dragon mount?

[Mystic Muse]

okay, I seem to remember there being a feat somewhere where you can trade in your Paladin warhorse or whatever for a dragon. Am I making this up? I just looked in Draconomicon though and couldn't find it.

[Flickerdart]

Dragon Steed (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Dragon_Steed).

[Cheesegear]

There's Dragon Steed in Draconomicon. It's a Feat. Not an ACF. Which is slightly less good. And you don't get a Dragon. You get a Dragonnel.

There's also Dragon Training in Races of the Dragon, which means you can train actual dragons to serve as a mount...If you can find them young enough, and your campaign takes place over years.

[Mystic Muse]

.

There's also Dragon Training in Races of the Dragon, which means you can train actual dragons to serve as a mount...If you can find them young enough, that is.

I think this is what I'm looking for. I remember looking at Dragon steed before. I hate the look of draggonels

[Cheesegear]

I think this is what I'm looking for. I remember looking at Dragon steed before. I hate the look of draggonels

DAMMIT.

I forgot; There is an ACF for Paladins;

Drakkensteed Mount out of Dragon Magic. A Drakkensteed looks very much like a horse-sized Dragon and looks proportionally cool. And has Trample as an (Ex) ability instead of the terrible Roar ability that Dragonnels have. And did I mention it was an ACF, not a Feat? :smallwink:

[Thurbane]

Yep, the Drakkensteed looks much cooler than the Dragonnel.

http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/dmag_gallery/100242.jpg
http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/draco_gallery/75629.jpg

The Dragonnel in tougher though (CR4 6HD vs. CR 3 4HD).

[Milskidasith]

Y'know, you'd think the horse dragon thing would be the drakkensteed, but it's not. :smallsigh:

[Flickerdart]

There's also Dragon Cohort (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Dragon_Cohort) that gives you a Dragon for a cohort, except the Dragon counts as 3 levels lower than actual. And then you ride it, like a horsie.

[Mystic Muse]

There's also Dragon Cohort (http://realmshelps.dandello.net/cgi-bin/feats.pl?Dragon_Cohort) that gives you a Dragon for a cohort, except the Dragon counts as 3 levels lower than actual. And then you ride it, like a horsie.

I may do that eventually but This character isn't level nine yet.

[Thurbane]

The Dragonnel looks more like a cross between a deer and a goanna to me...

[Cheesegear]

The Dragonnel looks more like a cross between a deer and a goanna to me...

I would've said goat, rather than deer. Also, what's with the bright orange? :smallyuk:

Also, for extra cheese[gear];
Paladin ACF at level 5 to gain Drakkensteed Mount (Dragon Magic)
Paladin ACF at level 6 to give Paladin Mount the Celestial Template (Planar Handbook)...Lose Remove Disease 1/day (you still get RD at other levels though...) as a special ability. *shrug*

Congrats. Your 'Holy Mount' is a Celestial Dragon. Hilarity ensues. Paladins are my favourite class for a number of reasons. This is one of them.

[Mystic Muse]

what does making them celestial do exactly?

[Sstoopidtallkid]

what does making them celestial do exactly?Primarily, allows it to qualify for Vow of Poverty. :smallbiggrin:

[Mystic Muse]

Primarily, allows it to qualify for Vow of Poverty. :smallbiggrin:

would that work since it has an INT of 2? or does the celestial template add intelligence?

[Sstoopidtallkid]

would that work since it has an INT of 2? or does the celestial template add intelligence?Celestial creature must have an Int of 3 or more. It's so they can qualify for a good alignment.

[Mystic Muse]

Drakkensteeds only have an INT of two though............

[Sstoopidtallkid]

Drakkensteeds only have an INT of two though............The template boosts their Int. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/celestialCreature.htm)

[Mando Knight]

The template boosts their Int. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/celestialCreature.htm)

As does the Paladin's mount Progression (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/classes/paladin.htm#thePaladinsMount), unless it's otherwise altered by the Drakkensteed ACF.

[Mystic Muse]

where does the feat wingover come from? the Drakkensteed has it as a feat and I'm not sure what it does.

[Suzuro]

It's here (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsterFeats.htm) in the SRD.


-Suzuro

[ex cathedra]

The MM/SRD. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsterFeats.htm#wingover)

[Mystic Muse]

thanks.

Now last question, at which point do mounts get feats? it doesn't say anything about them getting feats in the SRD

[Thurbane]

Mounts get feats every 3 hit dice, like everyone else.

[Mystic Muse]

so since My mount has six HD it would get two feats? or since it already had 4 HD does that mean it only gets one?

[ex cathedra]

Bonus HD
Extra eight-sided (d8) Hit Dice, each of which gains a Constitution modifier, as normal. Extra Hit Dice improve the mount’s base attack and base save bonuses. A special mount’s base attack bonus is equal to that of a cleric of a level equal to the mount’s HD. A mount has good Fortitude and Reflex saves (treat it as a character whose level equals the animal’s HD). The mount gains additional skill points or feats for bonus HD as normal for advancing a monster’s Hit Dice.

All types have a number of feats equal to 1 + 1 per 3 Hit Dice.

It would only get one, as the fourth level feat is included in the creature's base description. One manifestation of Psychic Reformation (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/psychicReformation.htm) would let you choose new feats, however. You could certainly get something better than Alertness, at least.

[Cheesegear]

what does making them celestial do exactly?

A level 5-7 Paladin's Drakkensteed has 6 Hit Dice (4 base, +2 for being a 'Holy Mount') and an Intelligence of 6 (qualifies for an alignment other than True Neutral).

Paladin level 6 (6 Hit Dice Celestial Drakkensteed), means a Celestial creature would have; Damage Reduction, Damage Resistance, Smite Evil attack (1/day), all Natural Weapons are magical, Spell Resistance, Darkvision (a Drakkensteed originally only has Low-Light vision), and a bunch of other stuff. But, that covers most of it.

All Paladins should take this ACF (even if they don't have a Drakkensteed...Giving your 'standard Paladin horse' the Celestial template is a huge boost as well...). Every time. Unless they don't use a mount. Which is slightly rare. Because it only costs 1 Remove Disease.

Be aware that a Paladin 6, who rides a Celestial Drakkensteed becomes pretty absurdly powerful at that level. And, more often than not, the Drakkensteed is better than the Paladin who rides it. Your DM would be foolish not to counter it somehow.

Also, since a Drakkensteed is a Dragon - sort of - ask your DM if the Dragonrider (Draconomicon) abilities will work when you're on your steed and have a think about heading into that PrC (it's only five levels, not a huge loss).

[Optimystik]

Ahh, Psychic Reformation - is there anything you can't un-suck?

[AirGuitarGod32]

Ahh, Psychic Reformation - is there anything you can't un-suck?

soulknife, monk, ect.

[Sintanan]

Seems like the best place to add in my question...

Is there any way to apply the paladin special mount ability to a different class (i.e. what ACF or feats allow this)? I had an idea to play a vassal of Bahamut and have a dragon steed, but I cannot stand playing paladins and the DM has banned Leadership. (Well... after the last game ending with a bone knight with a personal standing army of over 600 undead troops... yeah. Wasn't my character, though!)

[ex cathedra]

Sure. There's the Dragon Cohort feat in Draconomicon, which could help.

[Cheesegear]

Is there any way to apply the paladin special mount ability to a different class (i.e. what ACF or feats allow this)?

Not really, no.

There's Dragon Cohort and Dragon Steed (Dragonnel :smallyuk:) feats from Draconomicon. Dragon Steed is not a Paladin-only feat. And probably your only way to go.

Drakkensteed is entirely different. If you want one of those, you'd have to reason with your DM since it is Paladin-only. I would also rule that this is allowable for Blackguards. But, I'm not your DM.


I had an idea to play a vassal of Bahamut and have a dragon steed, but I cannot stand playing paladins and the DM has banned Leadership.

Dragon Cohort is pretty much like Leadership - except it gives you a Dragon instead of a 'follower'. I would assume anyone who bans Leadership would ban Dragon Cohort. Since it functions exactly the same otherwise, and, even gives a bonus if you have both Leadership and Dragon Cohort.

The abilities of Dragonfriend/Dragonthrall feat (Draconomicon) can vary wildly on what your DM determines "You are an ally of [alignment] Dragons." to mean. Note, that the description of the feat specifically gives you a bonus to Ride checks with Dragons. So, there is that in your defense.

The Dragon Lord PrC (Dragon Magic), gives you +2 to Leadership to your Leadership score when attracting a follower with the Dragon or Dragonblood subtype. Very handy in conjunction with Dragon Cohort feat. Your DM has banned Leadership (and probably Dragon Cohort once he finds out what it does). But, this is here for completeness.

The Swift Wing PrC (Dragon Magic) is reasonably powerful for Clerics and Paladins-without-mounts since it pretty much turns you into a Dragon with dismissible (!) wings. Very handy.

The Dracolyte PrC (Draconomicon) gives you a Wyrmling (Tiny) size Dragon. And also gains Summon Dragon (Adult) for 10 minutes/day.

The Swift Wing and Dracolyte function well in conjunction with the Platinum Knight PrC (Draconomicon), which is pretty much exactly a Paladin of Bahamut gaining some absurd bonuses.
Talon of Tiamat (guess which Dragon-God this guy worships) is...Different to a Platinum Knight. But, fairly good if you don't actually want to be a Paladin.

A Ranger or Druid can get a Phynxkin (and later, Dire Phynxkin {Dragon Magic}) as a Companion as an ACF to normal animals. If a small-size race (Halfling, Gnome, etc); you could ride it. It's like...a Cat-Dragon...Thing...A Phynxkin also has Pounce. :smallamused:

Races of the Dragon...Offers nothing of use to you at the moment.

Dragons are, of course, my favourite subject of DnD. And Paladins are my favourite class. If there's a way to relate my characters to Dragons, I've probably done it at least once. And I've made Paladins of Bahamut at least four or five times.

[Sintanan]

If there's a way to relate my characters to Dragons, I've probably done it at least once.

I shan't read into exactly what you mean by relate. :smalltongue:

All joking aside, thank you for the information. It appears that my best bet will be to talk the DM into allowing Dragon Cohort for the cohort and no horde of followers (which usually always ended up as fanatic devotees by the time the leadership-focused players got through).

[Cheesegear]

All joking aside, thank you for the information. It appears that my best bet will be to talk the DM into allowing Dragon Cohort for the cohort and no horde of followers).

Dragon Cohort doesn't give you followers. It gives you one Dragon. One. That's it. Also tell your DM that 'Dragons as Cohorts' gets a whole special mention in the Draconomicon on how a DM is supposed to treat it. It's not easy.

Also, a Paladin of 11th or higher with Dragon Steed (the feat), gets to pick a real, actual Dragon instead of a Dragonnel. But, from 6th to 11th, he's stuck with the terrible, terrible Dragonnel.

[Mystic Muse]

just FYI I'm using a Paladin homebrew and it unfortunately doesn't get remove disease at sixth level so no celestial mount ACF. however it does get celestial mount as a class feature at level 11

[Cheesegear]

I shan't read into exactly what you mean by relate. :smalltongue:

...There was this one time when a Bronze Dragon had polymorphed into a human, and was looking to our party for protection (we didn't know she was a Bronze dragon, come on, she was polymorphed), and I was a super-awesome dude...And then we...Nevermind. It happened. I 'related' with a Dragon.


just FYI I'm using a Paladin homebrew and it unfortunately doesn't get remove disease at sixth level so no celestial mount ACF.

That would've been handy to know earlier. As well as what else it has. Any particular reason you're using this homebrew? Is your DM forcing you to? Most people tend to PrC out at Paladin level 5 or 6 so it's really not that big a deal. And, using the real rules, you can have a Celestial Dragon-esque mount by Level 6, much earlier than level 11.
Although, such concerns might be moot if you're starting the game at level 10...Still...Level 6 Paladin is usually more than enough. And then you can PrC out into a PrC that improves Mount progression (there are a few), or convince your DM to let you gain Mount progression in Paladin-like classes (ex; Knight of the Chalice, Complete Warrior), which some reasonable DMs will do.

[Mystic Muse]

I prefer this version of the Paladin because it gives me a reason to actually stick around in the class rather than go in for a couple levels and then leave. I chose this rather than being forced into it and I haven't noticed any real problems with it. If there are I'd like to be informed

http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=133737&highlight=Paladin