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jiriku
2010-01-13, 10:37 PM
Please review and critique this class, which is a 5-level defender PrC intended to blend the flavor of the Roman lictor and the Thayan Knight. The target balance point is a +0 PrC for a Tier 3 or strong Tier 4 base class. The class provides flavorful bodyguards for important NPC squishies, offers an interesting choice for a PC shopping for a cohort, highlights the unique flavor of the Calloran empire, and would be available as a PC option as well. Expected entry point would be crusader 5, knight 5, or fighter 6.

Relevant house rules and setting-specific information:


Tier 4 and Tier 5 melee classes receive additional class skills, skill points, and extra class features intended help them approach the non-combat versatility of Tier 3 classes.
Humans gain a bonus class skill based on their region of origin. With that and the extra class skills and extra skill points most melee types start with, meeting the skill requirements of the lictor is pretty easy.
Melee-oriented feat chains are compressed to a single feat, greatly improving the combat versatility of melee classes (especially the fighter). Shield Specialization adds shield bonus to Reflex saves, in addition to the usual benefit.
Psionics and magic are fully transparent.
Players have access to an inexpensive home-brewed incantation that will transfer enchantments from one piece of gear to another.
The Calloran empire is a predominantly human, pseudo-Roman nation. Denapoli is a city much like Rome.
Flavor-wise, red wizards lack the racism and evilness normally associated with the class. Instead they are merely badass Romanesque battlemages.



LICTOR PRESTIGE CLASS

Flavor Text:
The lictor is a member of a special class of Calloran civil servant, with special tasks of attending and guarding magistrates of the Calloran Empire who hold imperium; essentially, he is a bodyguard. The traditions of the lictors go back to the time when the Calloran empire was but a small kingdom, and lictors are highly esteemed among the Calloran soldiery.

Lictors are exempted from service in the Calloran legions, paid a salary by the state when not given leave to go adventuring, and organized into a guild of their fellows. Typically, a magistrate will personally select his lictors, but sometimes they are assigned by lots.

Lictors are intimidating in appearance, marked with prominent magical tattoos inscribed by the red wizards of the collegium arcanum, geared in spiked adamantine full plate and extreme shield, and often wielding a distinctive, serrated gladius and jagged pilum.

The lictors' primary task is to attend as a bodyguard to magistrates who hold imperium, escorting him in all places at all times, and opening th way when he must make his way through crowds. They carry rods formed of white birch branches tied with a red ribbon, called fasces lictoriae, as a symbol of their magistrate's power and authority. The rod is a symbol of strength through unity, bounded by restraint. Outside the limits of Denapoli, the fasces are tipped with one or two axe blades, symbolic of the fact that the magistrate holds the power of execution.

The degree of a magistrate's imperium is symbolized by the number of lictors escorting him or her:

The Empress has an escort of 24 lictors outside the city of Denapoli, 12 inside.
Consuls are escorted by 12 lictors.
Praetors have an escort of 6 lictors, 2 within Denapoli.
Curators have 2 lictors

A special branch of lictors, the lictores curiati, are assigned to escorting red wizards of the collegium arcanum, important religious figures, or even private citizens on special occasions. The lictores curiati are thirty in number and typically receive individual assignments.

Mechanics:
REQUIREMENTS
Alignment: Any Lawful
Base Attack Bonus: +5
Feat: Shield Specialization (heavy shield, extreme shield, or tower shield) (PH2 82)
Skills: Intimidate 8 ranks, Spellcraft 2 ranks, Spot 2 ranks.
Special: Must be a citizen of the Calloran Empire. Must be inducted into the order of the lictors or the lictores curiati.

Hit Die: d12
{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special

1st|
+1|
+2|
+0|
+2|Imperial Battle Garb, Iron Warrior, Martial Initiate, Mark of the Chosen I, Watchful Guardian

2nd|
+2|
+3|
+0|
+3|Run, You Dogs!, Uncanny Dodge

3rd|
+3|
+3|
+1|
+3|Mettle, Vengeful Guardian

4th|
+4|
+4|
+1|
+4|Frightful Presence, Imperial Training

5th|
+5|
+4|
+1|
+4|Blood-Spiked Charger, Improved Uncanny Dodge, Mark of the Chosen II[/table]
CLASS SKILLS
The lictor's class skills (and the key ability for each skill) are Balance (Dex), Climb (Str), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Gather Information (Cha), Handle Animal (Cha), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Knowledge (local), Knowledge (nobility and royalty), Profession (Wis), Ride (Dex), Sense Motive (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), Spot (Wis), and Swim (Str).
Skill Points at Each Level: 4 + Int modifier

CLASS FEATURES
All of the following are class features of the lictor prestige class.
Weapons and Armor Proficiency: Lictors gain proficiency with tower shields and extreme shields (RoS 157).

Imperial Battle Garb: As patricians, lictors are expected to supply their own gear, but imperial warsmiths will manufacture a newly inducted lictor's battle gear from adamantine for him at cost (1/3 of standard price), simply for the prestige of having such prominent citizen wear his work. A lictor's battle gear includes spiked full plate armor, a spiked extreme shield or spiked tower shield, a melee weapon, and a thrown weapon (often a gladius and a pilum). If these items are lost, destroyed, or stolen, he can obtain replacements at the same discount as long as he remains in good standing with his organization.

Iron Warrior (Ex): A lictor knows how to get the most out of his armor and shield. He gains the benefit of his shield specialization feat when using any heavy shield, extreme shield, or tower shield, and can make shield bash attacks with an extreme shield or tower shield (damage as for a heavy shield). He adds his class level to his shield bonus to AC, and his existing DR/adamantine improves by his class level. He must be wielding a shield to gain the shield benefit and he must already have DR/adamantine to gain the improved damage reduction.

Mark of the Chosen (Su): A lictor undergoes a long and painful tattooing ritual under the hands of one of the masters of the collegium arcanum. Magic tattoos placed on the back, forehead and face protect his mind from attack. The lictor gains immunity to fear, charms, and compulsions. At 5th level the protective magic grows stronger, and he cannot be affected by any mind-affecting effect unless he wishes. These immunities are not effective against the red wizards of the collegium arcanum. The tattoo also marks the lictor as a permanent servant of the Imperium. He is the property of the Empress until death. The lictor automatically fails any saving throw against a mind-affecting spell cast by a red wizard.

Martial Initiate: Choose a class that grants martial maneuvers. Add the lictor's class level (instead of half his class level) to his levels in that class to determine his initiator level.

Watchful Guardian (Ex): A lictor is watchful and vigilant in defending his charge against both mundane and magical threats. He adds his class level as a competence bonus to all Spot checks and Initiative checks, and to Spellcraft checks to identify a spell being cast, identify an in-place spell effect, or identify a spell after saving against it.

Run, You Dogs! (Ex): The fearsome demeanor and thousand-yard stare of the lictor makes him an implacable foe on the battlefield. Upon reaching 2nd level, he gains a competence bonus equal to his class level on Intimidate checks, and can demoralize an opponent as a swift action.

Uncanny Dodge (Ex): At 2nd level, a lictor gains the ability to react to danger before his senses would normally allow him to do so. He retains his Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if he is caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. If he has five or more levels in classes that grant uncanny dodge, he gains improved uncanny dodge instead (see below).

Mettle (Ex): A lictor's training hardens his mind and body against even magical and unusual assaults. At 3rd level, he gains Mettle. If he makes a successfull Will or Fortitude save against an effect that would normally have a lesser effect on a successful save, he instead completely negates the effect.

Vengeful Guardian (Ex): A lictor of 3rd level or higher gains a +2 morale bonus on attack rolls and damage rolls against any creature that attacks him or that he has previously seen attack his charge. Once per encounter as an immediate action, if he sees any creature attack his charge, he may throw a ranged weapon or initiate a charge action against the creature if it is within range. He can use this ability even while flat-footed, although if he charges during a surprise round he is only permitted a partial charge.

Frightful Presence (Ex): At 4th level, the lictor's onslaught strikes terror into the hearts of those who oppose him. Whenever he attacks or charges, all foes within 30 feet must succeed on a Will save (DC 10 + 1/2 character level + Charisma modifier) or become shaken. A creature that saves is immune to that lictor's frightful presence for 24 hours. Creatures with the frightful presence ability are immune to this effect.

Imperial Training (Ex): A lictor trains with the Calloran legionnaires and learns how to work well as part of a team. Beginning at 4th level, he no longer causes allies to take a -4 penalty with ranged attacks when he is in melee with a foe, and foes cannot use him for cover against ranged attacks. If he flanks a foe with an ally and that foe takes an opportunity attack against the ally, the lictor may take an immediate opportunity attack on the foe. Foes the lictor flanks are aware of this ability.

Blood-Spiked Charger: At 5th level, the lictor gains Blood-Spiked Charger (PH2 92) as a bonus feat, even if he does not meet the prerequisites for it.

Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex): At 5th level and higher, a lictor can only be flanked by a rogue four or more levels higher than his total levels in classes that grant uncanny dodge.

Edit: fixed table, removed some spoilers
Edit 2: incorporated recommended changes and added a number of new abilities intended to stress the class's role as a bodyguard. Also modified the entry requirements to speak more directly to the intended role.
Edit 3: added additional class skills and features intended to allow ToB classes to continue progressing key functions while progressing as a lictor.
Edit 4: added blood-spiked charger at level 5 to give the lictor additional tactical options. Added the ability to shield bash with extreme shields and tower shields! MOAR SHIELD SPIKES!
Edit 5: Improved Imperial Defender to make it more proactive.

Latronis
2010-01-13, 11:25 PM
I hate spoilered pertinent information :\

your table is brokeded:

Lictor
{table=head]Level|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Special

1st|
+1|
+2|
+0|
+0|Imperial Battle Garb, Imperial Training, Mark of the Chosen

2nd|
+2|
+3|
+0|
+0|Imperial Defender

3rd|
+3|
+3|
+1|
+1|Shield Other

4th|
+4|
+4|
+1|
+1|Never Fall

5th|
+5|
+4|
+1|
+1|Imperial Champion[/table]


That said and done, it looks fine. Automatically failing from red wizards is a bit harsh but I suppose its not really intended for players so it's ok. Given the devotion aspect of the class it could probably afford to have good will saves too; without losing anything.

jiriku
2010-01-16, 03:33 AM
Bump. C'mon, it's D&D meets the Roman Empire (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lictor). I value your opinions...would you say this is good, or how would you improve it?

Vaynor
2010-01-16, 03:51 AM
A few things:

What on earth is an extreme shield? Is this some setting-specific thing that I haven't heard of?

Imperial Battle Garb: How does this account for magical armor? Does the Lictor pay for enchantments himself or are those affected by the 2/3 price reduction? If it just affects the armor itself, that's a pretty good ability.

Imperial Training: I like it, I've always liked the idea of Intimidation but it has never really been good enough for common use. Pretty good ability but not overly powerful.

Mark of the Chosen: Immune to fear and charm effects is nice, but both are rarely use. Perhaps it should also provide a bonus against mind-affecting effects? This level needs a bit more.

Imperial Defender: Not much to say, it's not terribly amazing but it's decent enough and fits the flavor.

Shield Other: A level 2 spell as a spell-like ability is a bit dull, perhaps give a bonus to the AC bonus or Fort bonus based on class level?

Imperial Champion: Compulsions? Really? That's your capstone ability? Incredibly boring and only a few spells actually incur this ability. Possibly the worst ability this class gains when it is supposed to be the most powerful. Not sure what to put here, but this definitely needs something a lot better. I'd add the compulsion thing to Mark of the Chosen that's gained at level 5.

Latronis
2010-01-16, 04:27 AM
It's fairly specific enough to be compressed down to 3 levels with much change, would probably be more valuable as such too.

You could merge the compulsion with the charm and fear immunity and move the rest back. And keep it at 3 levels

ErrantX
2010-01-16, 11:01 AM
As the class stands currently, I will agree with some of the statements that Latronis and Vaynor have provided for you. However, I will try to provide some additional suggestions to help you with this class to make it do what I think you're trying to accomplish. I will give some non-Tome of Battle inspired suggestions (as not everyone jives with that book), and if you are into the ToB, reply and I will give advice from that perspective as well.

Alright:

Fluff-wise and crunch-wise, this class has a couple of issues. Firstly, you have strongly SWF'd the Thayan Knight. That's not exactly bad, but you did do a halfway decent job making it your own. That being said, the tier you were aiming for was sorely missed. As a +0 tier PrC for a tier 3 or strong 4, you missed. That's okay, I'm going to try to help you with that. If I were a Crusader or a Warblade, I would not touch this class (as they are tier 3 melee). What you're really aiming for is a +1 or better tier class for the fighters, paladins, and Knights of the realm. Without ToB support, this class will not do what your initial intent was.

Requirements: These are Nil, and that's actually a good thing. However, I'd consider adding in Shield Specialization as a possible, Goad, or maybe Endurance. Great Fortitude or Iron Will. This may factor in later.

Hit Dice: Improve to d12, they're defenders by role, they'll need the hit points.

Saves: Improve Will to full. They're coated in steel so Reflex should bomb, but being as they are supposed to be fearless protectors, they're going to need to have a hardened Will.

Extreme Shields: I would reference Races of Stone for these, just for convenience sake. But otherwise a fine addition to the class.

Imperial Battle Garb: Right now, this serves as more flavor than class feature. This doesn't serve any other purpose. You do have other class features at this level to offset this, and that's great; you understand exactly what this is. That being said, I'd allow the lictor to be able to requisition new equipment at each new level to replace equipment lost, damaged, or to be improved upon. Or at least each new odd level.

Imperial Training: When I think Imperial Training, I do not think "Ooo scary." You need to go another direction with this. This is an ability that needs to be either repeated or improved upon as you level (say at 1st, 3rd, and 5th). Now, you could go with bonus feats here (boo, but would work), or something more flavorful and class specific. Say at 1st level, the lictor adds his class level to his shield AC. At 3rd level, the lictor gains something like aura of courage, or maybe like an archon's aura of menace. (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/archon.htm) That will give the intimidation feel or the hardy fearlessness you're looking for and doesn't require wasted actions. Heck, give them a circumstance bonus to their Intimidation equal to their class level and let them demoralize as a move action too! It's not that potent. At 5th level, their training should allow them to perhaps get a rage like benefit to aid them in battle, or they need some form of additional defensive buff. From where I stand, evasion or uncanny dodge isn't going to fit, Mettle might work. It's more situational than Evasion, but when it's useful it is dang useful.

Mark of the Chosen: Another fluff ability, if you do some of my above suggestions, then you should be okay.

Imperial Defender: Not great but you don't want to overly front load it.

Shield Other: This is a good ability, but not stupendous. With an additional level 3 ability here, you'll do well.

Never Fall: I'd give them DR improvements before fast healing. Especially as there is no reasoning behind why they have it. As an Ex? They're eating a lot of vitamins or something. This needs work fluffwise.

Imperial Champion: Underwhelming in the extreme, and I will agree with Vaynor that this could go straight into the mark of the chosen ability and not break the world. I'd suggest the top ability being the strength to not fall, that perhaps while your charge is in danger, you cannot die from hit point damage. Or you can make a Fortitude save or a Will save to negate an attack that would drop you below 0 hit points, DC equal to the damage done perhaps, or half the damage dealt.

Those are some of my suggestions.

-X

jiriku
2010-01-16, 11:45 PM
These are some really excellent suggestions. Thanks to each of you for taking the time to comment.

Answers:

An extreme shield is what happens when a heavy shield and tower shield go on a date, drink too much, and wake up regretting what happened. RoS 157.
Imperial Battle Garb reduces only the cost of the armor, not of any enchantments. It's intended to encourage PCs to dress up like the badass-looking Thayan Knight on p.87 of Complete Warrior. Players have access to an inexpensive home-brewed incantation that will transfer enchantments from one piece of gear to another.
After consideration, I agree, the original version could have been a 3-level class. However, lictor is a vocation, not just a tour of duty, so rather than shrinking it down to three levels I bulked up on class features. Hopefully it justifies 5 levels now.
Yes, ToB-related suggestions are great! I'm pretty comfortable with granting stances in non-initiating PrCs, but I lean away from maneuvers, since they're less valuable to characters who lack a refresh method.


Comments:

Added Shield Specialization as a prerequisite. This feat has previously been houseruled to add shield bonus to Ref saves, as in 4e (S&B needed the boost), so it's pretty much a no-brainer for an S&B PrC.
Changed skill requirements and class skills to better suit the class.
Eliminated restrictions on Imperial Battle Garb and expanded it a little to encourage "period" weapon choices.
Better Will saves and hit dice.
Replaced fast healing with DR.
Compressed immunities as recommended.
Added AC bonus and Mettle as recommended.
I actually do see uncanny dodge as appropriate. A bodyguard should have good reaction time. In the same vein, added bonuses to Initiative, Spot and Spellcraft, and an interrupt attack. A bodyguard shouldn't be standing around navel-gazing while an assassin strikes. Between the Spellcraft bonus and the interrupt attack, the lictor even has a chance to identify a hostile spell being cast, then deal enough damage as an immediate action to ruin the spell.
Frightful presence, in conjunction with Run, You Dogs! allows for effective combat debuffing without sacrificing attacks.
Added some precise teamwork abilities for better tanking.
Immunity to mind-affecting as a capstone.
Also added the key discipline skills for all crusader and warblade disciplines and improved stacking of initiator level to make it ToB-friendlier.


tl;dr Class now has more hit points and DR, better AC, and formidable saves. It is difficult to surprise or trick and retains some offensive and defensive capability even when caught off guard. Immune to many common SoS spells and ToB-friendly.

Questions:

How does it look now?
Should I remove the 1/encounter restriction on Vengeful Guardian at 5th level, or is that excessive?
What is SWF?

Milskidasith
2010-01-17, 12:37 AM
Imperial Battle Garb: As patricians, lictors are expected to supply their own gear, but imperial warsmiths will manufacture a newly inducted lictor's battle gear from adamantine for him at cost (1/3 of standard price), simply for the prestige of having such prominent citizen wear his work. A lictor's battle gear includes spiked full plate armor, a spiked heavy shield, extreme shield or tower shield, a melee weapon, and a thrown weapon (often a gladius and a pilum). If these items are lost, destroyed, or stolen, he can obtain replacements at the same discount as long as he remains in good standing with his organization.

No class, prestige or otherwise, should ever grant gear from social status as a class feature, especially when you can use it to get magical gear at a lower cost than it costs to actually forge. Seriously, social status should not be a class feature.


Iron Warrior (Ex): A lictor knows how to get the most out of his armor and shield. He adds his class level to his shield bonus to AC, and his existing DR/adamantine improves by his class level. He must be wielding a shield to gain the shield benefit and he must already have DR/adamantine to gain the improved damage reduction.

So a free +5 to AC? Nice for requiring one feat.


Mark of the Chosen (Su): A lictor undergoes a long and painful tattooing ritual under the hands of one of the masters of the collegium arcanum. Magic tattoos placed on the back, forehead and face protect his mind from attack. The lictor gains immunity to fear, charms, and compulsions. At 5th level the protective magic grows stronger, and he cannot be affected by any mind-affecting effect unless he wishes. These immunities are not effective against the red wizards of the collegium arcanum. The tattoo also marks the lictor as a permanent servant of the Imperium. He is the property of the Empress until death. The lictor automatically fails any saving throw against a mind-affecting spell cast by a red wizard.

Immunities, fun.


Martial Initiate: Choose a class that grants martial maneuvers. Add the lictor's class level (instead of half his class level) to his levels in that class to determine his initiator level.


Initiation, more fun!


Watchful Guardian (Ex): A lictor is watchful and vigilant in defending his charge against both mundane and magical threats. He adds his class level as a competence bonus to all Spot checks and Initiative checks, and to Spellcraft checks to identify a spell being cast, identify an in-place spell effect, or identify a spell after saving against it.


+5 to spot, initiative, and spellcraft! Unfortunately, I don't think competence bonuses stack, so this could be replicate with cheap items. Maybe an untyped bonus?


Run, You Dogs! (Ex): The fearsome demeanor and thousand-yard stare of the lictor makes him an implacable foe on the battlefield. Upon reaching 2nd level, he gains a competence bonus equal to his class level on Intimidate checks, and can demoralize an opponent as a swift action.

Combined with the things that let you intimidate in an AoE this can get very powerful.


Uncanny Dodge (Ex): At 2nd level, a lictor gains the ability to react to danger before his senses would normally allow him to do so. He retains his Dexterity bonus to AC (if any) even if he is caught flat-footed or struck by an invisible attacker. If he has five or more levels in classes that grant uncanny dodge, he gains improved uncanny dodge instead (see below).

Are you throwing every goodie melee could want in here?


Mettle (Ex): A lictor's training hardens his mind and body against even magical and unusual assaults. At 3rd level, he gains Mettle. If he makes a successfull Will or Fortitude save against an effect that would normally have a lesser effect on a successful save, he instead completely negates the effect.

I suppose you are.


Vengeful Guardian (Ex): A lictor of 3rd level or higher gains a +2 morale bonus on attack rolls and damage rolls against any creature that attacks him or that he has previously seen attack his charge. Once per encounter as an immediate action, if he sees any creature attack his charge, he may throw a ranged weapon or initiate a charge action against the creature if it is within range. He can use this ability even while flat-footed, although if he charges during a surprise round he is only permitted a partial charge.

Free charges (dip to barbarian for pounce) makes everything better!


Frightful Presence (Ex): At 4th level, the lictor's onslaught strikes terror into the hearts of those who oppose him. Whenever he attacks or charges, all foes within 30 feet must succeed on a Will save (DC 10 + 1/2 character level + Charisma modifier) or become shaken. A creature that saves is immune to that lictor's frightful presence for 24 hours. Creatures with the frightful presence ability are immune to this effect.


More intimidation, woo. Combine with swift action intimidation and all who fail both the hard to beat demoralization and this slightly easier to beat presence are frightened.


Imperial Training (Ex): A lictor trains with the Calloran legionnaires and learns how to work well as part of a team. He no longer causes allies to take a -4 penalty with ranged attacks when he is in melee with a foe, and foes cannot use him for cover against ranged attacks. If he flanks a foe with an ally, that foe cannot take an opportunity attack when the ally drinks a potion, casts a spell (including a spell cast from a scroll), or stands from prone.



Improved Uncanny Dodge (Ex): At 5th level and higher, a lictor can only be flanked by a rogue four or more levels higher than his total levels in classes that grant uncanny dodge.

Which would be pretty low level if you get it only from this PrC.

I wouldn't call it extremely powerful, but it essentially requires no investment and gets a lot of nice goodies. It's probably solid, with it's most powerful feature probably being the immediate action charges, with everything else being a nice passive goodie.

jiriku
2010-01-17, 01:43 AM
No class, prestige or otherwise, should ever grant gear from social status as a class feature, especially when you can use it to get magical gear at a lower cost than it costs to actually forge. Seriously, social status should not be a class feature

My text may be unclear. The feature only discounts the purchase of nonmagical adamantine gear. It's sort of like having an uncle who's an automechanic and will do auto work for you for only his cost in the parts. Except you probably don't have an uncle who builds military hardware.

The line about being a patrician is flavor text, but in order to meet the prerequisites for the class (be inducted into the order of the lictors) a PC would either need to be born a patrician or would need recognition as a hero of the Imperium prior to becoming a lictor. Thus, it's not that the class grants the status, it's that the status grants access to the class.


So a free +5 to AC? Nice for requiring one feat.

It's better than you think. That one feat grants another +1 AC and applies shield bonus to Reflex saves. I'm very very nice to my melee players during character building. It makes up for how cruel I am to them during play. :smallsmile:


Immunities, fun.




Initiation, more fun!




+5 to spot, initiative, and spellcraft! Unfortunately, I don't think competence bonuses stack, so this could be replicate with cheap items. Maybe an untyped bonus?

Untyped wouldn't be too much? I'm hesitant; I was trying to mitigate the large size of the bonuses by limiting what they would stack with. On the other hand, with so many class skills to cover and just 4+Int skill points, a lictor may not be able to cover all his bases and may need to stack bonuses just to function. Spot checks in particular tend to be difficult to make against level-appropriate foes.


Combined with the things that let you intimidate in an AoE this can get very powerful.

Yup. That's what the frightful presence is for.


Are you throwing every goodie melee could want in here?

:smallbiggrin:


I suppose you are.

:smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin::smallbiggrin:


Free charges (dip to barbarian for pounce) makes everything better!

A barbarian patrician? I don't think so. Well, maybe if a player wrote me a really persuasive backstory. But anyone who optimizes like that is basically begging to fight my optimized caster villains.

However, the immediate charge does support a bull rush from a dungeoncrasher fighter/lictor quite well. :smallamused:


More intimidation, woo. Combine with swift action intimidation and all who fail both the hard to beat demoralization and this slightly easier to beat presence are frightened.

Yes exactly! Although only one at a time, and only for one round, since demoralize only affects a single threatened opponent. However, the lictor should be pretty handy at scattering the rabble, and will effectively debuff in support of any casters in his party. Since this is gained no earlier than character level 9, and the wizard has been throwing around fear spells since level 7, I don't think he's going to overshadow anyone with it.


Which would be pretty low level if you get it only from this PrC.

I wouldn't call it extremely powerful, but it essentially requires no investment and gets a lot of nice goodies. It's probably solid, with it's most powerful feature probably being the immediate action charges, with everything else being a nice passive goodie.

Thanks! Would you say it functions as an effective prestige choice for a Tier 3 or strong Tier 4 class, or does it need more oomph? You seemed a bit bemused by the number of class features. Does it need fewer abilities that are individually more powerful in order to avoid looking like an overstuffed Christmas tree, or is it just about right with the present number and power of features?

Milskidasith
2010-01-17, 01:53 AM
Thanks! Would you say it functions as an effective prestige choice for a Tier 3 or strong Tier 4 class, or does it need more oomph? You seemed a bit bemused by the number of class features. Does it need fewer abilities that are individually more powerful in order to avoid looking like an overstuffed Christmas tree, or is it just about right with the present number and power of features?

I would say, for the intent to be a T3 or T4 class, it works out pretty well. It probably doesn't boost a classes tier, but it does manage to be useful.

jiriku
2010-01-17, 02:33 AM
Bah! The lictores curiati scoff at your fancy hat, your roguish five-o'clock shadow and your lukewarm approval of their power! MOAR CLASS FEATURES!!!