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View Full Version : Help with Turning a Dragon Shaman into a Healer. (3.5)



Grifthin
2010-02-11, 07:47 AM
Does anybody have any tips for how to turn the dragon shaman into a decent secondry healer ? I'm planning on goin full Dragon Shaman 20 - Are there any feats which I should consider ?

Mushroom Ninja
2010-02-11, 07:54 AM
Does anybody have any tips for how to turn the dragon shaman into a decent secondry healer ? I'm planning on goin full Dragon Shaman 20 - Are there any feats which I should consider ?

Put many ranks in UMD and use wands of CLW to heal people between combat. In-combat-healing sucks for the most part.

RagnaroksChosen
2010-02-11, 08:44 AM
Well what your gonna want to do is a few things.
first full 20 is a little suboptimal.
I would sugest going to 11 then prestigeing or multiclassing out to something else.


Obviously your gonna want the vigor aura.

High charisma is also good. your gonna want to not use your touch of vitality untill after your vigor aura has hit the half way mark.

Not sure what you should go into at 11 but i would sugest finiding another class or prc.. I'm a big fan of dragon lord from dragonmagic(i belive) and picking up double draconic aura.



stats should be cha>con>every thing else

LichPrinceAlim
2010-02-11, 09:00 AM
Does anybody have any tips for how to turn the dragon shaman into a decent secondry healer ? I'm planning on goin full Dragon Shaman 20 - Are there any feats which I should consider ?

For first, I personally like the Dragon Shaman class. It can easilly foll the role of the Buff-o-Matic without magic...

However, healer it is not.

That said, I agree, but multiclass out earlier. I'd suggest Dragon Shaman 6/Marshall (Minis Hadbook) 5/ Healer (Also Minis Handbook) 9

I know, the multiclass penalties bite, but for what it's worth, this combo is not only a Healer, but the party's best friend (your melee players will thank you). The only issue is you pretty much have to be good. Choose the Adamantine or Gold dragon as your patron dragon and the Dragon Warlord is born!

Ormagoden
2010-02-11, 12:00 PM
That said, I agree, but multiclass out earlier. I'd suggest Dragon Shaman 6/Marshall (Minis Hadbook) 5/ Healer (Also Minis Handbook) 9


I'm sorry did you just put healer in a build? Healer? Really.

Well I would ignore that suggestion completely OP. Healer is a completely substandard class.

Instead I might do some of the following:

Least disruptive option: Buy gear!

Mushroom ninja's advice is the first thing that comes to mind for me as well. Get ranks in UMD and buy one or two cure light wounds wands. It's the fastest and easiest way to get healing. (alternatively eternal wands of cure moderate are awesome too.)

Belt of healing (MIC) is a nice touch as well.

Disruptive option: Take levels in cleric.

DMM persist : Mass lesser vigor and never worry about combat healing again.

LichPrinceAlim
2010-02-11, 12:13 PM
I'm sorry did you just put healer in a build? Healer? Really.

Well I would ignore that suggestion completely OP. Healer is a completely substandard class.

Instead I might do some of the following:

Least disruptive option: Buy gear!

Mushroom ninja's advice is the first thing that comes to mind for me as well. Get ranks in UMD and buy one or two cure light wounds wands. It's the fastest and easiest way to get healing. (alternatively eternal wands of cure moderate are awesome too.)

Belt of healing (MIC) is a nice touch as well.

Disruptive option: Take levels in cleric.

DMM persist : Mass lesser vigor and never worry about combat healing again.

Healer's Casting synergizes with Dragon Shaman's/Marshall's cha need. Granted, yeah it sux. I didn't say it was perfect....

and hey, I thought the concept of the Dragon Warlord was at least cool....


But I'd take his advice on items and "possible" cleric dip seriously. I just gave another option...

Blackfang108
2010-02-11, 12:20 PM
Does anybody have any tips for how to turn the dragon shaman into a decent secondry healer ? I'm planning on goin full Dragon Shaman 20 - Are there any feats which I should consider ?

Double Draconic Aura at character level 12 (I think) Keep your Vigor Aura up at all times, and switch the other around as needed.

That is really everything you can do, class-wise, in the healign department.

Wands of CLW used with UMD are the only other thing you need.

Grifthin
2010-02-11, 12:25 PM
Thanks for all the feedback - guess they will have to be happy with Vigor aura + buffs.

Blackfang108
2010-02-11, 12:28 PM
Thanks for all the feedback - guess they will have to be happy with Vigor aura + buffs.

Make sure to go over the feats in Dragon Magic. There's a few that could probably help you.

Ormagoden
2010-02-11, 12:44 PM
Healer's Casting synergizes with Dragon Shaman's/Marshall's cha need. Granted, yeah it sux. I didn't say it was perfect....

and hey, I thought the concept of the Dragon Warlord was at least cool....


But I'd take his advice on items and "possible" cleric dip seriously. I just gave another option...

Sorry! that was a rather strong reaction to you suggesting healer wasn't it.
My fault, It's a knee jerk reaction to seeing the class used in a build!

LichPrinceAlim
2010-02-11, 12:46 PM
Sorry! that was a rather strong reaction to you suggesting healer wasn't it.
My fault, It's a knee jerk reaction to seeing the class used in a build!

Forgiven. I like healer personally, minus its slight "one-trick-pony"ness.

Its a decent class, but like monk and soulknife, it needs a little coaxing to show its playability

The Glyphstone
2010-02-11, 12:53 PM
The Healer to the Cleric is like the Warrior to the Fighter, or more accurately, the Adept to the Sorcerer. It's fundamentally the same, but both forced into a specific, narrow niche, and it remains substandard at its own niche compared to the more versatile and at the same time more effective counterpart. It's not that the healer is bad at healing, it's that the cleric is better while simultaneously able to do many other things that the healer simply cannot. A unicorn companion is so not worth that, though it is one of the few classes that actually has a 20th level capstone worthy of the title - free True Resurrections are nothing to sneeze at in non-heavily optimized games.

RagnaroksChosen
2010-02-11, 01:17 PM
would not a favored soul work better for said dragon shaman rather then healer...

Blackfang108
2010-02-11, 03:33 PM
would not a favored soul work better for said dragon shaman rather then healer...

It could, but the Dual Stat spellcasting tends to put people off.

Sinfire Titan
2010-02-11, 03:38 PM
Thanks for all the feedback - guess they will have to be happy with Vigor aura + buffs.

You're dead-set on DS20, right? Ask your DM if you can get the Pally's Lay on Hands feats to affect your version of the ability. There's one in the BoED, and another in Magic of Incarnum. Both of them are really useful for that ability (though the MoI one, Azure Touch I believe is the name, needs Essentia to be useful).


If you take both, grab a Helm of Essentia from the Magic Item Compendium. And scour the books for other effects that will boost your psuedo-Lay on Hands ability.

jokey665
2010-02-11, 03:39 PM
It could, but the Dual Stat spellcasting tends to put people off.

Healer also has dual stat spellcasting. Using the same two stats as Favored Soul, just in reversed positions, IIRC.

RagnaroksChosen
2010-02-11, 03:48 PM
It could, but the Dual Stat spellcasting tends to put people off.

I don't know any thing is better then a healer... especialy where in this case DC doesn't realy matter.

Blackfang108
2010-02-11, 03:51 PM
I don't know any thing is better then a healer... especialy where in this case DC doesn't realy matter.

What exactly makes healer so bad?

I've never seen an actual synopsis, and I've never really run down the abilities in any detail.

I mean, I can tell why it's worse than Cleric and Favored Soul, but not why it's on par with a CW Samauri or Monk.

RagnaroksChosen
2010-02-11, 03:56 PM
What exactly makes healer so bad?

I've never seen an actual synopsis, and I've never really run down the abilities in any detail.

I mean, I can tell why it's worse than Cleric and Favored Soul, but not why it's on par with a CW Samauri or Monk.

My anything is better then a healer was specific to this descussion not a comment on the healer in general.. which IMO has its place.

Sinfire Titan
2010-02-11, 04:01 PM
What exactly makes healer so bad?

I've never seen an actual synopsis, and I've never really run down the abilities in any detail.

I mean, I can tell why it's worse than Cleric and Favored Soul, but not why it's on par with a CW Samauri or Monk.

It's only ability is healing until around 17th level, when it gets Gate (at which point it far outshines the Monk). Until then, your only combat-oriented ability is summoning an effing Unicorn. All of its SLAs are also spells on it's list, and it's a dual-stat caster.

Optimystik
2010-02-11, 04:16 PM
It's only ability is healing until around 17th level, when it gets Gate (at which point it far outshines the Monk).

Ironically, a synopsis of the Truenamer is similar. I think WotC just slapped Gate onto every bad 9th-level caster to try and save it.

(Oh look, Apostle of Peace got it too)

Sinfire Titan
2010-02-11, 04:26 PM
(Oh look, Apostle of Peace got it too)

Not like it needed it.

Optimystik
2010-02-11, 04:41 PM
Not like it needed it.

Does it break your vows if a CR 40 outsider trashes everything instead of you?

Call something LG that you can't control and stand back :smallbiggrin:

Sinfire Titan
2010-02-11, 04:44 PM
Does it break your vows if a CR 40 outsider trashes everything instead of you?

Call something LG that you can't control and stand back :smallbiggrin:

LoL. Probably, but if it doesn't then whatever you called takes the penalties imposed by your Vow.

Flickerdart
2010-02-11, 04:48 PM
Or you could keep calling CG Outsiders, and give them the benefit of the doubt. Every time. What's the lowest WIS an Apostle of Peace can have?

Optimystik
2010-02-11, 04:51 PM
LoL. Probably, but if it doesn't then whatever you called takes the penalties imposed by your Vow.

Ah, but if you can't control it then it shouldn't count as a "companion."

It's moot in any case - AoPs can't even cast most of the spells on their list because a holy symbol breaks VoP. :smallsigh:


Or you could keep calling CG Outsiders, and give them the benefit of the doubt. Every time. What's the lowest WIS an Apostle of Peace can have?

The class has no minimum, though you'll of course need at least 19 to cast Gate.