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Soranar
2010-01-15, 06:21 PM
looking for a monk unarmed damage/divine casting progression prestige class

sacred fist is very nice but I don't like the prerequisites and the full BAB isn't that important with access to divine power so I'm wondering if there isn't something else that could do the trick

Optimystik
2010-01-15, 07:09 PM
You can do something similar with psionics - The tashalatora feat for Psychic Warriors lets your Psywar levels stack with Monk for advancing your punches and AC.

For divine I think your only option is SF. But that's not a bad thing - Full BAB just means one less buff you have to persist. Besides which, the class is 10/10 casting by RAW.

Kabump
2010-01-15, 07:20 PM
Not sure if you are playing 3.5 or Pathfinder, but this month's issue of Kobold Quarterly has a revamped monk class for pathfinder rules. Basically lose some monk abilities to gain spell casting as a cleric, but no domains. Looks fun, however if you are looking for 3.5 Im not sure. And yes, Im aware its not a PrC, but I thought you might be interested anyway :)

Kylarra
2010-01-15, 07:57 PM
It's too bad Ur-Priest has so many skill reqs, otherwise that would be pretty interesting monk - Ur-Priest- Sacred Fist, you'd get up to 9th level casting and still have unarmed damage and such.

Hmm, take able learner at level 1,
Factotum 1/Monk2/Factotum 2/Ur-Priest 1/Sacred Fist 10/whatever

Kelb_Panthera
2010-01-15, 09:01 PM
What's wrong with sacred fist? The prereq's are pretty easy. You get two of the four feats just for being a monk, and combat casting + combat reflexes aren't bad choices for a gish. As for BAB, can you really have too much of a good thing here?

If you want a really weird idea how about Monk 1/ Savage Bard 4/ Ur-priest 1/ Sacred fist 9/ Enlightened fist 5? or the same but you change the numbers on Sacred/Enlightened fist? Not necessarily optimal, but certainly interesting IMHO.

Edit: I feel like a knuckle head, I forgot Combat reflexes can be grabbed as a bonus feat at Monk 2. So make that Monk 2/ Savage Bard 3/ Ur-priest 1/Sacred fist X/ Enlightened fist X, not necessarily in that order :smalltongue:

Soranar
2010-01-15, 09:14 PM
I'm trying to make a swordsage/cleric/sacred fist build but you need BAB +8 to get stunning fist if you're not a monk

but I guess I could go monk/swordsage/cleric/ sacred fist

Kelb_Panthera
2010-01-15, 09:44 PM
um..... just use the PrC in ToB that advances Maneuvers and Divine spell casting and grab superior unarmed strike?

Kylarra
2010-01-15, 09:50 PM
What's wrong with sacred fist? The prereq's are pretty easy. You get two of the four feats just for being a monk, and combat casting + combat reflexes aren't bad choices for a gish. As for BAB, can you really have too much of a good thing here?

If you want a really weird idea how about Monk 1/ Savage Bard 4/ Ur-priest 1/ Sacred fist 9/ Enlightened fist 5? or the same but you change the numbers on Sacred/Enlightened fist? Not necessarily optimal, but certainly interesting IMHO.You actually get 3 of 4 feats by taking monk 2, not to mention an additional point of BAB and saves. The only one you need to pick up manually is combat casting.

sonofzeal
2010-01-15, 09:55 PM
um..... just use the PrC in ToB that advances Maneuvers and Divine spell casting and grab superior unarmed strike?
Ruby Knight Vindicator, you mean? It's supposed to be Crusader-only, but Unarmed Swordsage/Cleric + Martial Study gets in pretty easily too, if you don't mind going that route.

Mando Knight
2010-01-15, 10:17 PM
You actually get 3 of 4 feats by taking monk 2, not to mention an additional point of BAB and saves. The only one you need to pick up manually is combat casting.

And Monk 2 isn't that bad a dip if what you want is to get your cleric good at punching things.

Darrin
2010-01-16, 04:31 PM
Master of the West Wind from Dragon #314. It's a monk/cleric PrC, medium BAB and 10/10 casting levels.

Otherwise, try Fist of Raziel (BoED).

Mongoose87
2010-01-16, 04:39 PM
Master of the West Wind from Dragon #314. It's a monk/cleric PrC, medium BAB and 10/10 casting levels.

Otherwise, try Fist of Raziel (BoED).

Fist of Raziel appears to have nothing to do with the Monk class.

Soranar
2010-01-16, 04:40 PM
hum, fist of Raziel is a smite PrC, it doesn't progress unarmed damage

master of the west wind does work but it also requires stunning fist

I think I'll give up and just use a dip of monk

playswithfire
2010-01-16, 04:44 PM
I'm trying to make a swordsage/cleric/sacred fist build but you need BAB +8 to get stunning fist if you're not a monk

but I guess I could go monk/swordsage/cleric/ sacred fist

Negotiate with your DM. Expand on the Unarmed Swordsage variant by trading discipline focus(weapon focus), 2 maneuvers known at 1st level and knowledge of a discipline (probably Desert Wind or Shadow Hand as the most supernatural) for Stunning Fist at 1st level, maybe?

Darrin
2010-01-16, 05:11 PM
Fist of Raziel appears to have nothing to do with the Monk class.

Whoops, I should have looked at that more closely. I thought there might be something in BoED, but Initiate of... the P-word? Doesn't advance divine spellcasting.

Mongoose87
2010-01-16, 05:15 PM
Negotiate with your DM. Expand on the Unarmed Swordsage variant by trading discipline focus(weapon focus), 2 maneuvers known at 1st level and knowledge of a discipline (probably Desert Wind or Shadow Hand as the most supernatural) for Stunning Fist at 1st level, maybe?

Holy steep price, Batman! Sohuldn't the first Discipline Focus, being the equivalent of a feat, be enough to trade for Stunning Fist as a feat?

playswithfire
2010-01-16, 06:14 PM
Holy steep price, Batman! Sohuldn't the first Discipline Focus, being the equivalent of a feat, be enough to trade for Stunning Fist as a feat?

The first is a feat that's available at first or second level; Stunning Fist usually isn't available til much later. Also, assuming he's only dipping in swordsage before mainly going sacred fist it doesn't cost all that much extra (2 maneuvers and the ability to learn a handful of them, which I think approximates the difference between Weapon Focus and Stunning Fist), but it has the benefit of significant, which may help win over a DM who would otherwise be unwilling to mess with class features.

Sinfire Titan
2010-01-17, 01:10 AM
The first is a feat that's available at first or second level; Stunning Fist usually isn't available til much later. Also, assuming he's only dipping in swordsage before mainly going sacred fist it doesn't cost all that much extra (2 maneuvers and the ability to learn a handful of them, which I think approximates the difference between Weapon Focus and Stunning Fist), but it has the benefit of significant, which may help win over a DM who would otherwise be unwilling to mess with class features.

You're effectively making him ban an entire school of magic, lose two spells known permanently, and ditch a bonus feat for a feat that sucks against anything with Stunning Immunity (to top it off, the feat has a limited number of uses/day that is based on a specific class, so he's not even getting the full benefits of the feat).

Trade his Weapon Focus and a Maneuver Readied for just Stunning Fist. Have him lose either AC Bonus or the 4th level Discipline Focus (but get the 11th level one) for the extra Stunning uses/day.


Edit: BTW, the difference between Weapon Focus and Stunning Fist is denying actions VS +1 to Hit. The difference between Stunning Fist and a an entire Discipline? The ability to be useful after moving 24/7 VS denying the enemy an action based on a strong saving throw and an attack roll, with limited uses/day. Not even remotely even.

gorfnab
2010-01-17, 02:23 AM
Yet another Sacrilegious Fist build: Duskblade 3/ Monk 2/ Ur-Priest 2/ Sacred Fist 10/ Enlightened Fist 3