[3.5] The Lasts. (Please Critique)

[Pika...]

While Lord Death himself has been quoted to say that extinction is not a absolute for any species, over the millennium the ancient libraries of the Elves and the somewhat lesser libraries of the oldest Dwarf Clans have recorded races presumably lost to mortal time. However, while extinction is defined as no surviving breeding pair the Elves and Dwarves are aware of those known as The Lasts.

Though the reason behind their existence, and whether they have a purpose, is unknown even to them, what causes their continued existence is known. It is none other than Lord Death himself who bars their passage to any sort of after life. Why is unknown to any living creature, and whether the gods know is uncertain. Elven sages have spent centuries looking over the books of their ageless libraries trying to learn the reasons behind the Lasts, but yet nothing has been found.

You see the Lasts are literally the last of their kind. Once a species begins to die off it's population either gradually or quickly plummets. Once a species' numbers reach a level it can not hope to recover from they begin to realize their days are done. Eventually only a handful will remain, and then there will always be only one.

This final one will never feel Lord Death's embrace, though they all will eventually come to know him well. Like divine casters they gradually obtain the ability to see Death in all his forms.

The Lasts remain indefinitely. They can not die, and obtain a natural healing ability that is the envy of trolls. Many have been literally incinerated by rivals or in attempts to finally cease their own existence (volcanoes are usually a first obvious attempt), but even if turned into nothing but ash or formless vapor their parts will eventually rejoin into the timeless individual leaving not even a scare on it's body.

Many choose different paths and goals for themselves, some noble, some not. Many will even shift between morals and alignments over the centuries as their perspectives and beliefs occasionally change. Some attempt to become a final voice for the stories of their long-gone race's great tales, or simply try to remind others that they were once here. Some who come from noble species attempt to be eternal heroes of good. Some who have gone mad (though most eventually go mad for a short time here and there) out of grief, sadness, and/or loneliness might use their ageless knowledge to grab power and rule as tyrants. Some, both good and evil, might seek revenge against the cause of their kind's demise, and it has been known in more than one occasion for one Last to cause the creation of another out of revenge due to actions such as deicide or outright genocide. The later situation often sparks a rivalry fueled by mutual hatred which often effects entire worlds as they use any means to get at each other, from ancient artifacts of continent shattering power, to manipulating whole kingdoms of creatures.

Whether this is the ultimate blessing or ultimate curse depends on which Last you speak to, but eventually each tends to come to a solid conclusion of which they believe is the case.



Template

The Lasts have the following features in addition to that of the base creature. Any mortal or sentient species, be it an animal, a monstrous race, a demi-human race, etc can eventually produce a single Last.

-Blessed/Cursed: A Last can never be killed. They can be slain or incapacitated, but they will always eventually heal up and continue their Earthly existence. A Last dropped to -10 "gets up" after 1d12 hours at which point it's wounds are all completely healed. If it's body is destroyed (DM's discretion as to what qualifies as destroyed) the Last instead returns 1d8 days later. Either way the Last returns completely healed, though his equipment may have been destroyed.
-Fast Healing: A Last possess Fast Healing/2.
-Visions of Death: Like divine casters the Lasts can see and hear Lord Death. Usually when he comes to reap a soul from it's body, though that is not exclusively the case.

Many Lasts often strike up conversations with his lordship, and though most have begged him to take them at one point or another they eventually learn the futility of sobbing at Death's skeletal feat.

Those who enjoy their existence as a Last often spend their first few centuries running at every sight of him, though once they realize he has no intention of using his scythe on them they quickly learn to enjoy his company.

While both the above types of Lasts occasionally are joined by Death as a companion on their travels (usually when he gets a bit bored), none has ever been revealed the reason as to why they are not allowed to die by the Reaper.
-LA: +2

[jiriku]

Trolls, having regeneration 5, will not envy anyone with fast healing 2. If you really want them to be radical self-healers, give them regeneration = HD.

[Glimbur]

Fast Healing 2 is not the envy of trolls.

Is it possible to maim but not kill a Last? Or do they recover from that also?

This is tricky to balance, because at low levels a free rez is really really strong, but at higher levels it saves you some money and a level. At really high levels it saves you 25K, or if you're Epic it saves your cleric a 9th level slot.

I'd suggest instead of LA, advising that either all the PC's have this (which would make an interesting campaign with different pacing and goals), or none of them do.

[Pika...]

1. My mistake.

I was imagining they would be envious, because they can recover from anything, while trolls can be killed.


2. Basically they recover from everything. A broken limb reattaches, and even if it were burned the ashes and/or smoke would just collect on his stump and regenerate.


3. I am kinda confused on the last one there Glimbur?

[arguskos]

3. I am kinda confused on the last one there Glimbur?
He's saying that this isn't something only ONE PC should have, but all of them should get or none of them should get. It doesn't really need LA, since well, it's an unusual thing that shouldn't be given to only one player in the group (for party balance reasons).

[Glimbur]

3. I am kinda confused on the last one there Glimbur?

It's hard to assign a static LA to this, because the power of being able to come back from the dead reduces as the characters gain levels. It would be easier to just give this to every PC, if that's the kind of campaign you want to run.

In retrospect, if you use LA buyoff rules then that problem is sort of solved. It makes it a pretty appealing template then for a long campaign.

Since a Last is the last of their species, it really affects the campaign world if a player decides to be a human or an elf or another common race and also a Last. DM control is the best solution to that, but it also means this template will see less use.

[Pika...]

In retrospect, if you use LA buyoff rules then that problem is sort of solved. It makes it a pretty appealing template then for a long campaign.

That is what I was thinking of. Something for a long-term campaign/group. And I was actually wondering if the LA buy-off was a good idea for this.


As for using it for a particular race? I was thinking I would work with a PC to work out a race for them to use it with. Either a creature, race, monstrous creature/race, animal, what have you I have not yet introduced into my homebrewed setting (hence making it canon), a tweaked one (maybe a failed subrace or more primitive ancestral race), aa straight homebrewed race, or one of the races I know are already extinct or nearing extinction in my setting.

For example, the Humans are nearing their end in my setting unless a group of players comes up with something REALLY good and REALLY fast. Hence a player of mine playing a Human might end up as the Last of his kind. Especially if they fail their time-jump again and land in the far future...>.>

[Pika...]

He's saying that this isn't something only ONE PC should have, but all of them should get or none of them should get. It doesn't really need LA, since well, it's an unusual thing that shouldn't be given to only one player in the group (for party balance reasons).

Why exactly?

Since many "retied" PCs in my games I take as NPCs I do not see why not.

For example, I currently got a Timelord, and a player who recently got himself sentenced as a Prinny (see Disgaea for the PS2) for the next 565 years.

[arguskos]

Uh... well, in nearly any other game, being functionally immortal isn't an ability only one player should have. However, in your... um... unique circumstances, I guess it's not an issue.

[Pika...]

Uh... well, in nearly any other game, being functionally immortal isn't an ability only one player should have. However, in your... um... unique circumstances, I guess it's not an issue.

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f173/celestialkin/Smilies/rofl2.gif


Should I take this as a bad thing, or as a compliment?



ps. What do you all think of the fluff? Too corny and/or cliche?

[arguskos]

http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f173/celestialkin/Smilies/rofl2.gif


Should I take this as a bad thing, or as a compliment?
However you wish, though I can't really PEACH for a game like yours, sadly. :smalltongue:

[Pika...]

However you wish, though I can't really PEACH for a game like yours, sadly. :smalltongue:

LoL.

I need to go find the definition of PEACH again. I hope I am not that bad...


ps. I just updated a whole load of errors and mistakes in my above fluff.

I also changed "healing speed" to "healing ability" hoping it made more sense for the trolls thing. Does it?

[arguskos]

LoL.

I need to go find the definition of PEACH again. I hope I am not that bad...
Please Evaluate And Critique Honestly. I tend to do this from a baseline of a normal-ish game. Your game style seem to be SOOOOOOO far beyond anything I can possibly fathom that you've just gone and lost me, and so my advice is less than useful in this specific circumstance. :smallwink:

Note: I will actually probably be stealing this for a campaign I'm currently running, but as a one-off fate granted sorta dealy.

[Pika...]

Please Evaluate And Critique Honestly. I tend to do this from a baseline of a normal-ish game. Your game style seem to be SOOOOOOO far beyond anything I can possibly fathom that you've just gone and lost me, and so my advice is less than useful in this specific circumstance. :smallwink:.

Well, I appreciate the effort either way. :smallsmile:



Note: I will actually probably be stealing this for a campaign I'm currently running, but as a one-off fate granted sorta dealy.


I am extremely honored that such an experienced DM and member here would use one of my ideas. :smallbiggrin:

If you don't mind me asking how you plan to use it/the plot behind it so I can get ideas for myself?



ps. I just added Visions of Death as a template ability to the template in the OP. Thoughts on this addition?


pss. Also, while Humans are nearing the end in my setting/cosmology Half-Orcs are about gone.

As a plot idea, what if I allowed an Half-Orc players (I currently do not allow them), but only this once. Then I bring in a Half-Orc NPC looking to off the previously mentioned PC. Unknown the the PC/player by that point in the campaign the rival/semi-villain has already offed all the other remaining Half-Orcs. Anyone following?

[arguskos]

Well, I appreciate the effort either way. :smallsmile:
We do what we can.


I am extremely honored that such an experienced DM and member here would use one of my ideas. :smallbiggrin:

If you don't mind me asking how you plan to use it/the plot behind it so I can get ideas for myself?
Uh... thanks for the compliment! Wasn't aware I was that experienced, but hey, 'snice of ya to say anyways.

Eh, I already have Death included in my world as a character the PCs can go speak with. They may challenge him to a single competition. If they win, they can ask one favor of him. In all the history of the world, there have only been 5 victors. One of the victors asked to be immortal and immune from Death himself. Death agreed, giving him the immortality he asked. I hadn't bothered working out how it functioned mechanically (just figured it'd be the Soul-Locked template from Heroes of Horror), so this works fine.

[Pika...]

Eh, I already have Death included in my world as a character the PCs can go speak with. They may challenge him to a single competition. If they win, they can ask one favor of him. In all the history of the world, there have only been 5 victors. One of the victors asked to be immortal and immune from Death himself. Death agreed, giving him the immortality he asked. I hadn't bothered working out how it functioned mechanically (just figured it'd be the Soul-Locked template from Heroes of Horror), so this works fine.


This is awesome!

I already had something similar where players can attempt to bring back someone by approaching a temple of death and convincing them to perform a ceremony to "appease" Death to come and play a one-on-one one-for-one life game. However, tossing in this would be great.

Not only can you do the above, but if you have the guts to just gamble you can attempt to wager for something. Sure ike the above he will cheat like there is no tomorrow, but boy it would be fun (for me at least :smallbiggrin:).

May I please steal?

ps. Would offering a Wish be appropriate from your experience?

[arguskos]

This is awesome!

I already had something similar where players can attempt to bring back someone by approaching a temple of death and convincing them to perform a ceremony to "appease" Death to come and play a one-on-one one-for-one life game. However, tossing in this would be great.

Not only can you do the above, but if you have the guts to just gamble you can attempt to wager for something. Sure ike the above he will cheat like a mother-huger, but boy it would be fun (for me at least :smallbiggrin:).

May I please steal?

ps. Would offering a Wish be appropriate from your experience?
Sure, help yourself. Ideas are free, after all.

As for winning a game against Death, if the players win (low chance), then they can ask him for something of their choice. I mean, I GUESS if they asked for a Wish he'd grant it, assuming he can of course.

The reason I even included him at all is because resurrection magic is nigh-impossible in this world. You have to go talk to Death personally to barter back a soul, and he only grants such a favor to those who best him in a challenge (his favorite is chess).

[Pika...]

Sure, help yourself. Ideas are free, after all.

Thanks.




As for winning a game against Death, if the players win (low chance), then they can ask him for something of their choice. I mean, I GUESS if they asked for a Wish he'd grant it, assuming he can of course.

The reason I even included him at all is because resurrection magic is nigh-impossible in this world. You have to go talk to Death personally to barter back a soul, and he only grants such a favor to those who best him in a challenge (his favorite is chess).

Oh, so you basically give them the equivalent of a Wish spell without any chance of failure?

[PirateMonk]

Especially if they fail their time-jump again and land in the far future...>.>

How would this work with time travel? If they go back to when there were others, do they lose their immortality? What if another of their species travels forward to their time?

[Pika...]

How would this work with time travel? If they go back to when there were others, do they lose their immortality? What if another of their species travels forward to their time?

I figured that Death being Death (and in my cosmology being the secret ruler of the Temporal Plane and guardian of the mythical gate at the Eternal Citadel which supposedly leads to beyond time [spoiler for those future PCs unfortunate enough to want to go questing for it, it leads to the Far Realm. LoL]) I would have him be able to predict/simply know (he us an "Uber Deity" in my games) that Human PC will time jump to the future, hence he was always intended to be the Last of the Human species. At that point I am thinking Death would either A) prevent him from ever being able to time-jump back, or B) allow it, but he has already become the Last of his kind (I know kind of odd since his kind is technically not gone yet, but eh that is what happens when you get a timelord in your games).

[arguskos]

Oh, so you basically give them the equivalent of a Wish spell without any chance of failure?
Mechanically, that's the usual way Death fulfills requests, yes. It really depends on what they ask me for. If they ask for a True Resurrection, he'll just cast that instead of Wish (since Wish can't duplicate that).

Basically, if you win a game against Death (stupid hard, and if you lose he claims your soul for eternity on the spot), you get anything you want. It's a real trick to do, since Death doesn't accept games he's not good at either. :smallwink:

[Pika...]

Mechanically, that's the usual way Death fulfills requests, yes. It really depends on what they ask me for. If they ask for a True Resurrection, he'll just cast that instead of Wish (since Wish can't duplicate that).

Basically, if you win a game against Death (stupid hard, and if you lose he claims your soul for eternity on the spot), you get anything you want. It's a real trick to do, since Death doesn't accept games he's not good at either. :smallwink:

I like how you work him. A bit darker and less humorous than mine, but since my cosmology's Death is the best example of TN I figre he could get serious during his "game time". :smallbiggrin:

Just curious on the following:

1. How do you keep it "stupid hard"? Mine cheats, then cheats some more for the laughs (Hey, who is gonna argue with Death? No one, that's who!).

2. What if they asked/wished for divinity?!

[Scarlet Tropix]

What happens if you subject a Last to a spell effect such as Imprisonment or Trap the Soul?

[Pika...]

What happens if you subject a Last to a spell effect such as Imprisonment or Trap the Soul?

I figured that would be up to each DM, but in my case it would work as follows.

Trap the soul would have no effect, for Death would not allow the soul to be removed from a Last. Plus, he would become VERY PO'd at whoever tried that.

Imprisonment would work, for it's entirety would be trapped. I was actually planning on having one or two imprisoned Lasts in my gaming world(s) and/or cosmology/planes. In addition, I was imagining such a spell or a similar spell/power/situation would probably be among the only ways to deal with the truly ancient ones, especially from my setting's/cosmology's nearly forgotten "Primoridal Phases" (Time had yet to truly exist back then as it is now known).

[arguskos]

I like how you work him. A bit darker and less humorous than mine, but since my cosmology's Death is the best example of TN I figre he could get serious during his "game time". :smallbiggrin:
I run things much darker and less humorous than most people. However, I think EVERYONE does things darker than you do. :smallwink:


1. How do you keep it "stupid hard"? Mine cheats, then cheats some more for the laughs (Hey, who is gonna argue with Death? No one, that's who!).

2. What if they asked/wished for divinity?!
1. Death only accepts games he has about a 75% chance of winning. I have access to my player's sheets, so I can do the math quickly and assign Death whatever modifiers he needs to give him the edge on the players. Basically, I cheat behind the screen.

2. If they win, he grants it. They are now a Divine Rank 0 god, and have to deal with the rest of the pantheon, who is probably not happy about the newcomer. :smallwink:

[Pika...]

I run things much darker and less humorous than most people. However, I think EVERYONE does things darker than you do. :smallwink:

LoL.

Thanks. :smallbiggrin:

You should see the disaster I am preparing over at the Roleplaying forum.



1. Death only accepts games he has about a 75% chance of winning. I have access to my player's sheets, so I can do the math quickly and assign Death whatever modifiers he needs to give him the edge on the players. Basically, I cheat behind the screen.

Only 75% yet only 5 people have won? O.o

Were these all former PCs?



2. If they win, he grants it. They are now a Divine Rank 0 god, and have to deal with the rest of the pantheon, who is probably not happy about the newcomer. :smallwink:

Oh, so you run a single united pantheon system? Pretty neat.

[Lysander]

I really like it. It's flavorful and original. I especially like the part of their being good and evil lasts with bitter rivalries that span millennium.

Here's a question. What happens if a Last gets a member of their species resurrected? Do they lose their last status and become mortal again?

[arguskos]

Only 75% yet only 5 people have won? O.o

Were these all former PCs?
For reference, probably about 300-400 hundred people have challenged him thus far, and 75% is the lowest odds he plays at.

And no, those are all just NPCs in the background. I've never run this campaign world before. Each of my games is set in a new, unique world. :smallwink:


Oh, so you run a single united pantheon system? Pretty neat.
In this world, there are a handful of pantheons. The one Death is a part of does not really like it when new gods randomly ascend.

[Pika...]

I really like it. It's flavorful and original.

Chucks, thanks. Makes me feel proud as a new DM hearing that. :smallredface:



I especially like the part of their being good and evil lasts with bitter rivalries that span millennium.

I am glad to hear that.

As I started one of my trains of thoughts/daydreaming I imagined what would happen if one race/species genocided another. Then I started imaging how the fallen race's Last would react (again, knowledge of the Lasts varies by race and location, or even entire worlds since they might not even have one yet).



Here's a question. What happens if a Last gets a member of their species resurrected? Do they lose their last status and become mortal again?

Eh. So many loophole you have to bottle up as a homebrewer I see. :P

For my take on it I will/would have it where Lord Death would prevent such measures. Now finding a way to prevent your species from going extinct in the first place might be within the rules, since time is not set in my multiverse, but again Death won't let her/him time travel (anyone smell a plot-hook?).



ps. You get some odd inspiration from the strangeest places. What do you all think about adding this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_JQiEs32SqQ