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AtwasAwamps
2010-01-22, 10:40 AM
So, I’m sitting here randomly plotting things out and I just came up with a fantastic and horrible idea that I want to use ASAP, but I just wanted to check and see if anyone else thinks this is as cool as I do.

I want to hand my players a copy of Weapons of Legacy and a copy of Tome of Battle and then say:

“Every three centuries, The Black Dragon Emperor rises from the abyss to conquer the world. Rising with him are the legendary Generals of Darkness, his mighty servants, who help him to strike down his foes and leave destruction in his wake. Should he prove victorious, he will plunge the world into darkness and terror. Few mortals can stand against his power.

But the gods are merciful and just and would not leave humanity to face the nightmare alone. When the Black Dragon Emperor arises, so too do the spirits of the Legendary Guardians return to the material land, choosing worthy heroes whom they shall guide to wield the Guardian Weapons of Legend and stem the tide of darkness.

This battle has repeated itself for time immemorial. Few mortals know anything of this cycle of legends. It has been 300 years since the last incarnations of the Guardians spent their lives to lock the Black Dragon Emperor away for what they thought was forever. He is remembered in stories and fairy tales now, a bogey to threaten children with and cause night terrors. Nowadays, there are more pressing concerns to worry about…the aggressive actions of the Atana Empire against its neighbors, the rise in necromancy, the strange robberies or outright destruction of various temples across the world…

Yes, there is a great deal to worry about and a great deal for the average wandering swordsman to do…”


Rough Game Parameters:


Characters start at level 5

Tome of Battle must be used in some way to create your character…whether you utilize the base classes or feats or what have you.
(Alternative: We will refluff The Giant’s “Bearer of the Ancestral Weapon” class with the understanding that you will be entering it ASAP.)

You must choose one weapon of legacy from the book. If you would like a custom weapon, you may discuss it with me, but for simplicity’s sake, choose one. Choose based on powers…weapons will be refluffed for the game world. Weapon types will be refluffed as needed…don’t worry about the sword you want being a greatsword or a dagger, that is easy to change.

Martial Lore is a class skill for everyone, ever.

Knowledge (History) is a class skill for everyone, ever.

I hope you like Kung Fu Movies and/or anime.




Does this sound like it has the makings of a fun game? I’m really going for a “You are legendary heroes” right from the start thing…a 4E before 4E feel, if you will.

I know that this restricts casters slightly, but there ARE options for them in ToB, combined with some of the powers that weapons of legacy grant and the Bearer of the Ancestral Weapon PrC that will be added in. Plus, I don’t mind caster’s being restricted a bit so that we can get some fancy melee things in there, and I don’t think my players would mind either.

Dusk Eclipse
2010-01-22, 10:43 AM
One question Can I play on that game?:smalltongue:

If you are going for giving them Legacy weapons I suggest you push a bit the Nine Swords, they make more sense IMO, also the cash cost for the rituals are ....too much IMHO so you may want to do something about that.

Ernir
2010-01-22, 10:48 AM
Does this sound like it has the makings of a fun game?
Oh, yes.

Will this be a Play-by-Post? Can I play? :smallbiggrin:

Roderick_BR
2010-01-22, 10:51 AM
IMO, it'll be awesome. If your players like to play in "legends" games, where they know the fate of the country/world is on their shoulders, go for it.

Funny note: A lot of people complain that ToB is "too wuxia" (as if it were bad), but 3E itself was beta-tested with a wuxia scenario, back in AD&D, testing the new BAB and Save Throw mechanics.

Optimystik
2010-01-22, 10:53 AM
That's an awesome idea, but you should also allow Shugenja/Wu Jen for the caster lovers. Let them have legacy items like ornate fans, staves or rings.

bosssmiley
2010-01-22, 11:06 AM
Don't use Weapons of Gimping Legacy as written. You know all that awesome these "grows with your character and remains relevant through his entire career" weapons are supposed to bring to the game, well, it's all a lie. They're parasites, not symbionts!

That caveat given, you are in the cool book for making me think of Al Swearingen in the context of wuxia.

mikej
2010-01-22, 11:10 AM
Wuxia? I see no bankai here :smallconfused:

AtwasAwamps
2010-01-22, 11:30 AM
You will have to forgive my ignorance. What is Bankai?

I may run a pBp version of this on the boards, but I was actually thinking of running it for one of my two IRL groups...not sure which one would like it more, but I'll have to see.

And yeah, I wouldn't be using the weapons of legacy as written (certainly not the rituals), but I probably will stick with the powers and what-not. Even if they are not all that great, they are quite flavorful and honestly, with the Maneuvers and Stances available to them, my players should be just fine with a little bit of nerfing that just feels straight up awesome.

Note that all I said was that ToB had to be involved in your character creation somehow. Classes like Wu Jen and Shugenja are definitely still on the table, but I'd like most of the characters to be martial in some way. It's not like Maneuvers aren't just spells, anyways...

awa
2010-01-22, 11:36 AM
(bankai) refers to the final stage of a soul reapers power from the anime bleach. which is very diffrent from wuxia.

Dusk Eclipse
2010-01-22, 11:37 AM
Bankai is a term of the AWESOME manga BLEACH,look it up

Also PLEASE do a PbP version of this

Serenity
2010-01-22, 11:38 AM
Seems to me that if you drop the permanent penalties associated with Weapons of Legacy than the effort and material costs of unlocking their powers would be balance enough.

AtwasAwamps
2010-01-22, 11:46 AM
Okay. I knew the Bleach thing, I was just really hoping that wasn't the reference...

Anime =/= Wuxia, though I admit they can be quite close.

I'll think about the PbP thing and am still working on the rebalancing legacy weapons thing...hrmmm...

mikej
2010-01-22, 11:47 AM
which is very diffrent from wuxia.

My bad. I get that term mixed in with other anime related chatter.

It was still joking though.

Shademan
2010-01-22, 11:50 AM
what is wuxia?

Serenity
2010-01-22, 12:25 PM
Probably the most well-known example of the genre in the West would be the movie Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon

Optimystik
2010-01-22, 12:27 PM
what is wuxia?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wuxia

Shademan
2010-01-22, 12:29 PM
ah, ok I see. Yeah I thought it was wuxia at first too. but I've seen some really good reflavouring done by players...so hey!:smallcool:

LurkerInPlayground
2010-01-22, 11:24 PM
So, I’m sitting here randomly plotting things out and I just came up with a fantastic and horrible idea that I want to use ASAP, but I just wanted to check and see if anyone else thinks this is as cool as I do.

I want to hand my players a copy of Weapons of Legacy and a copy of Tome of Battle and then say:

“Every three centuries, The Black Dragon Emperor rises from the abyss to conquer the world. Rising with him are the legendary Generals of Darkness, his mighty servants, who help him to strike down his foes and leave destruction in his wake. Should he prove victorious, he will plunge the world into darkness and terror. Few mortals can stand against his power.

But the gods are merciful and just and would not leave humanity to face the nightmare alone. When the Black Dragon Emperor arises, so too do the spirits of the Legendary Guardians return to the material land, choosing worthy heroes whom they shall guide to wield the Guardian Weapons of Legend and stem the tide of darkness.

This battle has repeated itself for time immemorial. Few mortals know anything of this cycle of legends. It has been 300 years since the last incarnations of the Guardians spent their lives to lock the Black Dragon Emperor away for what they thought was forever. He is remembered in stories and fairy tales now, a bogey to threaten children with and cause night terrors. Nowadays, there are more pressing concerns to worry about…the aggressive actions of the Atana Empire against its neighbors, the rise in necromancy, the strange robberies or outright destruction of various temples across the world…

Yes, there is a great deal to worry about and a great deal for the average wandering swordsman to do…”


Rough Game Parameters:


Characters start at level 5

Tome of Battle must be used in some way to create your character…whether you utilize the base classes or feats or what have you.
(Alternative: We will refluff The Giant’s “Bearer of the Ancestral Weapon” class with the understanding that you will be entering it ASAP.)

You must choose one weapon of legacy from the book. If you would like a custom weapon, you may discuss it with me, but for simplicity’s sake, choose one. Choose based on powers…weapons will be refluffed for the game world. Weapon types will be refluffed as needed…don’t worry about the sword you want being a greatsword or a dagger, that is easy to change.

Martial Lore is a class skill for everyone, ever.

Knowledge (History) is a class skill for everyone, ever.

I hope you like Kung Fu Movies and/or anime.




Does this sound like it has the makings of a fun game? I’m really going for a “You are legendary heroes” right from the start thing…a 4E before 4E feel, if you will.

I know that this restricts casters slightly, but there ARE options for them in ToB, combined with some of the powers that weapons of legacy grant and the Bearer of the Ancestral Weapon PrC that will be added in. Plus, I don’t mind caster’s being restricted a bit so that we can get some fancy melee things in there, and I don’t think my players would mind either.
A 4e feel? I didn't think there was one.

But it feels refreshingly unpretentious.

ShneekeyTheLost
2010-01-23, 12:20 AM
I could also see Warlock being of use... reflavoring 'Eldritch' as 'Chi'. Make Hedious Blow less... hedious, maybe letting him power up all of his unarmed strikes, then giving him Superior Unarmed Strike + Snap Kick and maybe a Monk's Belt so he's got the unarmed combat thing going, but more along the lines of 'creepy dude with supernatural powers who can pull some wierd stuff'.

storybookknight
2010-01-23, 01:38 AM
Ditto on the parasite weapons deal. I had a player who I gave a WoL to and he wound up somewhat gimped, even with the slightly unfair homebrew advantages I gave him.

Of course, he was playing a fighter/melee ranger multi....

The single biggest problem with running a campaign in this style (which I have) is that Tome of Battle characters do not follow the normal CR ratings for encounters. Armies of weak mooks are useless vs. TOB players. Without spells to recharge, CRs equal to party level also pose little threat. If it's a combat-heavy game be prepared to adjust things on the fly.

Callos_DeTerran
2010-01-23, 01:42 AM
My suggestion, considering I'm running a similar ToB campaign even now, is to allow your players access to homebrew disciplines to widen the range of potential characters. If you tell your players that you want them at least partially martial, in my experience, most will think to themselves 'why only go part way?' and build an entirely martial character. Tis best to provide more options for them that way.

Kelb_Panthera
2010-01-23, 02:01 AM
If I was one of your players I'd definitely call, "dibs on the swordsage/shugenja/ruby knight vindicator," :smalltongue:

Gametime
2010-01-23, 12:45 PM
If I was one of your players I'd definitely call, "dibs on the swordsage/shugenja/ruby knight vindicator," :smalltongue:

...Spending two feats to get the necessary Devoted Spirit maneuver and stance and somehow picking up Turn Undead in the mean time?

AtwasAwamps
2010-01-27, 04:01 PM
Just a quick update now:

I have three players who are trusted friends of mine putting together characters for this with the following additional house rules:

1) Tumble, Jump, and Balance are never cross class, but cap at cross class levels till you take a class that has them as class skills.

2) Ignore WoL parasitical features and costs...weapons will advance in a different manner than described in the book, which will be revealed during the course of the story.

They will be my "testing ground" to see if this game works. I will be running this game for them periodically, most likely in episodic format, much like an adventure television show or comic book. Really, the feel I'm going to go for is Journey to the West...multiple adventures on the way to a single goal.

I may give them a dragon horse. That was my favorite part of Journey to the West. Horse pee has never been more important.

OverdrivePrime
2010-01-27, 04:40 PM
This sounds incredibly fun - I envy your players!

AtwasAwamps
2010-01-27, 04:47 PM
This sounds incredibly fun - I envy your players!

Don't. I'm currently attempting to stat out Sun Wukong, Zhu Bhaijie, and Sha Wujing for this game.

How much damage would a 13,500 pound cudgel do?

Dusk Eclipse
2010-01-27, 04:58 PM
Don't. I'm currently attempting to stat out Sun Wukong, Zhu Bhaijie, and Sha Wujing for this game.

How much damage would a 13,500 pound cudgel do?
Look for a hurkling hurler build

Amphetryon
2010-01-27, 05:36 PM
My first thought was:

you made a game from this (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0090728/) awesome movie

Prime32
2010-01-27, 06:23 PM
There was talk of a Fist of the North Star game at BG (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=6701.0) a while back, but it didn't go anywhere. It was suggested that characters would have armour and weapons as normal, but everything would be reflavoured as bare-chested kung-fu.

I second the homebrew manouvers thing, and suggest the use of the ardent class as well.

For spellcasting in this game, try adding these rules (http://brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.php?topic=5398.0).

TheCountAlucard
2010-01-27, 06:42 PM
My first thought was:

you made a game from this (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0090728/) awesome movie

My first thought was, "Another Exalted thread?" :smalltongue: Should've known better.

AtwasAwamps
2010-01-28, 03:34 PM
Look for a hurkling hurler build

That shows me THROWN damage, though. This guy just slaps you with it. After he takes it out of his ear. Man, I love Chinese folklore...

Anyways, a lot of good suggestions. I am probably going to avoid homebrew disciplines unless absolutely necessary...only one of my players has ever used ToB before and he's paralyzed with choices right now. We'll see what happens.

I'll most likely post a campaign journal style log of this game if it comes out interesting. It should be quite amusing.