View Full Version : For the Indie folks out there...
Kjata
2010-01-14, 02:11 AM
Have you ever thought a band was "selling out?" Feel like "the man" is ruining music? Do you ever listen joyfully to very un-mainstream (counter culture?) music? If so, I have the perfect video for you to watch...
(Note, strong language and a joke that could be construed as offensive)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fIRo-UtdOU&feature=related
No offense to indie people, this is a tongue in cheek joke
reorith
2010-01-14, 02:15 AM
"so I've got some/ advice for you, little buddy/ before you point your finger/ you should know that/ i'm the man"
i <3 maynard with the near fanatical devotion that he finds so offensive.
Hey indie kids, you suck! No offense.
What is the point of this topic?
(Note, strong language and a joke that could be construed as offensive)
F*** YOU BUDDY!
That COULD be offensive.
reorith
2010-01-14, 03:54 AM
That COULD be offensive.
i highly doubt you could find an individual that would take offense to that :p
golentan
2010-01-14, 03:58 AM
I'm less offended by the message than the fact that the song isn't even good.
If you're going to insult me at least do it with a decent melody. (P.S. bonus irony points for "Buy Buy Buy my new record" as the lyrics to a song on Youtube).
Kjata
2010-01-14, 10:13 AM
Okay... I'm guessing nobody saw the spoiler... this was a joke.
@Goletan: The whole song is ironic. The song is basically a stab at people who talk about "selling out" as if it's a bad thing, because every band sold out to get their first record deal. Not to mention "All you know [them] is by what they sold you."
What is the point of this topic?
What is the point of any topic, for that matter?
Sneak
2010-01-14, 11:49 AM
Okay... I'm guessing nobody saw the spoiler... this was a joke.
Just because it's a "joke" doesn't mean it's funny or not offensive.
The whole song is ironic. The song is basically a stab at people who talk about "selling out" as if it's a bad thing, because every band sold out to get their first record deal.
That's not irony.
Re: tongue-in-cheek...According to the Wikipedia: "Tongue-in-cheek is a term used to refer to humor in which a statement, or an entire fictional work, is not meant to be taken seriously, but its sarcasm is subtle."
Saying "**** YOU" is not subtle.
It is a joke only in the sense that it's lambasting those who talk about "selling out" in a supposedly humorous fashion. Logically, then, those who talk about "selling out" would have a right to be offended.
Note: I'm not personally offended, and I couldn't care less about "selling out" as long as the music is good. Just pointing out why others are offended.
The Extinguisher
2010-01-14, 11:55 AM
Also, it doesn't really make any sense. Punk kids are the ones who complaining about selling out all the time.
Nowadays it's a good thing if a small indie band gets it song in a Kia commercial or something.
Get you're stereotypes right. :smallamused:
Catch
2010-01-14, 12:21 PM
The whole song is ironic. The song is basically a stab at people who talk about "selling out" as if it's a bad thing, because every band sold out to get their first record deal. Not to mention "All you know [them] is by what they sold you."
It's ironic for other reasons - primarily because Tool is terrible - but also that Maynard Keenan's pretentious/crass art rock shockingly made him rich enough to open a winery. The message here isn't more profound than "Ha, I'm rich now!" If he really wanted to be avant-garde, the song should have been a rap video.
And some bands (http://www.quoteunquoterecords.com/bands.htm) skip the quest for a record deal because it's not important. I would have chosen this song (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ch3oW550adA) (Lyrics (http://lyrics.wikia.com/Bomb_The_Music_Industry!:Side_Projects_Are_Never_S uccessful) are here) because Jeff Rosenstock gives away all his music on the internet and regularly laughs at himself, his "band" and everyone who tries to take music too seriously, despite being a paragon of DIY self-production.
Exeson
2010-01-14, 12:47 PM
It's ironic for other reasons - primarily because Tool is terrible
I feel that both the songs linked so far are absolute works of art. One is a valid point supported amazingly diverse and well crafted lyrics, and the other one is edgy and hip statement, I can almost feel the RAD!
:yuk:
golentan
2010-01-14, 12:58 PM
@Goletan: The whole song is ironic. The song is basically a stab at people who talk about "selling out" as if it's a bad thing, because every band sold out to get their first record deal. Not to mention "All you know [them] is by what they sold you."
That's not ironic. Ironic is that a song lambasting "for the art" and with a commercialist message is both terrible and being linked to for free on youtube. If anyone listens to that aptly named band for the art, or even for some other sense of enjoyment, the message would be lost because clearly such fans would have to be brain dead. Not to mention it's from a band I've rarely heard of. Which would imply they're not too popular, and thus not making all that much money even without being posted on youtube.
And I agree, just because something is a joke doesn't make it non-offensive. Also doesn't make it funny. I could get this forum locked (not just the thread, the whole friendly banter forum) with a single joke, but I think I'll pass. So instead I think I'll content myself with a joke about the music industry: So, the RIAA...
P.S. Catch, those guys are much better.
Exeson
2010-01-14, 01:11 PM
That's not ironic. Ironic is that a song lambasting "for the art" and with a commercialist message is both terrible and being linked to for free on youtube. If anyone listens to that aptly named band for the art, or even for some other sense of enjoyment, the message would be lost because clearly such fans would have to be brain dead.
Brain dead? Just because they listen to different music than you? To be honest I find that pretty offensive, despite the fact that I think the song is crap.
As for adding songs, how about this one? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdlzATLsQmA)
The Extinguisher
2010-01-14, 01:12 PM
^Say Anything are awesome.
But that's more about hipster culture, rather then the idea of "selling out"
ghost_warlock
2010-01-14, 01:12 PM
This thread is sooooooo 1996.
Also, Jeff Rosenstock is terrible.
Exeson
2010-01-14, 01:14 PM
But that's more about hipster culture, rather then the idea of "selling out"
It is, but I happened to be listening to it whilst reading this thread, and felt it had slight relevance. Plus the two things are definitely not mutually exclusive. Far from it.
Catch
2010-01-14, 01:14 PM
amazingly diverse and well crafted lyrics
So shut up and
Buy, Buy, Buy,
My new record.
Buy, Buy, Buy,
Send more money.
F--- you, buddy.
F--- you, buddy.
F--- you, buddy.
F--- you, buddy!
You're absolutely right.
Also, Jeff Rosenstock is terrible.
And yet, I have more respect for the guy who can barely afford gas to drive from show to show and produces his music on a laptop in his parents' house. Not because he's a poor musician, but Jeff puts out an album every year, tours his ass off, and writes truer music than multi-platinum rock stars. There's a spark of genuine humanity in art created for the sake of itself, rather than the bills it could pay.
The Extinguisher
2010-01-14, 01:17 PM
It is, but I happened to be listening to it whilst reading this thread, and felt it had slight relevance. Plus the two things are definitely not mutually exclusive. Far from it.
Probably.
Actually, I'm just ashamed I didn't think of it sooner :smallannoyed::smallbiggrin:
ghost_warlock
2010-01-14, 01:20 PM
And yet, I have more respect for the guy who can barely afford gas to drive from show to show and produces his music on a laptop in his parent's house. Not because he's a poor musician, but because Jeff puts out an album every year, tours his ass off, and writes truer music than multi-platinum rock stars.
And yet his music hasn't moved me or convinced me to do anything other than go digging around on my harddrive for my NES emulator.
Edit: Hm. Well, it has been years since I've played Excitebike so maybe some good has come from this after all. :smalltongue:
golentan
2010-01-14, 01:33 PM
Brain dead? Just because they listen to different music than you? To be honest I find that pretty offensive, despite the fact that I think the song is crap.
As for adding songs, how about this one? (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JdlzATLsQmA)
You're right. Just because I'd require head trauma before enjoying that doesn't mean there aren't other people who might enjoy it. But honestly the checklist I use: Melody, eh. Rhyme, no. Lyricism: No. Rhythm, eh. Sound quality, no.
Melody subchecklist:
Tonality: no. Phrasing, no. Chords: That's all they got.
Rhyme checklist:
Alliteration: no. Syllabic, no. Assonance, no. Apart from a few stock phrases (which I'm guessing were unintentional.
Lyricism: Is personal, and in this case not board safe, so I'll leave it off.
Rhythm:
Simplistic and inconsistent (every time it settled down into a simple pattern it broke the pattern in a sudden and arrhythmic way, that failed to make the overall pattern more complex)
Sound quality: the most forgivable of sins, if it weren't evident that the fuzz was not an artifact of youtube's compression, and fails to add to the piece.
And... I now hate you. Not really, but since I listened again to the song to compile that summary I now actually have a headache, and am feeling testy. So yes, I apologize if I'm being harsh in this thread, but having been insulted by a song for having views I don't actually hold, and which is actually bad enough to cause me physical pain, and having been subjected to the mental images present in the joke on the video (which is terrible and offensive in many, many ways), I am not feeling predisposed towards generosity.
Exeson
2010-01-14, 01:41 PM
You're right. Just because I'd require head trauma before enjoying that doesn't mean there aren't other people who might enjoy it. But honestly the checklist I use: Melody, eh. Rhyme, no. Lyricism: No. Rhythm, eh. Sound quality, no.
Melody subchecklist:
Tonality: no. Phrasing, no. Chords: That's all they got.
Rhyme checklist:
Alliteration: no. Syllabic, no. Assonance, no. Apart from a few stock phrases (which I'm guessing were unintentional.
Lyricism: Is personal, and in this case not board safe, so I'll leave it off.
Rhythm:
Simplistic and inconsistent (every time it settled down into a simple pattern it broke the pattern in a sudden and arrhythmic way, that failed to make the overall pattern more complex)
Sound quality: the most forgivable of sins, if it weren't evident that the fuzz was not an artifact of youtube's compression, and fails to add to the piece.
That is a very impressive checklist. If only the overall value of music was merely the sum of it's parts.
Catch
2010-01-14, 01:41 PM
And yet his music hasn't moved me or convinced me to do anything other than go digging around on my harddrive for my NES emulator.
Edit: Hm. Well, it has been years since I've played Excitebike so maybe some good has come from this after all. :smalltongue:
The best that can be expected from an internet spat. I checked BTMI!'s tumblr account for tour dates and discovered a video of the American Idiot musical (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egGARtwaFEo). How's that for a "selling out" thread?
golentan
2010-01-14, 02:03 PM
That is a very impressive checklist. If only the overall value of music was merely the sum of it's parts.
That's not how the checklist works. The checklist is a series of subjective things that I enjoy, but it's possible to score very high and still not be an enjoyable song because while your technical proficiency and individual components are good, you lack the ability to blend. Low scoring items can be very good. Even only making the cut on a single category doesn't prevent you from being great.
But it's not possible to fail to get any points on the checklist and be enjoyable. It simply isn't. Again: the song caused me physical pain.
Exeson
2010-01-14, 02:08 PM
But it's not possible to fail to get any points on the checklist and be enjoyable. It simply isn't. Again: the song caused me physical pain.
Then I recommend visiting the doctor and having your ears checked out.
The best that can be expected from an internet spat. I checked BTMI!'s tumblr account for tour dates and discovered a video of the American Idiot musical (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=egGARtwaFEo). How's that for a "selling out" thread?
And yet the idea of a musical fits the concept of the Album so amazingly well. Seriously.
golentan
2010-01-14, 02:19 PM
Then I recommend visiting the doctor and having your ears checked out.
Not auditory pain. Headache. I think in (among other things) music. It forms the basis of Low Thought. Low thought is how I tag physical sensations, and emotion. I'm not synesthetic, but music has a mild bleedthrough to other things. This song has caused a dull ache and a feeling of anger and mild depression.
On which note, I think I'm done with this thread before I start biting heads off.
Catch
2010-01-14, 02:25 PM
And yet the idea of a musical fits the concept of the Album so amazingly well. Seriously.
Delivering an over-produced, fanatically-hyped and ham-fisted attempt at grandeur that was a dead weight back when The Who tried it? You bet.
Unless you're referring to an album written in one key. That bit was nice.
Exeson
2010-01-14, 02:28 PM
Delivering an over-produced, fanatically-hyped and ham-fisted attempt at grandeur that was a dead weight back when The Who tried it? You bet.
Unless you're referring to an album written in one key. That bit was nice.
Have you seen this musical?
Minstrel Cowboy
2010-01-14, 02:59 PM
That COULD be offensive.
Maybe... Just Maybe.
Winthur
2010-01-14, 03:04 PM
I thought that I could possibly gain some advice in this topic on how to be more indie. I was thinking whether to start wearing a cardigan, because it's indie now. Unfortunately, people think I look like a reptile and that I'm the missing link between humans and geckos. :smallfrown:
But it's about music indie, so...
Exeson
2010-01-14, 03:51 PM
I thought that I could possibly gain some advice in this topic on how to be more indie. I was thinking whether to start wearing a cardigan, because it's indie now. Unfortunately, people think I look like a reptile and that I'm the missing link between humans and geckos. :smallfrown:
But it's about music indie, so...
Hats. hats are very indie, trillby, bobble hat, cossack hat etc.
Sneak
2010-01-14, 06:35 PM
Elvis Costello glasses.
I was listening to Elvis Costello before he was named Elvis Costello!
(That's how you make fun of indie kids without being rude; and yes, I know I'm not nearly old enough to support that as a fact. Not unless I find an old tape of him as a kid talking then make this sentence true by technicality.)
I wear a fedora, although I'd much like a panama from... There's this place near the city of panama that sells really nice hats, but I can't remember where...
As for actual indie stuff, I have no idea about the fashion scene. I just wear whatever isn't the most usual, even if it's common. (most people I see just wear a T or a polo)
The Extinguisher
2010-01-15, 12:26 AM
I wear a trilby sometimes and I'm pretty sure my glasses of the Elvis Costello variety but I can't say for sure.
I also shop at Value Village but that is mostly out of necessity. But I do tend to dress pretty indie.
golentan, I disagree with how you rate music, because there's a lot of music that I really should dislike because it is simply terrible and isn't even catchy or sound good, but I can't help but listen to anyway (a certain screamo cover of Crank That comes to mind)
Gaelbert
2010-01-15, 12:37 AM
Feel like "the man" is ruining music? Do you ever listen joyfully to very un-mainstream (counter culture?) music?
Ignoring the rest of the post, does this mean I'm pretentious if I enjoy music that is not mainstream? Because that's what it sounds like to me.
AgentPaper
2010-01-15, 01:00 AM
Ignoring the rest of the post, does this mean I'm pretentious if I enjoy music that is not mainstream? Because that's what it sounds like to me.
Only if you enjoy it BECAUSE it's not mainstream. :smallwink:
Okay... I'm guessing nobody saw the spoiler... this was a joke.
What is the point of any topic, for that matter?
Most topics are pretty self explanatory, or pose something to be discussed. This was out of left field insulting with no purpose or direction.
PROTIP: Trilbys are big in the ska and rockabilly scene!
Honestly I'd rather just discuss how awesome Henry Rollins is for the rest of the topic.
http://julieluongo.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/henry-rollins.jpg
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