PDA

View Full Version : Good loot for my party?(3.5E)



DarkEternal
2010-01-31, 05:04 PM
As we're nearing the end of the current war campaign in which the party will(hopefully) end with success, I am now in the position where I have to choose what rewards I will give to my players for their actions.


It should be a good, honest reward that will power them, but not overpower them. When they end the campaign they will be level 9, maybe level 10.

So, this is what I have so far:

1. Mage: Robe of Defense +2. Meaning, +2 on AC and on all saves. This seems pretty good, and I am currently satisfied with this choice.

2. Fighter: Winged Shield--this one will be a little modified from it's initial purpose. For one, it will not be a wooden +3 shield, but rather steel shield +3, and for other, instead of the fly spell on it, it will rather have an Overland Flight spell on it. He already has a good weapon, so defensive stuff seems more up to par.

3. Rogue---Gloves of Dexterity +4 and Cloak of Elvenkind. This seemed pretty good for him, and I don't think it needs much revision.

4. Ranger---Oathbow, again I am pretty satisfied with it, thought it might be a bit too powerful for him at that level.

5. Cleric---I was thinking of Dwarven Plate +1 of Fortification, but after scouting a bit, it seems a bit too much, an overkill to give him a 100 percent immunity to crits and/or sneak attacks at this level, so maybe I'll just make it a Dwarven Plate +2, though that seems like too little for a change since he already has a +2 plated armor on him.

Basically, what do you think of this distribition, and would you change something drastically(perhaps for the cleric?)?

Proven_Paradox
2010-01-31, 09:03 PM
More information is helpful. What do the party members like to do? Is the mage a blaster or Batman? What kind of feats does the fighter have? Does the rogue focus on scouting or stabbing? Is the cleric a healbot or zilla? These kinds of things shape what kinds of rewards are suitable. Also, what books are available? Most importantly here: do the PCs have access to the Magic Item Compendium (MIC) and Spell Compendium (SpC)?

Now, one by one...


1. Mage: Robe of Defense +2. Meaning, +2 on AC and on all saves. This seems pretty good, and I am currently satisfied with this choice.What is the type on those bonuses? I'm going to analyze this as though it's an Armor bonus to AC and Resistance bonus to saves, which effectively makes this equivalent to Bracers of Armor +2 (4,000 gp) and a Vest of Resistance +2 (4,000 gp). If you go with the DMG method of combining items, it increases the cheaper property's cost by 50%, so they'd add up to 10,000 gp in worth. If you use the MIC rules, both of these qualify for being added at no extra cost, ending in 8,000 gp. If these are untyped bonuses that stack with everything else, raise the price by 50%, giving you 15,000 for DMG and 12,000 for MIC.

AC is worthless to a properly played mage. A mage's defenses should come from Mirror Image, Displacement, Blink, and that sort of thing, as well as just not being close enough to soak attacks. Saves are nice, but by this point a Cloak of Resistance +3 (which should easily be within reach), or even better, the Greater Resistance spell (SpC) would be better than this. Were I in your mage's shoes, I'd be feeling pretty gypped if this was my entire reward, especially next to what everyone else is getting.


2. Fighter: Winged Shield--this one will be a little modified from it's initial purpose. For one, it will not be a wooden +3 shield, but rather steel shield +3, and for other, instead of the fly spell on it, it will rather have an Overland Flight spell on it. He already has a good weapon, so defensive stuff seems more up to par.The shield component is 9,000 gold (already better than what you're giving the mage by MIC rules). But the Overland Flight component sends the price through the roof. The spell is 5th level, making the minimum caster level 9. Scrolling down a bit on this page of the SRD (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/creatingMagicItems.htm#) gets you to a series of tables for estimating magic item cost, and the 1/day Overland Fligth falls under the "Spell Effect: Command Word" section. SL * CL * 1,800, so you get 5 * 9 * 1,800 = 81,000. That shield is worth 90,000 gp, which is more than the recommended WBL of a 12th level character. I strongly recommend toning this one down. A standard Winged Shield is plenty. Going from wood to steel is trivial. If you really don't think that's enough, maybe make it +4 or give it another special ability. I personally don't think that's necessary.


3. Rogue---Gloves of Dexterity +4 and Cloak of Elvenkind. This seemed pretty good for him, and I don't think it needs much revision.Gloves are 16,000, Cloak is 2,500. 18,500 total, and the items are both highly relevant to his function. This isn't bad, and if I were this rogue I'd feel well rewarded for a job well done.

That said, if I were a rogue of that level with approximately 20,000 gp to spend, I would much rather have a Ring of Invisibility. Still, I think this is the right area to shoot for, and maybe they'll have the money from other loot for the ring.


4. Ranger---Oathbow, again I am pretty satisfied with it, thought it might be a bit too powerful for him at that level.This isn't bad for an archery focused ranger. If you go with this for him/her, I'd recommend giving the rogue a bit more and putting the others' treasure in the neighborhood of 25,000.


5. Cleric---I was thinking of Dwarven Plate +1 of Fortification, but after scouting a bit, it seems a bit too much, an overkill to give him a 100 percent immunity to crits and/or sneak attacks at this level, so maybe I'll just make it a Dwarven Plate +2, though that seems like too little for a change since he already has a +2 plated armor on him.Adamantine full plate: 16,500. For the fortification (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/magicArmor.htm#fortification), it depends on the grade you're talking about. "Complete immunity to crits" implies Heavy Fortification, making this a +6 equivalent armor, adding 36,000 to the cost, total 52,500 gp, which you rightly see as overkill. Cut it down to Moderate Fortification, and you've got +4 armor, 16,000 gp, total 36,500. That's still too strong for this level. Light fortification makes it +2, adding 4,000 to the cost, total 20,500. That's right in line with the rogue's gloves and cloak, a bit low next to the ranger's bow, but in the right neighborhood. To bring him up to the Oathbow's level, maybe throw in a nice wand or two. Minor Vigor is always handy, and Lesser Restoration can be good to have around.



All things said, your distribution is frankly wonky as hell, though I suspect the fighter's shield being an obvious outlier was not intentional. You seriously need to work on something better for the mage. Metamagic Rods are always nice to have around, just off the top of my head. Shooting for equality to the Oathbow, I'd say give the rogue something else smallish--perhaps some Boots of Elvenkind to go with that cloak.

Runestar
2010-01-31, 09:14 PM
To be more specific, AC bonuses of 4 or less aren't very useful to a wizard as they will likely be having extended mage armour on. To be honest, I think he is getting the shorter end of the stick.

Try looking up MIC, it has quite a number of cheap magic items that add more options to a caster. :smallsmile:

Zaq
2010-02-01, 03:27 AM
On some level, changing loot distribution is a good way to combat power imbalance. Since fighters and rangers (and to a lesser but still very real extent, rogues) are SO MUCH weaker than wizards and clerics, it makes perfect sense to me that they should have significantly nicer things, because they need them more. The casters still need to get something cool, and you need to be fully aware of what you're doing, but I see no issue with giving the mundane characters better gear than the magic characters. Just make sure that the casters don't feel like they're being cheated, since they're still your players (even if they are playing at a higher level than everyone else... or at least, it's trivially easy for them to do so) and they still need cookies.

Note: I'm assuming that the casters are not completely incompetent. If the wizard thinks that Fireball is the best spell ever and the cleric thinks that it's a good idea to prep plenty of Cure spells, my advice won't really apply.

Rasman
2010-02-01, 03:55 AM
i'd definitely give the mage something different, perhaps a really nice staff or a rod, maybe stillness or silence, that way he either doesn't have to move or doesn't have to speak in order to cast spells, as for staffs, staffs of illusion tend to be fun, but you can probably do better

Rogue seems to be getting a LOT, either up the cash for the rest or take one item away, imo

DarkEternal
2010-02-01, 08:20 AM
Yeah, I went over my choices some more and found some of them need to be corrected. The idea is that they don't get the money for their actions but magic items, since I run the campaign where magic items are pretty hard to get in shops, no matter what amount of money the adventurers have, especially not in smaller towns.

For starters, the shield will definitively have Fly and not Overland flight.

For ranger, I think no real changes are in order(plus, the loot distribution was really poor for him throughout the campaign, due to the rogue having simply more luck and a lot of stuff that "dropped" was from "Small" enemies)

For the rogue, maybe I'll scrap the entire idea and just give him a Rogue's vest. It's in that price range, gives nice skill bonuses and extra 1d6 on Sneak attacks.

For the cleric, probably Minor Fortification on Dwarven plate +2 or something like that. I think that's a good deal.

As for the mage I am at a loss. Originally, I wanted to give him a Ring of Wizardry(level 2 spells). Hell, I might still go with it, though I know spamming of Web will then commence to it's fullest. He hinted to me, outside the campaign that he would like something defensive which is why I thought the robe would be a good deal(I don't know if it would stack with other stuff, but I'd house rule it enough that it would), but I also contemplated the

Robe of Scintilating colors. It's a bit more expensive then I wanted to give to the party:

Robe of Scintillating Colors: The wearer of this robe can cause the garment to display a shifting pattern of incredible hues, color after color cascading from the upper part of the robe to the hem in sparkling rainbows of dazzling light. The colors daze those near the wearer, conceal the wearer, and illuminate the surroundings. It takes 1 full round after the wearer speaks the command word for the colors to start flowing on the robe. The colors create the equivalent of a gaze attack with a 30-foot range. Those who look at the wearer are dazed for 1d4+1 rounds (Will DC 16 negates). This is a mind-affecting pattern effect.

Every round of continuous scintillation of the robe gives the wearer better concealment. The miss chance on attacks against the wearer starts at 10% and increases by 10% each round until it reaches 50% (total concealment).

The robe illuminates a 30-foot radius continuously.

The effect can be used no more than a total of 10 rounds per day.

It's a pretty good robe, the cost is 26 000 gp.

Of course, if anyone has some other suggestions, I am more then open to them.

Munchkin-Masher
2010-02-01, 08:34 AM
Metamagic rods are always awesome.

Give him a minorb rod vof maximize if he is a blaster and a mjnor rod of chaining or some such nonsence if he's a batman.

Gnaritas
2010-02-01, 08:38 AM
If the Wizard wants defense it depends a lot on what defense he gets from his spells.

If he does not have Mage Armor or something equivalent it is possible to buy Bracers of Armor or an armor without spell failure.

Bracers of Armor +5 (25k)
Twilight Mithral Chain Mail +3 (+7 armor AC, max dex 6, no ACP, no ASF)(17.100 gp)
Mithral Buckler +1 (2.015 gp)

An Amulet of Health +4 (16k) will always be usefull i guess.

A ring of invisibility (25k)

A War Wizard Cloak might interest him (16k)

Tyndmyr
2010-02-01, 08:42 AM
To be more specific, AC bonuses of 4 or less aren't very useful to a wizard as they will likely be having extended mage armour on. To be honest, I think he is getting the shorter end of the stick.

Try looking up MIC, it has quite a number of cheap magic items that add more options to a caster. :smallsmile:

This. Mage armor lasts for an entire adventuring day at these levels, and it's a first level slot. There's really no reason not to have it up.

Stat boosters are handy. Metamagic rods are good. There's the one item set in MIC thats pretty juicy(gloves of the starry sky, goggles of the golden sun, belt of the wide earth and...one more).

DarkEternal
2010-02-01, 08:50 AM
If the Wizard wants defense it depends a lot on what defense he gets from his spells.

If he does not have Mage Armor or something equivalent it is possible to buy Bracers of Armor or an armor without spell failure.

Bracers of Armor +5 (25k)
Twilight Mithral Chain Mail +3 (+7 armor AC, max dex 6, no ACP, no ASF)(17.100 gp)
Mithral Buckler +1 (2.015 gp)

An Amulet of Health +4 (16k) will always be usefull i guess.

A ring of invisibility (25k)

A War Wizard Cloak might interest him (16k)

He's got Mage armor, also Braces of Armor, I think +2. Twilight Mithral Armor seems pretty good.

Gnaritas
2010-02-01, 08:52 AM
He's got Mage armor, also Braces of Armor, I think +2. Twilight Mithral Armor seems pretty good.

Does he (and you) realise Mage Armor and Bracers of Armor +2 do not stack? Neither does the Mithral Armor.

Runestar
2010-02-01, 08:54 AM
Consider a ring of enduring arcana (complete mage, 6000xp), rod of lesser extend (if he doesn't already have one).

Or for armour, +1 twilight glamered mithral chain shirt as a base. For extra augments, consider the iron ward diamond (MIC) or the death ward property (+1, MIC).

DarkEternal
2010-02-01, 08:56 AM
Does he (and you) realise Mage Armor and Bracers of Armor +2 do not stack? Neither does the Mithral Armor.

Of course. If he casts Mage armor now, he gets two AC or something, also know about the armor, which is why I thought the robe wasn't a bad deal since it boosts your saves as well as your AC(it would basically put him at zero,due to bracers, but at least he would have a free slot now).

Tyndmyr
2010-02-01, 09:04 AM
Of course. If he casts Mage armor now, he gets two AC or something, also know about the armor, which is why I thought the robe wasn't a bad deal since it boosts your saves as well as your AC(it would basically put him at zero,due to bracers, but at least he would have a free slot now).

Save boosts? Meh. You can add them to stuff via MIC or have them all day long via the resistances in SpC. You can get both, but they don't stack.

Resistance(the phb version) can also be permanencied, but again, doesn't stack.

In general, avoid giving loot that causes stacking to be a big issue. As a mage, I would honestly sell any of those items and buy something useful instead.