Could the Oracle help Xykon find his phylactery?

[paladinofshojo]

I'm just wondering why Xykon doesn't just coerce the Oracle into helping him find his phylactery? Instead of having the entire hobgoblin army look for it

[Mr. Spock]

Probably because Xykon doesnt think that far ahead. Or he might not know about the oracle

[Pyron]

:xykon: "Where's my phylactery?"
Oracle: "In the water."

[paladinofshojo]

:xykon: "Where's my phylactery?"
Oracle: "In the water."

:xykon: Meteor Swarm

[Zea mays]

:xykon: Meteor Swarm

Oracle: Didn't see that one coming.

[Kish]

I suspect, wherever Xykon looked for the Oracle, the Oracle wouldn't be. The Order of the Stick are worth playing games with. Xykon, not so much.

[derfenrirwolv]

:xykon: Meteor Swarm

Oracle: *comes out from behind the curtain, looks at chared remains of kobold in oracle robes. "PHEW! Thanks for standing in for me Herb, that looked painfull"

[Lvl45DM!]

Oracle: *comes out from behind the curtain, looks at chared remains of kobold in oracle robes. "PHEW! Thanks for standing in for me Herb, that looked painfull"

:xykon: Another Meteor Swarm. Soul Bind

[megabyter5]

Obviously that was also a fake Oracle. The real one is vacationing on an island somewhere.

[zql]

I am not familiar with epic or divine rules, so

Can divine divination overcome epic abjuration?

[TriForce]

I am not familiar with epic or divine rules, so

Can divine divination overcome epic abjuration?

IF powerful enough, sure, but the oracles kind of divination isnt with spells it seems, so its kinda hard to classify

[Seppl]

I am not familiar with epic or divine rules, so

Can divine divination overcome epic abjuration?

That's no problem: The oracle can just look into the future when the strip where the phylactery is found is compiled into a book and read it.

[Kish]

I am not familiar with epic or divine rules, so

Can divine divination overcome epic abjuration?
I'm told it's a moronic name for a mediocre game with incredible music...

...oh, divine divination, not Divine Divinity. Never mind, then.

[Beorn080]

The oracles oracular orations don't seem to care about epic spells. After all, he told Roy exactly where Xykon was, despite Cloister.

[Starscream]

Obviously that was also a fake Oracle. The real one is vacationing on an island somewhere.

And he already has the phylactery. And is using it as an ashtray.

[Acero]

The oracles oracular orations don't seem to care about epic spells. After all, he told Roy exactly where Xykon was, despite Cloister.

we dont know if he cloistered Dorukan's

[Kish]

we dont know if he cloistered Dorukan's

We don't? (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0532.html)

Of course, it's possible the Oracle told Roy where to find Xykon in the window between Dorukan dying and Xykon recasting the Cloister, since Celia is vague about how big that window was.

[Zevox]

Theoretically? Yes. I'd be willing to bet he simply doesn't know about the Oracle, though, else he'd have visited him already to inquire about things like the defenses around Girard's Gate and how he can overcome them.

Zevox

[paladinofshojo]

Theoretically? Yes. I'd be willing to bet he simply doesn't know about the Oracle, though, else he'd have visited him already to inquire about things like the defenses around Girard's Gate and how he can overcome them.

Zevox

Are we talking about the same Xykon?:smallconfused:

[TheSummoner]

We know the Oracle is scared of Xykon... So even if Xykon was aware of his existance, I doubt the Oracle would let himself be anywhere neat Xykon or any of his minions.

[Zevox]

Are we talking about the same Xykon?:smallconfused:
Assuming you're thinking of the Xykon who was accepting Redcloak's excuse (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0548.html) that O-Chul might be able to give them exactly that information as a reason for them to sit tight in Azure City for months while he grew progressively more bored, then yes, we are.

Zevox

[INWranger]

While I have no doubt the Oracle COULD help Xykon I doubt very much that Xykon would ask him. Evidence in strip #653 against Darth V, when he actually takes advice from somebody.

[NerfTW]

I think it's simply a matter of Xykon not knowing about the Oracle.

But we don't really know. We haven't seen Xykon since he sent out the hobgoblins to search. For all we know, he DID go to the Oracle and find the exact location, and it just took a few weeks. For instance, if it fell into the ocean, knowing the current location doesn't help him get down there to retrieve it any more easily.

Also there's the possibility that he thinks the Oracle can't find it. Remember that nobody remembers details about him and think he's a cleric. Xykon could also have thought his spells were too strong for the Oracle to break.

[Dr.Epic]

A) He doesn't know about the Oracle.
B) Hasn't this been brought before?:smallconfused:
C) I wouldn't ask the Oracle a location related question (second panel) (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0330.html).

[Iamyourking]

Xykon may not know about the Oracle, but I'd be willing to bet that Redcloak does. A person who possesses such useful knowledge, especially when they are from a monstrous race and are an important servant of one of the Dark One's allies, would definetely be known to someone as informed as Redcloak.
However, right now Xykon is not likely to listen to any suggestions that Redcloak makes and Redcloak is not likely to try and help Xykon so chances are they won't be visiting the Oracle.

[Pyron]

I think we're forgetting the biggest reason (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0328.html) why Xykon can not consult the oracle.

[paladinofshojo]

Assuming you're thinking of the Xykon who was accepting Redcloak's excuse (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0548.html) that O-Chul might be able to give them exactly that information as a reason for them to sit tight in Azure City for months while he grew progressively more bored, then yes, we are.

Zevox


What I meant is that Xykon would rather play Yahtzee than plan ahead (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0414.html)

[paladinofshojo]

I suspect, wherever Xykon looked for the Oracle, the Oracle wouldn't be. The Order of the Stick are worth playing games with. Xykon, not so much.

Neither is an ancient black dragon who has recently lost her only son (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0628.html)

[paladinofshojo]

IF powerful enough, sure, but the oracles kind of divination isnt with spells it seems, so its kinda hard to classify



From what is inferred, the Oracle's power may be a form of epic divination granted to him directly from a diety (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0566.html) or the lack of a fourth wall allows him to see how the plot will unravel by using his powers to forsee how the comic will go ( http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0330.html)

[ΩΩΩ]

I think we're forgetting the biggest reason (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0328.html) why Xykon can not consult the oracle.

This is probably the case. However, there's no reason he couldn't just send Redcloak to ask on his behalf. Or I suppose he couldDominate something to the same effect.

However, I think it's probably because Xykon simply doesn't know the Oracle exists. He doesn't strike me as the type to remember anything that isn't immediately useful to him (or entertaining). So even if he's been informed of the Oracle, he probably forgot about it.

[paladinofshojo]

I think we're forgetting the biggest reason (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0328.html) why Xykon can not consult the oracle.

The oracle's gaurdians aren't dumb enough to hassle an epic level lich who's just lost his phylactery (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0565.html)

[Zevox]

What I meant is that Xykon would rather play Yahtzee than plan ahead (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0414.html)
You missed my point. We know for a fact that Xykon is interested in more detailed knowledge about Girard's Gate and its defenses - it's why Redcloak was able to convince him to wait around at Azure City all this time. If he knew about the Oracle, why wouldn't he just go to him for that information, rather than waiting for Redcloak to finish interrogating a prisoner when it is clearly taking him a long time for him to do so?

Zevox

[Prowl]

I'm told it's a moronic name for a mediocre game with incredible music...

...oh, divine divination, not Divine Divinity. Never mind, then.

I thought Divine Divinity was actually pretty darn good, if maybe a little too difficult in the beginning... it was the sequel which was mediocre (on a good day).

[Kish]

Neither is an ancient black dragon who has recently lost her only son (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0628.html)
There is no indication that she didn't deal honorably with the Oracle, or that the Oracle had any reason to expect she wouldn't. Xykon, on the other hand, would be at least as dangerous to merely be around as Belkar, and we know how well that worked out for the Oracle.

[Asta Kask]

Neither is an ancient black dragon who has recently lost her only son (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0628.html)

But the oracle is given his powers by Tiamat, so it's likely that there's a "no-screwing-around" clause for chromatic dragons.

[Optimystik]

The original question depends on two factors:

1) Would Tiamat be inclined to locate the phylactery when requested,
2) If yes, would she be inclined to share that knowledge with the Oracle.

And none of that gets into the question of whether the Oracle WOULD help Xykon. After all, "Dude is frickin' scary." (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0567.html)

[The Pale King]

:xykon: Another Meteor Swarm. Soul Bind
:xykon: *sees a note on the dead kobold* Dear Xykon, that wasn't me either. I'm hundreds of miles away from here. That kobold was actually a wizard. A wizard that prepared Explosive Runes this morning.

[factotum]

1) Would Tiamat be inclined to locate the phylactery when requested,
2) If yes, would she be inclined to share that knowledge with the Oracle.


I'm not convinced Tiamat really has a choice here. After all, she must have been able to foresee what would happen if the Oracle gave V's name to the ABD, yet that information was given and resulted in the deaths of a quarter of the black dragon population of the planet. If Tiamat is willing to allow that sort of thing to happen for the sake of the Oracle always giving a truthful answer, I don't think there's much she WOULD baulk at!

[Larkspur]

If Team Evil knew about the Oracle, it wouldn't have taken them 18 years to determine the non-Lirian gate locations, and they wouldn't have needed Serini's diary.

Ergo, neither Xykon nor Redcloak know.

[TheBlackShadow]

I think we're forgetting the biggest reason (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0328.html) why Xykon can not consult the oracle.

I sseem to remember the very reason the Oracle implemented the Test of Heart was because of someone having a heart attack due to his predictions and the ensuing legal battle. As Xykon doesn't even have a heart, the Oracle has no need to worry on that front, so Xykon goes straight through.

[paladinofshojo]

You missed my point. We know for a fact that Xykon is interested in more detailed knowledge about Girard's Gate and its defenses - it's why Redcloak was able to convince him to wait around at Azure City all this time. If he knew about the Oracle, why wouldn't he just go to him for that information, rather than waiting for Redcloak to finish interrogating a prisoner when it is clearly taking him a long time for him to do so?

Zevox



Correction, we know that Redcloak is interested in more detailed knowledge about Girard's Gate and its defenses. Up until now, most of Xykon's priorities were just to a)take over the world via the Redcloak's ritual and b) entertain himself as much as possible...he also has shown to hinder Redcloak's attempts to gather data in the first place for no other reason to sate his own amusement (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0543.html) In fact, planning ahead is against Xykon's very character, one of his core beliefs is that there is a level of force over which no tactics can be successful. I'm assuming he believes himself to be at that level

[Zevox]

Correction, we know that Redcloak is interested in more detailed knowledge about Girard's Gate and its defenses. Up until now, most of Xykon's priorities were just to a)take over the world via the Redcloak's ritual and b) entertain himself as much as possible...he also has shown to hinder Redcloak's attempts to gather data in the first place for no other reason to sate his own amusement (http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0543.html) In fact, planning ahead is against Xykon's very character, one of his core beliefs is that there is a level of force over which no tactics can be successful. I'm assuming he believes himself to be at that level
You're not understanding me. Xykon agreed to wait for Redcloak to acquire that information before they moved on - this shows he must place some value on Redcloak doing that, or else he'd have just brushed Redcloak off and been on the move quickly, precisely because of his impatience to take over the world and usual disdain for planning. The fact that he actually waited months for Redcloak to do this, while being incredibly bored with the waiting (as he mentioned when Redcloak discussed his "playing" with O-Chul for his amusement), just reinforces how much he must have actually valued that information. If he didn't, he wouldn't have been willing to wait around like that.

Zevox

[Optimystik]

I'm not convinced Tiamat really has a choice here. After all, she must have been able to foresee what would happen if the Oracle gave V's name to the ABD, yet that information was given and resulted in the deaths of a quarter of the black dragon population of the planet. If Tiamat is willing to allow that sort of thing to happen for the sake of the Oracle always giving a truthful answer, I don't think there's much she WOULD baulk at!

You're assuming that providing that info to V changed the outcome in some way. The fate of those dragons could have been set in stone the minute the ABD decided to go after V and his family.

You're also assuming that Tiamat received a clear vision of what would happen in the future; but looking forward through time isn't like flipping on the television, even in D&D. For all we know, she merely received those cryptic words to her inquiry, and subsequently passed them on to the Oracle. Nothing in V's prophecy says anything about slaying dozens of dragons after all, and this was both weeks after he killed the dragon in the cave, and months before he would later cast Familicide.

[factotum]

Nothing in V's prophecy says anything about slaying dozens of dragons after all, and this was both weeks after he killed the dragon in the cave, and months before he would later cast Familicide.

What does V's prophecy have to do with it? I was talking about the information the Oracle gave to the ABD, not to V.

[Optimystik]

What does V's prophecy have to do with it? I was talking about the information the Oracle gave to the ABD, not to V.

That's even less useful. All she asked was likely "who killed my baby," and possibly even "where can I find him." It's unlikely she asked "Is it a bad idea to teleport to this elf's house and kill his family as revenge for killing mine?"

Without such a query, the Oracle's/Tiamat's future sight can't be relied on to have seen Familicide coming.