level adjustment homebrew template question

[AustontheGreat1]

what an appropriate level adjustment for getting a spell as an at will ability.

the concept is that the people of the land are essentially one with the magic and gain a power. your social status is determined by the level of you power, (i.e. the level of your spell) the most politically and magically powerful people, being the ones with 9th level powers.

so whats a good level adjustment for people who get an at will spell. level 0 through 9?

[Obrysii]

It does depend on the spell.

I believe Savage Species listed any sort of Wish spell-like ability as LA +5.

Something like Prestidigitation at will might be worth +.03 by itself. Meaning that if you have a high-powered LA +0 race, adding that in might bump it to LA +1 ... but by itself it isn't worth that much.

In addition, low-level spells become pretty useless at high level.

So what if you can spam Summon Monster I at level 20? Or Cause Fear at that level?

[AustontheGreat1]

thats the point. people with ray of frost and detect poison are serfs and commoners, people with shapechange and meteor swarm are rulers of nations and figures of legend.

[Milskidasith]

Here's an idea: Make them sorcerers? Honestly, there's no point to applying templates instead of just making them powerful sorcerers, who have innate magic anyway.

Besides, a commoner who can only cast prestidigitation will for 0 LA at ECL 17+ (or 15+, honestly), mop the floor with somebody who can cast Wish 1/day at a +5 LA, assuming both are full casters.

[Zaydos]

Ray of Frost, even at will, isn't as good as a generic bonus feat even at first level.

Shapechange at will (assuming CL = character level) is extremely awesome even at low levels (turn into whatever is the strongest thing with racial HD = to Character Level). It effectively means you are as strong as the strongest thing in the books sans spell-like abilities. Looking at 1 HD that might be pixie (CR 5 but they have some spell-like abilities). Shapechange at will remains good until 17th level where a wizard has it for as long as necessary anyway and will have more hit dice and therefore more and better forms to play with. So it's hard to adjudicate. I'd say Shapechange at will is definitely better than being a pixie. The problem is for it to remain balanced requires you to look at each spell individually.

[AustontheGreat1]

Here's an idea: Make them sorcerers? Honestly, there's no point to applying templates instead of just making them powerful sorcerers, who have innate magic anyway.

Besides, a commoner who can only cast prestidigitation will for 0 LA at ECL 17+ (or 15+, honestly), mop the floor with somebody who can cast Wish 1/day at a +5 LA, assuming both are full casters.

well because everyone has a spell they can use and everyone cant be sorcerers. and it ranges from 0 to 9.

[Milskidasith]

well because everyone has a spell they can use and everyone cant be sorcerers. and it ranges from 0 to 9.

If you want everybody to have a limited spell pool and innate magical talent, having an entire race of sorcerers makes more sense, and is far more balanced than this templates (Shapechange at will, for instance, is damn powerful, but once you hit ECL 17 all that LA is entirely useless; replace with any powerful spell, and you've got the same problem.)

[Jane_Smith]

There are some feats in complete arcane that grant spell-like abilities. You could allow everyone in the world one of these as a bonus feat at 1st-level.

Communicator [General]
You possess a magical understanding of the essence of language.
Benefit: An innate talent for magic grants you the following spell-like abilities as a 1st-level caster: 1/day - arcane mark, comprehend languages, message.


Insightful [General]
You possess a magical understanding of the workings of arcane detection.
Benefit: An innate talent for magic grants you the following spell-like abilities as a 1st-level caster: 1/day - detect magic, detect secret doors, read magic.


Necropolis Born [General]
You possess a magical understanding of the essence of mortal dread.
Benefit: An innate talent for magic grants you the following spell-like abilities as a 1st-level caster: 1/day - cause fear, ghost sound, touch of fatigue. Save DC 10 + spell level + your Cha modifier.


Night Haunt [General]
You possess a magical understanding of the workings of the unseen.
Benefit: An innate talent for magic grants you the following spell-like abilities as a 1st-level caster: 1/day - dancing lights, prestidigitation, unseen servant. Save DC 10 + spell level + your Cha modifier.


Soul Of The North
You possess a magical understanding of the nature of cold.
Benefit: An innate talent for magic grants you the following spell-like abilities as a 1st-level caster: 1/day - chill touch, ray of frost, resistance. Save DC 10 + spell level + your Cha modifier.


You could change these up and make customized ones. Perhaps where it gives a cantrip at-will, and a 1st level spell 1/day, and have the DC of the spells (if any) based on 10 + 1/2 character level + cha modifier - so that rulers, sorcerers, or high-level people get stronger potency with their innate powers.

[Anonymouswizard]

I say that you either use feats or male it a human subrace, with LA depending on it's spell-like ability.

The first feat should grant a 0th level, the second a 1st level, and so on up to 9th level. Then your caste can be determined not by how powerful your innate magic is but by the number of powerful effects you can produce. An epic level feat slowly makes them at will.

So something like this:

Innate magic
You have an innate connection to magic that, while not that of a sorcerer, lets you use a limited amount of magic.
Prerequisite: must be unable to use spell-like abilities from other sources.
Benefit: choose any 0th level spell from the wizard/sorcerer list. You can use that spell as a spell-like ability a number of times per day equal to half your level+2.
Special: you can take this feat multiple times. Each additional time you take this featlets you choose a spell whose level is one higher than the highest spell-like ability you have. Each level above 0th level has one less use per day (1/2 level+1 for 1st level spells, 1/2 level for 2nd level spells, 1/2 level-1 for 3rd level spells...).

[AustontheGreat1]

I say that you either use feats or male it a human subrace, with LA depending on it's spell-like ability.

The first feat should grant a 0th level, the second a 1st level, and so on up to 9th level. Then your caste can be determined not by how powerful your innate magic is but by the number of powerful effects you can produce. An epic level feat slowly makes them at will.

So something like this:

Innate magic
You have an innate connection to magic that, while not that of a sorcerer, lets you use a limited amount of magic.
Prerequisite: must be unable to use spell-like abilities from other sources.
Benefit: choose any 0th level spell from the wizard/sorcerer list. You can use that spell as a spell-like ability a number of times per day equal to half your level+2.
Special: you can take this feat multiple times. Each additional time you take this featlets you choose a spell whose level is one higher than the highest spell-like ability you have. Each level above 0th level has one less use per day (1/2 level+1 for 1st level spells, 1/2 level for 2nd level spells, 1/2 level-1 for 3rd level spells...).


this has potential. its not quite where im going yet, but i can make it work.

[For Valor]

A quick and dirty fix is it costing a feat, where you can choose a spell of any level equal or below your ECL/2 - 1. (rounding up/down will change the power depending on your campaign, I'd round up) That spell is now an at-will spell-like ability, and you can change it every time you gain a level.

Problem is people who get polymorph self at 9th level and spam it all the time, so you'd probably have to blacklist certain spells. You could also limit the stuff to one school of magic, but you'll still have to cut out the polymorph jazz, as well as miracle, wish, and power word: kill.

OR

LA +1. Same scenario as above, except the spell level is ECL/2 (and NOT minus 1). It'll bump up the spell level, and it'll make you slightly squishy. Now, this one is really variable, as some at-will spells are worth a lot of LA and some aren't...

honestly, there's no quick way to do it. If you tell us what [kinds of] spells you're looking at, it'd make things easier.

[ericgrau]

It's difficult to do it by spell level because shorter duration spells benefit more from being at will than long duration spells. Based loosely on magic item costs, I'd apply the following multipliers to the LA for self or ally targetable at will abilities:
round/level: x2
minute/level: x1.5
10 minute/level: x1.25
1 hour/level: x1
1 day/level: x0.75

As for LA vs. spell level, I'd guess 1 LA per 4 spell levels. For multiple spells with similar uses (like fireball and lightning bolt), the LA would not stack. Instead it would get a minor bump if anything. I'd also allow LA buyoff for spells that aren't as good at high levels.

Polymorph actually isn't problematic at all if you make its caster level equal to the race's class HD. Then it scales beautifully. As long as you make sure spells aren't available at a lower ECL than when a wizard/cleric can get them, I doubt there will be any new surprises regardless of the spell. The exception may be personal range spells, which were meant to target a squishy caster not something beefy.

[DracoDei]

Don't know if this point has been sufficiently handled yet, but: Making them Sorcerers would give them a LOT of spells, whereas the OP was concerned with ONE spell each.
I would actually say that LA=Spell level might be a good place to start from, and I agree about the suggestion of duration multipliers. In the end however, you are going to have to double check each individual spell and tweak.