Defacing the dollar

[TSGames]

I happened across this (http://moneymumbojumbo.co.uk/fun-articles/30-bizarre-examples-of-defacing-money), and thought I would share.

I'm especially fond of the Kiss and the Ninja dollar.

[Pyrian]

Some of those are great. The last one is just SOO wrong... :smalltongue:

[RandomNPC]

tulip looks real, thats great.

[Jacklu]

This is the only dollar defacing trick I know. (http://www.darcomic.org/comics/2009-10-22magictrick.jpg)

[TheCountAlucard]

I lol'd at the Sparta one; #30 was a bit of a guilty pleasure, but I laughed for a good minute on that one.

[Serpentine]

I can't find a clip or even a photo of the money vandalism from Two Hands. This gives me a sad :smallfrown: I recommend the movie, anyways.

[Starfols]

Wow....I miss having money :smallsigh:

[Sneak]

I enjoyed the assassination one.

I felt bad about it, though.

[rayne_dragon]

I'm extremely impressed. In fact, I wouldn't call it defacing the money as much as enhancing it.

[Temotei]

I really like the museum one and the Mario one. I'd laugh to see someone's reaction to getting paid with that.

[Rutskarn]

Not to buzzkill, but I'm like 70% sure this is illegal.

[Temotei]

Not to buzzkill, but I'm like 70% sure this is illegal.

But so worth it if you plan on keeping the money.

[Vaynor]

But so worth it if you plan on keeping the money.

Regardless, illegal topics are not permissible on these forums.

[Don Julio Anejo]

Oh man, that was awesome! :smallsmile:

[RS14]

Not to buzzkill, but I'm like 70% sure this is illegal.


Question: Is it illegal to damage or deface coins?

Answer: Section 331 of Title 18 of the United States code provides criminal penalties for anyone who “fraudulently alters, defaces, mutilates impairs, diminishes, falsifies, scales, or lightens any of the coins coined at the Mints of the United States.” This statute means that you may be violating the law if you change the appearance of the coin and fraudulently represent it to be other than the altered coin that it is. As a matter of policy, the U.S. Mint does not promote coloring, plating or altering U.S. coinage: however, there are no sanctions against such activity absent fraudulent intent.
http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/coins/portraits.shtml

I can't immediately find a Govt. opinion on notes, but the law seems to suggest that there needs to exist an intent to prevent the reissue of the note.

[Don Julio Anejo]

http://www.ustreas.gov/education/faq/coins/portraits.shtml

I can't immediately find a Govt. opinion on notes, but the law seems to suggest that there needs to exist an intent to prevent the reissue of the note.
To add on to that, I believe the original intent of the law was to prevent shaving of coins when they were still made from precious metals, such as silver.

[skywalker]

Regardless, illegal topics are not permissible on these forums.

I'm going to go make a thread about honking my horn downtown and scaring all the horses. This is the equivalent.

My top five are:
1. Sparta
2. Ninja
3. Half-Life
4. KISS
5. Assassination (It's wrong, but it's so funny too.)

I had seen the Sparta one before.

[Icewalker]

These are fantastic. I do quite love the Half-Life one. And the Tron ones are pretty awesome. Really just great all around.

[Athaniar]

I wish Ninja Dollar was a global currency.

[Tirian]

Not to buzzkill, but I'm like 70% sure this is illegal.

To add on to RS14's comment, note that there are machines at major American tourist attractions (including Washington itself, IIRC) that will remold a penny into a medallion representing whatever site you're at. So I'm pretty sure that the intent is that you're not allowed to deface money and expect anyone to accept it as legal tender.

ETA: But, of course, that's just the American currency; I couldn't speak to the legality of defacing Canadian or British bills.

[potatocubed]

Yeah, when you deface (US) money it ceases to be legal tender, but unless you're using your mad art skillz to commit fraud you're not committing a crime.

Of course, just because it isn't legal tender doesn't mean you can't buy anything with it - a shopkeeper can sell you their goods for a handful of beans if they want - it just means that you have no right to expect them to do so.

In other news, the moth one is amazing.

[BisectedBrioche]

I lol'd at the Wicked Witch one. Although I'm surprised someone decided it was worth £20 to do (that's about $30, or 30x the amount most of the other notes are worth).

[Eldan]

Is that even a painting, or did someone glue a dried moth to their dollar?

Edit: According to the source, it is. Neat.

[KuReshtin]

Don't talk to me about legal tender...
Scotland's a mess when it comes to legal tender.


Scottish bank notes are not legal tender in Scotland. English bank notes of denomination less than 5UKP were legal tender in Scotland under Currency and Bank Notes Act 1954. Now, with the removal of BoE 1UKP notes, only coins constitute legal tender in Scotland. English bank notes are only legal tender in England, Wales, The Channel Islands and the Isle of Man. In Scotland, 1 pound coins are legal tender to any amount, 20ps and 50ps are legal tender up to 10 pounds; 10p and 5ps to 5 pounds and 2p and 1p coins are legal tender to 20p (separately or in combination). 2 pounds coins and (if you can get hold of one) 5 pound coins are also legal tender to unlimited amounts, as are gold coins of the realm at face value (in Scotland at least).

This was brought to everyone's attention when a local council had found this information and decided to refuse some lady's payment of her council tax when she tried to pay it in bank notes. The council decided that since the notes weren't legal tender, they'd not accept it, so her council tax of about £1000 needed to be paid with legal tender.

Only legal tender in Scotland? Coins.

Good luck trying to get that sorted when someone comes along with a sack of gold coins to pay a bill of £1000+ and the cashier needs to sit there and count it to make sure that it's the right amount.

[Temotei]

Regardless, illegal topics are not permissible on these forums.

Pretty sure the defacing of notes doesn't matter, though, as long as that note isn't reprinted. Not positive on that though. Still have to take Economics.

If it is indeed banned on the forum, Roland will come and six-gun this down. In the meantime, I'm going to comment on the awesomeness of these bills. :smallbiggrin:

[Brother Oni]

Good luck trying to get that sorted when someone comes along with a sack of gold coins to pay a bill of £1000+ and the cashier needs to sit there and count it to make sure that it's the right amount.

Banks have scales that will do that for them. :smallbiggrin:

What they probably have is a target weight and a figure for acceptable range to account for wear and tear on the coins.

That said, counting out that many coins isn't as difficult as you think, as you just make one stack of 10, then make multiple stacks by just matching the height of your first stack. When you run out of space, stick two stacks into those small plastic coin bags banks used (which is pre-labelled with the cash amount) and carry on.

[Kobold-Bard]

Don't talk to me about legal tender...
Scotland's a mess when it comes to legal tender.



This was brought to everyone's attention when a local council had found this information and decided to refuse some lady's payment of her council tax when she tried to pay it in bank notes. The council decided that since the notes weren't legal tender, they'd not accept it, so her council tax of about £1000 needed to be paid with legal tender.

Only legal tender in Scotland? Coins.

Good luck trying to get that sorted when someone comes along with a sack of gold coins to pay a bill of £1000+ and the cashier needs to sit there and count it to make sure that it's the right amount.

What? Why are Scottish notes not legal tender in Scotland. This is bizarre beyond my ability to comprehend obscure logic (which is usually pretty good).

Boba Fett and Ninja Dollar were great. The moth one was just plain impressive.

[KuReshtin]

Banks have scales that will do that for them. :smallbiggrin:

This is true. I doubt a local council does, though.
And the story I was referring to was about a council refusing to accept payment for council tax in notes.



What they probably have is a target weight and a figure for acceptable range to account for wear and tear on the coins.

That said, counting out that many coins isn't as difficult as you think, as you just make one stack of 10, then make multiple stacks by just matching the height of your first stack. When you run out of space, stick two stacks into those small plastic coin bags banks used (which is pre-labelled with the cash amount) and carry on.

Of course. But if the council decides to be difficult about it, why make life easy for them? I'd just show up with a bagful of coins and dump it on their desk and say: "There you go. Count it to make sure I've paid in full."

If they got four or five of those each day, I'm pretty sure that they'd reconsider their idiotic idea of not accepting notes.

I would also think that the local branch of the bank would be a bit miffed if they got repeated requests to exchange £1000+ worth of notes into £1 coins in order for people to be able to pay their council tax.

[Emperor Ing]

I can't immediately find a Govt. opinion on notes, but the law seems to suggest that there needs to exist an intent to prevent the reissue of the note.

Even though the quote from the treasury dept says that as long as the notes aren't presented as different than what they really are it's legal, discussion of legality on this forum, i'm 95% sure is not allowed, i'd expect a thread close soon.

[Riffington]

What? Why are Scottish notes not legal tender in Scotland. This is bizarre beyond my ability to comprehend obscure logic (which is usually pretty good).

So, if a nation prints currency, it typically makes that currency legal tender. That has an advantage and a disadvantage:
*if that government then wants to print a lot more of it, devaluing the currency and soft-defaulting on its debts, it can't turn around and say "yeah, but if you owe us money we want payment-in-full" (ie gold or USD or whatever). So it limits the government's options: if it devalues its currency, it is devaluing debts owed to it.
*but people have more confidence in the currency.

Scotland doesn't print paper money. Various Scottish banks print paper money. If Scotland recognizes those as legal tender, and then one of those banks fails/illegally prints too many/etc, there's some theoretical problem because the government is not fully responsible for what the banks do even though it regulates them heavily. You're safe taking a Scottish banknote, but it's guaranteed by the bank (which is regulated) not by the government of Scotland itself.


The Randomizer: You are confused. Go reread.

[The Glyphstone]

#26: Really? Really?

#30 was good though.

[Kobold-Bard]

So, if a nation prints currency, it typically makes that currency legal tender. That has an advantage and a disadvantage:
*if that government then wants to print a lot more of it, devaluing the currency and soft-defaulting on its debts, it can't turn around and say "yeah, but if you owe us money we want payment-in-full" (ie gold or USD or whatever). So it limits the government's options: if it devalues its currency, it is devaluing debts owed to it.
*but people have more confidence in the currency.

Scotland doesn't print paper money. Various Scottish banks print paper money. If Scotland recognizes those as legal tender, and then one of those banks fails/illegally prints too many/etc, there's some theoretical problem because the government is not fully responsible for what the banks do even though it regulates them heavily. You're safe taking a Scottish banknote, but it's guaranteed by the bank (which is regulated) not by the government of Scotland itself.


The Randomizer: You are confused. Go reread.

But English places accept Scottish notes as legal tender. I know nothing about economics, but how can that be if they aren't backed up by the Scottish treasury (or whatever it is)? That means they're worthless doesn't it?

[CrimsonAngel]

BOOM1! Headshot!11!

[Riffington]

But English places accept Scottish notes as legal tender.

No. They accept them as currency, but not as legal tender.


I know nothing about economics, but how can that be if they aren't backed up by the Scottish treasury (or whatever it is)? That means they're worthless doesn't it?

So, they are backed up by the banks, and really (via various regulations) probably by the Scottish government. They are money, but they aren't legal tender.

Let me explain the distinction: suppose I owe you $200 and we live in the US. I decide to pay by credit card. Now, you have every right to say "cool, I'm being paid", or to refuse the credit card and say "don't flash your plastic at me, I want dollars". Same goes if I try to pay by check, gold, or Euros. But if I give you $200 in quarters, you have to call the debt settled.

If we lived in Scotland, and I tried to give you the bank notes, you'd surely say "cool", but you have the right to say "no, I demand coins".

[Eldpollard]

This is true. I doubt a local council does, though.
And the story I was referring to was about a council refusing to accept payment for council tax in notes.



Of course. But if the council decides to be difficult about it, why make life easy for them? I'd just show up with a bagful of coins and dump it on their desk and say: "There you go. Count it to make sure I've paid in full."

If they got four or five of those each day, I'm pretty sure that they'd reconsider their idiotic idea of not accepting notes.

I would also think that the local branch of the bank would be a bit miffed if they got repeated requests to exchange £1000+ worth of notes into £1 coins in order for people to be able to pay their council tax.

Basically the reason the council did that is because of the costs involved with handling actual cash. You've got to have cashiers, security, a counting centre, and this is without taking into account any fees charged by the bank the council pays the money into. It's not a matter of doing it because it's legal tender or not, it's simply cost cutting.

And as for local councils, my local council does have scales that will weigh both notes and coins. Oh and places are only obliged to accept so much cash at a time in coins loose, it has to be properly bagged.

And please don't come in with a bag of loose change. I have to work in those offices from time to time, and let me tell you, they are mind-crushingly monotonous places to work. Ever since the local council (my employer) thought that fusing libraries with cash offices would be a good idea.
And easier way, if they refuse to take payment in Scottish notes get English ones.

With regards to the OP they are rather pretty.

[Zanaril]

But English places accept Scottish notes as legal tender.
No they don't. :smallannoyed:

They can be used, but shops don't have to accept them and generally won't accept them. It makes getting rid of scottish notes fiendishly tricky.

[Kobold-Bard]

No they don't. :smallannoyed:

They can be used, but shops don't have to accept them and generally won't accept them. It makes getting rid of scottish notes fiendishly tricky.

I never said they have to accept them, but I've never had a problem with them. Everywhere seems to take them for me. Thought I worked in a shop and a customer wouldn't take one as part of her change because she didn't believe in the Scottish.

[Zanaril]

she didn't believe in the Scottish.
...wuh? :smallconfused:

[Kobold-Bard]

...wuh? :smallconfused:

Exactly. Unfortunately she was old and a customer so I couldn't slap her for being crazy :smalltongue:

[Totally Guy]

she didn't believe in the Scottish.

Probably didn't have confidence (belief) that her Scottish note/coinage would be accepted when she'd want to use it in the future. Sounds like a fair opinion too with all the legal tender talk.

[Kallisti]

Ia customer wouldn't take one as part of her change because she didn't believe in the Scottish.

...okaaaaaayyy....ummmm...wow. That's an interesting one. So did she think Scotland was the government's lie to hide Area 51 from the public because they don't want it go get out that Roland is mind-controlling ET to scan our minds and make sure nobody is planning to violate the forum rules? Or did you not ask?


Probably didn't have confidence (belief) that her Scottish note/coinage would be accepted when she'd want to use it in the future. Sounds like a fair opinion too with all the legal tender talk.

No, no, no. Unless I totally misread this, Kobold's saying that she literally does not believe the Scottish exist.

[Kobold-Bard]

Probably didn't have confidence (belief) that her Scottish note/coinage would be accepted when she'd want to use it in the future. Sounds like a fair opinion too with all the legal tender talk.

Nope, she genuinely meant that she didn't believe in the Scottish nation/people, specifically not just their currency.

[Flickerdart]

But wait, there's more (http://www.flickr.com/photos/joefxd/sets/72157604423778692/)!

[TheThan]

As inconvenient and stupid as it sounds, I find the idea of paying in coins intriguing, but then again dealing with large costs gets quite inconvenient and a bit heavy.



She didn't believe in the Scottish.

But I believe in fairywinkles Scotts!

Also, whenever someone says that they don't believe in the Scottish, we have to clap a lot to keep one from dieing.

[Thursday]

Pretty sure Defacing Pictures of the Queen is illegal.. though I doubt anyone in authority over here would actually enforce that.

On a side note, If we all stop Believing in the Scots, will they all cease to exist?
I only mention this as a certain Scot of my aquaintance refuses to return a book of mine that I know he has.

Never had any trouble with Scottish notes either, I get them all the time and they are readily accepted even as far down as Brighton.

[Roland St. Jude]

Nope, she genuinely meant that she didn't believe in the Scottish nation/people, specifically not just their currency.

Just a conspiracy of cartographers, then?

[Fawkes]

Just a conspiracy of cartographers, then?

Heads or tails, Roland?

[Kallisti]

Just a conspiracy of cartographers, then?

What I want to know is what they're hiding...

[Flickerdart]

Scotland is actually sitting right over top of Atlantis, dontchaknow.

[Jacklu]

Also, all that secret Templar treasure hidden in Washington D.C.

[Roland St. Jude]

Heads or tails, Roland?

Must be indicative of something other than the redistribution of wealth. :smallwink:

Got it in one! That Fawkes is a man of refinement and good taste.

[Maximum Zersk]

Mmmm, taste. :smalltongue:

This is awesome.

[DrakebloodIV]

Is the fact that Roland is posting here a good indicator or a bad indicator with regards to the longevity of this thread? Maybe a neutral indicator? How 'bout a chaotic indicator?

[Maximum Zersk]

I'd say a mosh pit vindicator.

[KuReshtin]

Basically the reason the council did that is because of the costs involved with handling actual cash. You've got to have cashiers, security, a counting centre, and this is without taking into account any fees charged by the bank the council pays the money into. It's not a matter of doing it because it's legal tender or not, it's simply cost cutting.

And as for local councils, my local council does have scales that will weigh both notes and coins. Oh and places are only obliged to accept so much cash at a time in coins loose, it has to be properly bagged.

And please don't come in with a bag of loose change. I have to work in those offices from time to time, and let me tell you, they are mind-crushingly monotonous places to work. Ever since the local council (my employer) thought that fusing libraries with cash offices would be a good idea.
And easier way, if they refuse to take payment in Scottish notes get English ones.


If the council insisted that I couldn't use notes, I would turn up with a bag full of coins. According to the law, they would be forced to accept payment in coins as that is legal tender. And nowhere does it state that the coins need to be properly bagged. that's just something put in place by banks and shops that don't want to count the money themselves. If I turned up with 1154 £1 coins to pay a bill of £1153.54, they can't refuse that as payment.



They can be used, but shops don't have to accept them and generally won't accept them. It makes getting rid of scottish notes fiendishly tricky.

Actually, yes, they do. New legislation was put in place so that Scottish bank notes has to be accepted by shop keepers in the rest of the UK. I believe it was put in place sometime last year.


And I just realised that I now have started going into legalities and stuff, so I'll stop now so as not to anger Roland any further.

[rakkoon]

Exactly. Unfortunately she was old and a customer so I couldn't slap her for being crazy :smalltongue:

So you can slap middle-aged customers for being crazy...interesting

I guess it's like those Euro coins. You can use them in Londen (England) and Varadero(Cuba) in some shops but usually not in the rest of the land.

[Kobold-Bard]

So you can slap middle-aged customers for being crazy...interesting

I wish. Card shops in the weeks leading up to Christmas are hellish. All 7 cashiers on and people still complain we should do more to shorten the queue. If I could hit people I definitely would have done.


I guess it's like those Euro coins. You can use them in Londen (England) and Varadero(Cuba) in some shops but usually not in the rest of the land.

Maybe, but I still find it bizarre that places in Scotland won't accept Scottish notes.

[KuReshtin]

I still find it bizarre that places in Scotland won't accept Scottish notes.

Well, it was one publiziced case that went to court, where the Sheriff basically told the council to shut the hell up and stop being silly.

[Kobold-Bard]

Well, it was one publiziced case that went to court, where the Sheriff basically told the council to shut the hell up and stop being silly.

Fair enough.

[TheCountAlucard]

Reminds me of the story in which a guy got the cops called on him for counterfeiting, because the Taco Bell employees he was trying to pay didn't seem to think there was such a thing as a two-dollar bill...

[Helinon]

Check these out.
http://epicwinftw.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/129079800260945422.jpg
http://epicwinftw.files.wordpress.com/2010/01/129055719306537166.jpg
Also great find on those pics! :smallbiggrin: They're awesome!

[Maximum Zersk]

@ Above:

Reminds me of that Billy Mays video.

"Making your money my money is something I'm really passionate about."

Of course, Billy Mays is simply awesome, so:

WIN.

[Boo]

Billy Mays

If only it covered the shipping and handling...