, I would say a good rule of thumb is one expletive per sentence. Once someone starts going over that they probably need to calm down or learn some actual words.

For quality... I'm loath to put a level of banninating on individual words. What is considered offensive, and the level of offence, varies from person to person. My inclination is to say that if you find something offensive, speak up. Issue a polite request not to speak like that, then follow it with a kick if necessary. I'm working on what's going to go on the front page, which should include "No racial/homphobic/religious slurs." so people know what to expect.

I think 80% approval is a good number for gimmick rounds, etc. We can adopt that as a rule and adjust it if necessary later.

On the subject of music... mumblegrumble. I personally loathe music spam, especially since a) I usually have my own music playing and b) it usually comes through to me as a distorted mess of white noise. So perhaps the 100% requirement is more my personal outlook.

[Faulty]

I'm working on what's going to go on the front page, which should include "No racial/homphobic/religious slurs." so people know what to expect.

Can we had gendered insults to that? So no calling a woman a "dumb slut" or some such.

[Fawkes]

Can we had gendered insults to that? So no calling a woman a "dumb slut" or some such.

What if we call a dude or an androgynous player a dumb slut?

Looking at you, Jibar.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Can we had gendered insults to that? So no calling a woman a "dumb slut" or some such.

Again, there's no hard-and-fast rule. For example...my friend DirtyS fully expects me to say things like "you dirty whore" to her when we're playing TF2 and she dominates me or ends a great spree or something. Hell...even if we're on the same team and she lets me (her Medic) die. She's definitely female, but she'd be worried if I didn't say things like that to her.

It's entirely in jest, of course, and she's not offended...which I feel is the important part. Tone, intent, and the perceived reception by the second party are what we should be judging. Also, if only the perceived reception is bad, don't punish...if the tone and intent was joking, just ask them nicely to not do it again. If it was intended as a joke and the second party didn't appreciate it, that's no reason to kick someone...it was meant to be harmless, after all.

[Jibar]

What if we call a dude or an androgynous player a dumb slut?

Looking at you, Jibar.

Hey hey hey those are just rumours.

Ugly, possibly true rumours that in no way involve Blackfox, Rabbit and Ego.

[Player_Zero]

Oh Jibar, you used to be cool.

[Jibar]

Oh Jibar, you used to be cool.

Now I go around the country delivering talks on how Crowbars ruined my life.

I can't do that rock and roll life anymore, man. I got a Baby to look after. It's not mine but God damn it it took the bait I own it now.

[potatocubed]

Can we had gendered insults to that? So no calling a woman a "dumb slut" or some such.

See, the thing is I need a one-line rule that can go on the splash page that is both more specific than "Don't be offensive" and less specific than a ranked list of offensive words and contexts.

That said, the old d20 splash screens were quite informative without any specific rules on. Ack - food's up. Will return later.

[Faulty]

Again, there's no hard-and-fast rule. For example...my friend DirtyS fully expects me to say things like "you dirty whore" to her when we're playing TF2 and she dominates me or ends a great spree or something. Hell...even if we're on the same team and she lets me (her Medic) die. She's definitely female, but she'd be worried if I didn't say things like that to her.

It's entirely in jest, of course, and she's not offended...which I feel is the important part. Tone, intent, and the perceived reception by the second party are what we should be judging. Also, if only the perceived reception is bad, don't punish...if the tone and intent was joking, just ask them nicely to not do it again. If it was intended as a joke and the second party didn't appreciate it, that's no reason to kick someone...it was meant to be harmless, after all.

I can understand in a situation like that. Or in a situation where it's meant satirical a la this (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MMb8Csll9Ws). But generally I would advise against it and think that a gendered insult is no better than insulting people based on their sexual orientation.

I know it's going to be situational, but I think it should be counted in as something that, by rule of thumb, should be avoided.


See, the thing is I need a one-line rule that can go on the splash page that is both more specific than "Don't be offensive" and less specific than a ranked list of offensive words and contexts.

That said, the old d20 splash screens were quite informative without any specific rules on. Ack - food's up. Will return later.

Basically I mean something like this for the one line: "Racial/gendered/sexual/religious discriminatory language is unacceptable, and can result in kicks or bans."


(Related, I'm surprised you find 'bitch' offensive, Faulty, considering your sailor's tongue.)

It's not an issue of cursing. I just feel that 'bitch' along with the T, P and C slang terms for the vagina, when used in an insulting manner, perpetuate harmful (in this case sexist) aspects of our culture, just as racial slurs perpetuate racist ones, or using 'gay' to mean something negative perpetuates homophobic ones. I don't expect people to have as much of a problem with bitch as I do, but I feel like slut/whore/and the T/P/C words are reasonable things to prohibit on the server, except in certain cases (ex: using them in a positive sense, such as Djinn calling DirtyS a bitch by her consent and for her enjoyment). Similarly I would think that in the case of, say, a gay regular finding it amusing when he or she is called a fruitcake, it would be acceptable. I really draw the line at racial slurs though. I feel like that is never acceptable.

[Phase]

Basically I mean something like this for the one line: "Racial/gendered/sexual/religious discriminatory language is unacceptable, and can result in kicks or bans."

I like this one, mainly for the "can result in kicks or bans" part. It leaves some leniency for each admin or mod to use his judgement. Why have sentience if we don't use it to make judgements on the fly?

[Faulty]

To decide whether to get a large or extra large side of fries. Duh.

[Phase]

Precisely! What judgement is more important?

[Faulty]

My lunch today was like a flat bread wrap basically. It had fries IN THE WRAP. With a side of fries.

[memnarch]

Can a non-giant/admin ask for a team scramble?

[Faulty]

Yes. Type "scramble" sans quotation marks into general chat and it will record your scramble vote. After a certain number of votes, the teams will scramble. Also, only admins are capable of forcing scrambles, not giants.

Hey potato, speaking of... Yesterday I was in a game that was obviously imbalanced, and too few people voted to scramble, so I forced to a scramble. My reasoning was that the teams were definitely imbalanced, so even if the winning team didn't feel like a scramble, it would be the most conducive to fair game play. Is it OK for admin to scramble in situations like that?

[Nano]

I imagine that's what the command is for. If one team is getting absolutely rolled and they're the only ones voting to scramble then I think you're perfectly justified.

[Faulty]

I imagine that's what the command is for. If one team is getting absolutely rolled and they're the only ones voting to scramble then I think you're perfectly justified.

D:

Nano, I am going to challenge you on the field of honour.

[Surrealistik]

Lol, my Blutsauger medic *spanked* yo Eyelander wielding ass Alterform.

[Dispozition]

Oh, on the topic of swears, I'm subject to using them every so often, but one that I won't accept under any circumstances is the C word for certain female anatomy. That one is almost an instant kick from me. I'll always warn first, but I'll be telling them that if they do it again I'll be banning them for at least a day. I've been bought up with that word being the biggest no-no ever, and I can agree with that.

On the topic of the other swears, I'll occaisonally drop the F bomb at someone when they continually kill me, but in jest. Same with bastard or bitch.

[watsyurname529]

Okay, I've been gone for the last couple days and I've missed quite a bit on the forums here. After reading a bit and skimming the last few posts I have one thing, actually two things, to say.

First, the way I use my new-found Giant powers is I have to make the call is the act(s)/player(s) in question intending to be harmful or not. If it's not meant to be harmful, then it's fine. If it is, then the warning-kick-ban train is started. The second thing is an example of this in a game I was playing in a couple minutes ago.

Two players, Player_Zero and OctaneHugo started getting at each others throats over the map change (Redfort to koth_nucleus). I let it go for a while seeing if it would die down but they kept going and it was obvious that they were trying to win an insult-war. So over the chat I just asked them to stop and they did.

I just followed what I typed above. Were they trying to be harmful? Somewhat, as they kept going at it. So I just warned them, or really just asked them to stop, and they did. Problem averted.

Now I just need to get my game back after not playing for a few days.

[Dispozition]

Over Christmas (read now), server needs this (http://tf2wiki.net/wiki/Party_Mode). I can't do it since it's server cfg stuff, but hey, I can recommend it :P

[shadow_archmagi]

OctaneHugo

He's one of mine. Have reprimanded him.

[Dragor]

Okay, I've been gone for the last couple days and I've missed quite a bit on the forums here. After reading a bit and skimming the last few posts I have one thing, actually two things, to say.

First, the way I use my new-found Giant powers is I have to make the call is the act(s)/player(s) in question intending to be harmful or not. If it's not meant to be harmful, then it's fine. If it is, then the warning-kick-ban train is started. The second thing is an example of this in a game I was playing in a couple minutes ago.

Two players, Player_Zero and OctaneHugo started getting at each others throats over the map change (Redfort to koth_nucleus). I let it go for a while seeing if it would die down but they kept going and it was obvious that they were trying to win an insult-war. So over the chat I just asked them to stop and they did.

I just followed what I typed above. Were they trying to be harmful? Somewhat, as they kept going at it. So I just warned them, or really just asked them to stop, and they did. Problem averted.

Now I just need to get my game back after not playing for a few days.

Yeah, I was on the server at the time. You dealt with it really well, that's just the kind of admin intervention which I like to see.

[Volug]

To decide whether to get a large or extra large side of fries. Duh.

One does not simply eat his way into Dustbowl.

[Jahkaivah]

Over Christmas (read now), server needs this (http://tf2wiki.net/wiki/Party_Mode). I can't do it since it's server cfg stuff, but hey, I can recommend it :P

I thought we could have some nice Christmas Themed Maps.

[Rutskarn]

I wonder how abused the votes get on other servers. It's probably like, "How much do the unlocks suck?" or "SHOULD WE CHANGE TO DSTBOWL FOR THE FIFFTH TIME LOL".

On Counter-Strike servers, of course, it's all:


How high am I right now?


So high.
Duuuude.
Like, whoa, man.

[Dispozition]

Yeah, a decent amount of vote abuse is among us...But it's fun, and we don't take it too far. Also, seems I can put party mode on, but I turned it off because of a vote v.v

We also need to do some KOTH 12v12 human vs bots.

[Player_Zero]

Two players, Player_Zero and OctaneHugo started getting at each others throats over the map change (Redfort to koth_nucleus). I let it go for a while seeing if it would die down but they kept going and it was obvious that they were trying to win an insult-war. So over the chat I just asked them to stop and they did.


To be fair, he was trolling.

[Rutskarn]

Now, there's one thing I'd like to get into a bit. I guess, judging by the way you guys talk, I'm a little more of a Judge Dredd admin than y'all.

Don't get me wrong, I'll give warnings for stuff. The difference is, I don't kick for major offenses--I ban.

If somebody is coming into a server and making trouble, repeatedly calling people by sexual slurs and ignoring admin admonitions to stop, he is not someone we want on our goddamn server. Full stop, they're not somebody we want on board.

Let's say some guy comes in and starts acting like a twit, harassing and abusing players. I warn him, he doesn't stop. I kick him.

Once he gets the kick notice, he'll do one of two things:


Move on. He'll find another server that meets his bastardly sensibilities.
"What? Those *******s kicked me? Screw them, I'm coming back!" At which point, we have to suffer another offense before banning him.


The first option is as good as a ban, and the second option leads to one. Never does a kicked player go, "Well, I really loved playing on that server, and I didn't get the picture the first few times I was warned. I guess I'll come back and behave now."

There are thousands of servers out there. I'm sure outcasts can find somewhere else to play.

[Phase]

We need to put on party mode whenever an admin has a birthday.

[KBF]

We need to put on party mode whenever an admin has a birthday.

We need to put on party mode whenever anyone has a birthday.

I like Rutskarn's no-nonsense adminning more than the current system none of us follow.

[shadow_archmagi]

"Well, I really loved playing on that server, and I didn't get the picture the first few times I was warned. I guess I'll come back and behave now."

I HAVE HAD THAT PRECISE THOUGHT BEFORE

[Rutskarn]

I HAVE HAD THAT PRECISE THOUGHT BEFORE

Really? You've been repeatedly warned not to continue abusive behavior, and have not stopped--and then have wanted to return to the exact server that spurned you so you could play fair?

[Surrealistik]

Really? You've been repeatedly warned not to continue abusive behavior, and have not stopped--and then have wanted to return to the exact server that spurned you so you could play fair?

Well the kick does let them know that you're for real.

[Rutskarn]

If they're only behaving because they don't think there's an admin there, they can find another server.

[Surrealistik]

If they're only behaving because they don't think there's an admin there, they can find another server.

It may be that they're seeing what they can and can't get away with. Hell I do it myself, test the waters, see how strict the admins are, then adjust behaviour accordingly, unless they're such intolerable douches that I may as well go full monty for a ban.

[Rutskarn]

And if they give you a warning? What, are they just assuming you're kidding, or you're not really an admin? That's pretty bad form.

I'm not just talking bad language, or even slurs, here (for the most part). I'm talking about abuse. If they're abusive, and they don't stop being abusive, they can screw off forever.

This has been my personal policy, anyway, and that's why I'm bringing it up. I'll bow to the wishes of the admin, but for the most part I think a ban is a better tool than a kick.

[Surrealistik]

And if they give you a warning? What, are they just assuming you're kidding, or you're not really an admin? That's pretty bad form.

The moment they prove they have admin powers (usually in the form of a kick/gag/whatever), I stop. I'm not going to respond to random player X or Y and stop playing my fun soundbites as an example, because he thinks they're annoying when no one else on the server has a problem with them (or others even enjoy them).

[Dispozition]

The moment they prove they have admin powers (usually in the form of a kick/gag/whatever), I stop. I'm not going to respond to random player X or Y and stop playing my fun soundbites as an example, because he thinks they're annoying when no one else on the server has a problem with them (or others even enjoy them).

I'm going to say this. Don't play on our server please. You seem like a giant douchebag.

[Rutskarn]

The moment they prove they have admin powers (usually in the form of a kick/gag/whatever), I stop. I'm not going to respond to random player X or Y and stop playing my fun soundbites as an example, because he thinks they're annoying when no one else on the server has a problem with them (or others even enjoy them).

Yeah, but if he says, "Surrealistik, our policy is not to have soundbites, since we consider that micspamming. Please stop, or I'll be forced to eject you," you stop doing that. Frankly, if he boots you off, you have no real reason to complain.

[Fawkes]

I'm going to say this. Don't play on our server please. You seem like a giant douchebag.

Lulz were had. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_XmJT_3zbs&feature=related)

[Arbitrarity]

I'm going to say this. Don't play on our server please. You seem like a giant douchebag.

Says the guy who bound a key to slapping me, turns himself invisible, and gives everyone on the server godmode and 100% crits.

Oh, not to mention you did the same thing with the Ghostbusters theme. Except with a vote. Sure, some people disapproved. It was still played (not saying that wasn't awesome)

[watsyurname529]

Every Admin will deal with trouble makers in their own way and for the most part on our server, I think that's fine. Unless Rutskarn decides he's going to trade the Equalizer for his Banhammer and use it as such, we're fine.

Also I think party mode rounds would be fun. It should become mandatory if anyone says anything about someone having a birthday. Even if someone says, "Hey, it's [insert name here]'s birthday today!" we put on party mode. Immediately.

[Dogmantra]

Even if someone says, "Hey, it's [insert name here]'s birthday today!" we put on party mode. Immediately.

Even if they're lying?

[Faulty]

I do think Arbitrary has a point though.

[shadow_archmagi]

Really? You've been repeatedly warned not to continue abusive behavior, and have not stopped--and then have wanted to return to the exact server that spurned you so you could play fair?


Well, there's a fine line between "Oh ho ho ho, shadow you are such a bastard :smalltongue:" and "Shadow you are such a bastard :smallmad:"

There have been occasions where I get kicked and I'm sitting in the sudden quiet of the lobby and I'm like "Wha? Wait... hmph. Maybe I *did* cross that line."

[Dispozition]

Says the guy who bound a key to slapping me, turns himself invisible, and gives everyone on the server godmode and 100% crits.

Oh, not to mention you did the same thing with the Ghostbusters theme. Except with a vote. Sure, some people disapproved. It was still played (not saying that wasn't awesome)

Yeah, I'm toning down a lot now. And that was only for that game (although I may still have the bind), it was after a 6v6, and it was a fun round anyway.

[Phase]

Well, there's a fine line between "Oh ho ho ho, shadow you are such a bastard :smalltongue:" and "Shadow you are such a bastard :smallmad:"

There have been occasions where I get kicked and I'm sitting in the sudden quiet of the lobby and I'm like "Wha? Wait... hmph. Maybe I *did* cross that line."

I would never kick you! D: I know that whatever you say is in jest, purely!

[shadow_archmagi]

I would never kick you! D: I know that whatever you say is in jest, purely!

Oh, yes. I don't think I've had any such occasion on THIS server, (or any server at all, for quite some time), but it's still there.

[Dogmantra]

I would kick you...
but not from, y'know, the server

[Surrealistik]

I'm going to say this. Don't play on our server please. You seem like a giant douchebag.

Because I willfully disregard a minority opinion about something I and others find enjoyable? My god, the sheer douchiness!

Also, what's the point of a please, when you immediately follow that with the insinuation that I'm a "giant douchebag"?



Yeah, but if he says, "Surrealistik, our policy is not to have soundbites, since we consider that micspamming. Please stop, or I'll be forced to eject you," you stop doing that. Frankly, if he boots you off, you have no real reason to complain.

Sure, there's authority there, but if someone's just asking me to stop, I'm not gonna respond until he shows he can make me or there's some sort of majority consensus; not because I'm out to grief, but because I value my fun (and that of those who actually like what I'm doing).

[shadow_archmagi]

Because I willfully disregard a minority opinion about something I and others find enjoyable?

I think it's more about everything you've ever posted

[Surrealistik]

I think it's more about everything you've ever posted

I still don't see it, being as I've generally been courteous lately.

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

The moment they prove they have admin powers (usually in the form of a kick/gag/whatever), I stop. I'm not going to respond to random player X or Y and stop playing my fun soundbites as an example, because he thinks they're annoying when no one else on the server has a problem with them (or others even enjoy them).

Dispozition and Surrealistik, I'm going to nip this rising conflict here and say the following:

Surrealistik, whatever you do in game in your own time and on other servers is fine, and I'm not able to judge you. That said, if you come play on our sever, we have a list of admins on the first page of this thread. Given that you're from the playground, I'd appreciate it if you cooperated with them, or with anyone whose text shows up in green. They are admins/giants, and I'd much rather that you take that as proof that they can punish you than actually forcing the punishment upon yourself.

I assure you 100% that anyone who can type with their name in green is capable of muting/silencing/gagging/kicking or even banning you. Don't make them test their powers, as that makes everything less fun for everyone involved.

Thanks.

Now, let's drop this argument before it gets ugly.

[Rutskarn]

Well, there's a fine line between "Oh ho ho ho, shadow you are such a bastard :smalltongue:" and "Shadow you are such a bastard :smallmad:"

There have been occasions where I get kicked and I'm sitting in the sudden quiet of the lobby and I'm like "Wha? Wait... hmph. Maybe I *did* cross that line."

Yeah, and that really isn't your fault, right there. That's the fault of the admin who didn't give you a clear warning.

Believe me, if I give a warning, it's less, "Oh, you silly, silly person," and more, "xXKnobGoblin69Xx, stop yelling cheese at random intervals and calling your teammates ***s, or you will be de-invited to our server."

[Thanatos 51-50]

So, um...
I got beeped on over Steam and asked to kick somebody from the server.
Did I miss something? Were Mod powers bestowed upon me while I wasn't looking?

[Arbitrarity]

Nah, we get desperate. I tried asking Rutskarn to remove some trolls once, and was saddened because he lacked mod powers.

Incidentally, I'd really appreciate some sort of Dwarf powers or something. Just Gag/Mute/Kick seems like it'd be useful for eliminating the occasional troll, since it's enough to say "Hey, dude. I'm serious here".

[Thanatos 51-50]

When are we going to get that Chalkboard thingie to say things like:
"These are the rules!"
and
"Potatocubed pays for this server"
and
"These are the admins/mods"
?

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Incidentally, I'd really appreciate some sort of Dwarf powers or something. Just Gag/Mute/Kick seems like it'd be useful for eliminating the occasional troll, since it's enough to say "Hey, dude. I'm serious here".

Problem is that we're already very close to the "everyone has powers and there's no real chain of command" issue, as previously discussed. At this point, I'm more inclined to throw a "vote kick/vote mute" function over the server and then decrease the number of Admins/Giants...I think it would make those that we have find that more people listen to them.

I'm also thinking about getting one of those plugins that states whether or not Admins are on, and who they are. Thoughts?

[Arbitrarity]

Cool. That also seems reasonable. Means I get to exercise my shift-tab a bit more, but that's fine.
My desire is built off of a single instance anyways, where we had a team of trolls on the server, and I spent ~15 minutes trying to get someone with giant powers on. Was rather frustrating. Mind you, votes don't work so well with large groups of co-ordinated trolls, but that's what the mods are for after all.
Everyone remember This? (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7195931#post7195931) Was not fun.

[watsyurname529]

By the way, I'm online 90% of the time I'm logged in so if anyone needs some adminboots for some kicking or a banhammer, I can usually provide.

Plus, I think vote mute/kick would be useful (however honestly I don't want to lose my Giant power) because it takes the question off the admin in cases of questionable kicking. If the server wants them off, then there we go, problem solved. Plus that gives a glimmer of hope when there's no admin in sight.

[Dispozition]

Problem is that we're already very close to the "everyone has powers and there's no real chain of command" issue, as previously discussed. At this point, I'm more inclined to throw a "vote kick/vote mute" function over the server and then decrease the number of Admins/Giants...I think it would make those that we have find that more people listen to them.

I'm also thinking about getting one of those plugins that states whether or not Admins are on, and who they are. Thoughts?

I was thinking that to. I know that there's a Source Mod plugin that let's you give certain players custom chatbox intros, even music play when they come in (but we won't be using that).

[Dread Cthulhu]

give certain players custom chatbox intros

I dunno, that bit sounds alright to me.

[Fawkes]

My desire is built off of a single instance anyways, where we had a team of trolls on the server, and I spent ~15 minutes trying to get someone with giant powers on. Was rather frustrating.

When was this?

[onasuma]

To be honest, Im against voteable kick/ban/mute. It would be a bit iffy to draw the server line then. I think its better to keep things with a hard admin line.

Ok, Im struggling to get my point across in as much clarity as I would like - for summaries sake, Ill just say that it will cause issue between admins, giants and everyone else, when considering what a mute/ban/whatever is given for.

[Fawkes]

Well, everyone already has the ability to mute people at their discretion, so votemute strikes me as unnecessary. Voteban strikes me as too abuseable. Votekick seems like a good idea, but it would need a strong majority.

[onasuma]

Not everyone has mute. Those who do have a higher up (so to speak) people can complain to, all the way up to Potato and Djinn. If someone is vote kicked/muted/banned, they cant really go higher up - the populace spoke and therefore no one is accountable for those actions.

[Fawkes]

How do you not have mute? It's in the Esc menu.

[Dispozition]

How do you not have mute? It's in the Esc menu.

This. Votemute isn't needed, at all. Votekick should be fine so long as it's something like 80% for yes, or maybe even 90%, although 90% may be able to be abused if there's three people greiving.

@Dread Cthulhu: Yeah, my grammar wasn't great in that sentence, I only meant for the sound to be a no. I'd love a custom intro in the chatbox :P

[Dogmantra]

The thing with adding votekick to the server then reducing the amount of people who can kick or ban is that eventually you're going a situation, like one time when it was a couple of regulars and random people who dropped in, then 6 or 7 people all from the same clan came in and started generally being annoying. If everyone votekicked, that would still have only been 50% and they wouldn't have been kicked.

[watsyurname529]

Note to self and anyone else on the server: Don't do Sniper Only gimmick rounds when Arbitrary is in the server.

[watsyurname529]

Is it possible to have bots on our server? 'Cause I tried earlier today on koth_nucleus and couldn't get them to work.

[Belobog]

Note to self and anyone else on the server: Don't do Sniper Only gimmick rounds when Arbitrary is in the server.

Yeah, that...that was a bad idea. I can speak from experience on that one.

[memnarch]

I sometimes have the problem of my items being equipped, but I'm not using them while playing. Anyone else have this problem? :smallconfused:

[Dogmantra]

That's when the server loses connection to Steam. Kind of annoying when the only servers with players and empty slots are 24/7 2fort instant respawn servers, so I have to make a LAN match with bots to play with my brother and then I end up sucking because I've become so dependent on the C&D and Blutsauger, so I can't play my main or my psuedo-main.

[memnarch]

That's when the server loses connection to Steam. Kind of annoying when the only servers with players and empty slots are 24/7 2fort instant respawn servers, so I have to make a LAN match with bots to play with my brother and then I end up sucking because I've become so dependent on the C&D and Blutsauger, so I can't play my main or my psuedo-main.

Doesn't explain why I can temp fix it by reconnecting to the server and why other people still have their items. :smallyuk: