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Zaq
2010-02-14, 05:23 PM
So, I played my first 4e game last night. I spent a good few days reading through the material and playing with the character builder, and I came up with a build that I thought looked pretty fun.

Relevant houserules: 24 point buy, no backgrounds, 250 starting gp (low, but apparently there's a lot of loot to compensate), only one White Lotus feat functions per attack, only one AoO per round (like 3.5).


Level 3 human swordmage (Aegis of Ensnarement)

STR 10
DEX 10
CON 17
INT 17 (15+2)
WIS 14
CHA 8

Sub-stats:

HP 44
Surge Value 11
Surges/day 11
AC 19 (with warding)
Fort 15
Ref 15
Will 16

Feats:
Intelligent Blademaster
White Lotus Hindrance
White Lotus Riposte

Powers:
(AW) Booming Blade
(AW) Lightning Lure
(AW) Sword Burst
(EC) Sword of Sigils
(DA) Dance of the Sword
(UT) Channeling Shield
(EC) Dimensional Vortex

No relevant equipment besides a non-masterwork longsword and non-masterwork leather armor.

Skills:
Arcana, Athletics, Diplomacy, Insight, Endurance


Basically, I wanted to be someone who could really hinder the enemy. Lots of immediate interrupts, lots of fighting on my terms (you WILL do this, or you will regret it in ways X, Y, and DIE), lots of defining the parameters of the encounter. After an evening of play, though (running a full day of 5 encounters), I don't really feel like I got to do anything. I never even got to use my Aegis (I had someone marked, but they always just attacked me... which is somewhat good, but it meant that the Ensnarement part was completely useless. I couldn't put the enemy in the no-win situations I had envisioned.)

I was decent at attracting attention (when I could hit, at least, which was WAY less often than I would like. I'd say I hit maybe 30 or 35% of the time. Part of that was the fault of the dice, but still) but not very good at dealing with enemies when they decided to actually attack me. My only really good trick was Dimensional Vortex (which is the ability that made me want to play a swordmage, because it's EXACTLY the kind of thing I had in mind for this character), but one bit of coolness per encounter doesn't make me a fun character. If I could do things like that more often, I would have been a lot happier... not that I expect something on the power level of a level 3 encounter power as an at-will, or anything, but more options to actually say "no, I don't think you're going to be doing that today" would be, well, nice.

More often than not, I felt like what I did really wouldn't matter: sure, I COULD use that power, but what difference would it make? I also didn't help defend much... I really couldn't soak a hit, and I spent the majority of the final encounter on the ground failing death throws. I never felt like what I could do would make a difference.

Is there anything that I'm doing wrong, really? Did I make poor power choices, or is the character concept simply not viable at all? Or is there some other reason for my lack of effectiveness? I know that I'm under-equipped, but I wasn't the only one in that situation, and the others did just fine.

I'm just not sure what a good 4e character actually looks like. Is there anything I could do to make this character stronger? (I'm talking more about rebuilding than about going forward in level, because sucking now for payoff later isn't my idea of a good time.) Any advice?

potatocubed
2010-02-14, 05:30 PM
The first thing I notice is that your Int is low for a class with Int as a primary stat.

See, in 4e all classes have one primary stat which drives most (or all) of their powers and two secondary stats, which you usually focus in one of unless you roll well, which drive certain secondary effects of your powers.

You should start at 1st level with at least 18 in your primary stat after racial modifications. In your case I'd be tempted to buy an 18 and bump it to 20 with the human +2 modifier. This will not only boost the to-hit and damage of almost all your powers by +2, but it'll bump your AC and Reflex defences as well.

Since I'm not a build expert you'll have to get other people to help you with further specifics, but the primary stat thing is what I notice.

Kaun
2010-02-14, 05:30 PM
Can you tell us who/what makes up the rest of your party?

Zaq
2010-02-14, 05:42 PM
The first thing I notice is that your Int is low for a class with Int as a primary stat.

See, in 4e all classes have one primary stat which drives most (or all) of their powers and two secondary stats, which you usually focus in one of unless you roll well, which drive certain secondary effects of your powers.

You should start at 1st level with at least 18 in your primary stat after racial modifications. In your case I'd be tempted to buy an 18 and bump it to 20 with the human +2 modifier. This will not only boost the to-hit and damage of almost all your powers by +2, but it'll bump your AC and Reflex defences as well.

Since I'm not a build expert you'll have to get other people to help you with further specifics, but the primary stat thing is what I notice.

When I asked the GM for help with stats, he explicitly told me that he expected us to have a post-racial 17 in our primaries at level 3 and an 18 at level 4. I've been told that level 4 is a huge power boost (though +2 looks way less exciting to me than, you know, actually getting something you can do, but maybe that's just my 3.5 experience talking?), so I guess there's that. I'm pretty sure that the other party members had similar stats, but I can't be certain. Besides, if I were to pour even more into my INT, what would I have left? I'm already feeling like my defenses suck, and anything I put into INT is taking away from one of my defensive stats. My understanding is that a defender's job is to make the enemy pay attention to them, and then actually deal with it when the enemy complies. I'm already having trouble with that. Would it be worth it to decrease my defenses even worse? Or am I working off of a mistaken understanding? (Ideally what I wanted to do is to force an enemy to pay attention to me, then make them very unable or unwilling to comply, but that didn't go as well as I had hoped.)


Can you tell us who/what makes up the rest of your party?

Not in general, since we have an "open campaign" (we have about 15-20 people involved, and any given meeting just consists of whoever's got the time and the inclination) rather than a set party. Last night, we had me, two strikers (an avenger and a barbarian) and two controllers (two druids). I gather that having a leader around might have made me not spent the majority of the last encounter in a dirt nap, but I only had one surge left to spend at that point anyway, so being able to spend surges wouldn't have really helped me anyway. Regardless of the lack of a leader, though, no one else seemed so ineffective as I did.

ashmanonar
2010-02-14, 05:45 PM
Ensnarement is somewhat weak, compared to Shielding or Assault. Just looking at your power choices, I'd say you should just go Shielding, and take advantage of your Con. Pick powers that have Shielding riders, and you're fine. (I highly recommend Dimensional Warp; helps you pull people out of at-risk situations.)

Also, adjust your stat build. Buy a 16 int (and add the human bonus to it), and buy a 16 con. You can just barely afford a 14 Wis with your higher point buy, and then put an 11 in whatever stat you want to base feats off of later.

Feat choices are solid. Make sure you're keeping track of what you hit with your at-wills, it's easy to lose track.

Also: 250 gold to start at level 3? Really? What kind of control freak is your dm? (The standard for starting a character at above 1st level is 3 magic items, L + 1, L, and L - 1, and gold equal to L - 1. For level 2, I might be tempted to drop the number to 2 items, but that's because you're expected to gain 1 item per level.)

The other house rules seem excessively anal retentive to me. The White Lotus stuff is powerful, but you're spending feats on them, which is what they're for. Also means that you have to hit the enemy with an at-will attack, sometimes forgoing the better effects of an encounter. And one OA a round? Might as well say "no fighters or wardens in my campaign", and make his/her life a little easier.

Tengu_temp
2010-02-14, 05:46 PM
I'm not sure what the White Lotus feats do, but at your level you should have roughly 3 AC and attack more: +1 weapon and armor (nothing you can do about those yet), at least 18 intelligence, and feats - Weapon Expertise and either Armor Proficiency (Hide) or that feat which improves your Warding, with the latter being preferable. You put way too much into Constitution, I'd swap it and Intelligence if I were you. Do you really need 14 Wisdom? It's a tertiary stat and gives you very minor bonuses - with 12 Wisdom you only get -1 to some skills and Will (which is the least targeted defense anyway), and you save 3 points you can spend somewhere else.


I'm already feeling like my defenses suck, and anything I put into INT is taking away from one of my defensive stats.


Uh, Intelligence boosts your AC and Reflex. Investing in it doesn't take away from your defensive stats, it reinforces them.

Also, your DM works on weird assumptions. The standard for 4e is at least one ability score at 18 (or more) at first level, and at third level you should pretty much have all your base magic items (weapon, armor, amulet) enchanted, one of them maybe even at +2.

Yakk
2010-02-14, 05:52 PM
*nod*, aim for at least a 18 int for a defender who uses int to attack.

Int boosts your AC, your attack, and your damage. It is very useful.

Con gives you healing surges, and gives secondary benefits sometimes.

...

The general technique with a swordmage is to mark something far away from you, then move even further away. And have allies in the way between you.

You want your mark to fire.

Swordburst is your bread-and-butter ability. You'll note that it gets stronger the more opponents are near you -- ensnaring means that you mark something away from you, and if it doesn't come close to you, it gets teleported next to you.

Two white lotus feats after white lotus has been nerfed seems pointless. You can only use one -- so use one.

...


(DA) Dance of the Sword
I find dance of the sword too finnickey.

(UT) Channeling Shield
I prefer the one that swaps positions -- encounter power that ups your entire groups mobility is the win.

(EC) Dimensional Vortex
This is a ranged power, which means it provokes OAs. It is only really useful if bad guys are ignoring you.

Here is a slight rebuild:

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
level 3
Human, Swordmage
Swordmage Aegis: Aegis of Ensnarement
Background: Occupation - Scholar (+2 to Arcana)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 12, Con 16, Dex 11, Int 18, Wis 13, Cha 8.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 12, Con 16, Dex 11, Int 16, Wis 13, Cha 8.


AC: 20 Fort: 15 Reflex: 16 Will: 15
HP: 43 Surges: 11 Surge Value: 10

TRAINED SKILLS
Insight +7, Arcana +12, Athletics +7, Endurance +9, History +10

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +1, Bluff, Diplomacy, Dungeoneering +2, Heal +2, Intimidate, Nature +2, Perception +2, Religion +5, Stealth +1, Streetwise, Thievery +1

FEATS
Human: Intelligent Blademaster
Level 1: White Lotus Riposte
Level 2: Focused Expertise (Longsword)

POWERS
Bonus At-Will Power: Booming Blade
Swordmage at-will 1: Sword Burst
Swordmage at-will 1: Lightning Lure
Swordmage encounter 1: Sword of Sigils
Swordmage daily 1: Frost Backlash
Swordmage utility 2: Dimensional Warp
Swordmage encounter 3: Blades of Fiery Wrath

ITEMS
Leather Armor, Longsword
====== Copy to Clipboard and Press the Import Button on the Summary Tab ======

The attributes I chose are actually aimed at mid/long range feats. Str 12 gives you improved swordmage warding in paragon (+1 to all defences for a feat), for example. Dex 11 means that in epic, you could do something like switch to a quarterstaff of ruin/dual implement/staff fighting for +10 static damage on attacks (great if you go the AOE route), and a few other things.

I chose Blades as my level 3 encounter because it is an interrupt attack. Your main goal, tactically, is to pull as many bad guys into being adjacent to you, then sword burst. If you can only get 1 adjacent to you, aegis the guy 2 away from you, shift 1 square closer to some other bad guy, then booming blade the guy in front of you.

When you miss with an at-will melee power, use the close burst 1 as a free attack.

Sword Burst will place White Lotus Riposte on creatures that you hit (punishing them if they attack you), and Sword of Sigils places a punishment if they don't attack you. This lets you crank up your stickyness, or down.

An alternative to the level 3 power is "incindiary sword", which lets you pull a 3x3 group of opponents to you with a punishment effect if they don't attack you. It is really an opening power.

I chose expertise, because hitting matters.

I usually prefer shielding swordmages to ensnaring swordmages, because the -8 to damage is usually enough to encourage bad guys to run guantlets to attack you -- and if so, you can position allies in the way so that they get OAs! (And if they ignore you, all the better).

Lighting Lure becomes an edge-case power which you use in the case of flying enemies.

In short, two standard tactics:
1> Use your mark to encourage distanct opponents to cluster near you,
2> Use close burst on clusters of opponents,
3> Use booming blade to make single opponents stay near you.

Note that booming blade is a really evil "you are screwed" with riposte. If they attack you, they get riposted -- if they don't, they get booming bladed. It can lead to crazy combos.

Mando Knight
2010-02-14, 05:56 PM
Drop your Con down to 14 or 15. Drop your Wis to 12, then use the points to boost Strength and Dexterity. Dex should be at least 13 to qualify for Improved Warding. The reason why I'm not stressing getting 18 Int right away is that you know that level 4 is right around the corner.

White Lotus Hindrance is worthless for a Swordmage: leaving difficult terrain is always 1 square of movement.

The ideal for the Swordmage is to mark and move. Aegis one guy, then move far away and Booming Blade the next guy.

Also, if you're going to only take powers that have rider effects for Shielding Swordmages, take Aegis of Shielding, dammit.

Kesnit
2010-02-14, 06:07 PM
When I asked the GM for help with stats, he explicitly told me that he expected us to have a post-racial 17 in our primaries at level 3 and an 18 at level 4.

That's still low. You should start with an 18 INT.

[/quote]Besides, if I were to pour even more into my INT, what would I have left?[/quote]

A lot. INT covers AC and Reflex save. You've already dumped CHA, which is fine. (I played a Swordmage with a 8 CHA and had no problems.) Not sure what your secondary stat for an Ensnarement SM is, so I don't know what else you can dump. (I am guessing CON is your secondary, given it is 17.) If it is CON, lower it a little. Your secondary can be lower than your class primary without gimping yourself.


I'm already feeling like my defenses suck, and anything I put into INT is taking away from one of my defensive stats.

Lowering DEX won't change anything, since your Reflex will be based off INT. If you lower CON, a loss of 1 point won't change much. (You will get hit 5% more of the time.)


My understanding is that a defender's job is to make the enemy pay attention to them, and then actually deal with it when the enemy complies.

No, a defenders job is to make the enemy pay attention to them and make them pay if they don't. Smart enemies will stay on the defender, meaning you won't get to trigger you Aegis.

However, if your DM is having even unintelligent monsters sticky on you, you may want to talk to him away from the table. Smart monsters know the effect of leaving a defender, so they won't. Unintelligent ones are much less likely to know. Also remember, your marks stay, even if you aren't adjacent to the marked enemy. You can mark and then move, forcing an enemy to move with you or take the effect of your mark.

Shardan
2010-02-14, 06:28 PM
As a defender, you pretty much want the enemy you mark attacking you. The white lotus riposte gives them their 'damned if they do' response by giving them auto damage for attacking you.
Replace intelligent blademaster with Melee training-Intelligence. same effect on attack and you get boost for damage too (not sure by wording if intelligent blademaster boosts damage too or not)

If you have a controller, use lightning lure to drag the target into damage zones or try frigid blade to boost your stickiness or booming blade to boost the 'damned if they do' attack you.

If Dragonmark feats are allowed, mark of warding is made of win.

some swordmage tactics I've heard of is 'mark and run' which essentially leaves the target with permanent penalties and possible ongoing damage from powers if they don't chase you, or possible AoO's if they do. this works especially well with slow and immobilize effects to keep them from following. Ensnarement mark and run, then teleport them accross the battlefield when they attack someone else, then immobilize or slow them and leave 'em. This tactic can be kinda dangerous though (leaving you open to AoO's)

Kiero
2010-02-14, 06:32 PM
You don't need an 18 in your primary stat to be effective, just a 16 or more.

4E is a team game, it's impossible to assess what you "did wrong" without also knowing what the other PCs did. Sometimes it could be a case of a team not working together effectively.

Kylarra
2010-02-14, 06:37 PM
Replace intelligent blademaster with Melee training-Intelligence. same effect on attack and you get boost for damage too (not sure by wording if intelligent blademaster boosts damage too or not)
Intelligent blademaster is strictly better than melee training (int), as it allows you to make RBAs using Int with thrown weapons.

rayne_dragon
2010-02-14, 07:44 PM
Basically, I wanted to be someone who could really hinder the enemy. Lots of immediate interrupts, lots of fighting on my terms (you WILL do this, or you will regret it in ways X, Y, and DIE), lots of defining the parameters of the encounter.

When somebody says they want to hinder the enemy an define the parameters of the encounter, I would assume they want to play a controller class rather than a defender.

Still, if you want to stick with swordmage, I think you'd do better with a higher INT (18 at least) for more accuracy and better AC and Reflex. White Lotus Hiderence could be replaced with something that gives you a bonus to hit. I'm not too familiar with swordmage powers, but I know sometimes a power seems great in theory, but is lackluster in actual play, so trying out powers and retraining them later is to be expected on occasion.

You can also help your accuracy by trying to set up combat advantage, which is most easily done by flanking. The extra +2 to hit can really help at times. Also, it occurs to me that you may have just had bad luck, did you roll poorly? If not, are you missing a bonus to your attack rolls or defences somewhere? On average you should be able to hit at least 50% of the time and, as a defender, be hit yourself less often than that.

Oracle_Hunter
2010-02-14, 07:54 PM
When somebody says they want to hinder the enemy an define the parameters of the encounter, I would assume they want to play a controller class rather than a defender.
Not necessarily. Wardens, for example, are extremely good at defining the parameters of the Encounter - a mass-mark combined with a ranged At Will Interrupt makes 'em soak up a lot of attention.

Anyhow, the Swordmage is certainly not the right choice for this kind of attitude. Most of their "forced moves" are pretty easy to ignore since it is usually the Swordmage rather than their opponent who wants to get away. Plus, remember that you only get one Intermediate Action per round (OAs excepted); when building Defenders I try to limit the number of Immediate Powers I take unless I don't plan on using my class Immediate a lot.

I'll second Yakk's suggestions - save that you said you weren't using Backgrounds.

nightwyrm
2010-02-14, 08:10 PM
I noticed that your DM houseruled 1 OA per round. That cuts down quite a bit on your effectiveness. The basic idea behind a Swordmage is to mark one target then run somewhere else so the target has to either attack someone else (thus triggering your aegis) or run through a gauntlet of OAs from your party members to get to you.

Also, the ensnarement aegis needs a bit of synergy from other party members for full effectiveness, unlike shielding aegis which works well regardless of your party. If other members can't take advantage of the granted CA or your ability to force teleport enemies (into a zone, for example), then your effectiveness will also drop.

Artanis
2010-02-14, 08:12 PM
250 starting gp (low, but apparently there's a lot of loot to compensate)

250gp at level 3 isn't just low, it's virtually nonexistent. The standard starting gear for a level 3 character is worth more than TEN TIMES that amount.

nightwyrm
2010-02-14, 08:17 PM
250gp at level 3 isn't just low, it's virtually nonexistent. The standard starting gear for a level 3 character is worth more than TEN TIMES that amount.

Well, as a DM, I'm not quite comfortable using the L-1,L,L+1, cash=L-1 starting equipment for characters less than lv 4. If I do start a campaign at lv 2 or 3, I will start PCs with normal 100 gp and then give accelerated loot (all the expected stuff from earlier levels) before the PCs level up. If the DM is planning to do this, I don't think it's a problem, but if he isn't....

greenknight
2010-02-14, 08:19 PM
Swordmage is considered to be the weakest of the defenders, and your Intelligence is a bit on the low side as well. Others have suggested ways to make the character more effective, but for what you want to do I think you'd need an entirely new character. I suggest a Dwarven Wildblood Warden, multiclassed to Fighter (eventually going for Pit Fighter PP).

Here's one build which should be fairly effective for what you want:

level 3
Dwarf, Warden
Build: Earth Warden
Guardian Might: Earthstrength

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 16, Con 16, Dex 14, Int 10, Wis 16, Cha 8.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 16, Con 14, Dex 14, Int 10, Wis 14, Cha 8.

AC: 17 Fort: 15 Reflex: 13 Will: 15
HP: 47 Surges: 12 Surge Value: 11

TRAINED SKILLS
Nature +9, Athletics +8, Dungeoneering +11, Perception +9

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +2, Arcana +1, Bluff, Diplomacy, Endurance +5, Heal +4, History +1, Insight +4, Intimidate, Religion +1, Stealth +2, Streetwise, Thievery +2

FEATS
Level 1: Sudden Roots
Level 2: Dwarven Weapon Training

POWERS
Warden at-will 1: Thorn Strike
Warden at-will 1: Weight of Earth
Warden encounter 1: Thunder Ram Assault
Warden daily 1: Form of Winter's Herald
Warden utility 2: Guardian Thorns
Warden encounter 3: Earthgrasp Strike

ITEMS
Halberd, Hide Armor

Your AC isn't that great, but you've got lots of hitpoints and healing surges, and you want to use your Second Wind during the battle anyway. You can mark several enemies per round, and bring them close with Thorn Strike. Thunder Ram Assault is there to give you a break if you need it, or just want to rearrange the battlefield. And once per day, you can go into your Form of Winter's Herald, just to make things worse for your foes.

Oracle_Hunter
2010-02-14, 08:23 PM
Well, as a DM, I'm not quite comfortable using the L-1,L,L+1, cash=L-1 starting equipment for characters less than lv 4. If I do start a campaign at lv 2 or 3, I will start PCs with normal 100 gp and then give accelerated loot (all the expected stuff from earlier levels) before the PCs level up. If the DM is planning to do this, I don't think it's a problem, but if he isn't....
Don't worry about it - having optimized starting equipment in 4E isn't as explosive as it has been in previous editions. I know this both as a player and as a DM.

And I also know (as a player) that being in a high-level game without useful magic items is annoying to the extreme. I once was forced to play as a cleric who, after three levels of adventuring, still did not have a magic holy symbol at Level 10. It got to be so bad that the party revolted and demanded loot from the DM :smallannoyed:

nightwyrm
2010-02-14, 08:28 PM
Don't worry about it - having optimized starting equipment in 4E isn't as explosive as it has been in previous editions. I know this both as a player and as a DM.

And I also know (as a player) that being in a high-level game without useful magic items is annoying to the extreme. I once was forced to play as a cleric who, after three levels of adventuring, still did not have a magic holy symbol at Level 10. It got to be so bad that the party revolted and demanded loot from the DM :smallannoyed:

Yeah, that lv 10 no symbol thing is pretty bad...

But I still don't think equipment is the OP's main problem when dealing with effectiveness. After all, it's just level 3. A standard party of 5 would have only 8 items (more if you buy stuff with your money) so you'd expect somebody (maybe everybody) would still be lacking in one of the big three slots.

I'm still thinking the 1 OA per round houserule is a bigger deal for gimping a defender.

Tequila Sunrise
2010-02-14, 08:29 PM
Yeah you should really have magical bling. You don't need an 18 Int, but it'd help.

Some DMs play all monsters safe, no matter what. Even if the defender has an AC ten points higher than the nearby wizard, the DM will attack the defender so long as the monster's marked. I don't get it myself -- when I DM I like to make the PCs bleed and I don't care if my monsters die trying. In fact, that's the point -- I like combats fast and exciting.

Tengu_temp
2010-02-14, 08:44 PM
But I still don't think equipment is the OP's main problem when dealing with effectiveness. After all, it's just level 3.

The lack of equipment pretty much means he's only losing 1 point of attack, damage and all defenses, which is barely noticable... but it stacks with other non-optimal decisions, and added together they greatly decrease his performance, even if they're not very relevant individually.

Artanis
2010-02-14, 08:57 PM
Yeah, that lv 10 no symbol thing is pretty bad...

But I still don't think equipment is the OP's main problem when dealing with effectiveness. After all, it's just level 3. A standard party of 5 would have only 8 items (more if you buy stuff with your money) so you'd expect somebody (maybe everybody) would still be lacking in one of the big three slots.

I'm still thinking the 1 OA per round houserule is a bigger deal for gimping a defender.

A couple comments about the gear thing:

1) I mostly pointed it out because everything else I could think of had already been covered, not because I necessarily thought it was his main problem :smalltongue:

2) If you add up those eight items with the total gp that each level says it gives at the top of its list, then it comes to 1824gp worth of loot per player when they hit level 3. So they'd have 1924gp if you count in the 100gp they start with. That's nearly eight times what the OP's DM is giving them.



Sure, they'd be lacking some stuff anyways, but it's still going to hurt having one-eighth the gear that they're supposed to. That goes double when they're already getting smacked by things like the OA houserule and the messed-up stats :smallfrown:

BobTheDog
2010-02-14, 09:03 PM
Since you already have a lot of comments regarding your character, I'll raise some topics you might discuss with the DM:

- Marked monsters should ignore the marks sometimes. This is something that the DM must always keep in mind because, as TS said, DMs tend to try and "protect" the monsters, and a lot of the time that is just "how we're used to". So ask him to do that. You can also mark someone who's away and "hide" to make monsters run to you (provoking) or attack someone else (triggering your mark).

- What type of encounters are you facing? If your DM is throwing high-level critters at you, it makes sense you're hitting less and getting hit more. Optimizing your character a bit might help, but if you're constantly fighting lvl+3 soldiers, you're bound to have problems with the math.

- Houserules. As said above, some of those are just arbitrary. Why are AoOs restricted? If the reason is "to make it work like they did in 3.5, there are too many AoOs in 4e", then the houserule should die. No backgrounds is also odd, is the DM afraid a +2 to one skill is going to break his game? Or is it because of the "different" backgrounds (use Int for HP instead of Con/roll twice for this skill etc)? He could just restrict those if he thinks those are not "right" (as I do).

Colmarr
2010-02-14, 10:32 PM
I gather that having a leader around might have made me not spent the majority of the last encounter in a dirt nap, but I only had one surge left to spend at that point anyway, so being able to spend surges wouldn't have really helped me anyway. Regardless of the lack of a leader, though, no one else seemed so ineffective as I did.

Being a defender without a leader is tough. The real advantage of having a leader (other than them being surge-triggers) is that they boost the effectiveness of each surge.

Your surge value is 11. With a devoted cleric (or god-forbid a shielding pacifist cleric) in the party, your surge value could easily hit 20 (surge value + 1d6 + cleric's wisdom value). That makes a significant difference to your longevity.

I would also recommend that you re-jig your Intelligence to a post-racial 18. It's not completely necessary, but an extra +1 to hit, +1 to Reflex, and +1 to AC is pretty valuable for a defender. I'd drop Con to get the spare points. The few hp a 17 in Con gets you will be easily outweighed by the Intelligence bump.

Otherwise, your build seems pretty solid. If it didn't work out, it's probable that (a) you were playing it wrong, (b) your companions were playing their characters wrong, (c) you were really unlucky, or (d) your DM is a douche.

It's hard to comment on any of those options without actually witnessing the game.