Ninja questions :)

[FishAreWet]

I've been looking through Dragon and some of the Ki feats are pretty cool! So, I'm trying to make a Ninja work. Yes, that means the Ninja class, not the archetype. I'm aiming for tier 3.

1. If my ninja levels and my monk levels stack to determine Ki, do prestiges classes that stack with monk also stack with ninja? (I don't think they will but I don't think it'd be too powerful)
2. How can I get Ki Strike (magic) without more then a single monk level?
3. Are there any prestige classes that stack for Ki uses?
4. Anyone have any ideas?!

Notes:
-I don't give a **** about Death Attack or Stunning Fist.
-I need a ton of Ki uses.
-All sources open.

[Draz74]

Yes, that means the Ninja class, not the archetype. I'm aiming for tier 3.
Good luck ... :smalltongue:


1. If my ninja levels and my monk levels stack to determine Ki, do prestiges classes that stack with monk also stack with ninja? (I don't think they will but I don't think it'd be too powerful)
Nope, not unless you can get the DM to houserule it. I agree that it wouldn't break anything, though.

[Dimers]

Ninja questions :)

I don't Spot any questions. What did you want to ask?

:smallwink:

[Longcat]

1. PrCs that stack with Monk for the purpose of advancing monk abilities do not advance your Ki pool, unless specifically stated.
2. Kensai allows you to enchant your fists, and there's an amulett from the DMG that grants an enhancement bonus to your unarmed strikes.
3. None that I am aware of.
4. Ideas for making your build be Tier3? Take Craven (for dmg boost), Versatile Unarmed Strike (to adapt your dmg type), and carry some poison-laced Shuriken as a backup weapon.

[JaronK]

1. If my ninja levels and my monk levels stack to determine Ki, do prestiges classes that stack with monk also stack with ninja? (I don't think they will but I don't think it'd be too powerful)

Not by RAW. It's not overpowered at all though.


2. How can I get Ki Strike (magic) without more then a single monk level?

I don't believe you can. I might be wrong.


3. Are there any prestige classes that stack for Ki uses?

No. The CAdv Ninja was basically abandoned as a failure and remade with the Swordsage. There was very little extended support for it.


4. Anyone have any ideas?!

Play a Swordsage, they're supposed to replace the CAdv Ninja and fix what's wrong with it. The only annoyance is they lack Trapsense, but something simple like Rogue 1/Rokugan Ninja/Unarmed Variant Swordsage X gets the job done quite nicely. That would give you enough sneak attack to have fun, all the appropriate ninja abilities you want (like turning invisible, running up walls, bouncing all over the battlefield, and so on), and even a wonderfully varied weapon selection.

If you insist on using classes with Ninja in the name, consider the Ninja Spy PrC and the Rokugan Ninja (though the latter is hardly impressive as anything other than a basic dip).

JaronK

[Optimystik]

I don't Spot any questions. What did you want to ask?

:smallwink:

I would have seen what you did there, but I failed my Spot check. :smallsmile:

Anyway, to assist the OP - remember that sudden strike explicitly allows you to qualify for feats and PrCs that require sneak attack dice.

Sneak Attack is generally superior (since you can get it merely from flanking, while Sudden Strike can't) so to compensate, take some marbles with you everywhere from Arms & Equipment. Toss them at your enemy's square to deny them their Dex bonus, enabling SS.

But I have to agree with JaronK - Swordsage will basically give you what you're looking for, especially with enough Shadow Hand and Diamond Mind maneuvers for Ninjutsu flavor.

[AslanCross]

If you really want to use the Ki feats, please get your DM to houserule that you don't need both hands to do the jutsu hand signs. Besides reminding me of Naruto, it just feels unnecessarily handicapping to me because you can't be holding your weapon. Heck, even wizards only need one hand free for M-type components.

[Optimystik]

Heck, even wizards only need one hand free for M-type components.

I think you mean S-type (Somatic) rather than M-type (Material) there. Unless M-type means something else?

[Faleldir]

You could take a few Ardent levels for Psionic Minor Creation.

[Soranar]

sudden strike works just as well with shurikens

I'd just go with a throwing build based sudddenstrike instead

and any class that gives you ki strike requires 4 levels as far as I know so you won't get it for anything less than 4 levels of monk

[AslanCross]

I think you mean S-type (Somatic) rather than M-type (Material) there. Unless M-type means something else?

Sorry, addled brain. Yes, I mean S.

[Runestar]

I would advise no more than a few lv dip in ninja for ki reserve.

This is the only excerpt I could find of a ninja-esque character in play. No concrete build listed, you will need to infer it for yourself.


Torrin Ghaladra: Elf monk, ninja, swordsage, and Shadow Sun Ninja

Like Elerosse, Torrin appears to fall into one of the four roles, namely the sneak position. He's got sudden strike, heavy Hide and Move Silently ranks, and trapfinding. The catch? He throws himself into combat with less abandon than the more resilient Lehatharath or Elerosse. He does this for two reasons. First is that he has excellent defenses.

His AC is good, though not as good as Lehatharath's often is; more importantly, he can call upon invisibility from both his maneuvers and ninja ki abilities. Invisibility can often be a better defense than high AC or HP; it's kept him alive with less HP than the rest of the party. Having incredible saves - the best in the party by far for almost all three - doesn't hurt either.

The second reason is that he can flank from any angle (with the Island of Blades stance) and perform combat battlefield control that a fighter type is normally expected to provide (with his Setting Sun maneuvers). On top, his Touch of the Shadow Sun ability allows him to heal allies after damaging enemies. It's not uncommon for Torrin to heal more hit points in a battle than Lehatharath.

[Amphetryon]

Half-elf Ninja 3/Ex-Paladin 2 (retrain to 1)/Swordsage 3/Blackguard 2 (3)/Scar Enforcer 8/Scarlet Corsair 2.

It's a Ninja Pirate. :smallcool:

It has some de-buffing, some spells from Blackguard + Scar Enforcer, and + 9d6 or so on a Sudden Strike, Smiting for more damage against more than a single type of adversary.

[RagnaroksChosen]

wait which ki feats are we talking about?

are we talking about the ones that run off your stunning fist attempts?

[Person_Man]

1. No.
2. There are a few PrC that offer this. Kensai, Enlightened Fist, Initiate of Pistis Sophia, and maybe a few others. Also, a common house rule allows Monks to use magical hand wrappings or gauntlets without giving up their unarmed damage progression.
3. Initiate of Pistis Sophia, and probably some Eberron PrC I can't recall right now.
4. Monk/Ninja is a lousy combination. If you want to be a Ninja, I would just stick with strait Ninja.

The best Ki feats are River Eel Jutsu (Freedom of Movement), Thousand Faces Jutsu (limited Alter Self), Wind Oxen Jutsu (Bull Rush), and Ki Smite (Wis to hit, Ninja level + ki pool to damage). Shadow Puppet Jutsu is also good if your DM lets you use Iajutsu Focus and Gnomish Quickrazors. I would also pick up Staggering Strike, Craven, and Dragonfire Strike to buff your Sudden Strike, and Intuitive Strike to apply your Wis bonus in place of your Str bonus to hit. Ask your DM if you can use flaws to get more feats. Because you're going to need a lot of them to make it into Tier 3.

[Runestar]

Probably the feats in dragon 351 which let you expend ki attempts to net extra abilities, such as healing or tripping.