Jane_Smith
2009-12-21, 11:44 PM
People for many years have said that base attack progressions, as-is, is pethetically underpowered. A -15 attack penalty for a fighters 4th attack might as well just not exsist, after all...
Now, while I understand the reasoning behind it, that durring a suddeny frenzy of swings you loose slightly more power/accuracy each swing, for a character with magic aiding them, superhuman strength, or just enough regular training should still have a decent chance to hit every swing.
Another thing I strongly beleive in - is that weapons should determine how many attacks you get, in addition to feats/spells (like haste), etc. A greataxe, for example, should get fewer attacks then a dagger, dont you agree?
I found a solution - the Everquest Rpg d20 booklet has converted all forms of base attack into just a single 'value'. Effectively, everyone gets X base attack value. Their is no extra attacks gained by base attack - so a fighter is +20 at level 20, a wizard is +10, a rogue is +15, etc. You gain extra attacks when your base attack bonus is high enough to give your next attack +1.
Now, the fun part? Their is 6 speed catagories/levels of weapons. When you use a natural weapon, or hand-held weapon, its base speed value, + other modifiers, determine your extra attacks and their attack bonuses/iterative attack penalties.
Incredibly Fast - You take a -1 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 5 times a round with this weapon (maximum 20/19/18/17/16). This speed is impossible to reach without magical aid and other forms of resources, no weapon is naturally made this fast.
Very Fast - You take a -2 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 5 times a round with this weapon (maximum 20/18/16/14/12).
Quick - You take a -3 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 4 times a round with this weapon (maximum 20/17/14/11).
Standard - You take a -4 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 4 times a round with this weapon (maximum 20/16/12/8).
Slow - You take a -5 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 3 times a round with this weapon. (maximum 20/15/10).
Very Slow - You take a -6 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 3 times a round with this weapon. (maximum 20/14/8).
So... Level 5 fighter with +5 base attack value with a Dagger (Quick base speed) would get +5/+3 attack with it. At level 10, it would be +10/+7/+4/+1, while the same fighter with a greataxe (slow) would get +10/+5.
The only issue with this is - weapon damage needs to be greatly changed to make these changes worth-while and not just make everyone go "ew, two-hander BAD!". Im guessing greatswords would be 2d10 or 2d8ish, and so forth.
The major issue with everquest, rpg's, weapons, despite this good idea for bab values... is that they did not change weapons at all. Kinda sad when you can get 4-5 attacks from a dagger as a barbarian and do more damage then that fully-decked out enchanted greataxe could ever dish out... If you use this system, modifications must be made to weapons to make them fit this system.
Now, while I understand the reasoning behind it, that durring a suddeny frenzy of swings you loose slightly more power/accuracy each swing, for a character with magic aiding them, superhuman strength, or just enough regular training should still have a decent chance to hit every swing.
Another thing I strongly beleive in - is that weapons should determine how many attacks you get, in addition to feats/spells (like haste), etc. A greataxe, for example, should get fewer attacks then a dagger, dont you agree?
I found a solution - the Everquest Rpg d20 booklet has converted all forms of base attack into just a single 'value'. Effectively, everyone gets X base attack value. Their is no extra attacks gained by base attack - so a fighter is +20 at level 20, a wizard is +10, a rogue is +15, etc. You gain extra attacks when your base attack bonus is high enough to give your next attack +1.
Now, the fun part? Their is 6 speed catagories/levels of weapons. When you use a natural weapon, or hand-held weapon, its base speed value, + other modifiers, determine your extra attacks and their attack bonuses/iterative attack penalties.
Incredibly Fast - You take a -1 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 5 times a round with this weapon (maximum 20/19/18/17/16). This speed is impossible to reach without magical aid and other forms of resources, no weapon is naturally made this fast.
Very Fast - You take a -2 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 5 times a round with this weapon (maximum 20/18/16/14/12).
Quick - You take a -3 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 4 times a round with this weapon (maximum 20/17/14/11).
Standard - You take a -4 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 4 times a round with this weapon (maximum 20/16/12/8).
Slow - You take a -5 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 3 times a round with this weapon. (maximum 20/15/10).
Very Slow - You take a -6 iterative penalty on extra attacks with this weapon. You may attack a maximum of 3 times a round with this weapon. (maximum 20/14/8).
So... Level 5 fighter with +5 base attack value with a Dagger (Quick base speed) would get +5/+3 attack with it. At level 10, it would be +10/+7/+4/+1, while the same fighter with a greataxe (slow) would get +10/+5.
The only issue with this is - weapon damage needs to be greatly changed to make these changes worth-while and not just make everyone go "ew, two-hander BAD!". Im guessing greatswords would be 2d10 or 2d8ish, and so forth.
The major issue with everquest, rpg's, weapons, despite this good idea for bab values... is that they did not change weapons at all. Kinda sad when you can get 4-5 attacks from a dagger as a barbarian and do more damage then that fully-decked out enchanted greataxe could ever dish out... If you use this system, modifications must be made to weapons to make them fit this system.