Help me decide which class to homebrew

[Lysander]

I have a few ideas for new base classes, but I don't want to make something redundant with existing material. And if something sounds outright overpowered or useless I'd rather avoid spending time on it in the first place. Which of these sounds worth making (if any):

Arcane Channeler
Fluff: These individuals draw magic through their bodies as sorcerers do, but lack the ability to weave it into complex spells. Instead they can only release their power in the form of dangerous elemental energy.
Crunch: They'd gain elemental blasts (fire, cold, lightning) that they could use at will similar to a warlock's eldritch blast. They would also be able to unleash massive energy damage area effects centered on themselves a limited number of times a day that they would be immune to damage from. Despite these supernatural abilities the arcane channeler would still be a martial class, with heavy armor proficiency and decent hit dice.

Champion of Tomorrow
Fluff: Mysterious powers from the future seek to either protect or alter their past. Those that have chosen to trust them are gifted with technologically advanced devices as powerful as any magic item.
Crunch: Yes, a sci-fi inspired class embedded in fantasy DnD times. They'd kind of be like warlocks with a number of at will powers selected from a list. The difference is that instead of having built in abilities they would gain Gizmos, small machines that only they could use. For example instead of having an eldritch blast they would have a ray gun. They could select a force field belt to provide a bonus to AC, a jetpack for flight, hologram projectors (illusions), etc. The cool thing is that Gizmo effects are all (Ex), and not be subject to spell resistance, dispel magic, disjunction, or AMFs.

Schizoid Sorcerer
Fluff: The strain of magic has fractured the minds of these mages into several distinct personalities, each with an independent alignment and list of spells known.
Crunch: A split personality sorcerer variant. The personalities all share the same spell slots, but each knows a completely different list of spells. They start with two personalities and gain a new one every five levels. Only spells from the one personality currently in control can be cast. This expanded number of spells known doesn't come without a price though. The personalities are always jockeying for power and trying to maintain control over the body. To switch personalities the player must make an opposed wisdom check against themselves. Each personality also has its own unique mental flaw, that penalizes it in certain situations and causes it to act in less than rational ways.

[Deathdarken]

Schizoid Sorcerer sounds interesting that would be cool to see

[arguskos]

I'll throw down on the Arcane Channeler. I like the idea of another gish-like base class.

[Fortuna]

Schizoid Sorcerer sounds awesome. Then I'll dig out my split personality race and play a Schizoid Sorcerer Ksisf. Fun!

[Temotei]

Either arcane channeler or schizoid sorcerer. They both sound pretty cool. I think the most interesting to see would be schizoid sorcerer.

[JoshuaZ]

The Schizoid seems the most interesting in that it fits with standard D&D flavor ideas but I know of absolutely nothing like it in D&D (although variants certainly exist in other settings. In the Doom Patrol comic there's a character with multiple personalities and each personality has a different superpower).

The person gaining power from the future is neat but just doesn't fit well in the general setting.

[Zeta Kai]

Schizoid Sorcerer sounds the best by far. The name is unacceptable, though.

[Temotei]

Schizoid Sorcerer sounds the best by far. The name is unacceptable, though.

Agreed. Perhaps "split sorcerer" or something.

[Lysander]

Fractured Arcanist? Shattered Sorcerer? Mad Magus? The Split Mind?

[Satyrus]

I think the idea of an actual melee blaster rather than a semi-squishy caster/fighter is a very interesting idea and it has a lot of story and roleplay potential too.

I've had one player try and do the split personality thing, it was interesting but got confusing keeping track of what character they were at the time. If you can find a way to manage that it sounds like a lot of fun.

[dragonfan6490]

My vote is for Arcane Channeller.

I had a character once whose mind was inhabited by the two deities of magic, a lich, an elf wizard, and himself. One of the deities basically granted free true rezzes to me, at the cost of being her marked servant. The other was Mystra. Imagine the fun I had there. The lich provided me with additional spells known but was constantly trying to corrupt me. The elf wizard basically allowed me to cast spells as a wizard equal to my character level (yes, I mean character level). And I was an Aasimar Sorcerer/Cleric/MT/Druid of Paranor from Dragon magazine.

Every single one of these "beings" had their own minds and souls. Arguments were so common, the other members of the party thought that I was crazy and had voices in my head. Which I did.

[pyrefiend]

Arcane channeler, for sure! Sounds like a cool, fun idea.

[Jota]

Schizoid Sorcerer sounds the best by far. The name is unacceptable, though.

If you're disagreeing with the name because you find the terminology pejorative, I would have to disagree with you.

If you are referring to the fact that the disorder it refers to should not be conflated with schizophrenia (which the class description seems to implicate, even though the two are quite distinct), then I would be inclined to agree.

[DracoDei]

Yeah... probably don't want to do the middle one...
The first could be good if it doesn't end up too much like a martial adept focused on Desert Wind and/or the energy-based homebrews.

[Bobmufin52]

Schizoid Sorcerer gets my vote, sounds like it would be realy fun to play.

[Lappy9000]

Fractured Arcanist? Shattered Sorcerer? Mad Magus? The Split Mind?I like all of those :smallbiggrin:

Put me down for Schizoid Sorcerer, although I personally would vote for a name change 'cause "schizoid" soulds silly, alliteration aside.

[Zeta Kai]

If you're disagreeing with the name because you find the terminology pejorative, I would have to disagree with you.

If you are referring to the fact that the disorder it refers to should not be conflated with schizophrenia (which the class description seems to implicate, even though the two are quite distinct), then I would be inclined to agree.

A little of column A, a little of column B. The name sounds stupid, if not outright offensive to the layman's ear. And schizophrenia has almost nothing to due with multiple personality disorder, other than they both affect the brain. And if we are able to suggest a name, I'd like to get behind Fractured Mind. It's simple, accurate, & has a Badass-Through-Adversity vibe that I like.

[JKTrickster]

I would like to see the third option too! The idea of split personalities and each having their own unique set sounds absolutely amazing! And it'll be interesting to roleplay as more and more personalities split off :smallbiggrin:

But I also agree with Zeta Kai; it's current name isn't really desirable. If you're looking to name it after a mental illness, it should refer to Multiple Personality Disorder, or Dissoactive Identity Disorder. Schizophrenia has absolutely nothing to do with "split personalities".

[Xallace]

I vote for "Schizoid Sorcerer," and also cast "The Mad" or some derivative thereof for the name.

[Melayl]

I vote for Arcane Channeler.

[Apropos]

Arcane Channeler sounds best.

Champion of Tomorrow doesn't seem to really work so well as a base class, but maybe a 5 level PrC or something.

Schizoid Sorcerer could be good, but I'm a bit skeptic on the balance of such a class. Not to mention that it completely depends on your character having an awkward mental disorder, something that normally only prestige classes require.

EDIT: Also, when I first saw it, I thought the word "Schizoid" might have been referring to the psionic power schism. Shows how silly I am.

[Renrik]

Technically, that should be 'Dissociative Identity Disorder Scorcerer', unless he gets paranoid, hallucinates, goes into torpor, and can be moved about into ridiculous positions.

[Zeta Kai]

Technically, that should be 'Dissociative Identity Disorder Scorcerer', unless he gets paranoid, hallucinates, goes into torpor, and can be moved about into ridiculous positions.

You know, that could work in theory, but I just don't see that playing well at the table... :smallamused:

[Temotei]

You know, that could work in theory, but I just don't see that playing well at the table... :smallamused:

Dragon!
Holy!...there's no dragon. Let's go guys.
Come on! We're all going to...aaagggghhhhhhh...
*sigh*

[ArcanistSupreme]

I vote "Schizoid Sorcerer", which could perhaps have a different name based on which personality is in charge, just to be more confusing.

[Lysander]

Ok, before I write up a table here are the main ideas of the Something Sorcerer so I can get your feedback.

Non-magical stuff:

-Bab, proficiencies, saves, HD, spell slots, etc. all as sorcerer.

-2 split personalities at level 1, one additional split personality gained every five levels. Split personalities share the same set of mental stats, skill points, feats.

-Each personality must have a different alignment. No two personalities can have the exact same alignment. For the purposes of spells/abilities that deal with alignment use the alignment of whichever personality is dominant.

-Only 1 personality is dominant at any given moment. The other personalities are still conscious but can take no action other than mentally chatting with another. For hilarity's sake, whichever personality is dominant loses the ability to mentally chat and must reply to the other personalities aloud.

-Every 24 hours one personality randomly assumes (or retains) control. Submerged personalities would be able to try to take control at other times, but this requires an opposed charisma vs. wisdom check with themselves, even if the dominant personality is willing to switch. Each personality can attempt to assume control a number of times daily equal to the character's charisma modifier. Changing personalities is a free action that must be attempted before your turn, but each personality can only attempt to take control once per round. Successfully taking control dazes the sorcerer for the remainder of their turn, leaving them unable to act.

-Personalities do not necessarily have to be antagonists with each other, and may share many goals in common.

-Each personality randomly receives a mental quirk of some sort. No two have the same quirk. Quirks would include things like paranoia, shyness, narcissism, pride, lechery, etc. and would impose a specific penalty on a type of skill check.

As for magic:

-Same number of spell slots per day as the sorcerer. The dominant personality can spend them as they will.

-Each personality has its own separate list of spells known, which has the same spells known as a normal sorcerer of that class level. The dominant personality can only cast spells from their own personal list. No two personalities can know the same spell.

-If the sorcerer ever takes a prestige class that advances the number of spells known, instead of benefiting each personality's list of spells known, they only learn new spells as a normal sorcerer would and those spells are known by all personalities.

-They may summon a familiar as a sorcerer can. However the familiar ALSO has a split personality, with one personality obedient to each of the sorcerer's personalities. The familiar's personality dominant personality randomly changes when the sorcerer's does and does not change otherwise. If a submerged sorcerer personality controls the dominant familiar personality they can use the empathic link to tell it whether to obey the dominant sorcerer personality, ignore them, or cause mischief.

[MoleMage]

I love it. Personality traits should be limited by alignment. Does the player of the character have to think for all personalities? Actually, this would be a fun concept with several people playing a single character.

The familiar's personality swaps in the same way, but doesn't always line up? Do the personality traits of the familiar match their controlling personality? For example, I have Sorcerer with three personalities: a Paladin-like Lawful Good, a Lecherous Chaotic Neutral, and a Neutral Evil, who is afraid of sunlight. Do the personalities of my familiar match up? Lawful Good smiter of evil, etc? Or does the familiar have its own distinct set where each one follows a specific personality?

[Lysander]

A familiar personality has the same alignment as the sorcerer personality its loyal to. And the familiar isn't always loyal to the dominant sorcerer personality. Its a way the submerged personalities have of exerting a little influence. If the submerged personality that controls the familiar agrees with what the dominant personality is doing however, it can instruct the familiar to obey.

[ArcanistSupreme]

My only issue with the personality mechanic as written is that a personality that recognizes that it is unable to deal with a current threat can't willing step aside to let a better-equipped personality take the reins. I would be okay if you made the check between the non-dominant personalities to randomly determine which one stepped up, but I feel like a personality should be able to stand down when it wants to.

[Bobmufin52]

Do the mental quirks of each personality have any effects on the charater's skill/stats/ect., or are they just roleplaying tools?

[Lysander]

My only issue with the personality mechanic as written is that a personality that recognizes that it is unable to deal with a current threat can't willing step aside to let a better-equipped personality take the reins. I would be okay if you made the check between the non-dominant personalities to randomly determine which one stepped up, but I feel like a personality should be able to stand down when it wants to.

The thing I'm worried about is making it too easy for players to switch as needed. Then there's no downside to this class, it's just sorcerer powers with extra spells known. And while ideally the personalities should have some disagreements, they would work together on some issues. Also, a minmaxing player might ignore roleplaying disadvantages and use this just as a better sorcerer.

So switching personalties requires extreme mental effort, even if it isn't opposed. Perhaps if the dominant personality is willing though the check to switch should receive a +2 bonus?

In addition to making switching an unsure thing I'm trying to think of ways to mechanically force there to be some problems resulting from the personality quirks, besides roleplaying issues.

[sigurd]

I think this would be a pretty clear experience penalty. You are only you half the time.

My guess is it would be easier to use if it was a simple gestalt character or possession.


Sigurd

[MoleMage]

I think this would be a pretty clear experience penalty. You are only you half the time.

An experience penalty for playing a base class? Wouldn't fly.

And as for it being too easy for personalities to switch, allow the dominant personality to take 5 on the check to resist being replaced, but doing so causes all his rolls to try and take, not maintain, control (even if the now current dominant personality is taking 5) to suffer a penalty for the rest of the day? That way they can still pretty easily move out of the way, but every time they do, that spell list becomes more difficult to access until they rest and replenish spell slots.

[Jota]

Why not just making switching personalities something that takes time, like a swordsage refreshing his maneuvers or something akin that? If you want to be player-friendly, you just take a full-round action (or whatever) to switch to whatever personality you want.

If you want to make it more complicated, each personality could have an ego. When a personality willingly relinquishes control of the body, each other personality rolls a number of d6 equal to its ego (with egos ideally being only separated by one or two points and being somewhere around 5, so the number of dice rolled isn't too ridiculous and yet each personality has a chance to win), and the winner assumes control. The outgoing personality could choose which one it thinks is best equipped to handle the situation and grant that one a +X (say 5, if that's the average number of dice rolled) bonus on its ego check, perhaps. In this case, given the chance to screw the player over, I would suggest a move action for this whole process, so the player could still cast, or run away, or do something.

For simplicity's sake, each personality could also just have an ego of one (all being equal), with the bonus being +1 or +2, depending on how kind the DM is.