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Decoy Lockbox
2010-01-16, 12:36 AM
One of my PC's asked if there was a superior version of the halberd for him to use. I didn't really have an answer, so I decided to make one. I came up with three initial designs:

Superior halberd: +2, 1d12, high crit, reach

or

Superior halberd: +2, 1d12, brutal 2, reach

or

Superior halberd: +2, 1d12, reach, pulls target one square on natural attack roll of 15+

Now, I realize that last one is rather unorthodox, but would it be overpowered? I was looking to represent the hook on the back of the halberd in some way. I toyed with knocking prone instead of the pull, but that would probably be a bit much.

Any thoughts?

Swordgleam
2010-01-16, 12:53 AM
I'd say the third is the most powerful, and the second is the least, easily. I'm not sure it's overpowered, though. Maybe change the range to something a little narrower.

Mando Knight
2010-01-16, 12:55 AM
Third is weird, but the other two are mostly fine. I'd lean more towards the first rather than the second.

Evard
2010-01-16, 10:18 AM
I like all three but one thing i have noticed is that when you give a weapon brutal (say khopesh) you subtract 1 from the prof bonus

longsword +3 prof 1d8 dmg

Khopesh +2 prof 1d8 dmg brutal

(there are many other examples of this i'm just to lazy to put them down lol)

I think the best way to go about making the Superior Halberd would be...
Superior Halberd
+3 Prof 1d10 dmg, Reach, On a natural roll of 16-20 you may choose to pull the target of the attack 1 square

>Boost the ability to hit
>A little less dmg (which is made up in its ability to hit and special ability)
>give special property 1/4 chance of doing it (5/20 = 1/4)

This would be superior to the normal halberd not in damage but in ability to use and ability to control the target if hit with a nat roll of 16-20

ocato
2010-01-16, 10:44 AM
Would the Greatspear not suffice? +3 prof, d10 damage, reach.

Granted, it is a different weapon type (spear) than the halberd's Polearm/axe. The beauty of tabletop gaming is that he can just reflavor it as a halberd and no one will really care.

Now, if he's hung up on sneaking a little more oomf into some polearm combo, then I'd probably tell him tough cookies. However, if he just wants a nicer weapon, the greatspear is a fine choice.

juggalotis
2010-01-16, 10:52 AM
the last one could be a little overpowered but in a way that can be done anyway. for example for no other reason the to frustrate my dm i made a gnoll fighter who specialized in polearms, through feats and power choice essentially he could pull any target into his sqare and move into an adjacent square with each attack, now when it was coupled with a reach and a feat that says whenever i pull/push a target 2 sqares he falls prone. turns into pull target target falls prone, target uses move to stand and either attacks me staying in distance for me to shift and repeat or uses standard to move invoking opportunity attack with big bonuses and stopping movement if successful. unescapable battlefield controller fighter.

Evard
2010-01-16, 11:02 AM
please please tell me you had a rogue in the party...


Anyways, i could see number three not being to powerful of course anyone can abuse anything

Duos Greanleef
2010-01-16, 11:03 AM
Personally, I don't like d12s at all.

Would it be too much to say:
Superior Halberd +2 Proficiency bonus / 3d4 damage / Reach / Heavy Blade, Polearm

MAYBE you could make it Paragon-exclusive. If he's just jonesin' for bigger numbers, then make a superior halberd a character goal.

juggalotis
2010-01-16, 11:18 AM
well 3d4 is inherantly better then 1d12 in the fact it still has a max of 12 but now it has a minimum of three. 3d4 is like haveing automatic brutal 2 on a 1d12.

Evard
2010-01-16, 11:42 AM
that's true but i found that most people think that size of die means its better even if its 2d6 versus d12 or 2d4 versus d8.

Duos Greanleef
2010-01-16, 11:46 AM
Hmm, I've always liked rolling more dice vs. rolling bigger dice, and most of my group has as well.

There's something about that sound that just makes me feel more manly.
:smallamused:

Evard
2010-01-16, 01:04 PM
haha

I've always loved d4's just something about them is fun :3

Of course one time for a dungeon crawler i had my players roll 2d4 +10 for their stats :p ok maybe i need help with my obsession with d4 ^ ^ lol

Mando Knight
2010-01-16, 01:52 PM
Come to think of it, by comparing the weapons to existing ones, a superior reach/+2/brutal 2 weapon should have d10 damage dice. Option 1 is balanced with the other superior weapons, though. The last one is quirky, but I'd save it for a magic item property.

Of course, the question that comes to my mind is... what in the Nine Hells is a superior halberd?

Hal
2010-01-16, 02:23 PM
well 3d4 is inherantly better then 1d12 in the fact it still has a max of 12 but now it has a minimum of three. 3d4 is like haveing automatic brutal 2 on a 1d12.

Hey now, this might be the one chance this guy will ever get to throw a d12. Would you take that away?

Duos Greanleef
2010-01-16, 03:24 PM
If I'm not mistaken, The Giant has something to say about d12s...
:smalltongue:

Evard
2010-01-16, 04:05 PM
Come to think of it, by comparing the weapons to existing ones, a superior reach/+2/brutal 2 weapon should have d10 damage dice. Option 1 is balanced with the other superior weapons, though. The last one is quirky, but I'd save it for a magic item property.

Of course, the question that comes to my mind is... what in the Nine Hells is a superior halberd?

one with a sense of humor? or maybe class features?


But seriously

If you want to upgrade a weapon there are 3 things you need to look at

Prof/Damage Die/Extra

If you add to one you have to subtract from another, certain extras like versatile will not be affected (usually)

short sword
+3/1d6/off hand

Special Superior Short Sword
+2/1d8/off hand
or
+3/1d4/brutal 1, off hand
+2/1d6/brutal 1, off hand

Decoy Lockbox
2010-01-17, 02:53 AM
Come to think of it, by comparing the weapons to existing ones, a superior reach/+2/brutal 2 weapon should have d10 damage dice. Option 1 is balanced with the other superior weapons, though. The last one is quirky, but I'd save it for a magic item property.

Of course, the question that comes to my mind is... what in the Nine Hells is a superior halberd?

I can't use for a magic item property, as this is a post apocalyptic/no-item game. I was planning on having the superior halberd be some sort of dwarf special weapon, as the character thats going to be using it is a dwarf. And the dwarf's player doesn't have the slightest clue about optimization, she just wants something cool -- so I think I might go with my number three (set for natural rolls of 16+).

For the record, I hate big dice too, they seem to betray me. Back in the day, I asked a DM if I could roll 5d4 instead of 1d20 for my attack rolls :smallbiggrin:

JaxGaret
2010-01-17, 03:07 AM
Back in the day, I asked a DM if I could roll 5d4 instead of 1d20 for my attack rolls :smallbiggrin:

4d4 is much closer to 1d20 than 5d4, you little cheater! :smallbiggrin:

On-topic: The weapon property might work better this way:

Superior Halberd: +2, 1d12, Reach, Tumbler*

* When a character crits with a Tumbler weapon, pull the target 1 square and knock it prone.

Decoy Lockbox
2010-01-18, 12:47 AM
4d4 is much closer to 1d20 than 5d4, you little cheater! :smallbiggrin:

On-topic: The weapon property might work better this way:

Superior Halberd: +2, 1d12, Reach, Tumbler*

* When a character crits with a Tumbler weapon, pull the target 1 square and knock it prone.

The player in question is a notorious low-roller, and I don't think she would go for this. Cool idea though.