[3.5] Goblin!

[mikej]

Man, I'm stumped on this one.

Alright, today my group was talking about what they're going to play during the next campaign. It's set in a classic Party vs Horde of Orcs ( other cliche stuff too ) but it's very military like. Soo we're having a good time throwing ideas around. One of the players really love Goblins. One in particular is a frying pan wielding chef named "Chef Pan-Pan." I'm used to normal[ish] races being used and I was really stumped on what would make a good Goblin character. We thought Rogue right away and joked about the concept of a Barbarian Goblin. Obviously there is going to be role-play issues given the campaign main purpose. He hasn't decided on anything yet and I'd like to help him out. Soo far the party consist of a Human Druid, Dragonwrought Kobold Wizard, and some kind of Bard.

With access to every 3.5 WoTC sourcebook. What Class, Feats, PrC, and random stuff would you do with the Goblin? Not asking for a complete build but some ideas to contribute next week.

[Heliomance]

1/11 Barbarian 1/11 Bard 1/11 Cleric 1/11 Druid 1/11 Fighter 1/11 Monk 1/11 Paladin 1/11 Ranger 1/11 Rogue 1/11 Sorceror 1/11 Wizard.

[BobVosh]

Beguiler. No penalty to a relevant stat, and +4 dex. +8 to hide (small 4 + racial 4) with a full 30 foot movement? They make amazing rogues and beguilers. Darkvision is also always nice on a sneaky sneaky. If you like UMD, they do have a mild penalty to charisma.

Scouts are fun too, if you want to snipe. +10 (2 dex bonus, 4 small, 4 racial) is a nice bonus with whatever ranks you give him, along with magical gear. Move 10, snipe, hide, and snicker.

[Baron Malkar]

a blue psion?

[Vizzerdrix]

Play one of the elite of the elites! Play a coveted Ammunition Holder (http://www.shufflingdead.com/TotW/Magic/Goblin-Artillery.jpg)!


Honestly, a worg rider would be darn cool. Dunno how you'd build one at the moment though. Gimme a few hours to wake up and I'll post a build

[Thurbane]

With his small size and ability mods, a Goblin would probably be best at an INT or WIS based caster:

Druid
Archivist
Wizard
Cleric
Beguiler
Wu Jen

...Druid or Cleric probably fit the Goblin stereotype better than the others.

Beguiler. No penalty to a relevant stat, and +4 dex. +8 to hide (small 4 + racial 4) with a full 30 foot movement? They make amazing rogues and beguilers. Darkvision is also always nice on a sneaky sneaky. If you like UMD, they do have a mild penalty to charisma.
Heh, we've got a Goblin Beguiler in my current party...he used to be a Gray Elf until he got reincarnated. :smallbiggrin:

[Grumman]

How about a civilized, Artificer goblin? He can take Martial Study to get Hide as a class skill and fill the trap-disarming niche.

[Johel]

1/11 Barbarian 1/11 Bard 1/11 Cleric 1/11 Druid 1/11 Fighter 1/11 Monk 1/11 Ranger 1/11 Paladin 1/11 Ranger 1/11 Rogue 1/11 Sorceror.

Fumble... Sorry, Baron Von Vorpal
:smalltongue:

Not a bad idea, though.
http://goblins.keenspot.com/d/20060219.html

[Ianuagonde]

My group once liberated a goblin slave from the hobgoblins we killed. He was weak and unarmed, and we needed someone to clean our armor. He stuck, and the group face kept him as a pet. He eventually got levels, and became a rogue/ranger. Sneak attack dice and favoured enemy bonus don't care about size. He was a pretty decent scout/sniper, especially from his favorite hiding place, the back pack from the face (we cut out two holes in the bottom for his legs).

Point is, ranger, rogue or combination works pretty well.

[Riffington]

Beguiler. No penalty to a relevant stat, and +4 dex.
+4? Is this errata?

[dsmiles]

Place my vote for a Goblin Arcane Trickster.

Unless your campaign world has guns.

Big guns.

Then he could be a Goblin Gunslinger.

:smallbiggrin:

[tcrudisi]

Goblins don't exactly knock anyone's socks off with their awesomeness. Imo, you could let the player pick another stat to give +2 (just not Dex since it's already at +2) and then let the player have real choices as to what class to play. Even then, a Barbarian won't be hurting too badly since he could get Str +0 with the optional rule outlined above. And it's not as if players would line up to be a Goblin with an additional +2.

[Heliomance]

Fumble... Sorry, Baron Von Vorpal
:smalltongue:

Not a bad idea, though.
http://goblins.keenspot.com/d/20060219.html

Senor Vorpal Kickass'o, actually.

[HCL]

He is probably talking about the Air goblin from unearthed arcana that has +4 dex -2 str -2 con

[Zeta Kai]

1/11 Barbarian 1/11 Bard 1/11 Cleric 1/11 Druid 1/11 Fighter 1/11 Monk 1/11 Paladin 1/11 Ranger 1/11 Rogue 1/11 Sorceror 1/11 Wizard.

Fixed it for you.

[Heliomance]

Ah, cheers. I wondered why it had 12 if I put all the classes in. Not sure how Ranger snuck in twice.

[Telonius]

Ah, cheers. I wondered why it had 12 if I put all the classes in. Not sure how Ranger snuck in twice.

Obviously he was taking two different favored enemies. :smallbiggrin:

For a chef, I would think that whatever he is, Potions have to be a big part of it.

I seem to remember there being a 20-level Witch class somewhere in published WotC materials, but I can't seem to find it. Could be good for some "Double double, toil and trouble"-ing, depending on what the class abilities are.

[drengnikrafe]

Senor Vorpal Kickass'o, actually.

(If I remember my quotes right...)
"What class gives you a feat at 3/11ths of a level?"

[Shademan]

I always give goblins the same bonuses dwarves get in fighting just against dwarves :smallbiggrin:
+3 to saves vs eating rotten or spoiled food
and sometimes +2 to wisdom. theyre not very smart, but they are ALWAYS watching out for things that may bite their heads off.
(also: racial bonus: weapon proff. morningstar ;P)

[dsmiles]

I'm tellin' ya'...grotz wit' gunz...

http://www.games-workshop.com/MEDIA_CustomProductCatalog/m1440419_99060403028_BitzRebelGrotzMain_445x319.jp g

Stoopid humies.
:smalltongue:

[FMArthur]

Air Goblins get +4 Dex, -2 Con and -2 Str. That +4 Dex is the one thing a Goblin can do that no other LA0 race can get (I think), so you may as well use it.

A hand-crossbow specialist could be a good choice - it heavily relies on Dex, doesn't use Str at all, and can hopefully stay out of sight enough to not make the Con penalty significant. Crossbow Sniper gets you half your Dex modifier to damage, and Hand Crossbow Focus is actually two feats in one. Hand crossbows also take no penalty (aside from the usual) for being used in two hands, and proficiency comes free in both the Ninja and Rogue.

Or you could recommend him a warlock. They often don't care about anything but dex.

[Kantolin]

The races of stone has a thematically awesome class in the Stonedeath Assassin, which is goblinoid only (and the only goblinoid-only prestige class I'm aware of)

A roguelike goblinoid who breaks into dwarven citadels and kills people.

That would be a fun option. ^_^

[Trixie]

Ninja, obviously (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0003.html) :smallamused:

[Kylarra]

Warlock would still be pretty cool. He could even hold a "gun" and have his eldritch blast fire through that.

[awa]

scout on a worg is nice run around shooting arrows if your level 7 you should be able to take a worg with leadership if not theirs a dragon mag scout variant with a mount (a wolf mount would have the same int and hit dice as a worg so you could just call it a worg) finally i believe their is a feat that gives you an animal companion just take a wolf.

Goblins have few racial abbilities +4 move silently (+4 to hide from being small) and ride are two of them so in my opinion you should try and make use of them.

If you go the leadership route once you gain an extra level have the worg take ranger so it can buff up it's hide and move silently so you can both be really sneaky.

Alternatively or in addition to the worg you could max out your stealth

if you have the con a 1 level dip in totemist can net you a + 6 hide and move silently (or higher depending on other factors) and will allow you to meet the hard prerequisites to taking umberal disciple which at level 3 (wich you can get by level 8) a hide in plain sight like ability that does not require shadows then just grab shot on the run

[Mystic Muse]

Obviously he was taking two different favored enemies. :smallbiggrin:
.

I think he's going to take that level in ranger back after, well, you know.:smallfrown:(not spoiling for anybody who hasn't read the comic)

[Optimystik]

a blue psion?

Scruffy seconds this

[Grumman]

A roguelike goblinoid who breaks into dwarven citadels and kills people.

That would be a fun option. ^_^
As a DM, I would probably kick you from the game immediately. It would appear at first glance that you were trying to provoke intra-party conflict by playing an evil character who murders members of a generally Lawful Good race for a living.

[BobVosh]

+4? Is this errata?


He is probably talking about the Air goblin from unearthed arcana that has +4 dex -2 str -2 con

Er. I used pathfinders PRD since d20srd is blocked at work, and I didn't think they changed goblin... >.>

Also -2 con is a relevant stat change to a ...well, anything but undead and construct.

[Kantolin]

As a DM, I would probably kick you from the game immediately. It would appear at first glance that you were trying to provoke intra-party conflict by playing an evil character who murders members of a generally Lawful Good race for a living.

Whoa.

That's a little needlessly harsh of you, Grumman. :smallconfused: Yiikes.

Still, I suppose the point of the complaint makes sense, particularly as I wasn't very clear about the class. Let me be more clear, then, rather than respond directly.

The Stonedeath assassin is a very interesting stealth-based class in the races of stone. Interestingly, the requirements are almost exclusively skill based - hide and move silently - and then the class /gives/ you trapfinding. Summarily, you can hop in as a Ranger (or other stealthy but not trapfinding class), and still be the trapmonkey, which the above party seems to lack (Which may or may not be a problem per se... just something they don't have).

For the stealth aspect (in addition to 6+int skill points), it also gives you meld with stone and stoneskulk - hte latter of which gives you essentially hide in plain sight while you're underground touching stone.

Most interestingly, though - and primarily why I like the class - is that there are absolutely no alignment restrictions thereon. The class is clearly meant to get into stone dwarven strongholds, but you can do so, be good, and it works out.

Why you're a stonedeath assassin and good can, itself, be the source of a bunch of neat roleplaying ideas. Could be a champion of goblins, who is attempting to advocate relations between his people and dwarves, and summarily only uses his powers to that aim. Could be raised by dwarves, who may or may not be happy when their adopted child(or project?) started being able to slip in and out of walls intrinsically(Could even be stoneblessed, another neat races of stone class). Could have absolutely nothing to do with dwarves - there are plenty of enemies and earth elementals who deal with stone, most towns have houses made of stone, whatever. Maybe you have abilities that aren't directly related to your job.

Either way, rogue-like classes fit goblins, and the stonedeath assassin is an /interesting/ one, so I recommend giving it a look.

[Ianuagonde]

+1 Stonedeath Assasin

This was the plan for our cowardly goblin rogue/ranger friend: good for fleeing where no-one can follow, hiding from the big bad, or just sulking in stone. The other abilities are very nice as well. Also, I liked that there is no alignment requirement. Besides, the name of your class is not what you are. The goblin could keep calling himself the scout, the goblin, Steven, whatever.

[mikej]

Thank you everyone for all the helpfull suggestions. :smallsmile:

I'll pass this on during the next gaming session.

[Thurbane]

One more thing: the Goblin Paragon (http://www.wakinglands.com/htm_files/paragon_classes_goblin.htm) class.

[mikej]

One more thing: the Goblin Paragon (http://www.wakinglands.com/htm_files/paragon_classes_goblin.htm) class.

Wow, Thank you. :smallsmile:

Never seen that one before.

[chef_panpan]

hahaha behold chef pan-pan. baker of your death and boiler of your death

10 barbarian / 10 frenzied berserker