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Amiel
2010-03-07, 09:00 AM
The world has been irrevocably scarred by the aftermath of a great war. A plague, supernatural in origin, has been unleashed as an ill conceived scheme to unification. Powered by the sacrificed lives of a thousand epic mages, this sanguineous whirlwind has devastated the Illumined City, once a centre of thought, knowledge and balance (equity of power, equity of money, equality of gender, equality of race et al).

This infection, believed by many to be none other than the perfidious work of a deity of disease and mayhem is overwhelming in its ease of spread and devastating in its symptoms.

All touched by it erupt in ponderous explosions of blood, showering all within its radius with tainted, vile disease; causing many more to be infected, to be touched by its bloody hand.

These are the lucky ones; for others, they survive the initial onslaught only to "awaken" as seemingly mindless, brutally savage inhumans; super zombies. These massacre what little surviving residents remain and gouge themselves upon living and dead alike; propagating, multiplying. In doing so, destroying countless powerful magic items.

In little time, Illuminous becomes a wasteland of mortar and wood, a sad silent plea to what once was. Its very buildings, once heralded as innovative ahead of its time are decayed and crumbling. Its very streets are strewn with debris and the castoff seeds of ruined plants.

You have somehow managed to survive; be it from a lost magic item, your own immunity, or some other reason, you are perhaps the only godforsaken survivor.

You need to eke out a living, or whatever remains as a semblance of one. Yet you must always be mindful of the time of day; with the setting sun comes the threat of attack and multitudinous hordes. Even though you cannot be infected, you can still die.

What will you do? You are a mid-level D&D character, unoptimised with generic items.

You need to find food, and must search through every residence and building to find any item that may be beneficial to you. Occasionally, you will find that you need to venture into darkened tenements or blackened warehouses to uncover useful objects.

The creatures are only harmed by direct sunlight; no artificial light sources can harm them, even magically created ones.

You have your own dwelling and must quickly return to it every sunset, though the distance covered in your search and wanderings may be considerable; you cannot remain outside very long at all.

There may be an animal companion accompanying you, but inevitably it will become infected and you may need to put it down. Are you able to do this? Or will you simply abandon it? Or something other?

The seemingly mindless super zombies occasionally build traps to ensnare prey. You happen to be tricked into one of them, cracking your head and going unconscious. You awaken to find it is near night, and you are still hanging suspended upon a simple rope. What will you do? How will you evade and flee the horde to shelter once again in your sanctum?

Will you try to trap the super zombies in a bid to find a cure and thus restore society? Or will you remain a bastion of depression and loneliness?

How will you deal with your depression or the crushing despair? There is no one to converse with, no gods to commune.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 09:09 AM
I become a lich and lord over mankind. I use my rebuking powers to make the zombies my slaves.

onthetown
2010-03-07, 09:12 AM
I become a lich and lord over mankind. I use my rebuking powers to make the zombies my slaves.

This. :smallbiggrin:

Alternatively; hide in a corner, wait for my death, and cry like a little kid.

Amiel
2010-03-07, 09:15 AM
You are a mid-level D&D character, unoptimised with generic items.


The character must be able to cast spells and have a caster level of 11th or higher. The phylactery costs 120,000 gp and 4,800 XP to create and has a caster level equal to that of its creator at the time of creation.


Also, mortal races please.

Closak
2010-03-07, 09:18 AM
Step 1: Perform a ritual to attract the attention of 'Turalisj Nugri'

Step 2: Laugh as the 'Turalisj Nugri' eats the entire universe, killing the zombies, me and and everything else.


There you go, i may have died, but i took all those bastards down with me.

Amiel
2010-03-07, 09:21 AM
Addendum; how sure are you (general you) that they are actually undead?
They may very well be aberrations.

Longcat
2010-03-07, 09:26 AM
You are a mid-level D&D character, unoptimised with generic items.

Mid-level is rather tangible, and encompasses everything from L5-15. Would you care to narrow it down?

Now, assuming I can defeat a zombie in combat, I would powerlevel my character MMO-style, to the point where I can pull off an (near-)infinite loop to grant myself limitless power. Then, I would create a new world utilizing Genesis, and leave the crapsack zombie place. If I feel like it, I will Locate City Bomb the old world, just for the hell of it. Twice. After all, double-tapping is the most important thing next to cardio in a zombie adventure.

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-07, 09:27 AM
Be a 9th level cleric(9 being below mid-level) and Plane Shift (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/planeShift.htm) to the Astral Plane. Wall of Stone (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/wallOfStone.htm) a shell around myself. Float around forever creating my own food/water and entertainment(via Summon Monster gladitorial battles).

Volkov
2010-03-07, 09:32 AM
Also, mortal races please.

Level 11 is mid-level. And I will use detect undead to see if they are capable of being slaves, if they are abberations, I convince them to join my army with a diplomacy check. Or I use my own zombies to fight them. As my undead hordes ravage the psuedo-zombies, I laugh as the world slowly falls under my command. And then once I reach epic level, I will use an epic spell to make everything in the universe my permanent slave. As Yuri once said, "There will be no more free will, only my will."

Vizzerdrix
2010-03-07, 09:59 AM
The Build and the Plan
Mid level? and unoptomized? Regular cleric into Techsmith. Gond willing, I have everything in the city to make cheap golems, constructs, homunculi and effigy creatures from. my gondsman and homunculi are intellegent so I'll have company. Homunculi are used to scout, along with animated objects+ scry. They also order any simple constructs while salvaging out in the city.

Given time, long term plans call for Some sort of flying Effigy creature is built for relocation, and huge effigy creatures that can dig. I'll sink the damn city if I can't save it, but only as a final order.


The Home
Sanctuary will be a cluster of buildings that are at least 3 stories tall and have basements. Chop out the stairs going up to the second floors and the ground floors as well, then seal up the second floor in each and trap the living heck out of them. plank bridges will allow access between the third or higher floors of each building (say 3-4 buildings in total). Finally, a rope ladder and a basic winch/crane are the only access up. Now unless they fully assault all the buildings at one time I;m safe, but they will loose many in taking the second floor, and I can just burn any buildings that are over run.Lost constructs can be rebuilt from the scraps.

If captured:
That is what the gondsman is for. I'd be cut down and carried back to sanctuary on tireless legs.

The Crew:


-1 Gondsman. an Intelligent golem who is bodyguard and companion. I think I'd name him Mr. Handy.

-5 or more Cheap Constructs: The ones from Dragon Magazine. Don't remember the issue, but they are weak, cheap and can be made from scraps. If I'm gonna loose something, might as well just be a wood or tin golem.

-3 Homunculus. A Packmate and two Expeditious messengers. I don't think the zombies will bother a chest, so long as it stays still when they are around, and the messengers are sneaky and swift fliers.

5-Effigy creatures: one Large size locust for transportation, then either 4 large grapplers (If I can find a cure) or 4 large size diggers (if I must sink the city).



Granted, it isn't as efficient as using the undead in the same manner, but working on them all helps to keep my mind occupied and fills the time. The feeling of accomplishment each time a new creation starts to move will stave off depression, and the companionship from the sentient ones will stave off insanity.

bosssmiley
2010-03-07, 10:15 AM
Tell the DM his "Omega Man" pastiche sucks.
Hijack the group in the name of truth, justice and the Gygaxian way, leading them in the paths of righteousness to the promised lands of high adventure. :smallwink:

Killer Angel
2010-03-07, 10:16 AM
What will you do? You are a mid-level D&D character, unoptimised with generic items.

There is no one to converse with, no gods to commune.

Pazuzu Pazuzu Pazuzu :smallcool:

Volkov
2010-03-07, 10:17 AM
I also summon Pazuzu, and tell him that I'll share the universe with him if he gets rid of the zombies with his wish power.

BenTheJester
2010-03-07, 10:38 AM
Level 11 is mid-level. And I will use detect undead to see if they are capable of being slaves, if they are abberations, I convince them to join my army with a diplomacy check. Or I use my own zombies to fight them. As my undead hordes ravage the psuedo-zombies, I laugh as the world slowly falls under my command. And then once I reach epic level, I will use an epic spell to make everything in the universe my permanent slave. As Yuri once said, "There will be no more free will, only my will."

Thats level 11 before the +4 LA

Level 15 is hardly mid-level



Why do you have to return to your shack?

I would just say I have a ring of sustenance(which I almost always have as a mid-level adventurer), being an Horizon Walker, I'd just follow the sun all the time and never worry about zombies.

Alternatively, I can just be a cleric(not as cool, but much more effective) and teleport to the sunlit part of earth whenever its getting dark.

Freedom of Movement or a good escape artist check means I don't care about traps

Volkov
2010-03-07, 10:41 AM
Thats level 11 before the +4 LA

Level 15 is hardly mid-level



Why do you have to return to your shack?

I would just say I have a ring of sustenance(which I almost always have as a mid-level adventurer), being an Horizon Walker, I'd just follow the sun all the time and never worry about zombies.

Alternatively, I can just be a cleric(not as cool, but much more effective) and teleport to the sunlit part of earth whenever its getting dark.

Freedom of Movement or a good escape artist check means I don't care about traps
Oh contrare, level 15 is the highest mid-level, and I can buy off some of the LA any way.

BenTheJester
2010-03-07, 10:46 AM
Au contraire, level 15 is the highest mid-level, and I can buy off some of the LA any way.

Who says you can?

And anyway I don't think the goal of this thread is to find how to be the most powerful being and have an easy fun time.

I think Vizzerdrix gave one of the best answer.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 10:49 AM
Who says you can?

And anyway I don't think the goal of this thread is to find how to be the most powerful being and have an easy fun time.

I think Vizzerdrix gave one of the best answer.

The goal is to survive, I not only survived but prospered.

Longcat
2010-03-07, 10:53 AM
Thats level 11 before the +4 LA

Level 15 is hardly mid-level


Actually, it is.




Alternatively, I can just be a cleric(not as cool, but much more effective) and teleport to the sunlit part of earth whenever its getting dark.




How will you deal with your depression or the crushing despair? There is no one to converse with, no gods to commune.

Emphasis mine.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 10:55 AM
Actually, it is.






Emphasis mine.

You don't need gods to be a cleric. Just faith.

Soranar
2010-03-07, 11:35 AM
I'd probably play a Vow of Poverty character (if I remember right they don't need to eat or drink, and also become immune to disease which would explain why the character is alive in the first place)

character would then spend all of his time trying to save everyone he can

Volkov
2010-03-07, 11:37 AM
I'd probably play a Vow of Poverty character (if I remember right they don't need to eat or drink, and also become immune to disease which would explain why the character is alive in the first place)

character would then spend all of his time trying to save everyone he can

But would you survive my horde of commanded and animated awakened skeletons? Or would you support my growing empire ruled by undead soldiers? And these skeletons would all be clerics to control more undead.

Soranar
2010-03-07, 11:42 AM
But would you survive my horde of commanded and animated awakened skeletons? Or would you support my growing empire ruled by undead soldiers? And these skeletons would all be clerics to control more undead.

actually I'd probably be saving people from you and your undead

Volkov
2010-03-07, 11:43 AM
actually I'd probably be saving people from you and your undead

Better free in a dangerous world than safe behind skeleton warriors eh?

Longcat
2010-03-07, 11:45 AM
But would you survive my horde of commanded and animated awakened skeletons? Or would you support my growing empire ruled by undead soldiers? And these skeletons would all be clerics to control more undead.

Eh Volkov, aren't all posters supposed to be undertaking the challenge posed by the OP individually? I.E. not clashing against each other while surviving the super zombies.

Although I have to admit that the entire challenge would be so much more awesome with multiple contestants competing. Kinda like Fallout/Mad Max with zombies :smallbiggrin:

Volkov
2010-03-07, 11:46 AM
Eh Volkov, aren't all posters supposed to be undertaking the challenge posed by the OP individually? I.E. not clashing against each other while surviving the super zombies.

Although I have to admit that the entire challenge would be so much more awesome with multiple contestants competing. Kinda like Fallout/Mad Max with zombies :smallbiggrin:

And roving armies of intelligent skeletons who "press-gang" you into service. A growing horde of intelligent undead skeletons fighting a horde of zombies vs a bunch of mid-level survivors. Now if that's not cool vs awesome I don't know what is.

Kol Korran
2010-03-07, 11:52 AM
Amiel- May i ask what is the sudden interest in the "I am Legend" D&D style type of game? the theme doesn't translate well. if you want something of that feel you have to get rid of most thing magic. i say most things from 5th level spells and higher allready make the theme fairly problematic.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 11:54 AM
Amiel- May i ask what is the sudden interest in the "I am Legend" D&D style type of game? the theme doesn't translate well. if you want something of that feel you have to get rid of most thing magic. i say most things from 5th level spells and higher allready make the theme fairly problematic.

Shush, Army of intelligent skeletons that skeletonize their foes vs zombies vs mid level PC survivors=instant awesome.

Longcat
2010-03-07, 11:56 AM
And roving armies of intelligent skeletons who "press-gang" you into service. A growing horde of intelligent undead skeletons fighting a horde of zombies vs a bunch of mid-level survivors. Now if that's not cool vs awesome I don't know what is.

So, it's "Join the Resistance" or "Extermination"?

Now we just need to find someone willing to DM this game. Any volunteers? :smalltongue:

The Shadowmind
2010-03-07, 12:41 PM
Be a warlock, with The Deadwalk, Fell Flight, and Brimstone Blast, and Vitriolic blast if high enough level.

Raising the various bodies of bunnies, puppies, and kitties are a temporary mining unit to dig for onyx for a more permanent army, while you searching for jewelry and gems stores with dead owners. You take the a section of the once fluffy army with you to maul any "super zombies" you may encounter while you are flying around searching for onyx. Slowly you build up your X*4 CL worth animals and people and then you clear town by town on the other undead menace. The recommended tactic is to swarm the "super zombie with at least 10 of the weaker units, then while they are distracted you fire the Brimstone/Vitrolic blast from the air while another group of 4 stronger humanoid skeleton units attack with the bows/crossbows.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 12:43 PM
Be a warlock, with The Deadwalk, Fell Flight, and Brimstone Blast, and Vitriolic blast if high enough level.

Raising the various bodies of bunnies, puppies, and kitties are a temporary mining unit to dig for onyx for a more permanent army, while you searching for jewelry and gems stores with dead owners. You take the a section of the once fluffy army with you to maul any "super zombies" you may encounter while you are flying around searching for onyx. Slowly you build up your X*4 CL worth animals and people and then you clear town by town on the other undead menace. The recommended tactic is to swarm the "super zombie with at least 4 10 of the weaker units, then while they are distracted you fire the Brimstone/Vitrolic blast from the air while another group of 4 stronger humanoid skeleton units attack with the bows/crossbows.

If I were to offer you a place in my undead legion, would you accept?

The Shadowmind
2010-03-07, 12:47 PM
If I were to offer you a place in my undead legion, would you accept?

As long as the undead part remains describing just the skeleton/zombie troops, and not me.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 12:48 PM
As long as the undead part remains describing just the skeleton/zombie troops, and not me.

Now, with our combined horde, how well do you think we'd do against the "zombies?"

Tiki Snakes
2010-03-07, 12:49 PM
Yeah, if we're mid level enough for there to be a chance of plane-shifting, just pop along down to your now god-less heaven of choice and kick back, really.

I reject your reality and substitute my own!

Volkov
2010-03-07, 12:50 PM
I'd eventually become a god if my plan works, and rule the universe absolutely with my lieutenants becoming parts of the new pantheon.

Flickerdart
2010-03-07, 01:01 PM
You can't buy off all of 4 LA even if you started with it. You could only buy off 1 point of LA at 12th, making you a 15th level character minimum. No lvl 15 needs to worry about such a trite thing as endless hordes of the walking dead. Necropolitan is a much better choice than Lich, or even Warforged. Elan would also be nice, since they can sustain themselves indefinitely as well. Any mode of flight makes you invulnerable (sleep during the day, if you've any need for sleep), and that can be had by 5th level or earlier with Half-Fey and such. Rope Trick solves all your hiding problems, and MMM does it with style. The only problem would be boredom, and that's easily solved by any number of ways that don't require sapient presence.

You could also Dragonwrought Kobold-cheese your way into early Epic casting and create eternal day, but that's against the spirit of the thing.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 01:06 PM
You can't buy off all of 4 LA even if you started with it. You could only buy off 1 point of LA at 12th, making you a 15th level character minimum. No lvl 15 needs to worry about such a trite thing as endless hordes of the walking dead. Necropolitan is a much better choice than Lich, or even Warforged. Elan would also be nice, since they can sustain themselves indefinitely as well. Any mode of flight makes you invulnerable (sleep during the day, if you've any need for sleep), and that can be had by 5th level or earlier with Half-Fey and such. Rope Trick solves all your hiding problems, and MMM does it with style. The only problem would be boredom, and that's easily solved by any number of ways that don't require sapient presence.

You could also Dragonwrought Kobold-cheese your way into early Epic casting and create eternal day, but that's against the spirit of the thing.
I like the way liches look. The picture of the necropolitan just looks stupid.

Longcat
2010-03-07, 01:09 PM
Personally, I'd go the Dry Lich route? You can turn into one by the time you reach L13 (Assuming that the LA+5 is incorporated into the 10 levels of WitW. Any other ruling is unreasonable).

On a side note, can zombies dehydrate?

Volkov
2010-03-07, 01:13 PM
Personally, I'd go the Dry Lich route? You can turn into one by the time you reach L13 (Assuming that the LA+5 is incorporated into the 10 levels of WitW. Any other ruling is unreasonable).

On a side note, can zombies dehydrate?

They can't get thirsty, but you can suck out all the moisture from them, which would make them very, very flammable.

Flickerdart
2010-03-07, 01:13 PM
You could be a Wight, they're pretty neat and the Gravewight template has no prerequisites as far as I recall (LA+4 though).

Now I'm wondering if there isn't a way to effectively keep the zombies around until the sun rises and they're dusted. A tripper might do a good job of keeping them at bay, and a Forcecage sticks around for long enough (but is expensive to cast). Walls of Iron can be used to surround them and leave them to their doom, and then salvaged for raw materials to make your constructs.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 01:14 PM
You could be a Wight, they're pretty neat and the Gravewight template has no prerequisites as far as I recall (LA+4 though).

Now I'm wondering if there isn't a way to effectively keep the zombies around until the sun rises and they're dusted. A tripper might do a good job of keeping them at bay, and a Forcecage sticks around for long enough (but is expensive to cast). Walls of Iron can be used to surround them and leave them to their doom, and then salvaged for raw materials to make your constructs.

The wight's picture looks even dumber(it looks like he's about to dance). If I want to be an evil overlord, I have to have a badass base appearance.

Flickerdart
2010-03-07, 01:20 PM
Not mentioning the facts that there's nobody to see you and you're a powerful Wizard for whom changing appearance shouldn't be difficult at all, you don't necessarily have to look exactly like the MM picture.

Longcat
2010-03-07, 01:24 PM
Not mentioning the facts that there's nobody to see you and you're a powerful Wizard for whom changing appearance shouldn't be difficult at all, you don't necessarily have to look exactly like the MM picture.

I always thought Mialee's picture in the PHB was WotC's way of balancing wizards against other classes. Cosmic powers at the cost of looking like a mutant frog.

Lysander
2010-03-07, 01:26 PM
Cleric. Travel domain. Fly up to a safe place every night. Create food and water for myself as needed. Level up, collect diamonds, and eventually resurrect people.

Gralamin
2010-03-07, 01:30 PM
Well, as I see it, you essentially have two choices:
1) Become the evil ruler of the plane
or
2) Die in a short lived blaze of glory.
(There is also Option 3 that Zero took: Stop caring and go somewhere else)

Lots of people are talking about one, so I'll go with #2.

To optimize how short lived we are, we will want to be Azurin (76 years max - I forget if there was anything lower then this but higher then Thri-Kreen) or Thri-Kreen (29 years max). Since we want glory, we will go with a strategy of "wading into the enemy ranks and riping them apart." Many builds are capable of doing this, and either race is good at it. Good classes include Warblade, Totemist, and Psionic Warrior. Cleave and Great Cleave are a must.

FlamingKobold
2010-03-07, 02:33 PM
@Amiel: Would you mind if I took this and turned it into the rough outline for a PbP game?

Volkov
2010-03-07, 02:36 PM
@Amiel: Would you mind if I took this and turned it into the rough outline for a PbP game?

Can I be the despotic lich cleric I suggested one could be?

Bibliomancer
2010-03-07, 02:48 PM
I'd be a warforged artificer and gradually replace the entire zombie population with loyal constructs and/or other warforged (created from craft reserve and/or experience points earned from killing zombies). I wouldn't need to sleep, and would be immune to the disease.

Note that if added to the above anti-undead horde, one would double the number of minions one would get per zombie killed, since one zombie = one skeleton + one cheap construct (if you let me kill the zombies for experience points).

In a few millenia I might get around to reinventing life.

Slayn82
2010-03-07, 03:26 PM
My plan would be:

0) Be a divination specialist or an artificer.
1) Find a Dragon, a Beholder or other monster with lots of nasty abilities.
2) Kill him/them
3) Make a few Simulacrum's of him/them
4) Organize them as an army, to disintegrate/burn enemies from distance and search for survivors.
5) Discover if the enemy is undead or not
6) If not Undead, summon shadows to try to drain and kill them.
7) If Undead, either try to create or find and open gates to positive energy plane, and bring its denizens to this world. Or maybe weaponize this.
8) Acquire as many Lyres of building as possible, than trap and barricate at insane levels safe refuges to other survivors. Heck, hidden subterran/oceanic cities with small autosuficient comunities work well in this context.
9) Use clarivoyance to get eagleview of the hordes movement, as well as all the surroundings of bases and other important places.
10) Prying eyes spells to search moderatelly dangerous areas for magic, knowledge and survivors.
11) If, as stated, only sunlight affects the enemies, discover their nests with the aforementioned tactics and use the lyres of building to uncover them to the sunlight.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 04:17 PM
My plan would be:

0) Be a divination specialist or an artificer.
1) Find a Dragon, a Beholder or other monster with lots of nasty abilities.
2) Kill him/them
3) Make a few Simulacrum's of him/them
4) Organize them as an army, to disintegrate/burn enemies from distance and search for survivors.
5) Discover if the enemy is undead or not
6) If not Undead, summon shadows to try to drain and kill them.
7) If Undead, either try to create or find and open gates to positive energy plane, and bring its denizens to this world. Or maybe weaponize this.
8) Acquire as many Lyres of building as possible, than trap and barricate at insane levels safe refuges to other survivors. Heck, hidden subterran/oceanic cities with small autosuficient comunities work well in this context.
9) Use clarivoyance to get eagleview of the hordes movement, as well as all the surroundings of bases and other important places.
10) Prying eyes spells to search moderatelly dangerous areas for magic, knowledge and survivors.
11) If, as stated, only sunlight affects the enemies, discover their nests with the aforementioned tactics and use the lyres of building to uncover them to the sunlight.
Would you stand with me or against me?

Jack_Simth
2010-03-07, 04:44 PM
Let's see...

For Survival:

Nourishment:
You need to either be able to not require food (racial pick, ring of sustenance, Clear Spindle Ioun Stone, Vow of Poverty, some class features), be able to make food (Cleric-5+ with Create Food and Water, Wizard-11+ or Sorcerer-12+ for Stone to Flesh, a Sustaining Spoon... there's probably a few other options), or be able to find food (Survival skill - class skill for lots of people, but you can work with Cross-class; also Craft(Food) or Profession(Farmer) would potentially work, if you can keep your crops safe).

Escape:
You need to be able to get away from traps or bad situations. Dimension Door, Teleport, Grease, Fly, Gaseous Form, Wind Walk, and several other methods will do. Most of those are spells... but you can also use stealth (Escape Artist, Search, Disable Device, Hide, Move Silently).

Rest:
You need to either have a portable method of being left alone or being when you rest, have a way to make a very good fortress for resting, or not need rest. Minions can do it (undead, constructs, Leadership, Charm, Familiars, Animal Companions) by either fighting off the undead for you, or warning you when something's coming so you can use an escape method. Spells can do it (Rope Trick, Magnificent Mansion, Wall of Stone, Summon Monster III for a Celestial Dire Badger to dig a hole, using a method of flight to reach a place that's completely inaccessible, Alarm, et cetera). Racial choices can do it (Warforged come to mind - no need for actual rest - as do Necropolitan and a few others). Alternately, you can travel to a location that is inaccessible by seemingly-mindless things that can't stand the light of day. Like, say, the middle of the Sahara (or the middle of any desert that's large enough that a dead run won't reach the middle before a few days have passed).

With those three, you can survive... as long as you're assumed to be immune to the plague, and the plague-zombies can't get to your hidey-hole, wherever that happens to be, while you sleep. The rest is "how do you respond".

A few build outlines:
Wizard 5+:
Extend Spell, Rope Trick, Gaseous Form, some cross-class ranks in survival, bat familiar.
Method: Extended Rope Trick gives you the rest you need. Gaseous Form gets you out of most sticky situations. Bat gets Blindsense, and you have Speak With Familiar at this point; Bat tells you exactly where things are, so you can run away safely. Sleep in a Rope Trick at night, invisibly, 30 feet up in the air. Gaseous Form is your go-to escape spell (or others, if you're higher than 5th - plenty of options), use Survival to find food.

Sorcerer 6+: See Wizard 5+.

Cleric 5+:
Type A: Air domain. Gaseous Form + Create Food and Water + Summon Monster III. Food's not a problem, Shelter isn't a problem (dig a hole somewhere... but you want to be active at night, and rest during the day), escape isn't a problem (gaseous form).
Type B: Travel domain. Fly + Create Food and Water + Summon Monster III; same principle, but you'll also need an edged weapon for if you need to deal with rope-based traps, and something with which to smash walls for wall-based traps. Neither of those should be difficult.

Druid 5+:
Survival for food, Speak with Animals + Summon Nature's Ally II gets you shelter (Dire Badger digger). Wildshape can get you out of most traps (turn into something for which it does not apply) as can Summon Monster.

Rogue (Any): Survival (cross-class) for food and water. Stealth skills for getting around. Sleep during the day. Escape Artist for getting out of traps, Search for avoiding them in the first place.

Barbarian (Any): Survival for food and water. Climb for getting to places where the zombies can't (for rest). Sleep during the day. Hulk smash for getting out of traps.

Bard (Any): See Rogue, although Search is cross-class. At 7th+, Gaseous Form saves you from traps. Alternately, at higher levels, see the Wizard entry (mostly).

Fighter (Any): Can't work well without magic items, lots of cross-class skills, or support from one of the other classes (Cohort?). For magic items, see the casters, assuming you've got an item that does it (generally, you can get one that does the needed stuff - Ring of Sustenence, Cape of the Monteback, Sustaining Spoon, Slippers of Spider-climbing, whatever). For cross-class skills, see the Barbarian.

Monk (Any): See Rogue, although you'll need to focus on Escape Artist, as Search is cross-class. Alternately, see Fighter.

Paladin (Any): See Fighter.

Ranger (Any): See Rogue, but Survival is a class skill. Alternately, see Fighter. At 8th+, see Druid (although you'll still need Escape Artist for getting out of things).

That's, of course, assuming generic races that need sleep, food, and water. A few relatively cheap magic items make almost any character class viable here (Ring of Sustenance, Sustaining Spoon, Cape of the Monteback, Winged Boots, Slippers of Spider Climbing, those nifty boots, and so on). A race that can get by without food or sleep just needs something to escape trouble.

You probably want to get beyond mere survival, though.... which is where everything else comes in. But everything else is what most people have been addressing.

Nerocite
2010-03-07, 04:56 PM
I'd cut out my brain and put in a jar.

Or take the Survivor Prc.

Jack_Simth
2010-03-07, 05:14 PM
Continuing...

Survival:


Let's see...

For Survival:

Nourishment:
You need to either be able to not require food (racial pick, ring of sustenance, Clear Spindle Ioun Stone, Vow of Poverty, some class features), be able to make food (Cleric-5+ with Create Food and Water, Wizard-11+ or Sorcerer-12+ for Stone to Flesh, a Sustaining Spoon... there's probably a few other options), or be able to find food (Survival skill - class skill for lots of people, but you can work with Cross-class; also Craft(Food) or Profession(Farmer) would potentially work, if you can keep your crops safe).

Escape:
You need to be able to get away from traps or bad situations. Dimension Door, Teleport, Grease, Fly, Gaseous Form, Wind Walk, and several other methods will do. Most of those are spells... but you can also use stealth (Escape Artist, Search, Disable Device, Hide, Move Silently).

Rest:
You need to either have a portable method of being left alone or being when you rest, have a way to make a very good fortress for resting, or not need rest. Minions can do it (undead, constructs, Leadership, Charm, Familiars, Animal Companions) by either fighting off the undead for you, or warning you when something's coming so you can use an escape method. Spells can do it (Rope Trick, Magnificent Mansion, Wall of Stone, Summon Monster III for a Celestial Dire Badger to dig a hole, using a method of flight to reach a place that's completely inaccessible, Alarm, et cetera). Racial choices can do it (Warforged come to mind - no need for actual rest - as do Necropolitan and a few others). Alternately, you can travel to a location that is inaccessible by seemingly-mindless things that can't stand the light of day. Like, say, the middle of the Sahara (or the middle of any desert that's large enough that a dead run won't reach the middle before a few days have passed).

With those three, you can survive... as long as you're assumed to be immune to the plague, and the plague-zombies can't get to your hidey-hole, wherever that happens to be, while you sleep. The rest is "how do you respond".

A few build outlines:
Wizard 5+:
Extend Spell, Rope Trick, Gaseous Form, some cross-class ranks in survival, bat familiar.
Method: Extended Rope Trick gives you the rest you need. Gaseous Form gets you out of most sticky situations. Bat gets Blindsense, and you have Speak With Familiar at this point; Bat tells you exactly where things are, so you can run away safely. Sleep in a Rope Trick at night, invisibly, 30 feet up in the air. Gaseous Form is your go-to escape spell (or others, if you're higher than 5th - plenty of options), use Survival to find food.

Sorcerer 6+: See Wizard 5+.

Cleric 5+:
Type A: Air domain. Gaseous Form + Create Food and Water + Summon Monster III. Food's not a problem, Shelter isn't a problem (dig a hole somewhere... but you want to be active at night, and rest during the day), escape isn't a problem (gaseous form).
Type B: Travel domain. Fly + Create Food and Water + Summon Monster III; same principle, but you'll also need an edged weapon for if you need to deal with rope-based traps, and something with which to smash walls for wall-based traps. Neither of those should be difficult.

Druid 5+:
Survival for food, Speak with Animals + Summon Nature's Ally II gets you shelter (Dire Badger digger). Wildshape can get you out of most traps (turn into something for which it does not apply) as can Summon Monster.

Rogue (Any): Survival (cross-class) for food and water. Stealth skills for getting around. Sleep during the day. Escape Artist for getting out of traps, Search for avoiding them in the first place.

Barbarian (Any): Survival for food and water. Climb for getting to places where the zombies can't (for rest). Sleep during the day. Hulk smash for getting out of traps.

Bard (Any): See Rogue, although Search is cross-class. At 7th+, Gaseous Form saves you from traps. Alternately, at higher levels, see the Wizard entry (mostly).

Fighter (Any): Can't work well without magic items, lots of cross-class skills, or support from one of the other classes (Cohort?). For magic items, see the casters, assuming you've got an item that does it (generally, you can get one that does the needed stuff - Ring of Sustenence, Cape of the Monteback, Sustaining Spoon, Slippers of Spider-climbing, whatever). For cross-class skills, see the Barbarian.

Monk (Any): See Rogue, although you'll need to focus on Escape Artist, as Search is cross-class. Alternately, see Fighter.

Paladin (Any): See Fighter.

Ranger (Any): See Rogue, but Survival is a class skill. Alternately, see Fighter. At 8th+, see Druid (although you'll still need Escape Artist for getting out of things).

That's, of course, assuming generic races that need sleep, food, and water. A few relatively cheap magic items make almost any character class viable here (Ring of Sustenance, Sustaining Spoon, Cape of the Monteback, Winged Boots, Slippers of Spider Climbing, those nifty boots, and so on). A race that can get by without food or sleep just needs something to escape trouble.

You probably want to get beyond mere survival, though.... which is where everything else comes in. But everything else is what most people have been addressing.


Of course, once survival has been addressed, you can take a look at other options.

If these zombies do not have a method of breeding, then the method of reclaiming the earth is simple, if time-consuming: Kill them one at a time, over the course of time.

If they can't self-replicate, they're doomed provided there is any resistance that's even slightly effective. If they do have a method by which to replicate, you need to use extermination tactics - many of which have been mentioned. Eliminate their daytime resting territory (habitat destruction, essentially), or arrange to create a zombie-free zone which can be expanded upon (lots of minions of one kind or another - create a perimeter lethal to the zombies, and slowly expand that perimeter until the infection is fully purged). Alternately, you can just kill them faster than they can breed.

Even with that, though, there's sub-types; The Dominator (the one that builds/animates/impresses an army and beats back the zombies, ruling everything in his/her path), The Destroyer (variations on destroying the earth, and all zombies with it), The Escapist (just get out - Plane Shift elsewhere, mostly), The Leader (the one that organizes and recruits an army by free choice, leaving things nice in his wake, but otherwise acting like The Dominator), The Deliverer (as The Escapist, but focuses on getting everyone else out, rather than personal survival).

Riffington
2010-03-07, 05:18 PM
I think I'd be a druid for this, and take to the seas. Zombies can't swim (swim is a skill and they lose all skills), making them much less dangerous underwater. They also become unable to tell the difference between day and night; drag one to the surface during the day if they must die by sunlight; bite a head off if that's ok.

The goal would be to recreate some nature somewhere. Create a preserve on a coral reef, whatever. If I can manage that, I will try to save the land as well. If only the sea can be saved, I'll consider whether to slowly drown the land.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 05:22 PM
I think I'd be a druid for this, and take to the seas. Zombies can't swim (swim is a skill and they lose all skills), making them much less dangerous underwater. They also become unable to tell the difference between day and night; drag one to the surface during the day if they must die by sunlight; bite a head off if that's ok.

The goal would be to recreate some nature somewhere. Create a preserve on a coral reef, whatever. If I can manage that, I will try to save the land as well. If only the sea can be saved, I'll consider whether to slowly drown the land.

And If I send my army of awakened skeletons to raid your preserve for more corpses? And/or Onyxes?

Riffington
2010-03-07, 05:25 PM
And If I send my army of awakened skeletons to raid your preserve for more corpses? And/or Onyxes?

They'll be devoured by the superzombies on the ocean floor. Can't climb, can't swim, can eat skeletons. Right?

Volkov
2010-03-07, 05:26 PM
They'll be devoured by the superzombies on the ocean floor. Can't climb, can't swim, can eat skeletons. Right?

I counter this with boats, I'll invent Ironclad vessels and steam power to get by the lack of wood.

Riffington
2010-03-07, 05:30 PM
I counter this with boats, I'll invent Ironclad vessels and steam power to get by the lack of wood.

Are you coming on one of these boats, or just manning them with a skeleton crew?

Volkov
2010-03-07, 05:32 PM
Are you coming on one of these boats, or just manning them with a skeleton crew?

Terrible, terrible pun.....This deserves to be on TVtrope's list of incredibly lame puns.

Besides, I'd only come out if I notice the ships haven't returned. And you don't want to tangle with a evil lich cleric. Unless you are a higher level character.

Riffington
2010-03-07, 05:34 PM
Terrible, terrible pun.....This deserves to be on TVtrope's list of incredibly lame puns.

Besides, I'd only come out if I notice the ships haven't returned. And you don't want to tangle with a evil lich cleric.

Giant did it first. I couldn't help myself, it was like my fingers were moving and my brain said no, but my fingers just kept doing it anyway.
But wait: you invent a technology that you think will let metal float. You aren't sure if it works, so you send skeletons. They don't come back, so you go out yourself?

Volkov
2010-03-07, 05:36 PM
Giant did it first. I couldn't help myself, it was like my fingers were moving and my brain said no, but my fingers just kept doing it anyway.
But wait: you invent a technology that you think will let metal float. You aren't sure if it works, so you send skeletons. They don't come back, so you go out yourself?
I'd test it out first. All those points in wisdom have to count for something don't they?

Riffington
2010-03-07, 05:38 PM
I'd test it out first. All those points in wisdom have to count for something don't they?

True. I think they tell you that going out to sea will mean you're not in your element.

/I just can't help it. I think I have a problem.

Longcat
2010-03-07, 05:38 PM
Who says Zombies and Skeletons can't swim? Just use the versions from the Book of Bad Latin. Hell, we could even add in zombie pirates.

This setting gets more and more awesome by the minute.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 05:40 PM
Who says Zombies and Skeletons can't swim? Just use the versions from the Book of Bad Latin. Hell, we could even add in zombie pirates.

This setting gets more and more awesome by the minute.

Normal zombies and skeles can't swim, because they're mindless. Awakened skeles could. Awakened zombies would soak up too much water and sink any way.

Also, let's see how super zombies like judicious Flamestrike, then Firestorm spamming.

krossbow
2010-03-07, 05:42 PM
Become a paladin and Immune to disease, and Partner up with the MANY other paladins who are also immune to disease, and burn a path through the wretched hive of the world.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 05:43 PM
Become a paladin and Immune to disease, and Partner up with the MANY other paladins who are also immune to disease, and burn a path through the wretched hive of the world.

I counter with my loyal army of awakened skeletons, swordwraiths, death knights, greater mummies, mummies, mummified creatures, and other templated undead. Who will also be bashing zombie rear end.

Longcat
2010-03-07, 05:45 PM
Become a paladin and Immune to disease, and Partner up with the MANY other paladins who are also immune to disease, and burn a path through the wretched hive of the world.

As per the OP, you are automatically immune to the disease thanks to DM fiat. So no need for taking Paladin levels, especially if you don't know whether the so called superzombies are actually EVIL (as in "alignment evil").


Normal zombies and skeles can't swim, because they're mindless. Awakened skeles could. Awakened zombies would soak up too much water and sink any way.

Also, let's see how super zombies like judicious Flamestrike, then Firestorm spamming.

Could they, technically, just sink to the ground, and then walk to the other side of the sea? If so, you could just stack enough of them on top of each other, and you'll have a bridge for your other undead troops.

Or you could just make undead out of creatures with a swim speed. They get to keep their movement modes, amirite? A few undead giant tortoises should do nicely as boats.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 05:46 PM
Could they, technically, just sink to the ground, and then walk to the other side of the sea? If so, you could just stack enough of them on top of each other, and you'll have a bridge for your other undead troops.

Or you could just make undead out of creatures with a swim speed. They get to keep their movement modes, amirite? A few undead giant tortoises should do nicely as boats.

Yeah but inventing cannons, guns, ironclad vessels, and steam power is pretty damned epic.

Longcat
2010-03-07, 05:50 PM
Yeah but inventing cannons, guns, ironclad vessels, and steam power is pretty damned epic.

I wonder how the industrial revolution would be in a world were unpaid, mindless workers with no need for rest were readily available. Of course, you'd still have to deal with all those pesky Paladins demanding unions for your workforce.

Although there's few things in the world that a steampunk necromancer army couldn't handle.

Riffington
2010-03-07, 05:51 PM
Could they, technically, just sink to the ground, and then walk to the other side of the sea? If so, you could just stack enough of them on top of each other, and you'll have a bridge for your other undead troops.
Remember that they need a climb skill (no skills) to climb out of the ocean's canyons. And if you want to stack them up to fill the canyons... those are miles and miles deep.




Or you could just make undead out of creatures with a swim speed. They get to keep their movement modes, amirite? A few undead giant tortoises should do nicely as boats.

They lose the animal's swim skill. So they can move, but can't take any "special actions" or evade any hazards.

Longcat
2010-03-07, 05:54 PM
Remember that they need a climb skill (no skills) to climb out of the ocean's canyons. And if you want to stack them up to fill the canyons... those are miles and miles deep.


I wonder if there's any creature out there with both swim speed and climb speed. :smalltongue:



They lose the animal's swim skill. So they can move, but can't take any "special actions" or evade any hazards.

What hazards? They can't drown, won't freeze to death or starve, and any creature attacking them will get annihilated.

Riffington
2010-03-07, 05:58 PM
I wonder if there's any creature out there with both swim speed and climb speed. :smalltongue:

Climb speed is totally useless unless you have the climb skill.



What hazards? They can't drown, won't freeze to death or starve, and any creature attacking them will get annihilated.
Annhilated? They can't attack while swimming (no swim skill).
Any hazard (ocean current moving them to the side or dragging them down) is unavoidable. Tortoise ends up at the bottom like all the other zombies. It just moves tortoise speed once it ends up there.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 06:00 PM
And what will you do when you see a fleet of dozens of ironclad battleships? Crap your pants and run? Join me? Fight me? Some combination of the above? (however impossible it may be)

Olo Demonsbane
2010-03-07, 06:01 PM
Warforged Wizard 2/Warblade 4/Abjurant Champion 5/Sacred Exorcist 1

Cast all of your uber-abjuration buffs. Then use DMM to Persist Trollshape. Now you are immune to all damage but acid and fire, and are pretty awesome in combat nonetheless. Zombies typically don't do acid and fire damage.

I don't need to eat or sleep, and I am effectively immune to the zombies. I can go out and kill zombies all day and night.

Riffington
2010-03-07, 06:03 PM
And what will you do when you see a fleet of dozens of ironclad battleships? Crap your pants and run? Join me? Fight me? Some combination of the above? (however impossible it may be)

Figure out if you are aboard. If you are not, I will sink them all.
If you are, we will parlay: I will demand that my nature preserves be kept free of undeath or disease. A certain number of skeleton construction workers would be quite useful to me in constructing new preserves, and perhaps I might trade something for them.

Vizzerdrix
2010-03-07, 06:07 PM
I think I'd side with the druid on this one. Tell me, how would your steam ships handle several dozen huge octopi effigy critters supported by Effigy wyvern air support?

Volkov
2010-03-07, 06:12 PM
I think I'd side with the druid on this one. Tell me, how would your steam ships handle several dozen huge octopi effigy critters supported by Effigy wyvern air support?

Depth charges.

Vizzerdrix
2010-03-07, 06:14 PM
Depth charges.

schools of construct guppies the detonate them as they are dropped.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-07, 06:15 PM
I think I'd side with the druid on this one. Tell me, how would your steam ships handle several dozen huge octopi effigy critters supported by Effigy wyvern air support?

Remember he was a (maybe kobold) warlock on his side, and at level 12, a warlock can craft almost any magic item there is as long as he has the crafting feat.

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-07, 06:20 PM
Gentlemen. Please. Major Creation (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/domains.htm#creationDomain) + Eschew Material Components.

How many of you do you think I can kill with anti-osmium?

Vizzerdrix
2010-03-07, 06:52 PM
Gentlemen. Please. Major Creation (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/domains.htm#creationDomain) + Eschew Material Components.

How many of you do you think I can kill with anti-osmium?

Anti-what? :smallconfused:

Jack_Simth
2010-03-07, 06:57 PM
Anti-what? :smallconfused:

Basically star-trek antimatter, but with super-dense stuff. That's a tactic of The Destroyer, pretty much ... although he does need to add in a Contingent Teleport to get out of the blast zone.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 06:58 PM
Gentlemen. Please. Major Creation (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/divine/domains.htm#creationDomain) + Eschew Material Components.

How many of you do you think I can kill with anti-osmium?

An army of animatred skeles and freakin steam powered robots is a more awesome way to beat the zombies.

Vizzerdrix
2010-03-07, 07:06 PM
An army of animatred skeles and freakin steam powered robots is a more awesome way to beat the zombies.

.......

Agreed. Truce?

Jack_Simth
2010-03-07, 07:12 PM
An army of animatred skeles and freakin steam powered robots is a more awesome way to beat the zombies.
Yours is also one that leaves you something to work with, after. ZeroNumerous is The Destroyer, you're The Dominator. ZeroNumerous' plan WILL get rid of the zombies (right along with the ground underfoot and everything else most people care about, likely spinning the husk of the planet off into an ecliptic orbit where it alternately roasts near mercury's orbit and freezes near Jupiter... assuming he doesn't manage to blast the entire planet to scattered rubble). Yours will get rid of the zombies ... assuming you survive long enough to pull it off, assuming you can gather enough resources to pull it off, assuming that your skeletons and robots are strong enough that they're not completely overwhelmed by the zombie hordes, assuming you don't run into someone else doing the same thing who is both better at it than you and doesn't like you, and so on.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 07:15 PM
Yours is also one that leaves you something to work with, after. ZeroNumerous is The Destroyer, you're The Dominator. ZeroNumerous' plan WILL get rid of the zombies (right along with the ground underfoot and everything else most people care about, likely spinning the husk of the planet off into an ecliptic orbit where it alternately roasts near mercury's orbit and freezes near Jupiter... assuming he doesn't manage to blast the entire planet to scattered rubble). Yours will get rid of the zombies ... assuming you survive long enough to pull it off, assuming you can gather enough resources to pull it off, assuming that your skeletons and robots are strong enough that they're not completely overwhelmed by the zombie hordes, assuming you don't run into someone else doing the same thing who is both better at it than you and doesn't like you, and so on.
I'm a lich cleric, I have all the time in the universe. Not to mention, I can go clericzilla on their rear ends.

Flickerdart
2010-03-07, 07:17 PM
An army of animatred skeles and freakin steam powered robots is a more awesome way to beat the zombies.
I'd put my money on an Artificer or even Wizard inventing those things before a Cleric with 4 LA. Also, any equivalent-level character would have two spell levels on you, meaning you'd be dead, zombies or no zombies. My money's on the Druid, who has Control Wind, a spell that rules any sort of mass combat.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 07:18 PM
I'd put my money on an Artificer or even Wizard inventing those things before a Cleric with 4 LA. Also, any equivalent-level character would have two spell levels on you, meaning you'd be dead, zombies or no zombies. My money's on the Druid, who has Control Wind, a spell that rules any sort of mass combat.

Druid, meet 16 inch cannon. Plus the instant I reach epic level, it's game over for the entire universe the instant I finish the spell.

Jack_Simth
2010-03-07, 07:24 PM
I'm a lich cleric, I have all the time in the universe. Not to mention, I can go clericzilla on their rear ends.
All the time in the universe doesn't help if the resources you need to pull it off simply don't exist where you can reach them, or if the resources you need to pull it off are depleted faster than you can gather them. Besides, you don't have all the time in the universe; you've just got until something destroys your Phylactery (like, say, ZeroNumerous' plan).

Volkov
2010-03-07, 07:26 PM
All the time in the universe doesn't help if the resources you need to pull it off simply don't exist where you can reach them, or if the resources you need to pull it off are depleted faster than you can gather them. Besides, you don't have all the time in the universe; you've just got until something destroys your Phylactery (like, say, ZeroNumerous' plan).

That will be planeshifted to a hidey hole in the negative energy plane. And my plan can override his own. I can always fetch enough allies for the resources if ever truly threatend.

TheLogman
2010-03-07, 07:28 PM
If the goal is simple survival, then Shadowcaster is probably my first choice.

By mid level, he doesn't need to eat or drink, only needs to sleep an hour or so a day, and has some super useful spells.

No components, no gold needed, no spellbook, no gods. Just the shadows needed for power, and there's always a shadow around, be it your own or just simple darkness.

Spells are very multi-use, from stealth to transport to area control to blasty.

Worst case I bee-bop over to the Plane of Shadow and just live there.

Plus, mid-level Shadowcasters start casting their spells as Spell-Likes or even Supernaturals, which means no AoO, no Spell Resistance, no Dispel.

If the goal is world domination, then Wizard is the best choice IF you can get the right setup, and have the resources and time.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 07:30 PM
If the goal is simple survival, then Shadowcaster is probably my first choice.

By mid level, he doesn't need to eat or drink, only needs to sleep an hour or so a day, and has some super useful spells.

No components, no gold needed, no spellbook, no gods. Just the shadows needed for power, and there's always a shadow around, be it your own or just simple darkness.

Spells are very multi-use, from stealth to transport to area control to blasty.

Worst case I bee-bop over to the Plane of Shadow and just live there.

Plus, mid-level Shadowcasters start casting their spells as Spell-Likes or even Supernaturals, which means no AoO, no Spell Resistance, no Dispel.

If the goal is world domination, then Wizard is the best choice IF you can get the right setup, and have the resources and time.
If I offered you a place in my universal order, would you accept? That is, you get some people to lord over when I use my epic spell to permanently mind control everyone and everything in the universe.

Flickerdart
2010-03-07, 07:34 PM
Druid, meet 16 inch cannon. Plus the instant I reach epic level, it's game over for the entire universe the instant I finish the spell.
It's impossible, by the rules, to use ranged siege weapons in a Hurricane or Tornado, which a primitive cannon would certainly qualify as. You'd have to be Gargantuan to remain standing, and anything Large or smaller flies away, which could very well include your artillery. Hurricane-force winds also sink most ships. The Druid can do this by 9th level. Any sort of "when I hit Epic" considerations are moot because everybody else has a 4-level gain on you.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 07:35 PM
It's impossible, by the rules, to use ranged siege weapons in a Hurricane or Tornado. You'd have to be Gargantuan to remain standing, and anything Large or smaller flies away. Hurricane-force winds also sink most ships. The Druid can do this by 9th level. Any sort of "when I hit Epic" considerations are moot because everybody else has a 4-level gain on you.
I gather up every remaining human I can and sacrifice them for the XP in their souls.

Jack_Simth
2010-03-07, 07:52 PM
That will be planeshifted to a hidey hole in the negative energy plane. And my plan can override his own. I can always fetch enough allies for the resources if ever truly threatend.
1) How does your plan override his own? He just nukes everything. You need all that pesky "everything" there to strip-mine.
2) You'll first need to properly secure that section of the negative energy plane in order to prevent your phylactery from getting eaten by a wandering monster.
3) Are you sure you can get actual allies when your ultimate, declared plan is to subjugate everyone's minds?


If I offered you a place in my universal order, would you accept? That is, you get some people to lord over when I use my epic spell to permanently mind control everyone and everything in the universe.
If you're mind controlling everyone and everything in the universe, wouldn't that mean it doesn't matter anymore, as you control him either way? Besides, as Flickerdart noted, you're behind on progression due to heavy LA.

I gather up every remaining human I can and sacrifice them for the XP in their souls.
Oh, hey - an undefined: How many humans remain? "Do the resources exist?" - one of those pesky assumptions in your plan. Likewise, can you get them? After all, you're currently soaking +4 LA at the start of this... and even that is using the highest end anyone in this thread has posited as "mid level" - there's no particular reason you're necessarily a more effective character. Unless, of course, your plan is to go to another plane, and steal people from there... which would kinda make you a death from beyond the veil, and subject to adventurers.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 07:57 PM
1) How does your plan override his own? He just nukes everything. You need all that pesky "everything" there to strip-mine.
2) You'll first need to properly secure that section of the negative energy plane in order to prevent your phylactery from getting eaten by a wandering monster.
3) Are you sure you can get actual allies when your ultimate, declared plan is to subjugate everyone's minds?


If you're mind controlling everyone and everything in the universe, wouldn't that mean it doesn't matter anymore, as you control him either way? Besides, as Flickerdart noted, you're behind on progression due to heavy LA.

Oh, hey - an undefined: How many humans remain? "Do the resources exist?" - one of those pesky assumptions in your plan. Likewise, can you get them? After all, you're currently soaking +4 LA at the start of this... and even that is using the highest end anyone in this thread has posited as "mid level" - there's no particular reason you're necessarily a more effective character. Unless, of course, your plan is to go to another plane, and steal people from there... which would kinda make you a death from beyond the veil, and subject to adventurers.

For robots I can always get iron from the elemental plane of earth. For souls, there is the plane of shadow.

The Glyphstone
2010-03-07, 08:00 PM
Where are you going to get souls on the plane of shadow? If anything, find devourers on the Negative Energy Plane and steal the ones they've collected...somehow.

Volkov
2010-03-07, 08:13 PM
Where are you going to get souls on the plane of shadow? If anything, find devourers on the Negative Energy Plane and steal the ones they've collected...somehow.

Or use diplomacy cheese to get them to give them up.

Slayn82
2010-03-07, 08:22 PM
Volkov, as a Diviner or Artificer with divinations, i would probably perceive your plans for Cosmic Mind Control probably a lot earlier than most. That would be mostly intolerable.

Given the greater menace, i would probably work with you in a few enemy mine situations, and keep neutral most of the time. In my book, you could get any cow, elephant or whathever as a zombie, but zombifying living inteligent specimens would be wrong.

The raising of dead inteligent specimens would be allright - proper burial and eternal rest would be luxuries that the living probably could not afford to the dead in those times.

Now, if we are going "industrial revolution" route, Wall of Fire (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=7493690#post7493690) spell - powered engines absurdly powerfull at energy generation. With gate rings to allow the transfer of the energy remotelly throught a system of mechanical axis, and ill counter enemies with my own GIANT MECHA, with mechanized rapid firing crossbows. As long as the druids don't rust them into oblivion.

TheLogman
2010-03-07, 09:16 PM
The Plane of Shadow doesn't contain souls.

It's a transient plane, much like the Astral or Ethereal plane.

It contains twisted shadow versions of pretty much everything in the Material Plane, and is connected to the Material plane at points of shadow (See the spell Shadow Walk).

So, you know, I'll just find someplace nice to settle down, with some loyal shadow beasts or something, live an easy and convenient existence.

Also Volkov, not interested. In fact, if we're really going to combat/competition route, I'll go Noctumancer, it's the Mystic Thurge of Shadow Magic/Wizardry.

Enhanced spellcasting, awesome shadowprogression, and the most important part is that the Noctumancer is the greatest counterspeller ever. Auras and abilities that severely weaken other casters' spells, the ability to counterspell as an immediate action, the ability to counterspell with any spell, spell-like, or mystery as long as it matches the level of the spell you're countering, and the sweet ability to absorb the spells you counter to enhance your own casting.

With the right feat choices, I could get into Noctumancer at 6th level or so, and I'd have a significant number of mysteries and spells to fuel counterspelling, and a handful of my own mindcontrols or save or dies to pull, and the synergy with counterspelling makes them much harder to resist.

DragonBaneDM
2010-03-08, 12:38 AM
I am the Prince of Bel Air!

You Zombies shall let me down here at once! Lest my dog named Samantha biteth thee!

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-08, 01:02 AM
ZeroNumerous is The Destroyer, you're The Dominator. ZeroNumerous' plan WILL get rid of the zombies (right along with the ground underfoot and everything else most people care about, likely spinning the husk of the planet off into an ecliptic orbit where it alternately roasts near mercury's orbit and freezes near Jupiter... assuming he doesn't manage to blast the entire planet to scattered rubble).

Actually I escaped to the Astral Plane first. So my basic plan would be to Plane Shift to the Ethereal Plane(no matter to interact with) then Major Create some anti-osmium. Finally I'd Plane Shifted the anti-osmium back to my planet just to be sure nothing could follow me.


That will be planeshifted to a hidey hole in the negative energy plane. And my plan can override his own. I can always fetch enough allies for the resources if ever truly threatend.

Actually, my plan just nukes the entire planet. That's it. It's gone. Nothing to salvage, nothing to save, nothing to rule and no zombies(or otherwise) to kill. The whole world is, for all intents and purposes, destroyed.

However, given that I can Plane Shift I won't care as I'll be far too busy hanging out in Sigil or the Astral Plane.

Amiel
2010-03-08, 05:52 AM
A few points; some of these could cause you rethink your strategies.

The super zombies, as hinted at in the OP and in a subsequent post, are not undead but aberrations; they simply mimic the forms and affectation. Hence, they cannot be turned, cannot be rebuked.
They should be at least 4 to 5 CRs above you; so, if you're 14th, they should be 18th or even 19th.

Regarding the lich trick; you need to be at least 11th level to even think of attempting to become a lich. In addition, you must also supply 120,000 gp and 4,800 XP to the creation of your phylactery; for this, you need the Craft Wondrous Item feat.
The lich template also forces a +4 LA and +2 CR upon your character; this may, incidently, cause you to overshoot the written level.

On mid-level characters, sure, here's the narrow down; I was thinking of numbers between ~10 thereabouts; give or take four on either side, so 6th to 14th level, with leanings to/preference for the latter; certainly, the case may be made for the inclusion of 15th level, but you are approaching the upper ceiling of CR.

On being clerics, there are no gods to commune with; with no faith, you are essentially shut off from spells. Additionally, the crushing despair, loneliness, depression (also per the OP), you feel may cause you to lose all faith in the concept of belief.

On the prevalence of magic; the "super zombies" have essentially gouged themselves upon powerful items (per the OP), so much so that magic items are hard to obtain and this magic deadening effect creates a spell "gravity" well.
Magic does not function properly in this setting; it could backfire upon you, it could fizzle and function at half strength or it could not work at all.
What happens when your attempted teleportation spell transports you into a concrete wall?

On monsters and such in this setting, there are none, the super zombies have consumed them all. This has caused them to evolve into the horrific forms they are. This is why they are at such a high CR.

On materials within the setting; everything (most everything) is derelict (per the OP). Even if you are able to uncover salvageable materials, you need to find a way to restore them to working condition, otherwise you are looking at objects that are heavily corroded, nearly completely unusable or worse.

On surviving in the shadows, who do you think lurks behind darkened gloom? ;)

No cheese please. I may be lactose tolerant, but it's giving me indigestion.



FlamingKobold; Nope, go ahead. I'll make one myself, but time seems to be an issue. Be sure to link it back to this thread. Have fun! :)

lord_khaine
2010-03-08, 06:32 AM
Gentlemen. Please. Major Creation + Eschew Material Components.

How many of you do you think I can kill with anti-osmium?

Hmm, i would estimate a total of 0 kills, since major creation creates matter, not antimatter.

Well, i would bet my survival on a Psion (or Erudite) Warforget.

The race fixes the need for sleep and food, and it also gives you the needet lifespan to bring the plans into motion.

With metamorphis you can disguise yourself as a object, keeping you pretty save at night, where you can also observe the comming and going of the zombies.

Then with enough Quintecence i will make traps of it, to cach the zombies outside of time, making sure i have enough time to reseach a cure.

greenknight
2010-03-08, 07:08 AM
Warforged Artificer for me, and I'll only need to be 11th level. At that point, just before morning I can go out and Wall of Force a few zombies, trapping them for some juicy XP each day. I can also make all the friends and magical items I want, and my trap making/finding skills should be far better than any zombie's.

Longcat
2010-03-08, 07:19 AM
Ok, so no divine spellcasting, and magic in general fizzles. This leaves us with psionics. Therefore, Spell-to-Power Erudite, with either Elan or Warforged as the race. Probably Warforged, since Marvin the depressed robot is awesome.:smallbiggrin:
Defeating a non-caster of CR+5 shouldn't be any challenge, therefore leveling is fairly easy. Since the superzombies are confirmed to be non-undead, I can use their corpses to bolster my troops. With enough of those, I can eventually conquer the planet.
Then, I throw a coin: If heads, I'll genesis my way out of there, and nuke the old place. If tails, I'll stay and rule the world. If, for some reason, the coin lands on its side, I will develop a cure, turn the zombies back into whatever they were before, and repopulate the planet. After ascending to divinity, mind you.

Volkov
2010-03-08, 08:01 AM
A few points; some of these could cause you rethink your strategies.

The super zombies, as hinted at in the OP and in a subsequent post, are not undead but aberrations; they simply mimic the forms and affectation. Hence, they cannot be turned, cannot be rebuked.
They should be at least 4 to 5 CRs above you; so, if you're 14th, they should be 18th or even 19th.

Regarding the lich trick; you need to be at least 11th level to even think of attempting to become a lich. In addition, you must also supply 120,000 gp and 4,800 XP to the creation of your phylactery; for this, you need the Craft Wondrous Item feat.
The lich template also forces a +4 LA and +2 CR upon your character; this may, incidently, cause you to overshoot the written level.

On mid-level characters, sure, here's the narrow down; I was thinking of numbers between ~10 thereabouts; give or take four on either side, so 6th to 14th level, with leanings to/preference for the latter; certainly, the case may be made for the inclusion of 15th level, but you are approaching the upper ceiling of CR.

On being clerics, there are no gods to commune with; with no faith, you are essentially shut off from spells. Additionally, the crushing despair, loneliness, depression (also per the OP), you feel may cause you to lose all faith in the concept of belief.

On the prevalence of magic; the "super zombies" have essentially gouged themselves upon powerful items (per the OP), so much so that magic items are hard to obtain and this magic deadening effect creates a spell "gravity" well.
Magic does not function properly in this setting; it could backfire upon you, it could fizzle and function at half strength or it could not work at all.
What happens when your attempted teleportation spell transports you into a concrete wall?

On monsters and such in this setting, there are none, the super zombies have consumed them all. This has caused them to evolve into the horrific forms they are. This is why they are at such a high CR.

On materials within the setting; everything (most everything) is derelict (per the OP). Even if you are able to uncover salvageable materials, you need to find a way to restore them to working condition, otherwise you are looking at objects that are heavily corroded, nearly completely unusable or worse.

On surviving in the shadows, who do you think lurks behind darkened gloom? ;)

No cheese please. I may be lactose tolerant, but it's giving me indigestion.



FlamingKobold; Nope, go ahead. I'll make one myself, but time seems to be an issue. Be sure to link it back to this thread. Have fun! :)
I don't need gods, I just need a really strong belief. And he said they might be abberations. Also, I can buy off one point of LA.

Jack_Simth
2010-03-08, 08:03 AM
A few points; some of these could cause you rethink your strategies.

Let's see... no clerics, magic is exceedingly chancy. Opponents are WAY out of your league, so no melee characters can work. Oh yes, and hiding isn't an option, so skillmonkeys are also toast. Oh, and the DM causes the pseudo-zombies to spontaneously develop new abilities as needed to kill things. And just to round things off, "no cheese".

This isn't so much a campaign setting as it is an exercise in the DM killing all players (which is sometimes a genre; but for that, you want All Flesh Must Be Eaten or maybe Call of Cthulu).

Flickerdart
2010-03-08, 08:06 AM
Warforged Artificer for me, and I'll only need to be 11th level. At that point, just before morning I can go out and Wall of Force a few zombies, trapping them for some juicy XP each day. I can also make all the friends and magical items I want, and my trap making/finding skills should be far better than any zombie's.
Wall of Force doesn't work nearly long enough. I've suggested the Instantaneous Wall of Iron spell instead. Wall of Ice will do in a pinch.

Volkov
2010-03-08, 12:25 PM
How many times must I remind you, clerics don't need gods, really strong faith to a cause, ideal, thing, or even one's self can work. And as I was a lich before the apocalypse with a good sized cult to my ideal, I don't need to worry about resources, and I can establish a soul farm, farming rapid breeding creatures like goblins to eat their souls for the ten xp. My undead will build walls to block the enemy and will research technology for the industrial revolution, mining the plane of earth and capturing more survivors forn the farms, which will be masqueraded as play houses to trick gullible survivors into entering. Soon I will build an large enough army of steampunk robots will overwhelm the zombies.

I will grow mushrooms, which can grow more or less anywhere, to feed my soul farm captives, and get water from the plane of water. Or just make it. Once I have enough followers, I shall convince them to worship me as a god, which will turn me into a deity.

Quirp
2010-03-08, 02:10 PM
Is the VoP Monkadin considered cheese or not?

If not I want to be one.
And then I start running.

Slayn82
2010-03-08, 02:27 PM
@Volkov: that plan of yours is disturbing on so many levels. Slavery, soul harvesting, ritual killing, then mass undead raising, plans to become an undead god.:smalleek: at this point, i figure it would make more sense to leave the world to the abominations crawling around.

But fortunatelly for all of us, i would not put much faith in your side's Craft: Engineering skills.

Funny enought, there would be plenty of resources around. And reclaiming them would probably involve the side that could make more Magic items or more craft tests. Artificer's homunculi are golden them.

Volkov
2010-03-08, 03:43 PM
@Volkov: that plan of yours is disturbing on so many levels. Slavery, soul harvesting, ritual killing, then mass undead raising, plans to become an undead god.:smalleek: at this point, i figure it would make more sense to leave the world to the abominations crawling around.

But fortunatelly for all of us, i would not put much faith in your side's Craft: Engineering skills.

Funny enought, there would be plenty of resources around. And reclaiming them would probably involve the side that could make more Magic items or more craft tests. Artificer's homunculi are golden them.

Thank you, the fact that my sympathies have almost always have been to the bad guys and my intense study of them let's me really think like one. I am especially good at complete monsters.

I can leave the engineering to an necropolitan artificer cohort and a awakened skeleton artificer minion.

Touchy
2010-03-08, 04:20 PM
On being clerics, there are no gods to commune with; with no faith, you are essentially shut off from spells. Additionally, the crushing despair, loneliness, depression (also per the OP), you feel may cause you to lose all faith in the concept of belief.
Simple, I am a lawful stupid cleric of belief, the said belief is my law.
I believe I will win, because I believe I am the law. I will enforce the law with all my belief.
Naturally, someone must take control of a settlement. I will believe myself to be the most qualified to lead, my single-minded fury will not stop until I am in control. I will defend my followers, and have them believe the law will defend them, as long as they follow the law. They may fear me, but for the law to work you need to know not to defy it. I shall train other's in my divine knowledge of the law. My law will be strict, but my law is as my love, harsh. I believe these creature's to be of chaos, Chaos in all forms is my enemy. I will raise the youth in this ideal, I will raise them to learn to respect the law, I will shall show them the divine fury of the law. I shall allow other's to enter the domain, and leave as they whim, as long as they are following the law. The law is not good or evil, the law is both a sword and a shield. It will smite those that defy it and defend those who follow it.
(This detailed enough or shall I go on?)

If this get's big enough then an actual deity will form as well. A lawful neutral deity of law. His symbol would be a shield and a sword.

Besides, if I lost all hope then I might as well kill myself, there would be no point in living at all. If all gods are gone and the world sucks so much I might as well remove myself from existence.

Also inb4psionicsarebanned.

chiasaur11
2010-03-08, 04:26 PM
Simple, I am a lawful stupid cleric of belief, the said belief is my law.
I believe I will win, because I believe I am the law. I will enforce the law with all my belief.

Great, now I'm seeing that picture of Judge Dredd punching Judge Fear's face in.

As for me?

1D2 crusader.

One punch.

Touchy
2010-03-08, 04:31 PM
Also rereading the first post.

Are you asking us what would we do if we were reenacting "I am Legend" in Dnd?

greenknight
2010-03-08, 04:47 PM
Wall of Force doesn't work nearly long enough. I've suggested the Instantaneous Wall of Iron spell instead. Wall of Ice will do in a pinch.

An 11th level Artificer can use a Wall of Force Infusion, but Wall of Iron is 3 levels away (14th level). He could use a Wall of Stone instead, if duration really becomes an issue, but that allows a Reflex save. And he could also use any of the magical items he could have created, but that would cost some XP, so I'm holding that in reserve.

Assuming this character has an Int score of 20+ (not unreasonable, IMO, since he/she/it can also create magical items and should have created an Int booster by now), that's 2 5th level Infusions, which works out to be a delay of 22 rounds. Depending on how quickly these creatures can move, that represents somewhere between 330 feet and over 3,500 feet. Assuming they have a base 30' move and can at least hustle, it represents 1,320 feet. Assuming these are creatures who have literally left it to the last minute to get into hiding, that's enough to finish them off when the sun comes out.

But what if they go to their hiding places well before that - say an hour or so in advance? Well, he's an Artificer - he's got plenty of skill points, Craft is on his skill list, and he's got a very high Int score. He can almost certainly craft better traps than anyone else, and he can just create deadly traps. Lots and lots of them. They don't even need to be especially deadly, since all they need to do is hold the creatures until the sun comes up. So he can lure his foes into those traps just before they go into hiding, and once again collect that XP in the morning. That has the added bonus of being able to ignore the magical failure problem (which I'm mostly ignoring, I admit), although the artificer could finish the trap off with a Wall of Stone to seal the deal.

And by RAW, all he really needs (in addition to XP) for most of his magical item construction is gold, which should be plentiful since it doesn't rust and no one else should have much use for it. The city's destruction would actually help here, since most of the vaults containing the vast stores of gold such cities would have would be destroyed, along with their protections. Given how much XP he'll be gaining by single handedly defeating those much higher CR monsters each day, he can level up and make as many magical items as he wants. Pretty soon, he'll be 20th level and able to create any non-artifact item.

And the lack of Clerics won't worry him at all. He can heal himself through his infusions, and if he needs any spell on the Cleric spell list, he can just create a magical item for it (scroll or wand, probably). WotC ruled that his scrolls are neither Divine nor Arcane, so even if you rule that a Divine being is needed to power Cleric scrolls, he's fine.

Volkov
2010-03-08, 04:48 PM
Simple, I am a lawful stupid cleric of belief, the said belief is my law.
I believe I will win, because I believe I am the law. I will enforce the law with all my belief.
Naturally, someone must take control of a settlement. I will believe myself to be the most qualified to lead, my single-minded fury will not stop until I am in control. I will defend my followers, and have them believe the law will defend them, as long as they follow the law. They may fear me, but for the law to work you need to know not to defy it. I shall train other's in my divine knowledge of the law. My law will be strict, but my law is as my love, harsh. I believe these creature's to be of chaos, Chaos in all forms is my enemy. I will raise the youth in this ideal, I will raise them to learn to respect the law, I will shall show them the divine fury of the law. I shall allow other's to enter the domain, and leave as they whim, as long as they are following the law. The law is not good or evil, the law is both a sword and a shield. It will smite those that defy it and defend those who follow it.
(This detailed enough or shall I go on?)

If this get's big enough then an actual deity will form as well. A lawful neutral deity of law. His symbol would be a shield and a sword.

Besides, if I lost all hope then I might as well kill myself, there would be no point in living at all. If all gods are gone and the world sucks so much I might as well remove myself from existence.

Also inb4psionicsarebanned.
Will you support my lawful evilness or work against it? Besides, my plan has faster Xp gain if I can get enough goblins, or better yet myconoids (those mushroom men from the MM2) who reproduce and mature at huge speeds. I will have a steady supply of souls to harvest and soon, enough worshippers to make me a god....of something. Probably of undeath, law, evil, bones, fungi, death, and industry.

Touchy
2010-03-08, 05:12 PM
Will you support my lawful evilness or work against it? Besides, my plan has faster Xp gain if I can get enough goblins, or better yet myconoids (those mushroom men from the MM2) who reproduce and mature at huge speeds. I will have a steady supply of souls to harvest and soon, enough worshippers to make me a god....of something. Probably of undeath, law, evil, bones, fungi, death, and industry.

The difference between you and me is mindless undead. My law has no prejudice against those who do not break the law, the only prejudice is against those who break the law. So I would likedemand my citizen's unharmed, but those who break the law are you'res for the picking. We also do not have use for those pseudo-zombies. Which I can offer for you in trade of self-defense.

Alternatively, we split the land 50/50 and deal with each other when the "Undead" problem is over. After which we break into warfare for control of the land.
Breaking this compromise is punishable by death. Or in the case of Undead, destruction of the body and soul, and personal belongings(Aka, you're phylactery). In either compromise you are not above the law in my land.
Do we have a deal?

Volkov
2010-03-08, 05:18 PM
The difference between you and me is mindless undead. My law has no prejudice against those who do not break the law, the only prejudice is against those who break the law. So I would likedemand my citizen's unharmed, but those who break the law are you'res for the picking. We also do not have use for those pseudo-zombies. Which I can offer for you in trade of self-defense.

Alternatively, we split the land 50/50 and deal with each other when the "Undead" problem is over. After which we break into warfare for control of the land.
Breaking this compromise is punishable by death. Or in the case of Undead, destruction of the body and soul, and personal belongings(Aka, you're phylactery). In either compromise you are not above the law in my land.
Do we have a deal?

Then we shall have the lattter deal, as my phylatcery is hidden deep in a well guarded fortress deep in the negative energy plane, it should be safe from you, the living zombies, and pesky wandering monsters.

Touchy
2010-03-08, 05:27 PM
Then we shall have the lattter deal, as my phylatcery is hidden deep in a well guarded fortress deep in the negative energy plane, it should be safe from you, the living zombies, and pesky wandering monsters.

Very well, Now I must cast Quest on both of us, as is the default form of legal binding.(Note, no gods, no miracles)Dictated under section 537, article 33 of the Great Tome of Law.

In more challenge terms, now that an alliance has formed, We have two divine caster's who both have reasons that subvert you're ruling on faith, we both have no chance of arcane spell failure. He has legions of undead, and I have an army of low-level clerics that all have at-least the law domain, and one other domain that does not violate the law.

Longcat
2010-03-08, 05:31 PM
Can I have the movie rights for this campaign?

I mean, seriously, who wouldn't pay to see steampunk necromancers, druids, robot artificers and Judge Dredd facing off in a Fallout/Mad Max/I am Legend setting filled with zombies? The original movie would have been so much better with you guys as the main cast. :smallbiggrin:

Volkov
2010-03-08, 05:33 PM
Can I have the movie rights for this campaign?

I mean, seriously, who wouldn't pay to see steampunk necromancers, druids, robot artificers and Judge Dredd facing off in a Fallout/Mad Max/I am Legend setting filled with zombies? The original movie would have been so much better with you guys as the main cast. :smallbiggrin:

Don't forget the killer goombas under my command.

Touchy
2010-03-08, 05:40 PM
Can I have the movie rights for this campaign?

I mean, seriously, who wouldn't pay to see steampunk necromancers, druids, robot artificers and Judge Dredd facing off in a Fallout/Mad Max/I am Legend setting filled with zombies? The original movie would have been so much better with you guys as the main cast. :smallbiggrin:

I would pay good money to see that movie.

Remember, we are still flexible enough to move on if he changes.

Volkov
2010-03-08, 05:47 PM
Killer goombas? Check.
Goblins? Check.
Liches? Check
Hollywood style zombies? Check.
D&D style zombies? Check.
Skeleton men? Check.
Druids? Check.
Steampunk? Check.
Mad max style? Check.
Judge Dredd? Check.
Fragging robots? Checked with a capital C.

Awesome? Hell **** yes.

Tinydwarfman
2010-03-08, 05:56 PM
I'd be a Planar Shepherd of Dal Quor with a reasonably large guard of (hellfire)Warlocks. No number of zombies would ever reach me!

Now I just have to figure out how to legally get 15 warlocks accompanying me at all times...

Volkov
2010-03-08, 06:25 PM
I'd be a Planar Shepherd of Dal Quor with a reasonably large guard of (hellfire)Warlocks. No number of zombies would ever reach me!

Now I just have to figure out how to legally get 15 warlocks accompanying me at all times...

Firespitting warlocks and a planar shepherd? Now all we need is several tens to hundreds of millions of dollars, some good voice actors for the CGI only people, some good actors for the humans, a CGI team and a skilled director and we got ourselves a kick ass movie.

Longcat
2010-03-08, 07:06 PM
Firespitting warlocks and a planar shepherd? Now all we need is several tens to hundreds of millions of dollars, some good voice actors for the CGI only people, some good actors for the humans, a CGI team and a skilled director and we got ourselves a kick ass movie.

If only we had the money to pull this off...

Slayn82
2010-03-08, 07:15 PM
Looks more like an RTS game to me.

Acero
2010-03-08, 07:19 PM
Ranger.
Favored enemy: Undead
Favored enviorment: Wasteland.
High search

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-08, 07:21 PM
On being clerics, there are no gods to commune with; with no faith, you are essentially shut off from spells. Additionally, the crushing despair, loneliness, depression (also per the OP), you feel may cause you to lose all faith in the concept of belief.

You can worship an ideal and still get spells.

In this scenario, I'd worship the Glory of Blowing S*** Up. And as everyone knows, destruction leads to the possibility of more Creation. As such, I have the Glory and Creation domains. Given that I worship no god, the lack of gods has no effect on me. Finally: My build requires nothing but 9 levels of Cleric and one feat.

Alternatively: A Nomad 9 does just fine due to Psionic Major Creation (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/majorCreationPsionic.htm) and Teleport Trigger (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/teleportTrigger.htm).

Longcat
2010-03-08, 07:26 PM
Ranger.
Favored enemy: Undead
Favored enviorment: Wasteland.
High search

Unfortunately, the OP stated that the superzombies aren't actually undead. Unless of course you wish to fight our resident necromancer.


Looks more like an RTS game to me.

You're right, we could build an entire franchise!

Touchy
2010-03-08, 07:33 PM
Unfortunately, the OP stated that the superzombies aren't actually undead. Unless of course you wish to fight our resident necromancer.

Under Article 33 Section 6465, "Attack of our allies is against the law, even if not in our boundarys." Attacking said necromancer is against the law, as upholder of said law, I will be forced to deal with you in all way's normal criminal's shall be dealt with.

Death.

Eldonauran
2010-03-08, 07:49 PM
Start with Magic of Incarnum and let your imagination run wild.

If I couldn't use Incarnum, I would probably be running around with Whisper Gnome with the Bone Creature Template applied, dipping into Dragon Shaman for an aura or two and then some Warlock.

That is, if we are just talking about survival. Its all about what you can do in a pinch.

greenknight
2010-03-09, 03:12 AM
Under Article 33 Section 6465, "Attack of our allies is against the law, even if not in our boundarys."

But said necromancer isn't my ally, and I need the XP for my magical items! You just can't run a couple of dozen Dedicated Wrights without it. And it's not really my fault if his undead wander into my brilliantly made traps...

lord_khaine
2010-03-09, 03:40 AM
It seems my first task wont be to research a zombie cure, but to capture all those undead-spawning madmen, and imprison them outside of time.

Volkov
2010-03-09, 07:00 AM
It seems my first task wont be to research a zombie cure, but to capture all those undead-spawning madmen, and imprison them outside of time.

What, it's not if my Soul harvesting farms is immoral or anything. It's perfectly moral to raise innocent creatures for the sole purpose of devouring their souls for the XP and having the rest worship me as a god to make me ascend to godhood. In a year or two, my harvesting operations would have granted me many levels and godhood. I would then crush the zombies underfoot with judicious usage of the alter reality salient divine ability. And my awe inspiring presence would make other survivors worship me, until I become the head of the new universal pantheon. I'd also let loose an vast army of Devils and Yugoloths under my command onto the Material plane after becoming a god, and let loose a cackling laugh as they tear apart the zombie horde with ruthless efficiency.

Now all we need is a doom marine and dukem nukem. And Especially WAZZDAKKA GUTSMEG WAAAAGH!!!!!! He drives his enormous bike armed with four automatic TANK cannons up a cliff and into a warlord titan's head to punch out the crew himself and succeeded. Now that is badass.

Touchy
2010-03-09, 07:29 AM
But said necromancer isn't my ally, and I need the XP for my magical items! You just can't run a couple of dozen Dedicated Wrights without it. And it's not really my fault if his undead wander into my brilliantly made traps...

The law is blind to such things, the law does not care. However, you're point is considered in the law. According to my accountant they were considered an ally, however from my nightly reviewing of the law I see you have a point, they are considered neutral to us, do not worry, as the offender is being arrested as we speak.

Carry on citizen.

greenknight
2010-03-09, 04:43 PM
What, it's not if my Soul harvesting farms is immoral or anything. It's perfectly moral to raise innocent creatures for the sole purpose of devouring their souls for the XP and having the rest worship me as a god to make me ascend to godhood. In a year or two, my harvesting operations would have granted me many levels and godhood.

A year or two? You slowpoke! By then my Furtive Filchers would have recovered every available gold piece on the continent, and my Dedicated Wrights would have made a mountain of magical items.


I would then crush the zombies underfoot with judicious usage of the alter reality salient divine ability. And my awe inspiring presence would make other survivors worship me, until I become the head of the new universal pantheon. I'd also let loose an vast army of Devils and Yugoloths under my command onto the Material plane after becoming a god, and let loose a cackling laugh as they tear apart the zombie horde with ruthless efficiency.

That would be a little irritating - I need peace and quiet to make my masterpieces, and all these things you're unleashing might prove to be a nuisance during the daylight hours I work. Sure, I could do with a bit more XP, but the abominations are easier for me to kill and I get plenty of XP from them already. I think I might just loan lord_khaine a few of my lesser creations just to keep you busy while I work on more important things...

Volkov
2010-03-09, 04:47 PM
A year or two? You slowpoke! By then my Furtive Filchers would have recovered every available gold piece on the continent, and my Dedicated Wrights would have made a mountain of magical items.



That would be a little irritating - I need peace and quiet to make my masterpieces, and all these things you're unleashing might prove to be a nuisance during the daylight hours I work. Sure, I could do with a bit more XP, but the abominations are easier for me to kill and I get plenty of XP from them already. I think I might just loan lord_khaine a few of my lesser creations just to keep you busy while I work on more important things...

Alter reality, your creations are mine.

greenknight
2010-03-09, 05:45 PM
Alter reality, your creations are mine.

Alter Reality (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Alter_Reality_%28Divine_Ability%29) doesn't work that way. And if it did, I'm accessing Wishes and Miracles at 15th level (thanks to my scrolls), so I can probably do something along those lines much more quickly than you can. Maybe just Wish that all those people worship me instead of you and become a God myself.

And remember, my scrolls aren't divine in nature, so the lack of Gods doesn't worry me at all. I still have everyone's spell list - Cleric, Druid, Wizard, Ranger, Paladin, you name it. And soon enough, I can make just about any non-artifact magical item too.

Mind you, I think it might be time to make use of that Disrupting Weapon infusion I've been playing with. How many HD did you say you had? :smallbiggrin:

Volkov
2010-03-09, 06:01 PM
Alter Reality (http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Alter_Reality_%28Divine_Ability%29) doesn't work that way. And if it did, I'm accessing Wishes and Miracles at 15th level (thanks to my scrolls), so I can probably do something along those lines much more quickly than you can. Maybe just Wish that all those people worship me instead of you and become a God myself.

And remember, my scrolls aren't divine in nature, so the lack of Gods doesn't worry me at all. I still have everyone's spell list - Cleric, Druid, Wizard, Ranger, Paladin, you name it. And soon enough, I can make just about any non-artifact magical item too.

Mind you, I think it might be time to make use of that Disrupting Weapon infusion I've been playing with. How many HD did you say you had? :smallbiggrin:

Alter reality is more powerful than wish or miracle by a good deal. (Can replicate spells of up to ninth level vs only sixth level spells universally.)

greenknight
2010-03-09, 06:35 PM
Alter reality is more powerful than wish or miracle by a good deal. (Can replicate spells of up to ninth level vs only sixth level spells universally.)

Which is the same thing I can do at 15th level, although with slightly more trouble. Nothing a couple of dozen Dedicated Wrights can't deal with though. But once you start irritating me, I doubt you'll survive long enough to attain godhood, since I have access to every Divination spell and I have literally inhuman search skills.

Volkov
2010-03-09, 06:36 PM
Which is the same thing I can do at 15th level, although with slightly more trouble. Nothing a couple of dozen Dedicated Wrights can't deal with though. But once you start irritating me, I doubt you'll survive long enough to attain godhood, since I have access to every Divination spell and I have literally inhuman search skills.

But why oppose me? When we could work together and establish a new universal order? I'd leave you alone and help you set up your own soul farm. In addition, I'd give you added defense against the zombies with armies of skeletons and robots. Heck, my artificer minion and cohort could share plans with you.

Combined with me, a warlock, another artificer, and the lawful stupid guy, we could not only rule the universe, but rule the entire D&D multiverse, every setting would be under our command.

greenknight
2010-03-09, 06:47 PM
But why oppose me?

Your zombies irritate my Furtive Filchers, and I need them to collect my raw materials.


Heck, my artificer minion and cohort could share plans with you.

You have an artificer as a cohort/minion? That's like a flea having a God for a servant. This is an insult to my entire Craft. Terminator mode ACTIVATED!


Combined with me, and the lawful stupid guy, we could not only rule the universe, but rule the entire D&D multiverse, every setting would be under our command.

I have no wish to rule - it takes too much time which I could spend on my magnificent creations. I leave such petty tasks to those who can find no better use for their time.

Volkov
2010-03-09, 07:30 PM
Your zombies irritate my Furtive Filchers, and I need them to collect my raw materials.



You have an artificer as a cohort/minion? That's like a flea having a God for a servant. This is an insult to my entire Craft. Terminator mode ACTIVATED!



I have no wish to rule - it takes too much time which I could spend on my magnificent creations. I leave such petty tasks to those who can find no better use for their time.
A cleric is a tier one class for a reason. Plus, aren't artificers below wizards and clerics in the tier one subtier?

Cohort AND Minion, you can have both. I could make you a god of craft, which would let you make artifacts. Plus, the soul farm could cover the expenses of item making, even if it makes you irredeemably evil.

Desmond Tiny
2010-03-09, 07:30 PM
I would probably be a hellfire warlock with major devil bloodline which does does not increase character level. I could fly at will, create my own undead if necessary, and deal absurd amounts of damage. I would obviously take a one level dip into binder to negate the constitution damage. I would make alliances with anyone I could. I would join forces with the previously formed Volkov alliance on the condition that I get to be leutenant and do not get dominated. I would also be happy being an enforcer of your laws.

Volkov
2010-03-09, 07:36 PM
I would probably be a hellfire warlock with major devil bloodline which does does not increase character level. I could fly at will, create my own undead if necessary, and deal absurd amounts of damage. I would obviously take a one level dip into binder to negate the constitution damage. I would make alliances with anyone I could. I would join forces with the previously formed Volkov alliance on the condition that I get to be leutenant and do not get dominated. I would also be happy being an enforcer of your laws.

Do you want your own soul farm of Myconoids? 10 XP per soul and Myconoids reproduce and mature really damned fast. So you can rely on this source for all eternity by feeding them mushrooms and digging to an very large aquifer. And once it gets big enough, you can make them worship you to become a god.

greenknight
2010-03-09, 08:05 PM
A cleric is a tier one class for a reason. Plus, aren't artificers below wizards and clerics in the tier one subtier?

Any class in the same tier is considered to be equally powerful. In this particular scenario, where the vast majority of magical items have been destroyed and your character only has a few generic items to begin with, the Artificer's ability to create just about any magical item, and make them quickly in large quantities via Dedicated Wrights (unique to Artificers and Wizards) gives them a powerful edge.

Sure, you're a Cleric, but you've wasted levels becoming a Lich. You now have fewer hit dice than I do, and my Disrupting Weapon infusion can easily destroy you with a single hit. Oh, did I mention I've also been powered up with Persisted Divine Power, Persisted Wraithstrike and am using True Strike?


I could make you a god of craft

I already am. That's the definition of Artificer.


Plus, the soul farm could cover the expenses of item making, even if it makes you irredeemably evil.

I already get all the XP I need and much, much, more from the aberrations/zombies in the original scenario. And they are incredibly simple for me to kill (just expose them to sunlight), so all I need to do is make traps to hold them for a little while if I'm feeling a bit lazy. Your zombies are a bit more of a pain to destroy, and since they are out during the day they will interfere with my filchers.

If you didn't interfere with my plans, I won't worry about you. But your zombies are an irritation to me, and your arrogance in claiming an Artificer as your servant has marked you for destruction.

Volkov
2010-03-09, 08:08 PM
Any class in the same tier is considered to be equally powerful. In this particular scenario, where the vast majority of magical items have been destroyed and your character only has a few generic items to begin with, the Artificer's ability to create just about any magical item, and make them quickly in large quantities via Dedicated Wrights (unique to Artificers and Wizards) gives them a powerful edge.

Sure, you're a Cleric, but you've wasted levels becoming a Lich. You now have fewer hit dice than I do, and my Disrupting Weapon infusion can easily destroy you with a single hit. Oh, did I mention I've also been powered up with Persisted Divine Power, Persisted Wraithstrike and am using True Strike?



I already am. That's the definition of Artificer.



I already get all the XP I need and much, much, more from the aberrations/zombies in the original scenario. And they are incredibly simple for me to kill (just expose them to sunlight), so all I need to do is make traps to hold them for a little while if I'm feeling a bit lazy. Your zombies are a bit more of a pain to destroy, and since they are out during the day they will interfere with my filchers.

If you didn't interfere with my plans, I won't worry about you. But your zombies are an irritation to me, and your arrogance in claiming an Artificer as your servant has marked you for destruction.

I don't use zombies, I use awakened skeletons. Much better for PR. And someone has to build the robots, and start the industrial revolution. And don't you want some divine ranks to boot? You could make the one thing beyond your reach, Artifacts. The soul-farm and the XP from killing zombie...things will make me epic level really quickly, because I don't need magic items, I can just use plain old magic. Flamestrike, and eventually firestorm would make the zombies burn, and eventually, and by level 20, I'd only have one point of LA left, which I could get rid of at epic level. Once I am an epic level god, there is absolutely no threatening me because I am an epic level spellcaster.

Wings of Peace
2010-03-09, 08:12 PM
I become an Ardent with Time as my Dominant Ideal and Synchronicity subbed in. After this I spend my days finding people about to die only to pop in and lecture them on their poor choice in professions while they are devoured before returning to safely looped time whilst madly whistling a jaunty tune.

taltamir
2010-03-09, 08:12 PM
I should note that extremely virulent diseases are actually LESS effective at spreading. They kill everyone who gets it before he can infect anyone else.
however, if the super zombies carry the disease, then it could work...

I think the solution is obviously to play a tier 1 character.
A level 9 to 11 cleric or wizard will have no trouble.
heck, a level 8 wizard who prepares 3 rope tricks and 3 flys a day (to fly between the rope tricks) along with his usual spells. naturally you need a ring of sustenance.

Mine XP MMO style and get high enough level to create your own world via genesis and enjoy...

the thing is, the above is way too easy... what if you are a muggle and don't have a ring of sustenance?

Jack_Simth
2010-03-09, 08:23 PM
taltamir:
Unfortunately, the standard Teir 1 characters have already been nixed; see This Post (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8034114#post8034114). Basically, they're individually CR 4 or 5 above you, arcane magic will get you killed, Divine magic is unusable, you can't hide, and no cheese. See Here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8034473#post8034473) for my initial response to the ... what word fits? Clarification ... of the scenario.

Volkov
2010-03-09, 08:26 PM
taltamir:
Unfortunately, the standard Teir 1 characters have already been nixed; see This Post (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8034114#post8034114). Basically, they're individually CR 4 or 5 above you, arcane magic will get you killed, Divine magic is unusable, you can't hide, and no cheese. See Here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8034473#post8034473) for my initial response to the ... what word fits? Clarification ... of the scenario.

No it's not unusable. Lots of Faith will work just fine, and a horribly evil, complete monster of a cleric would not lose faith just because of some silly apocalypse. In fact, he'd just take it as a sign for him to rise to power.

greenknight
2010-03-09, 08:38 PM
I think the solution is obviously to play a tier 1 character. A level 9 to 11 cleric or wizard will have no trouble.
heck, a level 8 wizard who prepares 3 rope tricks and 3 flys a day (to fly between the rope tricks) along with his usual spells. naturally you need a ring of sustenance.

Nothing says the super zombies all have to be walkers, although I expect many of them are. For all we know, the magic these creatures have absorbed allows some of them to fly around and shoot fire and lightning from their mouths.


the thing is, the above is way too easy... what if you are a muggle and don't have a ring of sustenance?

That's one reason why Warforged are so good - they don't need food or drink (or even sleep, for that matter). And they're also immune to whatever other diseases might spring up. But if you don't have that sort of protection, and don't have someone who can do healing/cure diseases etc, then you're probably toast in the long run.


I don't use zombies, I use awakened skeletons. Much better for PR. And someone has to build the robots, and start the industrial revolution. And don't you want some divine ranks to boot? You could make the one thing beyond your reach, Artifacts.

I'll probably become a God anyway without your soul farms (see Ascending Overpowered Characters in Dieties and Demigods).


I can just use plain old magic. Flamestrike, and eventually firestorm would make the zombies burn

Wait, you're going to do what now? The OP stated (in the original post, no less):

"The creatures are only harmed by direct sunlight; no artificial light sources can harm them, even magically created ones."

Why do you think I've been relying on traps and walls of force to take them out? My Artificer has more than enough skills to build those traps, and Wall of Force is an 11th level infusion which can stop them in their tracks. But all your Flamestrikes and Firestorms will do is alert them to a new foe to destroy. At that rate, you're not going to survive long enough to become a problem for me.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-09, 08:41 PM
Would Binder's pact magic, Warlock's invocation "magic", and Hellfire's warlock's "magic" function right?


I'm already a human warlock aligned with Volkov, but I rather be a Kobold(without the dragon-wrought cheese) Binder 1/Warlock 12+1/ Hellfire warlock 1/,but that needs the multi-class penalty brushed under the rug. With all this debate between Volkov and greenknight, someone should DM this as a team PvPvE game, to prove who is right.

Volkov
2010-03-09, 08:42 PM
Nothing says the super zombies all have to be walkers, although I expect many of them are. For all we know, the magic these creatures have absorbed allows some of them to fly around and shoot fire and lightning from their mouths.



That's one reason why Warforged are so good - they don't need food or drink (or even sleep, for that matter). And they're also immune to whatever other diseases might spring up. But if you don't have that sort of protection, and don't have someone who can do healing/cure diseases etc, then you're probably toast in the long run.



I'll probably become a God anyway without your soul farms (see Ascending Overpowered Characters in Dieties and Demigods).



Wait, you're going to do what now? The OP stated (in the original post, no less):

"The creatures are only harmed by direct sunlight; no artificial light sources can harm them, even magically created ones."

Why do you think I've been relying on traps and walls of force to take them out? My Artificer has more than enough skills to build those traps, and Wall of Force is an 11th level infusion which can stop them in their tracks. But all your Flamestrikes and Firestorms will do is alert them to a new foe to destroy. At that rate, you're not going to survive long enough to become a problem for me.

The skeles and robots will be able to hold them off long enough for the sun to make them turn into ash. And Sunburst will destroy them utterly, as it works as natural sunlight for anything weak only to it.

Slayn82
2010-03-09, 08:58 PM
greenknight

Funny how our characther concepts aproached each other. Our main distinctions are our aproach to politics. Personally, i may consider Volkov's actions disgusting, but his faction as a matter of fact represents a lot of the former citizens of our world. He is reasonable enought to cut the slavery/onslaught of other inteligent races in favor of the Fungus people (thats a problem for the druids). Thats a somewhat workable compromise. What i want is to restore our world as it was before the plague, and ill work with all the Tools and Keys at my disposal.

Sure, he has some disturbing plans for ascension into godhood, but thats his fanatical former clerical side in work. If godhood would be all that worthy in this scenario, some of our former gods would be still around and would have altered the reality as they would see fit, erradicating the plague. We are artificers, we must use our inteligence scores to find new paths and keep a critic posture instead of reliance in conventional wisdow.

Of course, this leaves the unconfortably unaswered question of what happened to those powerfull beings beyond the mortal power who were once called gods...

Volkov
2010-03-09, 09:01 PM
greenknight

Funny how our characther concepts aproached each other. Our main distinctions are our aproach to politics. Personally, i may consider Volkov's actions disgusting, but his faction as a matter of fact represents a lot of the former citizens of our world. He is reasonable enought to cut the slavery/onslaught of other inteligent races in favor of the Fungus people (thats a problem for the druids). Thats a somewhat workable compromise. What i want is to restore our world as it was before the plague, and ill work with all the Tools and Keys at my disposal.

Sure, he has some disturbing plans for ascension into godhood, but thats his fanatical former clerical side in work. If godhood would be all that worthy in this scenario, some of our former gods would be still around and would have altered the reality as they would see fit, erradicating the plague. We are artificers, we must use our inteligence scores to find new paths and keep a critic posture instead of reliance in conventional wisdow.

Of course, this leaves the unconfortably unaswered question of what happened to those powerfull beings beyond the mortal power who were once called gods...
Wait a minute, I just realized that Tharidizun and Pandorym should be free (the zombies ate everything) We're doomed...Unless they fight each other. In that case, we should grab popcorn and soda. Sadly my tongue and entire digestive tract has rotted away.

I'm still going to need something for skeletons. Of course, there are all the fossilized bones lying around. Unless...no I couldn't do it...UnlessI make mummified Myconoids. Mummified Mushroom people, Now that's beyond the impossible. A horde of slavering mummies at my command, shambling and terrifying the zombies with their hideous faces. Hordes of undead scarabs and locusts will ravage the flesh of the zombies, and the dead shall rise to the bidding of me and my clerical followers. And the mindless shall be awakened to worship me.

I can easily afford to fight a war of attrition with the zombies, with each one of mine that falls, I can recycle it, with each one of them that falls to the sun, I get a new mindless shambling minion. Soon I can build robots and beat back the zombies and the alliance shall be declared heroes and worshipped by the survivors, and we all become gods.


In time I will research a disease that is lethal only to the zombies, it will spread amongst them like wildfire, felling zombie after zombie. And I shall feast on all of their souls.

High Octane Nightmare Fuel indeed. Now move over Necrons, I just outdid you.

Slayn82
2010-03-09, 09:14 PM
So you dont have a working digestive tract? Whats the problem? Go for Arcane Jar. Use the gustative papils of someone else. Enjoy your popcorn.

No one should be dennied of enjoying his popcorn.

Volkov
2010-03-09, 09:18 PM
Should I keep a few to torture for all eternity? Guarded by undead of course, and will have shutters that will open up upon daytime and let the sun in if they leave their prisons.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-09, 09:21 PM
Should I keep a few to torture for all eternity? Guarded by undead of course, and will have shutters that will open up upon daytime and let the sun in if they leave their prisons.

Have a set of mirrors reflecting the sun light from outside, forming a prison of natural sun light during the day, and a near complete encloser of walls of iron at night.

Volkov
2010-03-09, 09:22 PM
Once I attain godhood, I wonder, shall I add skeletal wings, horns and a tail to my form? Or would that be too stereotypical? In any case, I call dibs on the position of the god of evil. Once my position is secure will storm the lower planes and capture their outsider lords and the lords of elemental evil and devour their essences for more power, but not before breaking them and showing them what evil really is all about. I will make them see that to me, they don't hold a candle in evilness. Then kill them with a smile and feast on their souls.

I'll also hunt down Moradin's essence and cheerfully remind him that his time is done and capture it to torture for all eternity. And do it in front of some dwarfs just to watch them cry.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-09, 09:24 PM
Once I attain godhood, I wonder, shall I add skeletal wings, horns and a tail to my form? Or would that be too stereotypical? In any case, I call dibs on the position of the god of evil.
I call dibs of god of chaos, and and if kobold, god of dragons.

Desmond Tiny
2010-03-09, 09:25 PM
Do you want your own soul farm of Myconoids? 10 XP per soul and Myconoids reproduce and mature really damned fast. So you can rely on this source for all eternity by feeding them mushrooms and digging to an very large aquifer. And once it gets big enough, you can make them worship you to become a god.

Yes i would thank you. Also do want me to be an enforcer if any opposition occurs besides the super zombies of course? Also I call dibs on god of time because time is cool.:smallcool: I would also take god of death if not time.

Volkov
2010-03-09, 09:26 PM
Yes i would thank you. Also do want me to be an enforcer if any opposition occurs besides the super zombies of course?

Sure. And I think I found another way to break 3.5e.

Longcat
2010-03-09, 09:46 PM
taltamir:
Unfortunately, the standard Teir 1 characters have already been nixed; see This Post (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8034114#post8034114). Basically, they're individually CR 4 or 5 above you, arcane magic will get you killed, Divine magic is unusable, you can't hide, and no cheese. See Here (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=8034473#post8034473) for my initial response to the ... what word fits? Clarification ... of the scenario.

Psionics still works fine. ;)

And Erudite is still T1, with the right adjustments.

Jack_Simth
2010-03-09, 10:01 PM
Have a set of mirrors reflecting the sun light from outside, forming a prison of natural sun light during the day, and a near complete encloser of walls of iron at night.
Nah, you just need more mirrors, and bigger mirrors, in the right spots. Constant prison of natural sunlight, all day, every day. Just keep the sight lines clear.

Psionics still works fine. ;)

And Erudite is still T1, with the right adjustments.
I have this nasty suspicion that Psionics will be off the boat with the next post from the OP. Alternately, Magic/Psionics transparency is the default, and magic is already listed as unreliable.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-09, 10:11 PM
Nah, you just need more mirrors, and bigger mirrors, in the right spots. Constant prison of natural sunlight, all day, every day. Just keep the sight lines clear.

Going to take awhile to position mirrors all around the material plane. But since this after we get near godhood then we have all the time there is. But this will only work if the material is round, and I think Planescape and Spelljammer says it is, but are setting specific material.


Edit: By the op: "
The creatures are only harmed by direct sunlight; no artificial light sources can harm them, even magically created ones. "

What about organic sources of light, like phosphorescent moss, why not make them about to stun the pseudo-undead., but enough to actually harm them, and could explain how certain areas are relatively untouched by the pseudo-undead.

Touchy
2010-03-09, 10:27 PM
I'm assuming we are going to recraft the world from scratch, mostly because some of us *Cough cough* Volkov *cough cough* is killing everyone.

If we want to become gods then we need more than an evil god, I am a lawful neutral god of well... Law.

Volkov would be the god of undeath, while I do not like his strategies, I realize he is keen to balance.

Desmond is the god of time, he will be outside our affairs.

Shadowmind would either be the god the god of chaos, or the god of dragons.

Slay would be the god of the craft.

The problem is...
We still do not have a balance, we need 1 good aligned good to achieve some sort of balance. We have every OTHER alignment besides good. If we lack a force of good, then we will merely collapse into this world again.

Jack_Simth
2010-03-09, 10:32 PM
The problem is...
We still do not have a balance, we need 1 good aligned good To achieve some sort of balance.

So basically, in order to keep the new world from decaying, you need to conspire to set someone up to become a good deity. Plant a rebel faction among your worshippers who recognize that their deity isn't so much "taking them to paradise" as he is "devouring their souls and denying them an afterlife" and find a way to make them focus on the selected patsy as their ultimate savior in the battle... a battle which must also be avoided permanently.

So you need a patsy to manipulate into being Volkov's polar opposite, and close cousins to his equal in power.

That's... incredibly twisted. Which I suppose is perfect for Volkov spearheading it.

Well, as long as we're handing out divine roles....


Edit:
And... the patsy doesn't need to be in on it. And, of course, to maintain balance, if the patsy isn't in on it, the patsy needs about as many victories as failures... which means the opposition must make a good show of losing on a regular basis ... and sometimes a not so good show of losing if good is being stupid very poor at strategy ... which could lead to the rise of a myth that good shall always triumph in the end... huh.

Touchy
2010-03-09, 10:37 PM
So basically, in order to keep the new world from decaying, you need to conspire to set someone up to become a good deity. Plant a rebel faction among your worshippers who recognize that their deity isn't so much "taking them to paradise" as he is "devouring their souls and denying them an afterlife" and find a way to make them focus on the selected patsy as their ultimate savior in the battle... a battle which must also be avoided permanently.

So you need a patsy to manipulate into being Volkov's polar opposite, and close cousins to his equal in power.

That's... incredibly twisted. Which I suppose is perfect for Volkov spearheading it.

Well, as long as we're handing out divine roles....
The force of law is not evil, it is not good, it is law. Law imposes justice. As justice I am also balance, I have to believe someone must enforce a balance. I however cannot break the law, as I am law. It appear's chaos must do this, for it is his job.

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-09, 10:38 PM
Gentlemen, please. The planet would be destroyed two rounds after the outbreak. Or two rounds before the outbreak if I bother to create a time machine.

Psion: It Cures What Ails Ya(Violently).

Touchy
2010-03-09, 10:42 PM
Gentlemen, please. The planet would be destroyed two rounds after the outbreak. Or two rounds before the outbreak if I bother to create a time machine.

Psion: It Cures What Ails Ya(Violently).

We've actually already defeated all the tasks, so basically we moved on to improving the realm.

Although we still have slots open for divinity, though the god of craft would be more up you're alley for asking for a recommendation.

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-09, 10:45 PM
We've actually already defeated all the tasks, so basically we moved on to improving the realm.

Although we still have slots open for divinity, though the god of craft would be more up you're alley for asking for a recommendation.

Oh, you thought I was destroying the world to save it from the zombies? No, no. I was destroying the world to save it from you guys.

Touchy
2010-03-09, 10:49 PM
Oh, you thought I was destroying the world to save it from the zombies? No, no. I was destroying the world to save it from you guys.

You understand you are one against many...Many many divine casters, most of whom have explained how they keep their powers.
And a warforged artificer.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-09, 10:50 PM
Oh, you thought I was destroying the world to save it from the zombies? No, no. I was destroying the world to save it from you guys.

We deleted you yes yes, rip you from the thread of life yes, to never rest you will, never to rest. Become a vestige you might or maybe a cakelogical singularity, we no knows the future. The future is unknown to all for ours forces weave and turn the forces of fate in chaos, for I am the gOd of cHaOS.

Touchy
2010-03-09, 10:56 PM
This thread only get's better and better.

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-09, 11:00 PM
You understand you are one against many...Many many divine casters, most of whom have explained how they keep their powers.
And a warforged artificer.

It takes one round. A round. 6 seconds. No one would have known until the world was blown to bits with anti-osmium. At that point the discussion rapidly becomes moot as you would be dead.


We deleted you yes yes, rip you from the thread of life yes, to never rest you will, never to rest. Become a vestige you might or maybe a cakelogical singularity, we no knows the future. The future is unknown to all for ours forces weave and turn the forces of fate in chaos, for I am the gOd of cHaOS.

A) Time machine.

B) Destroyed the world when you were mortal.

chiasaur11
2010-03-09, 11:00 PM
Oh, you thought I was destroying the world to save it from the zombies? No, no. I was destroying the world to save it from you guys.

Hey, you think I'd be going 1D2 crusader to deal with the zombies?

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-09, 11:02 PM
Hey, you think I'd be going 1D2 crusader to deal with the zombies?

I like the cut of your jib. I think we should go on whacky extraplanar adventures wherein which we solve problems with extreme violence.

Touchy
2010-03-09, 11:03 PM
It takes one round. A round. 6 seconds. No one would have known until the world was blown to bits with anti-osmium. At that point the discussion rapidly becomes moot as you would be dead.



A) Time machine.

B) Destroyed the world when you were mortal.

Assuming you win initiative?
We are already gods and we already know you're plan.
We all have the power to remove you, in 6 seconds.

But yeah if you win it all becomes moot, but who cares, you would be dead and you have no reason to take the realm with yo...
wait where is anti-osmium from and how are you making it?

Edit: I don't know why you want to ruin the fun anyways. Is it just the pleasure you get in destroying the realm or are you just trying for a different plan to end this challenge.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-09, 11:06 PM
A) Time machine.

B) Destroyed the world when you were mortal.

Silly mortal, your senses bound by law cannot see this reality. This plane and reality are not the one you think. Ripped from the threads of the plane once yours, placed now in a in new tapestry of fate. In the plane of the mockery are you now, a ruleless game you will now play. Destroy the mockery all you wish, matter not to us.

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-09, 11:06 PM
Assuming you win initiative?
We are already gods and we already know you're plan.
We all have the power to remove you, in 6 seconds.

But yeah if you win it all becomes moot, but who cares, you would be dead and you have no reason to take the realm with yo...
wait where is anti-osmium from and how are you making it?

Psionic Major Creation. Anti-Osmium (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2013195&postcount=89) specifics. And I wouldn't be dead. I'd have been teleported to out of the planet-wide blast radius via Teleport Trigger.

Second: Your plan to become gods? Reliant on worship. Worship takes time you don't have. It'll take me less time to destroy the world than it takes some people to complete a full thought. The only worshiper you'd have at that point is yourself.

Finally: Time machine. Can't be gods if I've traveled back through time to the point where you were still babies. :smalltongue:


Silly mortal, your senses bound by law cannot see this reality. This plane and reality are not the one you think. Ripped from the threads of the plane once yours, placed now in a in new tapestry of fate. In the plane of the mockery are you now, a ruleless game you will now play. Destroy the mockery all you wish, matter not to us.

Now you're just goading me into epic powers. Gods? Pfft. I have epic psionics. :smalltongue:

Touchy
2010-03-09, 11:07 PM
Psionic Major Creation. Anti-Osmium (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2013195&postcount=89) specifics. And I wouldn't be dead. I'd have been teleported to out of the planet-wide blast radius via Teleport Trigger.

Second: Your plan to become gods? Reliant on worship. Worship takes time you don't have. It'll take me less time to destroy the world than it takes some people to complete a full thought. The only worshiper you'd have at that point is yourself.

Finally: Time machine. Can't be gods if I've traveled back through time to the point where you were still babies. :smalltongue:
Okay it's a combination of "Fun" and "Alternative solution".

The only factor you do not consider is that this is a realm, not a planet, might want to revise you're plan.

In anycase, we still must find us a god of goodness.



Now you're just goading me into epic powers. Gods? Pfft. I have epic psionics. :smalltongue:
Explain how you got epic level powers at level 11.

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-09, 11:13 PM
Okay it's a combination of "Fun" and "Alternative solution".

The only factor you do not consider is that this is a realm, not a planet, might want to revise you're plan.

In anycase, we still must find us a god of goodness.

I think I can do enough damage to kill an entire plane of existence... Even if I can't, I know a crusader who can.


Explain how you got epic level powers at level 11.

Well, we could start with Pazuzu and a level dip of Paladin. If that doesn't work then the original Pun-Pun was a level 11 psion, if I recall correctly.

Touchy
2010-03-09, 11:16 PM
I think I can do enough damage to kill an entire plane of existence... Even if I can't, I know a crusader who can.



Well, we could start with Pazuzu and a level dip of Paladin. If that doesn't work then the original Pun-Pun was a level 11 psion, if I recall correctly.

Until we confirmed Pazuzu exists in the realm or not then I have to applaud you. Because you won.

Although I'd like to continue onto the god plan, it was so much more fun than arguing.

Fulkerin
2010-03-09, 11:27 PM
Use zero as the *cough* good *cough* god. Just make sure there's no time travel or anti-matter.

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-09, 11:29 PM
Although I'd like to continue onto the god plan, it was so much more fun than arguing.

I agree. Who am I to get in your way of fun?

Might I suggest the standard pantheon is a God of Chaos, Good, Law, Evil, Fire, Water, Air, Earth, Magic, Physical Might, Life, Death & Undeath?

You know, all the metaphysical forces.

Touchy
2010-03-09, 11:35 PM
I agree. Who am I to get in your way of fun?

Might I suggest the standard pantheon is a God of Chaos, Good, Law, Evil, Fire, Water, Air, Earth, Magic, Physical Might, Life, Death & Undeath?

You know, all the metaphysical forces.

I got balance, law, and justice so far.

I know Volvok is evil, undeath, death, and necromancy

We got a god of chaos/dragons, a god of time, and a god of craft/constructs.

So far we almost got alignments filled, we got some flavor gods, but now we need the rest.
Bolded what we don't have.

chiasaur11
2010-03-09, 11:48 PM
I like the cut of your jib. I think we should go on whacky extraplanar adventures wherein which we solve problems with extreme violence.

Extreme Violence, Mega-Violence, or Ultra-Violence?

The Shadowmind
2010-03-09, 11:52 PM
Extreme Violence, Mega-Violence, or Ultra-Violence?
Extreme violence is equal normal violence times cake then divided by the number of moles in a non-dimensional space.
Mega-Violence is extreme violence divided by the question of the universe, then plus 42.
Ultra-Violence is 1/5 of Extreme Violence.

Fulkerin
2010-03-09, 11:52 PM
For the four elements you could use druids of different alignments...
Hell, you could even give them elemental companion ACF, and although it's not optimized it might actually fit :P.

CN-Air (storms, etc. Could be considered chaotic... but so could fire)
LN-Earth (Doesn't change much, does it?)
NG-Water (All (mostly all in dnd I suppose) life needs it)
NE-Fire (Destroys things, basically)

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-09, 11:59 PM
Extreme Violence, Mega-Violence, or Ultra-Violence?

Merely extreme violence. We're gentlemen of fortune after all. None of that unsophisticated ultra-violence because I like leaving a body behind to be buried and all.


In Twenty-Ten a pair of gentlemen were propelled across planar boundaries by an explosion they didn't create. These men promptly escaped from the third plane of Baator to the Sigil underground. Today, still wanted by the devils, they survive as gentlemen of fortune. If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them, maybe you can hire the Two-Team.

greenknight
2010-03-10, 05:49 AM
The skeles and robots will be able to hold them off long enough for the sun to make them turn into ash. And Sunburst will destroy them utterly, as it works as natural sunlight for anything weak only to it.

Couple of problems with this. First and foremost, Sunburst/Sunbeam doesn't actually mention that it works as natural sunlight in the spell description. That said, these monsters are only supposed to be CR+5, so there would need to be some effective way to deal with them while they are underground etc. Otherwise they'd be CR Infinite. So personally I'd allow this to work.

But now you've got a real problem because they are Druid spells, and are only available to Clerics as a Domain spell. And they are also high level spells - 7th and 8th level. With your LA, you won't be casting either of them initially even if you have got the right domain somehow. But an 11th level Artificer can scribe Sunbeam scrolls without too much trouble, and can make as many of those scrolls as are needed.

So while I get yet another means of defeating these monsters, you still have the problem of how you are going to kill enough of them to level up. That Lich LA is going to really hurt you for a while yet.


greenknight

Funny how our characther concepts aproached each other. Our main distinctions are our aproach to politics.

That probably has more to do with the fact that I'm lazy and want the best solution for the least effort. I played in a campaign somewhat similar to this where I used a Human Artificer, but that was with a group. For solo efforts a Warforged is definitely the best choice. As for the politics, the way I see it the character is basically Neutral and just wants to get on with making stuff. The scenario is almost perfect for that, and anything which changes it will probably only make things harder. If things revert to roughly what they were before, that's not too bad because it allows the character to obtain some things more easily, and there's a certain amount of peace to create things. But Volkov's eventual plan will cause far too much chaos to get any real work done.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 08:05 AM
Psionic Major Creation. Anti-Osmium (http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2013195&postcount=89) specifics. And I wouldn't be dead. I'd have been teleported to out of the planet-wide blast radius via Teleport Trigger.

Second: Your plan to become gods? Reliant on worship. Worship takes time you don't have. It'll take me less time to destroy the world than it takes some people to complete a full thought. The only worshiper you'd have at that point is yourself.

Finally: Time machine. Can't be gods if I've traveled back through time to the point where you were still babies. :smalltongue:



Now you're just goading me into epic powers. Gods? Pfft. I have epic psionics. :smalltongue:
Epic level magic, and even epic magic is said to not be able to do more than pull someone ONE round away in the future.

Plus, I'll go to other worlds for more worshippers.

Slayn82
2010-03-10, 08:35 AM
Well, i know im beating a dead horse here, but Ring Gates could allow the passage of directed sunlight pretty easily on underground. Well, if only being able to beat Engineering checks on around DC 50 (thats pretty epic and dificult, no?) allowed our artificers to create laser beams, or Alchemy checks to create good explosives. :smallsigh:

Alas, someone figured anti-matter already, so why not take the rabbit out of the hat? Of course, even if you could only create matter, there's still plutonium to be created. Or crafting artificial diamonds throught chemistry to ressurrect people. D&D spells would allow for so many tricks with science SCIENCE!!!.

Longcat
2010-03-10, 09:08 AM
Well, i know im beating a dead horse here, but Ring Gates could allow the passage of directed sunlight pretty easily on underground. Well, if only being able to beat Engineering checks on around DC 50 (thats pretty epic and dificult, no?) allowed our artificers to create laser beams, or Alchemy checks to create good explosives. :smallsigh:


Piece of cake for an artificer. Remember, we can change bonus types :smalltongue:

Volkov
2010-03-10, 09:38 AM
Now I can make robot sharks with fricken laser beams and jetpacks.

Desmond Tiny
2010-03-10, 10:14 AM
I am neutral because I did not sacrifice fungus only got it to worship me fo godhood. Just pointing that out.

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-10, 12:00 PM
Epic level magic, and even epic magic is said to not be able to do more than pull someone ONE round away in the future.

Plus, I'll go to other worlds for more worshippers.

A use activated item of Time Regression (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/timeRegression.htm) and/or another of Time Hop (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/timeHop.htm).

Time travel by a Nomad is easy as pie.

Finally, you missed the whole "You would be dead" issue.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 12:18 PM
A use activated item of Time Regression (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/timeRegression.htm) and/or another of Time Hop (http://www.d20srd.org/srd/psionic/powers/timeHop.htm).

Time travel by a Nomad is easy as pie.

Finally, you missed the whole "You would be dead" issue.

One round back without cheese. How amazing....and I'd classify anti-osmium as cheese. Or any form of anti-matter or fissile material. Also. As my phylactery is safe in the negative energy plane, I'd reform, and I have a second base on the plane of shadow. Your efforts have failed.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-10, 12:44 PM
Normally gods are powered by worship, but couldn't a perpetual magic source work just as well?
Waterwheel+decanter of endless water, replace the magnets that is normally used with dragon-shards. The system would constantly produce water and energy, turn the water into water elementals for worshipers on the side, and make a race of cat-girls with the a regeneration property like the Doctor, but without limit to the number of regenerations for perpetual to sacrifice.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 12:50 PM
Or I could pull an acererak and directly draw from the negative energy plane and it's companion quasi-elemental planes. Thus giving me an limitless source of power to bolster my magic. I could also draw from the divine energy in the lower planes, further strengthening me.

Longcat
2010-03-10, 01:03 PM
Or I could pull an acererak and directly draw from the negative energy plane and it's companion quasi-elemental planes. Thus giving me an limitless source of power to bolster my magic. I could also draw from the divine energy in the lower planes, further strengthening me.

And we'll eventually get access to the Volkov Vestige? I just imagine a Binder with the ability to create awakened steampunk skeletons.

chiasaur11
2010-03-10, 01:27 PM
Merely extreme violence. We're gentlemen of fortune after all. None of that unsophisticated ultra-violence because I like leaving a body behind to be buried and all.

Leaving a body behind?

What's a "body"?

As far as I can see, all things have two states. "Existing" and "Clump of unconnected particles".

Infinite damage tends to do that, I gather.

ZeroNumerous
2010-03-10, 01:29 PM
One round back without cheese. How amazing....and I'd classify anti-osmium as cheese. Or any form of anti-matter or fissile material. Also. As my phylactery is safe in the negative energy plane, I'd reform, and I have a second base on the plane of shadow. Your efforts have failed.

Actually it's an infinite number of rounds backwards. Nothing, at all, is stopping you from continually using Time Regression every round until you find a place you like. It's not even cheese, it's just reading the spell and thinking outside the box.

Better yet, make it a command-word activated item. Now you can time hop even while under attack.

I'm sorry, but you're dead. Time Travel trumps anything else you've got.


As far as I can see, all things have two states. "Existing" and "Clump of unconnected particles".

Infinite damage tends to do that, I gather.

You, my friend, are what we call a deterrent.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 03:41 PM
Actually it's an infinite number of rounds backwards. Nothing, at all, is stopping you from continually using Time Regression every round until you find a place you like. It's not even cheese, it's just reading the spell and thinking outside the box.

Better yet, make it a command-word activated item. Now you can time hop even while under attack.

I'm sorry, but you're dead. Time Travel trumps anything else you've got.



You, my friend, are what we call a deterrent.
Alter reality: time travel is no longer possible.

Plus, Quaruts will beat you up for using time travel, and valakhuts will beat you up for threatening a god. And pit fiends and balors will beat you up for threatening evil's strongest mainstay. And aurumarch's will beat you up for threatening the balance, and and solars will beat you up for destroying entire worlds, and black and white slaads will beat you up for the hell of it.

Also, infinite time regression is most certainly going to qualify as unfair at most tables and will most likely make Dm's and fellow players hurt you for using. Also, enjoy that max hit dice phane you just spawned.

druid91
2010-03-10, 03:56 PM
A little late joining in but, I would go with an elan Shaper. Farm super zombies for XP via Crystallizing them and leaving them for the sun to destroy, since they can't be destroyed by anything but sunlight,they can still be hampered by psionics, technically crystallize just leaves them helpless and coated in and filled with crystal. Once I get to high enough levels I recreate the mind flayer race using epic psionics, then recreate the trolls, and other requisite creatures to make the Emerald legion, Possibly using the super zombies for experiment fodder to mitigate the costs, they ate all the other monsters to become the super zombies in the first place so there should be something in there being that I can work with. Also strike up a friendship with ZeroNumerous :smalleek:.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 04:06 PM
A little late joining in but, I would go with an elan Shaper. Farm super zombies for XP via Crystallizing them and leaving them for the sun to destroy, since they can't be destroyed by anything but sunlight,they can still be hampered by psionics, technically crystallize just leaves them helpless and coated in and filled with crystal. Once I get to high enough levels I recreate the mind flayer race using epic psionics, then recreate the trolls, and other requisite creatures to make the Emerald legion, Possibly using the super zombies for experiment fodder to mitigate the costs, they ate all the other monsters to become the super zombies in the first place so there should be something in there being that I can work with. Also strike up a friendship with ZeroNumerous :smalleek:.

Wouldn't matter, he'd kill you anyway apparently. Plus, I have myconoid soulfarms in Mechanus, Archeon, The nine hells, Gehenna, the plane of shadow, and on the material plane (after a month tops, I'd have all this) and not just on one planet but hundreds, with an ever expanding franchise. I get 10 xp per soul and myconoids reproduce and gestate very rapidly. Soon I'll have enough live ones to make me a god by making them worship me. And soon after that I'll become a over god and long before that I'll render time travel impossible.

The zombies will be held at bay by robots and skeletal undead. I'll make sure my rule is fair and just to avoid making enemies. And I'll be able to kick the soul harvesting gig once I reach epic level.



Also, his plan relies on abusing certain spells.

druid91
2010-03-10, 04:29 PM
Wouldn't matter, he'd kill you anyway apparently.

Also, his plan relies on abusing certain spells.

I just realized I would have nothing to worry about he would have to go through the Time when the plague first started round by round. and you have undead and robots, I have horrid troll monstrosities comparable to things from the far realms. Unfortunately creating them will probably make me evil. Why is every way to get an awesome unstoppable horde evil? http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101587

Volkov
2010-03-10, 04:35 PM
I just realized I would have nothing to worry about he would have to go through the Time when the plague first started round by round. and you have undead and robots, I have horrid troll monstrosities comparable to things from the far realms. Unfortunately creating them will probably make me evil. Why is every way to get an awesome unstoppable horde evil? http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?t=101587

Yes, but my robots have gatling guns that make hundreds of attacks per round. Enough to put down your trolls with ease. That and flamethrowers to burn them dead.

Touchy
2010-03-10, 04:39 PM
Yes, but my robots have gatling guns that make hundreds of attacks per round. Enough to put down your trolls with ease. That and flamethrowers to burn them dead.

Actually I'm assuming you won't be able to become an arch Deity, assuming the fact we really don't see him much, or know how to ascend to one, unless 3.5 has a rule for that(Who am I kidding, if there is a feat that is called lich-loved... And actually applies, certainly there are rules for it).


Although you would be on top-tier of the gods list.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 04:42 PM
And to counter your legion, I shall create the Horde of Horror. Consistent of Undead, Robots, Abberations, Outsiders, Elementals, and other horrible nasties. Maybe I'll use my divine seed to create to some Abominations while I'm at it. Can your Emerald legion deal with Infernals, Anaxims, and Atropals?

druid91
2010-03-10, 04:49 PM
These are no ordinary trolls, these are emerald legion trolls!
Once they are finished they are immune to standard hit point damage, the only way to kill them is save or die and seeing as my mind-flayer overseers can manifest anti psionic fields through each and every troll at any time they want thats not a very reliable thing to go with that and their saves are pretty good. Go through the link for more details. But seeing as I am going to end up evil or dead anyway tell me more about this "soul farming," equals XP thing, What is that from?

Can your Emerald legion deal with Infernals, Anaxims, and Atropals?
Probably.

Fulkerin
2010-03-10, 04:50 PM
Short answer: Emerald legion can deal with anything.

Longer answer... anyone want to dig out the actual thread where it was created?

Volkov
2010-03-10, 04:51 PM
These are no ordinary trolls, these are emerald legion trolls!
Once they are finished they are immune to standard hit point damage, the only way to kill them is save or die and seeing as my mind-flayer overseers can manifest anti psionic fields through each and every troll at any time they want thats not a very reliable thing to go with that and their saves are pretty good. Go through the link for more details. But seeing as I am going to end up evil or dead anyway tell me more about this "soul farming," equals XP thing, What is that from?

The BoVD says that a soul is worth 10 xp, an value that never diminishes no matter what level you are, and is constant for all creatures. So that got me thinking, why not take a race that reproduces and gestates really quickly, like Myconoids, and farm them for souls. Doing this, you can have a ever-increasing supply of souls to farm for XP. You can eventually make them worship you to make you ascend to godhood.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 04:52 PM
Short answer: Emerald legion can deal with anything.

Longer answer... anyone want to dig out the actual thread where it was created?

Even an army of Awakened Skeleton Clericzillas who were all created in a Desecrated Area and have had all corpse crafter feats used on them? Which will be under my command after attaining godhood?

druid91
2010-03-10, 04:53 PM
Short answer: Emerald legion can deal with anything.

Longer answer... anyone want to dig out the actual thread where it was created?

Already did look at the link in one of my above posts. its quoted in Volkovs post at the top of he page.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 04:56 PM
These are no ordinary trolls, these are emerald legion trolls!
Once they are finished they are immune to standard hit point damage, the only way to kill them is save or die and seeing as my mind-flayer overseers can manifest anti psionic fields through each and every troll at any time they want thats not a very reliable thing to go with that and their saves are pretty good. Go through the link for more details. But seeing as I am going to end up evil or dead anyway tell me more about this "soul farming," equals XP thing, What is that from?

Probably.

How about Ikea Tarrasque, Soviet, Armored, Paragon, Epic Pseudonatural, Half white dragon, Half fiendish, Ten headed Cyborg-Max hit dice-Chimeric Dire Battletitans of legend? Ridden by anaxim's? With laser beams and gatling cannons? And a flaming chain axe? And yes, both the dinosaur and the anaxim are equipped with these.

druid91
2010-03-10, 05:03 PM
How about Ikea Tarrasque, Soviet, Armored, Paragon, Epic Pseudonatural, Half white dragon, Half fiendish, Ten headed Cyborg-Max hit dice-Chimeric Dire bears of legend?

The emerald legion is an Ikea Tarrasque that could be made in game as opposed to just being there because the dm says so. so no clue. but in the case of your original plan I quote
Is an elder evil awakening and unleashing a relentless tide of undead? The Legion can step in and stop them dead in their tracks. The possibilities are endless.


How about Ikea Tarrasque, Soviet, Armored, Paragon, Epic Pseudonatural, Half white dragon, Half fiendish, Ten headed Cyborg-Max hit dice-Chimeric Dire Battletitans of legend? Ridden by anaxim's? With laser beams and gatling cannons? And a flaming chain axe? And yes, both the dinosaur and the anaxim are equipped with these.

You know what, to stop this escalation why don't you explain to me where your going to get all that stuff from?

Volkov
2010-03-10, 05:05 PM
The emerald legion is an Ikea Tarrasque that could be made in game as opposed to just being there because the dm says so. so no clue. but in the case of your original plan I quote

I replaced the bears with battletitans. Which are more awesome. And it's not a mere elder evil, it's a Epic level Lich Cleric who's now an overdeity. Heck, this could make for a new blood-war. The Hordes of Horror vs the Emerald Legion.

druid91
2010-03-10, 05:11 PM
I get the mind-flayers to teleport a few legionares to your soul farms and annihilate your worshipers say good by god-hood or at least bring you down a rank or two and ignoring your armies entirely.
Heck, this could make for a new blood-war. The Hordes of Horror vs the Emerald Legion. Eh fine with me, I take the abyss you take baator. deal?

Volkov
2010-03-10, 05:14 PM
I get the mind-flayers to teleport a few legionares to your soul farms and annihilate your worshipers say good by god-hood or at least bring you down a rank or two and ignoring your armies entirely. Eh fine with me, I take the abyss you take baator. deal?

I already have the lower planes. You'll need to make that Demi-plane of yours a lot larger, emphasis on a lot.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 05:16 PM
I get the mind-flayers to teleport a few legionares to your soul farms and annihilate your worshipers say good by god-hood or at least bring you down a rank or two and ignoring your armies entirely.

Robot and Undead Guards. Plus many of my worshippers will be the undead. And I won't need the soul farm past epic levels. But it'd be nice to keep around.

druid91
2010-03-10, 05:19 PM
Ah well I can always link a few together, and what with the increased time and all I will be able to crank out more trolls.
Wait has anyone claimed the upper planes yet if not I move to ysgard, if so I conquer ysgard.

greenknight
2010-03-10, 05:21 PM
And to counter your legion, I shall create the Horde of Horror. Consistent of Undead, Robots, Abberations, Outsiders, Elementals, and other horrible nasties. Maybe I'll use my divine seed to create to some Abominations while I'm at it. Can your Emerald legion deal with Infernals, Anaxims, and Atropals?

Volkov, you still haven't become Epic because you still haven't worked out how to destroy any of these undead-like aberrations while you're 11th level (at best, given you also take a +4 LA from Lich). Can't proceed with any of those plans without that.

Also, remember the original post specified you can have an animal companion (although it's likely that will succumb to the disease eventually), but it said nothing about a cohort. Even if you've taken the Leadership feat, your cohort and all your followers are already dead.

I'm not really convinced diplomacy will work either, since you'll be facing a very high DC, and these creatures have been described as practically mindless. I don't know if WotC ever really clarified it, but I think most DMs only allow Diplomacy to work when you're talking to intelligent creatures (Int 3 and higher) using a common language. Somehow I doubt an impressive display of good table manners on its own is going to do much to influence these creatures.

Finally, I'm not sure how many bodies remain that are intact enough for you to make your skeletons out of. I guess if you raid the graves, you might find a few, but since D&D has such a long history of necromancers doing just that, you'll probably find slim pickings from most graveyards.

(Edit: Added undead-like aberrations)

Volkov
2010-03-10, 05:21 PM
Ah well I can always link a few together, and what with the increased time and all I will be able to crank out more trolls.
Wait has anyone claimed the upper planes yet if not I move to ysgard, if so I conquer ysgard.

That would be more or less impossible considering that everything gets back up completely unharmed in a day. Damned true resurrection...

Volkov
2010-03-10, 05:23 PM
Volkov, you still haven't become Epic because you still haven't worked out how to destroy any of these undead-like aberrations while you're 11th level (at best, given you also take a +4 LA from Lich). Can't proceed with any of those plans without that.

Also, remember the original post specified you can have an animal companion (although it's likely that will succumb to the disease eventually), but it said nothing about a cohort. Even if you've taken the Leadership feat, your cohort and all your followers are already dead.

I'm not really convinced diplomacy will work either, since you'll be facing a very high DC, and these creatures have been described as practically mindless. I don't know if WotC ever really clarified it, but I think most DMs only allow Diplomacy to work when you're talking to intelligent creatures (Int 3 and higher) using a common language. Somehow I doubt an impressive display of good table manners on its own is going to do much to influence these creatures.

Finally, I'm not sure how many bodies remain that are intact enough for you to make your skeletons out of. I guess if you raid the graves, you might find a few, but since D&D has such a long history of necromancers doing just that, you'll probably find slim pickings from most graveyards.

(Edit: Added undead-like aberrations)

They're undead and as I said. Myconoid soul farms. Now be quiet. And I can buy off the LA as I increase in level. So again, be quiet.

druid91
2010-03-10, 05:26 PM
That would be more or less impossible considering that everything gets back up completely unharmed in a day. Damned true resurrection...Only If you leave them on ysgard. After safely killing them, chuck them through a one-way gate to somewhere unpleasant. like the positive energy plane, or the negative energy plane.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 05:29 PM
Only If you leave them on ysgard. After safely killing them, chuck them through a one-way gate to somewhere unpleasant. like the positive energy plane, or the negative energy plane.

So you plan on doing this to untold billions or even trillions of petitioners and outsiders? Personally, I'd just go in and kill the most important people to break their morale.

The Shadowmind
2010-03-10, 05:29 PM
Can't dragons get divine levels from eating their horde, and kobolds are true dragons by RAW?

greenknight
2010-03-10, 05:30 PM
They're undead and as I said. Myconoid soul farms. Now be quiet. And I can buy off the LA as I increase in level. So again, be quiet.

They are actually aberrations. And you can't increase in level if you can't kill anything. You're stuck on 11th level (effectively 15th level, with the Lich LA), you can only create a few undead servants at best, and you don't have any surviving cohorts. You're in big trouble, I think.

Tinydwarfman
2010-03-10, 05:30 PM
I do believe these zombies are a minor inconvenience to me...

IRON HEART SURGE!!!

:smallbiggrin: :smalltongue:

Volkov
2010-03-10, 05:33 PM
They are actually aberrations. And you can't increase in level if you can't kill anything. You're stuck on 11th level (effectively 15th level, with the Lich LA), you can only create a few undead servants at best, and you don't have any surviving cohorts. You're in big trouble, I think.

One soul=10 xp, farm Myconoids who reproduce and gestate very quickly for souls, Myconoids often live in completely sealed off caverns that have absolutely no connection to the outside world, protecting them from zombies. So as I said before be quiet. And I was referring to my Minions, so be quiet.

druid91
2010-03-10, 05:34 PM
So you plan on doing this to untold billions or even trillions of petitioners and outsiders?

I never said that it would be easy, simple, and probably effective but not easy, though considering we could use bags of holding to carry the dead in it wouldn't be all that hard, just clean up after the battle. though as you point out I probably wouldn't have to kill them all dead, after all they would make good field training for the troops :smallbiggrin:.


They are actually aberrations. And you can't increase in level if you can't kill anything. You're stuck on 11th level (effectively 15th level, with the Lich LA), you can only create a few undead servants at best, and you don't have any surviving cohorts. You're in big trouble, I think.

You don't have to kill them out right, just engineer the circumstances for their death. the way your talking you would deny me XP for knocking my opponent off a cliff because the ground killed them.

greenknight
2010-03-10, 05:52 PM
One soul=10 xp, farm Myconoids who reproduce and gestate very quickly for souls, Myconoids often live in completely sealed off caverns that have absolutely no connection to the outside world, protecting them from zombies. So as I said before be quiet. And I was referring to my Minions, so be quiet.

And you are finding these completely sealed off caverns how ? And even if you do manage to find them (they are known to hide from strangers), how are you going to persuade them to worship you?

That assumes you can survive the journey to the caverns in the first place, given that these creatures are almost immune to any kind of damage while they are in darkness.


You don't have to kill them out right, just engineer the circumstances for their death. the way your talking you would denied me XP for knocking my opponent off a cliff because the ground killed them.

If you read through my earlier posts on this thread, you'll see that my plan is to use Walls of Force and traps to detain them, letting the sunlight finish the job. So I'm not only aware that you can kill them indirectly, I'm using that as a central part of my XP farming plan. And note, the OP specified direct sunlight is the only thing that destroys them, so it's quite possible that redirecting sunlight via mirrors etc won't work.

The problem for Volkov is that he just doesn't have the same options as I do, so he has to make a plan based on what he can actually do here. All his talk of becoming a deity is pointless if he can't kill stuff at 11th level.

druid91
2010-03-10, 05:56 PM
If you read through my earlier posts on this thread, you'll see that my plan is to use Walls of Force and traps to detain them, letting the sunlight finish the job. So I'm not only aware that you can kill them indirectly, I'm using that as a central part of my XP farming plan.

Ah I misunderstood that as using the walls of force to keep them out of your base not using it to kill them. Ok sorry my bad.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 05:58 PM
And you are finding these completely sealed off caverns how ? And even if you do manage to find them (they are known to hide from strangers), how are you going to persuade them to worship you?

That assumes you can survive the journey to the caverns in the first place, given that these creatures are almost immune to any kind of damage while they are in darkness.



If you read through my earlier posts on this thread, you'll see that my plan is to use Walls of Force and traps to detain them, letting the sunlight finish the job. So I'm not only aware that you can kill them indirectly, I'm using that as a central part of my XP farming plan. And note, the OP specified direct sunlight is the only thing that destroys them, so it's quite possible that redirecting sunlight via mirrors etc won't work.

The problem for Volkov is that he just doesn't have the same options as I do, so he has to make a plan based on what he can actually do here. All his talk of becoming a deity is pointless if he can't kill stuff at 11th level.
Immune to any kind of damage in darkness....Where are you getting that? There is nothing of the sort in the monster manual II.

And I'll get my undead to put them in camps to harvest their souls for XP. I will dwell in caves and will have walls to keep the "zombies" away until the sun comes up, and will keep them here by shooting arrows through tiny slits to irritate them. Also, I can get skeletons from fossils and from isolated underdark communities.

Touchy
2010-03-10, 06:01 PM
I'd like stats for the monsters, or a template.

Just so I(and my clerics of law) know what we are up against.

Remember, you don't have to kill them immediately, you just have to get them to be in one place long enough to leave them to die in the sun.

greenknight
2010-03-10, 06:26 PM
Immune to any kind of damage in darkness....Where are you getting that? There is nothing of the sort in the monster manual II.

It's from the original post:

"The creatures are only harmed by direct sunlight; no artificial light sources can harm them, even magically created ones."

I expect these are a completely new type of creature, since I don't know of anything in any MM which matches what the OP wrote.


And I'll get my undead to put them in camps to harvest their souls for XP. I will dwell in caves and will have walls to keep the "zombies" away until the sun comes up, and will keep them here by shooting arrows through tiny slits to irritate them. Also, I can get skeletons from fossils and from isolated underdark communities.

That's all well and good for your hideout. The OP has implied that for some reason the creatures can't or won't go there. Maybe you can just barricade it before nightfall each day so they can't get in. But the OP has also told us that prior to the sun coming up the creatures retreat to their own dark hidey holes. So if you start wandering into dark places other than your hideout, expect to meet a high concentration of them. Which is something you just don't seem able to deal with.

And I'm not sure that shooting arrows is going to be enough to keep their attention. The fact that they survive even one dawn means that they either have enough intelligence to get under cover (unlikely, given that they are described as mindless), or it's an instinctive thing for them. In either case, your arrows aren't going to force them to stay and growl at you uselessly when it's time for them to leave.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 06:30 PM
It's from the original post:

"The creatures are only harmed by direct sunlight; no artificial light sources can harm them, even magically created ones."

I expect these are a completely new type of creature, since I don't know of anything in any MM which matches what the OP wrote.



That's all well and good for your hideout. The OP has implied that for some reason the creatures can't or won't go there. Maybe you can just barricade it before nightfall each day so they can't get in. But the OP has also told us that prior to the sun coming up the creatures retreat to their own dark hidey holes. So if you start wandering into dark places other than your hideout, expect to meet a high concentration of them. Which is something you just don't seem able to deal with.

And I'm not sure that shooting arrows is going to be enough to keep their attention. The fact that they survive even one dawn means that they either have enough intelligence to get under cover (unlikely, given that they are described as mindless), or it's an instinctive thing for them. In either case, your arrows aren't going to force them to stay and growl at you uselessly when it's time for them to leave.
No you daft fool, I am referring to the Myconoids, not the fragging zombies! The Myconoids can live perfectly well in caves that have absolutely zero connection to the surface and would take far too much digging for most foreign predators to reach. They are fairly easy to kill as well.

greenknight
2010-03-10, 06:40 PM
No you daft fool, I am referring to the Myconoids, not the fragging zombies! The Myconoids can live perfectly well in caves that have absolutely zero connection to the surface and would take far too much digging for most foreign predators to reach. They are fairly easy to kill as well.

That might be true for the Myconoids, but:

1) How do you expect to find them in the first place?
2) How do you expect to avoid the "zombies" while you're looking for them?
3) If you do find them, how are you going to get to them? And if you do find a way to get to them, how are you going to prevent the "zombies" from getting to them using exactly the same method?

There's also a problem in that while you might be immune to the disease, you could also be a carrier for it. So even if you pop into a previously untouched colony of Myconoids, they might get the disease from your contact. Given how we've been told the disease spreads, that scenario seems very likely.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 06:42 PM
That might be true for the Myconoids, but:

1) How do you expect to find them in the first place?
2) How do you expect to avoid the "zombies" while you're looking for them?
3) If you do find them, how are you going to get to them? And if you do find a way to get to them, how are you going to prevent the "zombies" from getting to them using exactly the same method?

There's also a problem in that while you might be immune to the disease, you could also be a carrier for it. So even if you pop into a previously untouched colony of Myconoids, they might get the disease from your contact. Given how we've been told the disease spreads, that scenario seems very likely.

Because the zombies are mindless and would have absolutely no motivation to dig hundreds or even thousands of feet below for bad-tasting, or outright poisonous mushroom men with their own army of fungus zombies, and i'm a walking pile of partially-ossified bones. I can't carry disease because there is nothing for it to munch on.

druid91
2010-03-10, 06:45 PM
He just has to be sure to be a squeaky clean corpse. also how are you expecting a virus to survive on someone who is existing because he is filled with negative energy?


Because the zombies are mindless and would have absolutely no motivation to dig hundreds or even thousands of feet below for bad-tasting, or outright poisonous mushroom men with their own army of fungus zombies, and i'm a walking pile of partially-ossified bones. I can't carry disease because there is nothing for it to munch on.

don't forget the loose skin and pure evil.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 06:46 PM
He just has to be sure to be a squeaky clean corpse. also how are you expecting a virus to survive on someone who is existing because he is filled with negative energy?

And has no flesh, organs, fat, or any tissue besides some bone left. And even the bones are somewhat fossilized. And even viruses, viroids, and prions still need water to survive. And because it can jump species, it's not a virus, it's a bacterial life form, and even bacteria can't really jump kingdoms.

druid91
2010-03-10, 06:48 PM
You know we are agreeing quite a bit for two people who started the new blood-war.

Volkov
2010-03-10, 06:49 PM
You know we are agreeing quite a bit for two people who started the new blood-war.

Now imagine if I had fungus zombies in my army as well, and mummified killer goombas, because after all, what is a myconoid but a goomba with arms and fancy powers? Also, I have an Artificier, A warlock, and a Lawful Stupid cleric as allies. I am sure we can handle any dinky zombies.

greenknight
2010-03-10, 07:07 PM
Because the zombies are mindless and would have absolutely no motivation to dig hundreds or even thousands of feet below for bad-tasting, or outright poisonous mushroom men with their own army of fungus zombies, and i'm a walking pile of partially-ossified bones. I can't carry disease because there is nothing for it to munch on.

Ok.

1) You still haven't answered how you're going to find those Myconoids.
2) You still haven't answered how you're going to get to them once (if) you find them.
3) How do you know what these "zombies" like to eat?
4) How do you know the disease can't stick to you? It's magical in nature, who is to say what limits that magic has? Remember, the OP allowed you to have an animal companion, but there was a warning that said companion would inevitably become infected. The disease is still spreading.

Now that I think about it, that poses another problem. Are your undead going to be immune to this disease? If they are, that implies that there are lots of other undead out there who also survived, and many of them would be considerably more powerful than you. You'll have to fight your way through them before you can achieve your plans.

And if your undead aren't immune to the disease? That's even worse, because now you have an army which could turn on you at any moment.

Tiki Snakes
2010-03-10, 07:08 PM
Speaking as a disembodied observer, It does appear that Volkov's plan to survive long enough to become a God seems to revolve around having survived long enough to become a God, at which point his various allies do all the work and he ascends by default. :smallwink:

Personally I think the Druids are the most Viable tactic, with their undersea empire and high level weather mojo. The psionic destroy-the-world plot is nice and efficient, but kind of revolves around the laws of theoretical physics working, and the whole Anti-Osmium bomb thing going according to plan.

Also, Re: Disease - Who says it has to be Bacterial or Viral? It could well be a magically transmitted curse that takes the form of a horrible disease.

I mean, without 21st century science, how are you even going to check? :smallsmile:

druid91
2010-03-10, 07:11 PM
So now that I have ripped the requisite materials from the zombies, why don't we sign a temporary ceasefire and wipe them off the prime material?