Where Girard's Gate REALLY is

[Kieran Cage]

Given that Girard is a master illusionist, trickster and all-around cunning deceptioner, some, part, or all of the recorded message could very well be code specifically designed to be understood only by other Scribble members. (As well as getting a few digs in at Soon in the process.)

This would rely on a specific notation that the Scribblers used as a shorthand in their travels.

The numbers mentioned by Girard:

"...you are at least 90 percent likely..."

"...who took two levels of ranger..."

"...if it's been no more than 12 weeks, I just won 10,000 gp..."

90. 2. 12. 10,000.

From a fixed position (such as facing due North, or another starting point frequently used by the Scribblies in their adventuring days...

Turn 90 degrees, two times. (Or 180 degrees. Due South, in this example.)

Travel 10,000 units of 12 (ie: feet=12 inches)

Or...

The gate is located 1.89 miles from here, due South.

And just for the heck of it...

"Say hello to your barnyard gods for me"

The heurestic magic for that recorded illusion will recognize that phrase as the appropriate password."


By the way, though I have been reading the strip and the comments for years, I just created my account this morning, when this thought struck me.

Of course with my luck, it was already posted somewhere in a thread I did not see, and summarily discounted. ;)

[Hatevah]

Or be 90/2=45 or some other more complicated process...either way, seems like a poor mechanism for hiding the location, because the good guys & the bad guys have an equal chance of figuring it out.

I expect that if the clue is embedded in the message Girard left, the mechanism would be a bit more obscure to someone who didn't know him/his other party members...but if he didn't want them to find it, the hints that the party members would pick up on would be misleading...

basically: too simple to be feasible, I think...but I don't have a better answer :(

[Renrik]

Given that Girard is a master illusionist, trickster and all-around cunning deceptioner, some, part, or all of the recorded message could very well be code specifically designed to be understood only by other Scribble members. (As well as getting a few digs in at Soon in the process.)

This would rely on a specific notation that the Scribblers used as a shorthand in their travels.

The numbers mentioned by Girard:

"...you are at least 90 percent likely..."

"...who took two levels of ranger..."

"...if it's been no more than 12 weeks, I just won 10,000 gp..."

90. 2. 12. 10,000.

From a fixed position (such as facing due North, or another starting point frequently used by the Scribblies in their adventuring days...

Turn 90 degrees, two times. (Or 180 degrees. Due South, in this example.)

Travel 10,000 units of 12 (ie: feet=12 inches)

Or...

The gate is located 1.89 miles from here, due South.

And just for the heck of it...

"Say hello to your barnyard gods for me"

The heurestic magic for that recorded illusion will recognize that phrase as the appropriate password."


By the way, though I have been reading the strip and the comments for years, I just created my account this morning, when this thought struck me.

Of course with my luck, it was already posted somewhere in a thread I did not see, and summarily discounted. ;)

You know the Da Vinci code? Put it down. Now.

[rewinn]

[QUOTE=Hatevah;7533834]
I expect that if the clue is embedded in the message Girard left, the mechanism would be a bit more obscure to someone who didn't know him/his other party members...but if he didn't want them to find it, the hints that the party members would pick up on would be misleading...
[QUOTE]

For example, what if Gerard didn't actually have 2 levels in Ranger? Then the discrepancy in the message would be obvious to his fellow Order of the Scribble members but to just about no-one else. The question then becomes, o.k., what data in the message are really clues and what data are distractors?

[TriForce]

Why would girard post clues to his fellow scribble members? if he want them to be able to find the gate he could have told them so, and if he didnt want it to be found its not really logical to post clues

[the_tick_rules]

It's an interesting idea. Of course there's no evidence to support this.

[Atronach]

Given that Girard is a master illusionist, trickster and all-around cunning deceptioner, some, part, or all of the recorded message could very well be code specifically designed to be understood only by other Scribble members. (As well as getting a few digs in at Soon in the process.)

This would rely on a specific notation that the Scribblers used as a shorthand in their travels.

The numbers mentioned by Girard:

"...you are at least 90 percent likely..."

"...who took two levels of ranger..."

"...if it's been no more than 12 weeks, I just won 10,000 gp..."

90. 2. 12. 10,000.

From a fixed position (such as facing due North, or another starting point frequently used by the Scribblies in their adventuring days...

Turn 90 degrees, two times. (Or 180 degrees. Due South, in this example.)

Travel 10,000 units of 12 (ie: feet=12 inches)

Or...

The gate is located 1.89 miles from here, due South.

And just for the heck of it...

"Say hello to your barnyard gods for me"

The heurestic magic for that recorded illusion will recognize that phrase as the appropriate password."


By the way, though I have been reading the strip and the comments for years, I just created my account this morning, when this thought struck me.

Of course with my luck, it was already posted somewhere in a thread I did not see, and summarily discounted. ;)

That definitely is an interesting theory on the topic... How long did that take for you to piece together?

[Kieran Cage]

That definitely is an interesting theory on the topic... How long did that take for you to piece together?

It quite literally came to me out of nowhere when I was occupied with something else entirely.

I do realize that there are no facts in evidence to support this, just a wild theory, but hey, that's what these threads are for.

The numbers just seemed so arbitrary to me since I first read them. Why a 90% chance? And why say "12 weeks" as opposed to 3 months? They just struck me as an odd way to phrase things, and couldn't help but wonder if there were a hidden meaning to them.

[Boogastreehouse]

I'm of the opinion that even if this exact cryptic message, or some similar variation, isn't applicable and truly concealed in Girard's speech (and it's certainly too soon for us to know for sure), I believe that this is definitely the sort of thinking that will lead the party to his gate. Good thinkin' Kieran Cage!

Riddles and misdirection.

I can't wait.



You know the Da Vinci code? Put it down. Now.

PS: The Da Vinci Code only wishes it could have been Foucault's Pendulum. I couldn't even get through the first chapter of the former, and I can't recommend the latter strongly enough. Give it a read.

[Nilan8888]

I'm of the firm opinion that Girard's gate's in the chamber next to the Donkey Wheel on LOST.

That or it's floating around in space atop the obilisk from 2001

[Kieran Cage]

I'm of the opinion that even if this exact cryptic message, or some similar variation, isn't applicable and truly concealed in Girard's speech (and it's certainly too soon for us to know for sure), I believe that this is definitely the sort of thinking that will lead the party to his gate. Good thinkin' Kieran Cage!

Riddles and misdirection.

I can't wait.


Thanks Boogas.

The thing that seems most striking to me is how many recent threads, posts, etc. seem to be dedicated to Girard's speech, and his attitude towards Soon.

It's one of the most divisive topics I've seen on the boards in recent memory, with nearly everyone jumping on to either say how Girard is either their new all time favorite fictional character ever, or the biggest idiot in history.

And all this based on accepting at face value, the recorded speech of a man who probably has more ranks in Bluff than Gil Grissom has in Spot.

Sure, it may yet prove to be on the up and up. But considering it is an epic level illusionist we are talking about, my money is still on things not being quite what they seem.

[Leolo]

I still believe that there are mountains near the gate, as Shojo picture in 276 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0276.html)

[Ronan]

It Can be right there. Both Xykon and the OotS know the plot(OotScribble)
Part of the deception may be the "it's not here". instead of "it's here but you gave me the wrong password"

[The Rose Dragon]

And why say "12 weeks" as opposed to 3 months?

Because 12 weeks, that is, 84 days, always contains fewer days than 3 months.

At least, according to the Solar calendar of Earth.

[DukeGod]

I still believe that there are mountains near the gate, as Shojo picture in 276 (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0276.html)

yeah but Shojo also thought it would be at where they are now...
since he mentioned coordinates it can be Lattitude/Longitude as well,they are usually measured in 5 numbers
so
90.212 Lat(North or South)
10.000 Long(East or West)
that leaves 4 locations,and we know each other took the rifts that are nearest to their hometowns,so find out where is Girard's hometown and take the location nearest to it

stretching it I think...

[Leolo]

yeah but Shojo also thought it would be at where they are now...

Yes.

But it would fit to the currently revealed backstory that shojo "knows" how the general location of the gate looks like (from Soon, who was there) but do not know the right coordinates. There are no additional assumptions to make, like "Girard was lying when he told he was lying" or "There is a hidden message in the message"

And if the image on 276 pictures only Girards faked gate location there would not be any reason to show mountains, because (as the order has proofed) there are no mountains at this coodinates.

So i believe 276 shows the true location. Maybe this could even be a way to teleport to the gate, if the OOTS finds a way to cast the spell. And if this image is sufficient for a teleport, of course.

And there is something more support for this theorie, as the map of the western continent (in 680) shows mountains surrounding the desert.

[magic9mushroom]

Thanks Boogas.

The thing that seems most striking to me is how many recent threads, posts, etc. seem to be dedicated to Girard's speech, and his attitude towards Soon.

It's one of the most divisive topics I've seen on the boards in recent memory, with nearly everyone jumping on to either say how Girard is either their new all time favorite fictional character ever, or the biggest idiot in history.

And all this based on accepting at face value, the recorded speech of a man who probably has more ranks in Bluff than Gil Grissom has in Spot.

Sure, it may yet prove to be on the up and up. But considering it is an epic level illusionist we are talking about, my money is still on things not being quite what they seem.

Law/Chaos is a big divide in RL. No **** it's going to cause arguments on internet forums when it's brought up.

[Fitzclowningham]

yeah but Shojo also thought it would be at where they are now...
since he mentioned coordinates it can be Lattitude/Longitude as well,they are usually measured in 5 numbers
so
90.212 Lat(North or South)
10.000 Long(East or West)
that leaves 4 locations,and we know each other took the rifts that are nearest to their hometowns,so find out where is Girard's hometown and take the location nearest to it

stretching it I think...

Could be something like this, but 90 degrees latitude is either the north or south pole...

Love the OP's interpretation; it's a great way to think about the kind of misdirection that is surely obscuring the gate. Given that Team Evil is thought to have the correct location, and Roy & Co. have no way to find them, they'll have to puzzle it out for themselves.

[DukeGod]

Could be something like this, but 90 degrees latitude is either the north or south pole...

Love the OP's interpretation; it's a great way to think about the kind of misdirection that is surely obscuring the gate. Given that Team Evil is thought to have the correct location, and Roy & Co. have no way to find them, they'll have to puzzle it out for themselves.

Kraagor's gate location it is then...
if Serini is alive she might be there and may give them the right location

[[TS] Shadow]

Umm...interesting. While that IS a really well thought out idea, I doubt that it's correct. Something tells me that Soon would be too ticked off at Girard (due to the insults) to notice all of those little clues, thus making such a code completely pointless. That's not even taking into account the fact that it's an oral message that's said once before the recipient is blasted by some explosion thingy.

[Sedgewood]

PS: The Da Vinci Code only wishes it could have been Foucault's Pendulum. I couldn't even get through the first chapter of the former, and I can't recommend the latter strongly enough. Give it a read.

Seconded, thirded, and fourthed.

[Fish]

But it would fit to the currently revealed backstory that shojo "knows" how the general location of the gate looks like (from Soon, who was there) but do not know the right coordinates.
If you're going to base any theories on the Order of the Scribble tale, in particular that the images in those panels represent images as described by Shojo, start here:

Shojo evidently knows what every member of the Order of the Scribble looks like — this has been confirmed not only by Start of Darkness but by the appearance of Girard. Shojo knows what the Snarl looks like. Shojo knew what a rift looked like even though he'd never seen one. Shojo knows what the freakin' Dawn of Time looks like. Shojo knows what the Gods of the East, who were destroyed by the Snarl before the world was created, looked like.
You can't go down that road because it leads to the town of Crazy, population you. It's not productive.

Just accept that Rich had to draw something to fill in those panels. Don't make any untoward assumptions about what Shojo knows based on what those illustrations look like.

[Thanatosia]

I agree with Fish. I think the things drawn in the panels are supposed to represent the true state of things, not reflect details Shojo actualy knows/describes. I can't see Shojo sitting there telling the order of the stick "and one of the gates was about 30 yards to the left of a pine tree, that grew on a rock, that was 30% covered with snow, lying in a snowy area, near a larger rock formation, that had some snow on parts of it".

No, thats just what the surrounding of the gate looks like seen through the omniscient lense of storyteller narration - its something we got to see that the actual characters in the story did not. It's like when Rich cuts to a scene showing what Team Evil is up to, we see that stuff, but the Order of the Stick does not. All the order of the stick heard was "They discovered five rifts, scattered across the world. Through diligent study and magical inquiry, they were able to guess at their nature" - the visual depictions that went along with those words in the strip are for us the readers and are not part of Shojo's naration.

Projections on the outside of the fourth wall if you will.

[Leolo]

Hey, Haley does even pickpocket her introduction image. And Elan does not knew how Xykon looks like when he summons his plot exposition. There is no strict separation about what the character knows and what Rich is telling us.

I do not believe that Shojo really knows these things. That is why there are "" arround the knows. But within the webcomic there is no 4th wall. I would not be surprised if Elan could go back and look what the real place looks like.

:smallsmile:

And it is not important if Shojo knew something about it. At least not for the question if the gate is anywhere near the orders current location.

[Kieran Cage]

And now we see (as of #696) that even Roy is surprised that Girard would automatically assume that Soon would break his oath.

I think the odds of the message being not entirely what it appears just went up.:smallcool:

EDIT: And as of 697, the original theory is still holding (unlike a lot of them) :smalltongue:

[Agi Hammerthief]

the Oracle has given a good clue where the gate is located

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0331.html

edit:
or did I interpret that wrong?

*double checks comic*


meh

[Tass]

PS: The Da Vinci Code only wishes it could have been Foucault's Pendulum. I couldn't even get through the first chapter of the former, and I can't recommend the latter strongly enough. Give it a read.

Not that I'll defend The Da Vinci Code (or Dan Brown for that matter), but not making it through the first chapter is hardly a good way to judge a book.

Its not "judging a book by its cover" but close.

[Kieran Cage]

the Oracle has given a good clue where the gate is located

http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0331.html

edit:
or did I interpret that wrong?

*double checks comic*


meh

Agi, I'm curious as to what you saw as a clue in the Oracle's words. Even if you did decide you interpreted it wrong, an incorrect guess can sometimes lead in the direction of a correct one.

All I could get from #331 is that either Xykon will head to Girard's Gate upon leaving Azure City (likely), or he will head to Kraagor's Gate by way of the Great Desert and just happen to come close to Girard's Gate by sheer coincidence (unlikely to the point of nigh-impossible.)

If you caught on to something that the rest of us may have overlooked, please share. :smallsmile:

[waterpenguin43]

My thoughts are that if it was a cryptic message, Elan would have figured it out.

[Kieran Cage]

My thoughts are that if it was a cryptic message, Elan would have figured it out.

<blinks and reads message again>

Elan?

Tallish, blond hair, carries a rapier, is dating Haley? That Elan?

In other words...This Elan (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0597.html)?

Is the person who will figure out the hidden code? (If one exists)

Ummmm...ok. I guess.

[Miklus]

...since he mentioned coordinates it can be Lattitude/Longitude as well,they are usually measured in 5 numbers
so
90.212 Lat(North or South)
10.000 Long(East or West)
that leaves 4 locations,and we know each other took the rifts that are nearest to their hometowns,so find out where is Girard's hometown and take the location nearest to it

stretching it I think...

I thought something similar, but with:
90.2 west (since they are on the western continent)
12.10 north or south, depending on where they are now.

Kudos to Kieran Cage for thinking of the numbers in the first place.

[Agi Hammerthief]

Agi, I'm curious as to what you saw as a clue in the Oracle's words. Even if you did decide you interpreted it wrong, an incorrect guess can sometimes lead in the direction of a correct one.

All I could get from #331 is that either Xykon will head to Girard's Gate upon leaving Azure City (likely), or he will head to Kraagor's Gate by way of the Great Desert and just happen to come close to Girard's Gate by sheer coincidence (unlikely to the point of nigh-impossible.)

If you caught on to something that the rest of us may have overlooked, please share. :smallsmile:
given that the gate aparently, isn't where its supposed to be I was thinking of a chance passing of Girard's Gate outside the desert.

somewhere in direct traveling route to Kraagor's Gate

my memory being as lousy as it is I now don't remember the reason for the "meh"

[Dr.Epic]

If his last name if Butler I bet it's in Sparta (get it?).

[Azukar]

If his last name if Butler I bet it's in Sparta (get it?).

Gerard, Girard, same diff :smalltongue:

[Dr.Epic]

Gerard, Girard, same diff :smalltongue:

Pronounced close enough and with a one letter difference.