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Aron Times
2009-12-19, 03:11 PM
I was going through my psion's inventory in the Character Builder when I noticed a new tab labeled, "Martial Practices." I click on it and I see three sample martial practices, a preview of Martial Power 2. Anyway, the three martial practices are:

1. Speech Without Words - At the cost of a healing surge, you can communicate with a creature that can't speak your language. Basically, a character with this martial practice is a master of nonverbal communication.

2. Precise Forgery - At the cost of a healing surge, you can make exceptional forgeries (think USA Network's White Collar series).

3. Alter Ego - For 50 gold and a healing surge, you can masterfully disguise yourself or an ally for 24 hours. The disguise is as good as a changeling's with the right outfit.

One thing you'll notice about these previewed martial practices is that they all cost a healing surge and a small amount of gold.

Discuss.

Hal
2009-12-19, 03:14 PM
Class feature? Feat? Utility power? How do you get these?

Aron Times
2009-12-19, 03:16 PM
Martial practices are the equivalent of rituals for martial characters. These are nonmagical techniques that martial characters can do because they are simply that awesome. I'm guessing that one of the main advantages of martial practices is that they are nonmagical, and do not show up on Detect Magic.

Duos Greanleef
2009-12-19, 03:17 PM
Are these one time investments or consumable items?

Aron Times
2009-12-19, 03:27 PM
They use the same mechanics as rituals. Once you learn a martial practice, you can use it as often as you want as long as you can pay the component cost, which is usually a healing surge.

Duos Greanleef
2009-12-19, 03:55 PM
Well, if they stay along the lines of what you've posted, then I believe we have something tremendously awesome on our hands.
But maybe that's just because I enjoy rituals and alchemy already.
One more thing can't hurt right?

Suleman
2009-12-19, 07:20 PM
So... only for martial characters? So my swordmage couldn't possibly pull off a masterful disguise like that, and my monk couldn't possibly use gestures to nonverbally communicate with someone who doesn't know his language?

I'm all for little bits ritualy things like these, but I just want to know the mechanics on how to get them.

Colmarr
2009-12-19, 11:17 PM
I agree.

If it takes a class feature or a feat to use rituals, does it take a class feature or a feat to use Martial Practices?

Moff Chumley
2009-12-19, 11:20 PM
Presumably. It probably requires training in a certain skill, like Ritual Casting, but I can't for the life of me figure out which.

This does look very cool, though. Good to see the X Power II books will be more interesting than I thought.

Aron Times
2009-12-19, 11:40 PM
Basically, you need the Practiced Study feat to use martial practices. Practiced Study requires you to be a martial class and grants you a free ritual of your level or lower. Otherwise, it works just like the Ritual Caster feat, except that it's for martial practices.

Fulfilling the martial class prerequisite can be done by being a martial class, multiclassing to a martial class (even if it's just the initial multiclass feat), or being a hybrid martial class. For example, a sorcerer with at least 13 dexterity could take Sneak of Shadows (multiclass rogue) to qualify for Practiced Study.

I can't really post anything else here due to copyright issues (I don't want my subscription revoked). :smallsmile:

Duos Greanleef
2009-12-19, 11:48 PM
...For example, a sorcerer with at least 13 dexterity could take Sneak of Shadows (multiclass rogue) to qualify for Practiced Study...
This seems a bit excessive to me.
Based on what I know (Which is what's been posted here) I'd say that as long as you take the feat, you can use the practices, maybe even make it exchangeable with Alchemist/Ritualist. I mean, rituals and alchemy aren't restricted to Arcane characters.

Haven
2009-12-19, 11:53 PM
I've heard about this before. I love the idea, but making it take healing surges is still kind of D:


Based on what I know (Which is what's been posted here) I'd say that as long as you take the feat, you can use the practices, maybe even make it exchangeable with Alchemist/Ritualist. I mean, rituals and alchemy aren't restricted to Arcane characters.


Well, it comes out to about the same: since Rituals are based on Arcana or Religion, as a martial character you pretty much have to take either Skill Training or a multiclass feat before you can take Ritual Casting. (There are some exceptions, of course, like if you're an Eladrin)

edit: Huh! I appear to have been reverse ninja'd.

Aron Times
2009-12-19, 11:54 PM
Well, Ritual Caster requires training in either Arcana or Religion, so fluff-wise they are related to mages and clerics. Alchemist doesn't really count since it's a trap (it doesn't have any prerequisites, though).

Kurald Galain
2009-12-20, 03:26 AM
The mechanic feels redundant to me, and replacing the gold cost with a healing surge cost doesn't solve the fundamental problems with rituals.

Colmarr
2009-12-20, 05:11 PM
The mechanic feels redundant to me, and replacing the gold cost with a healing surge cost doesn't solve the fundamental problems with rituals.

By which I assume you mean the time sink?

True, it doesn't solve the time sink factor, but it does convert a permanent cost (gp out of a finite per level gp source) to a temporary cost (healing surges). That's a pretty significant change, IMO.

How long do martial practices take?

hamishspence
2009-12-20, 05:20 PM
Healing surge rituals do exist already (Manual of the Planes)

basically- as long as you spend a surge every day (doesn't require anything special) for a year and a day, the original ritual becomes permanent instead of temporary.

it's how things like teleportation circles are created.

Aron Times
2009-12-20, 05:31 PM
By which I assume you mean the time sink?

True, it doesn't solve the time sink factor, but it does convert a permanent cost (gp out of a finite per level gp source) to a temporary cost (healing surges). That's a pretty significant change, IMO.

How long do martial practices take?

Speech without words has a "casting time" of 5 minutes and lasts 10 minutes. Basically, it takes up to 15 minutes to communicate nonverbally with someone who doesn't share your language. Precise Forgery requires 10 minutes of work and is permanent, i.e. your forgery lasts as long as it doesn't get destroyed. Alter Ego takes 1 hour to "cast" (basically makeup, clothing, etc.) and lasts 24 hours.

Gamerlord
2009-12-20, 05:31 PM
Meh, doesn't really sound interesting to me, probably will buy the book anyway to see the new class options.

Colmarr
2009-12-21, 12:43 AM
Speech without words has a "casting time" of 5 minutes and lasts 10 minutes. Basically, it takes up to 15 minutes to communicate nonverbally with someone who doesn't share your language.

In my opinion, this and similar rituals are the things done worst in 4e.

It's downright nonsense to suggest that a creature with whom you don't share a language is going to sit around and wait 5 minutes (Speak without Words) or 10 minutes (Comprehend Languages) to hear what you have to say.

Even worse, if the creature is intelligent enough to know that you're casting a ritual, they'd need to be very trusting indeed to wait to see what happens when you complete it.

Aron Times
2009-12-21, 09:19 AM
The five minute "casting time" of Speech without Words can be roleplayed as both parties experimenting with nonverbal cues to determine how to communicate with each other, while the ten minute duration represents finding a common ground with which to communicate with each other.

4e content tends to be fluff-neutral, and it's up to us to flavor it with our imagination. :smallsmile:

Lost Demiurge
2009-12-21, 12:54 PM
Hm, this is good news!

See, I like rituals. I like the fact that anyone who wants to invest feats and gold can do'em. I like making up rituals to tailor the magic level and feel of the campaign. This is another take on rituals, and they've managed to pull it off without making it totally unrealistic for the martial classes that they complement.

It's another step toward the Batman-style rogue... :smallbiggrin:

The J Pizzel
2009-12-21, 02:26 PM
4e content tends to be fluff-neutral, and it's up to us to flavor it with our imagination. :smallsmile:

Believe it or not, this sentence actually explains one of my favorite things about DnD 4E, as well as Star Wars Saga Edition.

Well said Mr. Silver.