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Lysander
2010-02-23, 01:58 PM
Magician's Apprentice

Prerequisite: Training with an arcane or divine spellcaster for six months. This training only requires ten minutes a day. Skipping a day is allowed but extends the length of the training period by one day.

Benefit: You gain either two level 0 spell slots or one level 1 spell slot, and you learn either two cantrips/orisons or one level 1 spell your trainer knows how to cast. Other than class, you must meet any and all prerequisites and provide any components the spell requires when cast by your trainer, including minimum stats and alignment restrictions. You must spend 15 minutes earlier in the day preparing the spell or spells even if your trainer is a spontaneous caster. Preparing these slots does not require a spellbook. If you have any other class that grants spells treat these slots and spells known as entirely separate, and they cannot work with metamagic feats. Your effective caster level for these spell slots is 1.

Special: If your trainer assists you in preparing a spell slot granted by this feat you may instead opt to prepare any other spell of that level the caster knows, but otherwise can only cast the spells you were trained in.

This feat may be taken multiple times, each time granting new spell slots and new spells known.

arguskos
2010-02-23, 02:00 PM
What is the key casting stat for this feat? Do these slots grant bonus spells based on a high casting stat? Can you personally learn and prepare other spells with these slots?

Also, I like it. It's a fun and flavorful feat, and I approve.

Lysander
2010-02-23, 02:04 PM
The casting stat is the same as whatever your trainer uses. You don't gain any bonus spells.

On your own you're limited to casting just the one spell or two cantrips/orisons you learned with this feat, but with your trainer's assistance can cast any spell of the appropriate level that they know how to cast.

DracoDei
2010-02-23, 02:14 PM
I would put a character level 3 minimum on this or something, otherwise, at first level, it gives about a 50% increase in power to any caster who takes it.

Lysander
2010-02-23, 02:33 PM
I don't know if it's that overpowered for casters though. Isn't there a feat that grants you a level 2 spell at level 1? Plus it becomes a penalty later on, when instead of having a nice metamagic feat you just have yet another level 1 spell.

Ashtagon
2010-02-23, 02:33 PM
For the price of a feat, you get one 1st level spell per day*? This doesn't strike me as a good bargain at all.

(* or two cantrips, which is even worse)

arguskos
2010-02-23, 02:34 PM
I don't know if it's that overpowered for casters though. Isn't there a feat that grants you a level 2 spell at level 1? Plus it becomes a penalty later on, when instead of having a nice metamagic feat you just have yet another level 1 spell.
Yeah, Precocious Apprentice. You have to make a Spellcraft check to cast it though.

Also, Ashtagon, I have this feeling this feat is intended for NPCs and low-level PCs. No one will take it past level 4 or so.

agumathebear
2010-02-23, 03:02 PM
i did something like this, except it wasnt a feat, its just if they have leadership they can do it. i also use a reputation system, every +1 grants them fame in a new nation, so i require you be famous in that nation as well, but it's not just for magicians, for instance we have a druid and an assassin too, and if the assassin wanted he could bring in an apprentice from his guild and the druid can take on a druid too, and to determine their level i just take the character's level and roll the closest die and add. for instance: bael has an ecl of 16, hes a rogue assassin, if he wanted a cohort he just goes looking in the guild. he finds 3 - since the closest die to his level is d20 i roll a d20 and subtract 4 and that's the level. i roll a 6, another 6, and a 10, making them a level 2, level 2, and a level 6. i also have an 18 page random character generator, that generates personality and everything, so i roll that for each one, and he may decide among them, because although the level 6 may be more advanced, he may be an ******* and arrogant and perhaps launches himself headlong into combat, etc.

idk, that's just me. but i do like your idea

Lysander
2010-02-23, 03:15 PM
For the price of a feat, you get one 1st level spell per day*? This doesn't strike me as a good bargain at all.

(* or two cantrips, which is even worse)

I think it's probably not worth it by itself, but becomes useful if your trainer assists you so you have the flexibility of their spell list. And a fighter being able to cast say Grease or True Strike 1/day isn't that bad.

It's also good for very specific situational types of characters. For example, an explorer who wanders in the desert. In their case being able to cast Create Water 2/day could mean the difference between life and death.

Cieyrin
2010-02-23, 03:40 PM
Hey, looky there, 1st level kobolds with 2 Power Word Pains a day.:smallbiggrin:

arguskos
2010-02-23, 03:44 PM
Hey, looky there, 1st level kobolds with 2 Power Word Pains a day.:smallbiggrin:
Power Word Pain is a level 1 spell dude. Means you can only get it once a day. :smalltongue: But yes, that's all sorts of "wtfguys".

Milskidasith
2010-02-23, 03:47 PM
Power Word Pain is a level 1 spell dude. Means you can only get it once a day. :smalltongue: But yes, that's all sorts of "wtfguys".

Draconic rite of passage. They already get one per day from that.

This would definitely help out for level 1 arena competitions, but as for actual play, it's worthless past... level 3 or so.

arguskos
2010-02-23, 04:09 PM
Draconic rite of passage. They already get one per day from that.

This would definitely help out for level 1 arena competitions, but as for actual play, it's worthless past... level 3 or so.
...bad-dum-tish. I feel silly now. :smallredface:

Evard
2010-02-23, 06:11 PM
Make it a series of feats that allows the player to gain more spells as they keep studying ... Each time they take the feat they gain 1 more spell from the Trainer's spell list going up a level each time....

Lvl 1: as you made it
Lvl 3: get 1 lvl 2 spell
lvl 6: get 1 lvl 3 spell

Maybe for every feat liek this you have you gain +1 spells for a spell level you already know therefore if you take this feat at level 3 you would have 1 lvl 2 and 2 lvl 1 spells

Yes for most people this wont be much but allow a fighter to choose this as a fighter feat.. then things could get fun :D

sigurd
2010-02-23, 06:49 PM
Its supposed to be a feat not a character class.

Its pretty good. Not overpowered in the long run and at first level it will sort of rock your world. If your character is likely to only get a couple of levels its powerful if you're going to become an arch mage its meh but still nice.


I like it.


Sigurd

Lysander
2010-02-24, 09:15 AM
For a straight caster the best bet would be to pick up a spell from another class' spell list. For example a cleric could learn Identify without needing to have Magic as a domain. And an archmage could pick up Detect Evil. Basically, specialized utility spells. Non-casters would be best served with more basic spells that aid survival or in combat.

deuxhero
2010-02-24, 07:06 PM
You could use it to qualify for a PRC, but I can't think of anything that requires first level spells and doesn't make advancement of the entry a big part.

sigurd
2010-02-24, 11:46 PM
For a straight caster the best bet would be to pick up a spell from another class' spell list. For example a cleric could learn Identify without needing to have Magic as a domain. And an archmage could pick up Detect Evil. Basically, specialized utility spells. Non-casters would be best served with more basic spells that aid survival or in combat.

Good point.


In Pathfinder I'd probably take the cantrips if you could cast them at will like the other cantrips. I might even take the feat at higher levels.

Lappy9000
2010-02-24, 11:54 PM
Considering the other options in feats (as far as I know, of course) for low level casters, I'd totally take this as a level 1 feat, especially if it's a human caster we're talking about. The prerequisite makes it a bit difficult to follow through afterwards, but if I could get the chance again at level 3, I'd probably take it again.

It's also nice that you don't need a spellbook for them.

TheLaughingLich
2010-02-25, 12:47 AM
As written, it looks as though you can use this to grab spells from weird lists, like Trapsmith (which has some level 3 sor/wiz spells as level 1). Given the CL, it might not be a problem, but it's something to think about.

Cieyrin
2010-02-25, 04:38 PM
Draconic rite of passage. They already get one per day from that.

This would definitely help out for level 1 arena competitions, but as for actual play, it's worthless past... level 3 or so.

This is exactly what I meant. Sorry for the confusion. :smallredface: