[3.5] Several weird questions.

[Goonthegoof]

Question one: If a character has the Ti-Khana template, which gives shape change as an at will power but can only transform into certain snakes, does that qualify it for the Warshaper prestige class?

Question two: If you take say a magical beast as your race with 9HD (so in a game where the characters start at at least ECL 9) do you get the beast's feats or do you just get to spend the 4 feats that 9HD would provide?

Question three: If you bull rush someone with the knockback feat, you don't move with them. The Dungeon Crasher fighter class variant's ability to damage enemies when you knock them against a wall or similar object mentions in the fluff that your momentum crushes him against it, which implies that you need to be moving with him. Can the two be combined?

[Runestar]

Question one: If a character has the Ti-Khana template, which gives shape change as an at will power but can only transform into certain snakes, does that qualify it for the Warshaper prestige class?

Not familiar with this ti-khana template, but I would say that change shape is change shape, regardless of whatever restrictions are placed on it, so it should still qualify you for warshaper.


Question two: If you take say a magical beast as your race with 9HD (so in a game where the characters start at at least ECL 9) do you get the beast's feats or do you just get to spend the 4 feats that 9HD would provide?

You would not get those 4 feats as bonus feats. You need to take them using your normal allotment of feats (or you could use them to acquire other feats). In any case, the 2nd option - you just get to spend the 4 feats that 9HD would provide.


Question three: If you bull rush someone with the knockback feat, you don't move with them. The Dungeon Crasher fighter class variant's ability to damage enemies when you knock them against a wall or similar object mentions in the fluff that your momentum crushes him against it, which implies that you need to be moving with him. Can the two be combined?

Yes, ignore the fluff, and evaluate how the 2 feats work together solely on mechanics.

[sonofzeal]

Question one: If a character has the Ti-Khana template, which gives shape change as an at will power but can only transform into certain snakes, does that qualify it for the Warshaper prestige class?
Yes, you qualify.


Question two: If you take say a magical beast as your race with 9HD (so in a game where the characters start at at least ECL 9) do you get the beast's feats or do you just get to spend the 4 feats that 9HD would provide?
Depends. Certain creatures have bonus feats (marked with (B) next to it, such as the hawk's Weapon Finesse (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/hawk.htm)), in addition to the ones from levelling. Anything not marked that way follows normal rules though, and you can pick different ones if you want.


Question three: If you bull rush someone with the knockback feat, you don't move with them. The Dungeon Crasher fighter class variant's ability to damage enemies when you knock them against a wall or similar object mentions in the fluff that your momentum crushes him against it, which implies that you need to be moving with him. Can the two be combined?
Mechanically, yes. Your DM may rule differently, but I suggest you have an alternate fluff of your own instead, some other explanation of what you're doing that better reflects the combination of rules involved.

[Pluto]

Question three: If you bull rush someone with the knockback feat, you don't move with them. The Dungeon Crasher fighter class variant's ability to damage enemies when you knock them against a wall or similar object mentions in the fluff that your momentum crushes him against it, which implies that you need to be moving with him. Can the two be combined?
Ask the DM.

The importance of fluff varies enormously from person to person.

[Goonthegoof]

Thank you heaps for all the useful and rapid responses, they were very helpful :smallbiggrin:

Another thing I just thought of then: If a creature who only has natural weapons is under the effects of haste, does the creature get to attack twice a turn with one of the weapons?

[sonofzeal]

Thank you heaps for all the useful and rapid responses, they were very helpful :smallbiggrin:

Another thing I just thought of then: If a creature who only has natural weapons is under the effects of haste, does the creature get to attack twice a turn with one of the weapons?
Technically, no. "May make one extra attack with any weapon he is holding" pretty much sinks a hole in that.

Of note is that you also can't make iteratives with natural weapons. Even if you have claw-claw-bite, I highly recommend carrying one weapon and using the rest as secondaries (so sword-iteratives-claw-bite). That way you can keep and even expand your number of attacks, and don't really lose much except Rend.

[Goonthegoof]

Thanks again. How do weapons, weapon iteratives and natural attacks interact in a full attack action?

Say a creature has one bite (primary) two claws (secondary) a greatsword in the hands that don't have claws, BAB +6/+1 and the haste effect.

How would a full attack action look?

[sonofzeal]

Thanks again. How do weapons, weapon iteratives and natural attacks interact in a full attack action?

Say a creature has one bite (primary) two claws (secondary) a greatsword in the hands that don't have claws, BAB +6/+1 and the haste effect.

How would a full attack action look?
Assuming four arms then?


Greatsword +6 / Greatsword +6 / Greatsword +1 / Claw +1 / Claw +1 / Bite +1

Weapon's always your primary. You could take Multiattack to raise things to...

Greatsword +6 / Greatsword +6 / Claw +4 / Claw +4 / Bite +4 / Greatsword +1

[Goonthegoof]

Thanks :smallsmile:. So basically if I have improved multiattack, the only thing I lose by grafting a couple of arms onto myself and attaching a weapon is the extra half of my strength mod on my primary natural weapon?

[Thrawn183]

The best way to think of it is this: if you use a weapon, you can also attack with all of your natural weapons, but they are secondary attacks, taking a -5 penalty (unless you have multiattack or other feats, of course).

[sonofzeal]

Thanks :smallsmile:. So basically if I have improved multiattack, the only thing I lose by grafting a couple of arms onto myself and attaching a weapon is the extra half of my strength mod on my primary natural weapon?
Er, I think your "hypothetical" is getting a little complicated at this point, and I can't say for sure without seeing the build in question. And even then, rules for 1.5 str / str / 0.5 str on natural weapons are not very clear. For further information, consult your pineal gland DM

[Goonthegoof]

Ok, thanks a bunch for that. I can see why people love Bite of the Wolf so much now.

[Runestar]

And even then, rules for 1.5 str / str / 0.5 str on natural weapons are not very clear.

You get 1.5 str mod to damage on a natural attack only if it is your sole natural weapon (otherwise stated, as in the case of a dragon's tail). You get 1.0 if it is your primary natural weapon (which implies you have more than 1), and 0.5 if it is your secondary.


Thanks . So basically if I have improved multiattack, the only thing I lose by grafting a couple of arms onto myself and attaching a weapon is the extra half of my strength mod on my primary natural weapon?

Again, it depends. If you only have 1 primary attack and many secondary attacks, then it will probably be more worth it to wield a weapon for the extra attacks.

However, if you have several primary attacks, the loss of 1/2 str mod to damage for each of them may outstrip the gain in damage from wielding a weapon. Also remember that if you wield a 2-handed weapon, you will not be able to use the claw attacks associated with those hands (if any), so that is another source of wasted damage.

There are also other considerations, such as whether you can afford an amulet of mighty fists and a magical weapon together.

It sounds complicated, but it really boils down to weighing the pros and cons of each path, and choosing whichever you feel suits you best. :smallsmile:


Ok, thanks a bunch for that. I can see why people love Bite of the Wolf so much now.

They love it because it is essentially an extra source of damage with no drawback (beyond acquiring said power). Anytime you can make a full attack, it is simply an extra attack. Even if the damage is not that stellar, who can say no to extra damage? :smallsmile:

Other useful natural weapons also include gore, tentacles, tail and feet-based claw attacks, as they never interfere with your weapon attacks. Do note however, that they tend to have issues overcoming dr, and too many attacks may also bog down the game (especially if you finding yourself missing a fair amount of the time).

[Goonthegoof]

Cheers, thanks for all that. I'm a huge fan of grafts' ability to give me a bunch of new limbs for attacking, so I was trying to make sure I didn't get anything wrong.