The 10-year-old air traffic controller

[pendell]

At least, that's how old I think this kid is (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6beDDNcIYMc&feature=player_embedded). Could be wrong.


Respectfully,

Brian P.

[golentan]

Sounds to me like he was just giving "cleared for departure" messages, under supervision, when signaled, and with an adult in the tower on the line.

I can't say I see this as a big deal. It's not like he was making decisions. Of course, it's the FAA's job to be humorless about this sort of stuff, but I hope they go easy on 'em unless there's a regulation I don't know about being broken by having the kid in the tower.

[KuReshtin]

Even though I can understand that it would be frowned upon by the FAA, it's also obvious that the kid's father was present and telling the kid what to say, so if something would have come up that needed his attention.

Ill-advised, but harmless, I would say.

[Ikialev]

Irresponsible, but no real harm done, righ?

And he sounds 5.

[Emperor Ing]

Considering the way things are run these days, i'd say both the dad and everyone else in the tower broke more than enough rules and regulatons for all of them to be thrown into jail for the duration of a dragon's lifetime before the 10-year-old even stepped foot into the tower. :smalltongue:

[KuReshtin]

Also, the air traffic controllers don't sit in 'the tower'.
They're most likely miles and miles away in some bunker somewhere.

[jlvm4]

Was it stupid? Yes. Was it threatening safety for anyone? No.

It was clear he was being supervised, the call patterns routine. It probably broke rules, looked bad, and deserved reprimand of the 'what were you thinking? Don't do it again.' variety.

But suspension? Possible firing? Not really. Not unless the controller had done this before and been warned before. That's what I hate about problem resolution in general lately: there's no step between doing nothing and doing everything. It's one or the other. I forsee overkill on this that will resemble a typical school 'zero-tolerance' event.

[The Vorpal Tribble]

Irresponsible? Ill-advised? Why? As long as the Dad is right there telling him what to say how can there be any danger to pilot, father or child?

[skywalker]

Also, the air traffic controllers don't sit in 'the tower'.
They're most likely miles and miles away in some bunker somewhere.

Since when?!

[Pyrian]

Generally speaking... Regional air traffic controllers aren't in the towers. The ones that control the airports' airspace also control their groundspace, and are based in the towers, where they can see the taxiways.

[KuReshtin]

Since when?!

I might be thinking about airport approach centres.

[Ikialev]

Irresponsible? Ill-advised? Why? As long as the Dad is right there telling him what to say how can there be any danger to pilot, father or child?
Because children can't be trusted. That is, you can't be 100% sure they will say what you want.

[Pyrian]

"Oh God DIIIIVE NOW!" *giggle* *giggle*

...Yeah, I could see that happening. :smallannoyed:

[KuReshtin]

This thread makes me want to watch 'Pushing Tin'....

[Comet]

I would hope that the dad was a good enough judge of character about his own kid to be pretty certain he wouldn't do anything horrible.

I really liked how the pilots were good sports about the whole thing. Brought a smile to my face, at least.

[ScottishDragon]

At least, that's how old I think this kid is (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6beDDNcIYMc&feature=player_embedded). Could be wrong.


Respectfully,

Brian P.

thats awesome,i wish i cuda done that when i was 10,this is poboabably gonna be the best day of this kids life.

[Mercenary Pen]

"Oh God DIIIIVE NOW!" *giggle* *giggle*

...Yeah, I could see that happening. :smallannoyed:

"What do you mean you don't have that other aircraft on your radar?"

"He's not responding. He's gonna ram right into you. Break left and climb now!"

[tcrudisi]

"Oh God DIIIIVE NOW!" *giggle* *giggle*

...Yeah, I could see that happening. :smallannoyed:

I could too... at which point the father would immediately jump back onto the headset.

But I think this is being really blown out of proportion. To me, it sounded just like a "take your kid to work" day. If the father gets more than a warning, it will be too much. Really, if I were the boss, I would say something like: "Hey Bill. Look, I don't want us getting into trouble, so let's call this your warning. As long as nothing bad happens, I don't really care, but I gotta be honest with you as it's your head if the kid says something stupid."

That wouldn't save me, I'm sure, but seriously -- does anyone really think this was a danger? I agree with the above poster who said that the father knew his kids character and knew nothing bad would happen. And if it did, I'm sure he was right there ready to yank back control.

Heck, even the pilots sounded amused.

[ForzaFiori]

With the father obviously right there, and only letting the kid say basic stuff, I don't see what was so wrong. Even if the kid somehow messed up, the dad was right there to correct it, and when all your doing is clearing someone for take off, you have time to tell them not to.

I understand that it was stupid for the dad to think that he wouldn't get in trouble for it, but a suspension? really? that is complete bull. He should get a warning, and told not to do it again.

[Tarnag40k]

Welcome to government agencies running anything, able to create more drama out of nothing then a schoolgirl would ever be capable of.

seriously? I'm going to repost this on some of my other forums, hell maybe even find out who is responsible for these disciplinary actions and send them the links. Then to top it off, ask them where they were educated so I know to where not to continue my "higher education" to avoid becoming as ridiculously idiotic and without the ability to rationally look at a situation.

Something like this is the equivalent of a father having his son steer the wheel of a car and such. Really? And people wonder why I am so disillusioned with my own country.

[SensFan]

Something like this is the equivalent of a father having his son steer the wheel of a car and such. Really? And people wonder why I am so disillusioned with my own country.
Not at all. It's the equivalent to a father going slowly on a small sidestreet and letting his son hold the steering wheel as he drove.

[skywalker]

"What do you mean you don't have that other aircraft on your radar?"

"He's not responding. He's gonna ram right into you. Break left and climb now!"

Commercial planes actually don't have radar. They are completely dependent on the tower (or whatever you want to call that place where the ATC guys sit) for instructions on avoiding other planes.

[pendell]

Update: The controller in question has been suspended (http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory?id=10005596).

Personally, I doubt the aircraft was in any danger whatsoever. The kid was basically acting as a repeater for his father's instructions with no discretion, with the father in the loop every minute, just as you would when training a new ATC.

Be that as it may, the father DID nonetheless violate one of the unwritten rules of governments and corporations, which is 'don't embarrass and get us on the television news. You WILL pay for it'.

Despite the fact that the aircraft were in no danger, it evidently made a lot of people nervous and upset. Therefore the agencies involved felt it necessary to punish him, and to be *seen* to punish him, for the technical rule violations. Violations which would probably have only resulted in a verbal warning if it hadn't made the news.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[RandomNPC]

this is silly. The kid had a good time, a few pilots even complimented the kids, and yes kids, as his other child came in the next day. Freaky kinds of awesome. I got to go to my dads work when I was a kid, and I still want to run a 72 inch guillotine cutter.

[Forever Curious]

To my understanding, the controller was given a warning of some sort when this sort of event happened previously. Which, in my eyes, justifies some sort of disciplinary action. Of course that fact it made news most likely escalated the punishment, but regardless he shouldn't have done it in the first place.

Unless I'm wrong, in which case ignore this post.

[Silverraptor]

I frankly disapprove of this big drama that everyone is bringing up. Pretty much everyone has already said all of my "Why does it matter" comments.

[bosssmiley]

Sounds to me like he was just giving "cleared for departure" messages, under supervision, when signaled, and with an adult in the tower on the line.

I can't say I see this as a big deal. It's not like he was making decisions. Of course, it's the FAA's job to be humorless about this sort of stuff, but I hope they go easy on 'em unless there's a regulation I don't know about being broken by having the kid in the tower.

Unfortunately Pops did the one thing which modern institutions will not tolerate, ever: he exposed them to liability. The cowardly response by the airport authority and the FAA ("Appease the precautionary principle lobby first!") was entirely predictable.

No harm done. None ever likely to occur. But don't ever let common sense get in the way of the rules. :smallwink:

[deuxhero]

The pilots sound like they enjoyed it, and honestly, their opinions are the ones that count here.

[lightningcat]

Having worked in the airline industry, I can say that the kid was there with full permission, and he was following the standard departure procedure, which is a script anyways. In fact, I would bet good money that more people were watching over that plane then any other one at the time, just to make sure that nothing did go wrong.

But to small minded officials there's nothing like ruining the dreams of a child.

But, the duty of regulatory offices, such as the FAA, is to protect us from ourselves, regardless of if we need it or not. They treat everyone as if they were a clueless dolt that cannot do even the simplest task without assistence, and then can't understand why common sence is dissappearing.

[Solaris]

Having worked in the airline industry, I can say that the kid was there with full permission, and he was following the standard departure procedure, which is a script anyways. In fact, I would bet good money that more people were watching over that plane then any other one at the time, just to make sure that nothing did go wrong.

But to small minded officials there's nothing like ruining the dreams of a child.

But, the duty of regulatory offices, such as the FAA, is to protect us from ourselves, regardless of if we need it or not. They treat everyone as if they were a clueless dolt that cannot do even the simplest task without assistance, and then can't understand why common sense is disappearing.

I gotta go with this, and the fact that they made the news.
Bets someone cried out shrilly "Won't someone think of the children?"

[wadledo]

Update: The controller in question has been suspended (http://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory?id=10005596).

What burns me about this article is the last paragraph has the implication that the child would have caused a crash because he let his kid feel important.
Because letting a child have fun while under your supervision in an international airport is exactly the same as joking with your girlfriend in a dinky, unimportant airport.

[Solaris]

What burns me about this article is the last paragraph has the implication that the child would have caused a crash because he let his kid feel important.
Because letting a child have fun while under your supervision in an international airport is exactly the same as joking with your girlfriend in a dinky, unimportant airport.

Exactly. The crash was due to negligence. The kid on the radio was parroting what his father was telling him, and as stated in the article the kid was giving no maneuver directions, simply routine messages.